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Thread: Trolls who contribute nothing to the site.

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachChaz View Post
    Let's say there are 3 or 4 guys...might be a troll, might be a Denver fan...that consistently create arguments and degrade opinions that differ from their own and are just plain asses. Now let's assume 7 or 8 people come here less or not at all because they prefer not to be annoyed with people like that. Is it worth it in the end?

    Simple answer. yes or no.

    The only problem there is does everyone agree on the same people being a problem. I would be willing to guess that some of those who choose not be here could also be listed as "problem" posters. I could be wrong but i think thats another area that would be subjective depending on who you talk too.

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  3. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northman View Post
    The only problem there is does everyone agree on the same people being a problem. I would be willing to guess that some of those who choose not be here could also be listed as "problem" posters. I could be wrong but i think thats another area that would be subjective depending on who you talk too.
    Here's the root of the problem. Most people are never going to complain about another poster. They'll just get tired of that person(s) and move on. Mods can ask for imput all they want but that doesnt mean they'll get it. After that, it's easy to rest on the "we don't know it's a problem until someone tells us". Personally, I dont buy that. it doesnt take a rocket scientist to see the people that consistently cause problems and consistently have arguments with damn near everyone here.

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  5. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachChaz View Post
    Here's the root of the problem. Most people are never going to complain about another poster. They'll just get tired of that person(s) and move on. Mods can ask for imput all they want but that doesnt mean they'll get it. After that, it's easy to rest on the "we don't know it's a problem until someone tells us". Personally, I dont buy that. it doesnt take a rocket scientist to see the people that consistently cause problems and consistently have arguments with damn near everyone here.
    So, are you saying that the moderator team should just proactively remove those folks that the moderator team considers to be a problem?

    edit: if so, I would be curious to know how many folks would agree with that course of action, and how many wouldn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NightTrainLayne View Post
    So, are you saying that the moderator team should just proactively remove those folks that the moderator team considers to be a problem?

    edit: if so, I would be curious to know how many folks would agree with that course of action, and how many wouldn't.
    No, but what about a pro-active approach? Instead of waiting on people to complain, maybe make a list of the members that the group considers the top posters or the most frquesnt visitors, or whatever and ask them. I just dont get the idea that seeing a problem and ignoring it simply because people choose not to complain about it makes it a non-issue.

    But even then you may only get 7 out of 10 people to complain or say that they would prefer someone not be here. Then you'd have to have pro-longed discussions on what percentage of people would constitute an action taking place.

    At the end of the day, i really dont care. I just see how many people have left and have cut back on how often they come here and in talking to them...many of the reasons are the same. Most of them arent going to complain because it's either not in their nature or they just dont feel anything will be done.

    I guess I'm on that side. I'll say something in general from time to time, but i really dont expect anything to be done about it. So, when it gets to the point that like them...I dont like being here anymore...I wont be.

  7. #125

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    As NTL has said, the more feedback we get the better off we will be.

    The one comment I will make in terms of the 'proactive' part is that like with most other things on a message board, people's opinions seem to vary GREATLY on the subject of who or what is a troll or does more harm than good to the message board.

    There have been a number of very frequent posters that have been ID'd by many other posters (via reports, PM's, MHS messages to us, etc.) stating the site would be better off if they were gone, yet those same people have many other posters that like them and what they bring to the site.

    Some of the people that left were both loved by a great deal of posters and hated by others. Right now, it's hard to even know who has left vs. is just laying low, as we are in one of the darkest off seasons in recent Broncos history.

    Back to the proactive/subjective thing. Short of starting to vote people off the island, I personally don't have an answer. What one person finds funny, another finds irritating. We have some members that spam threads with nonsense, yet get high fived by others for doing it, while at the same time driving another set of posters crazy.

    So, do we need to define what the 'majority' likes in terms of posting styles, and then start kicking out or driving out those that don't like or conform to that style?

    I honestly don't know what the answer is, but I don't think it is quite as 'simple' as some would indicate, because like with opinions about Shanahan or Cutler or Marshall or McDaniels, it isn't like 95% of people on here see things the same way. Some of the people who chose to leave (some of who I hated to see go) were also responsible for driving other members off due to their posting styles. Unfortunately, this isn't a black and white issue, because so many people have such varying opinions on what is or isn't ok, what is or isn't funny, what is or isn't appropriate.

    Anyway, like has been stated, the best thing that can happen right now is getting as much feedback as possible about how you want the community run.
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  9. #126
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    That is kind of the point I am trying to make NTL. We all know who these 4 or 5 posters are, and due to the CoC, I will not name names. (I'm sure that if they see this and say something about it, they will out themselves).

    I think a good start would be setting some sort of criteria to determine when both parties
    in an altercation should be banned.
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  11. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thnikkaman View Post
    That is kind of the point I am trying to make NTL. We all know who these 4 or 5 posters are, and due to the CoC, I will not name names. (I'm sure that if they see this and say something about it, they will out themselves).

    I think a good start would be setting some sort of criteria to determine when both parties
    in an altercation should be banned.
    I'm not sure we all do know who they are. Could you please PM me the 4 or 5 posters in question. My guess if everyone PM'd me 'their' 4 or 5 posters, that the list would be pretty long with minimal overlap, but I could be wrong.
    Posting from a mobile phone. Short replies and typos are likely.

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  13. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tned-Mobile View Post
    I'm not sure we all do know who they are. Could you please PM me the 4 or 5 posters in question. My guess if everyone PM'd me 'their' 4 or 5 posters, that the list would be pretty long with minimal overlap, but I could be wrong.
    No offense, but I really find this surprising

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    All i know is there was a certain gentleman on the Mane who although was quite funny at times and had some good input here and there he also was very disruptive and crass a good portion of that time. Well, he ended up getting banned for like a month or something like that and he made up a 2nd account and complained how he was a valued member (he had been there longtime since its inception i think) and he shouldnt have been banned. Well, he vowed he wasnt coming back and never did but two other posters who were very good posters left with him because they didnt like the fact that he got banned. So, while the ban was temporary and because it happened to a guy who the board probably could do without because he caused more problems than the usual person it also costed the board two legitimate posters along the way.

    Point of my story is no matter who gets banned or deemed a "problem" poster im sure there will be others who are not as bad and contribute more who will show outrage and leave also. Again, its all subjective depending on who you talk too. If 10 members came out and said i was worthless to this board im sure i could scrounge up 1 member who was a great poster to vouch for me. (ok, maybe not)

    But you get my drift. Its really not as easy as it may seem. I remember having discussions on how long a certain member should be banned and even that wasnt a
    easy thing to do. Other mods would say that said person was a valued member and didnt deserve that certain length of time while i might of disagreed because of the infraction that caused it. Its an imperfect system but the mods try to do the best they can and as fairly as they can.

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  16. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thnikkaman View Post
    That is kind of the point I am trying to make NTL. We all know who these 4 or 5 posters are, and due to the CoC, I will not name names. (I'm sure that if they see this and say something about it, they will out themselves).

    I think a good start would be setting some sort of criteria to determine when both parties
    in an altercation should be banned.
    I am speaking out of turn here, and maybe breaking some rules myself, but here goes:


    We think we do sometimes know who these 4-5 posters are. When Tned made all the changes in the mod staff at the beginning of the year we came up with a "top ten" list of trouble-makers as we saw it. . .it was actually ony 6-7 instead of 10, but you get the idea.

    We sent each a PM putting them on notice, and told them they had a short leash. A couple of them basically left not post much here anymore because they didn't like the restrictions. A couple of them were suspended once or twice and have improved their behavior significantly. A few seem to test the boundaries every month or so and see if we've slacked in our response.

    The latest controversy has brought out a couple of these folks again and we're keeping our eye on them.

    In short, we PROBABLY all are seeing the same problems, and we as a moderator team have probably done ourselves a disservice in some ways of trying to keep our dealings with these folks confidential to be fair to them.

    So. .. sometimes when we get a general complaint we will ask members to report it. That doesn't always really mean that we haven't noted it either. Probably, sometimes, we have already discussed the issue behind closed doors, and simply need some community input to figure out if it is really a big problem that needs to be fixed, or if it's just our own biases and dislikes taking over.

    One thing that I think is a good thing, is that this group of moderators is very keen on not letting the power of the position go to our heads, and really want to follow Tned's vision of this being a community-driven board. That means that sometimes we will complain amongst ourselves "Damn, that poster X is irritating", but absent any feed-back we worry that we are imposing our own views vs. the views of the community.

    Hopefully, you all can see the issue there, and understand then why we always ask for you all to report it. Not necessarily because we are ignoring it, or that we don't see it. On the contrary, often it's because we are LOOKING for valid reasons to get rid of someone, and we simply don't have the ammunition to back it up and have the suspension stand up to appeal so to speak.

    Edit: I see Tned already adressed this somewhat. The issue becomes are we seeing the same things the community is seeing or are our own biases coming into play. I can guarantee you that one or two people I would personally like to see gone are not on your list Thnikka of who you think needs to be gone, and that's the rub.

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  18. #131

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachChaz View Post
    No offense, but I really find this surprising
    I can only go by what I know, and who people complain to me about (which is not that often, because most seem to think it's a 'given' that we should know who the problems are).

    However, my gut (based on who people have complained about and opinions voiced in Town Hall threads) is that the opinions about who the 'problems' are or were would vary greatly, and there wouldn't be just 4 or 5 names that constantly came up if everyone sent in their 4-5 posters that would make the site better if they were gone.
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  20. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northman View Post
    All i know is there was a certain gentleman on the Mane who although was quite funny at times and had some good input here and there he also was very disruptive and crass a good portion of that time. Well, he ended up getting banned for like a month or something like that and he made up a 2nd account and complained how he was a valued member (he had been there longtime since its inception i think) and he shouldnt have been banned. Well, he vowed he wasnt coming back and never did but two other posters who were very good posters left with him because they didnt like the fact that he got banned. So, while the ban was temporary and because it happened to a guy who the board probably could do without because he caused more problems than the usual person it also costed the board two legitimate posters along the way.

    Point of my story is no matter who gets banned or deemed a "problem" poster im sure there will be others who are not as bad and contribute more who will show outrage and leave also. Again, its all subjective depending on who you talk too. If 10 members came out and said i was worthless to this board im sure i could scrounge up 1 member who was a great poster to vouch for me. (ok, maybe not)

    But you get my drift. Its really not as easy as it may seem. I remember having discussions on how long a certain member should be banned and even that wasnt a
    easy thing to do. Other mods would say that said person was a valued member and didnt deserve that certain length of time while i might of disagreed because of the infraction that caused it. Its an imperfect system but the mods try to do the best they can and as fairly as they can.
    He was a great poster and the woman that left with him was awesome as well....but who was the 3rd???
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    Wow. This turned into a rather interesting thread.

    I wonder if I'm on anyone's "list"...

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  23. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoJoe View Post
    Wow. This turned into a rather interesting thread.

    I wonder if I'm on anyone's "list"...
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  25. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoJoe View Post
    Wow. This turned into a rather interesting thread.

    I wonder if I'm on anyone's "list"...
    Your my #1.

    jk

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