Thread: the Head Coach candidates thread

Originally Posted by dogfish

Almost exactly two years later, I'm afraid it's time to dust this bad boy off again. It seems clear that Bienemy really does have some demons in his past. He'll undoubtedly be in the interview mix again as a Rooney Rule guy, but I no longer view him as a serious candidate. Eberflus did get hired by the Bears. Kellen Moore was big on the interview cycle this past off-season, and I expect him to be a hot name again next year-- the work he has done with Cooper Rush will likely gain some positive attention. I still think Mike LaFleur is a name to watch, as the Jets have made tremendous progress this year, and Shanny tree coaches continue to be in demand. Brian Daboll and Robert Saleh are both killing it right now. With the review out of the way, let's take a look at some guys I expect to be in demand in the coming cycle.

The veteran coaches are a small group. Sean Payton is the obvious crown jewel of the class. Jim Harbaugh is another name that will draw attention, but he does come with a huge ego and some obvious red flags. Dan Quinn got a lot of press last year, and his defense is balling again. Jim Caldwell and Chuck Pagano are still out there, and Leslie Frazier, but none of them are getting any younger. Frank Reich is a guy to keep an eye on if the Colts let him go.

On the offensive side, there's Moore and LaFleur, and I think you can add Joe Lombardi, Shane Stiechen, Mike Kafka, and Ken Dorsey to the list of guys who may start getting some consideration in years to come. Maybe Brian Callahan as well.

On the defensive side, IMO Demeco Ryans is probably the top name to watch, and I do think Ejiro Evero is doing work this year that may get his hat into the ring at some point. Jonathon Gannon got a couple looks last year, and his unit is performing well again.

I still don't know anything about college coaches, and I'm not sure it matters.

The worst part about hiring an inexperienced guy who doesn't work out? You're basically committed to hiring someone with NFL HC experience the next time around - aka a "re-tread" who isn't going to get anyone super excited -- e.g. the Leslie Frazier's and Dan Quinn's of the world shoot to the top of the list... I wouldn't have been very excited about hiring Doug Pederson in this last go around, but we'd probably be better off.

I can go dig up the college coaching failures list that I posted the other week - but essentially Harbaugh is the only one who hasn't flamed out badly, so that's basically a non-option.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

I was pretty against Dan Quinn last year but I think I'd be more in favor of it this year. He's coached on a team with Russ so there is a familiarity there, even though it was the opposite side of the ball. He has experience so he won't be learning on the job the nuts and bolts of head coaching. If he came packaged with a hotshot OC and Quinn just focused on the game management and let Eviro and the OC run those sides of the ball, I could get on board.

Hard to dispute that he'd have been the better hire at this point, and I hear what you're saying, but I still go back to my reasoning from last year. There are no "hotshot OCs," all the even semi-capable guys are already OCs somewhere else, if not HC candidates. I just can't stomach trusting the likes of Bill O'Brien or Mike Mularkey (Darrell Bevell, whoever) to fix the absolute shit-disaster we've had on offense for the better part of a decade.

Originally Posted by Buff

The worst part about hiring an inexperienced guy who doesn't work out? You're basically committed to hiring someone with NFL HC experience the next time around - aka a "re-tread" who isn't going to get anyone super excited -- e.g. the Leslie Frazier's and Dan Quinn's of the world shoot to the top of the list...

If Elway was making the hire, absolutely. With Paton, if it's even him making the hire, who knows. For me, the Walmarts are the wild card here. They aren't going to feel beholden for the Hackett shitshow, they weren't responsible for it. I'm sure they'll feel free to hire whoever they want. As far as I'm concerned, it's Sean Payton or bust (unless Reich is available). But if it's not, I'd have no fear going with another younger first time guy. We should have hired Daboll this past time, full stop. I do think they'll still come back to earth at some point, as you can only cover up Daniel Jones with smoke and mirrors so far, but BD clearly knows WTF he is doing. I like Leftwich a lot, and would also take a look at LaFleur and Steicken. I got zero interest in some Foxball retread.

I think Payton is pretty overrated, but he probably is the best option out there. We at least wouldn't be a disaster with him. But his Saints teams underachieved in the playoffs a lot, and had that weird stretch in Brees' prime where they went 7-9 three years in a row. Something just seems off about him. I also think he only has eyes for the Dallas job so I'm not sure how realistic he'd be.

Sadly I think Quinn is the best we're gonna do if Hackett goes.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

I think Payton is pretty overrated, but he probably is the best option out there. We at least wouldn't be a disaster with him. But his Saints teams underachieved in the playoffs a lot, and had that weird stretch in Brees' prime where they went 7-9 three years in a row. Something just seems off about him. I also think he only has eyes for the Dallas job so I'm not sure how realistic he'd be.

Sadly I think Quinn is the best we're gonna do if Hackett goes.

The thing I hate about some of these old school NFL-lifers like Payton and Fangio is that much like John Fox, they come with a certain level of malaise. They bring a bunch of legacy (see: outdated) methods with them. They are kind of surly with the media, tough on younger players, and generally make coming to work kind of miserable for a lot of people...

I loved the idea of having a fresh/hungry staff who didn't come with years of baggage... But dammit if the old guys don't know a thing or two about winning football games.

That's why I like the Evero model of young coordinator / old school seasoned consultant with Dom Capers. In theory you'd like to see Hackett making that work with Rosburg - but that seemed like a marriage of necessity more than anything.

Only has one ring, has underachieved in the playoffs. . . that also describes Andy Reid, Pete Carrol, John Harbaugh, and essentially every other good coach in the league who isn't Belichick. I'm sorry, but if Payton doesn't excite you, then I think your level of expectations has reached unattainable heights. Bill Walsh and Don Shula aren't available, and the Rams aren't letting McVey go.

I'd take a flyer on Staley if the Chargers fire him. I know he gets clowned on for his ridiculous aggressiveness, but he developed Herbert well and I think has mostly been unlucky with a team maybe even more injured than we've been. And he's just with a dead organization that doesn't seem to prioritize winning.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

I'd take a flyer on Staley if the Chargers fire him. I know he gets clowned on for his ridiculous aggressiveness, but he developed Herbert well and I think has mostly been unlucky with a team maybe even more injured than we've been. And he's just with a dead organization that doesn't seem to prioritize winning.

If you want the guy most responsible for Herbert's development, isn't Lombardi a better choice? I'd just make Evero the HC over Staley-- dude gets clowned for a reason, and we've had more than enough experience with blatantly incompetent game managers.

Originally Posted by dogfish

Only has one ring, has underachieved in the playoffs. . . that also describes Andy Reid, Pete Carrol, John Harbaugh, and essentially every other good coach in the league who isn't Belichick. I'm sorry, but if Payton doesn't excite you, then I think your level of expectations has reached unattainable heights. Bill Walsh and Don Shula aren't available, and the Rams aren't letting McVey go.

I guess this is fair, but I still can't get that weird run of 7-9 seasons out of my head. That's not something you see from guys like Reid, Carrol, and Harbaugh usually. I know a ton of Saints fans having lived in New Orleans, and none of them seemed that upset about Allen taking over for Payton. It just strikes me as odd when a fanbase isn't that upset over such a successful head coach leaving.

Granted, we're in a beggars can't be choosers situation and he's certainly the most accomplished guy who will be available.

Originally Posted by dogfish

If you want the guy most responsible for Herbert's development, isn't Lombardi a better choice? I'd just make Evero the HC over Staley-- dude gets clowned for a reason, and we've had more than enough experience with blatantly incompetent game managers.

If we're gonna have a bad game manager, I'd rather at least one who is actually aggressive than one who punts twice on 4th and 1 in the second half. Go down swinging!

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

I guess this is fair, but I still can't get that weird run of 7-9 seasons out of my head. That's not something you see from guys like Reid, Carrol, and Harbaugh usually. I know a ton of Saints fans having lived in New Orleans, and none of them seemed that upset about Allen taking over for Payton. It just strikes me as odd when a fanbase isn't that upset over such a successful head coach leaving.

Granted, we're in a beggars can't be choosers situation and he's certainly the most accomplished guy who will be available.

The last sentence is obviously the most important part here. As for their down stretch, Mickey Loomis has to take some of the blame. They had an atrociously bad defensive roster, and went years where they only had one real offensive weapon at a time. They handed out some bad contracts, and went through a purge. Here, Payton would hopefully keep Evero, and walk into a situation with a ready-made elite defense. IMO he's absolutely one of the top three offensive minds in the game, and he's younger than Andy. No chance in hell he'd ever field the worst offense in the league, regardless of personnel.

Also, Staley at least has a philosophy that he believes in and sticks to. Hackett just seems to overreact in the opposite direction each week from whatever egregious mistake he made the week before. He's as clueless as clueless could be.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

If we're gonna have a bad game manager, I'd rather at least one who is actually aggressive than one who punts twice on 4th and 1 in the second half. Go down swinging!

I don't disagree with that, but I'd much rather just have a good game manager who's still aggressive. We can afford to hire the best, we don't have to settle for interns anymore.

Originally Posted by dogfish

The last sentence is obviously the most important part here. As for their down stretch, Mickey Loomis has to take some of the blame. They had an atrociously bad defensive roster, and went years where they only had one real offensive weapon at a time. They handed out some bad contracts, and went through a purge. Here, Payton would hopefully keep Evero, and walk into a situation with a ready-made elite defense. IMO he's absolutely one of the top three offensive minds in the game, and he's younger than Andy. No chance in hell he'd ever field the worst offense in the league, regardless of personnel.

Ultimately I think he's just waiting out the Dallas job. Feels like it's either that or a cushy TV job for him.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

Granted, we're in a beggars can't be choosers situation and he's certainly the most accomplished guy who will be available.

I don't really agree with you and NTL here. This isn't the University of Colorado coaching search committee. We have the richest owner in the league and there are only 32 of these jobs -- I think there are maybe a handful of coaches who have enough juice to be selective about their next opportunity - Payton and guys who are currently HC with another NFL team. Who else? Brian Flores ain't coming here since he's suing us and all... But beyond that?

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

Ultimately I think he's just waiting out the Dallas job. Feels like it's either that or a cushy TV job for him.

That certainly may be the case. I'd have his agent on the phone today, though.