Thread: Foles or Cousins?

Originally Posted by Rick

I agree, for now I would sit on Foles if I were them until they see Wentz come back and play.

If he comes back fine they can still move Foles later.

Well, I think he only has 1 year left on his contract, so they would have to franchise him in order to keep or trade him in 2019. But, they still might get something for him if they franchised him and traded his rights, just like the Patriots got for Jimmy Garapolo. Foles ought to be worth a 2nd round pick in that scenario - IF the team that traded for him could re-negotiate a long term contract with him, the way the 49ers did with Garapolo.

So, despite all the speculation that the Eagles would maximize Foles' trade value by moving him this off-season, it's most unlikely they will do that!

They cannot be certain until sometime in September whether Wentz is really going to be fully recovered from his knee injury. He might even miss some games or at least be less than 100% to start the season. And why should they take that risk, when they could have the insurance of knowing they have the SB MVP to start and get the team off to a fast start as defending champions, if Wentz can't go.

And it has to be tempting to have the same safety net in place in case Wentz get hurt or re-injures his knee during the season. It worked well enough they won the SB, why change anything?

Originally Posted by Joel

For sake of argument, Foles is a FA SB MVP, and Wentz got them homefield advantage and a bye in just his second year on a cheap contract that runs through 2020. In other words, Foles is going to set the new salary standard for the highest paid position in football, and SB Champs always have more All Pros than they can re-sign under the cap, so why wouldn't they take their chances with Wentz' health when he's already proven he can play with the big boys? Not to mention that Foles just turned 29, so how many more $25M seasons does he have before "veteran" becomes "aging veteran"?

It's unprecedented for a SB Champ to release the SB MVP, much less a SB MVP QB. But after journeyman backup Doug Williams won a SB with Jay Schroeders team he posted a 5-7 record over the next two seasons, then quietly retired.

Foles is cheap as hell. He's only making $7.6m this season. That's not expensive even for experienced backup money, let alone a viable starter, let alone SB MVP!

Nick Foles signed a 2 year, $11,000,000 contract with the Philadelphia Eagles, including a $3,000,000 signing bonus, $7,000,000 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $5,500,000. In 2018, Foles will earn a base salary of $4,000,000 and a roster bonus of $3,000,000, while carrying a cap hit of $7,600,000 and a dead cap value of $5,400,000.

There is literally no downside to holding on to him and all the speculation about the Eagles trading him has been circulated by outside sources. We haven't heard any rumors out of the Eagles that they were interested in dealing Foles at all.

They can always franchise and trade him next off-season.

The Washington Redskins can officially tag Kirk Cousins starting on Tuesday. But if they do, expect the quarterback to go on the offensive.

Cousins will file a grievance through the NFL players’ union if the Redskins stick a franchise tag on him, according to a person with knowledge of the situation who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

The basis for the complaint is simple: Cousins could argue that the organization is violating the terms of the collective bargaining agreement because the team has no intention of engaging in good-faith negotiations on a long-term deal, or having him play under the franchise tag amount of $34.5 million guaranteed in 2018.

rest - https://www.denverpost.com/2018/02/1...hise-tag-used/

Originally Posted by Cugel

Foles is cheap as hell. He's only making $7.6m this season. That's not expensive even for experienced backup money, let alone a viable starter, let alone SB MVP!

There is literally no downside to holding on to him and all the speculation about the Eagles trading him has been circulated by outside sources. We haven't heard any rumors out of the Eagles that they were interested in dealing Foles at all.

They can always franchise and trade him next off-season.

Ah; all the talk about teams lining up to sign him up gave me the impression he's no longer under contract. If he's got a year left, yeah, he's going nowhere. Maybe he could hold out for more money and force Philly to release him, but otherwise, you're right, they'll never just dump a SB MVP QB with a $7½M cap hit.

Edit: Actually, I take it back; I could totally see Philly trying to get one (or both?) of Clevelands 1st rounders for Foles, and Cleveland being stupid enough to go along because "it's a cheap contract, and we're only committed for a single year." Of course, a year from now they'll either have spent a 1st round pick on a mediocre QB on the wrong side of 30, or have to cough up $20M+/yr to keep their former SB MVP starter.

Originally Posted by Denver Native (Carol)

rest - https://www.denverpost.com/2018/02/1...hise-tag-used/

Would be an exceptionally dumb move by the Redskins.

But then, it wouldn't be the first dumb move they've made.

The Washington Redskins can officially tag Kirk Cousins starting on Tuesday. But if they do, expect the quarterback to go on the offensive.

Cousins will file a grievance through the NFL players’ union if the Redskins stick a franchise tag on him, according to a person with knowledge of the situation who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

The basis for the complaint is simple: Cousins could argue that the organization is violating the terms of the collective bargaining agreement because the team has no intention of engaging in good-faith negotiations on a long-term deal, or having him play under the franchise tag amount of $34.5 million guaranteed in 2018.

I don't understand it at all to be honest. I'm stumped.

First of all Adam Schefter said something on the radio to the effect that to franchise him they would need to carry his $34.6 million on the books until he was traded.

But, he could do one of two things, either of which would royally screw the Redskins:

#1 - He could refuse to sign the franchise tender and sit out. Normally, the team has all the leverage because they can just play hardball, keep the money on the books, and force the player to sit out the season. The player usually folds in that situation. But, the Redskins can't negotiate a long term deal with Alex Smith with Cousins on the books at $34.6m and they have zero intention of keeping him anyway. So, I don't see how that would work.

#2. Worse for the Redskins: Cousins could sign the franchise tender. This would technically allow them to trade him to another team, but Cousins could throw a monkey-wrench into those plans by refusing to negotiate a long term deal with whatever team they want to trade him to.

In that case, no team would be willing to pay the Redskins anything for him because they'd only be getting a 1 year rental at $34.6m. And who would be willing to give up draft picks for a 1 year rental on Cousins, knowing that he would be a FA at the end of the year, and pay him $34.6m on top of that! No team would want to do that.

Maybe the NFLPA wanted Cousins to bring a grievance on behalf of all players?

But, I can't believe the Redskins would do this because Cousins could just sit out a couple of months until they rescinded the tag, and this would totally screw the Redskins because they wouldn't have the money to go out in FA and sign anybody or even sign Alex Smith.

Originally Posted by Joel

Ah; all the talk about teams lining up to sign him up gave me the impression he's no longer under contract. If he's got a year left, yeah, he's going nowhere. Maybe he could hold out for more money and force Philly to release him, but otherwise, you're right, they'll never just dump a SB MVP QB with a $7½M cap hit.

Edit: Actually, I take it back; I could totally see Philly trying to get one (or both?) of Clevelands 1st rounders for Foles, and Cleveland being stupid enough to go along because "it's a cheap contract, and we're only committed for a single year." Of course, a year from now they'll either have spent a 1st round pick on a mediocre QB on the wrong side of 30, or have to cough up $20M+/yr to keep their former SB MVP starter.

Cleveland is dumb, but I highly doubt it:

Remember that their last GM passed on drafting Carson Wentz and instead traded down. He got fired after Carson Wentz became an NFL MVP candidate, the Browns still don't have a QB and lost almost every game the last 2 seasons. The new GM knows this and can't be stupid enough to repeat the same mistakes.

They are going to draft a QB at #1 overall to avoid the humiliation of seeing Darnold or Rosen become an elite QB and they passed on getting him, again.

If they do that there's no point in taking Nick Foles. Draft a QB at #1 and he can't just sit there behind Nick Foles for a season or two. The pressure to play him will be too intense.

They totally suck now, so they might as well just trot Darnold out there and suck some more, and hope he learns to become an elite QB.

People say foles is cheap as hell. his trade value is insanely high. Cost more than a 1st round pick prob for him since he is still under contract.

Originally Posted by NightTerror218

People say foles is cheap as hell. his trade value is insanely high. Cost more than a 1st round pick prob for him since he is still under contract.

Yes, but they could conceivably get that for him or at least a 2nd rounder like the Pats got for Garapolo after next season, so why trade him now when they aren't sure how soon Wentz will be fully recovered from his knee injury?

Just because other teams desperately need QBs is no reason for the Eagles to oblige them. They don't need to trade Foles this off-season. They can franchise him and trade him next off-season and still get real value for him, just like the Pats did. And Foles is worth more than Garapolo since he was SB MVP and Garapolo has only started a hand full of games.