Ok, but its been 5 years since our SB win and we have no real direction whether it be at the coaching level or player level. There isnt any real commitment to anything that we are doing right now. Do you think fans should just suck it up and deal? It would be one thing if it looked like we had a real plan but im just not seeing it.
I've come off the ledge a tad on Elway's comments yesterday - whether it's realistic or not, he can't throw in the towel on the season until we're mathematically out of contention... So through that lens, his comments on CHJ and Lock make some sense.
If the team is somehow back in wild card contention (which is preposterous because they're terrible) then it would make more sense to bring back Patrick and Theo Riddick from IR than it would to bring back a rookie QB. And obviously you wouldn't trade CHJ if they were in playoff contention.
And it also makes sense on his Sanders comments that he probably felt like Sanders forced his hand and he had to move earlier than he wanted to. Though I'd argue it may end up being a blessing in disguise because the market may have been dry be the time Elway felt comfortable giving up on the season.
Some more here -
https://www.9news.com/article/sports...d-d7b502c725b9
I think we ****** up bad with VJ
If that one mistake was fixed we would be in a better position right now...... but for me, everything bad is as a result of that one decision
I think fangio is too soon to tell if he is another VJ and if he is, then sure the lack of coach and qb is a problem.... but if lock is the answer and fangio becomes who we thought he was...... then everyone praises elway, and I think he has earned that chance
They may hvae had one of the best offenses that year. It was not THE BEST OFFENSE THE NFL HAS EVER SEEN! By like a mile!! What we did will be hard to replicate for a while. As rules change and favor offenses, etc it will happen but not for a long long while.
How we lost in the SB has no bearing on the hawks or Elway. We lost. Elway recognized that and in one fell swoop decided to switch the team from NFL best offense Ever! to NFL all time defense top 5 ever. Most teams do not ever get to say in the HISTORY of the NFL did they have a top 1 offense or a top 5 defense. HISTORICALLY. you can tell me all you want about manning having great offenses as a colt. But it is not even close to what we did and you know it. History knows it. It is not a debatable fact.
Yes, a lot of those guys did come in because of manning. No disagreement. My disagreement is that people argue it was manning that brought in the those guys and made those teams and that is crap. Elway did. Manning had been in the league for like 15 years prior to coming here (I dont know how long he has been in the league). You are telling me all those years that all the free agents did not want to play with manning because he was a colt, but when he was a bronco they changed their mind? NO, Garbagio amigo! It does not fly. It cannot fly. They came here because elway rocked his face off with awesome deals and savvy negotiations.
This point is further proved by the fact that we went out and made a top 5 defense after manning was clearly done. What was it 7tds and 15 ints for manning that year? Yeah, that SB win was not manning. Manning did not build that defense. Manning had no part of it. Manning had never had a defense which is why he lost so many SB and playoffs. Elway did that. Only Elway.
Waves overall point stands and is valid. His contention that it is only because of manning and we lucked into is is not.
I agree he has to do it again.
But finding a QB that is actually starter material is the most difficult thing to do in football. The only time we have ever won a SB or gone to one is when we have one of those QBs. This is why teams suck for years and years....Dolphins, Jets, Bills, 9ers, Browns, Titans, Skins, Rams, Cards, etc etc. Because they dont have one.
This is why these teams are now relevant because they got their QB....Raiders, Cheifs, Browns (lol sorta), Rams, bills, Ravens, packers, pats.
All the good teams have a QB. All the bad teams do not. The middle teams have a QB just good enough to start but not good enough to win. It is a QB league. Finding one is the hardest thing to do. So I will give Elway more than 3 years to find one knowing exactly what he can do with a team when he does! That said, and as I agreed with you, if we do not find out what we have in lock or do not draft a top qb this year (I know its going to be herbert and I am scared to death of that) then we will have big big problems.
The Plan at the moment:
Draft: Trade a 3rd and 6th this year to a team to move up and get a 2nd next year (this will happen).
Players I want:
Jake Ferguson (Jake Butt) or Jelani Woods or Jeremy Ruckert or Cade Otten (owen daniels) at TE- All 4th rd or later.
Troy Anderson LB 3rd/4th rd (yay Timmy!)
Neil Farrell, JR DL- run stuffer- bye purcell
My problem with Elway's QB whiffs isn't even that he's missed on several. Like you said, that's the hardest position to hit on and you're gonna miss way more than you hit. My problem is moreso that he seems obsessed with the tall, slow, big armed QBs who were prototypical in the 80s and 90s but not necessarily today. I'd rather he whiff on a Baker/Kyler type QB than keep going to the well with the tall guys. It's becoming as big a meme as Al Davis just drafting the fastest guy who can't do anything else.
I think we are all with you there.
The Plan at the moment:
Draft: Trade a 3rd and 6th this year to a team to move up and get a 2nd next year (this will happen).
Players I want:
Jake Ferguson (Jake Butt) or Jelani Woods or Jeremy Ruckert or Cade Otten (owen daniels) at TE- All 4th rd or later.
Troy Anderson LB 3rd/4th rd (yay Timmy!)
Neil Farrell, JR DL- run stuffer- bye purcell
I’m hoping that the fact that Elway traded Sanders means John realizes his team isn’t in “win from now on” mode anymore. It’s the first step in admitting to himself that his team is officially rebuilding. Hopefully Sanders is just the beginning of him dealing vets.
I agree with everything you said, except that I have zero confidence that Elway either gets it or ever will get it. His ego demands that his organization be on top - NOW, and he hasn't got the patience to build properly through the draft even though that means a period of perhaps 2 or 3 years where you're NOT "winning now."
The Raiders, the Dolphins, the Jets, the Browns, the Cardinals all are in the process. The 49ers and Rams and Eagles went through it and emerged as solid teams.
When you lose a Hall of Fame QB like Elway or Peyton there is no way to "win now" unless you can draft an Andrew Luck. And the Broncos have never been in position to draft an obvious generational player like him.
So, I fully expect Elway is waiting to see if the Broncos can "turn things around" meaning that they win the next 2 games. Then he can stick to his imbecilic Joe Flacco is "in his prime" B.S. for another season and delay the rebuilding process he hates.
Idiot. There's no way around it. His stubborn denial of reality is just destroying the franchise.
Joel Klatt summed it up perfectly this AM on 104.3 the Fan:
They need a franchise QB or any development they do with the rest of the team is completely pointless. And Joe Flacco is just flat not the answer moving forward."If the ball isn't out in less than 2.5 to 2.75 seconds in this west coast offense, there's a huge problem. And that problem is the QB. Of the eight sacks Flacco suffered Thursday night that were attributable to the offense, virtually every one of those sacks he held the ball for 2.75 seconds. Here's the numbers. 2.71, 2.88, 3.16, 3.27, 3.12, 3.38, 3.03. Here's the problem. He's holding the ball for 3 seconds! You can't do that! You can't even do that in college!" -- Joel Klatt
"This league is built for 8-8. This league is built for NFL purgatory. It's built for teams that think they're good enough, but really aren't. And it plays on that vanity from an organizational perspective, of teams that think "well, we probably could make the playoffs if this or this happens. I tell you, being a wild card team in the NFL outside of a couple of years with teams with elite QBs . [ex: Steelers, Packers]. . I think being a wild card team is one of the worst things you can be. I want A's or I want F's. And I think it would be smart for Denver to start thinking about how do we become an A football team."
John Elway hasn't admitted it yet because that would raise the question -- "why do you keep making such obvious blunders?" Everybody in the league just assumed that Flacco wasn't good enough -- except in Denver.
If Elway has to admit the Joe Flacco experiment was a disaster, like the Case Keenum experiment was a disaster, like the Paxton Lynch experiment was a disaster, like the Trevor Siemian experiment was a disaster, then who can he point the finger at?
He has to look in the mirror and admit "I just suck at my job." And he just can't do that. It would take an owner willing to pull the plug. Unfortunately for the Broncos there is no owner. Joe Ellis isn't going to fire Elway. We're just stuck in loserville for the foreseeable future.
Man, at some point, Elway must have stolen cugels lunch money.
Yes. This happened 4 times. First it was when he directed Paxton Lynch to dip his hand in my pocket. Then it was Trevor Siemian. Then Case Keesum. Then Joe Flacco. I'm tired of the Broncos taking my money for tickets and merch, having Elway tell me that they're in "win now mode" and putting the kind of product we saw on Thursday night out on the field.
If you're OK with Elway screwing you over, fine. Just keep believing in him.
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