Thread: Broncos' Marshall suspended over conduct

Originally Posted by Tempus Fugit

No offense, but you know nothing about any level of arrogance or approachability. You simply assume it. It's a bad assumption.

I don't think so. Again, I support McD. But from day one there's been a significant amount of alienation and discontent with several players. Does that mean I think bend over backwards to keep them at all costs? No. Maybe Cutler was a lost cause I don't know. But it doesn't seem like it to me.

It's not so one sided that it's just the players here. When in NFL history do you recall a top 10 unit full of young players approaching their prime being gutted? Maybe you're convinced that this is black and white and that Cutler and Marshall were both just hotheaded garbage and that were better off without them? I do not. I think there's a middle ground in which you instill a culture but avoid pushing people out.

Well regardless of which "side" you are taking here McD will be held accountable for the product on the field. Lets hope he gets more then one year to prove his ability to produce a winner or hes in deep shit.

Originally Posted by MHCBill

How do you know what was said in those meetings to "piss" them off?

All that needed said is, "I'm the boss, do what I ask."

Do you really think that? Hardline approaches with no room for circumstance or compassion do not succeed.

Quoted from ESPN the magazine.

(regarding Belichick, )

Thats why they like him as a boss. He makes his own copies. He maintains that his assistants work with him, not for him. He doesn't do small talk, but always says hello in the hallway. "He doesn't think he's above anyone" Pioli says.


Josh's problem is arrogance, he does think he is better than anyone and it shows.

And it interferes.

It clouds judgement.

He may have learned X's and O's in New England.

But he missed the most important lesson he could have learned.

Originally Posted by OldschoolFreak

I agree there's an element of this. You do indeed need to bring in accountability right away and build a thriving team culture. But part of that involves meeting people halfway--I'm not talking about handing out contracts but for godsake, don't alienate people by being completely non-approachable.

Again, nothing i have seen from McDaniels shows that he isnt approachable. It sounds like the two players in question didnt like what was said to them and decided to force their way out.

Wow.......this team is so messed up....it is almost hard to believe.........How fast things have gone into the crapper....

just cut the clown and move on....

Originally Posted by OldschoolFreak

I don't think so. Again, I support McD. But from day one there's been a significant amount of alienation and discontent with several players. Does that mean I think bend over backwards to keep them at all costs? No. Maybe Cutler was a lost cause I don't know. But it doesn't seem like it to me.

It's not so one sided that it's just the players here. When in NFL history do you recall a top 10 unit full of young players approaching their prime being gutted? Maybe you're convinced that this is black and white and that Cutler and Marshall were both just hotheaded garbage and that were better off without them? I do not. I think there's a middle ground in which you instill a culture but avoid pushing people out.

Really? Which coaches have accomplished that in the past 20 years? It's certainly not been done that way by Parcells or Belichick, for example, and they are the gold standard.

Going from a hardass coach to a cream puff is easy. It's just fatal over time. Going from a cream puff to a hard ass pretty much ensures that you'll have issues. All Denver fans have to do is look over at K.C. and you'll note that the same problems were happening, but the players didn't escalate the problems.

Originally Posted by OldschoolFreak

I agree there's an element of this. You do indeed need to bring in accountability right away and build a thriving team culture. But part of that involves meeting people halfway--I'm not talking about handing out contracts but for godsake, don't alienate people by being completely non-approachable.

Originally Posted by OldschoolFreak

Do you really think that? Hardline approaches with no room for circumstance or compassion do not succeed.

Should I take that as your assumption that McDaniels has no compassion or has
left no room for circumstances? I mean, even reporters much closer to the
situation than we don't know the details. How could we know?

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Originally Posted by Tempus Fugit

Really? Which coaches have accomplished that in the past 20 years? It's certainly not been done that way by Parcells or Belichick, for example, and they are the gold standard.

I disagree. As someone posted earlier, Bellichick is disciplined and focused but that doesn't make him unapproachable. From all that I've heard out of NE, he's actually honest and communicative with the players telling them exactly what he expects and needs from them and letting them know their role as only one part of the larger team.

So to answer your question--Bellickick, Cowher, Shannahan (was a hardass early on in hos career), Seifert, even Dungy who didn't scream like a maniac but had clearly defined accountability would qualify.

Originally Posted by topscribe

Should I take that as your assumption that McDaniels has no compassion or has
left no room for circumstances? I mean, even reporters much closer to the
situation than we don't know the details. How could we know?

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I'm not claiming to know and do acknowledge that I'm speaking from appearances. But the appearances are driven by the actual occurrences we've seen in the past few months here. McD and Cutler really did fail to come to a point of agreement on a situation that possibly could have been defused. So far the same can be said of the BM situation.

Originally Posted by OldschoolFreak

I'm not claiming to know and do acknowledge that I'm speaking from appearances. But the appearances are driven by the actual occurrences we've seen in the past few months here. McD and Cutler really did fail to come to a point of agreement on a situation that possibly could have been defused. So far the same can be said of the BM situation.

I've seen the same appearances and obviously have interpreted them differently.
So, since we have nothing more than such appearances to go by, then would it
not behoove us to be a bit less assumptive about what is going on behind
closed doors?

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Originally Posted by Superchop 7

Josh's problem is arrogance, he does think he is better than anyone and it shows.

Where do you guys come up with this??? This is 100% pure conjecture and speculation that you state as fact. Yes, maybe he is arrogant. Then again, maybe he is not.

Personally, I watch the guy speak and he does not come across as arrogant. Read articles from guys like Woody Paige, who has been all over McDaniels moves from a football perspective, and Woody says he is humble, approachable, and funny. That is what I get from watching too.

Maybe behind the scenes he is a tyrant. I will admit: it is a possibility. However, from all public appearances, that does not appear to be the case.

Originally Posted by topscribe

I've seen the same appearances, and obviously have interpreted them differently.
So, since we have nothing more than such appearances to go by, then would it
not behoove us to be a bit less assumptive about what is going on behind
closed doors?

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Boring

You guys might not believe this now ... but you might be better off without this head case malcontent on your team.....

Originally Posted by topscribe

I've seen the same appearances, and obviously have interpreted them differently.
So, since we have nothing more than such appearances to go by, then would it
not behoove us to be a bit less assumptive about what is going on behind
closed doors?

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That could be said about assuming the players motives as well.