Thread: Is #13 any good?

We always said we just needed him to be decent. He's been kind of inconsistent - the stats today will say he was great (4 TD, 0 INT) but we all saw a couple of balls that could have been picked. It was really a tale of two halves. In the first half, he couldn't seem to hit the broad side of a barn, though I'm not sure why. Even the TD to Sanders was underthrown, and Sanders had to turn all the way around to catch it. Then in the second half, he's throwing darts including the beautiful TD to Thomas. Been kind of like that all year, really. So to me, that adds up to ... decent, which is what we need anyway.

I think ultimately this offense will be better off with Lynch out there, though I'm really only basing that on potential and hope. For now, if he can avoid turnovers, Siemian seems good enough to me.

Originally Posted by Valar Morghulis

The sunshines on a duck's arse every now and again.....

But it's not so much that I am unhappy, more that I can't evaluate or decide on what I have seen so far.

Problem is that with only three games and a grand total of less than 100 career passes, nobody knows.

It's important to remember that other than when Manning was hurt for the stretch last year, Trevor was mostly running scout team plays as the third string QB. Not only was he not getting any playing time during games, he was the third stringer in practice, with little to no first team reps (was probably lucky to get many second team reps).

So, now he's sitting middle of the pack in passing yards and around 10th or so in passer rating, and the Broncos are 3-0.

The first half of this game, he made more bad throws than he did in the first two games combined. During those first two games, he made only a half dozen or so bad throws. I'm not counting a throw that is thrown to the outside, leading the receiver away from the defender and then being just out of reach or off the finger tips a "bad" throw. Bad throws are missing a wide open receiver, throwing a pick into the defenders hands (vs. a pass that is tipped up, especially if off the receiver's hands).

Overall, when you look at his mechanics, and the results of his throw, it really is astounding when you also consider the fact he had a limited college career.

I believe I read he only had around a dozen starts in his four year college career and his senior season ended with a torn ACL, which means he entered the NFL recovering from that ACL injury.

So, I find myself asking the same questions, trying to figure out what exactly we have in Trevor, but then on the other hand, when I see how insanely good his mechanics and throws are (with the exception of that handful of awful looking throws in the first half), and more importantly, his decision making, and poise in the pocket, and then think that he's had less than 100 pass attempts, three games total, and 12 or so college starts, and I can't help but get a bit excited about what this guy might be like when he actually has some game experience behind him.

Originally Posted by Slick

I like him but I'm still thinking Lynch could have done just as well over the last 3 games, maybe not today but certainly the last two. Gary has handled this well. You can't do any better than 3-0.

I think there is almost zero chance of this.

Originally Posted by Joel

I'm curious what reason you have to think Lynch could have done as well in the last 2-3 games. Maybe he could, maybe not, but it's the third game of a rookie season where he's yet to play a snap: What possible evidence could exist that he'd have done as well as the guy who's taken EVERY snap? The biggest thing we're probably seeing right now is how much a full year (rather than two months) of studying Kubiaks playbook helps a young QB.

Understand, I still think Lynch will EVENTUALLY be the guy, but this isn't 2017, 2018 nor 2026. Likewise, I still expect veteran DCs to catch up to Siemian sooner than later, but until we have permanent starters on the right side of our line (preferably starters worthy of the name) I'd rather Lynch weren't the one taking the licks when the protection's non-existent and/or the stuffed run game leaves us in 3rd and 13.

Lynch seems more athletic and has a better arm from the little I saw of him. However, read my post again. I'm not arguing with 3-0. You can't do better than that.

The sole cause for concern I see with our QBs is how well Kubiak and Knapp can divide their attention between developing TWO talented young QBs simultaneously. If we could put Siemians skilled technique and calm self assurance in Lynchs powerful arm and legs we'd have an All Pro QB. Instead, we have a guy ideally suited to mind even a contenders store all year, then Lynch can come out and show our coaches are a big part of why Siemian looks far more experienced than he is.

Originally Posted by I Eat Staples

I think it's hilarious when people react negatively to Siemian being compared to QBs like Orton or Schaub. Getting an Orton or Schaub in the 7th round is ******* phenomenal.

I think it's hilarious when people start comparing a QB to Orton after the guy's first and second career starts.

Ironically, Kyle Orton's third career start was against the Bengals (although at home, not in Cincy).

Let's compare the lines:

Trevor - 23 / 35 65.7% 312 yards 8.9 avg 4 TDs 0 Ints 132.1 rating
Orton - 17 / 39 43.6% 149 yards 3.8 avg 0 TD / 5 INT 14.7 rating

When comparing the first three games of their careers, Siemian is averaging over 100 yards more a game, nearly twice the passer rating, and has thrown 3 more TDs and 2 less int's and has completed 15% more of his passes.

Do you not see how silly it is for you guys to compare Siemian with two, and now three, starts under his belt, to your memory of Orton when he was a five, six or eight year vet?

How many of you actually even watched Orton's first three games of his career? How many of you remember that he was barely serviceable, and that they won mostly due to the incredible defense (he finished that seasons with a passer rating under 60), and even though he started all year, they pulled him in favor of Grossman for the playoffs.

So, I am curious what it is about Trevor's first three games that reminds you so much of Orton's, in order to make the comparison that they are the same type of QB?

Originally Posted by Slick

Lynch seems more athletic and has a better arm from the little I saw of him. However, read my post again. I'm not arguing with 3-0. You can't do better than that.

With very poor mechanics, who struggles under center, and drops back way too far on his five step drops, dropping back so far that his tackle's can't block the outside speed rush.

He has the raw talent to be incredible. He's big, fast, strong and has a rocket arm, but he came from a shotgun only school and is very raw when it comes to NFL skills. That said, I think it's a testament to how much work he's put in that the Broncos are confident with him being the backup.

Originally Posted by Tned

With very poor mechanics, who struggles under center, and drops back way too far on his five step drops, dropping back so far that his tackle's can't block the outside speed rush.

He has the raw talent to be incredible. He's big, fast, strong and has a rocket arm, but he came from a shotgun only school and is very raw when it comes to NFL skills. That said, I think it's a testament to how much work he's put in that the Broncos are confident with him being the backup.

Dak Prescott also went to a shotgun-only school and he is already doing just fine from under center. I don't see why Lynch couldn't pick it up quickly as well.

He's played well but has been inconsistent so far.

Originally Posted by Slick

Lynch seems more athletic and has a better arm from the little I saw of him. However, read my post again. I'm not arguing with 3-0. You can't do better than that.

No one denies Lynch has more inborn talent, but Siemian's succeeding with the practiced skill a franchise QB needs at least as much (despite little ACTUAL practice to develop it.) Again, if Lynchs natural ability came with that same developed ability, we'd be set—but it's also undeniable he came into the NFL pretty raw, just a few months ago. If Siemian's making too many ill-advised pickable throws, imagine how many Lynch would make.

I didn't get to see the first 8 or 9 minutes of the first quarter, but did hear about the missed passes on the radio. When I finally got home and started watching, it seemed to me like the pocket was collapsing on him quickly and regularly. Now, I don't know football as technically as a lot of you,mso maybe it was just my perception, but sure seemed like he was trying to rush passes to avoid the collapsing pocket. That funky, dead duck pass that was almost picked was because a defender got to his arm.

Things seemed to start changing after the 55 yard td to Sanders. Yes, he still made a few mistakes after that, but that play seemed to get the Bengals to pull back a little. Somebody obviously made the right corrections at halftime, because things went well after that.

Trevor sure seems to never get rattled, unlike the fainting goat Orton.

Originally Posted by Tned

I think there is almost zero chance of this.

Zero chance of being better that 3-0? Way to go out on a limb.

Not sure how people could compare Orton and Trevor at all.

Trevor has a much stronger arm and is much more mobile.

Orton was the perfect example of game manager, short accurate throws, don't take chances.

Trevor is really more of a gun slinger that in games 1 and 2 they had him try and act more like manager. Based on college and what I have seen in pros though, he is a slinger and some picks are going to come with the package.

Originally Posted by Slick

Zero chance of being better that 3-0? Way to go out on a limb.

Nearly zero chance that Lynch would have played just as well in his first three games. Not only for the reasons I mentioned, but also because he didn't have the benefit of a red shirt first year in the NFL, learning behind Peyton Manning.

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

Dak Prescott also went to a shotgun-only school and he is already doing just fine from under center. I don't see why Lynch couldn't pick it up quickly as well.

Yes, and Prescott has surprised everyone. Nobody thought he would play this well, this soon, which is why he was drafted where he was and considered a project with good upside. He had a great preseason, and has been impressive.

That said, unless you think that Lynch is somehow a clone of Prescott, I'm not sure what one has to do with the other.

Are you really saying that you would rather see the kid that couldn't win the job, be the starter, because he "might" be able to pick it up like Prescott, and defending the Lombardi be damned?

Originally Posted by Tned

Nearly zero chance that Lynch would have played just as well in his first three games. Not only for the reasons I mentioned, but also because he didn't have the benefit of a red shirt first year in the NFL, learning behind Peyton Manning.



Yes, and Prescott has surprised everyone. Nobody thought he would play this well, this soon, which is why he was drafted where he was and considered a project with good upside. He had a great preseason, and has been impressive.

That said, unless you think that Lynch is somehow a clone of Prescott, I'm not sure what one has to do with the other.

Are you really saying that you would rather see the kid that couldn't win the job, be the starter, because he "might" be able to pick it up like Prescott, and defending the Lombardi be damned?

No, I'm not saying that. I'm simply saying that just because he played in a shotgun system in college doesn't mean he couldn't transition to the NFL quickly.