Thread: Cousins is a pro, but...

...Absolutely NOT worth a cap-crushing salary. He's top 10 at best. The money he seems to be predicted to be offered is validated only by QBs that can carry a team on their backs and to the SB. Cousins is definitely not that guy. He's got good numbers and is a leader. He'd be a great Bronco, and I'd be happy as hell to have him but we have to be realistic.

He has not carried the Redskins to notoriety as a starter on his own. That may seem unfair but I'm only talking about his monetary value, not his professional value. Again, he's top 10. That would be awesome for us Broncos fans but is he a SB winning QB, or is he simply a playoff QB? I'm leaning towards a playoff-only QB with question marks. So...

If we do pursue him, Elway should pull out all of his a-hole negotiating skills and make him realize his place in the greater NFL and what he needs, if he hopes to be a SB QB. Of course, it's totally realistic for him to want to see stability and support from the Broncos, regarding what we have to offer (drafts, coaching, free agents, o-line, receivers, etc.)...but he isn't worth 30-35 mil. and if he wants a great team around him, he should be open to reality, and suck up to 20-25 mil, to show he is a team player. Otherwise, he's not our guy.

Brees, however. That guy is gold and I would offer my second born (not happening but still...) to have him as a Bronco!

Brees is 38. I would love to have him for 2-3 years but with him I am drafting his future replacement.

I would take Cousins over Brees at this point. Brees is better but Cousins isn't THAT far behind.

Cousins could possibly be here another 10-12 years.

Originally Posted by Rick

Brees is 38. I would love to have him for 2-3 years but with him I am drafting his future replacement.

I would take Cousins over Brees at this point. Brees is better but Cousins isn't THAT far behind.

Cousins could possibly be here another 10-12 years.

Very true but Brees is a proven winner and soooo much better than Cousins for his respective team currently. He's a SB champion and has kicked ass in a HUGE way this year, where Cousins has provided only good numbers/ leadership. I also agree that Cousins would be the better long term choice but I guess it's a matter of balance.

Brees: Immediate SB winner that we can draft or develop a franchise QB under for a few years. A few years that might just bring us a ring..or two.

Cousins: Long term winner that can develop into a SB champion, after a few positive playoff experiences. We just need a decent backup QB (Kelly, even) and can spend the best part of our economy on drafting and buying a kick ass support structure around him.

I'm ok with either option. I would prefer Cousins long term, but only if he owns the fact that he's not Brees....yet (and accepts a paltry 20-25 mil.). I would prefer Brees short term, as he can change the Broncos immediately, and we can develop a franchise QB under him. Assuming Elway has any idea how to do so....which he hasn't shown so far.

Basically, I agree! I'm just saying that Cousins isn't worth top dollar in the NFL when he is only a proven top 10 QB. He deserves top 10 dollar, and that's it. After a short contract that he proves he's worth top dollar, then we can pay him that. But for now...I just don't think he is equal to the extra 10-15 mil he would hurt us regarding the hit we would take in money available to make the entire team 'championship'.

Cousins lit up our defense with subpar players. Yea, i would love to have him as he is better than ANY QB we have on the roster.

Originally Posted by Northman

Cousins lit up our defense with subpar players. Yea, i would love to have him as he is better than ANY QB we have on the roster.

I think that game was a bad example, as our entire team was out of sync but yeah, I get it. He has poor playoff experience though (not his fault). I'm totally down, I just don't think he's proven himself to be the absolute ringer his projected value seems to show. My main point is that I WANT him. I just want him at a salary that leaves room for high-level building around him. And at a salary that is equal to his value. He's had a few great seasons, and is getting better each year but...no real playoff experience.

Again, top 10. I'll take top ten all day. I just want Elway to prove his worth as the deal maker we know him to be and sell Denver as a paradise for the Cousins family. And to get Cousins at his real value, not his hyped value.

Originally Posted by Northman

Cousins lit up our defense with subpar players. Yea, i would love to have him as he is better than ANY QB we have on the roster.

True, at present. But I'm one of those die-hards who are not counting out Paxton Lynch for
the future until I see more of him. There's no way anyone can have a bead on him after 4½
whole games.

Originally Posted by topscribe

True, at present. But I'm one of those die-hards who are not counting out Paxton Lynch for
the future until I see more of him. There's no way anyone can have a bead on him after 4½
whole games.

Chances are Denver isnt going to discard him, but i wouldnt expect him to start next year, he still has a long way to go and lot more to learn (if he ever does). I just dont see Denver rolling the dice next year and letting him start the entire season which is why i think they are giving him this last game to see if he improved any. Much like the Raiders game the cards are stacked in his favor, the Chiefs will be sitting a lot of starters so its basically Lynch and our starters vs a preseason squad. If he cant do anything against them at home i think the writing will be on the wall in that regard.

Originally Posted by Northman

Chances are Denver isnt going to discard him, but i wouldnt expect him to start next year, he still has a long way to go and lot more to learn (if he ever does). I just dont see Denver rolling the dice next year and letting him start the entire season which is why i think they are giving him this last game to see if he improved any. Much like the Raiders game the cards are stacked in his favor, the Chiefs will be sitting a lot of starters so its basically Lynch and our starters vs a preseason squad. If he cant do anything against them at home i think the writing will be on the wall in that regard.

It's quite a dilemma, as I view it. If they rely on him, they're rolling the dice. If they go after, say, a Cousins or spend their #1 on a QB, they're also rolling the dice. In Cousins' case, they're betting Lynch won't make it because that will end his quest to be a starter, and that's a #1 down the drain plus the $27K or whatever for Cousins. In the case of a draft choice, they're bringing in another untested #1 to compete with an already invested, largely untested #1. It's a choice I'm glad I don't have to make . . .

Originally Posted by Ziggy

The problem with Lynch outside of his miniscule football IQ is his contract. It would be a 4.46 million dollar cap hit to cut him, and he has no trade value. The Broncos are stuck with him for at least another year. He gets to be a multi million dollar clipboard holder.

You know, I've heard more than once about Lynch's football I.Q., and I would like to know specifically what has caused that impression. I wonder what they would have thought about the I.Q. of a rookie who put his hands under a guard's butt to receive the snap.

Originally Posted by topscribe

You know, I've heard more than once about Lynch's football I.Q., and I would like to know specifically what has caused that impression. I wonder what they would have thought about the I.Q. of a rookie who put his hands under a guard's butt to receive the snap.

Specifically, Tyler Polumbus was talking about it during the preseason on Orange and Blue radio. Then they interviewed a former player that was a coaching intern last season, and he was talking about how Paxton didn't understand even the most basic football concepts coming in. His play on the field seems to back it up. Polumbus has a lot of friends in the locker room, and plays cards with the Olineman on occasion. (Or so he says)

Originally Posted by Northman

Cousins lit up our defense with subpar players. Yea, i would love to have him as he is better than ANY QB we have on the roster.

I don't know about "lit up" benefited from a short field maybe. The majority of the game I was fairly unimpressed. Don't forget that the very next week he threw 3 INT's and zero TD's against the Giants...

I'm just not buying the Cousins hype personally. I don't feel like we'll be any better at QB next year with Cousins than we were with Brock.

Originally Posted by Freyaka

I don't know about "lit up" benefited from a short field maybe. The majority of the game I was fairly unimpressed. Don't forget that the very next week he threw 3 INT's and zero TD's against the Giants...

I'm just not buying the Cousins hype personally. I don't feel like we'll be any better at QB next year with Cousins than we were with Brock.

Yes, i know you dont like the guy. We get it.

Originally Posted by Northman

Yes, i know you dont like the guy. We get it.

Yikes, so much touchiness. There are a lot of things I like about him, I like his fire, passion and leadership ability. I'm just not convinced he's worth being paid top QB money.

If he comes here, I'm not going to rally against him. He'll have as much support from me as TS did because he'll be our starting QB and overpaid or not, I'll support that.

I just feel there are better options.

Lets back the venom off and have a conversation, I come in peace I swear.

Problem with Brees is if we make the same mistake with the successor like we did with Manning, then we are in a world of hurt again in a few years.

Originally Posted by Rick

Problem with Brees is if we make the same mistake with the successor like we did with Manning, then we are in a world of hurt again in a few years.

Yep, good point. A point that accentuates a lack of faith in Elway's choices at QB. I hope that Elway has learned from his idiocy and will make different choices in the future but we can't assume that...so maybe more weight on Cousins than Brees because of the point you make.

Sad but true. Fandom has to be realism though, since we have no say outside of our purchase power.

Still don't want to leave the bank account empty for Cousins, though. But when thinking long term, a balance can be found with his salary and leaning towards drafting a future team around him. Of course, that brings back into question Elway's development prowess, and his ability to open up to let his coaches and staff help make a better future for the team. Also, it means the inevitable wait for fans to see the Broncos reach a championship level again.

Thanks for the point you made. I'm down for long term commitment and stability. Although we can't discount extended-aged success for Brees, ala Brady, Cousins makes much more sense in a reality where Elway leaves little room for faith in what he would do after Brees retires at the QB position. There is a long list of very successful QBs he has passed on while leaving us with what we have currently. He may change but unless he can land another ringer after Brees, a longer term proven QB is the better choice.

Originally Posted by Ground Control

Still don't want to leave the bank account empty for Cousins, though. But when thinking long term, a balance can be found with his salary and leaning towards drafting a future team around him. Of course, that brings back into question Elway's development prowess, and his ability to open up to let his coaches and staff help make a better future for the team. Also, it means the inevitable wait for fans to see the Broncos reach a championship level again.

Thanks for the point you made. I'm down for long term commitment and stability. Although we can't discount extended-aged success for Brees, ala Brady, Cousins makes much more sense in a reality where Elway leaves little room for faith in what he would do after Brees retires at the QB position. There is a long list of very successful QBs he has passed on while leaving us with what we have currently. He may change but unless he can land another ringer after Brees, a longer term proven QB is the better choice.

What Elway did wrong wasn't what you supposed. He passed on Russell Wilson and took Osweiler in the 2nd round. That was a mistake. But, every single GM in the NFL made exactly the same mistake - TWICE and some of them three times.

Russell Wilson should have been drafted in the top 5 picks of the NFL draft if anybody had a clue what he would become. So, I don't think you can fault Elway for not seeing what nobody in the NFL saw. Because if they had even a passing glimmer of an idea, they would have drafted him in the first or second round. THat's where QBs teams see as serious candidates to become franchise starters are drafted.

Rarely third round, and later than that almost never.