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Thread: Barry Larkin to the Hall of Fame

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by G_Money View Post
    Edgar Martinez is still twiddling his thumbs while stalled in the 30-something percent range.

    Glad Barry made it...

    but man, at some point I'd like to see NL voters get over their abject terror of the DH position and actually vote for it like any other lineup position. Do 1B need to hit more than 2B to get in the HOF? Sure. Why? Because positionally their glove isn't worth much so bigger guys can play the position.

    Any hitter can play DH since by default glovework is not an issue, so only the very best hitters should get in. I understand that.

    *sighs* Just vote for DH with those principles in mind, and maybe the guy with the 5th best OBP ALL-TIME for RH hitters might one day make it into the hall.

    ~G

    Edgar did play 3b early in his career and is well deserving to get in. Also he was not linked to PEDs like some of these guys on the list, that will never get in, mainly Sosa and McGwire IMHO

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    Quote Originally Posted by King87 View Post
    The most underrated shortstop to ever play the game made it in today.
    Underrated?? No way. Alan Trammell is proving he is more underrated than Larkin. Plus, I've always said that if Ozzie Smith is a first-ballot Hall-of-Famer, Dave Concepcion at least deserved to get in too.
    I miss the old Mile High Stadium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by G_Money View Post
    Edgar Martinez is still twiddling his thumbs while stalled in the 30-something percent range.

    Glad Barry made it...

    but man, at some point I'd like to see NL voters get over their abject terror of the DH position and actually vote for it like any other lineup position. Do 1B need to hit more than 2B to get in the HOF? Sure. Why? Because positionally their glove isn't worth much so bigger guys can play the position.

    Any hitter can play DH since by default glovework is not an issue, so only the very best hitters should get in. I understand that.

    *sighs* Just vote for DH with those principles in mind, and maybe the guy with the 5th best OBP ALL-TIME for RH hitters might one day make it into the hall.

    ~G
    Or even better, the AL can get rid of the DH.
    I got mind control while I'm here
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medford Bronco View Post
    Dont forget the biggest fraud of all time, Dante Bichette played there. One season he had 31 HR at home and 9 on the road.

    all before the stupid humidor machine.
    He will be remembered more for what he did for the Braves.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thnikkaman View Post
    Or even better, the AL can get rid of the DH.
    This will never happen. The MLBPA has a vested interest in keeping it as it allows their members more money (DHs make more than pinch-hitters) and can extend the careers of vets.

    Also, watching the pitcher "bat" is pathetic.

    It's more likely that the NL would be forced to adopt the DH. I hope that doesn't happen - I like the difference between the two leagues.

    Except when it costs Gar a place in the HOF anyway.

    PS - they need to change interleague play, so that the home team has to play by the other league's rules. That means pitchers hit in AL ballparks and DHs hit in NL ballparks. Having it the other way around is silly - why have interleague play if you're not watching the other league's playing style in the park?

    ~G
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    My novels Mason's Order and its sequel Mason's Pledge are now available at Amazon in both paperback and kindle versions.

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    Using the other leagues hitting style in a home park will never work. AL fans love the DH and NL fans hate it. Personally...I dont care. With the exception of a few, I know that when a pitcher is due to bat, I can go make a sandwich. Seen one sacrifice bunt or a strikeout...seen them all.

    On the other hand, I'm a purist and a part of me would like to see the game played the way it was meant to be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thnikkaman View Post
    He will be remembered more for what he did for the Braves.
    He was overrated in co

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachChaz View Post
    Using the other leagues hitting style in a home park will never work. AL fans love the DH and NL fans hate it. Personally...I dont care. With the exception of a few, I know that when a pitcher is due to bat, I can go make a sandwich. Seen one sacrifice bunt or a strikeout...seen them all.

    On the other hand, I'm a purist and a part of me would like to see the game played the way it was meant to be.
    I always like then p hitting so he could be accountable if he hit someone on
    Purpose. He would face the consequences. Just my humble op

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    Quote Originally Posted by G_Money View Post
    This will never happen. The MLBPA has a vested interest in keeping it as it allows their members more money (DHs make more than pinch-hitters) and can extend the careers of vets.

    Also, watching the pitcher "bat" is pathetic.

    It's more likely that the NL would be forced to adopt the DH. I hope that doesn't happen - I like the difference between the two leagues.

    Except when it costs Gar a place in the HOF anyway.

    PS - they need to change interleague play, so that the home team has to play by the other league's rules. That means pitchers hit in AL ballparks and DHs hit in NL ballparks. Having it the other way around is silly - why have interleague play if you're not watching the other league's playing style in the park?

    ~G
    Tell Babe Ruth that watching the pitcher "Bat" is pathetic.
    I got mind control while I'm here
    You goin' hate me when I'm gone
    Ain't no blood clot and no fear
    I got hope inside of my bones

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    If we're going to take the pitcher out of the lineup because he "can't hit" then why stop there? We should have a DH for the shortstop because most shortstops can't hit and we should have a DH for the catcher because most catchers can't hit. Last season, the AL position with the worst OPS was left fielders so perhaps we should have a DH for left fielders too. The players union would love this idea.

    And think how much baseball would be better with catchers and shortstops who are enjoyed for their defensive skills without the pressure of having to hit as well. Yes, I think this is the future of baseball. We need more DHs in the lineup.
    I miss the old Mile High Stadium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thnikkaman View Post
    Tell Babe Ruth that watching the pitcher "Bat" is pathetic.
    We're going back 8 decades for the reason pitchers should be allowed to bat?

    I think they should play the game bare-handed, too - these new-fangled "gloves" are ridiculous. In 1865 we didn't use no stupid leather on the hand, we played the game the way it was meant to be played.

    ~G
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeHoof View Post
    If we're going to take the pitcher out of the lineup because he "can't hit" then why stop there? We should have a DH for the shortstop because most shortstops can't hit and we should have a DH for the catcher because most catchers can't hit. Last season, the AL position with the worst OPS was left fielders so perhaps we should have a DH for left fielders too. The players union would love this idea.

    And think how much baseball would be better with catchers and shortstops who are enjoyed for their defensive skills without the pressure of having to hit as well. Yes, I think this is the future of baseball. We need more DHs in the lineup.
    *shrugs* In several more decades we might go there.

    They used to play two-way football, but decided to specialize. There's a reason they use pre-merger and post-merger stats when defining players - the game of football has changed A LOT over the years.

    In 2080 maybe there will be 30-man teams with a set of fielders for "Defense," sluggers for offense, and only the best of both being allowed to play both ways.

    In the meantime, I'm perfectly satisfied by having a DH and letting pitchers worry about pitching. But I came to baseball as an adult, in the AL, so what NL afficianados call "strategy" I call "20 minutes to do housework while I wait to see who's actually gonna pitch the 7th inning."

    It's just not how I like to watch baseball. Different strokes and all that.

    ~G
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    My novels Mason's Order and its sequel Mason's Pledge are now available at Amazon in both paperback and kindle versions.

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    Couldnt have said it better. Bring back the wool uniforms, the crap quality baseballs and fields with no walls or fences, too.

    If we have to refer to a pitcher being a great hitter and go back almost 80 years...my point is made. I guess my biggest issue isnt necessarily pitchers not being able to hit, but simply not caring enough to hit. Sure, there are always Zambrano's, but pitchers that are capable of hitting and actually care about it are rare. If you look at the top hitting pitchers of all time...almost all of them were bad to mediocre pitchers.

    They just dont care and therefore, I'm okay if they dont hit

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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachChaz View Post
    Couldnt have said it better. Bring back the wool uniforms, the crap quality baseballs and fields with no walls or fences, too.

    If we have to refer to a pitcher being a great hitter and go back almost 80 years...my point is made. I guess my biggest issue isnt necessarily pitchers not being able to hit, but simply not caring enough to hit. Sure, there are always Zambrano's, but pitchers that are capable of hitting and actually care about it are rare. If you look at the top hitting pitchers of all time...almost all of them were bad to mediocre pitchers.

    They just dont care and therefore, I'm okay if they dont hit
    My biggest beef isn't having to watch the pitchers hit, but the decisions that are taken away from teams when the Pitcher doesn't have to bat.

    Its the 7th, you've got 2 on, your team is up by 1, and your pitcher who has only thrown 90 pitches so far, and still has another good inning or two in him is coming up to bat. Do you pinch hit and rely on your bullpen, or do you let him hit and be confident that he's not going to lose the game on defense.

    This never happens in the AL.
    I got mind control while I'm here
    You goin' hate me when I'm gone
    Ain't no blood clot and no fear
    I got hope inside of my bones

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    True, but in the AL you don't get automatic bailouts to end innings by getting to pitch to another pitcher. All the ABs count, so the game's harder on the pitcher. AL starters are always in for as long as they can keep their pitches working, which happens less often in the NL thanks to the needed pinch-hitter. We get drama out of when to pull a tiring pitcher in the way that you get it out of when to hit for him.

    When we do have those "horrible offense" questions with a fielder instead of a pitcher in the 7th we may go to the bench, which causes a pitcher switch, which creates the same double-switch potential that NL fans find so captivating.

    Decisions are still there. When to pull the pitcher. Which reliever to use. Whether to pinch-hit if a bad split is coming up for the batter.

    They just don't revolve around pulling the starting pitcher to avoid his plate appearance. I would think that if you grew up with that late-game question of when to pull the pitcher because his AB is coming up, it's probably disconcerting. It's 162 games x however many years of habit to worry about that.

    We worry about different things in the AL, normally revolving around how deep the opposing lineup is and how best to stem the tide.

    Straw Man:
    NL = worrying about the worst offensive performers
    AL = worrying about the best offensive performers

    I guess I like my kind of worrying better. NL vs. AL arguments feel to me like someone is trying to tell me that a field-position game between conservative offenses that is the ultimate form of football.

    It's ONE form, and depending on how spectacular the play is that kind of game can be absolutely riveting.

    But I don't think it's "playing the game the only way it was intended to be played" by any stretch. Which is why I wouldn't advocate the DH for the NL. Most sports leagues are homogonized. I like the differences, because they allow for different styles of play to be advocated and enjoyed by baseball fans.

    It just hurts one of my favorite players in this instance because half of baseball sneers at the position he excelled at.

    ~G
    "Dream as if you will live forever. Live as if you'll die today."
    -- James Dean


    My novels Mason's Order and its sequel Mason's Pledge are now available at Amazon in both paperback and kindle versions.

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