Thread: Brady may be suspended, refused to cooperate

Originally Posted by OrangeHoof

If the Broncos win the Super Bowl, then all the Patriots fans (including North) must take a one-year hiatus from this site. That would be a nice respite for me anyway. Why we bother tolerating these clowns is what I don't understand.

North is a loyal Broncos fan.

I really do hate the fan police.

Originally Posted by spikerman

Ok, I didn't read through this entire thread, but I hope that someone brought up that our "rights" are designed to protect us from the government. As far as I know the government has nothing to do with this investigation. The NFL, as a private organization, can dole out whatever punishment it deems appropriate.

Sure, under your analysis the NFL can dole out whatever punishment it deems appropriate, but then the employee has the ability to challenge that discipline arguing that the discipline was arbitrary, capricious, violated rules or regulations etc. If the private employer based any part of its decision on an employee's failure or refusal to turn over a personal phone or information contained on a personal phone, computer, etc., I am pretty sure that the court, arbitrator or finder of fact will find that the employer's punishment was invalid.

So spikerman, based on your post you would have no problems if your employer demanded that you turn over your personal phone, computer or the information contained on your personal phone or computer, let alone doles out whatever punishment it deems appropriate for what if finds on your personal phone/computer or your refusal to turn over personal phone, computer, or information contained on them? I highly doubt that you or any reasonable person would. If it was a company provided phone or computer that is different, but that is not the case here.

from article:

A Friday PFT poll question resulted in more than 27,000 responses, with more than 43 percent saying Brady should be banned for more than four games. If the decision to release the Wells report resulted not from a desire to be transparent but from a temptation to test the waters, that sentiment could be bad news for Brady.

Ultimately, the news will be bad; it’s not yet known how bad it will be. Although a league source insisted in the wake of Myers’ report that no decisions have been made regarding Brady (which actually feeds into the notion that the NFL is taking its time to gauge public opinion before pulling the trigger), how can Brady not be suspended?

AND

Per a league source, phones routinely were surrendered by many league employees (including the highest of the high-level league employees) when former FBI director Robert Mueller investigated whether someone at 345 Park Avenue had seen the Ray Rice elevator video before TMZ released it in September. No one refused to surrender their phones.

In Brady’s case, the same protections would have been provided. A third-party performs the imaging and data collection based on narrowly-defined search terms and recipient information. With Brady, an offer was made to let Brady’s camp perform the search itself. He still declined.

full article - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...tom-brady-yet/

Originally Posted by MNPatsFan

Sure, under your analysis the NFL can dole out whatever punishment it deems appropriate, but then the employee has the ability to challenge that discipline arguing that the discipline was arbitrary, capricious, violated rules or regulations etc. If the private employer based any part of its decision on an employee's failure or refusal to turn over a personal phone or information contained on a personal phone, computer, etc., I am pretty sure that the court, arbitrator or finder of fact will find that the employer's punishment was invalid.

So spikerman, based on your post you would have no problems if your employer demanded that you turn over your personal phone, computer or the information contained on your personal phone or computer, let alone doles out whatever punishment it deems appropriate for what if finds on your personal phone/computer or your refusal to turn over personal phone, computer, or information contained on them? I highly doubt that you or any reasonable person would. If it was a company provided phone or computer that is different, but that is not the case here.

Just grasping at straws at this point, aren't we?

Dude didn't cooperate with the investigation. Suspension impending.

I don't believe anyone has posted this article or the information included in it, so I will post it. According to the article:

To summarize, the NFL had two air pressure gauges available at the game. One had a Wilson logo on the back and a long, crooked needle. The other did not have a Wilson logo, and a shorter, straighter needle.

The gauge with the logo and the longer needle generated higher measurements of the Patriots footballs at halftime, ranging from 0.3 PSI to 0.45 PSI higher for each of the 11 footballs. If that gauge — the one with the logo and the longer, crooked needle — were used to set the PSI for the balls before the game began, the measurements from that gauge are the right measurements to rely upon at halftime. And those measurements show that there was no tampering, because most of the footballs fell within the 11.52 to 11.32 PSI range for halftime, as predicted by the Ideal Gas Law.

Referee Walt Anderson didn’t clearly recall which gauge he used to set the pressure in the Patriots balls at 12.5 PSI before the game. Page 52 of the Wells report reveals that it was Anderson’s “best recollection” that he used before the game the gauge with the logo and the longer, crooked needle. In other words, Anderson recalls using the gauge before the game that, based on the halftime measurements, leads to a finding of no tampering.

So how did Ted Wells get around the “best recollection” of Walt Anderson? Wells persuaded Anderson to admit that it’s “certainly possible” he used the other gauge. And the company hired to provide technical support for the Wells report concluded based on a convoluted explanation appearing at pages 116-17 of the report that it is “more probable than not” that Anderson used the other gauge.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...e-of-evidence/

This is one of the reasons I am skeptical of the investigation, its findings, etc. The Keystone Cops investigation however, did further convince me that Goodell must go and the NFL needs to find a new commish who has credibility, intelligence, etc.

The footballs, at this point, aren't the Patriots problem. If that was the only issue, there might be a fine.

Man, they should have cooperated with league officials.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

Just grasping at straws at this point, aren't we?

Dude didn't cooperate with the investigation. Suspension impending.

I'm not grasping at anything. I'm just stating my position and opinion that I wouldn't turn over my personal phone to my employer, especially if my employer has clearly demonstrated that it doesn't keep that information private and that information frequently gets leaked.

Originally Posted by MNPatsFan

Sure, under your analysis the NFL can dole out whatever punishment it deems appropriate, but then the employee has the ability to challenge that discipline arguing that the discipline was arbitrary, capricious, violated rules or regulations etc. If the private employer based any part of its decision on an employee's failure or refusal to turn over a personal phone or information contained on a personal phone, computer, etc., I am pretty sure that the court, arbitrator or finder of fact will find that the employer's punishment was invalid.

So spikerman, based on your post you would have no problems if your employer demanded that you turn over your personal phone, computer or the information contained on your personal phone or computer, let alone doles out whatever punishment it deems appropriate for what if finds on your personal phone/computer or your refusal to turn over personal phone, computer, or information contained on them? I highly doubt that you or any reasonable person would. If it was a company provided phone or computer that is different, but that is not the case here.

Yep just another Patriots fan with no ability to grasp reality.

Originally Posted by MNPatsFan

I'm not grasping at anything. I'm just stating my position and opinion that I wouldn't turn over my personal phone to my employer, especially if my employer has clearly demonstrated that it doesn't keep that information private and that information frequently gets leaked.

Cool. Enjoy the suspension.

Originally Posted by MNPatsFan

I don't believe anyone has posted this article or the information included in it, so I will post it. According to the article:



http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...e-of-evidence/

This is one of the reasons I am skeptical of the investigation, its findings, etc. The Keystone Cops investigation however, did further convince me that Goodell must go and the NFL needs to find a new commish who has credibility, intelligence, etc.

From same article you posted -

This doesn’t mean the Patriots should be exonerated. The texts between Larry and Curly and the potential involvement of Tom Brady a/k/a Moe Howard requires further examination regarding whether there was a pattern of deliberate efforts to get the footballs below 12.5 PSI at kickoff on a regular basis. And Tom Brady should be presumed guilty at best and suspended indefinitely until he gives up his text messages and emails at worst for his failure to cooperate with the investigation.

And from article I posted:

In Brady’s case, the same protections would have been provided. A third-party performs the imaging and data collection based on narrowly-defined search terms and recipient information. With Brady, an offer was made to let Brady’s camp perform the search itself. He still declined.

At a minimum, that entitles the NFL to infer that the contents of the phone were not helpful to Brady. It also could allow the NFL to tell Brady that he won’t play until he complies with the request.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...tom-brady-yet/

Originally Posted by BroncoWave

WTE and Pags are way better posters than a number of Bronco fans who frequent this site.

I would agree with that and Orangehoof has now been added to my ever increasing Iggy list.

So long 'Hoof. You are Dead to me.

Originally Posted by Denver Native (Carol)

From same article you posted -



And from article I posted:



http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...tom-brady-yet/

MN falls in the category Patriots fan that blame the NFL for their team being a bunch of lying cheats.

Originally Posted by MNPatsFan

I'm not grasping at anything. I'm just stating my position and opinion that I wouldn't turn over my personal phone to my employer, especially if my employer has clearly demonstrated that it doesn't keep that information private and that information frequently gets leaked.

In Ted Wells' biased report they submitted for their client he disclosed personal texts between McNally and his mom. If I was McNally I would file a lawsuit against Wells, Goodell and the NFL for invasion of privacy.

Originally Posted by TXBRONC

MN falls in the category Patriots fan that blame the NFL for their team being a bunch of lying cheats.

MN falls into a few categories and none of them are good.