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Superchop 7
11-11-2009, 08:58 PM
Paige: Give Chris Simms the start at QB vs. Redskins
By Woody Paige
The Denver Post
Posted: 11/11/2009 01:00:00 AM MST


All we are saying is give Simms a chance.

To give themselves a jump-start, the Broncos should give Chris Simms the start against Washington on Sunday.

The last time we saw Simms, in the first two exhibitions, he was completing 16-of-24 passes for 186 yards and two touchdowns, without an interception, and looking sharp, more like a starter than the other quarterback. Then Simms sprained an ankle and hasn't played since.

Change would be good for the Broncos' soul-searching.

Kyle Orton hasn't performed awfully (except for the three interceptions Monday night). Yes, the Broncos still have won six games — but he is what he is — the 18th-best quarterback in the NFL. And the Broncos are a reflection of that number. They are 22nd in scoring (18.8 points per game), just ahead of the Titans, and behind, ahem, the Bears. They are 19th overall in offense, 17th in passing, 18th in rushing.

The Broncos are third overall in defense. Add the 18 and the 3 to get 21, divide by two for 10.5, and that's about where the Broncos realistically rank in the NFL after back-to-back defeats to Baltimore and Pittsburgh.

The Broncos were off to an unbelievable start this season but haven't gotten off to a distinctive start in any game. The field goal at the end of the first drive Monday accounted for their only opening-drive points of the season.

Josh McDaniels was intent on improving the Broncos' missing-link production of a season ago inside the 20-yard line. He has, but the problem is, they aren't making enough visits. The Broncos were in the ruby region zero times against the Steelers and the Bengals and once in the Ravens game. The offense scored three, 12 and seven points in those games.

It has been suggested, wisely, by my columnist colleagues at Postmortem that the Broncos start Correll Buckhalter at running back, which they did against Pittsburgh, and open up the offense, which they didn't do. It doesn't matter who starts at running back, and McDaniels can't unleash the offense with Orton.

McDaniels showed me his "War and Peace"-sized offensive playbook before the season, but he's able to use only a section that's about the size of the pamphlet "Popular Lawyers And Journalists."

He has to try Simms, and what's a more appropriate occasion than after two losses and in a game against the most politically incorrect and football-inept team in America? Washington: First in war, first in peace, last (again) in the NFC East.

When I suggested this move to a rather large cheese at The Post, he said: "Simms hasn't played since early in the 2006 season."

Orton only played three games in 2006-07 after being benched, following 15 starts in 2005, before the Bears went on to the Super Bowl. Simms has started 15 NFL games.

"Simms' spleen was ruptured. What if he gets hurt again?"

Simms can't hurt his spleen again. It was removed.

"The Bucs got rid of Simms."

The Bears got rid of Orton.

"What did Simms ever do when he was a starter?"

He started a postseason game, which is more than Orton has done.

"Yeah, but . . ."

Yeah, but Simms has a stronger arm. Orton's lack of arm strength was revealed twice against Pittsburgh when he tried to make throws off his back foot and couldn't get the ball to open receivers. And, Simms can scramble better than Orton, who can't get outside the rush, can't run the quarterback draw and can't throw back across his body.

"Simms is left-handed."

So were Steve Young, Ken Stabler and Boomer Esiason, who took their teams to Super Bowls.

And Simms looked stronger in training camp than Orton, and better in the exhibition games (until he got hurt), and McDaniels thought so much of Simms he gave him more money to sign here than Orton makes.

McDaniels told me he doesn't care to switch quarterbacks in midgame or midseason, but, then, he had Tom Brady as his quarterback at New England, and who's going to remove him? Last year the Patriots' quarterback was Matt Cassel, and there was no backup. (Name him for 10 points.)

Let's see what Simms has. The Broncos gave a chance to another quarterback whose father had won a Super Bowl. And Brian Griese, the Broncos' radio analyst last Sunday, has played with both Orton and Simms, and knows that Simms got a raw deal at Tampa Bay, and would be the starting quarterback for the Bucs now if they kept him.

Simms can't play any more awfully than Orton on the first drive and in the first quarter at D.C. And if he's terrible, McDaniels can return to Orton at halftime.

There's only one problem with this sensible solution: McDaniels, who traded a quarterback, won't have the inner workings to do it.

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 08:59 PM
:tsk:

Superchop 7
11-11-2009, 09:00 PM
Im onboard.

It might wake up the rest of the team. (see Freeman/Josh)

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 09:01 PM
Im onboard.

It might wake up the rest of the team. (see Freeman/Josh)

:tsk:

Buff
11-11-2009, 09:02 PM
Paige is batting .000 with his last two columns... I'm a big Woody fan, but he's really missed the mark this week.

MasterShake
11-11-2009, 09:02 PM
This would disrupt the locker room and just hurt the team. You put Simms in when we are mathematically eliminated, and even at THAT point you put in Brandstater.

It would cascade. You hurt the confidence of the QB and it trickles down.

MasterShake
11-11-2009, 09:03 PM
Paige is batting .000 with his last two columns... I'm a big Woody fan , but he's really missed the mark this week.

Thats what she sai.... aww, nevermind. :lol:

Northman
11-11-2009, 09:04 PM
Ow my spleen!

Northman
11-11-2009, 09:08 PM
This would disrupt the locker room and just hurt the team. You put Simms in when we are mathematically eliminated, and even at THAT point you put in Brandstater.

It would cascade. You hurt the confidence of the QB and it trickles down.

Yea, i was thinking Plummer/Cutler all over again.

Iron Horse72
11-11-2009, 10:17 PM
How about no, that would cause problems in the locker room.

girler
11-11-2009, 10:21 PM
I've always been a Simms fan, but you can't changeout QBs in the middle of a season unless there's an injury. That only kills the team confidence, the individual confidence, and the confidence of the fans...

topscribe
11-11-2009, 10:44 PM
Im onboard.

It might wake up the rest of the team. (see Freeman/Josh)

I'm not surprised. :laugh:

-----

TXBRONC
11-11-2009, 10:48 PM
Im onboard.

It might wake up the rest of the team. (see Freeman/Josh)

Freeman was drafted in the first round and was going to eventually start anyway. I like Simms but right now that wouldn't be a wise move.

frauschieze
11-11-2009, 10:49 PM
No QB change please. QB controversies during the season ruins it for everyone.

TXBRONC
11-11-2009, 10:51 PM
I've always been a Simms fan, but you can't changeout QBs in the middle of a season unless there's an injury. That only kills the team confidence, the individual confidence, and the confidence of the fans...

If a starting quarterback has been ineffective then the coach should at the very least consider it.

TXBRONC
11-11-2009, 10:54 PM
No QB change please. QB controversies during the season ruins it for everyone.

As I was telling Girlier I think there are circumstances that would warrant a mid season change but the Broncos are not in any of the kind of circumstances that would warrant it.

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 10:56 PM
If a starting quarterback has been ineffective then the coach should at the very least consider it.

I will take the coach's opinion above all else. But since most consider him such an idiot, I won't be surprised when people unknowingly and unintelligently suggest otherwise.

Tned
11-11-2009, 10:58 PM
This would disrupt the locker room and just hurt the team. You put Simms in when we are mathematically eliminated, and even at THAT point you put in Brandstater.

It would cascade. You hurt the confidence of the QB and it trickles down.

Personally, I think it is WAY too early to throw Brandstater out there, even if we are eliminated. IMO, it is still Orton's job to lose, and if we lose another game or two, over the next three or four, maybe you start to talk about Simms getting a shot. I actually liked some of what I saw from Simms before he got hurt in Tampa, so I am curious what he could do, and unlike Orton, he is signed for next year and not overly cheap for a backup QB.

So, I see it as Indy is the soonest you turn the reigns over to Simms, unless were to lose the next three, and then KC would be a nice game for Simms to slide into.

Hopefully, a win in Washington and against SD will end this QB controversy.

Tned
11-11-2009, 10:59 PM
I will take the coach's opinion above all else. But since most consider him such an idiot, I won't be surprised when people unknowingly and unintelligently suggest otherwise.

Please provide links to the posts to backup your claim that 'most' consider coach McDaniel's an idiot.

:thankyouinadvanceforbackingupyourclaims:

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 10:59 PM
Fortunately, there is no actual quarterback controversy.

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 11:02 PM
Please provide links to the posts to backup your claim that 'most' consider coach McDaniel's an idiot.

:thankyouinadvanceforbackingupyourclaims:

You're kidding right?

I mean, seriously, after months upon months of McDummy and McIdiot and McDoucheBag and McDipShit posts you're going to ask me to provide links?

Really?

Tned
11-11-2009, 11:03 PM
Fortunately, there is no actual quarterback controversy.

No more than most QB controversies, which are fan/media based, rather than being anything the team is actually considering.

CrazyHorse
11-11-2009, 11:04 PM
Kevin O'Connell. That was easy. I get 10 points. Yay me!

Tned
11-11-2009, 11:04 PM
You're kidding right?

No, if you want to tout these crazy conspiracy theories (to use your phrase), back it up. By far, the majority of posters on this forum support McDaniels and all of the moves he has made, so I don't see how you can make a claim that most think he is an idiot. It simply has no basis.

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 11:05 PM
No, if you want to tout these crazy conspiracy theories (to use your phrase), back it up. By far, the majority of posters on this forum support McDaniels and all of the moves he has made, so I don't see how you can make a claim that most think he is an idiot. It simply has no basis.

Really? I mean, you're serious about this?

Tned
11-11-2009, 11:06 PM
You're kidding right?

I mean, seriously, after months upon months of McDummy and McIdiot and McDoucheBag and McDipShit posts you're going to ask me to provide links?

Really?

Sorry, you edited your post after I replied, and added the mcdummy stuff.

Yes, there was a minority of posters posting that stuff, and even the small number of people doing it in the offseason, FAR outnumbered by the fan police that attacked anyone that criticized McDaniels or Orton, but even most of that small number of critics came around very quickly.

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 11:07 PM
Sorry, you edited your post after I replied, and added the mcdummy stuff.

Yes, there was a minority of posters posting that stuff, and even the small number of people doing it in the offseason, FAR outnumbered by the fan police that attacked anyone that criticized McDaniels or Orton, but even most of that small number of critics came around very quickly.

A minority?

Do you even read your own web site?

Tned
11-11-2009, 11:07 PM
Really? I mean, you're serious about this?

Maybe you missed a lot of what was actually being discussed in the month you were gone and are out of touch. Don't know where you miconception comes from.

Tned
11-11-2009, 11:08 PM
A minority?

Do you even read your own web site?

Every day. Twice on Sunday.

frauschieze
11-11-2009, 11:08 PM
Time to knock it off.

:focus:

dogfish
11-11-2009, 11:27 PM
there's the woody we all know and want to punch in the face. . .


orton's completing 63% of his pases and is on pace for a respectable 3,600+ yards, take away the end of the quarter hail mary and his TD:INT ratio is an excellent 3:1, and before last week the guy had played the better part of half a season without throwing a single legitimate INT. . . AND we're frigging 6-2 and leading our division. . .

dude has a bad game and people are calling for the backup?

dogshit!

it's a waste of time to even discuss it, it's NOT happening. . . maybe woody the assclown should be asking that we rush for more than 27 lousy stinkin' yards next week instead of asking to bench the quarterback. . .

MOtorboat
11-11-2009, 11:28 PM
there's the woody we all know and want to punch in the face. . .


orton's completing 63% of his pases and is on pace for a respectable 3,600+ yards, take away the end of the quarter hail mary and his TD:INT ratio is an excellent 3:1, and before last week the guy had played the better part of half a season without throwing a single legitimate INT. . . AND we're frigging 6-2 and leading our division. . .

dude has a bad game and people are calling for the backup?

dogshit!

it's a waste of time to even discuss it, it's NOT happening. . . maybe woody the assclown should be asking that we rush for more than 27 lousy stinkin' yards next week instead of asking to bench the quarterback. . .

Thanks for logic.

dogfish
11-11-2009, 11:29 PM
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/286/bigshit.jpg (http://img27.imageshack.us/i/bigshit.jpg/)

TXBRONC
11-11-2009, 11:31 PM
there's the woody we all know and want to punch in the face. . .


orton's completing 63% of his pases and is on pace for a respectable 3,600+ yards, take away the end of the quarter hail mary and his TD:INT ratio is an excellent 3:1, and before last week the guy had played the better part of half a season without throwing a single legitimate INT. . . AND we're frigging 6-2 and leading our division. . .

dude has a bad game and people are calling for the backup?

dogshit!

it's a waste of time to even discuss it, it's NOT happening. . . maybe woody the assclown should be asking that we rush for more than 27 lousy stinkin' yards next week instead of asking to bench the quarterback. . .


We're certainly not at a juncture where it should even be considered.

Timmy!
11-11-2009, 11:32 PM
Oh for shits sake. :tsk:

I can't believe that douche bag actually got paid for that article.

weazel
11-11-2009, 11:56 PM
looking at a 6-2 team that could make the playoffs and saying we should change the QB is crazy! Only a crazy person would do that, I mean.... oh no, what am I saying? Shanahan did that!

While I dont see anything really changing with Orton or the offense, I cant see JM making a change at QB unless (when?) we lose a couple more.

56crash
11-12-2009, 12:34 AM
Kyle Orton Last Year. Kyle Orton this Year.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This year. 8 games

9TDs.

4INTS.

Last year. 8 games.

10TDs

4INTs

All the other stats pretty much fall in line too. I won't do the math but I can estimate by looking that last year at this point he has a QB rating in the 80s, a completion percentage in the 60%'s and overall yardage was virtually the same.

Kyle Ortons stats:

http://www.nfl.com/players/kyleorton...s?id=ORT716150

Kyle Ortons 2008 game logs:

http://www.nfl.com/players/kyleorton...50&season=2008

Kyle Orton is Kyle Orton is Kyle Orton.

Give him Brandon Llyod and a bunch of scrubs he will throw 10Tds. Give him Brandon Marshall and an elite unit he will throw 9. It just doesn't matter.

Give him Ron Turdner or Josh McWonderboy. Doesn't matter.

Now here is where a difference is made: Give him a great defense and he will guide you to a good record. Give him an average D that gets lots of turnovers and he will allow you to hover around .500. He showed this in 05 when he was a young rook. He is an above average player.

But he is who he is. Only a complete imbecile would want him over Jay Cutler. The Broncos with Cutler would be underfeated and would be serious super bowl contenders this season.


*EDIT* I did not realize that the bears were 5-3 at this point last year! This comparison is eerily similar. Take away a lucky richocet and the guy posts an identical record with studd recievers, a stud oline an a great defense as he does with a somewhat above average D, scrub recievers, a subpar oline and a good RB.

Edit This was made by a Bears fan just food for thought . I like Orton
__________________

56crash
11-12-2009, 12:39 AM
looking at a 6-2 team that could make the playoffs and saying we should change the QB is crazy! Only a crazy person would do that, I mean.... oh no, what am I saying? Shanahan did that!

While I dont see anything really changing with Orton or the offense, I cant see JM making a change at QB unless (when?) we lose a couple more.

I don't look at it as crazy just as an option. it is nice to have options.

Tned
11-12-2009, 12:53 AM
there's the woody we all know and want to punch in the face. . .


orton's completing 63% of his pases and is on pace for a respectable 3,600+ yards, take away the end of the quarter hail mary and his TD:INT ratio is an excellent 3:1, and before last week the guy had played the better part of half a season without throwing a single legitimate INT. . . AND we're frigging 6-2 and leading our division. . .

dude has a bad game and people are calling for the backup?

dogshit!

it's a waste of time to even discuss it, it's NOT happening. . . maybe woody the assclown should be asking that we rush for more than 27 lousy stinkin' yards next week instead of asking to bench the quarterback. . .

I didn't even bother reading the aritlcle. I think I have read one Paige article in the last four or five years, and that was when he did that 'exclusive' interview with Bowlen in the offseason.

I just don't see McDaniels even considering a QB change unless we lose to Was and SD and find ourselves going from 6-0 to 6-4. I just think like most of this type of 'controversy' it is driven by fans, and a little media speculation thrown in.

Northman
11-12-2009, 01:03 AM
I don't look at it as crazy just as an option. it is nice to have options.


Yea, i was where you were in 06'. Calling for a change and finally got it. Unfortuantely, 3 losing seasons in a row and now we are back to a winning season (thus far) with what is essentially a Plummer clone. Yea, ill take this right now as the last time it happened it was a massive mistake.

DenBronx
11-12-2009, 01:04 AM
orton isnt the one missing tackles, false starting, dropping balls, and making the bone headed play calling lately. two of his three ints were while we were trying to play catch up.

also moreno hasnt exactlly been playing lights out either. he has been a bum the last few weeks.

dogfish
11-12-2009, 01:22 AM
I didn't even bother reading the aritlcle. I think I have read one Paige article in the last four or five years, and that was when he did that 'exclusive' interview with Bowlen in the offseason.

I just don't see McDaniels even considering a QB change unless we lose to Was and SD and find ourselves going from 6-0 to 6-4. I just think like most of this type of 'controversy' it is driven by fans, and a little media speculation thrown in.

absolutely-- there IS no controversy. . . .

Tned
11-12-2009, 01:22 AM
orton isnt the one missing tackles, false starting, dropping balls, and making the bone headed play calling lately. two of his three ints were while we were trying to play catch up.

also moreno hasnt exactlly been playing lights out either. he has been a bum the last few weeks.

Moreno has struggled both running (not too surprising against Pitt and Baltimore) and pass blocking.

Tned
11-12-2009, 01:27 AM
absolutely-- there IS no controversy. . . .

Please excuse my momentary off topic rant.

While I was very dissapointed when you took down your Natalie Portman avvies, you more than made up for it by having some of the best looking women on the face of the earth to follow her.

I always look forward to a dogfish post, because of the sheer joy I get at wondering what lovely lady will be in his avvy (you're posts are good to, so that's a bonus ;)).

Tsk, tsk. From Natalie to an ostrich. How far the mighty have fallen....

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled QB controversy...

dogfish
11-12-2009, 01:36 AM
Please excuse my momentary off topic rant.

While I was very dissapointed when you took down your Natalie Portman avvies, you more than made up for it by having some of the best looking women on the face of the earth to follow her.

I always look forward to a dogfish post, because of the sheer joy I get at wondering what lovely lady will be in his avvy (you're posts are good to, so that's a bonus ;)).

Tsk, tsk. From Natalie to an ostrich. How far the mighty have fallen....

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled QB controversy...


i just wanted to be cool and fit in for once!!

JDL
11-12-2009, 01:37 AM
I would rather maintain Orton as a starter and bring him back as the man to groom another drafted QB.

Personally, I don't think Simms is an upgrade over Orton. He's a more dangerous passer, but see he is a poor substitute for a Cutler-type QB and a poor substitute for a guy like Orton that generally takes care of the ball.

Orton is what he is and I think even though some people tried to paint him as fine, he is an upgradeable aspect of this team, but there is NOBODY that is really going to be an upgrade NOW. I would say continue on this course (so long as the offense improves, if the past 3 weeks continues, then you have to make a change before player's quit or divisions occur, which could happen like last year where the offense turned on the D.)

But, I think for this year building a culture is what is necessary and sometimes change (like with Berger... can hurt you) and this team needs to solidify its gains of success by staying the course and giving itself the best chance of winning the division. Even a 1 and out in the playoffs wouldn't erase a division title and give McDaniels more currency to make changes and bring in players that will buy into his system.

dogfish
11-12-2009, 01:41 AM
the backup QB is always the most popular guy in town-- until he actually gets in there and plays. . . .

Tned
11-12-2009, 01:44 AM
the backup QB is always the most popular guy in town-- until he actually gets in there and plays. . . .

BVP. Anyone remember BVP?

Shazam!
11-12-2009, 01:50 AM
Unless Orton gets hurt, that's the only way I want to see Simms the starter at this point. Now, if the Broncos were sub-.500, why not. Using the Pitt game as a measuring stick is ridiculous, he spent the entire second half running for dear life.

HORSEPOWER 56
11-12-2009, 07:23 AM
Give Orton one more week against Washington. Win or lose, if he still can't move the offense and score meaningful points, then give the start to Simms vs SD. Hopefully, we'll open up the playbook a little and let Kyle throw downfield more. Hopefully, the O-line will give him a little more time, too.

Dirk
11-12-2009, 08:28 AM
Woody, Woody, Woody......again another one screaming "the sky is falling".

Does he (and some posters here) believe that Bal and Pitt were terrible teams? And all Orton had to do was walk on the field to beat them?

Give me a break....get off of Orton's back.

claymore
11-12-2009, 08:44 AM
This would disrupt the locker room and just hurt the team. You put Simms in when we are mathematically eliminated, and even at THAT point you put in Brandstater.

It would cascade. You hurt the confidence of the QB and it trickles down.

I have a hard time Orton is the heart and soul of this team. Its not like we are putting in a rookie.

Its obvious Orton isnt the answer this year, next year or ever.

Dirk
11-12-2009, 09:11 AM
I have a hard time Orton is the heart and soul of this team. Its not like we are putting in a rookie.

Its obvious Orton isnt the answer this year, next year or ever.

It has been quoted many times from the players that Orton is the true leader of the team.

You guys need to remember that even though we have enjoyed a fantastic start this season, no one thought it would be like this. New Coaches, New QB, New System.

I am like everyone else, I would LOVE to win every game but nobody was saying we would be 6-2 at this point. Enjoy what we have this season!

There are still 8 more games to play.

claymore
11-12-2009, 09:16 AM
It has been quoted many times from the players that Orton is the true leader of the team.

You guys need to remember that even though we have enjoyed a fantastic start this season, no one thought it would be like this. New Coaches, New QB, New System.

I am like everyone else, I would LOVE to win every game but nobody was saying we would be 6-2 at this point. Enjoy what we have this season!

There are still 8 more games to play.

We are lucky to be 6-2. I think everyone realizes that. Not only for the record, but because we really are lucky to be 6-2. If it wasnt for some lucky lucky plays that NEVER happen we would be 2-6, 3-5 something like that.

If Orton is the answer, then the Coach and Orton need to get their head out of their asses.

We are 6-2, Good, I know that, but I still dont want to be 6-10.

GEM
11-12-2009, 10:44 AM
Woody does know our Oline is already having issues, right? You make this move and you shuffle Ryan Clady around because Simms is left handed. Superiorly STUPID idea, Woody.

GEM
11-12-2009, 10:45 AM
I have a hard time Orton is the heart and soul of this team. Its not like we are putting in a rookie.

Its obvious Orton isnt the answer this year, next year or ever.

And Simms or Brandstater (sp?) are the answer? For sure? Because you better be damned sure BEFORE making that move cause you've lost the rest of your locker room because of it.

Dirk
11-12-2009, 11:11 AM
I'm not saying Orton is the answer AFTER this year, but barring a major meltdown on Orton's behalf, you don't bench him this year.

frauschieze
11-12-2009, 11:18 AM
I have a hard time Orton is the heart and soul of this team. Its not like we are putting in a rookie.

Its obvious Orton isnt the answer this year, next year or ever.

But all reports thus far indicate that Orton IS a major leader on this team. Dawkins may be the heart and soul, but Orton is that on offense. He's immensely popular in the locker room, same as he was in Chicago. Regardless of all other factors, the potential loss of the entire team's belief in themselves is enough to stick it out with Orton for the season. In the offseason? Who knows.

claymore
11-12-2009, 11:20 AM
Woody does know our Oline is already having issues, right? You make this move and you shuffle Ryan Clady around because Simms is left handed. Superiorly STUPID idea, Woody.
They wouldnt move Clady to the right side.

And Simms or Brandstater (sp?) are the answer? For sure? Because you better be damned sure BEFORE making that move cause you've lost the rest of your locker room because of it.

So many things to say, but I doubt anyone would read it or care. Bottom line is I feel our woes are a number of things, QB, Coach and personell. Mainly our coach not running a system that our personell are equipped to run. And our QB not being equipped to run anything more than a clip board.

claymore
11-12-2009, 11:23 AM
But all reports thus far indicate that Orton IS a major leader on this team. Dawkins may be the heart and soul, but Orton is that on offense. He's immensely popular in the locker room, same as he was in Chicago. Regardless of all other factors, the potential loss of the entire team's belief in themselves is enough to stick it out with Orton for the season. In the offseason? Who knows.

Orton is not the sole problem. I think our scheme is, but I dont know if Orton can run a ZBS type system.

If Orton was benched, he wouldnt pull a Plummer pout thing. He would help simms and be a valued member of the team still.

frauschieze
11-12-2009, 11:27 AM
Orton is not the sole problem. I think our scheme is, but I dont know if Orton can run a ZBS type system.

If Orton was benched, he wouldnt pull a Plummer pout thing. He would help simms and be a valued member of the team still.

I do believe that. But I do worry about what effect it would have on everyone else. I think we have to lose a bunch more games before it even should be an option.

NightTrainLayne
11-12-2009, 11:29 AM
Orton is not the sole problem. I think our scheme is, but I dont know if Orton can run a ZBS type system.

If Orton was benched, he wouldnt pull a Plummer pout thing. He would help simms and be a valued member of the team still.

Clay. We're 6-2. By Sunday evening we will be 7-2, with a home game against the Chargers coming up to potentially decide the AFC West (or go a long ways toward it).

We absolutely can't afford to change QB's now. Back in '06 I could get behind it because it was obvious we weren't going anywhere with Plummer running the offense that Shanny was making him run, and we might as well get Cutler the experience. But right now, we don't have the long-term QB solution sitting on the bench. We're talking about Simms. .. a great back-up, but not the future of the team.

Unless Orton gets injured, or we are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, then Orton needs to play.

dogfish
11-12-2009, 11:34 AM
We are lucky to be 6-2. I think everyone realizes that. Not only for the record, but because we really are lucky to be 6-2. If it wasnt for some lucky lucky plays that NEVER happen we would be 2-6, 3-5 something like that.

If Orton is the answer, then the Coach and Orton need to get their head out of their asses.

We are 6-2, Good, I know that, but I still dont want to be 6-10.

yea, we really should be 0-9 right now-- god, we suck!


*farts*




Orton is not the sole problem. I think our scheme is, but I dont know if Orton can run a ZBS type system.


what, we're gonna play orton at running back now? ZBS is a run blocking scheme. . .

the QB doesn't have to do anything different-- then handoffs are the same. . . . :lol:

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 11:36 AM
yea, we really should be 0-9 right now-- god, we suck!


*farts*

I'm predicting 4-12 at this point.

topscribe
11-12-2009, 11:41 AM
We are lucky to be 6-2. I think everyone realizes that. Not only for the record, but because we really are lucky to be 6-2. If it wasnt for some lucky lucky plays that NEVER happen we would be 2-6, 3-5 something like that.

If Orton is the answer, then the Coach and Orton need to get their head out of their asses.

We are 6-2, Good, I know that, but I still dont want to be 6-10.

Shanahan once (maybe more than once) said that to win in the NFL, you have
to be good, and you have to be lucky. In my more than half-century of
observing and playing football, I have never seen a championship team get there
without luck.

I remember the mid-1980s Raiders, how seemingly everyone was talking about
how "lucky" they were. I think George Blanda set it pretty straight: He said,
"We make our luck."

You do things right, and you will appear lucky. Champ Bailey said games aren't
won on Sunday; they are won during the practice week. Some of those
"lucky" events are results of practice, such as tip drills, etc.

Even the TD pass to Moreno was considered "lucky." But Orton made his luck
there, throwing a heater into such a tight window that 6 inches either way
would have meant failure. I was blown away by the sheer skill of that pass.

My friend, you call it "lucky." I call it hard work: dedication and preparation.
I call it doing things right. If you do that, you'll be "lucky."

-----

claymore
11-12-2009, 11:51 AM
I do believe that. But I do worry about what effect it would have on everyone else. I think we have to lose a bunch more games before it even should be an option.
I didnt start the thread, It wasnt my idea. It was my idea before the season started though.


Clay. We're 6-2. By Sunday evening we will be 7-2, with a home game against the Chargers coming up to potentially decide the AFC West (or go a long ways toward it).

We absolutely can't afford to change QB's now. Back in '06 I could get behind it because it was obvious we weren't going anywhere with Plummer running the offense that Shanny was making him run, and we might as well get Cutler the experience. But right now, we don't have the long-term QB solution sitting on the bench. We're talking about Simms. .. a great back-up, but not the future of the team.

Unless Orton gets injured, or we are mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, then Orton needs to play.I understand and I partially agree. JMCD needs to field a system that fits our players though.


yea, we really should be 0-9 right now-- god, we suck!

*farts*

what, we're gonna play orton at running back now? ZBS is a run blocking scheme. . .

the QB doesn't have to do anything different-- then handoffs are the same. . . . :lol:We were highly over rated and a paper tiger that got exposed 2 weeks in a row.


Shanahan once (maybe more than once) said that to win in the NFL, you have
to be good, and you have to be lucky. In my more than half-century of
observing and playing football, I have never seen a championship team get there
without luck.

I remember the mid-1980s Raiders, how seemingly everyone were talking
about how "lucky" they were. I think George Blanda set it pretty straight: He
said, "We make our luck."

You do things right, and you will appear lucky. Champ Bailey said games aren't
won on Sunday; they are won during the practice week. Some of those
"lucky" events are results of practice, such as tip drills, etc.

Even the TD pass to Moreno was considered "lucky." But Orton made his luck
there, throwing a heater into such a tight window that 6 inches either way
would have meant failure. I was blown away by the sheer skill of that pass.

My friend, you call it "lucky." I call it hard work: dedication and preparation.
I call it doing things right. If you do that, you'll be "lucky."

-----

You cannot get to the playoffs and win on luck alone. We won 3 games that didnt require any luck(Oak, Cle, NE kinda).

topscribe
11-12-2009, 12:01 PM
You cannot get to the playoffs and win on luck alone. We won 3 games that didnt require any luck(Oak, Cle, NE kinda).

I'm sorry I went to the trouble to write all that, Clay . . . :tsk:

-----

GEM
11-12-2009, 12:02 PM
They wouldnt move Clady to the right side.


So many things to say, but I doubt anyone would read it or care. Bottom line is I feel our woes are a number of things, QB, Coach and personell. Mainly our coach not running a system that our personell are equipped to run. And our QB not being equipped to run anything more than a clip board.

So I guess it's safe to say that a couple losses to the Super Bowl Champs and one of the teams in last year's AFC Championship game and you are back off the bandwagon? :shrugs:

Also, at the Clady point....what then? you keep him on the left side where he's been a monster, he no longer guards the blind side and you throw Polumbus in the fire? I'm not even sure Harris could hold up at the blindside like Clady has.

dogfish
11-12-2009, 12:14 PM
We were highly over rated and a paper tiger that got exposed 2 weeks in a row.



yea, the paper tiger that beat the 6-2 patriots, the 6-2 bengals, the 5-3 chargers, and the 6-2 cowboys. . . . but you're right, we suck-- IMO, the only way you can be a good team is if you win every game. . . if you can't go undefeated, you're pretty much garbage. . . .


*sobs*


excuse me while i go cut myself. . . .

claymore
11-12-2009, 12:43 PM
I'm sorry I went to the trouble to write all that, Clay . . . :tsk:

-----
Dont be sorry. I ve heard the luck analogies before though.

So I guess it's safe to say that a couple losses to the Super Bowl Champs and one of the teams in last year's AFC Championship game and you are back off the bandwagon? :shrugs:

Also, at the Clady point....what then? you keep him on the left side where he's been a monster, he no longer guards the blind side and you throw Polumbus in the fire? I'm not even sure Harris could hold up at the blindside like Clady has.I dont know the answer Gem, and remember Im not calling for Ortons head as much as I am calling for JMCD to call formations that our offense is suited to run.

Ive never liked Simms and almost threw up when we signed him as Cutler's backup.


yea, the paper tiger that beat the 6-2 patriots, the 6-2 bengals, the 5-3 chargers, and the 6-2 cowboys. . . . but you're right, we suck-- IMO, the only way you can be a good team is if you win every game. . . if you can't go undefeated, you're pretty much garbage. . . .


*sobs*


excuse me while i go cut myself. . . .You guys can be as dramatic as you want. I just dont think we are as good as our record says we are (yes I know the saying "you are as good as your record is").

IMO, we arent as good as I hoped we were. We got destroyed the past 2 weeks. Utterly embarrased.

Coach McD needs to change something. something needs to be done...

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 12:57 PM
I think we all know that I"m not Orton fan, but it doesn't make any sense to sit Orton now.

I know that I'm disappointed in our offense.... especially considering it as supposed to improve with McDaniels being the offensive genius and we having so many offensive weapons... not to mention ADDING to our offensive weapons with a first round RB.

Our offense has regressed a LOT since last year, but I give MAJOR credit to McDaniels and Nolan for fixing this defense.

The offense is just...weak. Which is strange considering the weapons we have.

claymore
11-12-2009, 12:59 PM
I think we all know that I"m not Orton fan, but it doesn't make any sense to sit Orton now.

Im not saying we bench him. But something has to be done. Our Defense isnt as good as we think it is and our offense sucks.

topscribe
11-12-2009, 01:04 PM
Im not saying we bench him. But something has to be done. Our Defense isnt as good as we think it is and our offense sucks.

Well, Clay, the defense is very good, but it suffers when the offense puts them
on the field too much. And the offense is going to keep putting the defense on
the field unless and until they establish some semblance of a running game.
Hopefully, with the beefing up of the line a little with Hochstein, that can begin
to change.

I wonder how much difference Hillis would make in there. When they discovered
that the LBs can't handle him, the defense may have to bring up the safeties
to help with gang tackling, which could open up some passing lanes?

-----

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 01:07 PM
Im not saying we bench him. But something has to be done. Our Defense isnt as good as we think it is and our offense sucks.

Hey. you are preaching to the choir here. I know that our defense has been whats won us these games so far,and... we just can't rely on the defense to continue to hold teams to zero points in the second half in order to win. It just won't happen.

Our offense is weak. Which just doesn't make sense to me considering the talent we have on this team on the offensive side of the ball. I expect McDaniels to fix this problem...because as you said.... something needs to be done.

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 01:17 PM
I understand and I partially agree. JMCD needs to field a system that fits our players though.



If this happens, I will join the bandwagon calling for McDaniels head. He has a sytem that he has mastered and runs well. Eventually, he will have the pieces in place to properly run that system, but getting all the pieces simply cannot happen in one year.

All he can do at the moment is amend his system based on the skill he has available...and if you dont think he's done that so far, then you arent watching the same Broncos I've been.

Even high schools dont change their system to fit the players...and they dont have a choice in who plays for them.

My son's freshman team has a good fullback, a great tailback, a small QB with a weak arm and one legitimate WR and they STILL run a spread offense. if they switched to a Pro-set they could better utilize the players they have, but the spread is what the coach runs. If HS coaches stick with their own systems regardless of personnel...why the hell would it make sense for pro coaches to change theirs? Eventually this team is going to be BADASS. Not this year and maybe not next, but soon...we'll all be very happy with the product. That much I'm convinced of

topscribe
11-12-2009, 01:27 PM
If this happens, I will join the bandwagon calling for McDaniels head. He has a sytem that he has mastered and runs well. Eventually, he will have the pieces in place to properly run that system, but getting all the pieces simply cannot happen in one year.

All he can do at the moment is amend his system based on the skill he has available...and if you dont think he's done that so far, then you arent watching the same Broncos I've been.

Even high schools dont change their system to fit the players...and they dont have a choice in who plays for them.

My son's freshman team has a good fullback, a great tailback, a small QB with a weak arm and one legitimate WR and they STILL run a spread offense. if they switched to a Pro-set they could better utilize the players they have, but the spread is what the coach runs. If HS coaches stick with their own systems regardless of personnel...why the hell would it make sense for pro coaches to change theirs? Eventually this team is going to be BADASS. Not this year and maybe not next, but soon...we'll all be very happy with the product. That much I'm convinced of

I agree with you, but I think NE, Dallas, and SD will tell you the Broncos are
pretty close to badass right now. In fact, in an interview I saw--I think
yesterday--Troy Polamalu remarked about what a tough opponent Denver was.
When a team that just beat you says that, I think that's a pretty good
compliment, don't you?

-----

slim
11-12-2009, 01:27 PM
Hold your water, boys.

claymore
11-12-2009, 01:35 PM
If this happens, I will join the bandwagon calling for McDaniels head. He has a sytem that he has mastered and runs well. Eventually, he will have the pieces in place to properly run that system, but getting all the pieces simply cannot happen in one year.

All he can do at the moment is amend his system based on the skill he has available...and if you dont think he's done that so far, then you arent watching the same Broncos I've been.

Even high schools dont change their system to fit the players...and they dont have a choice in who plays for them.

My son's freshman team has a good fullback, a great tailback, a small QB with a weak arm and one legitimate WR and they STILL run a spread offense. if they switched to a Pro-set they could better utilize the players they have, but the spread is what the coach runs. If HS coaches stick with their own systems regardless of personnel...why the hell would it make sense for pro coaches to change theirs? Eventually this team is going to be BADASS. Not this year and maybe not next, but soon...we'll all be very happy with the product. That much I'm convinced of

Coaches have schemes that fit their players abilities. Look at almost any team in the NFL.

claymore
11-12-2009, 01:35 PM
I agree with you, but I think NE, Dallas, and SD will tell you the Broncos are
pretty close to badass right now. In fact, in an interview I saw--I think
yesterday--Troy Polamalu remarked about what a tough opponent Denver was.
When a team that just beat you says that, I think that's a pretty good
compliment, don't you?

-----

Yeah It was real hard overcoming 3 points of offensive production.

GEM
11-12-2009, 01:37 PM
Im not saying we bench him. But something has to be done. Our Defense isnt as good as we think it is and our offense sucks.

I think our Defense is definately as good as we thought. Through both first halves of the losses the stats show, they played lights out. Unfortunately the offense can't keep the defense off the field and I don't care what team it is, at some point the defense will get overwhelmed.

broncofaninfla
11-12-2009, 01:38 PM
I'm not an Orton fan either but I think it's too soon to give up on him. Open up the offense some and give him a chance to show he can do more than dink and dunk.

claymore
11-12-2009, 01:43 PM
I think our Defense is definately as good as we thought. Through both first halves of the losses the stats show, they played lights out. Unfortunately the offense can't keep the defense off the field and I don't care what team it is, at some point the defense will get overwhelmed.

I like our defense. Whatever keeps our offense on the field Im in favor of. This 3 and out BS is sickening.

Dreadnought
11-12-2009, 01:47 PM
Coaches have schemes that fit their players abilities. Look at almost any team in the NFL.

Agreed. Great coaches run systems to fit the players rather than the other way around IMO. Don Shula is a perfect case in point, winning as an utterly land bound ball control coach until he got Dan Marino. The guy got to a Superbowl with David Woodley as a QB fer crissakes. In other words he worked with the assets he had and maximized them rather than pounding round pegs in square holes

broncofaninfla
11-12-2009, 01:51 PM
Lets hope McD isn't too stubborn to keep plugging his way into a team that can excel in an adjusted scheme. His way might very well work next year when we bring in more of his style players but for now I really wish he would incorporate what we have done well in the past and infuse that with what we currently do.

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 01:53 PM
I don't know if they change their schemes, but they definitely change their approach based on the team's personnel.

shanahan didn't run much bootleg with Griese. Plummer couldn't throw from the pocket, so we moved him a lot more. We threw the ball more with Cutler especially after we lost 5 RBs.

Look at Minnesota this year. Would you say they are more of a passing team or more of a running team? Last year they were definitely a run oriented team with Adrian Peterson... this year with Favre I'm not so sure.

So NFL coaches DO change things up based on their personnel. They have to. They can't remain stagnant like a HS coach. The system may 'generally' be the same, but you MUST put the ball in the hands of the best players. If thats your big RB.. or.. your big armed QB.

broncofaninfla
11-12-2009, 02:00 PM
Before the start of the season I envisioned Marshall playing the Moss role and Royal playing the Welker role. I've seen flashes on that in Royal but mostly very rarely see Marshall used as Moss has been. We have a pretty boring offense so far this season.

claymore
11-12-2009, 02:03 PM
Before the start of the season I envisioned Marshall playing the Moss role and Royal playing the Welker role. I've seen flashes on that in Royal but mostly very rarely see Marshall used as Moss has been. We have a pretty boring offense so far this season.

Im still pissed at the one yard screen on 3rd and 10. :mad: WTF was that!!!!!!

Lonestar
11-12-2009, 02:05 PM
I read on MHR last night that Brady stated it takes 3-4 years for a QB to really have the Scheme down tight..

we are 5 months in with Orton might want to cut him some slack..

not to mention all the other NEW pieces to the scheme..

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 02:10 PM
I read on MHR last night that Brady stated it takes 3-4 years for a QB to really have the Scheme down tight..

we are 5 months in with Orton might want to cut him some slack..

not to mention all the other NEW pieces to the scheme..

what new pieces to the offense??

Plus.. we see QB change teams every single year. We are halfway through the season. This excuse for a lack of offense, with this much talent on the offense, isn't holding water anymore.

Medford Bronco
11-12-2009, 02:19 PM
No what makes any qb better, a running game. We have not had that since the bye week but should be it back vs a not so good Wash team that lost to *gulp* Det this year.

Denver 27 Wash 14

claymore
11-12-2009, 02:20 PM
I read on MHR last night that Brady stated it takes 3-4 years for a QB to really have the Scheme down tight..

we are 5 months in with Orton might want to cut him some slack..

not to mention all the other NEW pieces to the scheme..


what new pieces to the offense??

Plus.. we see QB change teams every single year. We are halfway through the season. This excuse for a lack of offense, with this much talent on the offense, isn't holding water anymore.

I love Orton as a person. I hope he succeeds. But I doubt Orton has 3-4 years to get to know this system.

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 02:22 PM
I love Orton as a person. I hope he succeeds. But I doubt Orton has 3-4 years to get to know this system.

Thats a great point.

Dreadnought
11-12-2009, 02:24 PM
Thats a great point.

I'm thinking he has @ exactly 8 games to do it in

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 02:27 PM
I'm thinking he has @ exactly 8 games to do it in

heh... I don't htink McDaniels pulls the chord on him that quick. I think he has too much invested in Orton's success... PLUS.... we have too many holes to fill. I'm guessing Orton is an 'until' type of player..but that 'until' may be another season.

Dirk
11-12-2009, 02:41 PM
heh... I don't htink McDaniels pulls the chord on him that quick. I think he has too much invested in Orton's success... PLUS.... we have too many holes to fill. I'm guessing Orton is an 'until' type of player..but that 'until' may be another season.

I agree. Barring a major disapointment in Orton, or a major pickup, he will be calling the signals next year.

Dreadnought
11-12-2009, 02:41 PM
heh... I don't htink McDaniels pulls the chord on him that quick. I think he has too much invested in Orton's success... PLUS.... we have too many holes to fill. I'm guessing Orton is an 'until' type of player..but that 'until' may be another season.

Could be right...BUT, a cautionary tale...

Once upon a time there was a fresh new coach of a team desperate to turn around a franchise mired in mediocrity. He led his team to a 6-2 record right out of the gate and was hailed as one of the next Big Things. All sang his praises!

This was actually 2008, and Coach Zorn (for that is of whom I speak) floundered his way to a 2-6 finish to the Season. Should something similar happen to Coach McD he will throw Orton under the bus so quick it will make your head spin, because in order to go 2-6 the rest of the way would have meant a near total collapse from this offense

Gimpygod
11-12-2009, 03:20 PM
Give Orton one more week against Washington. Win or lose, if he still can't move the offense and score meaningful points, then give the start to Simms vs SD. Hopefully, we'll open up the playbook a little and let Kyle throw downfield more. Hopefully, the O-line will give him a little more time, too.

Here is the rub, Orton can't throw down the field effectively. Everybody sees the eight or nine guys at the line of scrimmage and we still throw 3 yard passes when it's third and five. I don't think the coaches are being purposefully obtuse they simply don't have the tools to take different action. Somebody driving a Pinto in a NASCAR race isn't overlooking the possibility of passing on the outside they simply don't have the horsepower to do it. The same is going to be true of bronco playcalling until we change quarterbacks. On a related note this same lack of ability is killing the running game because the defense can simply focus on a limited portion of the field.

Slick
11-12-2009, 03:39 PM
Chris Simms has thrown for more interceptions than touchdowns in his career. Take a look at his career stats on NFL.com. That's the last thing this team needs. I understand your frustration Chop, but anyone playing behind a line that gets beaten up and doesn't run the ball will have days like Orton had. QBs that win games all by themselves are very rare. I don't see one in the upcoming draft either.

LawDog
11-12-2009, 03:49 PM
I think Woody Paige has done an excellent job here and earned his pay with this column. After all, it generated a 100(ish) post thread in less than a day on a site not affiliated with the paper... Who cares what he actually said.

TXBRONC
11-12-2009, 03:53 PM
I think Woody Paige has done an excellent job here and earned his pay with this column. After all, it generated a 100(ish) post thread in less than a day on a site not affiliated with the paper... Who cares what he actually said.

:lol:

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 03:57 PM
Coaches have schemes that fit their players abilities. Look at almost any team in the NFL.

Any coach that is successful right now, has been in theor position for more than a year. They've had more time to obtain the players they want for their systems. If you can tell me that the Broncos 2 years from now are significantly the same as the Broncos today...I'll buy it. but there are still alot of changes that need to take place

OrangeHoof
11-12-2009, 03:59 PM
Typical Woody Paige nonsense. The only reason I'd start Simms over Orton is if our trouble appeared to be throwing the deep ball. I think our trouble is making the run game work which is not based on who hands them the football. Fix that problem and Orton ought to be okay.

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:02 PM
Any coach that is successful right now, has been in theor position for more than a year. They've had more time to obtain the players they want for their systems. If you can tell me that the Broncos 2 years from now are significantly the same as the Broncos today...I'll buy it. but there are still alot of changes that need to take place

I agree tons of changes need to take place. The Broncos this year are drastically different from last year. So I cant tell you we will be the same.

IMO our line cannot run what JMCD wants it to run. Why continue to run it if we know its going to fail? Why not mix in some ZB stuff. mix it up instead of the wild horse which scares no one.......

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:02 PM
Agreed. Great coaches run systems to fit the players rather than the other way around IMO. Don Shula is a perfect case in point, winning as an utterly land bound ball control coach until he got Dan Marino. The guy got to a Superbowl with David Woodley as a QB fer crissakes. In other words he worked with the assets he had and maximized them rather than pounding round pegs in square holes

I'm not going to say there wont be adjustments, but I dont see too many coaches that run a spread going to a WCO or vice versa. Look at the Eagles. Kolb isnt extremely mobile, but do you think Reid will switch to a pro-set or a spread when McNabb retires? Not a chance. He got a Westbrook clone to replace westbrook and another speed receiver this past year. He'll be WCO til he's done and he'll find players to fit his scheme.

Much the same way that Nolan wont be looking for a speedy Lb that is 230 pounds and good in coverage to play on the outside in his 3-4

red98
11-12-2009, 04:07 PM
Here is the rub, Orton can't throw down the field effectively. Everybody sees the eight or nine guys at the line of scrimmage and we still throw 3 yard passes when it's third and five. I don't think the coaches are being purposefully obtuse they simply don't have the tools to take different action. Somebody driving a Pinto in a NASCAR race isn't overlooking the possibility of passing on the outside they simply don't have the horsepower to do it. The same is going to be true of bronco playcalling until we change quarterbacks. On a related note this same lack of ability is killing the running game because the defense can simply focus on a limited portion of the field.

Everyone says Orton can't do this or that and maybe their correct. But I can't really judge if that's the case until Orton actually plays a game where he's asked to do it.

McKid's play calling has been far to conservative for my taste. What happened to the fearless play caller from NE?

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:14 PM
Everyone says Orton can't do this or that and maybe their correct. But I can't really judge if that's the case until Orton actually plays a game where he's asked to do it.

McKid's play calling has been far to conservative for my taste. What happened to the fearless play caller from NE?

I think we have a shit offensive coordinator too. I say that cause I had to look his name up.

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 04:17 PM
I think we have a shit offensive coordinator too. I say that cause I had to look his name up.

So our offensive coordinator is shit because you don't know who he is.

:offthedeepend:

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:19 PM
So our offensive coordinator is shit because you don't know who he is.

:offthedeepend:

Im sure most people dont know who he is. But he is a shit offensive coordinator because he has a shit offense.

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 04:19 PM
Im sure most people dont know who he is. But he is a shit offensive coordinator because he has a shit offense.

I'd hate to see your reaction if we were ACTUALLY as bad as you say we are...:eek:

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:24 PM
I'd hate to see your reaction if we were ACTUALLY as bad as you say we are...:eek:

On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 04:28 PM
On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

:bobsaget:

I dub thee :bobsaget:

Slick
11-12-2009, 04:30 PM
We have an offensive coordinator? I thought McDaniels was calling the plays.

Iron Horse72
11-12-2009, 04:31 PM
I would get pretty pissed in the past when we lost but now I just laugh it off.

I knew we wouldn't beat the Steelers or the Ravens so I just moved on.

Still have a lot of passion for the team, but I don't need to get worked up over it.

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:32 PM
I would get pretty pissed in past when we lost but now I just laugh it off.

I knew we wouldn't beat the Steelers or the Ravens so I just moved on.

Still have a lot of passion for the team, but I don't need to get worked up over it.

Im allot better than I used to be. I thought we had a chance to beat the steelers I wanted to believe we were legitimatley good.

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:32 PM
On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

No, but giving them away for free is only a very minor step in your reform

elsid13
11-12-2009, 04:33 PM
We have an offensive coordinator? I thought McDaniels was calling the plays.

Yes we do, yes he is. The OC has to be the best job in Denver. Seat around, drink some beer and get paid lots of money.

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:33 PM
Im allot better than I used to be. I thought we had a chance to beat the steelers I wanted to believe we were legitimatley good.

We are good. We lost to 2 very good teams. The Steelers lost to the Bears and a team we beat. Should they give up on their season too?

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:34 PM
Yes we do, yes he is. The OC has to be the best job in Denver. Seat around, drink some beer and get paid lots of money.

When ranking the salaries of NFL OC's, I have a funny feeling McCoy ranks somewhere around the bottom

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:35 PM
We are good. We lost to 2 very good teams. The Steelers lost to the Bears and a team we beat. Should they give up on their season too?

That makes me feel a little better. But the play calling is shit./

NameUsedBefore
11-12-2009, 04:36 PM
On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

The losses to Indy in the playoffs hurt so bad. Losing to the Steelers in the AFCC hurt a lot too, but something about those Indy losses just really got to me.

Dreadnought
11-12-2009, 04:37 PM
On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

I shut off Sirius NFL radio and the NFL Network until we win again. I can't stand it.

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:38 PM
That makes me feel a little better. But the play calling is shit./

Well, the line has been pretty sad the last 2 games. Missing Harris and having Hamilton forget how to block hasnt helped. Polumbus will improve and Hochstein cant do worse than Ben, so once the line is healthy, we should look better.

Hang in there princess. We'll be just fine

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:38 PM
I shut off Sirius NFL radio and the NFL Network until we win again. I can't stand it.

How can you listen to that horrid crap to begin with?

Slick
11-12-2009, 04:39 PM
When ranking the salaries of NFL OC's, I have a funny feeling McCoy ranks somewhere around the bottom

So he only makes half a million a year...poor guy.

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:40 PM
The losses to Indy in the playoffs hurt so bad. Losing to the Steelers in the AFCC hurt a lot too, but something about those Indy losses just really got to me.
Yeah, The super bowl losses were hardest on me. The loss to Jacksonville for the AFCCG.... I will be honest, I almost lost it.

Well, the line has been pretty sad the last 2 games. Missing Harris and having Hamilton forget how to block hasnt helped. Polumbus will improve and Hochstein cant do worse than Ben, so once the line is healthy, we should look better.

Hang in there princess. We'll be just fine

Thanks pops. :D

CoachChaz
11-12-2009, 04:43 PM
So he only makes half a million a year...poor guy.

I know...just doing a little comparative blabbering. I'll just say that as far as OC's go...he's probably not shopping at the same places as Jason garret...and I'll leave it at that

elsid13
11-12-2009, 04:46 PM
When ranking the salaries of NFL OC's, I have a funny feeling McCoy ranks somewhere around the bottom

You know kills me. This blurb about McCoy, almost sound like he was hired to merge the two systems (NE passing attack/ZBS) with Dennison and Turner help.


Mike McCoy, offensive coordinator: McCoy has spent 9 years with the Carolina Panthers, all on the offensive side of the ball, serving as quarterback coach, as an offensive assistant, and the last two years as the Panther’s passing game coordinator. McDaniels will call the plays on Sunday, but McCoy has worked in the New England system of offense and zone-blocking scheme at Carolina the past two years.

http://www.ffmastermind.com/os_view_article.php?id=403

Gimpygod
11-12-2009, 04:46 PM
On weeks we lose, I cant watch sports news or read about sports because I get so bummed. It used to really affect my life, I would have nightmares when we lost etc...

I dont like caring so much, but I do. At least I dont give blow jobs for crack money.

anymore

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:47 PM
You know kills me. This blurb about McCoy, almost sound like he was hired to merge the two systems (NE passing attack/ZBS) with Dennison and Turner help.


Mike McCoy, offensive coordinator: McCoy has spent 9 years with the Carolina Panthers, all on the offensive side of the ball, serving as quarterback coach, as an offensive assistant, and the last two years as the Panther’s passing game coordinator. McDaniels will call the plays on Sunday, but McCoy has worked in the New England system of offense and zone-blocking scheme at Carolina the past two years.

http://www.ffmastermind.com/os_view_article.php?id=403

QUick post it on Failblog.org!

NameUsedBefore
11-12-2009, 04:47 PM
Yeah I wish claymore would go back into that fold.

NameUsedBefore
11-12-2009, 04:47 PM
And by "fold" I mean sucking dicks for crack money.

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:49 PM
OK guys I never really sucked dicks. (Not for money)

TXBRONC
11-12-2009, 04:54 PM
I shut off Sirius NFL radio and the NFL Network until we win again. I can't stand it.

I've done the same more or less. I do want to see AFC Playbook to see what have to say about Denver's game against the Redskins.

claymore
11-12-2009, 04:56 PM
If Washington destroys us will someone panic with me? I need a panic buddy.

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 05:07 PM
If Washington destroys us will someone panic with me? I need a panic buddy.

You might need a shrink, and not just a buddy.

claymore
11-12-2009, 05:10 PM
You might need a shrink, and not just a buddy.

Im gonna call you drunk/.

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 05:11 PM
If Washington destroys us will someone panic with me? I need a panic buddy.

:laugh:

I think we'll see the boards explode if washington beats us.

I'm feeling pretty confident against washington though. But, if they DO destroy us, I'll be your panic buddy. :beer:

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 05:17 PM
Im gonna call you drunk/.

I'll talk you off the ledge. But I'm not telling you if you'll be jumping off of it or stepping down from it.

claymore
11-12-2009, 05:17 PM
:laugh:

I think we'll see the boards explode if washington beats us.

I'm feeling pretty confident against washington though. But, if they DO destroy us, I'll be your panic buddy. :beer:

Lets hope its not Haynnesworths coming out party!

claymore
11-12-2009, 05:18 PM
I'll talk you off the ledge. But I'm not telling you if you'll be jumping off of it or stepping down from it.

You were so nice before you made Editor in Chief.

MOtorboat
11-12-2009, 05:25 PM
You were so nice before you made Editor in Chief.

I've always been editor you maroon.

Slick
11-12-2009, 05:26 PM
Lets hope its not Haynnesworths coming out party!

He is going to own the interior of our line. Same as Ngata, Rogers, Hampton...etc. We'll have to throw to win.

dogfish
11-12-2009, 05:31 PM
He is going to own the interior of our line. Same as Ngata, Rogers, Hampton...etc. We'll have to throw to win.

or, they could try somethin' crazy like putting graham on the left side, calling a sweep and letting big #78 get rollin' out in space. . . . not every run has to be a dive up the gut. . .

Nomad
11-12-2009, 05:31 PM
He is going to own the interior of our line. Same as Ngata, Rogers, Hampton...etc. We'll have to throw to win.

Again, I don't see why McDaniels doesn't put Larson or Hillis in their to pass block or at least try it....Moreno looked pathetic!!

Slick
11-12-2009, 05:33 PM
or, they could try somethin' crazy like putting graham on the left side, calling a sweep and letting big #78 get rollin' out in space. . . . not every run has to be a dive up the gut. . .

I said that in the short yardage thread dog. That's the ticket.

Slick
11-12-2009, 05:34 PM
Again, I don't see why McDaniels doesn't put Larson or Hillis in their to pass block or at least try it....Moreno looked pathetic!!
The last two weeks, yes, but Knowshon's still been the best of all of our backs at picking up blitzes.

weazel
11-12-2009, 06:20 PM
without a run game you have no pass game. ...and vice versa.

balance... we need balance.

topscribe
11-12-2009, 06:50 PM
Yeah It was real hard overcoming 3 points of offensive production.

Yes it was, Clay. It was extremely difficult for the Steelers, and it didn't happen
until the 4th quarter when the Broncos' defense finally started to wear down . . .

-----

Ravage!!!
11-12-2009, 06:53 PM
actually... they shut down our OFFENSIVE production after the first drive of the game.

topscribe
11-12-2009, 07:05 PM
actually... they shut down our OFFENSIVE production after the first drive of the game.

Exactly . . . that's why the defense finally wore down.

I'm in agreement with everybody that the offense has to get better . . . and fast!

-----

Tned
11-12-2009, 07:42 PM
I agree. Barring a major disapointment in Orton, or a major pickup, he will be calling the signals next year.


heh... I don't htink McDaniels pulls the chord on him that quick. I think he has too much invested in Orton's success... PLUS.... we have too many holes to fill. I'm guessing Orton is an 'until' type of player..but that 'until' may be another season.

Orton is a free agent next year (seems to be some debate as to whether he will be RFA or UFA if next season is uncapped, but if they get a CBA in place, he will be unrestricted).

So, when you talk about him being the signal caller next year, he will need to be resigned as a free agent first.


Again, I don't see why McDaniels doesn't put Larson or Hillis in their to pass block or at least try it....Moreno looked pathetic!!

Did Larsen play any RB in college? Has he practed at RB for the Broncos?

Dreadnought
11-12-2009, 07:42 PM
How can you listen to that horrid crap to begin with?

Blind obsession. Same reason I'm here :D

TXBRONC
11-12-2009, 07:47 PM
Orton is a free agent next year (seems to be some debate as to whether he will be RFA or UFA if next season is uncapped, but if they get a CBA in place, he will be unrestricted).

So, when you talk about him being the signal caller next year, he will need to be resigned as a free agent first.



Did Larsen play any RB in college? Has he practed at RB for the Broncos?

I thought he just linebacker in college but I can't say that for fact.

weazel
11-15-2009, 03:31 PM
I hope today ends these crazy "Chris Simms for starting QB" threads.

LMAO

topscribe
11-15-2009, 03:39 PM
I hope today ends these crazy "Chris Simms for starting QB" threads.

LMAO

I just hope Simms plays well in the next series . . .

-----

topscribe
11-15-2009, 03:47 PM
This is turning out to be a comedy . . .

-----

topscribe
11-15-2009, 03:50 PM
Get well fast, Kyle!!

-----

weazel
11-15-2009, 03:51 PM
Ryan Leaf > Chris Simms

LRtagger
11-15-2009, 03:52 PM
Jamarcus Russell > Chris Simms

Northman
11-15-2009, 03:53 PM
Me>Chris Simms

dogfish
11-15-2009, 03:55 PM
wow. . . yea. . . good call on simms, there, fellas-- he really gave the O a spark. . . :tsk:

what was it, 2 of 11 for 6 yards and a pick? sure beats watching that stiff orton. . . .





the backup QB is always the most popular guy in town-- until he actually gets in there and plays. . . .

and there's a reason for that. . .

weazel
11-15-2009, 03:59 PM
I wanna punch this thread starter in the mouth!



not really, I wanna punch Simms in the mouth.

getlynched47
11-15-2009, 04:02 PM
There's a reason why Chris Simms hasn't been a starter since he injured his spleen........he sucks. Period.

Watchthemiddle
11-15-2009, 04:05 PM
wow. . . yea. . . good call on simms, there, fellas-- he really gave the O a spark. . . :tsk:

what was it, 2 of 11 for 6 yards and a pick? sure beats watching that stiff orton. . . .






and there's a reason for that. . .

This just goes to show how LITTLE some on here know about the QB position and football.

Well you got what you wished for...how did that turn out?

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:06 PM
This just goes to show how LITTLE some on here know about the QB position and football.

Well you got what you wished for...how did that turn out?

Orton still sucks. Simms inherited an even game and lost by 10 points. Waaaaaaaaa :cry:

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:07 PM
I wanna punch this thread starter in the mouth!



not really, I wanna punch Simms in the mouth.

Troll!

topscribe
11-15-2009, 04:09 PM
Orton 134.7 QB rating . . .

-----

weazel
11-15-2009, 04:10 PM
Troll!

youre funny...

first you whine Orton cant throw deep, he does and you claim only because the D had screwed up coverage.

So now youre saying he CAN throw deep, but its someone elses fault it worked


pathetic. you're ridiculous. :tsk:

Requiem / The Dagda
11-15-2009, 04:10 PM
http://wwwimage.cbsnews.com/images/2006/09/25/image2037186g.jpg

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/d/f/c/dfcca67c1f03c85f1d0e4e27270b7813.jpg

http://images.usatoday.com/sports/football/_photos/2006-09-29-wallace.jpg

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2007/players/02/06/simms0212/p1_simms.jpg


http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/09-06/0920simms.jpg


**** THIS DUDE!! **** him in the ear

NightTrainLayne
11-15-2009, 04:10 PM
Orton still sucks. Simms inherited an even game and lost by 10 points. Waaaaaaaaa :cry:

He inherited a 3 point lead, not an even game.

OrangeHoof
11-15-2009, 04:11 PM
I think Simms was rusty. How many snaps has he taken before Orton's injury?

He's not as bad as he looked today but he's not as good as Orton has been playing either. IOW, your typical NFL backup.

shank
11-15-2009, 04:12 PM
^ i've never seen so much rust.

topscribe
11-15-2009, 04:12 PM
I think Simms was rusty. How many snaps has he taken before Orton's injury?

He's not as bad as he looked today but he's not as good as Orton has been playing either. IOW, your typical NFL backup.

I don't buy that. I've seen all kinds of backup QBs come in and play just fine . . .

-----

wbmustang
11-15-2009, 04:12 PM
I think Simms was rusty. How many snaps has he taken before Orton's injury?

He's not as bad as he looked today but he's not as good as Orton has been playing either. IOW, your typical NFL backup.

This is not even an excuse. You are a PROFESSIONAL football player you should at least be able to make decent throws. If the reads were bad that may be rust but bad throws come on.

weazel
11-15-2009, 04:13 PM
He inherited a 3 point lead, not an even game.

clay doesnt care about details or reality...

weazel
11-15-2009, 04:14 PM
I think Simms was rusty. How many snaps has he taken before Orton's injury?

He's not as bad as he looked today but he's not as good as Orton has been playing either. IOW, your typical NFL backup.

they must have rubbed him down with salt before the game!

wbmustang
11-15-2009, 04:17 PM
Also there is no where you can throw Simms out there if Orton can't go. I rather see what Brandstater can do probably not worse than Simms.

weazel
11-15-2009, 04:20 PM
Bradley Van Pelt!

Dirk
11-15-2009, 04:22 PM
Rusty, crusty, I don't care what you want to call it. He sucked. Period

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:22 PM
He inherited a 3 point lead, not an even game.
My fault.

clay doesnt care about details or reality...
Im sorry I missed the 3 points that would have saved the game. Oh.... nevermind!

Medford Bronco
11-15-2009, 04:25 PM
Orton plays we win that game.

Simms is bad, I was wrong on him, I though he was okay. I hate football today.
Wash is atrocious

but Jay Cutler still sucks as well and for those who did not see Thursdays game is exhibit A

he would have thrown picks today vs Wash as well. He is a puke

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 04:27 PM
Oh Woody. How about the quickest player ever cut after a game artical?

Just tell Simms to leave his jersey and play book and leave him outside the locker room.

BigDaddyBronco
11-15-2009, 04:43 PM
Woody should break all of his fingers for writing that story. Terrible, just terrible.

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:47 PM
Orton plays we win that game.

Simms is bad, I was wrong on him, I though he was okay. I hate football today.
Wash is atrocious

but Jay Cutler still sucks as well and for those who did not see Thursdays game is exhibit A

he would have thrown picks today vs Wash as well. He is a puke

Great Post. Like how you brought a way to bash Cutler for no reason. Simms is bad, or else he would be the Bucs starting QB. Are you shocked? Orton sucks too, or else the Bears wouldnt have traded him.

None of our problems could be the game plan.

(I left out Cutler cause he had nothing to do with the loss)

broncobryce
11-15-2009, 04:48 PM
Some backups actually prepare "in case". Some don't. Obviously, Simms didn't. At least I hope he didn't.

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 04:48 PM
Great Post. Like how you brought a way to bash Cutler for no reason. Simms is bad, or else he would be the Bucs starting QB. Are you shocked? Orton sucks too, or else the Bears wouldnt have traded him.

None of our problems could be the game plan.

(I left out Cutler cause he had nothing to do with the loss)

:pantiesinabunch:

broncobryce
11-15-2009, 04:49 PM
Great Post. Like how you brought a way to bash Cutler for no reason. Simms is bad, or else he would be the Bucs starting QB. Are you shocked? Orton sucks too, or else the Bears wouldnt have traded him.

None of our problems could be the game plan.

(I left out Cutler cause he had nothing to do with the loss)

Cutler sucks otherwise the Broncos wouldn't have traded him. Is that your reasoning?

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:49 PM
:pantiesinabunch:

:pissedcauseimright:

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 04:50 PM
:pissedcauseimright:

Right about what?

BigDaddyBronco
11-15-2009, 04:51 PM
:pissedcauseimright:

What are you right about? Orton played great until he got hurt. Cutler has looked awful for the Bears.

Oh yea, you hated Simms. Ok, you were right about that.

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:52 PM
Cutler sucks otherwise the Broncos wouldn't have traded him. Is that your reasoning?

Nope.

Northman
11-15-2009, 04:52 PM
Cutler sucks otherwise the Broncos wouldn't have traded him. Is that your reasoning?

bwahahahahahaha. Oh man. owned.

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:52 PM
Right about what?


What are you right about? Orton played great until he got hurt. Cutler has looked awful for the Bears.

Oh yea, you hated Simms. Ok, you were right about that.

How did Orton play great?

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 04:53 PM
How did Orton play great?

:tsk:

Dude's rating was like 134.

Your Cutler is showing.

BigDaddyBronco
11-15-2009, 04:56 PM
:tsk:

Dude's rating was like 134.

Your Cutler is showing.

He is full blown Clobi mode, no reasoning with him.

Clay I pray that you are drunk.

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:56 PM
:tsk:

Dude's rating was like 134.

Your Cutler is showing.

Thats right, the 2 long throws into traffic that went for td's :laugh:

If he didnt make those throws he would be flipping burgers.

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 04:57 PM
Thats right, the 2 long throws into traffic that went for td's :laugh:

If he didnt make those throws he would be flipping burgers.

Shit if Tom Brady does not get drafted by the Patriots he does not have all those rings!

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 04:57 PM
Thats right, the 2 long throws into traffic that went for td's :laugh:

If he didnt make those throws he would be flipping burgers.

Oh, right, I forgot about those inaccurate 40 and 75 yard throws that went incomplete.

Damn!

You're right. Orton sucked today.

broncobryce
11-15-2009, 04:58 PM
I knew after a few losses people would be showing their true colors. Come on, man, the world is not ending, we are still better than 99.9 percent of the world thought we would be.

claymore
11-15-2009, 04:58 PM
Shit if Tom Brady does not get drafted by the Patriots he does not have all those rings!

Ok.........

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:01 PM
Oh, right, I forgot about those inaccurate 40 and 75 yard throws that went incomplete.

Damn!

You're right. Orton sucked today.
Not what I said but thanks for twisting it.

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 05:01 PM
Good quarterbacks find open receivers.

Chris Simms didn't do that. Kyle Orton did.

See what you want to see, but in my reality, in my opinion, what I saw, Kyle Orton is 10 times better than Chris Simms, and played one hell of a first half. Chris Simms sucked.

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:01 PM
I knew after a few losses people would be showing their true colors. Come on, man, the world is not ending, we are still better than 99.9 percent of the world thought we would be.

So you knew we would lose?

topscribe
11-15-2009, 05:02 PM
Thats right, the 2 long throws into traffic that went for td's :laugh:

If he didnt make those throws he would be flipping burgers.

Those two throws? That's alllllllllll Orton did?

:deadhorse:

-----

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 05:02 PM
Ok.........

Thats the same thing your doing with Orton. If, if, if. Luck, luck, luck.

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:02 PM
Good quarterbacks find open receivers.

Chris Simms didn't do that. Kyle Orton did.

See what you want to see, but in my reality, in my opinion, what I saw, Kyle Orton is 10 times better than Chris Simms, and played one hell of a first half. Chris Simms sucked.

What receivers did Simms miss?

topscribe
11-15-2009, 05:03 PM
What receivers did Simms miss?

:faint:

-----

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 05:04 PM
What receivers did Simms miss?

What is your point?

Are you really going to tell me that Simms played as well as Orton?

Seriously? Because if you are, you've completely lost it.

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:04 PM
Those two throws? That's alllllllllll Orton did?

:deadhorse:

-----
Yes, they accounted for well over half of our offense today. I think they are pretty important.

Thats the same thing your doing with Orton. If, if, if. Luck, luck, luck.

Explain.

BigDaddyBronco
11-15-2009, 05:04 PM
Good quarterbacks find open receivers.

Chris Simms didn't do that. Kyle Orton did.

See what you want to see, but in my reality, in my opinion, what I saw, Kyle Orton is 10 times better than Chris Simms, and played one hell of a first half. Chris Simms sucked.
All I know is that Orton gives us a chance to make the playoffs. With Simms we might not win another game (except maybe KC and OAK).

Right now I have more faith in Orton than our defense.

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:06 PM
What is your point?

Are you really going to tell me that Simms played as well as Orton?

Seriously? Because if you are, you've completely lost it.

He played as well or better than Orton last week, and he has had much less practice. He had like 13 snaps. Orton sucks too.

broncobryce
11-15-2009, 05:07 PM
So you knew we would lose?

Yes, I figured we would lose a couple games this year. I didn't think we would go 16-0.

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 05:07 PM
He played as well or better than Orton last week, and he has had much less practice. He had like 13 snaps. Orton sucks too.

Wait, so now we're talking about last week?

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:07 PM
Yes, I figured we would lose a couple games this year. I didn't think we would go 16-0.

Me too.

silkamilkamonico
11-15-2009, 05:10 PM
Simms is gabage.

Orton is average at best.

Neither is a good situation.

Deal with it.

claymore
11-15-2009, 05:11 PM
Simms is gabage.

Orton is average at best.

Neither is a good situation.

Deal with it.

Exactly.

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 05:13 PM
Explain.

If Orton does not hit 2 bombs, if Orton does not get soem luck etc..

If Brady gets drafted by a different team does he have all those rings?

All these if's you say for Orton go for the whole league. I know Kyle is not a world beater but he had the team on track to compeat for a W on the road after two rough games.

GEM
11-15-2009, 05:13 PM
Orton still sucks. Simms inherited an even game and lost by 10 points. Waaaaaaaaa :cry:

Even game? We were leading and our O was moving the ball before Simms came in the game. Orton sucks so bad he has a winning record in the NFL which in and of itself is a feat.

Simms ended the 2nd FULL half with negative yardage. Had he been able to complete a 1st down it would have given our D a chance to catch their breathe. We would have WON that game had Orton finished the game.

GEM
11-15-2009, 05:14 PM
Exactly.

Yet you can't even admit that Orton is average. You can't admit that he's what we have right now and in the situation he has done good for us.

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 05:14 PM
Even game? We were leading and our O was moving the ball before Simms came in the game. Orton sucks so bad he has a winning record in the NFL which in and of itself is a feat.

Simms ended the 2nd FULL half with negative yardage. Had he been able to complete a 1st down it would have given our D a chance to catch their breathe. We would have WON that game had Orton finished the game.

Don't even attempt to reason with his logic today...

GEM
11-15-2009, 05:15 PM
He played as well or better than Orton last week, and he has had much less practice. He had like 13 snaps. Orton sucks too.

Had Simms played against Balt or Pitt's defenses, he would have lost a kidney.

broncobryce
11-15-2009, 05:16 PM
If 27-15 is average, I'll take it.

Poet
11-15-2009, 05:16 PM
If you think Kyle Orton is average at best then you don't know football and shouldn't watch it. Period.

ikillz0mbies
11-15-2009, 05:17 PM
So who was in favor of Chris Simms starting other than Woody Paige?

What a load of bull this game was especially when spleenless wonder came in. How many consecutive incompletions did he have? Pathetic. Orton was having a field day against the number 1 defense against the pass. And for those who thought Simms would do a better job.....shame on you! I hope he doesn't start next week in a crucial game against the Chargers.....

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 05:17 PM
He played as well or better than Orton last week, and he has had much less practice. He had like 13 snaps. Orton sucks too.

That has nothing to do with this week? You would be all over Orton if this was flipped but you some how defend Simms? A back up should at least be ready to complete a few passes down field, is that not what he is getting paid to do? If starter gets hurt insurt stop gap?

topscribe
11-15-2009, 05:17 PM
Don't even attempt to reason with his logic today...

But then, Silk is making Clay look like an Orton groupie . . . :laugh:

-----

Overtime
11-15-2009, 05:20 PM
Chris Simms sucks. Shoulda let Brandstater play in lieu of Simms.

Denver Native (Carol)
11-15-2009, 05:22 PM
Chris Simms sucks. Shoulda let Brandstater play in lieu of Simms.

He was inactive

GEM
11-15-2009, 05:23 PM
Chris Simms sucks. Shoulda let Brandstater play in lieu of Simms.

As soon as Haynesworth went out of the game, I would agree with you. He needs the game time experience and definitely couldn't do worse than Simms. Negative friggen yardage....pathetic from a SEVEN year vet.

Overtime
11-15-2009, 05:24 PM
He was inactive

guess it's a real good thing that Simms didn';t get hurt then...Moreno woulda had to have been our QB, and that might not been real good either....:rolleyes:

not sure what Josh was thinking when he had Brandstater declared inactive.

GEM
11-15-2009, 05:27 PM
guess it's a real good thing that Simms didn';t get hurt then...Moreno woulda had to have been our QB, and that might not been real good either....:rolleyes:

not sure what Josh was thinking when he had Brandstater declared inactive.


It's hard to start and dress 3 QB's. Especially when your backup QB makes more than your starter and sucks ass.

Poet
11-15-2009, 05:28 PM
It's hard to start and dress 3 QB's. Especially when your backup QB makes more than your starter and sucks ass.

Rarely would I ever agree with him, but I do think you always have to dress 3 QBs.

shank
11-15-2009, 05:28 PM
brandy was in uniform on the sideline. he could only have played if simms got hurt, right?

BroncoAV06
11-15-2009, 05:30 PM
brandy was in uniform on the sideline. he could only have played if simms got hurt, right?

If you insert your 3rd QB then Simms would not be able to come back in untill Brand got hurt, I think thats correct.

Dean
11-15-2009, 05:36 PM
The third QB (not on the active roster for the game) can be used anytime. I believe.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d809f6279&template=with-video&confirm=true

WTE
11-15-2009, 05:46 PM
http://www.nflsite.com/players/s/simms_chris/simms_chris4.jpg

Looks like a High School freshman.

horsepig
11-15-2009, 05:50 PM
Simms was just a little rusty, LMFAO.

shank
11-15-2009, 05:50 PM
The third QB (not on the active roster for the game) can be used anytime. I believe.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d809f6279&template=with-video&confirm=true

ah, thanks. wish we would have taken advantage of that.

Magnificent Seven
11-15-2009, 05:51 PM
Simms Sucks!!! Seriously!!!!

Denver Native (Carol)
11-15-2009, 05:54 PM
guess it's a real good thing that Simms didn';t get hurt then...Moreno woulda had to have been our QB, and that might not been real good either....:rolleyes:

not sure what Josh was thinking when he had Brandstater declared inactive.

Same thing when John was playing. If it would have come down to the 3rd QB, it would have been Rod Smith. I don't know if there are any coaches who keep 3 QB's active for a game.

dogfish
11-15-2009, 05:59 PM
What receivers did Simms miss?

all the ones wearing denver uniforms. . . .

gobroncsnv
11-15-2009, 06:03 PM
appears that Josh is a better judge of QB's than most. Hopefully this beats back any further calls for Simms to start.

LRtagger
11-15-2009, 06:31 PM
Good thing these writers and forum GMs arent in charge. Moreno and Orton would have been on the bench for the entire game and we would have lost 80-0 with negative 97 yards of offense.

Overtime
11-15-2009, 06:49 PM
http://www.nflsite.com/players/s/simms_chris/simms_chris4.jpg

Looks like a High School freshman.

Very frightening how much he resembels Johnny Lawrence (William Zabka) from the Karate Kid

http://static.stuff.co.nz/1246579718/962/2562962.jpg

topscribe
11-15-2009, 07:44 PM
all the ones wearing denver uniforms. . . .

Simms did complete a long pass, though.

Of course, it was to a Redskin, but he did complete it!! :elefant:

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topscribe
11-15-2009, 07:48 PM
Simms' QB rating: 7.5 (not a typo)

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JDL
11-15-2009, 07:48 PM
I've certainly been a proponent of keeping Orton the QB this year and looking elsewhere in the future w/ Orton as the backup (He establishes what we want in terms of safety, but is not a championship type QB most likely.)

However, I do think it is fairly unfair to rip Simms like fans are. It is always tough for the backup QB, with limited reps, to come in and do well. But, yes I would agree we don't need the distraction of a QB controversy mid-season (been there done that) and this should end any chance of that happening, but I would not act like Simms is garbage based simply on him coming in for an injured Orton.

MOtorboat
11-15-2009, 08:44 PM
I've certainly been a proponent of keeping Orton the QB this year and looking elsewhere in the future w/ Orton as the backup (He establishes what we want in terms of safety, but is not a championship type QB most likely.)

However, I do think it is fairly unfair to rip Simms like fans are. It is always tough for the backup QB, with limited reps, to come in and do well. But, yes I would agree we don't need the distraction of a QB controversy mid-season (been there done that) and this should end any chance of that happening, but I would not act like Simms is garbage based simply on him coming in for an injured Orton.

Um, he was 3 of 13 for 13 yards. That's terrible, even if you don't get many reps.

Shazam!
11-15-2009, 08:52 PM
Simms completed 3 of 13 passes for 13 yards and an interception, which translates to a passer rating of 7.5.

For comparison’s sake, Orton’s passer rating against Washington was 134.7 with two long TD passes to WR Brandon Marshall.

End thread.

OrangeHoof
11-15-2009, 09:02 PM
I knew after a few losses people would be showing their true colors. Come on, man, the world is not ending, we are still better than 99.9 percent of the world thought we would be.

Indeed. I'm disappointed we lost today but we are so much further along than where I was expecting. And anyone with half a brain should realize that a top quarterback is still needed to make us a Super Bowl contender, not that Orton caused any losses but only that he's a limited QB better suited as a backup.

We need to shore up the o-line, the d-line (again), the kicking game, some depth and hope to do it before our secondary gets too old.

Really, were you expecting miracles?