Thread: Spread Option a viable offense?

OAKLAND, Calif. — Football on Sundays has become an aerial show. Knowing that Tim Tebow is not a conventional Sunday quarterback, the Broncos' coaching staff came up with an innovative idea against the Oakland Raiders: They brought football back to Saturdays.

Using a read-option running attack that hasn't been seen in the NFL since . . . since . . . since when? Since before helmets had face masks? Anyway, the Broncos defeated the Oakland Raiders 38-24 at O.co Coliseum on Sunday in an AFC West game that was widely characterized as an upset.

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From what we saw yesterday it CAN be effective at the NFL level. I'm not sure it's worth building around but I think it's something that should continue to be used even if sparingly to catch defenses off guard.

Two reasons it worked yesterday. One because Tebow completed that touchdown pass early and second because the Oakland defensive ends were selling out the dives to McGahee which was set up by his fantastic runs.

It will work, but not as the primary base of an offense. You have to have a lot of other stuff clicking.

Originally Posted by MOtorboat

Two reasons it worked yesterday. One because Tebow completed that touchdown pass early and second because the Oakland defensive ends were selling out the dives to McGahee which was set up by his fantastic runs.

It will work, but not as the primary base of an offense. You have to have a lot of other stuff clicking.

It they would throw from that formation they would kill.

I hope they add more than a few of those to next weeks game plan.

Another reason is because moss was the DE

Originally Posted by CrazyHorse

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From what we saw yesterday it CAN be effective at the NFL level. I'm not sure it's worth building around but I think it's something that should continue to be used even if sparingly to catch defenses of guard.

Sure you can win a few games with that offense. But, NFL defenses can easily adapt to stop it, which is WHY the option hasn't been used much in the NFL for about 35 years.

How many shots do you think Tebow can take and still keep getting up? He's taking a pounding every game. Well, he's a tough guy, and he's holding up -- for now.

But, project that into the future. How many seasons will the guy last if he's taking hits like a RB? The toughest RBs normally don't last more than about 5 years in the NFL.

And they don't pay them $9-$15 million a year either.

Originally Posted by Cugel

Sure you can win a few games with that offense. But, NFL defenses can easily adapt to stop it, which is WHY the option hasn't been used much in the NFL for about 35 years.

How many shots do you think Tebow can take and still keep getting up? He's taking a pounding every game. Well, he's a tough guy, and he's holding up -- for now.

But, project that into the future. How many seasons will the guy last if he's taking hits like a RB? The toughest RBs normally don't last more than about 5 years in the NFL.

And they don't pay them $9-$15 million a year either.

That's actually my biggest concern. Tebow took a massive beating out there. You can't have that and expect a quarterback to last. Just look at Vick. He's never completed a full season. Then again you could also make the argument that Tebow took just as much of a beating the last two weeks while trying to remain in the pocket.

I'd rather have my quarterback get hit by safeties and corners over linemen. Of course there isn't any rule to protect a quarterback running as there is when they are in the pocket. As long as he learns to take what's given rather than taking defenders head on and can become a more consistent passer I think he'll be pretty effective.

Originally Posted by Cugel

Sure you can win a few games with that offense. But, NFL defenses can easily adapt to stop it, which is WHY the option hasn't been used much in the NFL for about 35 years.

How many shots do you think Tebow can take and still keep getting up? He's taking a pounding every game. Well, he's a tough guy, and he's holding up -- for now.

But, project that into the future. How many seasons will the guy last if he's taking hits like a RB? The toughest RBs normally don't last more than about 5 years in the NFL.

And they don't pay them $9-$15 million a year either.

I was more concerned with the hits he was taking in the pocket.

He took some tough hits running the ball too, but he got hit harder in the pocket IMO, taking shots to the chin.

Those hits in the pocket are concussion city...that will end your career faster than anything.

Originally Posted by vandammage13

I was more concerned with the hits he was taking in the pocket.

He took some tough hits running the ball too, but he got hit harder in the pocket IMO, taking shots to the chin.

Those hits in the pocket are concussion city...that will end your career faster than anything.

First as Alfred Williams was pointing out on the Fan yesterday, they don't protect running QBs like Vick or Tebow the same way they do other more traditional QBs. Everybody knows they like to run so the refs tend to extend plays and let defenders get away with more hits on them that might be called penalties if it were a Kyle Orton.

Second, you can't avoid taking an occasional shot while standing in the pocket throwing the ball. It's a violent league and for all the rules that favor the QB in the pocket it's still legal to sack the QB after all.

Thus it is more important than ever for the QB to release the ball quickly to avoid taking extra hits. And Tebow does that very badly. He's not throwing to a spot anticipating where the WR will be before he makes his break, he's trying to wait until WRs get open and THEN throwing to them.

And you can't do that. It gives the defender too much time to react, and it gives them more time to hit Tebow.

Originally Posted by CrazyHorse

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From what we saw yesterday it CAN be effective at the NFL level. I'm not sure it's worth building around but I think it's something that should continue to be used even if sparingly to catch defenses of guard.

The Spread Option isn't viable, not at the NFL level at least. I remember that a lot of people said the Wildcat Option would eventually invade the NFL and be considered a Pro Offense, guess what happened, it flamed out. Problem is that the Spread Option requires not so much talent as deceptiveness to be successful, once a defense, especially the faster more hard hitting defenses at the professional level understand what they're facing then the offense becomes a liability for the team using it. No option offenses have been successful in the modern NFL for that very reason, they're gimmick offenses that once the flaws are discovered can not be adjusted.

Now that doesn't mean that an offense can not utilize certain aspects of that offensive system. After all, a quality offensive coordinator will take aspects of many different offenses in order to create a more dynamic offense. Wasn't that long ago that the shotgun formation was introduced to the Spread Options, look at the success of those offenses with the formation in play.

Originally Posted by Lancane

The Spread Option isn't viable, not at the NFL level at least. I remember that a lot of people said the Wildcat Option would eventually invade the NFL and be considered a Pro Offense, guess what happened, it flamed out. Problem is that the Spread Option requires not so much talent as deceptiveness to be successful, once a defense, especially the faster more hard hitting defenses at the professional level understand what they're facing then the offense becomes a liability for the team using it. No option offenses have been successful in the modern NFL for that very reason, they're gimmick offenses that once the flaws are discovered can not be adjusted.

Now that doesn't mean that an offense can not utilize certain aspects of that offensive system. After all, a quality offensive coordinator will take aspects of many different offenses in order to create a more dynamic offense. Wasn't that long ago that the shotgun formation was introduced to the Spread Options, look at the success of those offenses with the formation in play.

This is true, but it's only 1/2 the picture. I'm still going to write a thread about why the NFL went to a system designed for pocket-passing QBs.

But, the other half of the equation is that you're paying an NFL franchise QB WAY too much money to let him run around much.

In the NFL there is ONE rule: Troy Polomalu and Ray Lewis are bigger and faster and they hit harder than you. Stay away from guys like that and your career will last longer.

Originally Posted by Lancane

The Spread Option isn't viable, not at the NFL level at least. I remember that a lot of people said the Wildcat Option would eventually invade the NFL and be considered a Pro Offense, guess what happened, it flamed out. Problem is that the Spread Option requires not so much talent as deceptiveness to be successful, once a defense, especially the faster more hard hitting defenses at the professional level understand what they're facing then the offense becomes a liability for the team using it. No option offenses have been successful in the modern NFL for that very reason, they're gimmick offenses that once the flaws are discovered can not be adjusted.

Now that doesn't mean that an offense can not utilize certain aspects of that offensive system. After all, a quality offensive coordinator will take aspects of many different offenses in order to create a more dynamic offense. Wasn't that long ago that the shotgun formation was introduced to the Spread Options, look at the success of those offenses with the formation in play.

I disagree, I think a modified spread option isolates the defense and allows you to pick on the mismatch as well as giving you an extra player on the field by requiring a qb spy. (This whole thread is a mirror of the one whn Urban Meyer came to the SEC, just replace NFL with SEC)

Originally Posted by catfish

I disagree, I think a modified spread option isolates the defense and allows you to pick on the mismatch as well as giving you an extra player on the field by requiring a qb spy. (This whole thread is a mirror of the one whn Urban Meyer came to the SEC, just replace NFL with SEC)

The problem is that the spread option was pretty much neutralized when Florida played Alabama in the SEC CG of 2009. Alabama contained Tebow and made him stay in the pocket and try to beat them with his arm. Tebow was pressured, sacked, and had an INT while in the pocket (I believe; I try to block that game from memory), and his receivers were not doing him any favors. The offense never really got it going.

I would think that any DC would get a copy of Alabama's tape, Detroit's tape and design a scheme to beat Tebow.

I'm a Tebow fan, but he has to improve from the pocket. That will (1) make the zone option more effective; (2) get the media/Elway off his arse.

Originally Posted by TT15Superman

The problem is that the spread option was pretty much neutralized when Florida played Alabama in the SEC CG of 2009. Alabama contained Tebow and made him stay in the pocket and try to beat them with his arm. Tebow was pressured, sacked, and had an INT while in the pocket (I believe; I try to block that game from memory), and his receivers were not doing him any favors. The offense never really got it going.

I would think that any DC would get a copy of Alabama's tape, Detroit's tape and design a scheme to beat Tebow.

I'm a Tebow fan, but he has to improve from the pocket. That will (1) make the zone option more effective; (2) get the media/Elway off his arse.

I agree that he need to improve, I also think Alabama was superior talent wise to Fla that year. IMO talent trumps scheme 9 times out of 10

Originally Posted by catfish

I agree that he need to improve, I also think Alabama was superior talent wise to Fla that year. IMO talent trumps scheme 9 times out of 10

Players ALWAYS beat out schemes.

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Originally Posted by TT15Superman

The problem is that the spread option was pretty much neutralized when Florida played Alabama in the SEC CG of 2009. Alabama contained Tebow and made him stay in the pocket and try to beat them with his arm. Tebow was pressured, sacked, and had an INT while in the pocket (I believe; I try to block that game from memory), and his receivers were not doing him any favors. The offense never really got it going.

I would think that any DC would get a copy of Alabama's tape, Detroit's tape and design a scheme to beat Tebow.

I'm a Tebow fan, but he has to improve from the pocket. That will (1) make the zone option more effective; (2) get the media/Elway off his arse.

I distinctly remember him having absolutely no time at all to throw during that game. The FL O line looked like a bunch of Jr High kids against college kids.

T. Tebow 20/35 for 247 1 TD/1 INT, plus 60 yards rushing on 10 carries - I wouldn't exactly call that contained, more like the rest of FL sucked, including demps dropping like 5 passes.

To be fair, I think if you collapse middle, our zone read becomes an outside option and we are SOL. You don't even need a QB spy.