Banned
Originally Posted by Ziggy
got to remember that Jason also had a damned good NT/DT next to him most of the time and Zack covering his flanks and a fine set of CB back there also..
Those little things we do not have at this point in time.. and yes I know that Champ in back there, but they had two great ones.. not Champ and the other guy..
BTW their coaches name for most of this time was Bates..
Banned
like most of mikeys #1's..
ALL-IN
How far back you going? Here's what I see the last five years:
2004 - D.J. Williams
2005 - No #1
2006 - Jay Cutler
2007 - Jarvis Moss
2008 - Ryan Clady
For all of us who aren't history students, this looks pretty good, even if
Moss were to bust, which we don't know yet. It certainly would not
constitute "most, the busts being only 25% of the four years they had a #1.
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Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)
Senior Member
The last five years looks pretty good.
Banned
I guess I did not make myself clear so let me do so here..
1996 - John Mobley LB
1997 - Trevor Pryce lb-de converted to DT
1998 - Marcus Nash wr
1999 - Al Wilson LB
2000 - Deltha O'Neal CB
2001- Willie middlebroken CB
2002 - Ashley Lelie wr
2003 - George Foster t
2004 - D.J. Williams LB
2005 - No #1
2006 - Jay Cutler QB
2007 - Jarvis Moss de-LB
2008 - Ryan Clady T
most of mikeys picks were either LB made good or busts.. as noted by the colored coded list above..
so look at the list and if you want remove Pryce from the LB portion although that was the spot he primarily played in college..
you have either LB that made good or busts IMO..
Then you have Jay and Clady as the only other two #1 picks that have accounted for anything other than the normal, since he is a number one pick we have to play him to find out for sure whether he is worth a damn... Which I think we can all agree that the following were indeed busts for DEN in the long term application of what you expect from a top pick:
1998 - Marcus Nash wr
2000 - Deltha O'Neal CB
2001- Willie middlebroken CB
2002 - Ashley Lelie wr
2003 - George Foster t
with the jury still out on
2007 - Jarvis Moss de
I hope the clarifies what I thought was clear and concise before..
ALL-IN
This is why I mentioned that I am not a history student at least toward the NFL.
I'm more of a "what have you done lately" student.
BTW, you apparently have the "stars" in red. In that case, I would put
Cutler and Clady in red, too. They have already established themselves.
Also, I would not consider Foster a bust . . . not as good as we had hoped,
but not a bust. He did start for several years, and was part of that 2005
line that the league considered one of the best.
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Last edited by topscribe; 10-10-2008 at 11:05 AM.
Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)
Banned
This is why I mentioned that I am not a history student at least toward the NFL.
I'm more of a "what have you done lately" student.
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well to each his own.. I prefer to look at history, to learn from it so we do not repeat it again and again..
Looking at history as we speak mikey is 2 for 12 not counting LB picks or 6 for 12 if you do.. including Pryce and actual LB's..
Not sure I like being 50% with mikeys top picks..
Senior Member
So he's 50 percent in the first round...have you done any comparisons, or just more blind criticism?
*The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.
Banned
since you modified this since I answered the original.This is why I mentioned that I am not a history student at least toward the NFL.
I'm more of a "what have you done lately" student.
BTW, you apparently have the "stars" in red. In that case, I would put
Cutler and Clady in red, too. They have already established themselves.
Also, I would not consider Foster a bust . . . not as good as we had hoped,
but not a bust. He did start for several years, and was part of that 2005
line that the league considered one of the best.
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foster was played because he had no one better.. that does not IMO qualify him as a good choice for a top pick.. someone that can't hold a top spot on another team as bad as DET is is certainly not a great player..
the only reason he lasted as long as he did in DEN was the GM could not admit he was a bust and we had no one else better..
Jay and Clady are not in red because they were not LB's as to my original post answering your comment
"Well, I supposed it's LB or bust then?"
my response was
"like most of mikeys #1's.." meaning that MOST were either LB or busts..
Meaning they were neither LB or busts.. and they certainly were not in the MOST category..
Hope that helps..
Banned
NO I have not, nor am I going to do so..
My comment stands as quoted
most of his busts were catastrophic.. the players could not make it as a starter somewhere else in their original positions.. most, if they are in the NFL are backups ..
that is not what one expects out of a class organization like the Broncos..
at least not what I expect from them.. if your willing to allow it, fine be me..
there are plenty of reports on how bad they have done in the press which I'm sure you have seen already.. one in particular last year had them rated at the worst drafting team form 2000-2004.
Senior Member
So only Denver's busts were catastrophic...OK...gotcha...
Your arguments will never have much credence without a comparison. It's just blind criticism.
*The statements above are my opinions, unless they are links, because then they are links, which wouldn't make them my opinions, and I suppose stats aren't necessarily opinion, but they are certainly presented to support an opinion. Proceed accordingly.
ALL-IN
Why do I get the impression that if Shanny hits on the next 10 you will still
be dwelling on this past? JR, I love ya to death, but I can't go back there
with you.
From 2005 on, Shanny & Co. have scored up and down the the picks in the
drafts. Not only is Moss the only one who could possibly end up a bust
(but, as I mentioned, we don't know that yet), but they have made several
selections in later rounds that would go much higher today, including some
who would go in the first round, e.g., Marshall, Dumervil, Kuper, Hixon
(whom they threw under the bus but is now starring elsewhere), R. Harris,
Thomas, Larsen, and others. Moreover, a recent poll indicated that Cutler
would now be the overall #1 choice in his draft. D-Will probably would have
been a starter for us. Even Fast Eddie hasn't acted or played like a 2nd
rounder so far, and I've heard some scouts say they wouldn't be surprised
to see Scheffler ultimately join Gonzalez and Gates as one of the premier
TEs in the league.
Even in 2004, whereas the rest of the picks were shameful, D.J. was a
major score.
And Shanny & Co. have been wizards in FA, adding the likes of Woodyard,
Kern, Young, Hall, and Martinez.
The past be damned, all in all, I am thoroughly tickled with the acquisitions
these past four years.
There's a reason the Broncos are 4-1 this year. It's called talent.
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Last edited by topscribe; 10-10-2008 at 11:45 AM.
Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)
ALL-IN
Regarding Foster, that doesn't make much sense, JR. He started because
he was the starter. Shoot, Champ is starting because they don't have
anyone better.
Regarding the LBs, it's kind of ironic, isn't it, that LB is considered one of
the strengths of the team now?
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Though He slay me, I will trust in Him . . . (Job 13:15)
Banned
Sam Madison and Patrick Surtain was average.
Banned
It looks like we have not repeated that history as of late.
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