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weazel
12-08-2009, 06:26 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=A0PDlN_i3x5L.NYAgwc5nYcB?slug=ms-32questions120809&prov=yhoo&type=lgns


With 12 minutes to go in the 12th game of his 13th NFL season, Mike Vrabel(notes) finally lost his swagger. The Chiefs’ 34-year-old linebacker lost his composure, too: Upset after the Broncos went for it on fourth-and-1 with a 21-point lead – and rookie halfback Knowshon Moreno(notes) raced in for an 18-yard touchdown – Vrabel flipped his middle finger to the Denver bench as he walked off the field.


McDaniels and Pioli before Sunday's game.
(Denny Medley-US Presswire)
“I was frustrated,” Vrabel told Kansas City Star columnist Jason Whitlock after the game. “I’ve been on the other end of one of those [blowout victories] and it’s a lot of fun. Well, now I’ve been on the other side, and it’s not good.”

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Hey, payback’s a bitch – and then you retire.

For eight years Vrabel was a key part of this decade’s dominant NFL franchise, buying into the Bill Belichick code of boorish intimidation with a zealot’s devotion. Then, on Feb. 28, he received an unceremonious excommunication from the family. So much for loyalty: Looking for nothing more than cap space, the Pats included Vrabel in the trade that sent quarterback Matt Cassel(notes) to the Chiefs, where Belichick’s former right-hand man, Scott Pioli, was the newly hired general manager.

Now Vrabel is playing out his final football days for a 3-9 team that on Sunday allowed another Belichick prodigy, first-year Broncos coach Josh (I Wear a Hoodie, Too!) McDaniels, yet another opportunity to pay homage to his mentor. And if you think it was a coincidence that McDaniels chose to pour it on against the team run by Pioli, you probably also believe that Eric Mangini had nothing to do with Spygate.

Mangini’s estrangement from his former boss might have been the most celebrated instance of pettiness between the Pats and ex-Pats, but it clearly wasn’t an anomaly. From the Rocky Mountains to the shadow of the Rock N’ Roll Hall of Fame, Belichick’s Boys seem locked in chest-puffing quests to prove their alpha-male dominance, and really, should we be surprised?

These are single-minded men who conducted themselves in New England as though they’d run it up against their own mothers in Scrabble and displayed all the personal charm of a box of a GPS direction-provider. They also seem to have issues with boundaries, as I was just discussing with my new life coach, Charlie (Playa Hater) Weis.

So yes, Mr. Vrabel – McDaniels was most certainly trying to show you who your daddy is. Or perhaps he was telling Pioli, “I’m Bill’s best and brightest, not you.” Or maybe it had something to do with retribution for the Cassel trade, which didn’t exactly play out the way the Broncos had hoped, at least at the time.

It doesn’t really matter. The point is, in the eyes of Belichick and his disciples, you’re either ruthless or helpless, and if it’s the latter don’t expect your old buddies to help you up and assuage your pain.

The remotely amusing part of all of this is that the Don Mega himself may soon be reduced to flipping the middle finger to the world in frustration, which wouldn’t be much different from the way he behaved after losing Super Bowl XLII.

The Patriots are 7-5, and Belichick’s motivational magic seems to be a bit lacking. I say this because quarterback Tom Brady(notes), through his public comments Sunday and Monday, has taken over the role of locker-room warlord, questioning teammates’ commitment and intensity.

Belichick, I’m fairly certain, doesn’t have a problem with his future Hall of Fame quarterback sounding those notes. But it does mark a departure from the whole “One Voice” mission statement that the coach helped make famous, and I’m guessing that even if Belichick were bothered by Brady’s comments, he wouldn’t have the guts to censure him.

Loyalty might be a fleeting concept in Belichick’s world, but right now, he needs as much of it as he can muster.

1. New Orleans Saints: Given that Drew Brees(notes) believes in destiny and karma, can we also assume he believes he’ll face (and defeat) a certain team from San Diego in the Super Bowl?

2. Indianapolis Colts: How much fun will it be to watch Peyton Manning(notes) and Denver’s Brian Dawkins(notes) try to mess with one another’s minds on Sunday?

3. Minnesota Vikings: How much will E.J. Henderson’s(notes) broken femur hurt Leslie Frazier’s defense – and how touching was the sight of E.J.’s brother, Erin, holding his hand as he was driven off the field Sunday night?

4. San Diego Chargers: How cool was it to see LaDainian Tomlinson(notes) pass Jim Brown on the all-time rushing list, salute the Best Running Back Ever by pointing to Brown’s luxury suite, and then get love from the Hall of Famer in the locker room after the game?

5. Arizona Cardinals: What got devoured more quickly Sunday night – Larry Fitzgerald Sr.’s ice-cream sandwich or Adrian Peterson on running plays?

6. Cincinnati Bengals: Why does the sight of Chad Ochocinco(notes) in a poncho and sombrero make Roger Goodell so loco?

7. Green Bay Packers: Is it possible that Clay Matthews(notes), and not the Texans’ Brian Cushing(notes), is this year’s most impressive rookie linebacker from Southern California?

8. Philadelphia Eagles: If the Bills (or Cowboys) rammed a late Terrell Owens(notes) touchdown down the Eagles’ throat the way Andy Reid did with Michael Vick’s(notes) scoring pass against the Falcons Sunday, how bitter would the coach have been?

9. Dallas Cowboys: When Flozell Adams(notes) is in Tucson, can we expect to see him at this watering hole?

10. Denver Broncos: Why didn’t the Broncos redo Elvis Dumervil’s(notes) rookie deal before this season – and every time the linebacker makes a sack, is this what’s flashing through Pat Bowlen’s brain?

11. New England Patriots: Is the sky falling?

12. New York Giants: How did Brandon Jacobs(notes) stay inbounds on that 74-yard touchdown catch – and do Cowboys fans now feel the way about him that he feels about their team?

13. Miami Dolphins: Was Chad Henne(notes) the best Michigan man under center at Land Shark Stadium on Sunday – and can the Dolphins ride his big arm to another division crown?

14. Pittsburgh Steelers: How did Joe Burnett(notes) drop that potential game-winning interception with 40 seconds to go in Sunday’s defeat to the Raiders – and how desperately does this team miss Troy Polamalu(notes)?

15. Baltimore Ravens: Without T-Sizzle, how blatantly does their pass rush fizzle?

16. Tennessee Titans: Will Chris Johnson run for 300 yards against the Rams on Sunday – and how bummed about this matchup is the person who has to face UCSB women’s basketball coach Lindsay Gottlieb in the first round of their fantasy-league playoffs?

17. Atlanta Falcons: Is Matt Ryan(notes) the Sergeant Hulka of this team?

18. New York Jets: How much better would the Jets be if they’d signed Miles Austin(notes) over the offseason?

19. Jacksonville Jaguars: Does David Garrard(notes) define “destiny” as “playing really lousy opponents on a regular basis”?

20. Carolina Panthers: After a relatively restrained performance in his first start of ’09, will Matt Moore(notes) become the latest quarterback to air it out against the Pats?

21. Houston Texans: What was all that garbage we were hearing about Matt Schaub’s(notes) supposed lack of toughness – and after what we saw Sunday, will it finally stop?

22. San Francisco 49ers: Counterintuitive as it sounds, can a No. 1 overall draft pick become Mr. Irrelevant?

23. Seattle Seahawks: If Jim Mora had given a game ball to 49ers counterpart Mike Singletary after Sunday’s game, would linebacker Aaron Curry(notes) have volunteered to deliver it to the visitors’ locker room?

24. Chicago Bears: If the Bears try to trade Lance Briggs(notes) during the offseason, will Sunday’s performance by Jamar Williams(notes) be the impetus?

25. Oakland Raiders: When Justin Fargas(notes) yelled “Let’s get out of this hellhole” following the Raiders’ upset victory over the Steelers at Heinz Field, was he blasting this on his iPod?

26. Buffalo Bills: Who’s less ready for Prime Time – the Bills or this Bill, circa 1976.

27. Washington Redskins: What does it say about this franchise that Jason Campbell’s(notes) 367 passing yards against the Saints represent the team’s highest single-game total in a decade?

28. Kansas City Chiefs: What was more noteworthy on Sunday – Tamba Hali’s(notes) three-sack effort or his three-word postgame interview session?

29. Detroit Lions: What, exactly, is the point of trotting out an injured Matthew Stafford(notes) for a 2-12 team?

30. St. Louis Rams: If you run 34 of 65 plays inside the opponent’s territory and come away with nine points, how atrocious is your offense?

31. Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Yo, Raheem Morris and Greg Olson – when your rookie quarterback throws five interceptions inside the red zone, do you think it might be a decent idea to run the ball a bit more down there?

32. Cleveland Browns: If I’d told you in August that Chargers fullback Mike Tolbert(notes) would score on a 66-yard touchdown pass this season, what percentage of you would have been able to predict which opponent it would come against?

shank
12-08-2009, 06:37 PM
shoulda tackled him.

Ravage!!!
12-08-2009, 06:39 PM
Who's Danver?

honz
12-08-2009, 06:41 PM
shoulda tackled him.

Should have at least touched him to save face.

Brand
12-08-2009, 06:47 PM
I am enthused that the Patriots' era may be seriously changing. If you look at that division, the Pats long had an easy 6 in a season just like Indy did. But now, those "other guys" are begining to get temselves a few players. It is possible that the Broncos could play the Pats in round 1 in NE. I do believe the Broncos could win that game, if the team showed up.....

Vrabel had his time, now he should move on. And I "salute" him, too.....


For the record, Vrabel wasn't near the play. It was Williams who was the closest to Moreno.....

dogfish
12-08-2009, 07:26 PM
“I was frustrated,” Vrabel told Kansas City Star columnist Jason Whitlock after the game. “I’ve been on the other end of one of those [blowout victories] and it’s a lot of fun. Well, now I’ve been on the other side, and it’s not good.”


couldn't have happened to a bigger *******-- vrabel is a tremendous doucheknuckle, and he deserves every crappy minute in KC. . . .

TXBRONC
12-08-2009, 07:41 PM
Interesting. It was only two years ago the Patriots were going for it on 4th down week in and week out. Yet when players from opposing teams complained they were told stop whinning and just stop them if you can.

Hey Vrabel it stings when the shoes is on the other foot doesn't it?

WTE
12-08-2009, 07:41 PM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

Day1BroncoFan
12-08-2009, 07:53 PM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

You won't win so why bother to show. :elefant:

UnderArmour
12-08-2009, 07:54 PM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

Maybe in Denver. The Chargers may be hot, but they have the Cowboys, Bengals, and Titans. And with the way the Redskins have been playing, all it takes is an upset in Indy along with taking some winnable games and Denver could very well be on its way to the AFC West title.

Ravage!!!
12-08-2009, 11:00 PM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

you can't believe it? McDaniels learned from Belicheck. If you get classless, you know where he got it. :coffee:

WARHORSE
12-08-2009, 11:19 PM
Someone should quote him from his own mouth during those years of blatant arrogance in NE.

Stick your finger where the sun dont shine Vrabel. No one wants to hear you complain about coming to your senses.


Look at Belichick now. Hes so fly he doesnt need to punt on fourth down.


My o my how the mighty have fallen.........:coffee:


That being said, we shoulda kicked the fieldgoal.

No sense getting full of ourselves. I hope Bowlen addresses it.

BroncoWave
12-08-2009, 11:37 PM
Someone should quote him from his own mouth during those years of blatant arrogance in NE.

Stick your finger where the sun dont shine Vrabel. No one wants to hear you complain about coming to your senses.


Look at Belichick now. Hes so fly he doesnt need to punt on fourth down.


My o my how the mighty have fallen.........:coffee:


That being said, we shoulda kicked the fieldgoal.

No sense getting full of ourselves. I hope Bowlen addresses it.

Disagree with the last part. The way I see it, kicking the FG runs up the score, going for it runs down the clock. Just so happens Moreno made a good play and scored there.

KCL
12-09-2009, 12:28 AM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

:lol:

honz
12-09-2009, 01:19 AM
We weren't running up the score, we were trying to run down the clock and get the game over with. Does 4 points really matter when we are already up by 20 some points...besides they had a chance to run "down" the score since we gave them a chance to stop us from scoring any points at all.

outdoor_miner
12-09-2009, 01:31 AM
We weren't running up the score, we were trying to run down the clock and get the game over with. Does 4 points really matter when we are already up by 20 some points...besides they had a chance to run "down" the score since we gave them a chance to stop us from scoring any points at all.

Exactly. Running on fourth down does not equal running up the score. It's not like McD called a play-action pass or ran a flea-flicker. What's the point of kicking a field goal? If the shoe were on the other foot, I can honestly say I would not have a problem with a team running on 4th down if they were up big. This is professional football, and pro players should not be handled with kiddie gloves.

BCJ
12-09-2009, 02:42 AM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

funny KCL needs to give you hi five. One troll to another. That wasnt runnin gup the score. Situation called for it. Maybe go for a long field goal. Then the score is 40-13 and Chiefs still suck. Vrabel is stuck in hell in KC or he can retire. Even at 34, he is one of the best they got.
Plus, KC could have helped their own cause by not playing offense. Seems those turnovers were nicely gift wrapped in Chiefs end of the field. Better off punting on first down.

Iron Horse72
12-09-2009, 03:24 AM
Running up the score? What were we suppose to do, stop trying?

Timmy!
12-09-2009, 03:36 AM
:bncry::bncry::bncry::bncry::bncry::bncry:

:heh:

Northman
12-09-2009, 06:56 AM
They run up scores in College all the time. You would think players are use to that by now. I want my team to win whether its by 1 point or 50. I never had a problem with the Pats running it up and sure as hell dont have a problem with Denver doing it.

KCL
12-09-2009, 07:06 AM
funny KCL needs to give you hi five. One troll to another. That wasnt runnin gup the score. Situation called for it. Maybe go for a long field goal. Then the score is 40-13 and Chiefs still suck. Vrabel is stuck in hell in KC or he can retire. Even at 34, he is one of the best they got.
Plus, KC could have helped their own cause by not playing offense. Seems those turnovers were nicely gift wrapped in Chiefs end of the field. Better off punting on first down.

I thought giving high5s were allowed...:confused: I have been posting with
WTE for years..funny that high5 must have bothered you or you wouldn't have mentioned it...and you don't know me,I am far from being a troll...WTE on the other hand...yep he's a troll..and in fact I think I will go find another one of his post so I can give him another high5...:beer:

claymore
12-09-2009, 07:32 AM
I thought giving high5s were allowed...:confused: I have been posting with
WTE for years..funny that high5 must have bothered you or you wouldn't have mentioned it...and you don't know me,I am far from being a troll...WTE on the other hand...yep he's a troll..and in fact I think I will go find another one of his post so I can give him another high5...:beer:

You listen her LADY......... Vrabel has disgraced the game, my kid saw the "Finger", and he's still crying. He's never seen such potty talk on a football field.

EastCoastBronco
12-09-2009, 07:44 AM
couldn't have happened to a bigger *******-- vrabel is a tremendous doucheknuckle, and he deserves every crappy minute in KC. . . .

I bet he's wishing he'd retired like Bruschi did...;-)

Dirk
12-09-2009, 07:48 AM
Well....their defense could have stopped him.

Just sayin'

Mike
12-09-2009, 09:21 AM
I can't believe the Donks were running up the score.

Classless!!

We'll see your team in Foxboro in January.

IF....you win your division.

KCL
12-09-2009, 12:12 PM
You listen her LADY......... Vrabel has disgraced the game, my kid saw the "Finger", and he's still crying. He's never seen such potty talk on a football field.

He didn't disgrace the game...the Chiefs did.

claymore
12-09-2009, 12:14 PM
He didn't disgrace the game...the Chiefs did.

Our aerial attack was far to much for you guys. Just forfeit next time!

KCL
12-09-2009, 12:16 PM
Our aerial attack was far to much for you guys. Just forfeit next time!

well claymore I'm not in charge of the team....but maybe I will suggest that to them.

TXBRONC
12-09-2009, 12:17 PM
IF....you win your division.

When I saw his post I thought the same thing.

Buff
12-09-2009, 12:23 PM
There is no such thing as running up the score in pro football. The other guys are getting paid to stop you, if they can't do it--too bad.

Now, when you're talking about amateurs (college, high school, etc.) then I think you have to be a little bit more careful not to rub it in against an inferior group.

KCL
12-09-2009, 12:29 PM
There is no such thing as running up the score in pro football. The other guys are getting paid to stop you, if they can't do it--too bad.

Now, when you're talking about amateurs (college, high school, etc.) then I think you have to be a little bit more careful not to rub it in against an inferior group.

I agree..I have no problem with a team scoring as many points as they can but I remember when the Pats beat the Titans this season scoring over 50 points and shutting the Titans out...there were several Bronco fans (not saying you were one of them Buff) complaining that they were running up the score and called it classless.

TXBRONC
12-09-2009, 12:58 PM
There is no such thing as running up the score in pro football. The other guys are getting paid to stop you, if they can't do it--too bad.

Now, when you're talking about amateurs (college, high school, etc.) then I think you have to be a little bit more careful not to rub it in against an inferior group.

Whether we agree or not about running up the score the real issue is why is Vrabel bitching about it? Just two years ago he was on a team that did the exact same thing routinely. He was yucking it up when the Patriots were doing it so he didn't have any reason the complain.

The Glue Factory
12-09-2009, 01:04 PM
I agree..I have no problem with a team scoring as many points as they can but I remember when the Pats beat the Titans this season scoring over 50 points and shutting the Titans out...there were several Bronco fans (not saying you were one of them Buff) complaining that they were running up the score and called it classless.

And 45 of those 50 points were scored in the first half! That's not running up the score. That's the Titans playing competitively at pop warner level!

http://www.nfl.com/scores/2009/REG6
http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2009101810/2009/REG6/titans@patriots/analyze/box-score

Broncogator
12-09-2009, 08:49 PM
couldn't have happened to a bigger *******-- vrabel is a tremendous doucheknuckle, and he deserves every crappy minute in KC. . . .

After coming from Pittsburgh as a scrub, I guess he got a big head after catching TD's with Billishit....Whaaaaaaa! Douchenozzel!

rcsodak
12-10-2009, 12:40 AM
Interesting. It was only two years ago the Patriots were going for it on 4th down week in and week out. Yet when players from opposing teams complained they were told stop whinning and just stop them if you can.

Hey Vrabel it stings when shoes other foot doesn't it?

I'm curious...

which is better...does it 'look' better if the team trots out there to kick a FG?

or

Bypass 'sure points' and allow the defense to stop them?

Seems to me, the latter is most always the way most teams go.

Ravage!!!
12-10-2009, 01:02 AM
The situation dictates the sportsmanship of it.

Kicking the FG when you are close instead of going for it on 4th down is ALWAYS the way to go. Kicking a FG isn't running up the score, but going for it on fourth down appears as though you are EFFORTING to run up the score.

If you are in FG range, its within the "sport" of the game to kick it. No opposing coach can complain about that, unless you are just in the last minute of the game and you could kneel it instead.

But when you are close to the other team's endzone, and you choose to go for it on fourth down... its as if you are driving to score another TD instead of just "submitting" to a FG.

Belicheck was up by 30 points and went for it on the goalline against Washington.. against Joe Gibbs. One of the classiest coaches in the NFL, and Gibbs absolutely was pissed by the "lack of respect" that Belicheck showed.

I honestly don't want to be that kind of team. I don't know if this was really the same situation. But when you have a big lead going into the last of the game, going for it on fourth is walking a tight rope.

Kicking is NEVER wrong when it comes to sportsmanship. Its not the points, its the manner at which they are earned. Its the manner at which they are put up against another team. Its the class WITHIN the game that some just don't seem to understand, and it surprises me.

(but I do know one thing, Vrabel saying a SINGLE tiny word about it is one of the most ironic pieces of drivel I've ever read. Reminds me why I didn't like him as a Patriot)

WARHORSE
12-10-2009, 01:24 AM
Disagree with the last part. The way I see it, kicking the FG runs up the score, going for it runs down the clock. Just so happens Moreno made a good play and scored there.

Agreed.