Thread: "Deep Thoughts" Thread

Originally Posted by aberdien

You have to build a franchise around one of our post-Elway non Manning QBs...who do you pick?

Well if the question is "Favorite" I'm with Dog - none of the above.

If I have to build a franchise around one of them, it's not Cutler or Plummer, who both had shit work ethics. Give me Siemian, who at least is an over achiever. Or Tebow, for the same reason.

The only thing Tebow erased was 5 decades of NFL evolution.

Originally Posted by Jaded

The only thing Tebow erased was 5 decades of NFL evolution.

The only thing Tebow erased was his own NFL career with his complete ineptitude at making NFL reads and throws. But, the guy was a competitor and did what it took to win, and had too much respect for his teammates to let them down come 4th quarter. That's why he's among my favorites. Guy sucks, and KC, New England, and Buffalo figured his game out pretty quick. Luckily, Pittsburgh got overconfident, but man what a glorious run.

Originally Posted by Jaded

The only thing Tebow erased was 5 decades of NFL evolution.

Five years of evolution? Isn't that like saying a full glass of ocean?

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

Five years of evolution? Isn't that like saying a full glass of ocean?

Five decades.

Originally Posted by Jaded

Five decades.

Who loves ya dude?

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

Who loves ya dude?

You're drunk.

Originally Posted by aberdien

You have to build a franchise around one of our post-Elway non Manning QBs...who do you pick?

That's the toughest trivia question ever. There's no good answer really. Cutler was the only one of them who was really an elite prospect, but we all know how he turned out. Plummer reached his ceiling in 2005. He was the Broncos Alex Smith - good enough to look good and win some games in the pre-season, but not good enough to win in the playoffs. Teams figured out how to defense Plummer, by denying him his roll-outs and forcing him to throw from the pocket. He couldn't do that effectively.

You have to remember among all the revisionist history that Shanahan was not a bad coach. He drafted Cutler for a reason, and it wasn't because he could have won a SB with Plummer. He realized that would never happen after losing the AFC Championship game. They needed a new QB. Cutler just turned out to have a personality defect that prevented him from realizing on his astounding talent.

Since Paxton has proven to be a bust, there's nobody but Trevor to pick. I would be stuck with him by default. He's probably not great, but we aren't sure yet and we're pretty sure about all the others.

But, of course, Elway isn't stuck with the QBs on the roster. He can and will go out in next years' draft and draft a QB if Trevor doesn't have a really, really good year!

I kinda figured some idiot would pick Tebow, but whatever. "10% never get the word." J.F.K.

Originally Posted by Cugel

That's the toughest trivia question ever. There's no good answer really. Cutler was the only one of them who was really an elite prospect, but we all know how he turned out. Plummer reached his ceiling in 2005. He was the Broncos Alex Smith - good enough to look good and win some games in the pre-season, but not good enough to win in the playoffs. Teams figured out how to defense Plummer, by denying him his roll-outs and forcing him to throw from the pocket. He couldn't do that effectively.

You have to remember among all the revisionist history that Shanahan was not a bad coach. He drafted Cutler for a reason, and it wasn't because he could have won a SB with Plummer. He realized that would never happen after losing the AFC Championship game. They needed a new QB. Cutler just turned out to have a personality defect that prevented him from realizing on his astounding talent.

Since Paxton has proven to be a bust, there's nobody but Trevor to pick. I would be stuck with him by default. He's probably not great, but we aren't sure yet and we're pretty sure about all the others.

But, of course, Elway isn't stuck with the QBs on the roster. He can and will go out in next years' draft and draft a QB if Trevor doesn't have a really, really good year!

I honestly think had Cutler been in Denver for the last decade, Denver still wins a Super Bowl. I am looking forward to watching the Dolphins play this year, because it will be the first time in Cutler's career since he left Denver that he is surrounded by competent talent in all the key spots on OLine, at receiver, and at RB. Cutler never had that in Chicago.

Shanahan's absolute crap choice in nepotist defensive coordinators after Larry Coyer doomed him, and his complete inability to build a secondary or pass rush in the draft or free agency, or even identify defensive talent period just set the team up for failure. But man, he had some firepower on offense his last year if you take away the whole having to start 7 different RBs situation.

Originally Posted by Cugel

I kinda figured some idiot would pick Tebow, but whatever. "10% never get the word." J.F.K.

Well, Josh McDaniels did, and the league didn't get to see that play out. Even McDaniels wasn't about to put the guy into the game until he could execute a passing offense at an appropriate passing percentage. At the end of his rookie year, we saw a preview of what McDaniels/McCoy had in store for him, which was a bunch of screen passes. Fox completely went away from that.

Building a team around Tebow isn't viable, because defenses caught up to run-based quarterback schemes. Kaepernick and Griffin III aren't on rosters because teams figured out the read-option nonsense pretty quickly. With Tebow's build, he's more of a power runner, so had Elway absolutely had to keep him as the centerpiece for 2-3 more years then it is unlikely teams could shut us down the same way. Looking at what has happened to Andrew Luck though, is an offensive coordinator really going to continually place their "face-of-the-franchise" quarterback in harm's way? Then what do you do if the guy gets a ruptured spleen? You drew up all these plays and built an entire offense around ONE player's skill-set, so to even think about managing a guy like Tebow you would need a phenomenal offensive coaching staff to maximize and adjust in the event the guy went out plus to teach Tebow how to throw a football at the NFL level.

If Shanatan let's the Plummer/Cutler sitch play out, like GB did with Favre, Shanatan never loses the locker room and his job. I was calling for his job in '99 when his GM's awful drafts started killing his HC's results, but he found his way towards the end. All they needed to do was fix the defense, where the '09-'11 drafts were strong.

I made the statement that the Broncos fired Shanatan 5 years too late and I still believe that, he was getting his second wind as a GM until the HC finally screwed the GM, instead of the other way around.

Cutler was the better player from the start but he wasn't ready to lead, especially in Plummer's shoes. This is another example of "the 1st rnd QB has to be a starter in his first 2 seasons or he's a bust" being stupid, even 10 years ago. Sometimes they're ready to hit the ground running (Prescott) but most times you have to be patient and let it play out.

Drafting Cutler was smart, taking Plummer's team away from him was stupid. You can't force leadership, even if you're a born leader, you have to let it happen.

Originally Posted by Jaded

If Shanatan let's the Plummer/Cutler sitch play out, like GB did with Favre, Shanatan never loses the locker room and his job. I was calling for his job in '99 when his GM's awful drafts started killing his HC's results, but he found his way towards the end. All they needed to do was fix the defense, where the '09-'11 drafts were strong.

I made the statement that the Broncos fired Shanatan 5 years too late and I still believe that, he was getting his second wind as a GM until the HC finally screwed the GM, instead of the other way around.

Cutler was the better player from the start but he wasn't ready to lead, especially in Plummer's shoes. This is another example of "the 1st rnd QB has to be a starter in his first 2 seasons or he's a bust" being stupid, even 10 years ago. Sometimes they're ready to hit the ground running (Prescott) but most times you have to be patient and let it play out.

Drafting Cutler was smart, taking Plummer's team away from him was stupid. You can't force leadership, even if you're a born leader, you have to let it happen.

Shanahan NEVER lost the locker room. He just had an absolute trash defense that couldn't stop anything. Cutler never had leadership issues in Denver either, guy actually played through a season for us with undiagnosed diabetes and had lost like 20-30 pounds during the year.

Man, people still opining for Cutler. Lol.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

Man, people still opining for Cutler. Lol.

Bruh, I've been opining for Cutler since he was drafted. Not my fault Hurricane McDumbass came in and kicked him out of town (or pissed him off so much he asked to leave).