Thread: BREAKING: Kareem Hunt another Ray Rice situation?

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

In the age of equality for all, let me pose this question to you:

If a dude came at you swearing, threatening and being a total douche, and you popped him in the mouth, would that be justified?

I guess the key word, is threatening. So yes, that would be a reasonable response. If there was no serious threat, then no

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

I guess the key word, is threatening. So yes, that would be a reasonable response. If there was no serious threat, then no

So, is it different if a woman is doing it? Is the same response warranted? Also, who defines "serious"?

I'm not saying that's what happened in this particular situation, just curious of your response.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

So, is it different if a woman is doing it? Is the same response warranted? Also, who defines "serious"?

I'm not saying that's what happened in this particular situation, just curious of your response.

If safety is your fear then gender is irrelevant. But too many people have a damaged ego and think violence is therefore justified

Serious is perception led

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

If safety is your fear then gender is irrelevant. But too many people have a damaged ego and think violence is therefore justified

Maybe, but IMO the VAST majority don't.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

Maybe, but IMO the VAST majority don't.

My experience says otherwise. Butt I am not going to fall on my sword over it

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

My experience says otherwise. Butt I am not going to fall on my sword over it

I don't doubt that, but consider the occupation you're in. I think that's a widely unsubstantiated and biased statement based on what you do for a living.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

I don't doubt that, but consider the occupation you're in. I think that's a widely unsubstantiated and biased statement based on what you do for a living.

So you think the opinion of someone not working on the field is more scientific?

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

So you think the opinion of someone not working on the field is more scientific?

I think it's the behavior of what you have to typically deal with in your profession. The majority don't have a need to see someone in your field of expertise. Hence, the biased comment.

If your accusation were accurate, the entire world would be apocalyptic.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

I think it's the behavior of what you have to typically deal with in your profession. The majority don't have a need to see someone in your field of expertise. Hence, the biased comment.

If your accusation were accurate, the entire world would be apocalyptic.

Have you seen the state of the world?

The rates of females killed by male partners in America, let alone other countries is astronomical, and those deaths aren't because the perpetrator was scared for their life

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

Have you seen the state of the world?

The rates of females killed by male partners in America, let alone other countries is astronomical, and those deaths aren't because the perpetrator was scared for their life

I think you're once again inserting your bias into the conversation. Yes, the rates are not acceptable, but aren't any more than blacks killing blacks, men killing men, or any other sort of statistic you can throw out there.

The last study I read was 1,800 women were killed by a man in the US in 2016. There were over 17,000 homicides total. I'm not discounting the problem, but it's not as bad as you are stating it to be. Clearly, and theoretically, any murder/homicide is a problem, but it isn't reaching the elevation you're claiming.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

I think you're once again inserting your bias into the conversation. Yes, the rates are not acceptable, but aren't any more than blacks killing blacks, men killing men, or any other sort of statistic you can throw out there.

The last study I read was 1,800 women were killed by a man in the US in 2016. There were over 17,000 homicides total. I'm not discounting the problem, but it's not as bad as you are stating it to be. Clearly, and theoretically, any murder/homicide is a problem, but it isn't reaching the elevation you're claiming.

fair enough

I have no problem holding Hunt with 100% accountability for what he did. But i also understand KCL's point in that everyone should hold themselves accountable for their own actions. If Dave wants to think that we are victim blaming than i cant change his mind but here is my take on the woman herself which is a separate issue from Hunt's own actions.

1) She was drinking/drunk while being underage. It may be normalized in society but still against the law regardless.
2) Her out of control behavior (which includes any racial slurs directed at a minority) is totally and overwhelmingly unacceptable for any human being.

If i was her father sure, i would be really angry that some dude got physical with her in that manner but dont mistake as a father i would be all up in my daughters shit as to why she was behaving like that in the first place. If there was an issue about her phone she could have gotten security or even the police to handle the situation except she chose to engage with Hunt and company in a negative way. So yes, that onus is on her. The aftermath however is all on Kareem and the NFL and Chiefs have done the right thing because there should be penalties for actions no matter who you are.

In the end humans should treat each other with respect and that includes not degrading another human being because of their race, gender, religious beliefs, etc no matter if you are drunk or not. There are many ways this situation could have been handled from both ends of the spectrum and while the onus is put on Hunt in what he did there is no problem with pointing out that the young woman was out of line herself. She didnt deserve to get hit or kicked but that doesnt give her the ok to treat a black man like that either.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

I think you're once again inserting your bias into the conversation. Yes, the rates are not acceptable, but aren't any more than blacks killing blacks, men killing men, or any other sort of statistic you can throw out there.

The last study I read was 1,800 women were killed by a man in the US in 2016. There were over 17,000 homicides total. I'm not discounting the problem, but it's not as bad as you are stating it to be. Clearly, and theoretically, any murder/homicide is a problem, but it isn't reaching the elevation you're claiming.

actually, no not fair enough.

Your analysis is simply not accurate.

1 in 4 women will be abused by a male partner. That's 25% of the population.

90% of women attending ER with a physical injury is caused by male violence - 5% of men attending ER with a physical injury is caused by womens violence. I could go on with the disparity in harm caused by males towards females, but that is not relevant to this thread as i have said before......Hunt is not a domestic abuse issue, and you started asking me about suitable responses to violence based on my accurate description of victim blaming - i essentially gave you my rules of engagement in Iraq and Afghanistan to explain when force should be used. I then explained most people that use violence do not do so, because they felt threatened physically, but because their ego was bruised (or their insecurities were triggered, or they were worried about someone doing anything else other than physically harming them) - and this is accurate in all those forms of violence you quoted, men killing men and every other statistic you can throw out there as you put it. ALL THOSE ACTS OF VIOLENCE WERE NOT COMMITTED BY THOSE FEARING FOR THEIR LIFE - some were pre-meditated, some were drug fueled, some were gang related, some were status driven - BUT VERY FEW WOULD HAVE BEEN IN SELF DEFENCE OR AS A RESULT OF BEING THREATENED

excuse the Joel-esque capitals, but it is hard to explain how wrong you are.

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

actually, no not fair enough.

Your analysis is simply not accurate.

1 in 4 women will be abused by a male partner. That's 25% of the population.

90% of women attending ER with a physical injury is caused by male violence - 5% of men attending ER with a physical injury is caused by womens violence. I could go on with the disparity in harm caused by males towards females, but that is not relevant to this thread as i have said before......Hunt is not a domestic abuse issue, and you started asking me about suitable responses to violence based on my accurate description of victim blaming - i essentially gave you my rules of engagement in Iraq and Afghanistan to explain when force should be used. I then explained most people that use violence do not do so, because they felt threatened physically, but because their ego was bruised (or their insecurities were triggered, or they were worried about someone doing anything else other than physically harming them) - and this is accurate in all those forms of violence you quoted, men killing men and every other statistic you can throw out there as you put it. ALL THOSE ACTS OF VIOLENCE WERE NOT COMMITTED BY THOSE FEARING FOR THEIR LIFE - some were pre-meditated, some were drug fueled, some were gang related, some were status driven - BUT VERY FEW WOULD HAVE BEEN IN SELF DEFENCE OR AS A RESULT OF BEING THREATENED

excuse the Joel-esque capitals, but it is hard to explain how wrong you are.

Where did you get those statistics? 90% of women going to the ER is caused by male violence? I have a hard time believing that.