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Thread: Broncos will have to deal with Bailey decision

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by T.K.O. (team kyle orton) View Post
    though i realize this could not include unsigned rookies etc... it does seem Pat should have some dough to throw around

    Year / Total Payroll
    2010
    NFL Teams Total Payroll
    NFL Oakland Raiders Team Salaries $ 152,389,371
    NFL Dallas Cowboys Team Salaries $ 146,401,600
    NFL Minnesota Vikings Team Salaries $ 133,354,045
    NFL Cleveland Browns Team Salaries $ 131,916,300
    NFL New Orleans Saints Team Salaries $ 131,531,820
    NFL Pittsburgh Steelers Team Salaries $ 128,815,061
    NFL Tennessee Titans Team Salaries $ 126,017,443
    NFL Arizona Cardinals Team Salaries $ 122,110,110
    NFL Jacksonville Jaguars Team Salaries $ 122,109,207
    NFL Chicago Bears Team Salaries $ 120,065,819
    NFL San Francisco 49ers Team Salaries $ 118,766,239
    NFL New York Jets Team Salaries $ 116,910,097
    NFL St. Louis Rams Team Salaries $ 116,677,660
    NFL New York Giants Team Salaries $ 115,816,180
    NFL Miami Dolphins Team Salaries $ 114,649,660
    NFL Buffalo Bills Team Salaries $ 113,364,927
    NFL Carolina Panthers Team Salaries $ 112,114,711
    NFL Washington Redskins Team Salaries $ 111,963,684
    NFL San Diego Chargers Team Salaries $ 111,813,340
    NFL Cincinnati Bengals Team Salaries $ 109,727,880
    NFL Philadelphia Eagles Team Salaries $ 109,557,398
    NFL Houston Texans Team Salaries $ 108,445,418
    NFL Tampa Bay Buccaneers Team Salaries $ 104,329,311
    NFL Seattle Seahawks Team Salaries $ 102,985,710
    NFL Atlanta Falcons Team Salaries $ 96,391,525
    NFL Detroit Lions Team Salaries $ 95,827,117
    NFL Denver Broncos Team Salaries $ 95,599,778
    NFL Green Bay Packers Team Salaries $ 94,018,300
    NFL Indianapolis Colts Team Salaries $ 93,373,915
    NFL New England Patriots Team Salaries $ 92,734,120
    NFL Baltimore Ravens Team Salaries $ 90,713,965
    NFL Kansas City Chiefs Team Salaries $ 83,623,776
    Not sure where you got your numbers from but you also have to remember it ius not JUST this year they are looking at. But the ramificatiin in two years.

    Will there be a cap ,d just because we were always maxed out at the cap in the past does not mean we will be there in the future.

    I also think the numbers abo ve included all the capped numbers of players they unloaded.

    Like OAK dumping the fat man probalby cost them close to 35 mil of that money listed above.

    And just like you and yoiur family Pat has a budget he has to live with.

    Income IN should equal money spent or close to that. Or you are not in business for long.

    I think we were in free spending moe in the past UP to the CREDIT CARD limits he had. Just because the bar kept rising does noy mean it will continue to rise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jrwiz View Post
    do y'all not get it there is only so much money to pass around.

    we were under the old cap in 09 by about 10 mil.

    where are you going to get the money to resign all of the players without cutting somewhere.

    there is no cap this year and lots of money will be cleared from olf deals from both mikeys and Xmans contracts for players no longer here, that was all money spent paid out in bonus but just spread out over the contract years..

    the players get 60% of the clubs revenues under the old contract that will have to be lowered in the next CBA or there will be clubs going under.

    the owners in most cases did not just have a spare billion laying around to buy the franchise most had loans of some sort to pay off for the purchases.

    They also have other expenses than players contracts, lights and water, rent for their building or mortgages if they own them, salaries for the rest of the staff. medical bills and equipment. not to mention a little profit for their investors/ shareholders.


    this is not a hobby for most of the owners where throwing some more cash at buying a new motor to the model airplane that crashed. it is a business that has to remain viable. I repeat there is only so much money to go around, IIRC the new DL is costing about 12 mil a year, where should that money have come from the one tree that so many of you seem to think there is.

    just think of making out a budget for your household and getting by then to have extraordinary expenses come up like the freezer burning up and runing all the food in it.

    Do you have to find away to replace all of that food and Freezer inside your income?

    the owners do also.
    Getting rid of Kyle "The lame duck" Orton, Lonnie "waste of roughly $3 mil on a long-snapper" Paxton, Russ "I'm the highest paid, past my prime, backup O-lineman in the league" Hochstein, and Jarvis "I've never amounted to anything or earned a cent of that first round money" Moss should free up some space. Just a thought.

    The current regime has made just as foolish moves with FAs as the old one did. They CHOSE to revamp the roster and bring in high priced FAs on both sides of the ball. Not attempting to keep one of the best CBs in history so we can sign a couple more worthless-assed backups to overpriced (yet cheaper than Champ's!) contracts while we polish our pennies is almost criminal.


    “Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip.” -Winston Churchill

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  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jrwiz View Post
    Not sure where you got your numbers from but you also have to remember it ius not JUST this year they are looking at. But the ramificatiin in two years.

    Will there be a cap ,d just because we were always maxed out at the cap in the past does not mean we will be there in the future.

    I also think the numbers abo ve included all the capped numbers of players they unloaded.

    Like OAK dumping the fat man probalby cost them close to 35 mil of that money listed above.

    And just like you and yoiur family Pat has a budget he has to live with.

    Income IN should equal money spent or close to that. Or you are not in business for long.

    I think we were in free spending moe in the past UP to the CREDIT CARD limits he had. Just because the bar kept rising does noy mean it will continue to rise.
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    Actually, with no cap there is NO CAP HIT. The Raiders, other than being fleeced with all the guaranteed money they owed him, took no penalties for releasing Russell.

    For instance, we could cut Jarvis Moss and get out from under his 1st round contract with no penalties to the cap because there isn't one. We'd have to pay him whatever unpaid guaranteed bonus money ha has coming, but we'd get to dump his salary and wouldn't be paying him to not dress on Sunday like we've done for 3 years now.


    “Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip.” -Winston Churchill

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    Quote Originally Posted by T.K.O. (team kyle orton) View Post
    oh great now i gotta worry about champ.
    I wouldn't worry too much. His contract was heavily backloaded so he's getting some major coin this year and as such he's not going to be all that antsy about getting something done.

    Quote Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56 View Post
    Getting rid of Kyle "The lame duck" Orton,
    Dumping our solid starting quarterback who is coming off of a career to save $2.6 million is pretty high up on the "bad idea" scale.

    Lonnie "waste of roughly $3 mil on a long-snapper" Paxton
    Paxton gets paid just slightly over $1 million a year, which is roughly $200,000 over the minimum wage for a player with his time in the league. It's also about the same price we would have had to pay to re-sign Mike Leach.

    Russ "I'm the highest paid, past my prime, backup O-lineman in the league" Hochstein,
    Hochstein will get paid $3.5 million maximum to provide two years of service as a very good and versatile backup who can step in and be a serviceable starter if needed, which is exactly what he did in 2009.

    and Jarvis "I've never amounted to anything or earned a cent of that first round money" Moss should free up some space. Just a thought.
    Another great idea. Moss is on the cheapest part of his contract and might be very, very useful should we not be able to come to terms with Doom, but we should cut him anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bosco View Post
    I wouldn't worry too much. His contract was heavily backloaded so he's getting some major coin this year and as such he's not going to be all that antsy about getting something done.
    Right. I'm sure Champ loves having no security that he'll be in Denver after this year. You know there's more to it than just the bottom line dollar amount, right? Guys take less money than they may originally want all the time to either go to certain teams or stay with certain teams as long as their future is secure.

    Dumping our solid starting quarterback who is coming off of a career to save $2.6 million is pretty high up on the "bad idea" scale.
    Why not? Is Orton going to lead us to a Superbowl this year? Not likely AT ALL... Would Quinn really be that much worse? Probably not. Orton ain't coming back and he ain't playing for the Broncos after this year. He's nothing more than a hired gun playing for himself and the contract some other team offers him at the end of the year when he becomes an UFA.

    Paxton gets paid just slightly over $1 million a year, which is roughly $200,000 over the minimum wage for a player with his time in the league. It's also about the same price we would have had to pay to re-sign Mike Leach.
    I strongly doubt Mike Leach would've ever been paid anywhere near what Paxton was. Paxton was paid because he was a McDaniels bootlicker and NE would'nt pay him because he wanted TOO MUCH MONEY.

    Hochstein will get paid $3.5 million maximum to provide two years of service as a very good and versatile backup who can step in and be a serviceable starter if needed, which is exactly what he did in 2009.
    Hochstein was f'n terrible in 2009! What guy were you watching? Everyone got all excited when Hochstein replaced Hamilton but the running game and pass protection got WORSE when Hochstein came in!!! Then he got hurt and went on IR anyway.

    Another great idea. Moss is on the cheapest part of his contract and might be very, very useful should we not be able to come to terms with Doom, but we should cut him anyway.
    C'mon dude. Even you aren't that thick. Jarvis Moss is 7" taller than Dumervil and 10 lbs lighter. People complain that Dumervil isn't a "complete OLB" but Moss is somehow going to wake up, find his way off the bench, put on enough weight to anchor or bull-rush OTs, and actually become a decent OLB? Dude, seriously. STOP BELIEVING EVERYTHING YOU READ ON BRONCOS.COM! It's all just propaganda and fluff. Do you really think that Moss and scrub/UDFA Kevin Alexander are starting material just because they took most of the reps with the 1st unit at OTAs over Doom and Ayers?


    “Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip.” -Winston Churchill

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  9. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56 View Post
    Right. I'm sure Champ loves having no security that he'll be in Denver after this year.
    I doubt Champ cares. He is one of the most grounded players in all of sports.
    Why not? Is Orton going to lead us to a Superbowl this year? Not likely AT ALL... Would Quinn really be that much worse? Probably not. Orton ain't coming back and he ain't playing for the Broncos after this year. He's nothing more than a hired gun playing for himself and the contract some other team offers him at the end of the year when he becomes an UFA.
    Right, and he's still our starting quarterbacking coming off a career year when he had a few months to learn the system.

    Risk vs. Reward of cutting him is heavily slanted toward risk.

    I strongly doubt Mike Leach would've ever been paid anywhere near what Paxton was.
    That's exactly what happened. He got a 3 year contract worth just over $3 million. Paxton got just over $5 mil for a 5 year deal.

    Hochstein was f'n terrible in 2009!
    No he wasn't. He was a rather substantial upgrade to Ben Hamilton, who was getting absolutely abused as a starter. Certainly not a guy you want as your starter, but as a backup he's hard to beat.

    C'mon dude. Even you aren't that thick. Jarvis Moss is 7" taller than Dumervil and 10 lbs lighter. People complain that Dumervil isn't a "complete OLB" but Moss is somehow going to wake up, find his way off the bench, put on enough weight to anchor or bull-rush OTs, and actually become a decent OLB? Dude, seriously. STOP BELIEVING EVERYTHING YOU READ ON BRONCOS.COM! It's all just propaganda and fluff. Do you really think that Moss and scrub/UDFA Kevin Alexander are starting material just because they took most of the reps with the 1st unit at OTAs over Doom and Ayers?
    Moss was also a mid first round pick and the best pass rusher in that draft not named Gaines Adams. He was also very raw in technique, coming off a major staph infection and since being in the NFL had to deal with a broken leg, Bob Slowik and a position change.

    The guy is extremely physically gifted and by all accounts a well respected and professional teammate just like Dumervil. He's fought through more adversity than most players do in their entire careers and to date the coaching staff obviously thinks he's not a lost cause, otherwise he wouldn't have made it through 2009. There is absolutely zero reason to cut him unless someone comes in and takes his job from him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bosco View Post
    There is absolutely zero reason to cut him unless someone comes in and takes his job from him.
    Umm, unless it's freeing up money to sign Dumervil long term. I'd much rather pay Dumervil to play than pay Moss not to dress on Sunday. I've got a feeling that Moss is only still on the team because he's a first round pick that has ZERO trade value and Bowlen is probably still holding out hope that he'll develop some day and not be a complete bust. He's probably only still on the team because he won't let Josh cut him. That's my hunch.

    Moss has done absolutely nothing noteworthy since his rookie season. Every year he gets the same fluff piece about working hard and trying to earn a starting spot. Every year he fails. This year will be no different. Unless Bowlen really is ordering Josh to keep Moss around, I don't expect Moss to make it out of camp.


    “Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip.” -Winston Churchill

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    Quote Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56 View Post
    Umm, unless it's freeing up money to sign Dumervil long term. I'd much rather pay Dumervil to play than pay Moss not to dress on Sunday.
    Guess what. You'd then have to turn around and find another backup for Dumervil, making the cost savings rather small and good luck finding someone with Moss's potential to man a backup spot.

    I've got a feeling that Moss is only still on the team because he's a first round pick that has ZERO trade value and Bowlen is probably still holding out hope that he'll develop some day and not be a complete bust. He's probably only still on the team because he won't let Josh cut him. That's my hunch.
    Right. Bowlen, one of the most hands off owner in all of sports, is dictating to Josh that he keep a backup OLB.

    That sounds reasonable.

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    wow, i thought school was out for the summer.....it appears professor bosco is working overtime !

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    LINEBACKER JARVIS MOSS

    On the upcoming season


    "I'm looking forward to it. This year, like I said, it's a long ways to go and I'm going to get better from now and to the point when we're kicking the ball off to actually win a game."



    On whether he's added muscle weight this offseason

    "Yes, when we first started working with (Broncos Strength and Conditioning Coach) Rich (Tuten), I was dropping pounds but I weighed in the other day at around 245."


    On whether he plans to add more weight before training camp




    "I'm going to try to put on five-to-eight more pounds by the time we report."



    On playing linebacker


    "I should have been doing this, just being honest. This is what I was supposed to have been doing when I came to the NFL. The more comfortable I get, the more I think about it. When I'm sitting on the couch watching TV - just putting my own little twist and stuff, doing it the coach's way but being comfortable and putting my little twist on it and it's working. It works for me. I'm athletic, I can run, I can move in space and there's nothing that I really can't do at outside linebacker."


    On his comfort level at the linebacker position


    "It's getting there to that point. I've been rushing my whole life so when it comes that time, the rushing part is down but just covering and understanding the defense, yeah."

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    Champ won't be here next season. The Raiders didn't pay an aging Law, and we know McD wants to be just like Billy. Champ will go somewhere else, and get paid. Then, he might eventually move to safety.. maybe. But it will be for someone else. There is no way.. no way... McD breaks his pattern and signs Bailey to a contract that would compare to what he could get elsewhere.
    (the previous comment was not directed at any particular individual and was not intended to slander,disrespect or offend any reader of said statement)

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    Last night on the NFL portion on ESPN, Mike Golic and Chris Carter were discussing Champ, and both agreed that the Broncos need to get the young guys under contract first, and then turn their attention to Champ, as he is still under contract. Just because nothing has been done, as far as Champ's contract yet, does not mean that it will not get done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denver Native (Carol) View Post
    Last night on the NFL portion on ESPN, Mike Golic and Chris Carter were discussing Champ, and both agreed that the Broncos need to get the young guys under contract first, and then turn their attention to Champ, as he is still under contract. Just because nothing has been done, as far as Champ's contract yet, does not mean that it will not get done.
    which is now similar to the elvis situation,both are broncos in 2010 so the team's major focus should be on the unsigned guys

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    I expect Champ to be gone unless he is willing to agree to a reasonable deal. I will be surprised if Denver gives him another big deal. And to be honest, that would be the right decision. It looks like Denver has been preparing for this eventuality in how they have drafted the last couple of years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HORSEPOWER 56 View Post
    I've got a feeling that Moss is only still on the team because he's a first round pick that has ZERO trade value and Bowlen is probably still holding out hope that he'll develop some day and not be a complete bust.
    I would think the opposite is true! Moss walked away last summer and was ready to call it quits until his agent informed him he was about to lose $6 Million or whatever it was.

    Bowlen will be paying Moss to some degree whether he is with the Broncos or not.

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