Thread: Klis: Broncos finalizing 4-year deal with Kubiak

From what I saw of Hillman as he was the starter after Ball went down, he's got more abilities than it seems people want to give him credit for, imo. Anderson is the man, and maybe I've written Ball off too quickly (but I have written him off)...but Hillman has impressed me more than Juwan has, to this point. That might change later on down the road...but not yet.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

From what I saw of Hillman as he was the starter after Ball went down, he's got more abilities than it seems people want to give him credit for, imo. Anderson is the man, and maybe I've written Ball off too quickly (but I have written him off)...but Hillman has impressed me more than Juwan has, to this point. That might change later on down the road...but not yet.

We'll certainly get to see. Finding out how Kubiak plans to use our stable of backs to keep the pressure off Manning and grind up teams in the second halves of games should be a lot of fun. It ain't like we don't have the tools back there to do some interesting things.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

??? where is Thompson doing more in actuality???

Well, the big things are breaking tackles and moving piles, both of which Thompson does consisently but Hillman seldom. I've seen Thompson make some nice cuts to get by guys in the open field like Hillman, too, so it's not like his edge there (if any) offsets his much lesser power. Hillmans edge in receiving average is also negligible, though he looks to me like a slightly better receiver on the field. But Thompson averaged 5 yds/att bowling over and around defenders this year, a full yard more than Hillman (despite his average rising slightly from the 3.8 yds/att he had in 2013.)
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...T/ThomJu01.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...H/HillRo00.htm

Keep in mind we've had three seasons to look at Hillman, with Moreno and Balls injury and ball security issues giving him plenty of quality reps in each of them; we've only had one season to look at Thompson, and even after Ball and Hillman lost the starting job to injuries and anemic production, Anderson tore it up so consistently Thompson only got relief reps on the backend of the season. When he's played though, he's usually looked good; it's just that Anderson looked so much better it's hard to argue against starting him unless he's hurt.

Originally Posted by G_Money

We'll certainly get to see. Finding out how Kubiak plans to use our stable of backs to keep the pressure off Manning and grind up teams in the second halves of games should be a lot of fun. It ain't like we don't have the tools back there to do some interesting things.

The only problem's been what we DIDN'T have up front, but that will almost certainly change radically and immediately. In that sense, next years team could well resemble '97s in that it doesn't HAVE to ask much of Manning, and, contrary to popular belief, Mannings history playing his own OC and knowledge of footballs nature and history shows he's not only willing but EAGER to ride a strong ground game to victory. It's a passing league, sure, but there's a good argument its high octane flying circuses make it more important than ever to keep them off the field and pass rushers honest.

Originally Posted by Joel

Well, the big things are breaking tackles and moving piles, both of which Thompson does consisently but Hillman seldom. I've seen Thompson make some nice cuts to get by guys in the open field like Hillman, too, so it's not like his edge there (if any) offsets his much lesser power. Hillmans edge in receiving average is also negligible, though he looks to me like a slightly better receiver on the field. But Thompson averaged 5 yds/att bowling over and around defenders this year, a full yard more than Hillman (despite his average rising slightly from the 3.8 yds/att he had in 2013.)
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...T/ThomJu01.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.co...H/HillRo00.htm

Keep in mind we've had three seasons to look at Hillman, with Moreno and Balls injury and ball security issues giving him plenty of quality reps in each of them; we've only had one season to look at Thompson, and even after Ball and Hillman lost the starting job to injuries and anemic production, Anderson tore it up so consistently Thompson only got relief reps on the backend of the season. When he's played though, he's usually looked good; it's just that Anderson looked so much better it's hard to argue against starting him unless he's hurt.

Sooo... all you are saying is that going by the 'eye ball' test.. YOU believe that Thompson has proved in "actuality." Got it.

Yeah, what I'm waiting for is Kubiak, Elway and Dennison to get the O-line fixed. Maybe that means bringing in somebody like Samson Satele to have a vet hand at the center position, I dunno. I expect at least two moves. Clady and Vasquez are locks, but everybody else is up in the air for FA and the draft.

And then I'm hoping for a Seahawks-like mauling unit on the ground with CJ being spelled by Thompson and Ball, much as Lynch was spelled by Turbin. It doesn't get much EASIER to get Turbin on the ground. If Hillman winds up being the change of pace instead on the edges, so be it, as long as we don't forget about the run once we've got it squared away. Demarco Murray and Lynch have both shown you can get some work done running the ball in this league still, and I'd like to step it up from the 1800 yards rushing we've been getting the last 3 years.

More receivers will be open, play action will be beautiful, and Manning will still be standing. Plus it'll make the OL happier. Pass protecting sucks.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

Sooo... all you are saying is that going by the 'eye ball' test.. YOU believe that Thompson has proved in "actuality." Got it.

Going by their RUSHING AVERAGE, RECEIVING AVERAGE and the eyeball test; that's a big difference. I didn't link to my eyeball test, but to their tangible production.

Originally Posted by Jsteve01

People are very quick to forget that cJ came on after they got Green back and started bringing an extra lineman into the game. They are also quick to forget that ball was a monster in the last 6 games of 2014.

ypc by game the last 8 of last year

11: 5.7

12: 9.0

13:5.13

14: 0.3

15: 8

16: 7.2

The 14th game in that stretch was a total anomaly. and he still averaged 6 ypc over that stretch. It is faaaar to early to give up on him and unfair to forget what he did last year and only focus on the deficiencies in the run game this year.

oh man- ive been saying this for months. Since week 2 or 3 I believe.

Originally Posted by G_Money

Yeah, what I'm waiting for is Kubiak, Elway and Dennison to get the O-line fixed. Maybe that means bringing in somebody like Samson Satele to have a vet hand at the center position, I dunno. I expect at least two moves. Clady and Vasquez are locks, but everybody else is up in the air for FA and the draft.

I'm with you: Clady and Vasquez for sure, but hopefully no one elses job is safe. Franklin's showed improvement the second half of the season, but who but they know if that sold the coaches any more than it did I. Montgomery has three-year starter experience in a ZBS with Shannys 'Skins, and looked good when he took over from Ramirez, but that was late enough in the year I can't be sure he'll be that good consistently. I just wish we'd had these coaches to take care of that a year or two ago, and WE might be the ones going for a SB repeat this Sunday....

Originally Posted by G_Money

And then I'm hoping for a Seahawks-like mauling unit on the ground with CJ being spelled by Thompson and Ball, much as Lynch was spelled by Turbin. It doesn't get much EASIER to get Turbin on the ground. If Hillman winds up being the change of pace instead on the edges, so be it, as long as we don't forget about the run once we've got it squared away. Demarco Murray and Lynch have both shown you can get some work done running the ball in this league still, and I'd like to step it up from the 1800 yards rushing we've been getting the last 3 years.

More receivers will be open, play action will be beautiful, and Manning will still be standing. Plus it'll make the OL happier. Pass protecting sucks.

That last line said it perfectly. Imagine a world where pass rushers must keep one eye over their shoulder for Anderson/Thompson so they can't just charge Manning every down, safeties must stack the box on them so they can't play deep robber (e.g. Chancellor the last two times we played Seattle) and LBs can't all drop into shallow zones cutting off the short routes so safeties couldn't all hang back even if they didn't have run stopping duties. For all the claims he hates the run, Peyton Manning can imagine that quite well, and would surely be happier than anyone to see it.

SO psyched about the new coaches; if we can just get someone like Wade on board to take advantage of all the defensive talent we have this could be a dominant team for a long time to come.