Thread: Broncos will sign Case Keenum, per Schefter

top. . . have you found your new orton?

Originally Posted by dogfish

top. . . have you found your new orton?

Oh you bet. His heels are dug in. There’s no changing his mind. I can respect that. Top just goes high and right and looks for the “good” in Broncos QBs (especially if they fall in the underdog category) almost to a fault. I’m fine with giving Keenum the benefit of the doubt until he proves otherwise, but I’m not gonna do cartwheels and sing his praises based on one year and especially because he’s a “Kubiak or VJ endorsed guy”. I’m actually more inclined to be more critical of anyone endorsed by VJ. I don’t think he’s done pretty much anything right yet.

Heard he and Kimberly want to put down roots and start a family. But they say they have not been able to do that as a journeyman QB.

Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56

Oh you bet. His heels are dug in. There’s no changing his mind. I can respect that. Top just goes high and right and looks for the “good” in Broncos QBs (especially if they fall in the underdog category) almost to a fault. I’m fine with giving Keenum the benefit of the doubt until he proves otherwise, but I’m not gonna do cartwheels and sing his praises based on one year and especially because he’s a “Kubiak or VJ endorsed guy”. I’m actually more inclined to be more critical of anyone endorsed by VJ. I don’t think he’s done pretty much anything right yet.

In fact, I am the only one who has said I may be wrong.

So give me something to change my mind.

I have facts and figures. You don't. King doesn't. Jaded doesn't. UA doesn't.

I can change my mind if one of you will provide something besides a baseless opinion.

Give me something tangible I can work with. Then watch me.
.

Top you have what amounts to 14 games of a QBR, we have another 6 years of utter and total meh, there’s zero denying his backup QB skill set, his own HC drew the ire of CK for not being his biggest supporter ... do you seriously need us to post all that empirical fact for you “to work with”?

http://www.espn.com/nfl/qbr/_/year/2007

I made this point years ago; QBR tells me that David Garrard was a better QB than PFM, Brett Farve and Drew Brees.

You believe whatever you want but I’m not that stupid.

Originally Posted by Ziggy

The Vikings are also letting McKinnon walk. Watch what he does in San Fran this year. They feel that Cousins is an upgrade so they let Keenum go. That's not necessarily a reflection of Keenum being a poor QB.

Never said he was a poor QB. Only pointed out that he wasnt good enough to convince Minnesota to keep rolling with him. I mean, the guy lead your team to the NFC Championship game and the team wants to go another direction? Doesnt really speak a lot in terms of confidence. Fortunately for Case he will land on another team with a lot of talent to work with, the question is will he be able to replicate what he did in Minny? Guess we will find out.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

And the Redskins let Cousins walk.

Thats because Snyder is stupid.

Originally Posted by SmilinAssasSin27

And Indy let Peyton go.

Very nice.

Originally Posted by Freyaka

Same logic could be applied to Cousins, if Cousins was all that, Washington wouldn't have let him walk.

Well no, again. This is Snyder we are talking about, the king of stupidity.

Originally Posted by topscribe

I don't know why Minnesota let Keenum go, but it could not have been for bad play. Keenum
had a super year by all accounts (except King's). Maybe he and Zimmer had a personality
clash or something. Who knows? But Zimmer's logic defies . . . well, logic. He asked if
they would see the Keenum of 2017 or the Keenum of "three years ago." Three
years ago was 2014. He had previously played all of eight games, and only two that year.
Makes me wonder whether Zimmer was sober, or whether he needed an Alzheimer's
check. At any rate, I don't put much stock in that type of analysis.

Keenum's first full year on the field was in 2016. By the first game of that season, he had
12 whole games under his belt. I hardly saw any of him that year, but, going through his
stats, he did . . . um, okay, for no more experience than he had. But going into 2017, he
finally had significant playing time. He didn't disappoint. He actually played 14 regular
season games, scoring 22 TDs against 7 INTs.

There are two considerations to this: first, 22 TDs over 14 games would average out at
25 TDs over a 16 game season. Second, his 7 INTs meant that his TD/INT ratio was 3:1,
which was exceptional. I attribute his low INT level to his superb comp ratio which was
67.6%, again very good. In the course of the season, he attained the highest QBR in the
league for still active players. (Carson Wentz was the only one higher, but, of course, he
didn't finish the season.)

In the end, I don't place much stock in what Minnesota did or didn't see in Keenum.
Especially in that Kubiak and VJ know Keenum as well as anybody, and they went after
him. Be disappointed all you want (generically -- not at you, North), but Keenum's
sterling performance last year (in all but the last game) plus the obvious excitement of
the Broncos FO in getting him encourages me.

I saw Keenum play a few games last year, so I was pretty favorable toward him when
he came in. In fact, I thought before then that perhaps the Broncos should go after him
instead of Cousins because of the price differential for no appreciable differences in
performance last year.

Yes, i think Keenum is a great game manager. If Denver can get the team back to 2015 form (defensively) and improve the Oline and running game Keenum can excel. But im not sold at all that he is a guy that carry a team when he needs to which is much like what we have had the last couple of years.

Originally Posted by UnderArmour

There's all kinds of articles out there on why Kirk Cousins is elite, but the gist of it is that he consistently finishes top 5 statistically in the important QB categories. What allows Kirk to do that is his decision making and ability to read the field. Kirk had very little talent last year thanks to the losses of Jordon Reed (injury) and Pierre Garcon/DeSean Jackson to free agency, but still had a statistically decent year. We'll see what Kirk can do next year with arguably his best surrounding cast, but honestly Case has only had one good year.

Kirk has years of data showing he's an elite QB and years of tape showing he can break games. Case has some highlights last year, but really no games against elite defenses that would make you say "Wow. The QB really won that game for em."

^All this.

Trying to put Keenum and Cousins in the same category of talent is ridiculous. Lol

Originally Posted by topscribe

Whoa, wait a minute . . . I've been hearing all over the place that Cousins is a very good QB,
but "not elite."

I disagree with you about Keenum not winning any games for them. As I have mentioned,
I saw a few of those games. But that part is just subjective viewing, other than the eyeball
test with me was positive.

Keenum has had only one full season, last year, and even then he started only 14 games.
Of those 14 games, he broke 100 passer rating in seven of them. As I've said in other
places, he finished the season with the highest QB rating in the league among still active
QBs. (Cousins, BTW, was #15. Just saying.) In the 14 games he started, he passed for
3,380 yards, 22 TDs, and 7 INTs. He had a 67.6% completion ratio. So, averaged over a
hypothetical season of 16 games, that comes to 3,862 yards, 25 TDs, and 8 INTs. Still a
3:1 ratio between TD/INT.

Judging from his stats and what I personally saw, Keenum isn't too bad at reading the field
and making decisions, either. Moreover, he has very good pocket awareness and escapability,
which makes him very good at extending plays. Oh, and a quick release. He is also very
accurate with his throws. I've seen him place it in some jaw-dropping tight windows.

I personally think the Broncos have a very good quarterback and am happy he's the one
they ended up with. Of course, I could be wrong, but I don't think I am. We'll see . . .

If i had to be honest i can see why you like Keenum so much. He reminds me a lot of Kyle Orton (especially how Kyle played in Chicago) so i get it. They are very similar players.

Originally Posted by dogfish

top. . . have you found your new orton?

Damn, beat me to it. Lol

Originally Posted by Northman

If Keenum really was all that Minny would not have let him walk lets be honest here. There is a reason why Minny chose to go after Cousins and while it would be nice for Keenum to succeed here i have a feeling that we are going to see the same stuff from him that we have been seeing from Trevor and crew. If anything, JFE needs to give Case the best available talent around him and get the defense back to where they were for Keenum to have any kind of success like he did in Minny. But with VJ at the helm im not convinced we will be seeing the same guy we saw last year in Minnesota. The Vikings know what his limitations are and chose to part ways with him for a reason.

False assumption. "If Cousins was really all that Washington would never have let him go." Same exact argument!

In Cousins' case people admit they just were that stupid that they substituted Alex Smith at a much higher price than Cousins including giving up a 2nd round pick to get him!

Redskins got locked into a position on Cousins "he's not really our Franchise QB" just like MN did about Keenum, and both became increasingly defensive when their QB kept making them look bad by exceeding their expectations. Same thing with Keenum. It's just a certain petty stubbornness where people make their judgments and don't want to change those judgments to deal with the fact that they were wrong about someone. So, they get defensive and invent excuses and ultimately get rid of the player who was embarrassing them by making them appear in a bad light.

Story of Cousins' entire time in DC. In Keenum's case they never wanted him to be the franchise guy. He exceeded expectations, but unless he won the SB they were never going to keep him. Even then they would not have WANTED to keep him.

They never liked him in MN. He was always supposed to be the backup. They only used him because they had no choice.

The Vikings wanted Sam Bradford to start until Teddy Bridgewater was healthy and then they go back to Bridgewater. Keenum was always the emergency break glass QB.

Then he was forced into the lineup when Bradford and his glass knee went down. But, the Vikings kept trying to re-insert Bridgewater or Bradford into the lineup "Teddy is coming on, we anticipate getting him back soon." They couldn't wait to shove Keenum back into his place, during the entire time he was winning 13 games for them they kept refusing to name him the starter for the year.

"He's the starter this week" they kept saying.