Thread: Breaking Down The Chiefs

I think Thomas has earned the starting job, he's more than just a little better than Dreessen as a receiver and as long as he's healthy he is just gonna have to learn to block better while putting up 80-yard catch-and-run TD's.

The only real question is whether or not Slick used the apostrophe correctly.

Dreesen just showed that he's not anywhere in the same UNIVERSE as far as being a passing threat.

FACT: Dreesen doesn't beat Berry for that TD.

The Commentators quoted Manning saying that he just can't justify keeping Thomas off the field with his ability to make plays. Maybe Joel needs to talk with Peyton so that Joel can give Manning a good education on what's best for this offense.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

Dreesen just showed that he's not anywhere in the same UNIVERSE as far as being a passing threat.

FACT: Dreesen doesn't beat Berry for that TD.

The Commentators quoted Manning saying that he just can't justify keeping Thomas off the field with his ability to make plays. Maybe Joel needs to talk with Peyton so that Joel can give Manning a good education on what's best for this offense.

I was talking to my son on Sunday, and there was only one TE we could think of that can run like Julius does. There are not many TE's that would have scored on that 79 yard TD against the Chargers. He's every bit as athletic as Shannon was.

Originally Posted by Al Wilson 4 Mayor

I was talking to my son on Sunday, and there was only one TE we could think of that can run like Julius does. There are not many TE's that would have scored on that 79 yard TD against the Chargers. He's every bit as athletic as Shannon was.

That catch, spin, and run up the sidelines reminded me of Sharpes catch and run for the long TD in 2000 when he played for the Ravens.

Originally Posted by Jaded

I think Thomas has earned the starting job, he's more than just a little better than Dreessen as a receiver and as long as he's healthy he is just gonna have to learn to block better while putting up 80-yard catch-and-run TD's.

The only real question is whether or not Slick used the apostrophe correctly.

The apostrophe was fine; the question is whether Clark can consistently block well enough to justify starting a TE who blocks very poorly. Let's be reasonable here: After a guy said two of those three strip-sacks weren't on Clark and (again) told me to "watch the games," then I posted video of Clark giving up ALL THREE strip-sacks, why are ya'll busting MY chops? Clark had a good game Sunday, and I commend him for that, but it was just one game against costly blunders in THREE others. It doesn't matter how good JT catches and runs if Osweiler's our QB; there's more to football than catching passes.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

Dreesen just showed that he's not anywhere in the same UNIVERSE as far as being a passing threat.

FACT: Dreesen doesn't beat Berry for that TD.

The Commentators quoted Manning saying that he just can't justify keeping Thomas off the field with his ability to make plays. Maybe Joel needs to talk with Peyton so that Joel can give Manning a good education on what's best for this offense.

How's that a "fact?"? It's opinion about a hypothetical match up that never occurred; speculation about what might've been is many things, but not fact. Could JT make the block Ball spun inside off of for his first TD?

Yes Joel, I understand the difference between a fact and hypothetical. I do forget that you take everything SOOOOO very literally. Do you seem to understand that it is not necessary to respond to EVERY comment in a thread individually?

Let me clarify for you. Given EVERYTHING we know about the players, their skillsets, and the FACT that Kansas City has not allowed a touchdown to a TE all season long, I find it to be HIGHLY unlikely that Dreesen would not have been able to beat Berry for the TD. I know its a FACT that the Broncos lined up in that formation to give Thomas a 1-n-1 match-up against Berry based on the defenses that KC had been showing, and feel very comfortable in saying that the Broncos would NOT have lined up for the same match-up had Dreesen been on the field in place of Thomas.

I know its a FACT that Manning has stated that he can't justify sitting Thomas because of his skillset and playmaking ability. Considering we have seen QBs throughout the NFL survive with weaker OLs, and the fact that Manning is a bit more knowledgeable in these matters than you (you lost a LOT of credibility in assessing the NFL when stating that Marino couldn't survive in today's NFL), he'll be fine. Peyton has a better handle on the strengths and weaknesses of his offensive teammates than you or I do, that he is well informed as to how to handle those strengths as well as weaknesses.

NO ONE is saying that Thomas is a good blocker. However, your constant riding this "Dreesen must start to watch our glass QB" horse is not only inaccurate, but complete exaggeration. Now I'm sure you'll keep whipping the hindquarters until there is another sack, then you will raise your arms up in triumph as if you had somehow been vilified. But I'm very confident that Manning and Co. can evaluate the situation at a much higher knowledge base than what you possess.

Hey Joel, did you see Dreesen get blown up every time he tried to block Sunday, or are you conveniently ignoring that?

If it wasn't for a nifty spin move, Montee Ball would have been tackled on the 5 and not had a touchdown thanks to Dreesen who put an Ole block on.

Morambar_in_Tx is beatin Mo like Mo beats his ding dong.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

Hey Joel, did you see Dreesen get blown up every time he tried to block Sunday, or are you conveniently ignoring that?

If it wasn't for a nifty spin move, Montee Ball would have been tackled on the 5 and not had a touchdown thanks to Dreesen who put an Ole block on.

wait, he was giving credit for Dreesen on that play.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

Hey Joel, did you see Dreesen get blown up every time he tried to block Sunday, or are you conveniently ignoring that?

If it wasn't for a nifty spin move, Montee Ball would have been tackled on the 5 and not had a touchdown thanks to Dreesen who put an Ole block on.

I already posted the video of Dreesen locking up Hali on that play, but here it is again: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...Ball-1-yard-TD

Did you see the videos of Clarks THREE strip-sacks posted after you insisted he only had one? This thread stopped dead for, like, two days after that, and you've yet to comment on it. Busy not-watching games?

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

wait, he was giving credit for Dreesen on that play.

Because I "watched" it. Despite Collinsworths insistence Dreesen blew the play because Tamba Hali pushed him back, the FACT is Ball went right by Hali, who didn't make the tackle because he was engaged with Dreesen. And, yeah, call something an all caps "FACT" and that's how I'll take it. Ya'll keep denying what happened, or talking about what might've happened; I'll keep talking about what actually DID happen.

Originally Posted by Joel

Because I "watched" it; maybe we should see it again: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...Ball-1-yard-TD Despite Collinsworths insistence Dreesen blew the play because Tamba Hali pushed him back, the FACT is Ball went right by Hali, who didn't make the tackle because he was engaged with Dreesen. And, yeah, call something an all caps "FACT" and that's how I'll take it.

Ya'll keep saying things that happened didn't happen, or talking about what might've happened, and I'll keep talking about things that actually DID happen.

Yes, I believe it to be a FACT that Dreesen doesn't beat Berry on that slant route based on the FACT that he doesnt' have the skillset Thomas does to get it done.

As far as the rest, HORSE SHIT. ALL you do is give hypotheticals on how the OL can't handle this and can't handle that. How Dreesen is the best option because Thomas can't block. ALLLL you do is speculate for the worst, and now you are trying to tell us that all you talk about are things that DID happen????? Your ENTIRE posting career is based on negative hypotheticals and guesses.

I would guess that they are more hopes and wants considering how much you dislike Manning.

Originally Posted by Joel

I already posted the video of Dreesen locking up Hali on that play, but here it is again: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...Ball-1-yard-TD

Did you see the videos of Clarks THREE strip-sacks posted after you insisted he only had one? This thread stopped dead for, like, two days after that, and you've yet to comment on it. Busy not-watching games?


Because I "watched" it. Despite Collinsworths insistence Dreesen blew the play because Tamba Hali pushed him back, the FACT is Ball went right by Hali, who didn't make the tackle because he was engaged with Dreesen. And, yeah, call something an all caps "FACT" and that's how I'll take it. Ya'll keep denying what happened, or talking about what might've happened; I'll keep talking about what actually DID happen.

So, Dreesen getting knocked three yards into the offensive backfield was designed? Is that what you're trying to claim? Ball was supposed to go off tackle. Dreesen gets manhandled because he's the best tight end blocker Denver has, and Ball has to cut it inside with a spin move, and you're claiming that's designed?

Whatever.

My apologies. You were right about Clark on those three plays.

Originally Posted by claymore

Morambar_in_Tx is beatin Mo like Mo beats his ding dong.

It's embarrassing.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

Yes, I believe it to be a FACT that Dreesen doesn't beat Berry on that slant route based on the FACT that he doesnt' have the skillset Thomas does to get it done.

You can pretty much stop after "I believe," because from then on we're talking about opinion, not fact. If it didn't happen it's not a fact.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

As far as the rest, HORSE SHIT. ALL you do is give hypotheticals on how the OL can't handle this and can't handle that. How Dreesen is the best option because Thomas can't block. ALLLL you do is speculate for the worst, and now you are trying to tell us that all you talk about are things that DID happen????? Your ENTIRE posting career is based on negative hypotheticals and guesses.

It's documented fact (with video) JT's a poor blocker, hence Mannings pick against Indy: Thomas was pushed back FAR more than Hali pushed back Dreesen, right into Manning, in FACT, whose arm the defender grabbed during the throw to force a champagne cork Indy easily ran under for the pick.

It's documented fact (with video) Clark gave up strip-sacks in three consecutive games (starting with the one cited above.)

Here's the thing though: There's nothing wrong with speculation in itself; the problem is saying, "FACT: [Lots of speculation]" Sure, I speculate a lot; we all do, but I carefully avoid using "fact" rhetorically, for a very good reason: Because fact is fact and opinion opinion, and never the twain shall meet.

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

I would guess that they are more hopes and wants considering how much you dislike Manning.

My only problem with Manning is his losing playoff record, but there's a purportedly an easy way for him to both satisfy and silence me.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

So, Dreesen getting knocked three yards into the offensive backfield was designed? Is that what you're trying to claim? Ball was supposed to go off tackle. Dreesen gets manhandled because he's the best tight end blocker Denver has, and Ball has to cut it inside with a spin move, and you're claiming that's designed?
Whatever.

I'm claiming Ball went right by Hali and Hali couldn't make the tackle, because Dreesen locked him up: That's what HAPPENED. Whether the play was designed to go off tackle or one of those cutbacks we popularized with Terrell Davis and still use as much as anyone is something only our coaches can say with certainty.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

My apologies. You were right about Clark on those three plays.

Fair enough then. Hopefully his last game and the one against Dallas is more representative of what he'll produce going forward, but, especially once the playoffs start, we can't afford even ONE bad game from him.

Originally Posted by Joel

I already posted the video of Dreesen locking up Hali on that play, but here it is again: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...Ball-1-yard-TD

Joel, I honestly don't know WHAT play you are seeing when you see this goal line play, but if you are TRYING to give Dreesen CREDIT , then you are watching it with blinders on. Dreesen is COMPLETELY dominated and pushed 3 yards into the backfield. Thomas could have EASILY done as Dreesen did on this play and you are reaching WAY into your ass to defend Dreesen for your own purposes. Are you SERIOUSLY trying to tell us that you don't think Thomas could have done as well as Dreesen on this, seriously? You are trying to tell the "commentator" (and ex football player) that he was WRONG by pointing out the Hali won that battle? Dreesen did NOT win tht match. He did NOT make the block, and he did NOT keep Hali from making the play. Hali didn't make the play because Hali simply didn't see the play. Ball made a VERY Good spin, a NEEDED spin, because Dreesen was BLOWN UP and destroyed.

If you want to use GOOD examples on how Dreesen is "needed" to block, I would suggest you put this one away under lock and key and NEVER bring it out again....because it RUINS your case.

Because I "watched" it. Despite Collinsworths insistence Dreesen blew the play because Tamba Hali pushed him back, the FACT is Ball went right by Hali, who didn't make the tackle because he was engaged with Dreesen. And, yeah, call something an all caps "FACT" and that's how I'll take it. Ya'll keep denying what happened, or talking about what might've happened; I'll keep talking about what actually DID happen.

yeah, I've seen you try to use FACT in this sentence and you've proved that what you consider to be "fact" is in FACT.. wrong. I know you are VERY VERY literal.

But let me just say, its a FACT that Dreesen didn't make a good block on Hali, or even a mediocre block on that goal line, and its a FACT that Dreesen would not have beat Berry on the slant.