Thread: How is Tebow out of the league...

Originally Posted by Freyaka

Why must you always take anything said and just turn it into complete hyperbole? I don't think anyone realistically thinks we have a good shot at a Superbowl with Flacco.

I don't think SF's being too unreasonable here.

Originally Posted by King87

I don't think SF's being too unreasonable here.

Who have you seen acting like we're winning a superbowl because of this move? For that matter who on these boards is even overly excited about this move? Most of us were thoroughly unenthused. I think Shane's off base with this constant "OH SO WE'RE GOING TO THE SUPERBOWL WITH FLACCO" nonsense.

I've not seen a single person even suggest playoffs are likely, just that he's an upgrade over Case. Which is really, the lowest of low bars you can set at this point in time.

Originally Posted by King87

I don't think SF's being too unreasonable here.

That's a matter of opinion I guess, because I too think he went a bit over the top.

Originally Posted by Freyaka

Who have you seen acting like we're winning a superbowl because of this move? For that matter who on these boards is even overly excited about this move? Most of us were thoroughly unenthused. I think Shane's off base with this constant "OH SO WE'RE GOING TO THE SUPERBOWL WITH FLACCO" nonsense.

I've not seen a single person even suggest playoffs are likely, just that he's an upgrade over Case. Which is really, the lowest of low bars you can set at this point in time.

If the response to a question about his merits (whether the question is implicit or explicit) is he's won a SB, then his response is fine. It's a coy way, really, of picking apart some of Flacco's resume.

I saw on some sports show Flacco is last in QBR, TDs, and win loss record for any starting QB in the league since 2012 with 75 starts. I expect he can be better than that, but it's a projection.

Originally Posted by King87

I don't think SF's being too unreasonable here.

Yes and no.

I love Shane, i really do but if you are being honest at all the guys that Shane Loves/trumps/champions whatever have never tasted the success that Flacco has. Keep in mind, this does not make Flacco a HOF QB, in fact he probably has a lot more in common with Trent Difler and Brad Johnson. But the point i was making is that Flacco does have that experience, he does have far more consistency in the NFL with holding down a starting job than Kelly or Tebow and that is what im getting at.

Shane's comment was why one guy was in the league the other was not. My picture of Joe with the trophy wasnt to say that Denver is going to win the SB with him, only that Flacco has indeed done something that Tebow and Kelly have not. And lets be clear here, when it comes to Dilfer and Johnson both of those guys had way better defenses than Joe had when he won the SB. If Denver can at the very least get "that" version of Flacco i think we will be ok for a couple of years while we try and find our next QB.

Originally Posted by Northman

Yes and no.

I love Shane, i really do but if you are being honest at all the guys that Shane Loves/trumps/champions whatever have never tasted the success that Flacco has. Keep in mind, this does not make Flacco a HOF QB, in fact he probably has a lot more in common with Trent Difler and Brad Johnson. But the point i was making is that Flacco does have that experience, he does have far more consistency in the NFL with holding down a starting job than Kelly or Tebow and that is what im getting at.

Shane's comment was why one guy was in the league the other was not. My picture of Joe with the trophy wasnt to say that Denver is going to win the SB with him, only that Flacco has indeed done something that Tebow and Kelly have not. And lets be clear here, when it comes to Dilfer and Johnson both of those guys had way better defenses than Joe had when he won the SB. If Denver can at the very least get "that" version of Flacco i think we will be ok for a couple of years while we try and find our next QB.

I agree his guys aren't as successful as Flacco was. But I think, at heart of SF's commentary, is that it's just that, he was. And I know that you know that because you're a Viking. I don't disagree with you about the holding down a job, either.

I also get your standpoint to - it's not like you're expecting a SB win, but an experienced hand at QB does have some merit.

Originally Posted by Northman

Yes and no.

I love Shane, i really do but if you are being honest at all the guys that Shane Loves/trumps/champions whatever have never tasted the success that Flacco has. Keep in mind, this does not make Flacco a HOF QB, in fact he probably has a lot more in common with Trent Difler and Brad Johnson. But the point i was making is that Flacco does have that experience, he does have far more consistency in the NFL with holding down a starting job than Kelly or Tebow and that is what im getting at.

Shane's comment was why one guy was in the league the other was not. My picture of Joe with the trophy wasnt to say that Denver is going to win the SB with him, only that Flacco has indeed done something that Tebow and Kelly have not. And lets be clear here, when it comes to Dilfer and Johnson both of those guys had way better defenses than Joe had when he won the SB. If Denver can at the very least get "that" version of Flacco i think we will be ok for a couple of years while we try and find our next QB.

I think that might be the most unbelievable understatement of the new Millenium.

Let me see if I get this straight. If the Broncos could only get the miracle 2012 Joe Flacco, the'd be "ok" for a couple of years "until they could find their new QB?" Did I hear that right?

2012 Joe Flacco had a career moment. He was that guy who gets suddenly hot in the playoffs he is shocked they even have gotten into. And somehow, unexpectedly, they go on a run and just keep going until they win a Super Bowl. For reasons that in retrospect never make any real sense, but somehow, inside the locker room, they just seemed to make sense at the time. And somehow, magically it just seemed to work.

The seas parted before him, Rahim Moore fell over his own shoes, and suddenly, magically, the Ravens get past the 13-3 Broncos and even ambush the Patriots in a game where the Ravens scored 28 point, and utterly dominated the Patriots in the second half, scoring 21 points in the second half while Flacco threw 3 TDs.

It's just about the only time the Patriots lost an AFC Playoff Game at Gillette Stadium. They hardly ever lose there, but they lost that day, and badly.

Then of course they went on to crush the 49ers in the SB. It would have been a total blowout except for the extensive power failure time out that allowed the shellshocked and clearly beaten 49ers to clearly re-group and make a game of it in the second half.

I would love to be 25 again and meet my ex-girlfriend when I was living in NY, and go through all those wonderful experiences again. We'd get into all the exclusive clubs in NY where especially the ones where the snobby door men used to take screening out the unglamourous and un-famous as their job description. But we always got in right away, because she was tall and blonde and busty and beautiful and doormen took one look at her and waived her in. They'd glare at me and look me up and down in disapproval, but I got in too because I was holding her arm tight so they couldn't separate us. Those were some good times.

But, I'll never relive all those experiences ever again. I'm older now and you don't ever get to go back.

Joe Flacco doesn't ever get to go back to that magical time. He hasn't come close once in the last 5 seasons, and nobody expects him to now.

Originally Posted by King87

Jackie Robinson ran for office and made policy to allow for the integration of African-Americans into baseball. Koufax certainly did that same thing regarding pitching on holiday. And, thank god, the pre-game ceremonies are apolitical and have nothing to do with government or the country. Thank the lord herself that Ali was never political during his time as a boxer. There is certainly no history of minority athletes being political during their time of competition, and if there was nothing good could possibly come from it.

Wait a minute...

Robinson, Koufax and Ali 1) didn't become athletes to promote their political and/or religious agendas, 2) were actually good enough at their jobs that they're best remembered for THAT, not their activism, and consequently 3) also didn't suddenly "discover" their "deep convictions" a few months before going from "starting team captain earning an eight-figure annual salary" to "unemployed." Jackie Robinson wasn't trying to make some kind of freakin' political statement, just playing baseball--so well it was IMPOSSIBLE to keep him out of the majors. Sandy Koufax pitched during the World Series; he didn't do nationally broadcast TV ads in the middle of it citing HIMSELF as the best argument against abortion before he was even in MLB, let alone participating in the World Series as anything but a spectator.

Ali's the "best" comparison, but even that's a stretch because not only was he "The Greatest," he actually sacrificed a great deal for his convictions, rather than simply using them to "earn" another $15 million as a benchwarmer. Keapernick would have to WIN a championship before he could be stripped of one, and he's not out of the league because of his politics, but because he sucks; he just became political AFTER the trade deadline in an attempt to make the team already committed to a $15 million cap hit release him so he could get even MORE from some other team.

Sorry, man, but "they" DON'T "all look alike" to me.

Originally Posted by Joel

Robinson, Koufax and Ali 1) didn't become athletes to promote their political and/or religious agendas, 2) were actually good enough at their jobs that they're best remembered for THAT, not their activism, and consequently 3) also didn't suddenly "discover" their "deep convictions" a few months before going from "starting team captain earning an eight-figure annual salary" to "unemployed." Jackie Robinson wasn't trying to make some kind of freakin' political statement, just playing baseball--so well it was IMPOSSIBLE to keep him out of the majors. Sandy Koufax pitched during the World Series; he didn't do nationally broadcast TV ads in the middle of it citing HIMSELF as the best argument against abortion before he was even in MLB, let alone participating in the World Series as anything but a spectator.

Ali's the "best" comparison, but even that's a stretch because not only was he "The Greatest," he actually sacrificed a great deal for his convictions, rather than simply using them to "earn" another $15 million as a benchwarmer. Keapernick would have to WIN a championship before he could be stripped of one, and he's not out of the league because of his politics, but because he sucks; he just became political AFTER the trade deadline in an attempt to make the team already committed to a $15 million cap hit release him so he could get even MORE from some other team.

Sorry, man, but "they" DON'T "all look alike" to me.

First sentence, are you sure that Kaep did? Because the evidence for that seems to be non-existent. Kaep might not have been a great QB, but his play was good enough to be in the league. Ah, now you baselessly insist that Kaep become an activist because he wasn't starting. What's the basis for that? Jackie Robinson knew very well what his playing meant and embraced it, so let's not rewrite history. Robinson was a great player, but there were other great players who were black. He knew he was the first one into the MLB.

Koufax was or wasn't vocal about pitching on a Jewish holiday? I'm not making any one to one comparisons because I don't have to. In general, there's a rich history of athletes and politics. The breadth of the instances is pretty obvious. You cite to him being out of the leauge because of his play, yet stat analysis after analysis indicated he was better than quite a few of the starters, and certainly good enough to be a backup QB. For reference, Mark Sanchez was in the league last year. Paxton Lynch just signed with Seattle. Don't go down that road - it's pathetic and so obviously wrong.

Oh, they might not all look alike to you, but you're more than happy to tell them to shut their mouths and know their place.

Originally Posted by Northman

Yes and no.

I love Shane, i really do but if you are being honest at all the guys that Shane Loves/trumps/champions whatever have never tasted the success that Flacco has. Keep in mind, this does not make Flacco a HOF QB, in fact he probably has a lot more in common with Trent Difler and Brad Johnson. But the point i was making is that Flacco does have that experience, he does have far more consistency in the NFL with holding down a starting job than Kelly or Tebow and that is what im getting at.

Shane's comment was why one guy was in the league the other was not. My picture of Joe with the trophy wasnt to say that Denver is going to win the SB with him, only that Flacco has indeed done something that Tebow and Kelly have not. And lets be clear here, when it comes to Dilfer and Johnson both of those guys had way better defenses than Joe had when he won the SB. If Denver can at the very least get "that" version of Flacco i think we will be ok for a couple of years while we try and find our next QB.

Shane Falco was a Replacement player. People thought Martel was all hot shit. But Falco led the Washington Sentinels to the playoffs.