Interesting Mock

[SmilinAssasSin27]

http://www.drafttek.com/round12008.html

This DraftTek site uses an interesting spin on determining it's mock and uses value ratios for each pick. Kinda neat.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

It gives us:

1-Kenny Phillips, S, Miami (FL)
2-Shawn Crable, OLB, Michigan
4a-Nick Hayden, DT, Wisconsin
4b-Darry Beckwith, ILB, LSU
5a-Pedro Sosa, OG, Rutgers
5b-Allen Patrick, RB, Oklahoma

[CoachChaz]

Has Beckwith declared? If so, I'd love to get him in the 4th.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

ACTUALLY...Beckwith said last night he's staying put.

[CoachChaz]

ACTUALLY...Beckwith said last night he's staying put.

Good call on his part.

[BigDaddyBronco]

I thought Crable was a tweener? Good for a 3-4 OLB. Help me out.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

That's what some are saying, but it's not like he can't play in a 4-3.

Shawn Crable 6-5 241 40-Time: 4.65

Strengths:
Has excellent size and a big frame with long arms...Very athletic...Fantastic timed speed...Nice quickness and agility...Strong and powerful...Terrific pass rusher and blitzer...Makes a lot of plays behind the line...Offers some versatility...He does an adequate job in coverage...Still improving and has upside...Had a big senior year.

Weaknesses:
Does not have a great motor...Work ethic has been questioned...Intelligence may be a concern...Slow to read and react...Needs to play with better leverage...Was only a starter for two seasons...Sub par ball skills...Pass rush repertoire is limited.

Notes:
Was a highly-regarded recruit coming out of the prep ranks...He could project to a 4-3 (SAM) or 3-4 scheme...A real interesting prospect with a unique set of physical tools...Presents a rare combination of production and triangle numbers...Talented but may need to be pushed in order to fulfill his potential...May have played out of position in college...His best fit might be a pass rushing outside linebacker in a 3-4.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Sounds like he has great natural ability with no head on his shoulders. I would pass.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

I like him, but am not sold on who this draft got for us...more intrigued on how they rate/pick/assess the players overall.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Newest version has us taking:

1-Kentwan Balmer, DT, North Carolina
2-Anthony Collins, OT, Kansas
4a-Geno Hayes, OLB, Florida State
4b-Tom Zbikowski, SS, Notre Dame
5a-Spencer Larsen, ILB, Arizona
5b-DaJuan Morgan, FS, NC State...way late for him
7-Adamm Oliver, DE, Georgia Tech

[CoachChaz]

With the exception of Zbikowksi, I owuldn't mind that one

[SmilinAssasSin27]

I'm no fan of Tom Z, but in the 4th...I wouldn't be that upset.

[BeefStew25]

Geno Hayes is a criminal, no?

[lex]

That's what some are saying, but it's not like he can't play in a 4-3.

Shawn Crable 6-5 241 40-Time: 4.65

Strengths:
Has excellent size and a big frame with long arms...Very athletic...Fantastic timed speed...Nice quickness and agility...Strong and powerful...Terrific pass rusher and blitzer...Makes a lot of plays behind the line...Offers some versatility...He does an adequate job in coverage...Still improving and has upside...Had a big senior year.

Weaknesses:
Does not have a great motor...Work ethic has been questioned...Intelligence may be a concern...Slow to read and react...Needs to play with better leverage...Was only a starter for two seasons...Sub par ball skills...Pass rush repertoire is limited.

Notes:
Was a highly-regarded recruit coming out of the prep ranks...He could project to a 4-3 (SAM) or 3-4 scheme...A real interesting prospect with a unique set of physical tools...Presents a rare combination of production and triangle numbers...Talented but may need to be pushed in order to fulfill his potential...May have played out of position in college...His best fit might be a pass rushing outside linebacker in a 3-4.

I think his biggest weakness is breaking down and tackling a back with a little wiggle. I saw this first hand at the Michigan-Northwestern game. He's still not bad though.

[lex]

Newest version has us taking:

1-Kentwan Balmer, DT, North Carolina
2-Anthony Collins, OT, Kansas
4a-Geno Hayes, OLB, Florida State
4b-Tom Zbikowski, SS, Notre Dame
5a-Spencer Larsen, ILB, Arizona
5b-DaJuan Morgan, FS, NC State...way late for him
7-Adamm Oliver, DE, Georgia Tech

No way. If we take Balmer at 12, Im going to be breaking stuff.

[CoachChaz]

I have to question Crable and Adams a bit. Obviously someone on that defense had to stand out, but does that mean they are solid players? We'll see.

[CoachChaz]

No way. If we take Balmer at 12, Im going to be breaking stuff.

Move back, add a 2nd and take Balmer later in the 1st.

[Slick]

Cool draft site, thanks for posting. It said the next update would be the 5th. I saw they had Owen Schmitt going to the Cowboys after both of our fourth round picks.

If he's there in the 4th and we don't pull the trigger, I'm pulling an Elvis on my new LCD.

[lex]

Move back, add a 2nd and take Balmer later in the 1st.


Truly, I worry about Balmers bust factor. He had one good year in college. This worries me.

[CoachChaz]

Truly, I worry about Balmers bust factor. He had one good year in college. This worries me.

I think that is a risk that is taken with alot of players. Some pan out...others don't.

[lex]

I think that is a risk that is taken with alot of players. Some pan out...others don't.


Perhaps but when a player is good for 2 or 3 years it means more than a guy having one good year in college and then hitting the jackpot. Imagine if McCauley would have turned pro a year earlier than he did? He struggled his last year in college with so much fanfare. He's not the only one. It happens and I think the risk factor comes with a guy with one good year under his belt. Pat Sims is similar in this regard but the fact that he is slotted for the 2nd makes it hurt less if he is a bust.

[CoachChaz]

Perhaps but when a player is good for 2 or 3 years it means more than a guy having one good year in college and then hitting the jackpot. Imagine if McCauley would have turned pro a year earlier than he did? He struggled his last year in college with so much fanfare. He's not the only one. It happens and I think the risk factor comes with a guy with one good year under his belt. Pat Sims is similar in this regard but the fact that he is slotted for the 2nd makes it hurt less if he is a bust.

Yeah, but Balmer is one of those guys in the situation of Calais Campbell. He may not be great right away, but the talent and potential is undeniable. That being said, do we want a "project" guy in round one or do we want someone that can contribute immediately. Depends on the outlook.

[lex]

Yeah, but Balmer is one of those guys in the situation of Calais Campbell. He may not be great right away, but the talent and potential is undeniable. That being said, do we want a "project" guy in round one or do we want someone that can contribute immediately. Depends on the outlook.

Absolutely not. If we're taking a project, we might as well grab a DT later. We are really young on the DLine as it is. We'd just be extending the learning curve out that much further when we kind of need a jolt from whoever we draft. I think Laws is a better player and he is slotted for the 2nd. I wouldnt even mind Pressley instead. If its true that Detroit is willing to cut Shaun Rogers, Im all for offering a 4th.

[CoachChaz]

Absolutely not. If we're taking a project, we might as well grab a DT later. We are really young on the DLine as it is. We'd just be extending the learning curve out that much further when we kind of need a jolt from whoever we draft. I think Laws is a better player and he is slotted for the 2nd. I wouldnt even mind Pressley instead. If its true that Detroit is willing to cut Shaun Rogers, Im all for offering a 4th.

I do not disagree. Unfortunately, strange things tend to go through Shanny's head on draft day.

[SoCalBronco]

I've seen a couple of mocks that had us grabbing Clady at #12 & Mayo in the second.

that would be a sweet day one if You ask me.

Addresses the top two NEED positions.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

No way. If we take Balmer at 12, Im going to be breaking stuff.

Balmer could easily be a Merriman type once the combine comes along. People laughed at me for wanting huim in round 1 when he came out...then he zipped right past where we were picking and went top 10. Just cuz a player is projected at 1 spot now, does not mean he'll end up there.

[lex]

Balmer could easily be a Merriman type once the combine comes along. People laughed at me for wanting huim in round 1 when he came out...then he zipped right past where we were picking and went top 10. Just cuz a player is projected at 1 spot now, does not mean he'll end up there.


Id rather draft Laws or someone not slotted so high. Again, I worry about the bust factor with Balmer.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Took this from a guy at KFFL.com forums....... He used a computer to figure the drafting similar to what the BCS does to pick bowl games.

Yes I said computers so I owe you an explanation.

I am actively collecting player rankings (of 100+ players) and completed 5+ round mock drafts. So far I have thirteen and sixteen of them respectively. The database has 1400 eligible players, 950 of which have been ranked.

After cleaning up the data I create a base score for each players, an estimate of team needs by position and after I calibrate the BPA/need trade-off I come up with a ranking of players for each team. The way I score things it is easier for scores to move rapidly up than rapidly down.

A major deficiency arises as drafts/rankings become out of date quickly on certain players (Woodson, Ikegwuonu etc). Secondly I have not yet been able to subdivide position into skill sets so I can match players to teams better. Thirdly a draft choice in the first round has equal weight in the team needs score as a draft choice in the seventh round. Finally I accept the premise that on average the mocks have evaluated team needs fairly.

Using the rankings and the policy not to repeat positions I finished a three round mock. Keep in mind it is completely data driven and not my own mock.

1. Miami - Glenn Dorsey
2. St Louis - Chris Long
3. Atlanta - Darren McFadden
4. Oakland - Sedrick Ellis
5. Kansas City - Jake Long
6. NY Jets - Matt Ryan
7. New England (from San Francisco) - Dan Connor
8. Baltimore - Brian Brohm
9. Cincinnati - Calais Campbell
10. New Orleans - Kenny Phillips
11. Buffalo - Keith Rivers
12. Denver - Jonathan Stewart
13. Carolina - Andre Woodson
14. Chicago - Ryan Clady
15. Detroit - Vernon Gholston
16. Arizona - Mike Jenkins
17. Minnesota - DeSean Jackson
18. Houston - Sam Baker
19. Philadelphia - Derrick Harvey
20. Tampa Bay - Malcolm Kelly
21. Washington - Quentin Groves
22. Dallas (from Cleveland) - Antoine Cason
23. Pittsburgh - Jeff Otah
24. Tennessee - Early Doucet
25. Seattle - Rashard Mendenhall
26. Jacksonville - Lawrence Jackson
27. San Diego - Kentwan Balmer
28. Dallas - Limas Sweed
29. San Francisco (from Indianapolis) - James Hardy
30. Green Bay - Aqib Talib
31. New York Giants - Gosder Cherilus
32. New England - forfeited

33. Miami - Chris Williams
34. St Louis - Reggie Smith
35. Oakland - Adarius Bowman
36. Kansas City - Leodis McKelvin
37. NY Jets - Felix Jones
38. Atlanta - Frank Okam
39. Baltimore - Terrell Thomas
40. San Francisco - Pat Sims
41. New Orleans - Fred Davis
42. Buffalo - Martellus Bennett
43. Denver - Ali Highsmith
44. Carolina - Mario Manningham
45. Chicago - Steve Slaton
46. Detroit - Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie
47. Cincinnati - Martin Rucker
48. Minnesota - John Carlson
49. Atlanta (from Houston) - Barry Richardson
50. Philadelphia - Tracy Porter
51. Arizona - Xavier Adibi
52. Washington - Andre Caldwell
53. Tampa Bay - Joe Flacco
54. Pittsburgh - Roy Schuening
55. Tennessee - Erin Henderson
56. Seattle - Jermichael Finley
57. Cleveland - Jamaal Charles
58. Miami (from San Diego) - Phillip Wheeler
59. Jacksonville - Earl Bennett
60. Indianapolis - Curtis Lofton
61. Green Bay - Chris Johnson
62. Dallas - Ray Rice
63. NY Giants - Jonathan Hefney
64. New England - Justin King

65. Miami - Shawn Crable
66. St Louis - Tony Hills
67. Kansas City - Eric Young
68. New York Jets - Phillip Merling
69. Atlanta - Chad Henne
70. New England (from Oakland) - Mike Hart
71. San Franciso - Bruce Davis
72. Buffalo (from Baltimore) - Steve Justice
73. Buffalo - DJ Hall
74. Minnesota (from Denver) - Erik Ainge
75. Carolina - Anthony Collins
76. Chicago - John David Booty
77. Detroit - Beau Bell
78. Cincinnati - Dre Moore
79. New Orleans - DeJuan Tribble
80. Houston - Craig Steltz
81. Philadelphia - Harry Douglas
82. Arizona - Chris Ellis
83. Minnesota - Branden Albert
84. Tampa Bay - Red Bryant
85. Washington - Brandon Flowers
86. Tennessee - Andre Fluellen
87. Seattle - Carl Nicks
88. Cleveland - DeMario Pressley
89. Pittsburgh - Jack Ikegwuonu
90. Jacksonville - Dwight Lowery
91. Chicago (from San Diego) - Donnie Avery
92. Green Bay - Vince Hall
93. Dallas - Simeon Castille
94. Indianpolis - Oniel Cousins
95. NY Giants - Ezra Butler
96. New England - Jerod Mayo

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Stewart and Highsmith, huh? No thanx

But it is interesting to see what these computer systems come up with.

[MOtorboat]

And they say I need a life...

[BOSSHOGG30]

And they say I need a life...

No you need a woman

[BOSSHOGG30]

Todd McShay
Scouts Inc.
latest Mock

1. Miami Dolphins -- Matt Ryan, QB, Boston College
Record: 1-15 | Needs: OT, DL, ILB, CB, QB
Previous mock selection: Glenn Dorsey, DT, LSU
Assuming for our purposes that the Dolphins are unable to trade down, they will have a difficult decision to make between Ryan, DE Chris Long, OT Jake Long and DT Glenn Dorsey. Either of the Longs makes sense, considering offensive tackle and defensive line are two of the team's biggest needs. Dorsey is considered by many to be the No. 2 player in this year's class, but he's not an ideal fit for a 3-4 defensive scheme and it doesn't make financial sense to spend No. 1-type money on a lineman who will be asked to take up space. That's why Ryan makes a lot of sense.


At the end of the day, it will come down to Bill Parcells' opinion of current Miami QB John Beck, whom the former Dolphins regime drafted in the second round last year. If Parcells thinks he can win with Beck, Jake Long would be the next best option, followed by Chris Long, then Dorsey. If not, Ryan should be the selection. He has all the physical tools of a franchise quarterback and, most importantly, he possesses rare intangibles.



2. St. Louis Rams -- Chris Long, DE, Virginia
Record: 3-13 | Needs: DE, G/OT, CB, OLB, WR
Previous mock selection: Same
The season-ending injury to perennial Pro Bowl tackle Orlando Pace and the Rams' overall poor play along the offensive line in 2007-08 make Jake Long a possibility with this pick. But assuming Pace returns to form, the Rams have a much bigger need along the interior of their offensive line, and tackle can be addressed in free agency or in later rounds of the draft.

Don't be surprised, then, if St. Louis goes with the other Long at No. 2. Chris is not a prototypical edge rusher, but he is a dominant playmaker with rare versatility and a motor that never quits. The Rams could solidify their defensive line for years to come by teaming him with last year's first-round selection, DT Adam Carriker.


3. Atlanta Falcons** -- Darren McFadden*, RB, Arkansas
Record: 4-12 | Needs: QB, OT, DT, RB, S
Previous mock selection: Matt Ryan, QB, Boston College
Ryan should be the Falcons' selection if he is available, but if he is not, Atlanta will have to make a difficult decision among McFadden, Dorsey and Jake Long. The team has needs at all three positions, so this would be tough choice. McFadden is the top prospect on most teams' draft boards, though, so it is easy to envision this scenario playing out. McFadden could provide the type of offensive boost for the Falcons that Adrian Peterson gave the Vikings last season. That type of potential is tough to pass up.


4. Oakland Raiders** -- Glenn Dorsey, DT, LSU
Record: 4-12 | Needs: OT, DT, WR, DE, RB
Previous mock selection: Darren McFadden*, RB, Arkansas
The Raiders are financially strapped and will not want to dish out top-five money one year after selecting QB JaMarcus Russell with the top overall pick. If McFadden still is on the board, don't count out a blockbuster trade by owner Al Davis, since Cowboys owner and Arkansas alum Jerry Jones already has made his interest known. If Oakland is stuck here with McFadden gone, it will need to choose between Dorsey and Jake Long. While Long is worth the pick, Dorsey is the higher-rated player. He could provide the type of interior disruption the Raiders' defense has been lacking and fill in nicely for Warren Sapp, who announced his retirement following the 2007 season.


5. Kansas City Chiefs** -- Jake Long, OT, Michigan
Record: 4-12 | Needs: OT, DE, C, WR, CB
Previous mock selection: Same
Quarterback still is a question mark, but the Chiefs' No. 1 priority this offseason should be solidifying their offensive front. Long is unquestionably the most dominant offensive lineman in the 2008 class and could help Kansas City achieve its goal in a hurry. He has the versatility to play either right or left tackle, and his combination of size, technique, athletic ability and a mean streak would improve the Chiefs' line almost immediately.


6. New York Jets -- Vernon Gholston*, DE, Ohio State
Record: 4-12 | Needs: WR, NT, OLB, ILB, G
Projected pick: Same
This could be a bit of a reach for Gholston, who flashes top-10 talent in some games (three sacks against Michigan this season) but disappears in too many others. However, don't be surprised if he works his way into the top 10 simply because this year's crop of elite edge rushers does not meet the level of demand. That said, Gholston is one of the premier pass-rushing prospects in the 2008 class, and he would be the right fit as a rush linebacker in the Jets' 3-4 scheme.




7. N.E. Patriots (from 5-11 San Francisco) -- Leodis McKelvin, CB, Troy
Record: 18-1 | Needs: ILB, CB, OLB, OL depth
Previous mock selection: Mike Jenkins, CB, South Florida
The Patriots would like to inject some youth at inside linebacker, but there isn't a player worth selecting this high, with USC's Rey Maualuga and Ohio State's James Laurinaitis both returning to school in the fall. The next priority is to find a replacement for Asante Samuel, a free agent who can't be franchised for a second consecutive year. McKelvin currently is the top-rated cornerback in a 2008 crop that is deep but lacks elite talent atop the board. As always, look for the Patriots to shop this pick heavily.


8. Baltimore Ravens -- Sedrick Ellis, DT, USC
Record: 5-11 | Needs: CB, QB, OLB, LOT, DT
Previous mock selection: Brian Brohm, QB, Louisville
Baltimore would like to use this pick to put an end to a seemingly endless pursuit for a franchise quarterback. Unfortunately, there isn't one worth selecting here with Ryan off the board. Instead, the Ravens could go with the best value on the board (Ellis) or fill a hole at either cornerback (Mike Jenkins) or left tackle (Ryan Clady). Knowing the Ravens' draft-day discipline, Ellis will be the pick in this scenario.




9. Cincinnati Bengals -- Derrick Harvey*, DE, Florida
Record: 7-9 | Needs: DT, LB, OT, DE, TE
Previous mock selection: Sedrick Ellis, DT, USC
The Bengals have a much bigger need for interior help, but if Dorsey and Ellis are gone, there isn't a defensive tackle worth drafting at No. 9. Harvey is a bit of a reach here, but coach Marvin Lewis' defense is starving for potential playmakers, and Harvey possesses the pass-rushing skills and frame to develop into an impact starter in the NFL.




10. New Orleans Saints -- Mike Jenkins, CB, South Florida
Record: 7-9 | Needs: CB, MLB, DT, OLB, TE
Previous mock selection: Kentwan Balmer, DT, North Carolina
Cornerback and linebacker are the Saints' biggest areas of need, and Jenkins is the best athlete available at those positions. His combination of size, speed and athleticism is outstanding, and his recognition skills continue to improve each season. Jenkins also brings versatility to the table, since he can play some safety and chip in on returns. If New Orleans uses this pick on a corner, it should find much better value at linebacker early in Round 2.




11. Buffalo Bills -- Malcolm Kelly*, WR, Oklahoma
Record: 7-9 | Needs: WR, CB, TE, LB, DT
Previous mock selection: DeSean Jackson*, WR, California
Kelly is the type of big receiver the Bills need as a complement to current wideout Lee Evans. Kelly is unusually fluid for a bigger wideout and he might have the strongest hands of any player in the 2008 draft. However, Jackson could join forces with RB Marshawn Lynch to give Buffalo one of the most exciting young offensive skill groups in the NFL.


12. Denver Broncos -- Ryan Clady*, OT, Boise State
Record: 7-9 | Needs: OT, DT, S, MLB, G
Previous mock selection: Same
Clady still is improving his strength, but he possesses impressive feet to go along with his enormous wingspan and huge frame. He would be an ideal fit in Denver's famed zone-blocking scheme and give a boost to the Broncos' running game.


13. Carolina Panthers -- Chris Williams, OT, Vanderbilt
Record: 7-9 | Needs: QB, DE, OT, WR, OLB
Previous mock selection: Calais Campbell*, DE, Miami
Instead of drafting a young signal-caller who will need time to develop, look for the Panthers to bring in veteran competition for current QB Matt Moore, who showed some positive signs late in the season. Drafting a defensive end like Campbell to fill a need is a possibility, but don't be surprised if the team looks to fill a hole at offensive tackle, where Travelle Wharton and Jordan Gross are set to become free agents.


14. Chicago Bears -- Brian Brohm, QB, Louisville
Record: 7-9 | Needs: QB, LOT, DT, G, RB
Previous mock selection: Andre' Woodson, QB, Kentucky
The Bears will have a tough decision to make if Brohm still is available at No. 14. There has been a lot of talk about the Bears going in a different direction with this pick, including offensive and defensive tackle. And while that makes a lot of sense, I still wouldn't rule out Brohm just yet. His stock is likely to soar between now and April's draft because he should impress scouts with his overall passing efficiency and football intelligence during the combine and individual workouts.


15. Detroit Lions -- Aqib Talib*, CB, Kansas
Record: 7-9 | Needs: ROT, G, CB, S, DE
Projected pick: Same
The Lions will be selecting outside of the top 10 for the first time since 2001, and now the trick is to find quality players this far down the line. The Lions' secondary is undermanned and would welcome the services of Talib, who is a versatile, fluid athlete with excellent size and ball skills. His elite athleticism was on display when returned an interception 100 yards for a touchdown this season, and he also saw some snaps on offense.


16. Arizona Cardinals -- Rashard Mendenhall*, RB, Illinois
Record: 8-8 | Needs: CB, OLB, TE, RB, DE
Previous mock selection: Jonathan Stewart*, RB, Oregon
The Cardinals have more pressing needs on the other side of the ball -- defensive tackle and cornerback -- but there isn't an available player at those positions who is as valuable as Mendenhall. He has the size, burst and versatility to eventually develop into an every-down starter. In the meantime, Mendenhall and Edgerrin James would make a heck of a 1-2 punch for the next year or two.


17. Minnesota Vikings -- DeSean Jackson*, WR/RS, California
Record: 8-8 | Needs: DE, WR, S, QB, TE
Previous mock selection: Derrick Harvey*, DE, Florida
Believe it or not, Minnesota still is in the market for help at wide receiver and defensive end, despite investing first- or second-round picks in the past four drafts on WRs Troy Williamson (2005) and Sidney Rice (2007), and DEs Kenechi Udeze (2004) and Erasmus James (2005). Jackson still has room to improve as a route runner, and he must get stronger in order to endure a grueling 16-game NFL schedule, but his home run ability after the catch, on vertical routes and on punt returns will be tempting for teams drafting in the top 20 overall.


18. Houston Texans -- Jonathan Stewart*, RB, Oregon
Record: 8-8 | Needs: CB, RB, WR, S, LOT, G
Previous mock selection: Kenny Phillips*, S, Miami
The Texans need a featured back to go along with QB Matt Schaub and WR Andre Johnson, and Stewart has the bulk, burst and versatility to quickly fill that role. He also could offer a boost in the kickoff return game.

[BOSSHOGG30]

19. Philadelphia Eagles -- Calais Campbell*, DE, Miami
Record: 8-8 | Needs: WR, TE, DE, OT/G, S, LB
Previous mock selection: Malcolm Kelly*, WR, Oklahoma
Philadelphia OTs Jon Runyan and William Thomas aren't getting any younger, so Pittsburgh OT Jeff Otah is a possibility here. The Eagles also are in search of a home run threat at wide receiver, so don't count out Michigan's Mario Manningham. However, there aren't that many 6-foot-8, 280-pound defensive ends with Campbell's athleticism coming out of the college ranks these days, so don't be surprised if the Eagles take a flyer on this unpolished but supremely talented end.


20. Tampa Bay Buccaneers -- Mario Manningham*, WR, Michigan
Record: 9-7 | Needs: WR, OT, OLB, CB, QB
Previous mock selection: Sam Baker, OT, USC
Coach John Gruden will be pressing general manager Bruce Allen for a young playmaker at wide receiver, and Allen knows Manningham is capable of special things in the NFL. If Manningham gets with a coach like Gruden at the next level, he could emerge as the most productive wideout from a very talented 2008 class.




21. Washington Redskins -- Phillip Merling*, DE, Clemson
Record: 9-7 | Needs: WR, DE, S, OT, CB
Previous mock selection: Limas Sweed, WR, Texas
Sweed is a possibility here since wide receiver is on the short list of big needs for the Redskins, but Merling is a fast-rising junior prospect who is shooting up the draft boards of many NFL teams. The more we study film of him, the more we like his combination of size (6-4, 275), power and agility, and his ability to get into opposing backfields. Merling has the tools to become an impact starter in the next couple of seasons and would fill an area of need for Washington.


22. Dallas Cowboys (from 10-6 Cleveland) -- Sam Baker, OT, USC
Record: 13-3 | Needs: CB, WR, OT, RB, ILB
Previous mock selection: Mario Manningham*, WR, Michigan
Assuming owner Jerry Jones doesn't package picks to trade up, expect Dallas to use its two picks to address needs at corner, receiver, offensive tackle and possibly running back. Baker's stock is dropping after an injury-plagued senior season and a mediocre showing at the Senior Bowl, but he possesses the athleticism and technique to surprise a lot of people at the next level.


23. Pittsburgh Steelers -- Jeff Otah, OT, Pittsburgh
Record: 10-6 | Needs: OT, C, DE (3-4), G, RB
Previous mock selection: Same
The Steelers could use two of their first three picks on offensive linemen. They have bigger holes to fill inside, but Otah is far and away the best lineman available in this scenario. Interior help is available for a good value in later rounds (Oregon State G Roy Schuening, and centers Mike Pollak of Arizona State and John Sullivan of Notre Dame).


24. Tennessee Titans -- Limas Sweed, WR, Texas
Record: 10-6 | Needs: WR, CB, TE, WR, OL
Previous mock selection: Early Doucet, WR, LSU
The Titans need to draft a legitimate weapon for QB Vince Young to target in the passing attack, and who would be better than Young's former college teammate? Sweed could slip a bit due to a wrist injury that cut his senior season short and was re-aggravated at the Senior Bowl. However, when Sweed is healthy, he is arguably the most physically gifted receiver in this year's class. The 6-4, 217-pounder is worth the risk, in my opinion.


25. Seattle Seahawks -- Kentwan Balmer, DT, North Carolina
Record: 10-6 | Needs: ROT, DT, RB, TE, G
Previous mock selection: Rashard Mendenhall*, RB, Illinois
It is unlikely current Seattle starting RB Shaun Alexander will ever return to his 2005 MVP form, and backup Maurice Morris has proved to be at his best when limited to a complementary role. However, with McFadden, Stewart and Mendenhall all off the board, look for the Seahawks to go in a different direction here. Balmer is a fast-rising prospect with very good size, power and quickness. He would be a welcome addition to Seattle's thin interior defensive line.


26. Jacksonville Jaguars -- Early Doucet, WR, LSU
Record: 11-5 | Needs: WR, DE, SS, CB
Previous mock selection: Quentin Groves, DE, Auburn
The Jaguars should use this pick on the best available receiver or pass-rusher. Groves will be a possibility if he checks out physically at the combine. Doucet is another solid choice this late in the first round, however. While he is unlikely to emerge as anything more than a No. 2 receiver in the NFL, Doucet possesses the quickness and run-after-catch ability to complement Jacksonville's group of bigger receivers.


27. San Diego Chargers -- Gosder Cherilus, OT, Boston College
Record: 11-5 | Needs: RG/ROT, NT, FB, RB
Previous mock selection: Dan Connor, MLB, Penn State
The Chargers can select the best available athlete if they want, but the right side of their offensive line could use an upgrade, and Cherilus projects as a solid starting right tackle in the NFL. Cherilus' stock is on the rise following his impressive showing at the Senior Bowl.


28. Dallas Cowboys -- Felix Jones*, RB, Arkansas
Record: 13-3 | Needs: CB, WR, OT, ILB, RB
Previous mock selection: Leodis McKelvin, CB, Troy
If owner Jerry Jones can't strike a deal for McFadden, he could settle for Arkansas' other first-round running back prospect. Felix Jones is a speedster who could complement current Dallas RB Marion Barber well and provide a home run threat in the return game.


29. S.F. 49ers (from 13-3 Indianapolis) -- James Hardy*, WR, Indiana
Record: 5-11 | Needs: WR, OT, OLB, DE, QB
Previous mock selection: Same
San Francisco needs a playmaker at wide receiver to take the attention away from TE Vernon Davis and pressure off QB Alex Smith. Hardy comes with some baggage and he needs some polishing, but no receiver in this class possesses a more imposing combination of size and natural athleticism.


30. Green Bay Packers -- Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, CB, Tenn. St.
Record: 13-3 | Needs: CB, OT, S, TE, PT
Previous mock selection: Fred Davis, TE, USC
Packers QB Brett Favre certainly would welcome the addition of a tight end like Davis, who can stretch the seam and generate yards after the catch. However, the team has a more pressing need in the defensive secondary, and Rodgers-Cromartie is one of the fastest-rising prospects in the 2008 class right now. The small-school product proved capable of playing with the big boys at the Senior Bowl, where he demonstrated outstanding versatility and athleticism playing both free safety and cornerback throughout the week.


31. N.E. Patriots -- Pick forfeited
Record: 18-1 | Needs: ILB, CB, OLB, OL depth
Previous mock selection: Same
The Patriots lost this pick as part of the penalty handed down for illegally taping Jets coaches from the sideline in Week 1.


26. New York Giants -- Keith Rivers, OLB, USC
Record: 10-6 | Needs: OLB, CB, S, OT, DT
Previous mock selection: Same
The Giants are in need of an immediate and legitimate upgrade at linebacker, and Rivers is instinctive and athletic enough to contribute immediately on the weak side. They also could use a quick, explosive back who would complement current Giants power back Brandon Jacobs, so keep an eye on this selection.

[lex]

Thats not bad. Kind of surprised to see him having Ellis going at 8 though after the senior bowl and considering the fact that Mayock has him ranked ahead of Dorsey. To his credit, maybe he is trying to seperate what he thinks should be vs what he thinks is more likely to happen.

[Scarface]

Where did you find that mock, Boss? I've never seen him do a mock this early before.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Where did you find that mock, Boss? I've never seen him do a mock this early before.

I put the wrong name down.. sorry... this was Todd McShay's mock from
Scouts Inc..... you can find it on ESPN insider

[Scarface]

I put the wrong name down.. sorry... this was Todd McShay's mock from
Scouts Inc..... you can find it on ESPN insider

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I was looking all over NFL.com to find his mocks. He's never done mocks until the week before the draft. I was kind of hoping he had started early this year. Oh well. :beer:

[atwater27]

I could live with that pick. It fills a glaring need with a quality player with huge upside.

[atwater27]

I am starting to think we should consider a defensive end like Calais Campbell and move Tim Crowder to Tackle. Dude is 6'7" and a monster. The Giants got some tall, rangy defensive ends. They seem to create problems for O-lineman. He had 10.5 sacks last season.

[mclark]

Draftek Mock Draft:

Interesting: Sedrick Ellis #1 overall; we take Balmer with #12 (highest I've seen him go). I see they have Matt Ryan falling to #20 (something that wouldn't surprise me).

They have us taking DaJuan Morgan in the fifth round. Is he going to last that long in the draft?

[broncofanatic1987]

I am starting to think we should consider a defensive end like Calais Campbell and move Tim Crowder to Tackle. Dude is 6'7" and a monster. The Giants got some tall, rangy defensive ends. They seem to create problems for O-lineman. He had 10.5 sacks last season.

We already have a 6'6 1/2" Jarvis Moss. Why move Crowder inside when he's only 275 lbs.?


Newest version has us taking:

1-Kentwan Balmer, DT, North Carolina
2-Anthony Collins, OT, Kansas
4a-Geno Hayes, OLB, Florida State
4b-Tom Zbikowski, SS, Notre Dame
5a-Spencer Larsen, ILB, Arizona
5b-DaJuan Morgan, FS, NC State...way late for him
7-Adamm Oliver, DE, Georgia Tech

Has anybody else noticed that one of our 7th round picks is missing?

I'm fine with the Balmer choice, though I would definitely prefer to take an offensive tackle over him.

On the other hand, Collins is an interesting choice for an OT in the second. ESPN's Scouts, Inc. has his forty time listed as higher than Clady's or Baker's and he's 6'6" 310 lbs. He just might be athletic enough to fit in with the Broncos offense. They don't have analysis available for him at the moment though.

I don't like the idea of Geno Hayes just because he's 223 lbs. If he has to take on blockers, he's not going to fare very well.

Scouts, Inc. gives Zbikowski a grade of 48 which makes him an appropriate pick for the fifth round where DraftTek has us taking Morgan whom Scouts Inc. gives a grade of 52 which makes him more appropriate for where DraftTek has us taking Zibkowski. Switch them up and I'm fine with both.

Larsen has the physical dimensions to fit in with our linebacker corps. Maybe he could earn a back up spot.

Oliver would be camp fodder that would make the practice squad at best.

[atwater27]

We already have a 6'6 1/2" Jarvis Moss. Why move Crowder inside when he's only 275 lbs.?



280 is just fine for a DT

[atwater27]

I am interested in this Jordy Nelson guy. McCaffrey clone?
6' 5, 225, underrated, caught 122 passes!

[lex]

I am interested in this Jordy Nelson guy. McCaffrey clone?
6' 5, 225, underrated, caught 122 passes!

6'3 actually but he is more athletic in that he actually possesses long speed. He could run a 100 m in the 10.6s in high school. Tall, physical, catches with his hands.

[broncofanatic1987]

280 is just fine for a DT

Not when he's playing along side Marcus Thomas who's a penetrator, not a run stuffer. 280 lbs. wasn't good enough for Demetrin Veal. Granted, Crowder probably has more talent than Veal, but that talent has been mostly used at defensive end rather than defensive tackle. It might work in obvious passing situations, but I wouldn't count on it being very effective on running downs. I just don't see the logic in moving Crowder inside permanently. When has he demonstrated the potential to dominate inside or at least to be better inside than he is outside?

[CoachChaz]

Why would we want to waste Crowder's skills by sticking him at a position he's never played?

[BeefStew25]

Why would we want to waste Crowder's skills by sticking him at a position he's never played?

Because you guys are bored off your asses and are running out of things to talk about.

[turftoad]

280 is just fine for a DT

Maybe as a sutuational pass rusher, not for stopping the run.

[atwater27]

We had 350 pounders last season that couldn't stop the run.

[Lonestar]

We had 350 pounders last season that couldn't stop the run.

Huge difference washed up 350+ pounder and a 280 pound newbie.

You need your DT's in the 305-330 range, not fat but muscle to be able to handle the 295-315 centers and 300-350 guards that are beating on them every play, of every game all year.. Simple statement of fact..

[Scarface]

Why would we want to waste Crowder's skills by sticking him at a position he's never played?

For the same reason the Giants line up Justin Tuck at DT for passing downs.

[broncofanatic1987]

For the same reason the Giants line up Justin Tuck at DT for passing downs.


Yeah....Passing Downs. Not every down.

I have no problem with the idea of Crowder or Ekuban moving inside for passing downs.

Just don't try to convince me that it's a good idea for every down.:defense:

[BOSSHOGG30]

Hoog's first for 2008 (3 round, no trades)
(kffl guru)

1. Miami- Jake Long, OT, Michigan
2. St. Louis- Chris Long, DE, Virginia
3. Oakland- Glenn Dorsey, DT, LSU
4. Atlanta- Matt Ryan, QB, B.C.
5. K.C.- Darren McFadden, RB, Ark.
6. NYJ- Ryan Clady, OT, Boise State
7. N.E. (via S.F.)- Keith Rivers, LB, USC
8. Baltimore- Mike Jenkins, DB, S. Florida
9. Cincy- Sedrick Ellis, DT, USC
10. N.O.- Dan Conner, LB, Penn State
11. Buffalo- Vernon Gohlston, DE, Ohio State
12. Denver- Jonathan Stewart, RB, Oregon
13. Carolina- Brian Brohm, QB, Louisville
14. Chicago- Jeff Otah, OL, Pitt.
15. Detroit- Derrick Harvey, DE, Florida
16. Arizona- Calais Campbell, DE, Miami Fla.
17. Minnesota- Aquib Talib, DB, Kansas
18. Houston- Rashard Mendenhall, RB, Illinois
19. Philly- Leodis McKelvin, CB, Troy
20. T.B.- Chris Williams, OT, Vandy
21. Washington- Felix Jones, RB, Ark.
22. Dallas (via Clev.)- DeSean Jackson, WR, California
23. Pitt- Kenny Phillips, DB, Miami Fla.
24. Tenn- Mario Manningham, WR, Michigan
25. Seattle- Pat Simms, DT, Auburn
26. Quinton Groves, DE, Auburn
27. S.D.- Malcolm Kelly, WR, Oklahoma
28. Dallas- Sam Baker, OT, USC
29. SF (via Indy)- Kentwan Balmer, DL, N.C.
30. G.B.- Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie- DB, Tenn State
N.E.- forfeited
31. NYG- Antoine Cason, DB, Arizona

Round 2

32. Miami- Philip Merling, DE, Clemson
33. St. Louis- Gosder Cherilis, OL, B.C.
34. Atlanta- Carl Nicks, OL, Nebraska
35. K.C.- Trevor Laws, DT, N.D.
36. NYJ- Chad Henne, QB, Michigan
37. Oakland- Jamaal Charles, RB, Texas
38. Baltimore- Andre Woodson, QB, Kentucky
39. S.F.- Devin Thomas, WR, Mich State
40. N.O.- Tracy Porter, DB, Indiana
41. Buffalo- Limas Sweed, WR, Texas
42. Denver- Early Doucet, WR, LSU
43. Carolina- Anthony Collins, OT, Kansas
44. Chicago- James Hardy, WR, Indiana
45. Detroit- Patrick Lee, DB, Auburn
46. Cincy- Ali Highsmith, LB, LSU
47. Minn- Chilo Rachal, OL, USC
48. Atlanta (via Houston)- Ray Rice, RB, Rutgers
49. Philly- Fred Davis, TE, USC
50. Arizona- Kevin Smith, RB, C. Florida
51. Washington- Jason Jones, DE, Eastern Mich
52. T.B.- Xavier Adibi, LB, VaTech
53. Pitt- Brandon Albert, OL, Virginia
54. Tenn- Charles Godfrey, CB, Iowa
55. Seattle- Chris Johnson, RB, E. Carolina
56. Cleveland- Shawn Crable, LB, Mich
57. Miami (via S.D.)- Reggie Smith, DB, Oklahoma
58. Jax- Earl Bennett, WR, Vandy
59. Indy- Oniel Cousins, OL, UTEP
60. G.B.- Martell Bennett, TE, Texas A&M
61. Dallas- Terrell Thomas, DB, USC
62. N.E.- DaJuan Morgan, DB, N.C. State
63. NYG- Erin Henderson, LB, Maryland

3rd Round

64. Miami- Joe Flacco, QB, Delaware
65. St. Louis- Roy Schuening, OL, Oregon State
66. K.C.- Eric Young, OL, Tennessee
67. NYJ- Beau Bell, LB, UNLV
68. Atlanta- Dre Moore, DT, Maryland
69. N.E. (via Oakland)- John David Booty, QB, USC
70. S.F.- Dwight Lowery, CB, San Jose State
71. Buffalo (via Balt.)- Trae Williams, DB, S. Florida
72. Buffalo- Frank Okam, DT, TExas
73. Minn (via Denver)- Lawrence Jackson, DE, USC
74. Carolina- Andre Caldwell, WR, Florida
75. Chicago- Quinton Demps, DB, UTEP
76. Detroit- Steve Slaton, RB, WVU
77. Cincy- John Carlson, TE, N.D.
78. N.O.- DeMario Pressley, DT, Maryland
79. Houston- Craig Steltz, DB, LSU
80. Philly- Philip Wheeler, LB, GTech
81. Arizona- Jamaar Adams, DB, Mich
82. Minnesota- Martin Rucker, TE, Mizzou
83. T.B.- Adarius Bowman, WR, Ok. State
84. Wash- Chris Lofton, LB, Oklahoma
85. Tenn- Marcus Griffin, DB, Texas
86. Seattle- Erik Ainge, QB, Tenn
87. Cleveland- Mike McGlynn, OL, Pitt.
88. Pitt.- Bruce Davis, OLB, UCLA
89. Jax- Chris Ellis, DE, VaTech
90. Chicago (via S.D.)- Josh Johnson, QB, University of S.D.
91. G.B.- Lavelle Hawkins, WR, California
92. Dallas- Drew Radovich, OL, USC
93. Indy- Red Bryant, DT, Texas A&M
94. N.E.- Justin King, DB, Penn State
95. NYG- Steve Justice, OL, Wake Forrest

[mclark]

I'm mystified: we're sucking air in the core of our defense: DT, MLB, Safety. We are weak as kittens at OTackle. And we draft a running back and a wide receiver...?

(No trades: So we have Javon Walker, Marshall, Stokeley; with Early Doucett as our #4 receiver. And Ryan Harris and Eric Pears as our starting offensive tackles? What am I missing?)

[MHCBill]

If we go running back and wide reciever with our two picks on the first day I'll be surprised if we win six games next year.

[BOSSHOGG30]

If we go running back and wide reciever with our two picks on the first day I'll be surprised if we win six games next year.

He is probably thinking that Denver will get rid of Walker somehow somewhere down the road as well as Henry. Plus Shanny loves his offense.

[mclark]

If we go running back and wide reciever with our two picks on the first day I'll be surprised if we win six games next year.

I promise: I will puke at least once on draft day; and I'll be an unbelievable bear on this board for a few weeks.

I like both Stewart and Doucett -- I think they have a LOT of talent. But we can't pretend any longer that skill in the trenches doesn't really matter.

[BOSSHOGG30]

I promise: I will puke at least once on draft day; and I'll be an unbelievable bear on this board for a few weeks.

I like both Stewart and Doucett -- I think they have a LOT of talent. But we can't pretend any longer that skill in the trenches doesn't really matter.

I agree... I can understand why he made those picks for Denver, but if Denver was smart they wouldn't waste the 1st two picks of the draft on talent outside of DT and OL.

[lex]

I promise: I will puke at least once on draft day; and I'll be an unbelievable bear on this board for a few weeks.

I like both Stewart and Doucett -- I think they have a LOT of talent. But we can't pretend any longer that skill in the trenches doesn't really matter.

If you go by Shanahans last presser he seems ok with the OLine compared to a lot of people. Couple that with the fact that Ellis and Dorsey will both be gone by the time we pick, and suddenly youre possibly looking at other positions like RB in the first. Once Ellis and Dorsey are gone though, its better to get the guys in the 2nd-4th round where the gap isnt that big (if at all in some cases) and the bust factor is lower. Id take Laws any day over Balmer.

[G_Money]

IMO, Shanny believes that Nalen and Hamilton being back will solidify the line, and that Harris is a future difference-maker.

Nalen AND Hamilton being back would mean that Kuper would be freed up to try for that RT position against Pears, and since most picks on the OL wouldn't start for us in their first year anyway, what's the sense in spending an early pick on one?

If that's the case, I don't expect the Broncos to consider Tackle a position of need. That would make me cry, but that's how I see it.

Shanny didn't sound happy with our LB situation in his year-end presser, and he was dissatisfied with both Henry and Walker.

Sadly, I could see us doing exactly what that mock suggests and going RB/WR with our 1st day picks. Considering the sorts of 3rd and 4th round picks at RB and WR that should still be available, I might be joining mclark in the john heaving my guts out - and then spewing some venom here.

For all that I'm not sold on Non-Ellis/Dorsey DTs in the first round, I do think we can make some quality offensive picks on the second day, while our quality defensive picks have been few and far between.

I'd rather do LB/S or DT on the first day and spend the whole 2nd day on offense than spend the top 2 picks on RB and WR and then spend the whole second day on picks that don't fit us as well.

~G

[Cleveland Rocks]

56. Cleveland- Shawn Crable, LB, Mich
87. Cleveland- Mike McGlynn, OL, Pitt.

Not so good for Cleveland. Draft 1 minor need and 1 non-need. The defense needs all the help it can get. So draft a linebacker who won't start and an offensive lineman who will only be depth and to boot from Pittsburgh. I don't think so. The defensive line needs a major overhaul.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Cleveland needs CB above all else.

[Cleveland Rocks]

Cleveland needs CB above all else.

No.

Eric Wright was drafted last year and is doing very well. Then there is Leigh Bodden who has done admirably. The Browns need a defensive line to stop the run above all else. Ted Washington played 0 games last year and was too old to begin with. Orpheus Roye is too old as well. The defensive line needs to win the game in the trenches by clamping down on the run. Instead of running out of gas because they are old and decrepit.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Yer secondary is awful. I have no ill will towards Cleveland (F Pittsburgh!!!!!), but when you lost games, teams passed on you. Pitt's comeback...Cincy...etc. I'm not saying DL isn't a need, but "admirably" and a potential behavioral problem would worry the crap out of me if I was a Browns fan.

[Cleveland Rocks]

Yer secondary is awful. I have no ill will towards Cleveland (F Pittsburgh!!!!!), but when you lost games, teams passed on you. Pitt's comeback...Cincy...etc. I'm not saying DL isn't a need, but "admirably" and a potential behavioral problem would worry the crap out of me if I was a Browns fan.

Behavior problem?

Bodden? I don't much care about his airport issues. He didn't have a gun and he wasn't blasting it at pregnant women. He was picking someone up at an airport and made a stupid mistake. Everyone makes mistakes. Airport security is very tight and if you so much as fart they are going to send you away for special interrogation (ie someone with a glove....)

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Wright...Bodden was "admirably"

[Cleveland Rocks]

Wright...Bodden was "admirably"

Wright had an issue long ago in college and he got over that. Everyone has skeletons in the closet. No reason to take them out of the closet. I thought you were talking about Bodden and his brush w/ airport security.

[turftoad]

Hey CR, I see Anderson made the Pro Bowl.

[Cleveland Rocks]

Hey CR, I see Anderson made the Pro Bowl.

No real concern. Scott Mitchell did too. Look where he is.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Wright had an issue long ago in college and he got over that. Everyone has skeletons in the closet. No reason to take them out of the closet. I thought you were talking about Bodden and his brush w/ airport security.

Nah...The severity of Wright's skeleton concerns me...or it would if he was a Bronco. All the best to him though if it is truly behind him. I still think CB is necessity. I wouldn't argue against spending ALL of your picks on DL and secondary.

[BOSSHOGG30]

This is what I think Cleveland needs

1) Nose Tackle: someone who can anchor the defensive line for that 3-4 defense

2) two outside linebackers: McGinest is getting old and Peeks is a back up starting

3) Defensive end opposite of Wimbley

4) RB to mold behind Jamal Lewis.... he can't play much longer... better prepare for the future.

5) Depth for the o-line and d-line, as well as depth for cornerback

[Cleveland Rocks]

This is what I think Cleveland needs

1) Nose Tackle: someone who can anchor the defensive line for that 3-4 defense

2) two outside linebackers: McGinest is getting old and Peeks is a back up starting

3) Defensive end opposite of Wimbley

4) RB to mold behind Jamal Lewis.... he can't play much longer... better prepare for the future.

5) Depth for the o-line and d-line, as well as depth for cornerback

Wimbley is a linebacker. The Browns run a 3-4. McGinnest is the other starting outside linebacker. His backup is Peek. They alternate. Nose Tackle is on the defensive line something I mentioned was a need. Jamal Lewis has two viable backups in Wright and Harrison.

[Cleveland Rocks]

This is what Cleveland needs:

1) Nose Tackle: Washington should retire and Shaun Smith/Ethan Kelly are not starting material. Maybe somebody like Albert Haynesworth who is a FA if memory is right.

2) Defensive End opposite Robaire Smith.

3) Linebacker: somebody to take McGinest's job. I think Terrell Suggs is a FA and he would be an ideal player for the position.

4) Wide Reciever: Somebody to act as a slot reciever. Edwards and Jurevicius are not enough. Cribbs is fine on the occasional trick play and as a deep threat. But not as a normal everyday reciever. There needs to be a viable option other than Winslow (TE), Edwards and Jurevicius (WR).

That's about it. The offensive line is fine the way it is as are TE. The Browns desperately need to improve that defense and OLB, DE, NT are the most glaring needs.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Wimbley is a linebacker. The Browns run a 3-4. McGinnest is the other starting outside linebacker. His backup is Peek. They alternate. Nose Tackle is on the defensive line something I mentioned was a need. Jamal Lewis has two viable backups in Wright and Harrison.

I've seen Wimbley used at DE many times.

I've seen Wimbley at DE, Peek at one outside backer and McGinest as the other backer. Wright and Harrison are backups... not starters. I think I mentioned you need to groom the future RB for when Lewis leaves.

[turftoad]

This is what Cleveland needs:

1) Nose Tackle: Washington should retire and Shaun Smith/Ethan Kelly are not starting material. Maybe somebody like Albert Haynesworth who is a FA if memory is right.

2) Defensive End opposite Robaire Smith.

3) Linebacker: somebody to take McGinest's job. I think Terrell Suggs is a FA and he would be an ideal player for the position.
4) Wide Reciever: Somebody to act as a slot reciever. Edwards and Jurevicius are not enough. Cribbs is fine on the occasional trick play and as a deep threat. But not as a normal everyday reciever. There needs to be a viable option other than Winslow (TE), Edwards and Jurevicius (WR).

That's about it. The offensive line is fine the way it is as are TE. The Browns desperately need to improve that defense and OLB, DE, NT are the most glaring needs.

Looks like Balt is going to tag Suggs.

[Cleveland Rocks]

I've seen Wimbley used at DE many times.

I've seen Wimbley at DE, Peek at one outside backer and McGinest as the other backer. Wright and Harrison are backups... not starters. I think I mentioned you need to groom the future RB for when Lewis leaves.

Due to injuries. Towards the end of the year the Browns were left with one viable backup for the entire defensive line. Players were moved around due to injuries and Shaun Smith who was supposed to be at NT was used at DE in certain situations. Wimbley was slotted at OLB opposite McGinnest.

[Cleveland Rocks]

I think I mentioned you need to groom the future RB for when Lewis leaves.

The Browns need to resign Lewis to a longer contract. There should be no rush in replacing him for some time. He is just turning 29 and has several years left in him.

[BOSSHOGG30]

The Browns need to resign Lewis to a longer contract. There should be no rush in replacing him for some time. He is just turning 29 and has several years left in him.

He has a lot of miles on him... If you are willing to take that risk... more power to you... but I sure wouldn't count on it. This draft is stacked with runningback talent, so it would be smart to go ahead and take a guy somewhere that you like and have him on that roster just in case.

[Cleveland Rocks]

He has a lot of miles on him... If you are willing to take that risk... more power to you... but I sure wouldn't count on it. This draft is stacked with runningback talent, so it would be smart to go ahead and take a guy somewhere that you like and have him on that roster just in case.

The Browns have far more glaring needs than running back. Jamal Lewis did just fine and there is no reason to replace him. The defense was among the worst in the league. Ted Washington, who was the starter, is too old and needs replacing. At DE Orpheus Roye is also aged and needs replacing. Then opposite Wimbley there is yet another aged veteran who desperately needs replacing in McGinnest. The defense was god-awful last season and desperately needs improvement and new talent along the DL and in the LB corp.

[BOSSHOGG30]

The Browns have far more glaring needs than running back. Jamal Lewis did just fine and there is no reason to replace him. The defense was among the worst in the league. Ted Washington, who was the starter, is too old and needs replacing. At DE Orpheus Roye is also aged and needs replacing. Then opposite Wimbley there is yet another aged veteran who desperately needs replacing in McGinnest. The defense was god-awful last season and desperately needs improvement and new talent along the DL and in the LB corp.

I think I agreed with you in my post... Did you see where I had each position ranked as far as need..... RB wasn't that high up, but I still considered it a need.

[Cleveland Rocks]

I think I agreed with you in my post... Did you see where I had each position ranked as far as need..... RB wasn't that high up, but I still considered it a need.

Wimbley is an Outside Linebacker along with McGinnest. The Browns need 1 outside linebacker to replace McGinnest. Then the Browns need a DE to replace Orpheus Roye and a Nose Tackle to replace the non existing Nose Tackle.

[Lonestar]

perhaps the browns stuff should be in Other NFL area?

:focus:

[Cleveland Rocks]

perhaps the browns stuff should be in Other NFL area?

:focus:

It is just comments on the mock and the Browns needs and how the mock doesn't address those needs.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Wimbley is an Outside Linebacker along with McGinnest. The Browns need 1 outside linebacker to replace McGinnest. Then the Browns need a DE to replace Orpheus Roye and a Nose Tackle to replace the non existing Nose Tackle.

Ok, sorry for sharing my opinion.... maybe next time instead of trying to carry on a Cleveland Browns conversation with you I will just dog your team and move on since you seem to be set with your way or the highway.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

too funny

[SmilinAssasSin27]

OH, and as far as yer sig goes Boss...yer WAY OFF. It was Matt Lepsis who stopped TD.

[BeefStew25]

Oh, the pervert is posting.

[Cleveland Rocks]

Ok, sorry for sharing my opinion.... maybe next time instead of trying to carry on a Cleveland Browns conversation with you I will just dog your team and move on since you seem to be set with your way or the highway.

I do not like that and do not want that.

I am just correcting you that Wimbley is an OLB. He may line up at DE on occasion but that is not his primary position.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Mayocks updated position rankings.... Some very interesting picks

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story;jsessionid=8592A3761B383C2BB80FB0C33192A52A? id=09000d5d80406b71&template=with-video&confirm=true

[Scarface]

Cleveland needs CB above all else.

Their corners are probably the strength of their defense. They need D-Line and LB's.

[Scarface]

Mayocks updated position rankings.... Some very interesting picks

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story;jsessionid=8592A3761B383C2BB80FB0C33192A52A? id=09000d5d80406b71&template=with-video&confirm=true

Check out his RB rankings! I can't wait for the nightly Path to the Draft shows. I gotta hear his thoughts on this.

Mayock's top 5 RBs:
Rank Player College
1.
Rashard Mendenhall

Illinois
2.
Darren McFadden

Arkansas
3.
Jonathan Stewart

Oregon
4.
Felix Jones

Arkansas
5.
Chris Johnson

East Carolina

[claymore]

Check out his RB rankings! I can't wait for the nightly Path to the Draft shows. I gotta hear his thoughts on this.

Mayock's top 5 RBs:
Rank Player College
1.
Rashard Mendenhall

Illinois
2.
Darren McFadden

Arkansas
3.
Jonathan Stewart

Oregon
4.
Felix Jones

Arkansas
5.
Chris Johnson

East Carolina

I was Shocked as well.

[Scarface]

OH, and as far as yer sig goes Boss...yer WAY OFF. It was Matt Lepsis who stopped TD.

I blame Griese for throwing the pick.

[lex]

Check out his RB rankings! I can't wait for the nightly Path to the Draft shows. I gotta hear his thoughts on this.

Mayock's top 5 RBs:
Rank Player College
1.
Rashard Mendenhall

Illinois
2.
Darren McFadden

Arkansas
3.
Jonathan Stewart

Oregon
4.
Felix Jones

Arkansas
5.
Chris Johnson

East Carolina

Positives for Mendenhall:
1. Had a big game against USC in his last game so the memory of that is still fresh.
2. Runs with good vision...better vision than Stewart
3. More patient than McFadden
4. Has better pad level than McFadden and similar pad level to Stewart. Stewart and Mendenhall are both 5'11, McFadden is 6'2. Plus McFadden is in a bigger hurry when running to the point where its hard react to the cutback and lower the shoulder all the time.
5. Explosive speed. Ran a 10.6X 100 m. in HS and is expected to run low 4.5s or 4.6. Not as fast as Charles or Johnson but fast enough.
6. Good feet

Id still take McFadden over Mendenhall. I think McFadden just needs to throttle back like 5% or so when running past the LOS and to the LBs. I would put McFadden over Mendenhall though simply based on the results...and I actually think McFadden will be better in the NFL than college since his QB wont be Casey Dick and his teams leading WR wont be its fullback.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Give me Stewart or Charles... I like Stewart as a complete back, and I love Charles Speed... reminds me of Clinton Portis... and we all know how good he did in Denver.

[CoachChaz]

I like Stewart based on his complete game and size.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Stewart reminds me of Shaun Alexander for some reason.
Charles reminds me of Clinton Portis
Mendenhall reminds me of Larry Johnson
McFadden reminds me of L.T.

It is hard to see how we can go wrong with any of these backs.

[lex]

Stewart reminds me of Shaun Alexander for some reason.
Charles reminds me of Clinton Portis
Mendenhall reminds me of Larry Johnson
McFadden reminds me of L.T.

It is hard to see how we can go wrong with any of these backs.

Mendenhall is more like Ahman Green
I can see the Charles/Portis and Alexander/Stewart comparison
McFadden is more like Eric Dickerson

Johnson is taller than Mendenhall and more physical. Mendenhall is more shifty.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Mendenhall is more like Ahman Green
I can see the Charles/Portis and Alexander/Stewart comparison
McFadden is more like Eric Dickerson

Johnson is taller than Mendenhall and more physical. Mendenhall is more shifty.

Ahman Green is super fast.. didn't he run a 4.3 forty... Mendenhall is more a power runner.

McFadden and Dickerson is a good one... I can see where you coming from on that one.

[CoachChaz]

Ahman Green is super fast.. didn't he run a 4.3 forty... Mendenhall is more a power runner.

McFadden and Dickerson is a good one... I can see where you coming from on that one.

Yeah, Green is a speed back.

[lex]

Ahman Green is super fast.. didn't he run a 4.3 forty... Mendenhall is more a power runner.

McFadden and Dickerson is a good one... I can see where you coming from on that one.

It looks like a 4.44.

http://archive.profootballweekly.com/content/archives2001/features_2001/agrest_100101.asp

Green is most known for his speed, which won him Nebraska prep titles in the 100- and 200-meter dashes. At the Indianapolis Scouting Combine, Green ran the 40-yard dash in 4.44 seconds, one of the top times of his RB class. He’s also very athletic, having vertical-jumped almost 40 inches and broad-jumped more than 10 feet.

Mendenhall ran a 10.6 meters so I wouldnt be shocked if he was in the 4.4s.

But I was talking about size as much as I was talking about speed. Green is 6'0 and around 220. Mendenhall is 5'11 and around 220.

[BOSSHOGG30]

It looks like a 4.44.

http://archive.profootballweekly.com/content/archives2001/features_2001/agrest_100101.asp


Mendenhall ran a 10.6 meters so I wouldnt be shocked if he was in the 4.4s.

But I was talking about size as much as I was talking about speed. Green is 6'0 and around 220. Mendenhall is 5'11 and around 220.

You may be right... Green was super fast... and Mendenhall is very fast.. but I think Mendenall has that straight line speed... Green was just super fast ... little differnece

[tubby]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7786546/1st-round-mock-draft:-Dorsey-staying-close-to-home

[BOSSHOGG30]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7786546/1st-round-mock-draft:-Dorsey-staying-close-to-home

If the Falcons pass on a QB they are stupid and the draft pick they have for the Raiders doesn't make sense now that the Raiders spent big money on resigning Fargas,plus they have Michael Bush.

Also, why does everyone have us selecting Clady? I really don't get it.

[tubby]

If the Falcons pass on a QB they are stupid and the draft pick they have for the Raiders doesn't make sense now that the Raiders spent big money on resigning Fargas,plus they have Michael Bush.

Also, why does everyone have us selecting Clady? I really don't get it.

I guess they feel Clady makes the most sense if we stay put at #12. I don't disagree.

[BOSSHOGG30]

I guess they feel Clady makes the most sense if we stay put at #12. I don't disagree.

I think is is a very bad pick for 12th over all. Clady isn't that good... he isn't worth a top 12 pick. If it wasn't for the tackle position being so weak he would be a late 1st rounder or 2nd rounder easy. I know everyone thinks we need a LT and he is listed as the 2nd or 3rd best tackle in the draft.... but you do have to consider how weak the position is. We aren't talking D'brickshaw Ferguson or Olrando Pace here. We are talking about an average LT prospect.

[Requiem / The Dagda]

Are you saying that this is a poor draft for offensive tackles?

[BOSSHOGG30]

Are you saying that this is a poor draft for offensive tackles?

It is a good draft for tackles, but it doesn't really have any studs. It is deep with talent, but I just don't see any impact LT's like Orlando Pace, Jonathan Odgen and so on... You know what I mean? I see a lot of potential starters, but no one worth jumping on with the 12th over all pick... this is one of the highest picks we have had in a long time. Let's make it count. Get us a star!

[Requiem / The Dagda]

It is a good draft for tackles, but it doesn't really have any studs. It is deep with talent, but I just don't see any impact LT's like Orlando Pace, Jonathan Odgen and so on... You know what I mean? I see a lot of potential starters, but no one worth jumping on with the 12th over all pick... this is one of the highest picks we have had in a long time. Let's make it count. Get us a star!

Ah, I see.

I'd love to get a star - but I'd also love to trade down as well.

Who knows what we'll do.

Probably draft some FB #12.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Ah, I see.

I'd love to get a star - but I'd also love to trade down as well.

Who knows what we'll do.

Probably draft some FB #12.

I agree... if we must take a tackle in the 1st round.... please trade down... we would be reaching for one at 12... no tackle in this draft is worth the 12th overall pick with the exception of Jake Long. After that all the tackles are very similiar. There are only a few guys worth staying at 12 and Clady isn't one of them.

[Lonestar]

I agree... if we must take a tackle in the 1st round.... please trade down... we would be reaching for one at 12... no tackle in this draft is worth the 12th overall pick with the exception of Jake Long. After that all the tackles are very similiar. There are only a few guys worth staying at 12 and Clady isn't one of them.

So who do you see being there at 12 and should we take them IF we can't trade down/up.

[BOSSHOGG30]

So who do you see being there at 12 and should we take them IF we can't trade down/up.

Stewart, Mendenhall, Ellis, Dorsey, Jack Long, Chris Long, Malcolm Kelly

That is it! Everyone else would be a reach or not a position of need.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

KP!!!

[Scarface]

I guess they feel Clady makes the most sense if we stay put at #12. I don't disagree.

I have a feeling he won't even be there at 12 anyways. Teams don't just pass on stud LT's.

[BeefStew25]

I guess we can sign Leftwich to compete with Cutty now.

[Scarface]

I guess we can sign Leftwich to compete with Cutty now.

Or sign your Mom to protect him.

[BeefStew25]

Or sign your Mom to protect him.

My mom is dead. Thanks. Real classy.

[Scarface]

My mom is dead. Thanks. Real classy.

Sorry about that. I guess it's on to Plan B.

[atwater27]

I have a feeling he won't even be there at 12 anyways. Teams don't just pass on stud LT's.

I agree. Plain and simple. If he is there at 12, we pick him. The only way we don't is if Ellis or Dorsey magically fall down to us.

[tubby]

http://thefootballexpert.com/abromowitzmockdraft.html

12. Denver Broncos – Ryan Clady, OT, Boise St.
With the retirement of Matt Lepsis, that left tackle position now seems vulnerable, and Ryan Clady, formerly of the Boise St. Broncos makes sense to be the franchise left tackle for the Denver Broncos. Clady's massive size and athleticism probably makes him a better NFL player than Jake Long. Long is more NFL ready now, but Clady may just be the better prospect. Safety Kenny Phillips is an option, but protecting Jake Cutler has to be the first priority.



42. Denver Broncos – Pat Sims, DT, Auburn
The defensive tackle needs obvious help and Sims at 42 could be a steal.

[BeefStew25]

http://thefootballexpert.com/abromowitzmockdraft.html

12. Denver Broncos – Ryan Clady, OT, Boise St.
With the retirement of Matt Lepsis, that left tackle position now seems vulnerable, and Ryan Clady, formerly of the Boise St. Broncos makes sense to be the franchise left tackle for the Denver Broncos. Clady's massive size and athleticism probably makes him a better NFL player than Jake Long. Long is more NFL ready now, but Clady may just be the better prospect. Safety Kenny Phillips is an option, but protecting Jake Cutler has to be the first priority.



42. Denver Broncos – Pat Sims, DT, Auburn
The defensive tackle needs obvious help and Sims at 42 could be a steal.

I am going to kick you in the nuts.

[tubby]

I am going to kick you in the nuts.

LOL. I saw that too. Not my typo though. click the link