Thread: Looks like Talib is gone

Originally Posted by wayninja

The 2nd rounder is better than a 3rd rounder, no question there. But you could make the argument that Kendall Fuller is a better deal than Talib from a youth and salary standpoint.

He's certainly cheaper. But he's definitely not better. So, it's not a "better deal" except in the way that a new Chevy is a "better deal" than an older Ferrari that still has some life left in it. Talib is a pro-bowler and so far Fuller isn't. Maybe he'll be great in future, but right now he's not even close to the player Talib is.

The real reason the Chiefs didn't jump at that Denver offer is because the entire story was B.S. from the word go and the Broncos never offered it.

Originally Posted by Cugel

He's certainly cheaper. But he's definitely not better. So, it's not a "better deal" except in the way that a new Chevy is a "better deal" than an older Ferrari that still has some life left in it. Talib is a pro-bowler and so far Fuller isn't. Maybe he'll be great in future, but right now he's not even close to the player Talib is.

The real reason the Chiefs didn't jump at that Denver offer is because the entire story was B.S. from the word go and the Broncos never offered it.

Better is fairly subjective. Fuller was the #1 rated slot cover corner last year. #1 is pretty good, right?

The price tag isn't subjective. Fuller is "better".

The average age/declination in play isn't really subjective either. Talib is a fantastic corner there is no doubt. There is a reasonable doubt about how long before he declines. It's sooner rather than later.

Your analogy about cars is awful though. You can't really compare dynamism in the human mind and body to a static machine.

I do want to agree that the Broncos never offered the deal. I'll reserve judgement on it, but I'm grudgingly leaning toward it being true.

Originally Posted by wayninja

Better is fairly subjective. Fuller was the #1 rated slot cover corner last year. #1 is pretty good, right?

The price tag isn't subjective. Fuller is "better".

The average age/declination in play isn't really subjective either. Talib is a fantastic corner there is no doubt. There is a reasonable doubt about how long before he declines. It's sooner rather than later.

Your analogy about cars is awful though. You can't really compare dynamism in the human mind and body to a static machine.

I do want to agree that the Broncos never offered the deal. I'll reserve judgement on it, but I'm grudgingly leaning toward it being true.

Well, since the guy who started the rumor just completely walked it back and admitted it was wild speculation, I'd say it's all B.S. just like I've been saying all along.

And Fuller being the #1 "nickel CB" means nothing. There's a HUGE difference between covering the #1 WR and the nickel back. Most teams have at least 1 WR who's a serious threat, but not three.

That is why the Broncos want to promote Bradley Roby after they have to pay him $8.5m. His salary is the salary of a #2 CB, not a #3 CB.

Fuller is not a pro-bowl caliber CB yet, if he ever becomes one. He's in fact a bit like Bradley Roby, a good young player who is perhaps ready to take a bigger role, but not a super star perennial pro-bowler like Talib. Except Fuller has ONE good season so Roby is currently better.

Talib has 34 INTs and 10 career interceptions for TDs. That is a lot! Kendall Fuller has 4 career INTs, none for TDs.

Being number 1 at something in the NFL, no matter what it is, hardly "means nothing". I'm not sure how you can even say that with a straight face. Oh sure, qualify it if you want, it probably warrants that, but "means nothing". Nah.

Also, comparing career stats between a near rookie and a 9 year vet seems a bit silly IMO.

Originally Posted by nevcraw

Sub standard? How so.

Just because other fast food chains serve hot garbage doesn't mean Arby's is better than sub-standard. If something is unhealthy it's unhealthy, whether you compare it to something less healthy or not. It's like saying a K car was a great car because it's better than a Gremlin.

Their regular old beef and cheddar has more than half the daily recommended sodium, 20g of fat (6g sat fat, 1g trans), etc. It's not the worst thing you could eat, Taco Bell probably has that locked down, but it's not good at all. Yeah, sure, it tastes good... Antifreeze is sweet as well, but I'm not drinking it.

Arby's vs Antifreeze.

*finishes chugging bottle* - Ahhhhhh!

Originally Posted by wayninja

Being number 1 at something in the NFL, no matter what it is, hardly "means nothing". I'm not sure how you can even say that with a straight face. Oh sure, qualify it if you want, it probably warrants that, but "means nothing". Nah.

Also, comparing career stats between a near rookie and a 9 year vet seems a bit silly IMO.

What happens if a #3 CB does really well? He gets promoted like Chris Harris and Bradley Roby.

Then he gets more money, like both of them. So, the Chiefs get a promising young player with 2 years experience, and he's a decent prospect. No more.

But, you boxed yourself so far in a corner with this nonsense that you just won't quit.

So, go ahead. You win.

Originally Posted by Cugel

What happens if a #3 CB does really well? He gets promoted like Chris Harris and Bradley Roby.

Then he gets more money, like both of them. So, the Chiefs get a promising young player with 2 years experience, and he's a decent prospect. No more.

But, you boxed yourself so far in a corner with this nonsense that you just won't quit.

So, go ahead. You win.

I'm being dead serious here. I would respond if I had any earthly idea what you are talking about.

Jeez nevcraw, what gives? You act like someone called your firstborn fat and stupid

Originally Posted by Von Kinger

Talib's underpaid right now. He was highly paid at the time of the deal.

On the bright side, at least Joel is happy.

Not really, because we opted to let Webster walk last year "since we have Talib, Webster wants to start and we can't pay a #4 CB starter money." But we can't pay a physical 32-year-old CB $12M/yr, hoping he doesn't get suspended nor sidelined by injuries from onfield brawls or offfield gunshots. It was a short-sighted decision that only made sense if we genuinely thought we could win a SB with a first-year HC 2/3 seasons. Now here we are with NO nickelback (or no #1 CB, if people expect Roby to remain in that role or Harris to return to it.) Speaking of Harris: At least MY favorite Bronco's still on the team, so I'm happy about that.

Internet rumors claiming we offered to trade Talib for Alex Smith suggest he's truly gone though, one way or another.

Originally Posted by Joel

Not really, because we opted to let Webster walk last year "since we have Talib, Webster wants to start and we can't pay a #4 CB starter money." But we can't pay a physical 32-year-old CB $12M/yr, hoping he doesn't get suspended nor sidelined by injuries from onfield brawls or offfield gunshots. It was a short-sighted decision that only made sense if we genuinely thought we could win a SB with a first-year HC 2/3 seasons. Now here we are with NO nickelback (or no #1 CB, if people expect Roby to remain in that role or Harris to return to it.) Speaking of Harris: At least MY favorite Bronco's still on the team, so I'm happy about that.

Internet rumors claiming we offered to trade Talib for Alex Smith suggest he's truly gone though, one way or another.

I have no worries this front office can find a slot corner. They have cranked out good, physical cornerbacks.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

I have no worries this front office can find a slot corner. They have cranked out good, physical cornerbacks.

This is true, and encouraging. Both Harris and Roby have also proven they play well outside; Roby started out there (his first NFL game was a season opener in which he started opposite Reggie Wayne, and denied him a critical deep ball over the middle to seal what started out as a Broncos blowout before morphing into a Colts comeback that fell just a bit short.) Whether that was because the coaches felt Harris lacked the speed and/or experience to play outside or just because he's SO good and experience in the slot it was not worth sacrificing that to cover a #2 receiver is an open question (as well as whether it was some other reason altogether.)

That's another reason I never considered the loss of Talib "the end of the No Fly Zone" nor anything like that. There are actually a lot of reasons this makes sense, and even people who disputed that with me conceded we'd probably part ways with Talib about now. Life goes on.

Originally Posted by Cugel

What happens if a #3 CB does really well? He gets promoted like Chris Harris and Bradley Roby.

Then he gets more money, like both of them. So, the Chiefs get a promising young player with 2 years experience, and he's a decent prospect. No more.

But, you boxed yourself so far in a corner with this nonsense that you just won't quit.

So, go ahead. You win.

Decent prospect? LOL

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

Jeez nevcraw, what gives? You act like someone called your firstborn fat and stupid

This is a Talib thread that we are talking about all of this in. It's possible. I'd need to know more information first before I called this likely or not. Was his fat, stupid firstborn wearing a gold chain?

Better this way than overpay for a defender on the wrong side of his prime. (see Darrelle Revis)