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Thread: Who is the greatest baseball player of all-time?

  1. #31
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    Does Carlos Delgado get any mention? What are your guys' thoughts on him?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Benetto View Post
    Even before his steroid abuse controversy Bonds hit 40 homers and stole 40 bases in the early 90's...That warrants him a consideration, no doubt.
    Which is why I can't rule out the possibility that he might have done it anyway...

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    Ozzie Smith is on my to p10 list....I LOVED watching him play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Benetto View Post
    Does Carlos Delgado get any mention? What are your guys' thoughts on him?
    Same as Vlad.

    I think me and Ben need to clarify here, though, we're not talking about best player ever, we're talking about the best player we've seen (we're the same age....28).

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    I am reading "The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs" and the Bambino is easily 1A or 1B.

    It is hard because not only do you have the roid issue but you have just the issue of different eras. Babe Ruth played in an era with fences 500 plus feet away, where a HR wouldbe called a foul ball if it landed foul even if it went past the foul poll in fair teritory. I have no doubt that Ruth could easily be atop the all time home run list.
    Just look at that SLG%:
    His .690 career slugging percentage and 1.164 career on-base plus slugging (OPS) remain the major league records.
    And hit for AVG:
    Unlike many power hitters, Ruth also hit for average: his .342 lifetime batting is tenth highest in baseball history, and in one season (1923) he hit .393, a Yankee record.
    Oh and yes as mentioned before he was a hell of a pitcher.
    94-46 2.28 ERA, 163 G, 148 GS, 107 CG!, 17 SHO, 4 SV, 1.16 WHIP, 488 SO, 441 BB..
    The notion he sucked at fielding is also not true. He might look "fat" in pictures but he was all over the out field and stole plenty of bases. 1923 the beginning starting to hit his stride:


    Ruth did deal with a ton of media attention. He barn stormed more then any other player in the history of the game, really adding a ton of extra games to his career in which Ruth went all out. He hated to dissapoint the fans and wanted to give them the best he had no matter what. Played through many injuries and to the point of serious illness at times. He IMO is a big reason why baseball took off in this country. A player that I wish I could of watched.

    But as I said before they have been so many greats a different tiems it is really hard to have a true standout like say MJ in the NBA.

    Yes Carrol there was no pitch count and 8th inning men back in the day. That is why pitchers such as Walter Johnson (Had many great battles with Ruth by the way) won 30 games in a season. Managers would even use their ace starters as closer as well.

    As a right-handed pitcher for the Washington Nationals/Senators, Walter Johnson won 417 games, the second most by any pitcher in history (after Cy Young, who won 511). He and Young are the only pitchers to have won 400 games.

    In a 21-year career, Johnson had twelve 20-win seasons, including ten in a row. Twice, he topped thirty wins (33 in 1912 and 36 in 1913). Johnson's record includes 110 shutouts, the most in baseball history. Johnson had a 38-26 record in games decided by a 1-0 score; both his win total and his losses in these games are major league records. On September 4, 5 and 7, 1908, he shut out the New York Yankees (then known as the New York Highlanders) in three consecutive games.

    Three times, Johnson won the triple crown for pitchers (1913, 1918 and 1924). Johnson twice won the American League Most Valuable Player Award (1913, 1924), a feat accomplished since by only two other pitchers, Carl Hubbell in 1933 and 1936 and Hal Newhouser in 1944 and 1945.

    His earned run average of 1.14 in 1913 was the fourth lowest ever at the time he recorded it; it remains the sixth-lowest today, despite having been surpassed by Bob Gibson in 1968 (1.12) for lowest ERA ever by a 300+ inning pitcher. It could have been lower if not for one of manager Clark Griffith's traditions. For the last game of the season, Griffith often treated the fans to a farce game. Johnson actually played center field that game until he was brought in to pitch. He allowed two hits before he was taken out of the game. The next pitcher - who was actually a career catcher - allowed both runners to score. The official scorekeeper ignored the game, but later, Johnson was charged with those two runs, raising his ERA from 1.09 to 1.14.

    In 1913, also, Johnson won 36 games. The entire team won 90, so Walter finished with 40% of the team's total wins for the season.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroncoAV06 View Post
    I am reading "The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs" and the Bambino is easily 1A or 1B.

    .
    I read that book......it is really, really good. Lots of pictures and charts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Benetto View Post
    Does Carlos Delgado get any mention? What are your guys' thoughts on him?
    I don't trust players who played in Canada.

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    My first instinct was Barry Bonds.
    In Elway We Trust

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    Babe Ruth dominated the game like no other. (thanks, Boston!)

    Second, I'd say Bonds. Griffey is a hair behind, nothing to do with his injuries, I just think that if both played healthy during their careers, Bonds would be slightly better. A shame it's come to this.

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    Roberto Clemente was another exquisite player for as along as he was there.

    I don't know how one can single out a player as G.O.A.T., there have been so many . . .

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    OK, its way too hard to single out one player, so what's your dream lineup and dream pitching rotation...so your dream roster?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissouriBronc View Post
    OK, its way too hard to single out one player, so what's your dream lineup and dream pitching rotation...so your dream roster?
    That would be fun, but I have neither the time nor the knowledge for that undertaking.

    Perhaps you would like to tackle it for us?

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    Quote Originally Posted by topscribe View Post
    That would be fun, but I have neither the time nor the knowledge for that undertaking.

    Perhaps you would like to tackle it for us?

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    Working on it...had a few things I had to get done this morning in the real world...

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissouriBronc View Post
    Which is why I can't rule out the possibility that he might have done it anyway...
    Yes you can.

    No way Barry hits 73 in a year and I don't think he breaks Aaron's record without roids. I don't think he hits 700 hr without roids.

    You are talking about a guy that would fight off pitches and hit them out...hit balls out that he got jammed on or was so far out in front, nearly cue-balling it off his front foot to center field. This was later in his career. If you watch his swings early in his career, he hit the ball out of the park because his swing was so smooth and he was on top of the ball every swing. He very rarely muscled a bad swing into the stands.

    This is not to take away the fact that he is/was a great hitter. Steroids in no way improves your swing, your hand/eye coordination, or your ability to see pitches. But what huge strength does do is allow you to take bad swings and still hit the ball hard; get fooled by a pitch and still hit the ball out of the ballpark.

    The proof to me is in the fact that he was a much more fluid hitter and all around better player in his early years...when he was hitting 20-40 HR a year but still batting .300+. Yet in his mid to later years when he slowed a step but put on 30 lbs of muscle, he was hitting 40+ a year and hitting nearly .400 every season until injuries caught up with him. It is obvious steroids played a big part in his late career success.

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  21. #45
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    Tyrus Raymond Cobb

    The man had close to a hundred records when he retired. Many of which stood for years.

    Like hits. Rose broke that in what . . . '85? But just compare Rose's ABs to Cobbs. Rose never hit .366 in a season, yet that's Cobbs lifetime average.

    Runs. Broken just a few years ago by Ricky Henderson (who should get a couple votes for greatest of all time).

    And I'm sure you baseball fans heard about the time he got all pissed off that Ruth was getting all this media attention because he hit home runs. So he told a reporter he could hit them also. He hit 5 in the next 2 games and then went back to playing the game the way he thought it should be played.

    BTW, he was 38 when he did this. How many other 38 year olds have done this?

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