Thread: Broncos Gameday Thread: Broncos vs Chargers 11/18/18

Originally Posted by King87

**** You Keenum!

Love?

I was so pissed at VJ in this game. He almost cost us the game again. Going for it on 4th down cost us 3 points and not challenging the 2 point conversion cost another 2. That is 5 points off the board from poor coaching. The list is so long on bone head mistakes its unreal.

Originally Posted by NightTerror218

I was so pissed at VJ in this game. He almost cost us the game again. Going for it on 4th down cost us 3 points and not challenging the 2 point conversion cost another 2. That is 5 points off the board from poor coaching. The list is so long on bone head mistakes its unreal.

I'd rather a coach with the balls to go for it than a chicken like fox who plays to tie. Did you complain when he went for it on a fake punt and resulted in a TD? Would you have complained if he'd have gotten the 4th and gotten 7 points instead of settling for 3?

It's easy to second guess him, but for all his incompetencies, this wasn't one of them. When you are facing a high powered offense, settling for points won't work, you need TD's not field goals. Go for the throat.

As for the challenge. He's caught a TON of flack for challenging things when he shouldn't from the media and fans and I have zero doubt that Elway has told him "you need to listen to the booth" He had that challenge flag out ready to throw it, the booth told him no. You could see how pissed he was that he couldn't throw the flag.

The guy has a lot of flaws as a coach he deserves criticism for, these two are not valid IMO.

Originally Posted by Freyaka

I'd rather a coach with the balls to go for it than a chicken like fox who plays to tie. Did you complain when he went for it on a fake punt and resulted in a TD? Would you have complained if he'd have gotten the 4th and gotten 7 points instead of settling for 3?

It's easy to second guess him, but for all his incompetencies, this wasn't one of them. When you are facing a high powered offense, settling for points won't work, you need TD's not field goals. Go for the throat.

As for the challenge. He's caught a TON of flack for challenging things when he shouldn't from the media and fans and I have zero doubt that Elway has told him "you need to listen to the booth" He had that challenge flag out ready to throw it, the booth told him no. You could see how pissed he was that he couldn't throw the flag.

The guy has a lot of flaws as a coach he deserves criticism for, these two are not valid IMO.

I agree with the first one - I have no problem being aggressive there. Running three straight times and not getting three yards is on Musgrave and the players, IMO.

Disagree on the challenge though. I watched this again last night. Before they even go to commercial, they have a pretty definitive view that Keenum made it. Not sure why the booth didn’t tell him to challenge it (so not all on him) but two points there were huge and worth a risk even if he truly wasn’t sure

Originally Posted by VonDoom

I agree with the first one - I have no problem being aggressive there. Running three straight times and not getting three yards is on Musgrave and the players, IMO.

Disagree on the challenge though. I watched this again last night. Before they even go to commercial, they have a pretty definitive view that Keenum made it. Not sure why the booth didn’t tell him to challenge it (so not all on him) but two points there were huge and worth a risk even if he truly wasn’t sure

That's on the booth for telling him no. And we also can't assume that because the broadcast booth has that view, that our review booth has it too. We don't know which views were available to them.

Bottom line, he wanted to challenge it and he was told not to (this was confirmed in interviews after as well) So if it was definitive, that's on the booth for telling him no. My gut is VJ's on a very short leash and has strict instructions to follow what the booth asks for right now (which obviously is speculation on my part, but it's not a huge leap to assume something like that given past history with challenges)

You have no idea what the booth actually told him. What Radio said later at a presser is not relevant. It's just as likely that they were confused about whether it was an official's review or if it was subject to challenge. Heck even the broadcast official got it wrong first. Also, your suppositions about Elway putting him on a short lease for challenges is pretty lame.

Fact is, he should have challenged and didn't, and it likely had a direct impact on the game.

Originally Posted by LawDog

You have no idea what the booth actually told him. What Radio said later at a presser is not relevant. It's just as likely that they were confused about whether it was an official's review or if it was subject to challenge. Heck even the broadcast official got it wrong first. Also, your suppositions about Elway putting him on a short lease for challenges is pretty lame.

Fact is, he should have challenged and didn't, and it likely had a direct impact on the game.

League told the team the call would have stood.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

League told the team the call would have stood.

Which you would think would end discussion on it, but somehow I suspect, that won't stop anyone.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

League told the team the call would have stood.

To add a source to this and put this train of thought to bed once and for all.

NFL officiating boss Al Riveron informed Broncos the league would NOT have overturned ruling on field that Broncos' 2-pt try was no good, per league source. Not enough evidence to overturn. Vance Joseph made right call by not challenging, saving key TO needed for win. #9sports

— Mike Klis (@MikeKlis) November 21, 2018

League explanation confirming Joseph decision not to challenge 2-pt try makes sense. There has to be "clear and obvious visual evidence" for a reversal and there was not. Football analytics director Mitch Tanney can sleep easy. #9sports

— Mike Klis (@MikeKlis) November 21, 2018

Originally Posted by Freyaka

To add a source to this and put this train of thought to bed once and for all.

The fact that it IS an issue of discussion (and not just on this board) would seem to cut against the league's proclamation that it is a settled issue with a clear ruling that things would not have changed. Personally, I get a bit annoyed when the league comments on calls or non-calls after the fact because it changes nothing. Maybe it's not really the "league" commenting but "sources", however I still don't care for it.

It’s also unlikely the league would come out and say they were wrong, particularly with this being a moot point after the fact. Steratore said in real time he thought it would be overturned. Though Riverron screwing it up during the game is not out of the question

I don't care about the 2 Point conversion, as they called it no good I didn't think they would overturn it because that is how it usually works. What I want is an explanation of the Offensive PI and also why a penalty was called on Chris Harris Jr. when he had his head ripped off.

Originally Posted by MasterShake

I don't care about the 2 Point conversion, as they called it no good I didn't think they would overturn it because that is how it usually works. What I want is an explanation of the Offensive PI and also why a penalty was called on Chris Harris Jr. when he had his head ripped off.

That OPI was so ridiculous. Like, I can’t envision a way in which someone could see it that way

Originally Posted by NightTerror218

I was so pissed at VJ in this game. He almost cost us the game again. Going for it on 4th down cost us 3 points and not challenging the 2 point conversion cost another 2. That is 5 points off the board from poor coaching. The list is so long on bone head mistakes its unreal.

So, one note. Had he challenged the 2pt conversion and lost we wouldn't have won the game. We would've run out of time. I can't fault him for not wanting to risk a timeout when you're behind in the 4th quarter and your folks upstairs are saying they don't have a clear view.

I know it’s popular to pile on the offensive line, but I noticed 2 positives in the stat line.

1 zero sacks
2 zero tfl