Thread: Kubiak will NOT be the OC

Originally Posted by VonDoom

Reports are that we’re very interested in Lock.

Good, i would rather take him than Haskins.

Originally Posted by chazoe60

His Completion percentage scares the shit out of me. So sick of inaccurate QBs.

Yeah, this is my problem with Jones too. I saw one scouting report that compared Lock to Paxton Lynch, which also concerns me. Said his mental abilities are behind. We’ve been there before!

Originally Posted by VonDoom

Yeah, this is my problem with Jones too. I saw one scouting report that compared Lock to Paxton Lynch, which also concerns me. Said his mental abilities are behind. We’ve been there before!

If that's the case, then hard pass.

Originally Posted by VonDoom

Originally Posted by chazoe60

His Completion percentage scares the shit out of me. So sick of inaccurate QBs.

Yeah, this is my problem with Jones too. I saw one scouting report that compared Lock to Paxton Lynch, which also concerns me. Said his mental abilities are behind. We’ve been there before!

I don't think that's even close. When you look at him transitioning to the pro-style offense this year. And he is said to be a good leader. My concern is that he's always been inaccurate. Like I said before Shanahan always said if a kid was inaccurate in college he wasn't just going to Magically become accurate in the pros

Originally Posted by Jsteve01

I don't think that's even close. When you look at him transitioning to the pro-style offense this year. And he is said to be a good leader. My concern is that he's always been inaccurate. Like I said before Shanahan always said if a kid was inaccurate in college he wasn't just going to Magically become accurate in the pros

As I say, that was only one guy's opinion - I'm looking for dissent there, because I think we're targeting him and I don't want to kill myself. So you saying that's not close makes me feel better.

I've watched a couple of games of film from Lock and haven't been super impressed but I didn't get a Lynch vibe. My biggest problem with watching him is that most of the passes I've seen have been quick flat routes or swing passes. Hard to evaluate a guy at an NFL level when he's not asked to make a lot of NFL throws. Maybe it's just the games I saw, I don't know. I don't have a scout's eye.

And yes, completion percentage is a concern. This was my major knock on Allen last year - you can't teach accuracy.

To be honest, I've watched a little of all the top QB's this year and I haven't been in love with any of them. I haven't hated them either, I just can't find myself getting excited. We need whoever it is to work out or we're right back where we started.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

If that's the case, then hard pass.

Hmmm, yea i may have to rethink this. Didnt realize his accuracy was that bad. Even Finley and Stidham are way down there. To be somewhat fair to Lock though his QBR was in the 80's but that wont mean it will translate to the pros. But i do wonder how much of it is reliant on the teams they are on. The top 4 most accurate QB's are,

Tua- Bama
Murray- OU
Grier- WVU
Haskins- OSU

Then you have a guy like McKenzie from UCF who is ranked 9th in efficiency.

Meanwhile, a few of the guys i had been watching were much lower on the list,

Lock- 27th
Finley- 26th
Stidham- 52nd
Jones- 66th


Even Herbert is ranked 37th right now although he isnt coming out.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/...t/individual/8

Im still not comfortable with trading up this year though, just too many needs so we may need to take a guy like White at 10 and then gamble on a QB later which was kind of my plan for this year anyway. But i was pretty high on Lock until i saw his accuracy numbers.

Lock, Thorson and maybe even Stidham are the ones I would like the most from this draft. However Haskins is a wildcard, but dude seems to have tremendous upside. Lock has improved every year, shows maturity and growth consistently and has a full NFL skill set with a very good arm. His accuracy was a bit worrisome prior to this year, but his mechanics were improved yet again this year for the third year in a row and he completed more then 60% of his passes this season. Also I listen to what scouts have to say not some fan of Missouri....Fans are super bias about their own teams players good or bad.....just look at us on this board....Lots of scouts like Lock, Haskins, Jones and Stidham and think all 4 have long term potential. Murray is a huge wildcard as well because of his size. To me the difference this year compared to last year is 2 QB's were ready to start day 1 last year in Mayfield and Darnold, and there were thoughts that if Rosen or Allen had to start day 1, it could go either way...we saw that to hold true. This year I agree with what I have read from talent evaluators that their are a few Qb's with long term potential as franchise Qb's and that they will need some development time. Most scouts feel none of these Qb's are ready day 1 which is why the difference in qb class is suggested. It doesn't mean their isn't talent in this draft, it just means they may need to sit for a year like Mahomes or Rodgers to be ready for their shot.

Originally Posted by chazoe60

His Completion percentage scares the shit out of me. So sick of inaccurate QBs.

That was my same complaint with Allen last year....The average college QB has very high completion percentages compared to the NFL. If you can't get a good completion percentage in the lower levels, you are gonna be hella inaccurate in the pros...

Case in point... Josh Allen in college 56.2 career completion percentage. Rookie year in the NFL 52.8. If it's an inaccurate passer we want, well, you know who I'm going to mention, we don't even need to name he who must not be named here... But Tebow...

The one thing I'll say with Lock Vs allen. Allen's percentage stayed at about 56% both years he was the starter. Lock's consistently trended upward. From 49% his first year, 54% second year, 57% third year and 63% his senior year. I still don't want the guy, but his completion percentage is a lot less of an issue to me than Allen's because it's clear he was getting better and growing as a QB from year to year.

Originally Posted by Northman

Hmmm, yea i may have to rethink this. Didnt realize his accuracy was that bad. Even Finley and Stidham are way down there. To be somewhat fair to Lock though his QBR was in the 80's but that wont mean it will translate to the pros. But i do wonder how much of it is reliant on the teams they are on. The top 4 most accurate QB's are,

Tua- Bama
Murray- OU
Grier- WVU
Haskins- OSU

Then you have a guy like McKenzie from UCF who is ranked 9th in efficiency.

Meanwhile, a few of the guys i had been watching were much lower on the list,

Lock- 27th
Finley- 26th
Stidham- 52nd
Jones- 66th


Even Herbert is ranked 37th right now although he isnt coming out.

https://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/...t/individual/8

Im still not comfortable with trading up this year though, just too many needs so we may need to take a guy like White at 10 and then gamble on a QB later which was kind of my plan for this year anyway. But i was pretty high on Lock until i saw his accuracy numbers.

Grier and Murray also played in a conference that doesn't play defense.....Its pretty tough not to be accurate when running consistent 5 wide sets usually someone is always open....You also have to look at the talent around Them. I am not scared away from lock the Paxton lynch comparison isn't even close.....Lynch was closer to Allen then Lock, difference there is Allen loves football through and through, lynch likes XBOX more then football.....lol

Originally Posted by Elevation inc

Grier and Murray also played in a conference that doesn't play defense.....Its pretty tough not to be accurate when running consistent 5 wide sets usually someone is always open....You also have to look at the talent around Them. I am not scared away from lock the Paxton lynch comparison isn't even close.....Lynch was closer to Allen then Lock, difference there is Allen loves football through and through, lynch likes XBOX more then football.....lol

Fair analysis as its one of the things that scares me about system guys like Murray and Haskins. BUT, while playing the college level is much easier for players because the amount of talent that actually makes it into the NFL is a small percentage if you look at the efficiency ratings for those guys and then compare them to what they would do at the pro level its a pretty accurate gauge of measure. I feel confident in those stats because i remember looking them up when Russell Wilson came out and being shocked that he was rated #1 that year despite being taken in the 3rd round. So those kinds of stats for me hold a lot of water when discussing QB's who are about to enter the NFL. The only thing it doesnt really account for is the other intangibles that the QB's bring to the table. Lamar Jackson's accuracy percentage was very low coming out of college and we have seen him struggle at the pro level yet at the same time his athleticism helped him win ballgames for Bmore this year. I dont think they will be able to maintain that unless he improves his passing efficiency but so far when it comes to the efficiency numbers in that link they have not steered me wrong when looking at each QB and their relative success in the pros.

The biggest thing for me is the Improvement with Lock.....Also for comparison Mahomes accuracy avg. his 3 years was about 61%, Lock's over 4 years is about 56%....Big hack to that number was lock's freshman year of 49%. However to go from 49% to 63% in college over 4 years with college coaching is good stuff. The common theme that Mahomes and Lock had was that they improved each year. Their final years as a starter in college, Lock had a 63% completion percentage and Mahomes a 65% completion percentage...Their is a reason Lock is considered a rd 1. prospect....The difference between guys like Paxton Lynch, Tebow, Allen is that they never really improved throughout college throwing the ball. That cant be said about Lock...

Originally Posted by Northman

Fair analysis as its one of the things that scares me about system guys like Murray and Haskins. BUT, while playing the college level is much easier for players because the amount of talent that actually makes it into the NFL is a small percentage if you look at the efficiency ratings for those guys and then compare them to what they would do at the pro level its a pretty accurate gauge of measure. I feel confident in those stats because i remember looking them up when Russell Wilson came out and being shocked that he was rated #1 that year despite being taken in the 3rd round. So those kinds of stats for me hold a lot of water when discussing QB's who are about to enter the NFL. The only thing it doesnt really account for is the other intangibles that the QB's bring to the table. Lamar Jackson's accuracy percentage was very low coming out of college and we have seen him struggle at the pro level yet at the same time his athleticism helped him win ballgames for Bmore this year. I dont think they will be able to maintain that unless he improves his passing efficiency but so far when it comes to the efficiency numbers in that link they have not steered me wrong when looking at each QB and their relative success in the pros.

I also am with you on efficiency, but their are just so many factors in the college ranks....I'm still on the Lock and Haskins bandwagons.....I am also a huge believer in Thorson (but he needs some development time). I think we could easily find a guy in any draft that with the right coaching can be the guy....

I also wouldn't be shocked to see Elway go after Foles.....

Originally Posted by Elevation inc

I also am with you on efficiency, but their are just so many factors in the college ranks....I'm still on the Lock and Haskins bandwagons.....I am also a huge believer in Thorson (but he needs some development time). I think we could easily find a guy in any draft that with the right coaching can be the guy....

I also wouldn't be shocked to see Elway go after Foles.....

I think Foles will fit well with the direction we are trying to head (A blend of West Coast and college spread/RPO)

Originally Posted by VonDoom

Yeah, this is my problem with Jones too. I saw one scouting report that compared Lock to Paxton Lynch, which also concerns me. Said his mental abilities are behind. We’ve been there before!

Lock is not like lynch.....hes more of a Cutler and flacco.

One thing to consider about him is that he has had a lot of dropped balls. Some of it his fault because he does not throw with enough touch, yet.

Hes only had to scan and read defenses for 1 year. That is concerning but at least he did it. My biggest concern is him throwing behind wr and some short hop balls. To me that says he relies too much on arm and not mechanics. Also shows lack of finesse throws I mentioned.

I still really like him.