Thread: Practice / press conference notes - week 15 (Colts week)

Originally Posted by VonDoom

Troy Renck‏Verified account @TroyRenck 23m23 minutes ago

#Broncos Vance Joseph said does not buy into losing to improve draft status. "We can win and evaluate and look to the future". Also said snowglobe game of @Colts provided zero help in scouting @DenverChannel

Troy Renck‏Verified account @TroyRenck 17m17 minutes ago

#Broncos Vance Joseph. "Winning is first," explained Joseph on why not just play Langley, De'Angelo Henderson, etc #Denver7

Sorry but this makes me cringe... And I'm now convinced the NFL should move to a lottery system like the NBA that slightly de-incentivizes losing/tanking.

The needs of the organization and the needs of the coaches are not aligned right now.

We should absolutely be getting the young guys playing time, allowing them to make mistakes, and in the process giving ourselves a slightly worse chance at winning. I don't buy this idea that winning some meaningless games down the stretch is good for our culture... What would be good for our culture is getting one of the top QBs available in next year's draft.

Originally Posted by Buff

Sorry but this makes me cringe... And I'm now convinced the NFL should move to a lottery system like the NBA that slightly de-incentivizes losing/tanking.

The needs of the organization and the needs of the coaches are not aligned right now.

We should absolutely be getting the young guys playing time, allowing them to make mistakes, and in the process giving ourselves a slightly worse chance at winning. I don't buy this idea that winning some meaningless games down the stretch is good for our culture... What would be good for our culture is getting one of the top QBs available in next year's draft.

I agree.

but I also cant blame the guy for not coming out and saying we are mailing in the season. That prob wont go over well

Originally Posted by Buff

Sorry but this makes me cringe... And I'm now convinced the NFL should move to a lottery system like the NBA that slightly de-incentivizes losing/tanking.

The needs of the organization and the needs of the coaches are not aligned right now.

We should absolutely be getting the young guys playing time, allowing them to make mistakes, and in the process giving ourselves a slightly worse chance at winning. I don't buy this idea that winning some meaningless games down the stretch is good for our culture... What would be good for our culture is getting one of the top QBs available in next year's draft.

A coach shouldn't advocate tanking. That being said, why would they NOT want to evaluate some of the younger guys. Deangelo Henderson is the biggest mystery to me - he played well in preseason and hasn't even been given a chance. What exactly are we playing for, coach? We were officially eliminated from the playoffs. If anything, this gives us a leg up next year to see if we have anything with these players.

Originally Posted by underrated29

I agree.

but I also cant blame the guy for not coming out and saying we are mailing in the season. That prob wont go over well

Originally Posted by VonDoom

A coach shouldn't advocate tanking. That being said, why would they NOT want to evaluate some of the younger guys. Deangelo Henderson is the biggest mystery to me - he played well in preseason and hasn't even been given a chance. What exactly are we playing for, coach? We were officially eliminated from the playoffs. If anything, this gives us a leg up next year to see if we have anything with these players.

I agree the coach HAS to coach to win... That's why I think the NFL should go to a lottery where you aren't explicitly rewarded or punished for wins/losses - it adds some additional uncertainty into the mix.

But the idea that Jamaal Charles is getting playing time while Henderson rots on the bench seems silly to me. I guess maybe since he's a RB he could benefit from less wear and tear on his legs this season - but you could pick another inexperienced player who could benefit from additional time and apply the same argument.

Player development should be prioritized ahead of winning at this stage.

Originally Posted by Buff

Sorry but this makes me cringe... And I'm now convinced the NFL should move to a lottery system like the NBA that slightly de-incentivizes losing/tanking.

The needs of the organization and the needs of the coaches are not aligned right now.

We should absolutely be getting the young guys playing time, allowing them to make mistakes, and in the process giving ourselves a slightly worse chance at winning. I don't buy this idea that winning some meaningless games down the stretch is good for our culture... What would be good for our culture is getting one of the top QBs available in next year's draft.

Which QB in this years draft is your sure fire cant miss guy that the team just has to have?

I dont see darnold or rosen being cant miss guys, mayfield is questionable as well, although i do like his accuracy, Allen looks decent, but unpolished, Jackson, not sold at all.

I cant agree that tanking is ever going to be okay. 3-13, has to look like a place a older vet wouldnt want to be. why go to the basement to end your career, when you could live at least middle class....

Seeing what we have in young guys in role positions isnt all that meaningful either. Having lynch play would have been ideal, but he seems to be broken more than fixed. Which should speak enough about him along with his inability to beat out the rest of the crap we have tried to field.(yep i admit I was wrong about TS, he hasnt got it)

would rather see us 7-9 going out with fight, then 4-12 dying for the sake of dying.

continuing to dress frickin' charles over henderson has been pissing me off for weeks. . . they did the right thing putting wolfe and leary on IR, i don't understand why they're being so stubborn about henderson. . . vance is such a mouth-breather. . . you don't have to TRY to lose, numbskull-- you put the kids in, and then coach and play as hard as you can. . . player development and building/maintaining a strong culture don't have to be mutually exclusive. . . ya know, at least for coaches who are competent enough to walk and chew gum at the same time. . . give me a break with this chest-beating crap-- where the hell was your prideful insistence on winning at all costs when you were running numbnuts mckenzie out there to lose games for us, you toolbag?

Originally Posted by Krugan

Which QB in this years draft is your sure fire cant miss guy that the team just has to have?

I dont see darnold or rosen being cant miss guys, mayfield is questionable as well, although i do like his accuracy, Allen looks decent, but unpolished, Jackson, not sold at all.

I cant agree that tanking is ever going to be okay. 3-13, has to look like a place a older vet wouldnt want to be. why go to the basement to end your career, when you could live at least middle class....

Seeing what we have in young guys in role positions isnt all that meaningful either. Having lynch play would have been ideal, but he seems to be broken more than fixed. Which should speak enough about him along with his inability to beat out the rest of the crap we have tried to field.(yep i admit I was wrong about TS, he hasnt got it)

would rather see us 7-9 going out with fight, then 4-12 dying for the sake of dying.

This is fundamentally absurd to me. The higher draft pick is a real, tangible benefit that you can measure; the other is an intangible, impossible to quantify, *feeling* that fans have.

Originally Posted by Buff

This is fundamentally absurd to me. The higher draft pick is a real, tangible benefit that you can measure; the other is an intangible, impossible to quantify, *feeling* that fans have.

How is presenting yourself as a team who wins not tangible?

Originally Posted by Krugan

How is presenting yourself as a team who wins not tangible?

Because we just lost 8 in a row and are out of the playoffs. We're fooling ourselves if we think those matter. PLUS - we're 2 years removed from a Super Bowl championship and 5 straight AFC West titles - we're not the Browns who are trying to establish ANY winning culture whatsoever. People know we have a winning franchise.

Originally Posted by Buff

Because we just lost 8 in a row and are out of the playoffs. We're fooling ourselves if we think those matter. PLUS - we're 2 years removed from a Super Bowl championship and 5 straight AFC West titles - we're not the Browns who are trying to establish ANY winning culture whatsoever. People know it's a winning franchise.

I could agree with this, if we didnt live in a world where memories are as long as your nose. And relevance is measured in where you are this year. Call my cynical or crazy or whatever, im just calling it as i see it.

I do appreciate the position though and how tempting it is to pull in another guy in the same quality as Von. I, as a personal position, cant stomach the idea of sucking for the sake of a few draft spots to crap shoot a questionable QB.

Originally Posted by VonDoom

A coach shouldn't advocate tanking. That being said, why would they NOT want to evaluate some of the younger guys. Deangelo Henderson is the biggest mystery to me - he played well in preseason and hasn't even been given a chance. What exactly are we playing for, coach? We were officially eliminated from the playoffs. If anything, this gives us a leg up next year to see if we have anything with these players.

He wouldn't even have to start them, or have them take the majority of snaps.

As dog said above, it's asinine to keep trotting Charles out there at this point. He's probably gone next year anyway. Let's see what DH has.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

He wouldn't even have to start them, or have them take the majority of snaps.

As dog said above, it's asinine to keep trotting Charles out there at this point. He's probably gone next year anyway. Let's see what DH has.

Same. I feel the same for CJ too....

Id rather just run book and henderson and charles when they need a breather. CJ is gone. We know this. Charles is likely gone- although I have heard rumors that they want him back for next year (lol at the meltdown that will ensue if that happens!). Either way- we know Book and Henderson are our future. Lets get that going!

Latimer too. and Irman. Ditch green

i think traylor looks like the most promising of the TEs, honestly. . . i hope they keep finding playing time for him. . .

Originally Posted by underrated29

Same. I feel the same for CJ too....

Id rather just run book and henderson and charles when they need a breather. CJ is gone. We know this. Charles is likely gone- although I have heard rumors that they want him back for next year (lol at the meltdown that will ensue if that happens!). Either way- we know Book and Henderson are our future. Lets get that going!

Latimer too. and Irman. Ditch green

I'm not high on CJ anymore either. He's a MEH player.

Originally Posted by BroncoJoe

I'm not high on CJ anymore either. He's a MEH player.

He's above Meh, but not much. When I watch him I get frustrated because he just runs - sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. I never see him explode to the hole, never. I watch some of the other backs (EDIT in the league, not on the Broncos) and it seems that they are at full speed as they get the ball and just blast into the hole. Often resulting in an extra 3+ yards as they get tackled. The difference between a 2 yard or a 6 yard gain. Sometimes CJ makes a good move, gets a defender to miss, falls forward, but most often he gets stuffed at contact and it's pretty frustrating. Watching Drake last night made me yearn (literally) for an explosive back who runs with momentum and authority...