Thread: How would you stack the draft board for #5?

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

Last I checked, we needed a QB, not a shitload of picks that won’t make the roster anyway. Every guy we select in the draft either will bump a vet, or not make the team. We aren’t cutting 10 vets for draft picks that might not be any better.

Honestly, I’d trade our whole draft for the right QB if that’s what it took. In other words, I’d trade all our picks for Rosen.

They could easily find room for 10 new players. Their roster is badly depleted of talent, especially behind the starters.

They have nobody on offense who couldn't be replaced by a better player, including Bolles.

On defense they have lost 5 starters from the SB team.

They need talent at WR, TE, G, T, RB, DT, ILB, S, CB. If they had 10 first round picks they could draft 10 starters this year.

I feel pretty good that Allen is going Number 1 to the Browns, followed by Darnold to the bills at 2 after trading with the giants. At this point NE is going to be doing everything they can to trade up for Rosen or Mayfield. Its a division rival so I doubt the jets make the trade, but NE has a ton of ammo and the jets are crazy lol. I Think The Jets at least consider it, but pass and take Mayfield. Cleveland takes Chubb or Barkley at 4. At this point we have Rosen, who ever Cleveland didn't take from Barkley and Chubb and Nelson on the board. NE Makes a trade with us for both first rd. picks, pick #40 and pick #95 and Drafts Rosen, Pissing off 95% of the Denver fan base lol.

Good thing none of this is going to happen. NE doesn't have to trade up to get into the top 10 for a QB who won't start for another 2 years. They can take a QB in the 2nd round and develop him like they did Garappolo and draft a bunch of other players to put around him.

And the Jets didn't give up 3 2nd rounders to move up to #3 only to move back down again. They would not consider it.

What the Pats are doing is simple. They are re-stocking their team with talent because they've lost a lot of talent over the last few years like the Broncos, but their talent evaluation and player development is a lot better than Denver's so that they are likely to be successful with all those late 1st round and 2nd round picks.

Originally Posted by Cugel

Good thing none of this is going to happen. NE doesn't have to trade up to get into the top 10 for a QB who won't start for another 2 years. They can take a QB in the 2nd round and develop him like they did Garappolo and draft a bunch of other players to put around him.

And the Jets didn't give up 3 2nd rounders to move up to #3 only to move back down again. They would not consider it.

What the Pats are doing is simple. They are re-stocking their team with talent because they've lost a lot of talent over the last few years like the Broncos, but their talent evaluation and player development is a lot better than Denver's so that they are likely to be successful with all those late 1st round and 2nd round picks.

I think people are going to be very surprised draft day by the trades that happen....It wouldn't shock me at all to see NE make a play for Rosen

Originally Posted by Elevation inc

I think people are going to be very surprised draft day by the trades that happen....It wouldn't shock me at all to see NE make a play for Rosen

Andrew Luck didn't sound too positive about his rehabilitation. I'm wondering if Indy is having second thoughts about trading with Jets. Oh well....there's always next year.

Originally Posted by Elevation inc

I'm really not sure about your tone in this post, perhaps you missed the comedy....so I will keep it relaxed.....Couple things.....I mentioned the scourge of Denver fans that would be mad at this happening. I myself wouldn't be mad but discouraged and worried for sure. I don't disagree about needing a long term QB. I'm also not so sure why everyone gets so emo on this forum when someone discusses the opposite of what they like, want or agree with. I'm simply putting out a very likely scenario. Its very likely Buffalo, Arizona and NE make moves to try and grab a top QB, I personally feel we like Rosen the least so if he is at 5 and a team wants him and we don't, it ain't rocket science to figure out what can happen. NE doesn't make power moves like they recently did, without a good plan, and the last few drafts we have seen big movement from teams trying to get their guy. Belicheck is pissed he doesn't have a viable successor to Brady after losing Jimmy and Jacoby. A play will be made by NE, whether its successful or we are the ones to accommodate it is yet TBD, but its closer to a possibility then not.

It wasn’t just you and I know you are kidding, but lots of people, especially fans are always talking about trading back for more picks. Especially with high 1st rounders. That’s the kind of shit that makes you the Cleveland Browns. They had 3 first round picks last year. Went 0-16. Still no QB. Extra picks just create more “mouths to feed”. Drafting one or 2 impact players is much more important than 10 JAGs. Sure with 10 picks you might get lucky and hit on a late round gem that you wouldn’t have gotten otherwise, but you’ll almost never find a PFM or Von Miller. That’s what we need. Elite players. We already have plenty of JAGs.

Originally Posted by Cugel

Good thing none of this is going to happen. NE doesn't have to trade up to get into the top 10 for a QB who won't start for another 2 years. They can take a QB in the 2nd round and develop him like they did Garappolo and draft a bunch of other players to put around him.

And the Jets didn't give up 3 2nd rounders to move up to #3 only to move back down again. They would not consider it.

What the Pats are doing is simple. They are re-stocking their team with talent because they've lost a lot of talent over the last few years like the Broncos, but their talent evaluation and player development is a lot better than Denver's so that they are likely to be successful with all those late 1st round and 2nd round picks.

Honestly, BB hasn’t exactly done well in the draft of late. Hell, he traded away most of his picks last year and went the FA route. I wouldn’t bet on BB doing any better than anyone else.

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

It wasn’t just you and I know you are kidding, but lots of people, especially fans are always talking about trading back for more picks. Especially with high 1st rounders. That’s the kind of shit that makes you the Cleveland Browns. They had 3 first round picks last year. Went 0-16. Still no QB. Extra picks just create more “mouths to feed”. Drafting one or 2 impact players is much more important than 10 JAGs. Sure with 10 picks you might get lucky and hit on a late round gem that you wouldn’t have gotten otherwise, but you’ll almost never find a PFM or Von Miller. That’s what we need. Elite players. We already have plenty of JAGs.

Haha I agree every year draftniks talk trades. The problem is this QB class has been so trumped up it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see heavy action up top, especially since their are a few teams with ammo to do so. I wasn't advocating a trade back for Denver one way or the other in that post. I just feel that this organization currently feels they can make anyone elite because of their UDFA success. So it wouldn't surprise me at all to see them trade back.

The only QBs that make sense for the Broncos are Allen and Darnold. But if I must guess, I think Allen is who they were hoping for. Keenum and Mayfield are redundant. Rosen is injury prone while also lacking mobility, which is desired for Denvers offense. Allen is the one with the tools. It's probably been assumed Sam Darnold would go one or two.

Trevor Siemian wasn’t any more mobile than Rosen, TS was hand-picked for this offense.

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

Last I checked, we needed a QB, not a shitload of picks that won’t make the roster anyway. Every guy we select in the draft either will bump a vet, or not make the team. We aren’t cutting 10 vets for draft picks that might not be any better.

Honestly, I’d trade our whole draft for the right QB if that’s what it took. In other words, I’d trade all our picks for Rosen.

This is how it works, HP gets it.

Denver needs quality, not quantity.

Originally Posted by Jaded

This is how it works, HP gets it.

Denver needs quality, not quantity.

Here is my issue there are 4 supposed top ten QB's. Only 1 will be on the board at our pick and that's probably Rosen, unless the Jets are sending smokescreens. I like Rosen but he hasn't had the off-season the other 3 have had, and there is enough smoke from coaches and ex-teammates that there absolutely is some fire there, it 100% hit his draft stock. In fact some in the draft community now believe Rosen has been bypassed by Jackson. I cant say one way or another Rosen is the guy or will be a bust. However I spent enough years and time following the draft and the community to feel pretty strong he could fall out of top ten. That means that unless we truly believe in him at 5, we will not be drafting 1 of the supposed top 4 QB's. As a fan we want franchise QB, no idea if we have that yet or can get it in Rosen, but people need to buck up and prepare for the fact that Nelson, Chubb, or Barkley as well as trading back are options at 5 probably even more than Rosen now.

The main problem is that everyone, including scouting departments and front offices, have so much “data”, both fact and opinion on these QBs, that they can find any reason to talk themselves into, or out of, any of them. All the advances in media and the cash cow that has become the NFL draft scouting process has created a million so called “draftniks” who either think they have it all worked out or are just regurgitating everything they hear, not from real sources, but from each other. Speculation, hearsay, and downright fantasy guesswork is now gospel. How many times has the “top” QB in this class changed? Every week it’s a different guy that the Browns were high on and taking #1. Started with Darnold, then Mayfield, now it’s Allen. Stop believing everyone else’s speculation because it’s no better than your own.

The bottom line is this, the Broncos need a QB. It’s a fact. It’s not speculation. All signing Keenum did is buy them a year or two of slightly more pseudo-competitiveness than before so we don’t have to start a rookie. Lynch ain’t it. Kelly ain’t it. Keenum ain’t it. We should draft the guy we want right now. I’m sure if we offered enough, we could get up to 2 and get Rosen (who is so obviously the best QB in this draft that it’s ridiculous to think otherwise). That’s what we need to do. The Browns won’t take him at one, so we need to get to two to guarantee we get him.

Rosen is probably the surest thing since Luck. He’s a better QB right this second than both Goff and Wentz were at this point in their careers (pre draft), much better than anyone who came out last year, and he’s light years ahead of Darnold and Allen. The consensus is, he’s the one QB who could start right away. He’s actually a damned QB, not just some athletic freak who might or might not ever be a good pro after several years of development. He has the highest floor. I hope our FO does the right thing.

Originally Posted by 7alpha30

The only QBs that make sense for the Broncos are Allen and Darnold. But if I must guess, I think Allen is who they were hoping for. Keenum and Mayfield are redundant. Rosen is injury prone while also lacking mobility, which is desired for Denvers offense. Allen is the one with the tools. It's probably been assumed Sam Darnold would go one or two.

I think Darnold and Allen are actually the worst choices for our offense. One is a turnover machine (44 turnovers in 27 starts) the other was 82nd in completion percentage in college. Our QBs didn’t fail because of a lack of athleticism last year, we were lacking leadership, accuracy, and decision making at the QB position. If all we needed was someone to scramble around and avoid pressure, then Jackson makes the most sense. We need a leader who can make all the throws, is smart enough to know the playbook and audible when necessary, and read a damned defense. That’s it.

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

The main problem is that everyone, including scouting departments and front offices, have so much “data”, both fact and opinion on these QBs, that they can find any reason to talk themselves into, or out of, any of them. All the advances in media and the cash cow that has become the NFL draft scouting process has created a million so called “draftniks” who either think they have it all worked out or are just regurgitating everything they hear, not from real sources, but from each other. Speculation, hearsay, and downright fantasy guesswork is now gospel. How many times has the “top” QB in this class changed? Every week it’s a different guy that the Browns were high on and taking #1. Started with Darnold, then Mayfield, now it’s Allen. Stop believing everyone else’s speculation because it’s no better than your own.

The bottom line is this, the Broncos need a QB. It’s a fact. It’s not speculation. All signing Keenum did is buy them a year or two of slightly more pseudo-competitiveness than before so we don’t have to start a rookie. Lynch ain’t it. Kelly ain’t it. Keenum ain’t it. We should draft the guy we want right now. I’m sure if we offered enough, we could get up to 2 and get Rosen (who is so obviously the best QB in this draft that it’s ridiculous to think otherwise). That’s what we need to do. The Browns won’t take him at one, so we need to get to two to guarantee we get him.

Rosen is probably the surest thing since Luck. He’s a better QB right this second than both Goff and Wentz were at this point in their careers (pre draft), much better than anyone who came out last year, and he’s light years ahead of Darnold and Allen. The consensus is, he’s the one QB who could start right away. He’s actually a damned QB, not just some athletic freak who might or might not ever be a good pro after several years of development. He has the highest floor. I hope our FO does the right thing.

As your using the first part of your post to call out the draftniks (with good reason at times I might add), you then insert your opinion as well about Rosen, we all do it myself included around draft time which is why I at this stage(a couple weeks out) I no longer care about who is better only what's more likely to happen. 3 QB's are going in the top 3. We can argue all day long about who is better and which order, but unless we trade up 3 of them would not be options for us. The biggest hit being talked about in draft circles for the top ten is to Rosen's stock. So the consensus by people that get paid to do this (not you and me) is that Rosen is the guy who will be available at 5. I wont sit here and say that I have the answer about Rosen, because as I already stated I like him as a prospect. Him and Mayfield are my 2 favorites. No different than anyone else having theirs.

I clearly can tell Rosen is your guy, But this recent post is quite hypocritical with regards to calling others out while then using your own speculation about Rosen to present it as fact. You are way better than this as are many other posters here as well, but for some reason the favorites of the supposed top 4 Qb's has this board warped and losing their damn minds lol....The reality, the actual reality is unless Elway believes Rosen or even 1 of the others if the order changes is the guy at 5, neither you nor me have a say in the matter I might add, then he will probably go BPA or trade back.

On a side note there are rapidly growing rumors this morning that the Giants are in discussions with not just the bills but Denver for pick #2. Rumor has it Denver would send a player, Pick 5, and a 2nd rd, and 4th rd pick for the #2 overall to select Sam Darnold. This is truly speculation and rumor, and the value chart is a bit off unless the giants believe said player to be a 2nd or 3rd rd. pick worthy player. Actually as I'm typing this I just read a update on my phone as well from walterfootball.com with a similar scenario but the player is CJ Anderson. None of these places are gospel and actually I think most of this board despises Walterfootball lol, but its interesting to hear it more than once this morning for sure.

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

I think Darnold and Allen are actually the worst choices for our offense. One is a turnover machine (44 turnovers in 27 starts) the other was 82nd in completion percentage in college. Our QBs didn’t fail because of a lack of athleticism last year, we were lacking leadership, accuracy, and decision making at the QB position. If all we needed was someone to scramble around and avoid pressure, then Jackson makes the most sense. We need a leader who can make all the throws, is smart enough to know the playbook and audible when necessary, and read a damned defense. That’s it.

I agree I actually don't want either of them either.....I'm a huge Jackson fan as well but he isn't the passer Rosen or Mayfield is either