Thread: Don't trade PS2. Don't suggest trading him. Your hot take is bad.

Jay Cutler is a poor man's Kurt Cousins

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

It wasn’t Cutler that ended the Mastermind, it was his loyalty to Bob Slowik and the league’s worst defense combined with years of poor drafting and FA signings which wrecked that cap and gave the Broncos a terribly depleted roster of losers - Dale Carter, Darryl Gardener, the Browncos, etc.

It was a mistake.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

At this point, trading for a Cooper Rush, Tyson Bagent, or Bailey Zappe to compete with Stidham and ignoring QB in the draft wouldn't surprise me. I think Sean Payton thinks he can make guys fit his system as long as they are pocket passers first. In his last year in New Orleans, Payton relied on Siemian, Winston, and Hill at various points due to injuries.

If that's the case, my fandom will finally succumb to this death by a thousand cuts at QB.

Originally Posted by chazoe60

If that's the case, my fandom will finally succumb to this death by a thousand cuts at QB.

I mean, Russ made a thousand cuts at QB last year, but usually they were all backwards or laterally to extend a play and then all he did was fumble or throw a pick. I kind of want someone who is just going to step up in the pocket.

Originally Posted by chazoe60

I will also argue that being a game manager at a super elite level can be considered freaky. The freakiest game manager of all time is the guy that right now would win a poll of who is the GOAT. I wouldn't agree, but the reality is that Tom Brady is considered the GOAT by most and he was nothing more than the best game manager that ever lived.

It was maddening watching him complete 7 yrd passes alldayeryday. Brock Purdy if he's a game manager he's really ******* good at it and I haven't seen the Denver Broncos consistently do anything elite at the QB position since those 3 years with world beater PFM, and it was game manager PFM with the hardware.

People act like this has only been QB purgatory since PFM retired but I all reality this franchise has seen nothing but absolute dog shit QB play since Elway retired with the exception of two 4 year stints one by Plummer and the other by Manning.

I openly admit that in terms of drafting QBs I am mentally scarred by this franchise. Yes, my take on us drafting a QB is extreme, but I just can't let them get away with ******* this up yet again. One more chance and I'm out after that. Might join my boy Kinger in the land of the "I'll root for a team that I at least feel isn't literally okay with a one and done playoff season"

That is the franchise we currently root for. A one and done playoff season would be fed to us like all is well, then we'd sign whichever schlub was at the helm(Stidham or some Donald clone next season) to a big extension, miss the playoffs the following year and all this bullshit will start again. I can see this shit like Nostradamus, because it is built into the Denver Broncos DNA apparently. That's the message that will be sent to me without a 1st rd QB this draft.

IDC if that is irrational. This is the thing in my life that I get to be the most irrational about. In the end it doesn't matter and that's partly why it matters to me so much. ITS OKAY TO WHIFF ON A QB, LOOK AT THE BEARS RIGHT NOW. So take a shot and when you find out you whiffed(which you will because they almost all are whiffs), take another shot and another and another. This franchise takes a shot in a 1st rd QB about once a decade(probably worse than that actually) whiffs, curls into a ball and says "oh my God we can't try that again" and signs cast offs and the cycle starts all over again. I hate it.

Yeah. This is abut what I thought, and I get it. I'm *thisclose* to just giving up on them and watching Redzone going forward. To be clear, it's not even the losing that bothers me. It's the lack of any kind of cohesive plan or vision, and the stupidly stubborn insistence on doing things the wrong way. The constant digging through other teams' trash for a QB is what wears on me the most. How many hours of my life that I'll never get back were wasted watching Teddy f'n Bridgewater stumble around out there?

Ultimately, we all just want them to be competitive. Naturally, we're gonna have some different opinions about how they should try to get there. For me, I'll be more disheartened if they spend a 1st on Nix or Penix (or anything higher than a 5th on Prattler) than I would be having Stidham or Dinucci start all year. McCarthy is my cut-off line for who I can talk myself into. If they can't get him or Maye, I'd vastly rather just see them tank hard. It's all perspective. *shrugs*

Originally Posted by dogfish

Yeah. This is abut what I thought, and I get it. I'm *thisclose* to just giving up on them and watching Redzone going forward. To be clear, it's not even the losing that bothers me. It's the lack of any kind of cohesive plan or vision, and the stupidly stubborn insistence on doing things the wrong way. The constant digging through other teams' trash for a QB is what wears on me the most. How many hours of my life that I'll never get back were wasted watching Teddy f'n Bridgewater stumble around out there?

Ultimately, we all just want them to be competitive. Naturally, we're gonna have some different opinions about how they should try to get there. For me, I'll be more disheartened if they spend a 1st on Nix or Penix (or anything higher than a 5th on Prattler) than I would be having Stidham or Dinucci start all year. McCarthy is my cut-off line for who I can talk myself into. If they can't get him or Maye, I'd vastly rather just see them tank hard. It's all perspective. *shrugs*

Tank hard for who though? That crop next year is bad. Theyre talking Quinn Ewers as the second best QB in next years class. He's 7th or 8th best in this class.

Not sure what your aversion to Bo is? I get the Auburn stuff and I get the Oregon system "yadda yadda yadda" but I watch the kids film and see a dude who puts the ball right where it needs to be when it needs to be the vast majority of the time and also has some very interesting playmaker ability when shit breaks down. His film is littered with plays that if they happened on Sundays in a Broncos uni, this board would be creaming their collective jeans (holy shit we came up with the best slang in the 80's).

I think you and I are damn near at the same spot in terms of our disgust with this god forsaken bassackwards franchise and I'm right there with you as far as #1 complaint. Quit trying to fill the gaping hole with other team's trash. Find a mother****ing QB of your own and do the god damned required work to develop him, it is literally your ******* job you ********. Quit trying to cop out and hope the other NFL franchises will do the hard work for you. That's what this feels like to me. Like the Broncos as an organization have decided that developing a QB is too much work, let's let the rest of the league do that part for us. It's pathetic, weak and ******* cowardly.

When your franchise is damn near 70 years old and the most impactful player you've ever drafted at the most important position is Brock Osweiler because of one 7 game fill in stretch, you should probably have your franchise ripped from you and sent elsewhere. That is monumental amounts of shitty history. I get it that 16 years of that was filled up by a get out of draft jail free card in the form of John Elway but holy shit, get with the times.

Love ya Dog

It's not that I have an aversion to Nix. . . I just look at the murderer's row of elite QB talents in the AFC right now, and I simply can't convince myself that he has enough chance of ever competing against those guys to be worth the investment. It's not only Mahomes, there's Allen, Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Lawrence, and now Stroud. CJ has as many career playoff wins as Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. I can't talk myself into a guy who screams game manager to me. Just can't do it. Maybe he's a taller Drew Brees, WTF do I know? But I see a 6'2" Pac-12 shitgun QB who's going to be 24 years old as a rookie, who doesn't have any elite physical traits. I've heard scouts and analysts call his arm everything from average to quite good, but no one thinks it's special, and he's not a monster athlete. Maybe he really just is so smart and so accurate, etc, that he can dominate without the freaky skills, but I have significant concerns there also. Processing speed is probably the single hardest thing to judge about a QB prospect, but for me the fact that he needed five years of college before having his breakout season does not argue for him being special in that regard. I know he put up crazy numbers this year, but so did Mac Jones his final season-- except he did it in a pro style offense, against SEC defenses. I'm not 100% sold on JJ McCarthy either, but he played at a high level much earlier, did it under center, and against much tougher competition-- and scouts seem to be very high on his processing skills. There's enough there for me to be cool with him in the 1st. I can't get there with Nix. Of course, he's likely the guy we're gonna get, so hopefully all this reverse mojo will make him Brees 2.0. It be what it be.

In regards to tanking, you never know when a Joe Burrow is gonna come out of nowhere. But if it ends up being a two-year deal, and we end up with an elite edge or OT next season, I can live with that. We realistically need to put together a competent OL who can keep a young QB alive anyway. The Texans got Stingley last year, and Stroud and Anderson this year. Even in a best cast scenario, it's gonna take us a few years to get where we want to be. I, personally, can be patient if I just see that there is a cohesive plan in place. Do it right this time. No more garbage vet retread QBs, mid round picks, or overpriced FAs at any position. Clear cap space, acquire draft picks, build with young talent, and stop wasting all your high picks on WRs and corners when your lines blow on both sides of the ball. I can work with that. Which is why I would have hedged my bets with a wildly talented Justin Fields for dirt cheap in case we can't get the QB we want in this year's draft, but again, WTF do I know?

Originally Posted by dogfish

It's not that I have an aversion to Nix. . . I just look at the murderer's row of elite QB talents in the AFC right now, and I simply can't convince myself that he has enough chance of ever competing against those guys to be worth the investment. It's not only Mahomes, there's Allen, Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Lawrence, and now Stroud. CJ has as many career playoff wins as Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. I can't talk myself into a guy who screams game manager to me. Just can't do it. Maybe he's a taller Drew Brees, WTF do I know? But I see a 6'2" Pac-12 shitgun QB who's going to be 24 years old as a rookie, who doesn't have any elite physical traits. I've heard scouts and analysts call his arm everything from average to quite good, but no one thinks it's special, and he's not a monster athlete. Maybe he really just is so smart and so accurate, etc, that he can dominate without the freaky skills, but I have significant concerns there also. Processing speed is probably the single hardest thing to judge about a QB prospect, but for me the fact that he needed five years of college before having his breakout season does not argue for him being special in that regard. I know he put up crazy numbers this year, but so did Mac Jones his final season-- except he did it in a pro style offense, against SEC defenses. I'm not 100% sold on JJ McCarthy either, but he played at a high level much earlier, did it under center, and against much tougher competition-- and scouts seem to be very high on his processing skills. There's enough there for me to be cool with him in the 1st. I can't get there with Nix. Of course, he's likely the guy we're gonna get, so hopefully all this reverse mojo will make him Brees 2.0. It be what it be.

In regards to tanking, you never know when a Joe Burrow is gonna come out of nowhere. But if it ends up being a two-year deal, and we end up with an elite edge or OT next season, I can live with that. We realistically need to put together a competent OL who can keep a young QB alive anyway. The Texans got Stingley last year, and Stroud and Anderson this year. Even in a best cast scenario, it's gonna take us a few years to get where we want to be. I, personally, can be patient if I just see that there is a cohesive plan in place. Do it right this time. No more garbage vet retread QBs, mid round picks, or overpriced FAs at any position. Clear cap space, acquire draft picks, build with young talent, and stop wasting all your high picks on WRs and corners when your lines blow on both sides of the ball. I can work with that. Which is why I would have hedged my bets with a wildly talented Justin Fields for dirt cheap in case we can't get the QB we want in this year's draft, but again, WTF do I know?

I get all that. And to some degree I am for sure suffering from "this looks so much better than anything I've seen play QB in a Broncos uni that I want it no matter what" when it comes to this particular young man, but at this point that's the Broncos fault so to any degree that I'm wrong about the kid I blame no one but the Orange and Blue.

At this point I am so disgusted by the thought of watching Stidham/Tannehill for a year I don't care if they draft Joe Milton at 12 and run 65 go routes per game, at least I'm not watching someone else's failed dip shit trot his old ass out at Mile High for nothing more than a paycheck.

I swear to God I should be allowed to sue the Broncos for mental anguish.

Originally Posted by dogfish

It's not that I have an aversion to Nix. . . I just look at the murderer's row of elite QB talents in the AFC right now, and I simply can't convince myself that he has enough chance of ever competing against those guys to be worth the investment. It's not only Mahomes, there's Allen, Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Lawrence, and now Stroud. CJ has as many career playoff wins as Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. I can't talk myself into a guy who screams game manager to me. Just can't do it. Maybe he's a taller Drew Brees, WTF do I know? But I see a 6'2" Pac-12 shitgun QB who's going to be 24 years old as a rookie, who doesn't have any elite physical traits. I've heard scouts and analysts call his arm everything from average to quite good, but no one thinks it's special, and he's not a monster athlete. Maybe he really just is so smart and so accurate, etc, that he can dominate without the freaky skills, but I have significant concerns there also. Processing speed is probably the single hardest thing to judge about a QB prospect, but for me the fact that he needed five years of college before having his breakout season does not argue for him being special in that regard. I know he put up crazy numbers this year, but so did Mac Jones his final season-- except he did it in a pro style offense, against SEC defenses. I'm not 100% sold on JJ McCarthy either, but he played at a high level much earlier, did it under center, and against much tougher competition-- and scouts seem to be very high on his processing skills. There's enough there for me to be cool with him in the 1st. I can't get there with Nix. Of course, he's likely the guy we're gonna get, so hopefully all this reverse mojo will make him Brees 2.0. It be what it be.

In regards to tanking, you never know when a Joe Burrow is gonna come out of nowhere. But if it ends up being a two-year deal, and we end up with an elite edge or OT next season, I can live with that. We realistically need to put together a competent OL who can keep a young QB alive anyway. The Texans got Stingley last year, and Stroud and Anderson this year. Even in a best cast scenario, it's gonna take us a few years to get where we want to be. I, personally, can be patient if I just see that there is a cohesive plan in place. Do it right this time. No more garbage vet retread QBs, mid round picks, or overpriced FAs at any position. Clear cap space, acquire draft picks, build with young talent, and stop wasting all your high picks on WRs and corners when your lines blow on both sides of the ball. I can work with that. Which is why I would have hedged my bets with a wildly talented Justin Fields for dirt cheap in case we can't get the QB we want in this year's draft, but again, WTF do I know?

I watched Nix all season since Oregon is the only college ball I watch. I could live with Brees 2.0. Is it realistic? Don't know. Like you said, maybe they don't draft a QB. At least in the first. Still, I liked Nix...decision making and accuracy. The light sometimes does not go on as fast for some as others may think it should.

Originally Posted by dogfish

It's not that I have an aversion to Nix. . . I just look at the murderer's row of elite QB talents in the AFC right now, and I simply can't convince myself that he has enough chance of ever competing against those guys to be worth the investment. It's not only Mahomes, there's Allen, Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Lawrence, and now Stroud. CJ has as many career playoff wins as Kirk Cousins and Derek Carr. I can't talk myself into a guy who screams game manager to me. Just can't do it. Maybe he's a taller Drew Brees, WTF do I know? But I see a 6'2" Pac-12 shitgun QB who's going to be 24 years old as a rookie, who doesn't have any elite physical traits. I've heard scouts and analysts call his arm everything from average to quite good, but no one thinks it's special, and he's not a monster athlete. Maybe he really just is so smart and so accurate, etc, that he can dominate without the freaky skills, but I have significant concerns there also. Processing speed is probably the single hardest thing to judge about a QB prospect, but for me the fact that he needed five years of college before having his breakout season does not argue for him being special in that regard. I know he put up crazy numbers this year, but so did Mac Jones his final season-- except he did it in a pro style offense, against SEC defenses. I'm not 100% sold on JJ McCarthy either, but he played at a high level much earlier, did it under center, and against much tougher competition-- and scouts seem to be very high on his processing skills. There's enough there for me to be cool with him in the 1st. I can't get there with Nix. Of course, he's likely the guy we're gonna get, so hopefully all this reverse mojo will make him Brees 2.0. It be what it be.

In regards to tanking, you never know when a Joe Burrow is gonna come out of nowhere. But if it ends up being a two-year deal, and we end up with an elite edge or OT next season, I can live with that. We realistically need to put together a competent OL who can keep a young QB alive anyway. The Texans got Stingley last year, and Stroud and Anderson this year. Even in a best cast scenario, it's gonna take us a few years to get where we want to be. I, personally, can be patient if I just see that there is a cohesive plan in place. Do it right this time. No more garbage vet retread QBs, mid round picks, or overpriced FAs at any position. Clear cap space, acquire draft picks, build with young talent, and stop wasting all your high picks on WRs and corners when your lines blow on both sides of the ball. I can work with that. Which is why I would have hedged my bets with a wildly talented Justin Fields for dirt cheap in case we can't get the QB we want in this year's draft, but again, WTF do I know?

At this point, taking the best player on the board or trading back seems the way to go. If they have Nix graded highly, take him at 12. Otherwise, rebuild the roster. Need some big boys at DE and need better CBs aside from PS2. Payton can run a respectable offense with Stidham and post draft FAs.

My ideal draft would be moving back for somebody's #1 next year, then watching that team have a mid to trash season. Seattle used our draft capital from McDumbo to get Earl Thomas, which contributed to their resurgence and Super Bowl win. Seattle, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, Jacksonville are all on the rise because of other teams getting desperate. The people they traded with? Mixed results.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

At this point, taking the best player on the board or trading back seems the way to go. If they have Nix graded highly, take him at 12. Otherwise, rebuild the roster. Need some big boys at DE and need better CBs aside from PS2. Payton can run a respectable offense with Stidham and post draft FAs.

My ideal draft would be moving back for somebody's #1 next year, then watching that team have a mid to trash season. Seattle used our draft capital from McDumbo to get Earl Thomas, which contributed to their resurgence and Super Bowl win. Seattle, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, Jacksonville are all on the rise because of other teams getting desperate. The people they traded with? Mixed results.

I think you're last paragraph is probably the likely outcome, it still pisses me off though because that's what they should have been doing a ******* decade ago. Now we move the timeline back even another year, and I would guess even further than that because next year's crop sucks hind tit. I also know this organization and I know they won't be able to resist when a Tua or Dak or Goff becomes in any way available. We all know it deep in our bones, don't we as Broncos fans. We know they're never drafting and developing a FQB. What evidence could we possibly have to lead us to any other possible outcome.

The other bummer is, Sean Payton isn't going to be around for this shit. He will sprint into retirement after a couple more years of this trash. I'm shocked he took this job.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

At this point, taking the best player on the board or trading back seems the way to go. If they have Nix graded highly, take him at 12. Otherwise, rebuild the roster. Need some big boys at DE and need better CBs aside from PS2. Payton can run a respectable offense with Stidham and post draft FAs.

My ideal draft would be moving back for somebody's #1 next year, then watching that team have a mid to trash season. Seattle used our draft capital from McDumbo to get Earl Thomas, which contributed to their resurgence and Super Bowl win. Seattle, Detroit, Chicago, Houston, Jacksonville are all on the rise because of other teams getting desperate. The people they traded with? Mixed results.

What do they do at QB if they don’t draft one 1st round?

Originally Posted by chazoe60

I think I just heard James Merilatt say arguably the dumbest thing I have ever heard. He literally said when discussing Stidham Vs. Russ the last two weeks "The numbers were the same, the score of the games was the same but it was different."

**** off. I'm glad you're happy that the Stealers got Russ James, but don't let it make you say stupid shit like that.

Merilatt is PORWFC, President Of Russell Wilson Fan Club. Feel free to ignore his opinion on RW.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

At this point, trading for a Cooper Rush, Tyson Bagent, or Bailey Zappe to compete with Stidham and ignoring QB in the draft wouldn't surprise me. I think Sean Payton thinks he can make guys fit his system as long as they are pocket passers first. In his last year in New Orleans, Payton relied on Siemian, Winston, and Hill at various points due to injuries.

Now I know you’re trolling me.

Well played, Sir UR.

Originally Posted by King87

Jarvis Moss was not a boss.

“Jarvis reminds me of Charles Haley”—Mike Shanatan