Thread: broncos x-factor

Originally Posted by crazbarker

I couldn't agree with you more. And actually we can looknback at the 18-1 patriots a few years ago. Everyone including myself thought that towards week 13 or 14 that they had to come across a bad game and that there would no possible way they would pull off a dolphin 72. They fortunately (being a bronco)picked the thewrong to have that bad game. Elway experienced that also in 97. We went 12-0 till we went to the meadowlands a played a pretty pathetic giant team who had an below average quarterback with Graham.

I remember that; I was working retail at a mall at the time, so everyone HAD to work at least ONE weekend day, but I was the main non-manager there, so had enough leverage to say I wouldn't work Sunday and make it stick, which meant I got to see every game—until the Giants, when I saw they'd scheduled me, and was pissed, but then I saw who we were playing and was like "Meh; they've only won 4 games all year; I think we can handle them." Guess I wasn't the only one who skipped that game.

We were actually 13-0 going into that game, but lost two back-to-back to finish 14-2; fortunately we got our bad ones out of the way during the season and cruised through the playoffs. The bad news was Terrell Davis had a really bad game against Miami the week after, and that was the year Barry Sanders ran for 52 in his first two games but 2000 in his last 14, so Davis finished with 2008 yds but SECOND in total rushing.

Weird to think of a HoF RB having a 2000 yd season but not winning the rushing title, but his SB Ring was a nice consolation prize; I'm sure Barry would trade.

I was at that NYG game and my and my then-gf almost got killed on the way out.

Originally Posted by Shazam!

I was at that NYG game and my and my then-gf almost got killed on the way out.

Dunno why; NY won, and it was one of the few games they DID win that year.

TD led the league in rushing the year he had 2008 rushing yards, Sanders wasn't even 2nd that year.

Originally Posted by Jaded

TD led the league in rushing the year he had 2008 rushing yards, Sanders wasn't even 2nd that year.

Huh, right you are: Barrys 2053 season was the year before that. Weird; I could've sworn it was the same season. It's an underappreciated accomplishment: Sanders and OJ are STILL the only RBs to get 2000 in just 14 games; even Dickerson needed >100 his first 2 and a 215 in Week 15 to reach 2105.

I agree....however, when it comes to determining the most valuable player for their team. Terrell is easily in his own category. His presence on the field alone opened up elways options tremendously. Elway never in his career had it that easy. Don't get me wrong. Elways versatile in/out pocket passing along with the run threat revolutionized the position......but you could only imagine what the final results to the giants skins and 49er Superbowls would of been if terell. Was in the backfield. Back to the premise. I would definitely picked a healthy Davis over Sanders and Dickerson(with bias included)

Because it was their SB, we were supposed to go undefeated. We were surrounded by 65,000+ drunk and near rioting NYG fans who got dirty looks on our way in. We almost got killed, my gf was attacked.

Guts crazy! I believe at that time meadowlands was one of the three stadiums that had an inside jail. Forgot the year but do you remember the big snowball fight between fans and players. Believe it was the giants and Pitt or Philly.

Originally Posted by Joel

Huh, right you are: Barrys 2053 season was the year before that. Weird; I could've sworn it was the same season. It's an underappreciated accomplishment: Sanders and OJ are STILL the only RBs to get 2000 in just 14 games; even Dickerson needed >100 his first 2 and a 215 in Week 15 to reach 2105.

TD - never played in the majority of 4th quarters that season - had he done so, that feat might have been within his reach

Originally Posted by Shazam!

Because it was their SB, we were supposed to go undefeated. We were surrounded by 65,000+ drunk and near rioting NYG fans who got dirty looks on our way in. We almost got killed, my gf was attacked.

Gotcha; that sucks, man, sorry it was so rough for ya'll.

Originally Posted by daveaitken18

TD - never played in the majority of 4th quarters that season - had he done so, that feat might have been within his reach

True, but it meant we had him for the SB, and given why his career was prematurely shortened, I'm good with that. Records are literally made to be broken, and eventually always are; people thought Marinos 48 TD season would last forever until Manning beat him by one a generation later. Championships are eternal; if GB had never won again after the first two (which looked very plausible through the '70s, '80s and early '90s) the Lombardi Trophy would've still remained just that. Would Manning trade last years records for Wilsons Ring?

Originally Posted by Joel

Gotcha; that sucks, man, sorry it was so rough for ya'll.

True, but it meant we had him for the SB, and given why his career was prematurely shortened, I'm good with that. Records are literally made to be broken, and eventually always are; people thought Marinos 48 TD season would last forever until Manning beat him by one a generation later. Championships are eternal; if GB had never won again after the first two (which looked very plausible through the '70s, '80s and early '90s) the Lombardi Trophy would've still remained just that. Would Manning trade last years records for Wilsons Ring?

Joel mate, you misunderstood my point. I am with you on all of that.

I was just highlighting that TD could have reached 2k quicker than he did. Therefore should be in the same conversation as Simpson, Sanders and Dickerson

Originally Posted by daveaitken18

Joel mate, you misunderstood my point. I am with you on all of that.

I was just highlighting that TD could have reached 2k quicker than he did. Therefore should be in the same conversation as Simpson, Sanders and Dickerson

Well, IMHO, he's in a class by himself because he did something the other rarely had the chance to do: Produce MORE the closer he got to the SB. Any NFL back can rack up tons of yards with lots of runs against scrubs (Dickerson's Exhibit A for that argument; his average was good but not great most years, yet having just under 400 attempts his first two years got him 1800 yds and then the record playing the Falcons and Saints twice/season.)

There are no scrub playoff teams though, and the opposition just gets tougher the deeper a team goes: Terrell Davis played UP to his competition. Less so in '98, but Riggins is famous for upping his game in the playoffs that even though he also did it "only" one year: http://www.pro-football-reference.co...Jo00/gamelog//

He did set the record for most season TDs the year Washington LOST the SB, but Emmitt broke it in a SB-winning season just over a decade later, and Riggins' '83 season is currently 5th all-time. I'm sure he'd trade that ex-record for the SB they lost to Oakland that year, and just as sure that when Shaun Alexander took the record from Smith in '05 but lost the SB to Pitt, Emmitt took conslation from losing the record but keeping the Ring he won setting it. Records, schmecords.

Anyway, point is Davis just kept getting better as he neared the SB, understandably rare given the quality of teams that reach Conference Championships and SBs:

Rk	Year	G#	Date	Age	Tm		Opp	Result	Att	Yds	Y/A	TD	Rec	Tgt	Yds	Y/R	TD	TD	2PM	Pts
1	1996	17	1997-01-04	24-068	DEN		JAX	L 27-30	14	91	6.50	1	7	0	24	3.43	0	1	1	8
									Rushing						Receiving				Scoring
Rk	Year	G#	Date	Age	Tm		Opp	Result	Att	Yds	Y/A	TD	Rec	Tgt	Yds	Y/R	TD	TD	2PM	Pts
2	1997	17	1997-12-27	25-060	DEN		JAX	W 42-17	31	184	5.94	2	4	0	11	2.75	0	2		12
3	1997	18	1998-01-04	25-068	DEN	@	KAN	W 14-10	25	101	4.04	2	1	0	17	17.00	0	2		12
4	1997	19	1998-01-11	25-075	DEN	@	PIT	W 24-21	26	139	5.35	1	1	0	2	2.00	0	1		6
5	1997	20	1998-01-25	25-089	DEN	N	GNB	W 31-24	30	157	5.23	3	2	3	8	4.00	0	3		18
									Rushing						Receiving				Scoring
Rk	Year	G#	Date	Age	Tm		Opp	Result	Att	Yds	Y/A	TD	Rec	Tgt	Yds	Y/R	TD	TD	2PM	Pts
6	1998	17	1999-01-09	26-073	DEN		MIA	W 38-3	21	199	9.48	2	1	2	7	7.00	0	2		12
7	1998	18	1999-01-17	26-081	DEN		NYJ	W 23-10	32	167	5.22	1	1	2	12	12.00	0	1		6
8	1998	19	1999-01-31	26-095	DEN	N	ATL	W 34-19	25	102	4.08	0	2	3	50	25.00	0	0		0

He declined rather than rose in the repeat (though not as badly as Riggins, who only broke 4 yds/att in the divisional, and Davis' 199 yds, 9.5 average and 2 TDs in the '98 divisional would've been hard to improve anyway.) In the rest though, he averaged a whopping 6.5 yds on 19 attempts even in the '96 loss to the Jags, and that '97 playoff run is one for the ages. His stats slipped a little on the road against KC in the divisional, but he still had >100 yds and >4/att, and it was lights out after that.

Seriously, who RAISES their average by a full yard to 5.35 on the road against the mid-nineties Steelers? That's the same team that only allowed Emmitt and the stellar Dallas offensive line 48 yds in 19 atts at a NEUTRAL SB site. Dallas did better hosting the '95 NFCCG vs. GB (35 for 150 and 3 TDs,) but still not as good as Davis vs. GB in '97 at a neutral site (MORE yards in LESS carries for a Super Bowl record 3 TDs.) His average slipped slightly, but a literally blinding migraine and more yards and TDs more than make up for that.

How is this guy not in Canton? He's got as many seasons as Sayers, as many 2000 yd seasons as Simpson, Dickerson and Sanders and more championships than any of them. It only took Riggins three tries to make it, and Davis has as many champships and records. We should be asking whether they belong in the conversation with him, not the reverse.

Joel, normally I cannot stomach the stories you write here and I don't have the time to read them.

In this case it's simple. TD for all his greatness didn't have the length of a career like other Backs. That's the only thing that holds him back is longevity.

I also believe they hold it against him that he played behind the best OLine of the decade, second maybe only to Dallas.

Originally Posted by Shazam!

Joel, normally I cannot stomach the stories you write here and I don't have the time to read them.

In this case it's simple. TD for all his greatness didn't have the length of a career like other Backs. That's the only thing that holds him back is longevity.

I also believe they hold it against him that he played behind the best OLine of the decade, second maybe only to Dallas.

He played as long as Sayers, and did more. He did more in those 7 years than just about anyone, including everyone who played much longer.

Not as long as his contemporaries, Emmitt, Martin, or Sanders for example.