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Thread: I Agree To Disagree With Elway

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    Because up to this point they suck dick at evaluating quarterbacks.
    Why are you always talking about dick?
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    I'm happier than tom brady in a gay bar....

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  3. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    You asked why he was released. I answered your question. They released him because they clearly suck dick at quarterback evaluation. Their seventh round pick was better than their first round pick and their UDFA might have been better than all of them!

    It's been an absolute disaster in scouting and development. I wish they could somehow apply their defensive line magic to quarterback.
    In Elway's defense, not that he needs it, it's not easy to find a franchise QB which is why 10-12 teams every single year are desperately looking over all the rejects and has-beens and never-were's asking themselves "is this the guy? Am I missing somebody here?"

    Elway tried to find a QB on the cheap in 2012 because he had Peyton Manning and needed a long term replacement: Osweiler. He was the #56 pick of the 2nd round, and very few NFL Qbs are drafted that late. You can count the number of successes on the fingers of one hand practically: Warner, Brady, Russell Wilson, Dak Prescott (maybe), Tony Romo (although he never led Dallas anywhere near the SB).

    Sometimes a QB falls through the cracks and nobody drafts him in the first round, but he subsequently becomes a good to great QB.

    It happens the way that occasionally somebody beats the house in Vegas for a boat-load of cash. People believing that THEY are going to beat the odds is why Vegas is able to build billion dollar casinos, however.

    The problem in the NFL is getting rather like basketball: you either have Stepf Curry, or LeBron or you don't. For those 28 teams that don't: you have no chance. It's not that bad in the NFL, yet, but they keep changing the rules to favor the QBs, which makes an elite Hall of Fame QB more valuable than ever, yet there are only 4 or 5 QBs like that in the entire league, and probably NONE in this year's draft, or in FA either.

    So, teams are looking for bargains and not finding very many. Robert Kraft ordered Belichick to get rid of Garapolo because Brady was butt-hurt having him around, so Belichick dumped him on SF for a 2nd rounder, without bothering to negotiate and get a first rounder, which he could have done. But, that doesn't happen very often either.

  4. #78

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    Then, Elway tried drafting Paxton, who turned out to be a bust. They should have drafted Prescott in the 3rd round. But, think what you are saying criticizing Elway for this! 31 other NFL GMs passed on Prescott too, twice! Nobody in the NFL thought he was a starting caliber player or they would have drafted him ahead of Christian Hackenberg, Jacoby Brissett, Cody Kessler, or Connor Cook. And nobody did that.

    He was drafted 4 picks ahead of Ohio State QB Cardale Jones, taken #138 of the 4th by the Browns and the Browns are not planning on starting Cardale Jones either. That's what NFL GMs thought of Prescott.

    So, sometimes somebody falls, but it's hard to identify the right guy.
    Last edited by Cugel; 01-09-2018 at 11:49 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    There is almost no doubt that letting Sloter go for really no reason at all, with a question mark at starter and the backup hurt, was the wrong move.
    lynch's busted ass wasn't even available to play 'til like week 8 or 9 or whatever. . . there's no question they should have put him on IR, and kept sloter. . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by dogfish View Post
    lynch's busted ass wasn't even available to play 'til like week 8 or 9 or whatever. . . there's no question they should have put him on IR, and kept sloter. . .
    The sloter issue is all about an issue that we are not really qualified to answer. Certainly not me. Whether or not this league has a hard cap or not, there will always be financial considerations. Especially with certain owners. Now, with the hard cap, it is especially so. Most of us have no real clue how much of a priority it is.

    Sloter, never had a chance. Not on any team, and neither does any undrafted QB. Sloter was told that, and they meant that. Hence the reason if the Broncos draft a first round QB again this year, that will be it for any real shot for Kelly. Yes, a 7th rounder is for all intents and purposes a walk on.

    Our frustration when they let him go for Osweiler was the fact that all we had were known quantities. Especially Osweiler. However, I strongly believe Elway wanted an excuse to get rid of Sloter mainly because he wanted to shut the chants for Sloter down.

    He never had a shot here, and the economic reality of the league and this franchise are the reasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Broncoknight30 View Post
    The sloter issue is all about an issue that we are not really qualified to answer. Certainly not me. Whether or not this league has a hard cap or not, there will always be financial considerations. Especially with certain owners. Now, with the hard cap, it is especially so. Most of us have no real clue how much of a priority it is.

    Sloter, never had a chance. Not on any team, and neither does any undrafted QB. Sloter was told that, and they meant that. Hence the reason if the Broncos draft a first round QB again this year, that will be it for any real shot for Kelly. Yes, a 7th rounder is for all intents and purposes a walk on.

    Our frustration when they let him go for Osweiler was the fact that all we had were known quantities. Especially Osweiler. However, I strongly believe Elway wanted an excuse to get rid of Sloter mainly because he wanted to shut the chants for Sloter down.

    He never had a shot here, and the economic reality of the league and this franchise are the reasons.
    Which is utter bullshit if any team puts money ahead of winning. You want to lose me as a fan? Then do this kind of BS.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    Which is utter bullshit if any team puts money ahead of winning. You want to lose me as a fan? Then do this kind of BS.
    Yes, and that is why i have grown more and more disillusioned with the NFL.

    That may be the wrong word. The financial reality is what it is and it is not going to change.

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  12. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by dogfish View Post
    lynch's busted ass wasn't even available to play 'til like week 8 or 9 or whatever. . . there's no question they should have put him on IR, and kept sloter. . .
    You don't really think he was that hurt do you? That was their excuse for not putting him on the field because he was "not ready" which is a euphemism for "he still sucks." But, it's nice and polite to pretend you believe he will ever "be ready."

    He was healthy enough to play before he did. I high ankle sprain doesn't take three months to heal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    You don't really think he was that hurt do you? That was their excuse for not putting him on the field because he was "not ready" which is a euphemism for "he still sucks." But, it's nice and polite to pretend you believe he will ever "be ready."

    He was healthy enough to play before he did. I high ankle sprain doesn't take three months to heal.
    Yeah, and Luck's "shoulder."

    I am reading around the league that the Colts are not an attractive place as many may have thought and Luck is the reason. In other words, he really is not as good as many fans think, and he is sure taking up A LOT OF CAP ROOM.

    Several coaching prospects have turned the Colts down.

  14. #85

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    Sloter, never had a chance. Not on any team, and neither does any undrafted QB. Sloter was told that, and they meant that. Hence the reason if the Broncos draft a first round QB again this year, that will be it for any real shot for Kelly. Yes, a 7th rounder is for all intents and purposes a walk on.

    Our frustration when they let him go for Osweiler was the fact that all we had were known quantities. Especially Osweiler. However, I strongly believe Elway wanted an excuse to get rid of Sloter mainly because he wanted to shut the chants for Sloter down.

    He never had a shot here, and the economic reality of the league and this franchise are the reasons.
    It's more than that. NFL scouts are seldom THAT wrong about a QB. How many 7th round QBs are stars in this league. I can't think of one! Tyrod Taylor was a 7th rounder, and he's proven he can be a mediocre starter.

    But does anybody think Tyrod Taylor will ever lead a team to a SB? Me neither. He's just like Trevor - a 7th round pick who exceeded the very limited expectations of all NFL scouts and GMs. That's all.

    Sloter is the same. He's a marginal player who will spend his time in the NFL as a scout team QB until he's replaced by some other scrub.

    This is not some conspiracy. Teams are not ignoring the amazing ability of Kyle Sloter. He's just not very good.

    And the fact that the Broncos were wrong about Paxton does not invalidate this at all. Paxton has a lot more athletic talent than Kyle Sloter ever dreamed of. But, when they gave him the chance he proved he couldn't learn the system or how to read NFL defenses. Sloter was never given that chance. He played in the pre-season against vanilla defenses manned by marginal backup players the other team was evaluating to discover whether they even earned a roster spot.

    Fans saw him do great against scrubs and thought "This guy is the next Broncos QB!"

    No. Just no. He wasn't that good.

  15. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    It's more than that. NFL scouts are seldom THAT wrong about a QB. How many 7th round QBs are stars in this league. I can't think of one! Tyrod Taylor was a 7th rounder, and he's proven he can be a mediocre starter.

    But does anybody think Tyrod Taylor will ever lead a team to a SB? Me neither. He's just like Trevor - a 7th round pick who exceeded the very limited expectations of all NFL scouts and GMs. That's all.

    Sloter is the same. He's a marginal player who will spend his time in the NFL as a scout team QB until he's replaced by some other scrub.

    This is not some conspiracy. Teams are not ignoring the amazing ability of Kyle Sloter. He's just not very good.

    And the fact that the Broncos were wrong about Paxton does not invalidate this at all. Paxton has a lot more athletic talent than Kyle Sloter ever dreamed of. But, when they gave him the chance he proved he couldn't learn the system or how to read NFL defenses. Sloter was never given that chance. He played in the pre-season against vanilla defenses manned by marginal backup players the other team was evaluating to discover whether they even earned a roster spot.

    Fans saw him do great against scrubs and thought "This guy is the next Broncos QB!"

    No. Just no. He wasn't that good.
    Paxton Lynch did shit against those same scrubs, and scouts are often wrong.

    Very OFTEN wrong.

    However, once a certain player takes up cap room, that is it. Otherwise sloter would NOT have been told he has no chance, AND Lynch looking like shit against the same scrubs that sloter looked good against would have been a bigger deal.

    Scouts.....are often wrong. Plenty of examples. Plenty.

  16. #87

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    Let the healing begin, brethren.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
    Y’all know I’m an OL Groupie but I think Jeudy is going to be worth missing out on a T, knock on wood.

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    Every time I see this thread title, I have to chuckle a bit.

    I'm sure Elway is very pleased you agree to disagree with him...


  18. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by dogfish View Post
    lynch's busted ass wasn't even available to play 'til like week 8 or 9 or whatever. . . there's no question they should have put him on IR, and kept sloter. . .
    This is true Dog, but this coaching staff still wouldn't have played Sloter. He would have been warming up the inactive list along with DeAngelo Henderson. Why play young talent when you can keep playing the vets with poor results?

  19. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by Broncoknight30 View Post
    Yeah, and Luck's "shoulder."

    I am reading around the league that the Colts are not an attractive place as many may have thought and Luck is the reason. In other words, he really is not as good as many fans think, and he is sure taking up A LOT OF CAP ROOM.

    Several coaching prospects have turned the Colts down.
    You don't think that has anything to do with the glaring lack of overall talent on that team do you? No offensive line, no defense. Luck is 43-27 as a starter on one of the worst rosters in the NFL. The Colts are 8-16 without him since he was drafted. When Luck is healthy he's a franchise QB that can carry a team. His problem isn't talent. It's health.

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