Thread: Shane Ray happy with increased opportunities with Broncos

Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Let's not overstate Clark. He couldn't get on the field last year and got beat out by Harris this year.

Broncos were playing him out of position. He plays LT, not guard.

These guys get hungry in camp and preseason then take a shit once they win the job. Harris has been awful and Clark played LT for us the year we went to the SB.

So I'll say it again. Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Originally Posted by DenBronx

Broncos were playing him out of position. He plays LT, not guard.

These guys get hungry in camp and preseason then take a shit once they win the job. Harris has been awful and Clark played LT for us the year we went to the SB.

So I'll say it again. Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Wasn't he usually covered by a TE when they moved him to LT. I'm not buying it, if a dude can play LT in the NFL he sure as heck should be able to play RT.

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

Originally Posted by DenBronx

Broncos were playing him out of position. He plays LT, not guard.

These guys get hungry in camp and preseason then take a shit once they win the job. Harris has been awful and Clark played LT for us the year we went to the SB.

So I'll say it again. Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Wasn't he usually covered by a TE when they moved him to LT. I'm not buying it, if a dude can play LT in the NFL he sure as heck should be able to play RT.

You mean in 2013 when he played LT? Our TE JT that can't block? Lol

Originally Posted by DenBronx

You mean in 2013 when he played LT? Our TE JT that can't block? Lol

Good point!

Originally Posted by DenBronx

Broncos were playing him out of position. He plays LT, not guard.

These guys get hungry in camp and preseason then take a shit once they win the job. Harris has been awful and Clark played LT for us the year we went to the SB.

So I'll say it again. Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Clark wasn't that good Den. He was awful as a run blocker that's why lost the job as starting right tackle last year.

Originally Posted by TXBRONC

Originally Posted by DenBronx

Broncos were playing him out of position. He plays LT, not guard.

These guys get hungry in camp and preseason then take a shit once they win the job. Harris has been awful and Clark played LT for us the year we went to the SB.

So I'll say it again. Trading Clark for a 7th was stupid.

Clark wasn't that good Den. He was awful as a run blocker that's why lost the job as starting right tackle last year.

Maybe he wasnt a good run blocker but he was good in pass protection. Something Manning really needs right now. Stick to what you're good at and we were good at passing, not running. Now we dont have either.

Sorry to hijack the thread. It's about Shane Ray.

Originally Posted by Slick

The Ray pick looks like a good one by John.

Drafting a BACKUP in the FIRST ROUND can't be a good pick. No matter how elite a starter that backup may BECOME in YEARS later, the team has those intervening years to find an immediate replacement for its departing starter: Meanwhile, it has other needs ALREADY immediate, and thus far more urgent (in our case, the offensive line.)

Originally Posted by Slick

What about trading Clark for a 7th rounder? He was an NFL ready starting OT compared to any tackle on the roster at this point.

Clark's no NFL-ready starter compared to ANYONE: He was a backup before Cladys injury, after which he played poorly (I realize everyone raves about his 2013 season but, again: STRIP-SACKS IN THREE STRAIGHT GAMES.) When Clady came back and Franklin moved inside to replace Beadles, Clark was the default starting RT for all of, what, 3 games before benched for a PS guy? We got a 7th rounder for him because Houston wants to use him as what he is: A BACKUP for REAL starters Duane Brown and Derek Newton.

Originally Posted by DenBronx

Maybe he wasnt a good run blocker but he was good in pass protection. Something Manning really needs right now. Stick to what you're good at and we were good at passing, not running. Now we dont have either.

No, he wasn't: STRIP-SACKS IN THREE STRAIGHT GAMES, all of which scored opponent points. This isn't like with Kuper, a marginal run blocker who kept the starting job because he was our best inside pass blocker; Clark's just BAD. He didn't lose the starting RT job last year (just) because of poor run blocking, but because he gave up free shots on his QB even with TE help. Speaking of which...

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

Wasn't he usually covered by a TE when they moved him to LT. I'm not buying it, if a dude can play LT in the NFL he sure as heck should be able to play RT.

Originally Posted by DenBronx

You mean in 2013 when he played LT? Our TE JT that can't block? Lol

Yeah, in 2013, when we BENCHED JT after Clarks second strip-sack in as many games, and stuck Dreesen in there to help out, incidentally catching a couple 4th down passes (one in the end zone) along the way. I'm grateful we got a 7th rounder for Clark, because even that's more than he's worth. My only regret is that my second favorite team provided that overpayment, but I'd rather he waste roster space on my second favorite than absolute favorite team.

What I'd REALLY prefer is spending our 1st pick on an "NFL-ready starting OT" and our 2nd on a promising OLB to develop into Wares successor in a year or two. Y'know, instead of drafting someone to succeed Ware NOW, then someone to succeed Franklin in 2016-7 (even though we cut him in 2015.) Teams shouldn't take the "best player available" unless NONE of their players are good, and certainly not when the best player ISN'T available (only the 24th best.)

NO ONE should spend a FIRST ROUND pick on someone to DEVELOP into a possible starter a few years from now. There are plenty of guys like that in the 2nd and 3rd round, not only now, but next year and the year after that. If we lose (or don't even REACH) the SB, it won't be because we don't have someone good enough to spell Ware, but because we don't have a STARTER who can keep blitzers off Mannings neck >2 seconds and open holes for Anderson and Hillman. Ray's already playing well, but that's not the point; Mariota's playing well, too, but there's a reason we didn't try to trade up for him.

Love the Ray pick. Shows that you don't force a pick based on need but grab a quality player for future of team. Ray will be a starter, question is how long Ware will be around for.

Saying the Ray pick was a bad pick when he's clearly going to be a star is very strange. You don't pass up a elite pass rusher and run defender to reach on a o line.

Originally Posted by Yashahla17

Saying the Ray pick was a bad pick when he's clearly going to be a star is very strange. You don't pass up a elite pass rusher and run defender to reach on a o line.

First round picks aren't for guys who are "going to be" stars: They're for IMMEDIATE starters; you've got 2nd and 3rd round picks for talented but raw players good coaching will EVENTUALLY make stars. The last draft had a crapton of quality OTs; none were "reaches." Unless you mean "some draft picks are busts," in which case EVERY PLAYER EVER DRAFTED was a "reach" because any could've bombed. Ryan Leaf wasn't a "reach," he was a bust: Huge difference, and Ray could've just as easily gone the same route (still could, in fact.)

In terms of guys with the talent and skills, who were rated 1st round picks, there were plenty of non-reach OTs left at our pick, and we manifestly needed one a HELL of a lot better than we need a starting 2017 OLB we could've found in the 2nd or 3rd, or NEXT years 2nd or 3rd, or the FOLLOWING years 1st, 2nd or 3rd. We needed a solid backup OLB who might become good enough to succeed Ware, but spending a 1st rounder on that is overspending. Again, we won't lose or miss the SB because we were short a BACKUP, but losing/missing it because we were short a STARTING OT looks like a real possibility.

Originally Posted by NightTerror218

Love the Ray pick. Shows that you don't force a pick based on need but grab a quality player for future of team. Ray will be a starter, question is how long Ware will be around for.

The future is now, and drafting the best player "available" when he's ALREADY LONG GONE and the sole choice is the best player LEFT is a mistake. If we were in rebuild mode with a top ten draft pick in each round, sure: We'd have our pick of everyone (or nearly everyone) and need help EVERYWHERE, so as long as our scouts did their job we'd be guaranteed an elite player and huge immediate improvement WHATEVER his position—we'd even get a shot at TWO, because we'd have another top 50 pick in the 2nd round.

That's not where we are, and drafting one of a drafts top talents to SIT behind TWO ALL PROS is a textbook example of why good teams can't afford drafting the Best Player Left After Two Dozen Teams Get Their Choice. Not quite the posterchild, because Rays arrest scared away so many teams we could still get a very good player, not just "best of the rest." But in terms of getting 1st round VALUE: He only plays if Ware/Miller's tired or hurt; that's valuable, but not nearly as valuable as a 1st round pick. It's the kind of value we could've gotten in the 2nd round, when we actually DID "reach" on a STARTING OT.

Spending 1st round picks on developmental BACKUPS but 2nd round picks on critical STARTERS is bad drafting whether the teams a contender, dog or anything between the two. It's not even like 3-4 OLBs are soooo much more valuable than OTs; they're both at a premium: We just prioritized the position where ALL our starters are All Pros rather than the one where we had an All Pro and TBA. Then the All Pro goes on IR and we have a full complement of All Pro OLBs PLUS another waiting for his shot, but bupkis keeping their counterparts off our 39-year-old QBs surgically repaired neck. Bad luck, or bad preparation?

Dude your making shit up. You think all first rounders are immediate stars when that's just false. Damn near 80% of first round picks don't do a thing in there rookie years. Takes many of them at least a couple years. And even then Damn near half are bust. So what are you talking about.

Dude they had clady. Drafted sambrello. Drafted max Garcia. Signed Vasquez a year ago. Signed Mathis. The o line has been addressed. The talent is young. If you think there was a better player at 22 than a top 5 pick had he not got busted for his friends weed then your tripping lol. Makes absolutely no sense. Top 5 talent vs reaching on a development o line men? Sheesh I'm glad your not making the calls.