Thread: Is WR Brandon Marshall (remember him?) a HOFer?

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

I just don't think you can possibly leave out someone with his career numbers. The hof becomes meaningless if the best players aren't in it. I think the baseball Hof is a joke for that reason.

I get that he was a dick and dropped a lot of passes, but only Jerry Rice put up better stats than him in the 3 major receiving categories when he retired. The good simply outweighed the bad. To me he became a Hof lock when he played the super bowl on a broken leg and was the best player in the game.

Yeah, TO is a headcase but slam dunk HOF player.

Then you go, what does HOF mean? Is it about the person, or the player? Because if it's about the player, as it should be, since the whole point is the sport between the whistles, then yeah.

But the person matters too, because we revere heroes, and they can't be Tyreek Hills.

Marshall is a hell of a player, it's too bad the circumstances didn't line up better...I like him more than TO for some reason, but if we are taking about 'deserves' as some sort of measure of 'did it the right way' then Rod Smith should be in there five times before either of those cats.

There will always be a huge "What if?" hanging over the careers of Cutler and Marshall for me. If McDaniels never got the job, and the Broncos had instead gone for a defensive candidate (Spagnolo was the hot name at the time but Ron Rivera was landing interviews), both Cutler/Marshall definitely would have had better fortunes. It is absolutely crazy to think that Brandon Marshall never once made it to the playoffs in his entire NFL career, and that Cutler did not fare too much better.

Obviously, Marshall is not a Hall of Fame player. If he had been a member of the Steelers, Colts, or Patriots for a long stretch of his career with some playoff stats, he actually would be worthy of a discussion.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

There will always be a huge "What if?" hanging over the careers of Cutler and Marshall for me. If McDaniels never got the job, and the Broncos had instead gone for a defensive candidate (Spagnolo was the hot name at the time but Ron Rivera was landing interviews), both Cutler/Marshall definitely would have had better fortunes. It is absolutely crazy to think that Brandon Marshall never once made it to the playoffs in his entire NFL career, and that Cutler did not fare too much better.

Obviously, Marshall is not a Hall of Fame player. If he had been a member of the Steelers, Colts, or Patriots for a long stretch of his career with some playoff stats, he actually would be worthy of a discussion.

It's hard to imagine Cutler being any different with Steve Spagnolo or Ron Rivera. But, his alienation from his teammates didn't seem to be as great in Denver with Mike Shanahan. Shanny seemed to be able to reach him.

I've always wondered what would have happened if Pat Bowlen gave Mike 1 more year. Then McDaniels would have destroyed some other franchise.

Or if they had picked Spagnolo or someone else. The record would have been better in 2009 and 2010, so no Von Miller in 2011. They probably would have stuck with Cutler right up till 2012. On the other hand, nobody else would have been as insane with their draft picks like McMoron.

Broncos in the first and second round in 2009 had FIVE total picks, #s 12, 18, 37, 48, 64. Yet they came away with: Knowshon Moreno, Robert Ayers, Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath and TE Richard Quinn. I don't even know how drafting that bad is possible!

I watch a lot of Bears games because I grew up in a Chi Sports family, and I can tell you Cutler got absolutely demolished year in and year out by terrible protection in front of him. I would go as far to say that Cutler would actually still be in the league if he had not been traded. Cutler's deal was he could win games solely on his arm... But he also lost a lot of games with his arrogance. Cutler with Hillis, Marshall, and protection with a defensive minded HC has the team back in the playoffs in 2011 and probably still beating the Steelers, but as you said no Von Miller.

Originally Posted by Cugel

It's hard to imagine Cutler being any different with Steve Spagnolo or Ron Rivera. But, his alienation from his teammates didn't seem to be as great in Denver with Mike Shanahan. Shanny seemed to be able to reach him.

I've always wondered what would have happened if Pat Bowlen gave Mike 1 more year. Then McDaniels would have destroyed some other franchise.

Or if they had picked Spagnolo or someone else. The record would have been better in 2009 and 2010, so no Von Miller in 2011. They probably would have stuck with Cutler right up till 2012. On the other hand, nobody else would have been as insane with their draft picks like McMoron.

Broncos in the first and second round in 2009 had FIVE total picks, #s 12, 18, 37, 48, 64. Yet they came away with: Knowshon Moreno, Robert Ayers, Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath and TE Richard Quinn. I don't even know how drafting that bad is possible!

Jeremy Bates as well. Behind the scenes that was another piece to the drama. He loved Bates and when Mcd understandably went with his own guys. Jay was even more pissed.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

I watch a lot of Bears games because I grew up in a Chi Sports family, and I can tell you Cutler got absolutely demolished year in and year out by terrible protection in front of him. I would go as far to say that Cutler would actually still be in the league if he had not been traded. Cutler's deal was he could win games solely on his arm... But he also lost a lot of games with his arrogance. Cutler with Hillis, Marshall, and protection with a defensive minded HC has the team back in the playoffs in 2011 and probably still beating the Steelers, but as you said no Von Miller.

Jay's immaturity along with the circumstances of McD and so was really the tale of his career. Who knows if we had gone straight to Fox or Kubes how he may have turned out with more consistency (team wise) but a good part of that onus was on Jay as well. Jay should have had faith in this teammates in Denver to remain but instead chose to jump ship because of that arrogance.

3 pages for a simple NO.

Originally Posted by Nomad

3 pages for a simple NO.

Offseason is rough, and June/July are even rougher. Marshall certainly did have an impact on the league with regards to mental health, but I think what gets understated here is the impact he had on the television he broke (along with his wrist) after he slipped on a McDonald's bag. Athletes across ALL the major sports leagues surely learned to be more cautious about discarding fast food bags onto the ground after that incident.

If he didn't have the mental demons he would have been. Talent wasn't an issue. And he was productive at high levels for quite some time. Just didn't have the finishing touch, so to speak.

Originally Posted by King87

If he didn't have the mental demons he would have been. Talent wasn't an issue. And he was productive at high levels for quite some time. Just didn't have the finishing touch, so to speak.

No way to prove or disprove. Mental demons or not, he is not HOF material.

Originally Posted by Davii

No way to prove or disprove. Mental demons or not, he is not HOF material.

Based off the facts before us, no, he is not.

The rest of that is just my opinion. I like to opine. It suits me fine. It makes me kind. Opiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiine!

Originally Posted by Davii

No way to prove or disprove. Mental demons or not, he is not HOF material.

I think he pretty clearly had Hof talent. I don't even see how that's in dispute. His mental issues clearly hurt his career.

Originally Posted by Cugel

Didn't he have one game where he caught 21 passes or something? He gets consideration, but I doubt whether he gets in anytime soon. Perhaps he can lobby the Geezer Consideration Committee in a couple of decades. Or he can go into broadcasting, make a career of that and in a decade or so, he's still in the public eye, so the voters remember him. Guys like Gradishar just became "where are they now?" when they were done, so it's hard for them to get in.

I went to that game in Indianapolis.....the broncos lost of course, because the broncos are 0-7 with me in attendance in the stadium they are playing.

Originally Posted by sneakers

970 career receptions
12351 yards
83 TD

https://www.pro-football-reference.c...M/MarsBr00.htm

NO!!!

Originally Posted by Northman

Jay's immaturity along with the circumstances of McD and so was really the tale of his career. Who knows if we had gone straight to Fox or Kubes how he may have turned out with more consistency (team wise) but a good part of that onus was on Jay as well. Jay should have had faith in this teammates in Denver to remain but instead chose to jump ship because of that arrogance.

That narrative bears no correspondence to the facts. Jay didn't "choose" to do anything. The very first thing McMoron did when he hit town was to decide to trade Cutler for Matt Cassel. That was already an insane idea because Cutler was worth much more in trade than Matt Cassel.

He heard initially from McMoron the typical "hi, I'm the new head coach, glad to work with you, glad you're my QB, yada-yada."

Then IMMEDIATELY, within about 1 day, McMoron was actively trying to acquire Matt Cassel from the Patriots and trade Cutler. He was lying to Cutler, lying to the media, lying to everybody in the typical arrogant Cheetriots manner. He even had his desk arranged exactly like Bill Belichick.

Then Belichick screwed McMoron and traded Matt Cassel to KC for a 2nd round pick. Now McMoron has blown all his bridges.

The fans are pissed at him because of his idiot Cutler for Cassel trade idea. He was stuck with Cutler, and had to deal with him. Cutler was pissed at him because of being lied to. There was the immediate pissing match between Cutler and McMoron where Cutler wanted to be traded.

Pat Bowlen tried to get into it, but at this point there was no way to repair that relationship. Under pressure from all sides McMoron sat down with Cutler and delivered a 20 minute monologue on how nothing was his fault. Cutler then issued a presser in which he stated what was the obvious truth -- that he had gone into the meeting expecting McMoron to mend the fences so that they could work together for the season, and then McMoron could work out a trade or whatever the next season (2010).

But, McMoron had other ideas. He was simply going to lie massively to shift all the blame to Cutler. At this point it was 100% on McMoron and ZERO percent on Cutler.

Then Cutler, being arrogant Jay decided that he wanted to get out of town. So, when Pat Bowlen called him personally and left a message he, Cutler, ignored the message, totally disrespecting Mr. B. B. was correctly angry and told McMoron to go ahead and trade Cutler.

Then multiple teams approached Denver with trade offers. I think the Jets offer was the highest (they had a high first round pick). But, McMoron had already decided that he wanted Kyle Orton as his QB so this limited him to doing business with Chicago. So, that's what he did.

Then he wasted all those picks on Knowshon Moreno, Robert Ayers, Alphonso Smith, Darcel McBath and TE Richard Quinn.

Meanwhile Cutler went on to Chicago, where they welcomed him like a hero. However, being Jay he alienated the fans and his teammates with his "I don't care attitude."

That's why I think Shanny's firing was a disaster for Cutler. It seemed like Shanahan was able to coach him and nobody else ever seemed able to reach him. IDK if that would actually have been true in future of course, because it never happened.