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Thread: Off Season Notes - 2017

  1. #1051
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    Are you suggesting Slowick is an imaginary number?
    Just an imaginary coach.
    “If there are no animals in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went.” - Will Rogers (paraphrased)

  2. #1052
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    The Butt-tackular-ness of last year's OL is why they fired all the offensive position coaches, starting with OL Coach Clancey Barone. He was very the first one Elway fired, long before he selected Vance Joseph as his head coach. The idea is that they could develop some people better.

    Now, whether this works or not is an open question. But, they replaced the ZBS with McCoy's system which is mostly throw-first out of the shotgun. The idea is that they will replace a lot of the run plays that didn't work last year with short passes. Well, for that to work, they have to be able to be aggressive and push the ball downfield.

    Last year the running game didn't work partly because they couldn't pass the ball downfield, so teams just bunched up around the line with 8 or 9 guys in the box and jumped the underneath routes. Lots of 3 and outs resulted.

    The entire philosophy was wrong. The attitude was "don't screw things up for the defense by taking risks on offense." Just punt the ball and let the defense handle it. Well, the defense got worn down.

    So, this year they added a bunch of weapons on offense: Henderson, Butt, Charles. And they went to a more aggressive system. They added "guys with attitude" on the OL in Watson and Bolles. They think better coaching can get something useful out of Donald Stephenson for some reason as well as improving Max Garcia as a RG. They will be in the shot-gun around 70% of the time or more according to the sportswriters who talked with Trevor and Emanuel Sanders.

    But, who knows if they will work out? They are likely a season away from being a really serious competitor to the Patriots for the AFC Championship, and that development will depend on either Trevor or Paxton developing into a top 10 QB they need to compete in the division with Derek Carr and Philip Rivers.

    If not, then the Broncos offensive development will be delayed because Elway will have to go back to the 1st round in the 2018 draft and take a QB to become the long term franchise QB. And that guy's development will take until around 2019 of course. So, they are really banking on developing Lynch or Siemian. Otherwise they waste another 2 years and the defense gets older and worse meanwhile.
    And you wanted to sign the left tackle to a massive, massive contract. I'm just saying.
    *The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Buff View Post
    What is this, amateur hour? It's TNF against the Jets and you didn't think you'd need extra booze?

  3. #1053

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    Quote Originally Posted by MOtorboat View Post
    And you wanted to sign the left tackle to a massive, massive contract. I'm just saying.
    What are you talking about? Why would they sign Bolles to a massive, massive Contract? He's a rookie? I wanted them to go out in FA and sign a LT who could who could start so that they wouldn't have to depend on a rookie to protect a very delicate and easily injured Seimian from getting his arm torn off.

    Elway preferred to draft Garrett Bolles with #20. OK. We'll see how that works out. But, starting rookies at a key position like LT is never a good idea. Right now, the starting LT is Donald Stephenson. God help us! Do you really believe that will somehow be just fine? Did you see Stephenson last year?

    And Bolles is going to have to prove he's ready before he can even beat out Stephenson. Which he is not yet of course.

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  5. #1054

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    What are you talking about? Why would they sign Bolles to a massive, massive Contract? He's a rookie? I wanted them to go out in FA and sign a LT who could who could start so that they wouldn't have to depend on a rookie to protect a very delicate and easily injured Seimian from getting his arm torn off.

    Elway preferred to draft Garrett Bolles with #20. OK. We'll see how that works out. But, starting rookies at a key position like LT is never a good idea. Right now, the starting LT is Donald Stephenson. God help us! And Bolles is going to have to prove he's ready. Which he is not yet of course.
    Many left tackles do fine as rookies - Bolles in round one at that contract is better than Okung with his massive prohibitive contract. ****, if Stephenson sucks ass, so does Okung, but he's still better because his contract isn't massive. You can either suck or have a big contract - not both.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
    Y’all know I’m an OL Groupie but I think Jeudy is going to be worth missing out on a T, knock on wood.

  6. #1055
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    What are you talking about? Why would they sign Bolles to a massive, massive Contract? He's a rookie? I wanted them to go out in FA and sign a LT who could who could start so that they wouldn't have to depend on a rookie to protect a very delicate and easily injured Seimian from getting his arm torn off.

    Elway preferred to draft Garrett Bolles with #20. OK. We'll see how that works out. But, starting rookies at a key position like LT is never a good idea. Right now, the starting LT is Donald Stephenson. God help us! Do you really believe that will somehow be just fine? Did you see Stephenson last year?

    And Bolles is going to have to prove he's ready before he can even beat out Stephenson. Which he is not yet of course.
    Short memory?

    Oh, I'm sorry. Were you under the impression I actually read more than a couple sentences?
    *The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Buff View Post
    What is this, amateur hour? It's TNF against the Jets and you didn't think you'd need extra booze?

  7. #1056
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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Kinger View Post
    Many left tackles do fine as rookies - Bolles in round one at that contract is better than Okung with his massive prohibitive contract. ****, if Stephenson sucks ass, so does Okung, but he's still better because his contract isn't massive. You can either suck or have a big contract - not both.
    Sorry...Okung has both.
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  8. #1057

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canmore View Post
    Sorry...Okung has both.
    And that's why he's not a Bronco!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
    Y’all know I’m an OL Groupie but I think Jeudy is going to be worth missing out on a T, knock on wood.

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  10. #1058

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    Quote Originally Posted by Von Kinger View Post
    And that's why he's not a Bronco!
    Oh, give it a rest! NFL experts including Tyler Polumbus and Mark Schlereth both insist that Okung was mediocre not terrible. And he was mediocre. If he were as bad as fans keep insisting, then nobody would be paying him $13M a year! That's not an accident! He didn't just fall down on a big pile of money somebody left lying around!

    A mediocre LT who would have cost the Broncos $11M for 1 year. That's actually well BELOW NFL average for starting LTs. Which he is.

    Rookie LTs are not normally "fine" in the NFL, normally they don't start at all, which I pointed out months ago, but nobody apparently bothers to read or remember all the examples I provided of rookie tackles who were a lot better prospects than Bolles starting at RT or even LG in recent years - all in order to ease their transition to the NFL.

    The fact you think it's "normally fine" shows you don't know anything!

  11. #1059
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    Oh, give it a rest! NFL experts including Tyler Polumbus and Mark Schlereth both insist that Okung was mediocre not terrible. And he was mediocre. If he were as bad as fans keep insisting, then nobody would be paying him $13M a year! That's not an accident! He didn't just fall down on a big pile of money somebody left lying around!

    A mediocre LT who would have cost the Broncos $11M for 1 year. That's actually well BELOW NFL average for starting LTs. Which he is.

    Rookie LTs are not normally "fine" in the NFL, normally they don't start at all, which I pointed out months ago, but nobody apparently bothers to read or remember all the examples I provided of rookie tackles who were a lot better prospects than Bolles starting at RT or even LG in recent years - all in order to ease their transition to the NFL.

    The fact you think it's "normally fine" shows you don't know anything!
    You've been resoundingly wrong on rookie offensive linemen. I mean, yeah, the majority of rookies don't start. I mean there are 300 of them every year, which by shear math means there's limited spots. But rookies start and they are good, and it's been proven time and time again. Last year, a rookie tackle was an All-Pro.
    *The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Buff View Post
    What is this, amateur hour? It's TNF against the Jets and you didn't think you'd need extra booze?

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  13. #1060

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cugel View Post
    Oh, give it a rest! NFL experts including Tyler Polumbus and Mark Schlereth both insist that Okung was mediocre not terrible. And he was mediocre. If he were as bad as fans keep insisting, then nobody would be paying him $13M a year! That's not an accident! He didn't just fall down on a big pile of money somebody left lying around!

    A mediocre LT who would have cost the Broncos $11M for 1 year. That's actually well BELOW NFL average for starting LTs. Which he is.

    Rookie LTs are not normally "fine" in the NFL, normally they don't start at all, which I pointed out months ago, but nobody apparently bothers to read or remember all the examples I provided of rookie tackles who were a lot better prospects than Bolles starting at RT or even LG in recent years - all in order to ease their transition to the NFL.

    The fact you think it's "normally fine" shows you don't know anything!

    1 - I don't care what they insist - I care about what his rankings were and what his play was. I present this: https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro...m_campaign=nfl


    OK Russell Okung to Los Angeles Chargers
    Actual: Four years, $53 million, $25 million guaranteed
    PFF play-earned contract: Four years, $14.9 million, $4.3 million guaranteed

    Grade: F
    The headline figure for this contract looks insane, but though some reports had the guaranteed money at just $13.5 million, the later consensus seems to be a monstrous $25 million of guaranteed money, turning a one-year risk into a multi-year millstone for the Chargers. Okung remains a good run blocker—particularly on the backside of zone plays—but has his struggles in pass blocking, and was last solid in that regard in 2012.

    We can debate his play all year long, but everyone had us pegged for taking a LT BEFORE he left in free agency, that's how bad he was. And he was in the bottom half of LT's last season after being let go of by the Seahawks.

    2 - A bad LT who would have costed us a fortune - he's one of the highest paid LT's in the entire game. http://den.247sports.com/Bolt/Report...tract-51690553

    3. If you insist that Okung's awful play was medicore, then you'll be taking the play of just about any rookie to be on par with that if you're trying to be logically consistent. The year before this draft yielded multiple LT's who were average or better.

    4. You argued that we had to resign him and that he couldn't be replaced. At the least, we put in a cheaper alternative that will probably be on par with Okung. At best we drafted his replacement for this year and for many other years. Stop trying to defend your stance from months ago and move on. Everyone else did and that includes John Elway and the Denver Broncos.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
    Y’all know I’m an OL Groupie but I think Jeudy is going to be worth missing out on a T, knock on wood.

  14. #1061

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    Also, you argued that tackles are supposed to be safe picks that can start right away. You argued that so many times in multiple other threads, especially around draft time. So stick to some consistency, or better yet, admit that your stance was wrong and maybe stop worshiping 'Bronco Insiders'.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaded View Post
    Y’all know I’m an OL Groupie but I think Jeudy is going to be worth missing out on a T, knock on wood.

  15. #1062
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    I wonder if any NFL teams engage in guerrilla warfare type free-agency tactics. Sniping players to weaken division rivals.
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  17. #1063
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    I wonder if any NFL teams engage in guerrilla warfare type free-agency tactics. Sniping players to weaken division rivals.
    Well, the Patriots are notorious for it.
    *The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Buff View Post
    What is this, amateur hour? It's TNF against the Jets and you didn't think you'd need extra booze?

  18. #1064
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawgdriver View Post
    I wonder if any NFL teams engage in guerrilla warfare type free-agency tactics. Sniping players to weaken division rivals.

    Im sure they do. I do in my draft in FF and in Free agency. If I see your team has a weakness and I like my roster I will absolutely pick another QB so you only have Tebow and Joe Flacco as your options.

    Jim Moara Voice -"You play to win the game"
    The Plan at the moment:

    Draft: Trade a 3rd and 6th this year to a team to move up and get a 2nd next year (this will happen).

    Players I want:
    Jake Ferguson (Jake Butt) or Jelani Woods or Jeremy Ruckert or Cade Otten (owen daniels) at TE- All 4th rd or later.
    Troy Anderson LB 3rd/4th rd (yay Timmy!)
    Neil Farrell, JR DL- run stuffer- bye purcell

  19. #1065
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Not when you want to run the ball dominantly. You can use a slot receiver and backs out of the backfield to spread the defense. It doesn't have to be through a TE. See the 2016 Atlanta Falcons.
    Means when he comes on field he is a block.like Julius couldnt block so ypubonew he would receive when on field.

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