Thread: Broncos Gameday Thread: Broncos vs Steelers 11/25/18

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

We got Von Miller and won a super bowl because we bottomed out the year of that draft. If you hit on that draft pick, tanking can work.

Would we want this team to tank if we were probably out of it and we could get John Elway out of the draft?

Yeah, we would.

Originally Posted by Tbolt

I’m sorry I am trashing your tanking narrative. So what if Denver had done what most people were thinking and taken Marcel Dareus or Patrick Peterson instead of Von? We still win SB 50, or are we the Cardinals?

The draft is a consolation to sell fans of losing franchises hope. But in a parity league, that’s often false hope. See Cleveland and Detroit SB record. They draft high. Often. Maybe eventually they figure it out. Still have to change the culture, not miss on picks, and hope you don’t get freak injuries. That is not exactly formulaic for tanking.

As for Luck, he is very good, I wouldn’t say great.7 years in he has been to and lost one Championship game. So had Jay Cutler. I like Luck. As a player. He makes the Colts better no doubt. But so does Rapistburger for Pitt, and the Stealers didn’t have to tank to get him.

So you mean he's a great player who can carry a team to the AFCCG and he's so good you would literally need one of the worst rosters in the game to do poorly with him?

So, in other words, if he had a decent roster for most of his time he would probably be in more AFCCG, and most QB's aren't talented enough to be at that level?

Originally Posted by Tbolt

You missed my point entirely. Tanking in the NBA makes sense because you can build around 1 guy. With only 5 on the court it makes more sense. That formula doesn’t work in the NFL, yet fans cry all the time to do just that. So you are agreeing with me, yet trying to argue the point we agree on.

Also, I don’t think Luck is that great. Very few players have been able to carry a franchise on their own. Really, I can only think of one, and that one was Elway. Even he needed some help, but he absolutely carried teams.

Plus guys get their careers ruined all the time going to the wrong team. Steve Young was a bust for the longest time.

Fun fact, passing on Montana was one of the only times the Cowboys didn’t take the top guy on their board. If they had instead of Doug Cosbie, everything in the 80’s NFL is different.

No, I didn't miss the point. The analogy doesn't fit in any way, shape, or form. One man teams don't work. You typically need two stars. These days you need three stars. You can stick with the NBA all you want as an analogy if you want.

We have literally seen QB's get drafted recently and go nuts and transform their teams. There's this strange myth that if you move up or target a QB literally everything falls on him. So because the Rams traded up for Goff, did they stop building a great team? No. They built a great team. They still went and got their QB.

If you think Luck isn't legitimate, you really need to go back and look at those rosters he dragged to the playoffs.

Guys do get their careers ruined all the time. Hopefully we don't grab an elite talent and ruin him.

Fun fact, the odds get worse each round for finding a great QB.

Originally Posted by BigDaddyBronco

That would be King's MO.

Yeah, because having a solid opinion on tanking that isn't shortsighed and properly recognizing CK's merit is so awful. You're consistently rude to me. Welcome to ignore.

Dread, it's good to have you back. I don't care how much we disagree, I'll always love you.

Originally Posted by King87

No, I didn't miss the point. The analogy doesn't fit in any way, shape, or form. One man teams don't work. You typically need two stars. These days you need three stars. You can stick with the NBA all you want as an analogy if you want.

We have literally seen QB's get drafted recently and go nuts and transform their teams. There's this strange myth that if you move up or target a QB literally everything falls on him. So because the Rams traded up for Goff, did they stop building a great team? No. They built a great team. They still went and got their QB.

If you think Luck isn't legitimate, you really need to go back and look at those rosters he dragged to the playoffs.

Guys do get their careers ruined all the time. Hopefully we don't grab an elite talent and ruin him.

Fun fact, the odds get worse each round for finding a great QB.

Are you being willfully obtuse, or are you always this ignorant?

I am NOT comparing the NFL to NBA strategy of tanking to get better. I am saying fans think they are the same. The desire to tank in the NFL in no way works the same way, where you see the same awful franchises picking high, year after year.

There is nothing stopping the Broncos from dealing for a QB. Denver has had 4 QB's take us to a Championship game, none of whom we drafted.

Again, do you suffer from reading comprehension issues? I said Luck was very good and makes the Colts better. How does that in any way, shape or form equal I think he is illegitimate? And guess what, since they sucked for Luck, where is the supporting cast he should have since they picked high in every round?

Gee, thanks for that Mr. Wizard. I thought every team found a Tom Brady late in the draft. Who the hell is arguing that point? But you are over valuing sucking and drafting high. Just where were the top 10 QB's of 2018 taken in the draft anyway?

Drew Brees 32nd
Ben Rapistburger 11th
Patrick Mahomes 10th
Jared Goff 1st overall
Kirk Cousins 102nd
Matt Ryan 3rd
Aaron Rodgers 24th
Phillip Rivers 2nd
Andrew Luck 1st
Eli Manning 1st

So half the top 10 NFL passing leaders were drafted in reach of pretty much any team that wanted to make a move for them. The other half Eli, Luck, Goff, Rivers and Ryan you had to suck for. Of that group, only washed up Eli has won a SB. I'd take the other 5 over those 5 QB's any day.

Basically, all I am saying, is a winning culture is more important than where you draft. Pittsburgh had it when they took the Rapist. GB when they took the Scientologist. KC was still trying to win a SB with Smith when they took Mahomes. You can both try to win and also draft for the future, and history is on the side of teams that do both.

But, to surmise, great win over Pitt, on to Cincinnati.