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Thread: What About the Line of Scrimmage . . . Disaster?

  1. #1
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    Default What About the Line of Scrimmage . . . Disaster?

    The controversy and main concerns regarding what must be done with the
    Denver Broncos seems to center on the lines, on both sides of the ball. It
    seems disaster has struck, and nothing exists there except problems. But is
    it as bad as some have it? Allow me the luxury of breaking it down for my
    feeble attempt at analysis.


    OFFENSIVE LINE

    Lepsis' retirement would appear to leave a big hole. How that is filled will
    depend considerably on Ryan Harris. According to scouting reports, Harris is
    exceptionally quick and "rarely gets beat to the outside." However, he is also
    regarded as not having great upper body strength, so I hope he reviews his
    scouting reports, takes them to heart, and adds 10-15 pounds up there.

    However, Lepsis isn't overly strong, either, and it showed sometimes when he
    was caught by surprise with a bull rush, yet in his prime he was regarded as
    one of the better LTs. Harris is still a little bigger than Lepsis, so if Harris
    can bulk up a bit the position may eventually be even more solid than when
    Lepsis manned it.

    The return of Nalen and Hamilton would indeed buoy the O-line, although I look
    at Hamilton as a backup if he does return. Kuper will excel at that position,
    if he doesn't shift to LT, IMO. He has quick feet and exceptional upper body
    strength for his size, which at 305 is bigger than they are used to there.
    Kuper struggled early against quick moves in pass protection, but he improved
    considerably in that as the season wore on. However, it was not easy to bull
    rush him, which was Hamilton's weakness at 283. The point is, Kuper will
    improve in his areas of weakness, whereas Hamilton is as good as he is going
    to get, which bodes for a significantly greater upside for Kuper.

    Meyers looks like a keeper for the future at center, although he appears to
    have a long way to go. If Nalen can return for one season, that will give
    Meyers another year's development.

    Holland, I believe, is better than he appeared to play this year. His problem
    was, with first-year players (at their positions) on either side of him, he
    was on an island and lacked the help he would have had with experienced
    players there. I believe, then, that position is fine for now.

    Pears at RT worries me. Many times, he was just flat "owned" on that side.
    Maybe he will develop there, but I don't know. It would seem the Broncos might
    do well to watch the free agent market closely for a good RT.

    This shapes up to be a good offensive line for the future, especially if Nalen
    and Hamilton return, which will make them deep. Again, they probably need to
    upgrade at RT, then they should be a good unit to support the run and protect
    Cutler. If that happens, with the skill people the Broncos have, the offense
    will be one for opposing defenses to fear.



    DEFENSIVE LINE

    I do not believe the DL is in bad shape as some surmise. The Broncso are
    loaded at DE, especially if Ekuban can return from his injury . . . which is
    up in the air, given the nature of the injury and Ekuban's age. However, if he
    can indeed return, he is very strong against the run, which is essentially what
    is needed at LDE. He is also a decent pass rusher when others with that ability
    are present on the line. And we musn't forget Crowder, who mirrors
    Ekuban in size, and showed considerable ability at his position.

    This is where Dumervil and Moss come in. I would like to see the Broncos go
    into a variation of the 3-4 in some passing situations to allow Dumervil and
    Moss to be on the field at the same time without sending Ekuban to the bench,
    unless it is to replace him with Crowder, or vice versa. With the development
    of Thomas, that may give the Broncos a very strong pass rush.

    Of course, Thomas is at DT, where the Broncos badly need help. Thomas is the
    only DT of starting quality there. McKinley would likely make a good backup,
    but he should not be starting. The Broncos had it right in wanting to put some
    beef in there, but that beef needs to be able to move. Adams was a perfect fit,
    five years ago. Getting rid of Warren, in my opinion, is in the running for the
    gaff of the season. I was not a big fan of Warren's toward the end, but he was
    better than anyone else the Broncos had there (which obviously was not very
    good.)

    This is where the Broncos need to bring in a couple good, big, strong, mean
    defensive tackles. Until then, the DEs will not realize their true pass rushing
    talents, opposing running backs will maintain a special appreciation for the
    Broncos, and the linebackers and secondary will continue to struggle at times
    because they have to pick up where the DL left off, which will be way too
    early.

    Indeed, there is a lot more talent at LB and in the secondary than many people
    realize. If DT is stocked with some truly good players, people will be amazed
    at how the back seven have improved.


    SUMMARY

    Doom and gloom has seemed the theme among the media for the Broncos. They
    are going to need a major overhaul, seemingly according to the majority of them.
    I don't think so. The Broncos have talent galore in the offensive skill positions
    and defensive backfield. Linebacker is solid, it would appear, provided Winborn
    keeps coming on as he has . . . although they could probably use a bit more
    quality depth there.

    Therefore, where the Broncos need to shore up is in one right offensive tackle
    and two defensive tackles. (Hopefully, they won't have to go outside to replace
    Lepsis.) Put some true quality in those positions, and we will see an entirely
    different team next year.

    No, I am not willing to put my money where my mouth is.

    -----
    Last edited by topscribe; 01-01-2008 at 03:32 PM.
    Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)


  2. #2
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    Nice article and write up. I disagree we are loaded at DE. Moss is an unproven project with a small frame and Ekuban isn't exactly a Pro Bowl type DE. Doom is the best DE we have, he's only one. I just don't see us being "loaded".
    BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE

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    We are not loaded at DE.

    Very nice write-up if you're looking through orange tinted shades.

    Ekuban is at best an average DE, and that was before the injury.

    Moss is unproven, Doom is a pass rush specialist, Crowder has the best chance to become an every-down lineman yet it's too early to tell, Engleberger is a nice back-up.

    We can't fix both lines in one year, so I propose that we let Peterson and Crowder become our starting DE's and add one or two DT's from the draft to pair up with Thomas. Sure we'll still have growing pains next year up the middle with a rookie and a 2nd year player, but we need to sacrifice another season to get the team rebuilt. It will help the DT's too if we start Peterson and Crowder at ends because they have much more size than Doom or Moss.

    Patience is what we need. We're not use to it as Bronco fans, but we are still another year or two away, assuming we continue to draft well and at the right free agents.
    [

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    We DO have to royally work on our point of attack on BOTH sides of the ball, starting on the DT spot(s). This above all...
    "What do you want your dash to represent?"

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    Lightbulb

    If we re-sign Ekuban them I feel we can get by at DE. Ekuban and Peterson/McKinley are run stoppers, Dumervil and Moss as pass rushers, and Crowder can do some of both. Marcus Thomas could be a 3 technique D-tackle with McKinley as a back-up. However we have absolutely no nose tackles on the entire team and we need a minimum of 2.

    To control the line of scrimmage we must look at our LBs and safeties. I am not sold on our OLBs. We need a Will LB like a junkie needs a fix. If John Lynch retires we need a 'knock your head off and laugh' LB (excuse me safety) to replace him to keep receivers and Rbs from being too secure.

    Offensively, we need both a right and a left tackle. Maybe Kuper and Harris can handle it and maybe not. I haven't seen either of them there to know. My bet is that we need at the minimum one right tackle. We also need Dan Graham to heal up to protect our tackles in the event we have difficulty filling those spots with quality people.
    Last edited by Dean; 01-02-2008 at 07:22 AM.
    RIP Cameron, D, & D

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    What about safeties?

    Sorry guys, I don't have too many informations about that position here in france...

    What do you think about? DO we need to improve there (considering that Lynch could retire. And even if he doesn't, he wouldn't be the same player he was... Don't get me wrong, he's still a good player and a leader. But will he have all the physical and health? That's my concern).

    I agree about O-Line... IMO, we need to fix RT and may be add even more depth...
    D-Line is more suspect IMO (but I could be wrong... LOL). I don't think our LB had a great year... We need to improve here a bit there too...

    My summary :
    Our priority is D and O-Line.
    We must continue to develop our Special teams too (but IMO, ST were better in the end of the season)... Go on working!
    Top priority is about D IMO... We have given too many yards and points.
    ABout O, if we can protect a bit more Jay and open holes for RB like we usually did, we have a lot of talent (WR, TE, and even good -not great/franchise- RB)...
    Froggy's back !


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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchfan View Post
    What about safeties?

    Sorry guys, I don't have too many informations about that position here in france...

    What do you think about? DO we need to improve there (considering that Lynch could retire. And even if he doesn't, he wouldn't be the same player he was... Don't get me wrong, he's still a good player and a leader. But will he have all the physical and health? That's my concern).

    I agree about O-Line... IMO, we need to fix RT and may be add even more depth...
    D-Line is more suspect IMO (but I could be wrong... LOL). I don't think our LB had a great year... We need to improve here a bit there too...

    My summary :
    Our priority is D and O-Line.
    We must continue to develop our Special teams too (but IMO, ST were better in the end of the season)... Go on working!
    Top priority is about D IMO... We have given too many yards and points.
    ABout O, if we can protect a bit more Jay and open holes for RB like we usually did, we have a lot of talent (WR, TE, and even good -not great/franchise- RB)...
    The San Diego Chargers are a good example of the value of a good front
    seven. They have a decent secondary, but not all-pros by any stretch, at
    least on their own merits. But they often come out looking like all-pros
    because of the intense heat those guys can apply up front.

    The Broncos, on the other hand, do have all-pros back there who have
    been burned more than once because they have to cheat up to stop the
    RBs as the RBs carve through the front seven like a hot knife through
    butter, and the QB has time to stop for lunch on passing plays.

    I don't believe the thoughts of the staff should even stray toward any other
    position until they have fortified the DT posiition.

    IMHO.

    -----
    Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)


  9. #8

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    Denver does not have the personnel currently on the roster (healthy or no) on both lines to compete in the postseason and against the more physical teams of the league...

    If you want 8-8 seasons with possibly a road wild card a$$ whoopin, then continue to plug the personnel we have now...

    New faces (i.e...not currently on the roster) will be required if Denver wants to go beyond that...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Broncolingus View Post
    Denver does not have the personnel currently on the roster (healthy or no) on both lines to compete in the postseason and against the more physical teams of the league...

    If you want 8-8 seasons with possibly a road wild card a$$ whoopin, then continue to plug the personnel we have now...

    New faces (i.e...not currently on the roster) will be required if Denver wants to go beyond that...
    That is why we have to draft DT's and OT's high in the draft. There is no way a good DT is going to be allowed to leave a team via FA, such as Haynesworth. The only real option to get a Pro-Bowl type player is through the draft. Look at all the playoff teams and what do they have in common. Good drafts and using FA for depth.
    Last edited by BigDaddyBronco; 01-18-2008 at 01:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by topscribe View Post
    The San Diego Chargers are a good example of the value of a good front
    seven. They have a decent secondary, but not all-pros by any stretch, at
    least on their own merits. But they often come out looking like all-pros
    because of the intense heat those guys can apply up front.

    The Broncos, on the other hand, do have all-pros back there who have
    been burned more than once because they have to cheat up to stop the
    RBs as the RBs carve through the front seven like a hot knife through
    butter, and the QB has time to stop for lunch on passing plays.

    I don't believe the thoughts of the staff should even stray toward any other
    position until they have fortified the DT posiition
    .

    IMHO.

    -----
    Totally agree...
    BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE

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    Quote Originally Posted by topscribe View Post
    The San Diego Chargers are a good example of the value of a good front
    seven. They have a decent secondary, but not all-pros by any stretch, at
    least on their own merits. But they often come out looking like all-pros
    because of the intense heat those guys can apply up front.

    The Broncos, on the other hand, do have all-pros back there who have
    been burned more than once because they have to cheat up to stop the
    RBs as the RBs carve through the front seven like a hot knife through
    butter, and the QB has time to stop for lunch on passing plays.

    I don't believe the thoughts of the staff should even stray toward any other
    position until they have fortified the DT posiition.

    IMHO.

    -----
    GP...

    Ditto...

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    Quote Originally Posted by topscribe View Post

    No, I am not willing to put my money where my mouth is.

    -----
    i'll put my money where your mouth is. as far as the lines go, i agree with you completely. my main priority this offseason is getting 2 DTs, i'm hoping one proven FA and one early draft pick. 2 dominating DTs will make every other position on the defense easier.
    Quote Originally Posted by Buff View Post
    I don't know much about anything. In fact, I am one of the dumbest people alive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDaddyBronco View Post
    That is why we have to draft DT's and OT's high in the draft. There is no way a good DT is going to be allowed to leave a team via FA, such as Haynesworth. The only real option to get a Pro-Bowl type player is through the draft. Look at all the plyoff teams and what do they have in common. Good drafts and using FA for depth.
    Or we could seriously throw a ridiculous amount of money to get Correy Williams from GB ... ridiculous as is way, way, way overpay. He might not be worth that kind of money, but he could immediately make a huge difference, whereas a rookie would need lots of time to adjust. I think that's worth it, if we could lock him up for a good amount of time. An added bonus, he already knows how to play Bates system, most likely better than anyone in the Broncos.

    Besides the obvious value of his play, the younger guys will learn how to play this type of system by watching him. We mocked the Raiders for picking up Carlisle, but who's to say he hasn't had a big influence on the Raiders learning that zone-blocking that's put them ahead of the Broncos in rushing offense? That's what a veteran who knows the system can bring in.

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    Outside of Ellis and Dorsey we cant get a guy that will make an impact this year at DT. We can get a contributor, but not a stud, ala marcus thomas. So we either trade up, or use thomas+ free agency IMO. We do have a good chance at getting a STUD LB/ Saftey in rivers or Phillips. That OT from boise state could also fall to us, and could be a stud. We dont draft this high this often, it's time to hit a draft pick out of the park.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joshxhannah View Post
    Outside of Ellis and Dorsey we cant get a guy that will make an impact this year at DT. We can get a contributor, but not a stud, ala marcus thomas. So we either trade up, or use thomas+ free agency IMO. We do have a good chance at getting a STUD LB/ Saftey in rivers or Phillips. That OT from boise state could also fall to us, and could be a stud. We dont draft this high this often, it's time to hit a draft pick out of the park.
    There are a few guys who wold make instant impact... Balmer is very good... Just as good as Ellis.

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