Thread: Ronnie Hillman is the guy

Originally Posted by Joel

It CAN'T help the passing game if it can't convert short yardage: That's what forces LBs and safeties down into the box so we can throw over their heads. No one's talking about a dominant running game (if anything, just the opposite) only a guy who can muscle it through so 3rd and 1's not a passing down: If EVERY down's a passing down, that's not really "helping the passing game" is it? You're absolutely right we have PFM and a bunch of All Pro receivers to hit home runs, so don't need the running game to do it: But we DO need a pinch hitter, and that's not a slugger batting .200 because he always swings for the fences.

Lmfao. You're just complaining to complain now. The running g game has made a complete turnaround since Ball went out and you're still complaining. Just amazing.

Originally Posted by CoachChaz

Once again...I get it. All I'm saying is there might be better options already on the roster. If so...why not use them? Because things are "ok" as they are? Well...we're 29th in team rushing at a miserable average, so why not try to improve it?

Personally, I think it would be an added weapon to the arsenal if we could run the ball with any sort of conviction and create even more problems for opposing defenses. I guess I'm just one of those guys that isnt completely happy when only one phase of our offense is effective. But that's just me.

"Might be better, why not use them?" Uhmm... 'cause maybe they aint better?

Coach, our running game is effective. Seriously.

Originally Posted by Joel

It CAN'T help the passing game if it can't convert short yardage: That's what forces LBs and safeties down into the box so we can throw over their heads. No one's talking about a dominant running game (if anything, just the opposite) only a guy who can muscle it through so 3rd and 1's not a passing down: If EVERY down's a passing down, that's not really "helping the passing game" is it? You're absolutely right we have PFM and a bunch of All Pro receivers to hit home runs, so don't need the running game to do it: But we DO need a pinch hitter, and that's not a slugger batting .200 because he always swings for the fences.

If EVERY down is a passing down (welcome to the NFL, btw).... then what personnel does the defense bring in? Big bulky LBs that can't cover our TE and slot?

Actually. .because of Hillman's speed... those 3rd and short situations make it very difficult on the defense to spread out with our WRs and keep the holes bottled up. Our offense doesn't bunch everyone up on 3rd and short for a "plow 'em through" short yardage heap like they did in the 80s.

If your line surge ALONE'S not enough I could get 1 yd in a league where runs AVERAGE >4 (same as always) give up, go home and start deciding whom to pick #1 overall. If you always spread your LBs out on 3rd and 1, we need to play Madden for money; regardless, that's more likely to keep Hillmans cuts in front of it and prevent long gains than stop a bowling ball barrelling forward for 1 behind 300+ lb. linemen.

EVERY down shouldn't automatically be ANYTHING; that's why people talk about "having the whole playbook" in short yardage. When the D knows what you're gonna do, you usually don't GET to do it.

Originally Posted by CoachChaz

It was in reference to his performance in one game that people seem to think was a great game for him. If not for that one play...was his game all that great? So instead of him having a great game...a great play is more accurate. That's all I'm saying. And saying we "dont need a dominant run game" is ridiculous. If you have the opportunity to be dominant in both phases of the offense, dont you want to do it? What coach says all they want is an average run game to go with a strong pass game? Imagine if defenses had to defend the run as well as the pass against us. Right now...they dont do that.

He's having a nice stretch and I hope he keeps it up. But at the end of the day, he has never and probably will never be more than average when it comes to blocking and short yardage. It's just not his game.

Dude, 100 yards from scrimmage and 0 turnovers is great production from the rB position. What's the discussion here? Let's just hope that's a sign of more to come.

Originally Posted by Bronco9798

Coach, our running game is effective. Seriously.

No way I can agree with that. It has it's moments, but consistently effective is not a label that I would personally give it. Like I said...agree to disagree.

Originally Posted by Hawgdriver

Dude, 100 yards from scrimmage and 0 turnovers is great production from the rB position. What's the discussion here? Let's just hope that's a sign of more to come.

Depennds. It's only happened 3 times in 6 games and the first was against Indy when we first tried the whole "committment to the running game" that coaches said we were going to do. Even then, it was done in clock killing time at a rate of about 3 yards per carry. So, effectively, it's happened in 2 games.

If the team can get by the whole year without a consistent running game that can be relied on when needed...great. I just dont see Hillman as that guy for the long haul.

Not sure why this is controversial. Most teams don't opt to use backs Hillman's size as the primary ballcarrier.

It can be done. KC and Arizona have success with it (but also lots of nagging injuries).

But some just like a pounder better.

The NFL is a one year at a time venture with free agency and a salary cap.
I totally agree Hillman isn't a long term solution but for this year I think he is fine. That's all we are concerned with right now. Teams aren't going to invest a lot of money in RBs that much anymore. Its a passing game. You don't need a stud. Just a guy like Hillman. That's all you need. Peyton can throw a short pass for 3rd and short. Its just like a run. Its such a no brainer with our offense. Most teams are not balanced for the most part. Its a pass happy league with dome runs thrown in to keep D's honest. Anyway, that's that. Go Broncos.

Originally Posted by CoachChaz

Depennds. It's only happened 3 times in 6 games and the first was against Indy when we first tried the whole "committment to the running game" that coaches said we were going to do. Even then, it was done in clock killing time at a rate of about 3 yards per carry. So, effectively, it's happened in 2 games.

If the team can get by the whole year without a consistent running game that can be relied on when needed...great. I just dont see Hillman as that guy for the long haul.

Yeah, those doubts seem totally reasonable.

Hillman is doing well right now for a poor man's Jamaal Charles (comparable sizes). Wonder how our RB would do without the OL making mistakes. I have seen like 3 10+ yards runs taken away because of penalties. I think our OL is impacting our run rather then a gain by hillman we have a longer field so manning passes and runs not called.

Originally Posted by Joel

If your line surge ALONE'S not enough I could get 1 yd...

Stop right there.

If you were on this team the OL would duct tape you to a blocking sled while Manning gives you some beef stew.

Originally Posted by Joel

It CAN'T help the passing game if it can't convert short yardage: That's what forces LBs and safeties down into the box so we can throw over their heads. No one's talking about a dominant running game (if anything, just the opposite) only a guy who can muscle it through so 3rd and 1's not a passing down: If EVERY down's a passing down, that's not really "helping the passing game" is it? You're absolutely right we have PFM and a bunch of All Pro receivers to hit home runs, so don't need the running game to do it: But we DO need a pinch hitter, and that's not a slugger batting .200 because he always swings for the fences.

With Peyton Manning and our receiving crew, 3rd and 1 is just as easy as a passing down as a it is a running down. Teams throw on 3rd and 1 in this league. It isn't the days of Rocky Rocky Bleier and Franco Harris or Mercury Morris and Larry Csonka. There aren't many, if any, Fullbacks in this league. Yes, it's 2014, teams throw the ball on 3rd and 1 today. Any down is a passing down. That's what the NFL is and what it has become. You just don't have to convert 3rd down with a run. You really don't.

Originally Posted by Bronco9798

With Peyton Manning and our receiving crew, 3rd and 1 is just as easy as a passing down as a it is a running down. Teams throw on 3rd and 1 in this league. It isn't the days of Rocky Rocky Bleier and Franco Harris or Mercury Morris and Larry Csonka. There aren't many, if any, Fullbacks in this league. Yes, it's 2014, teams throw the ball on 3rd and 1 today. Any down is a passing down. That's what the NFL is and what it has become. You just don't have to convert 3rd down with a run. You really don't.

that's all well and good, but what about 3rd and a long 1, or 3 and 2?