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Thread: Peyton Manning Weighs in on Drew Lock, Broncos' QB Status: 'I'm Pulling for Drew'

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    Lock’s problem, in my opinion, isn’t reps and chemistry. I think he fits. His problem is playing the chess game at the next level. It’s a a damn hard thing to do. I can sit here and tell you what I think should have happened, and where they should go, and I feel confident in my ability to analyze it. It’s a whole other ball game to stand back there and do it. Much of it is pre-snap. It’s not easy.

    You have to add that quick twitch, decisive, accurate, intelligent decision with the physical ability to accomplish what your mind tells you to do. There’s only 3-5 people on the face of the planet that can do it at an elite level at any any given time.

    My contention is Lock has the physical ability, but maybe not the mental ability. And again, I’m not saying he’s stupid. I’m saying he might not be one of the 10 humans on a planet of ~8 billion who can accomplish the task.
    You have posted some analysis of this and I agreed with it, it was damning actually.

    Most of the other plays I watched were super vanilla and he didn't show any decision tree type ability, was locked (ahem) onto his target and made nice throws. So when I found one that *maybe* was a decision tree, I jumped on it. But I had doubts based on his body language...it looked designed but I'm not as good as y'all at knowing for sure.

    So I mean it when I say you guys know what you are talking about. I see it too.

    I have to wonder how much he will improve once the game slows down a little more--once he has that intuitive grasp of defensive looks, more timing mindmeld with Jeudy et al, all that jazz.

    Right now he looks lost af a lot of the time. I know what you mean about that quick twitch decision thing, and there's not much evidence to support that he'll develop into that player.

    So let me ask this--what 2d year players going into their third year does he remind you of? What's a best case/worst case?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    You have posted some analysis of this and I agreed with it, it was damning actually.

    Most of the other plays I watched were super vanilla and he didn't show any decision tree type ability, was locked (ahem) onto his target and made nice throws. So when I found one that *maybe* was a decision tree, I jumped on it. But I had doubts based on his body language...it looked designed but I'm not as good as y'all at knowing for sure.

    So I mean it when I say you guys know what you are talking about. I see it too.

    I have to wonder how much he will improve once the game slows down a little more--once he has that intuitive grasp of defensive looks, more timing mindmeld with Jeudy et al, all that jazz.

    Right now he looks lost af a lot of the time. I know what you mean about that quick twitch decision thing, and there's not much evidence to support that he'll develop into that player.

    So let me ask this--what 2d year players going into their third year does he remind you of? What's a best case/worst case?
    Obviously, I have watched Drew Lock more than any other team’s quarterback, but Andy Dalton might be an OK comp?
    *The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    Obviously, I have watched Drew Lock more than any other team’s quarterback, but Andy Dalton might be an OK comp?
    Dalton is a guy with the elite physical tools but unable to find what the defense gives away when it's 'go time'? I don't know much about him besides the fact he's ginger and King hates him. And he went to my wife's alma mater. I thought he was floppy-armed but NFL-bright.

    I just don't know that there's a pro with elite arm who can't consistently pick apart defenses who ended up as a starter.

    Maybe Drew will develop that quick-twitch intuition the more he studies film and defenses (in the context of Shurm's system)?
    Last edited by Hawgdriver; 02-21-2021 at 01:22 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    Dalton is a guy with the elite physical tools but unable to find what the defense gives away when it's 'go time'? I don't know much about him besides the fact he's ginger and King hates him. And he went to my wife's alma mater.

    I just don't know that there's a pro with elite arm who can't consistently pick apart defenses who ended up as a starter.

    Maybe Drew will develop that quick-twitch intuition the more he studies film and defenses (in the context of Shurm's system)?
    I just don't know that you can overstate the impact that having six different systems to learn in seven years combined with a lack of off season combined with the loss of your best receiver have on a kid that's pretty close to a rookie.. shanahan used to say that you never really knew what you had in a quarterback until their third year in the system we're basically going into year two under Pat

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jsteve01 View Post
    I just don't know that you can overstate the impact that having six different systems to learn in seven years combined with a lack of off season combined with the loss of your best receiver have on a kid that's pretty close to a rookie.. shanahan used to say that you never really knew what you had in a quarterback until their third year in the system we're basically going into year two under Pat
    yeah. sometimes I wonder about everyone's background, and how they make their assertions about mastery.
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    Andy Dalton is a scrub and he has no soul.

    Derek Carr physically and Baker Mayfield developmentally would be my comp for Lock.
    "Tuning ... into each other ... lift all higher”
    “I’m just different!”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northman View Post
    Roadhouse is one of my wife's favorite movies, i think she is going to find you and drop kick your ass. Lol
    She has poor taste ... no offense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jsteve01 View Post
    I just don't know that you can overstate the impact that having six different systems to learn in seven years combined with a lack of off season combined with the loss of your best receiver have on a kid that's pretty close to a rookie.. shanahan used to say that you never really knew what you had in a quarterback until their third year in the system we're basically going into year two under Pat
    So we should give him two more years then!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    Dalton is a guy with the elite physical tools but unable to find what the defense gives away when it's 'go time'? I don't know much about him besides the fact he's ginger and King hates him. And he went to my wife's alma mater. I thought he was floppy-armed but NFL-bright.

    I just don't know that there's a pro with elite arm who can't consistently pick apart defenses who ended up as a starter.

    Maybe Drew will develop that quick-twitch intuition the more he studies film and defenses (in the context of Shurm's system)?
    I’ve never viewed Andy dalton as a guy with elite physical tools.

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    The fact of the matter is why did drew look so intriguing under scangerello to just a guy showing flashes under shurmer? Literally nobody finished the year last year wondering if we had a quarterback! He was so impressive that the broncos were spot of people dark horse team to come out of nowhere.

    The facts are Drew sat nearly the entire year just studying and learning the playbook, this is a guy whose had to learn a new playbook 6 of his last 7 playing season’s from college to the pros! There’s no consistency in that, there’s no time to build on anything.

    When it’s all said and done Lock will be under center for the broncos this year and he’ll have his shot to show that he’s taking the next step, all this wishful dreaming of Watson whose going nowhere will fall through. And we’ll still have our Drew as we should! The kid deserves another year and he’ll get it. Paton would be a damn fool to dump Lock who has way more upside than the guy he believed in named Kirk cousins.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tbolt View Post
    So we should give him two more years then!
    I think this year is make or break. He doesn't need to be a pro bowler but has to show real progress and stay healthy. He also needs help from Shurmur that he wasn't saying until the second half of the season this year. Ply calling was horrid early

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tbolt View Post
    I think Lock had plenty of weapons. Really don’t think that’s the problem.

    Haven’t been to Aviano in probably 6-7 months since we’ve been restricted to our own areas. Much better PX/BX and Commissary though. I work on Camp Ederle.
    Jeudy was a weapon on paper who clearly had flashes but also was a clown who spent way to much time on timing routes trying to make moves and couldn't catch most of the year at the position, while also acting like a diva. Hamler another rookie, Flashed, but also couldn't hold onto the ball. His best WR was Tim Patrick who until this year was a complete scrub as well and could barely get past WR 3/4 status. Lets not even talk Hamilton who will most likely be gone after losing to Tyrie in TC this year. Fant is a weapon but has shown some injury woes and TE's aren't used a lot in Shurmurs scheme. Albert O certainly flashed, but also dropped 2 TD's and got hurt early. I think many of you see the paper stats for these guys but there actual performance was dogshit last year plain and simple, and that includes our entire OL except for Bolles who got lucky the NFL stopped caring about holding and Dotson, who was our best RT but got left inactive so the Wilkinson experiment could continue to fail at RT. Cush got owned all year, Risner regressed a bit, and RG was unstable most of the year as even when Glasgow was in he didn't play all that well.

    Throw that in with a average RB we pay 8 million a year to who had his own ball security issues, and Lindsay who is apparently mad at Shurmur but also has injury woes him damn self and cant stay on the field. A lot of you blame lock but the entire rest of our offense was pretty much a shit show. Call it scheme, play calling whatever for me its the players just not producing well, in a young offense who needed every rep together the off-season didn't provide them.

    Lock will be good for us next year if we are healthy and Sutton is back to himself. Throw in 2nd year players who can be playmakers but aren't fully there yet and hopefully a better OL and RB situation and we should be much improved to contend for the playoffs. If we get Watson were SB contenders.....I like our prospects for next year. Really hoping for a legit off-season for this team. It will pay dividends because we do have talent. It just needs to be molded together and groomed and developed for a change instead of just hoping constant turnover will do the trick.
    2021 Broncos Lets Go!

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    "TEs aren't used a lot in Shurmurs scheme"

    Quote Originally Posted by Shelby Harris View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    "TEs aren't used a lot in Shurmurs scheme"

    Partly because they cant stay healthy lol.....the a lot part is becasue we aren't going to see Travis Kelce type targets for Fant or Albert lol.....
    Last edited by Elevation inc; 02-22-2021 at 10:09 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeudy10Hamler13 View Post
    I’ve never viewed Andy dalton as a guy with elite physical tools.
    He’s THE elite scrub in all of the NFL, him and Kirk Cousins.

    So of course Paton likes him.
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