OK, so who could/should be there for us at 12?

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Miami (1-15, 138-118) GLEN DORSEY
St. Louis (3-13, 131-125) JAKE LONG
Atlanta (4-12, 129-127) DARREN MCFADDEN (QB in round 2)
Oakland (4-12, 132-124)* CHRIS LONG
Kansas City (4-12, 132-124)* MATT RYAN
New York Jets (4-12, 133-122)** VERNON GHOLSTON
New England [from San Francisco (5-11, 119-137)] JAMES LAURINAITIS
Baltimore (5-11, 132-123)*** BRIAN BROHM
Cincinnati (7-9, 117-138)** SEDRICK ELLIS
New Orleans (7-9, 123-133) MIKE JENKINS
Buffalo (7-9, 132-124)* MALCOLM KELLY
Denver (7-9, 132-124)* Andre Woosdon, Ryan Clady, Keith Rivers, Dan Connor, Kenny Phillips, Jon Stewart, Malcolm Jenkins, Sam Baker, Calais Campbell, Jeff Otah is the likely list of next available draftees at #12.


I'm not trying to mock this thing out with certainty, but I think it's safe to assess certain palyers WILL be gone in certain areas of the draft. ie McFadden, Long and Dorsey are both locks in the top 4.

Given the list of players remaining (and even the ones after Bmore picks), I think we're in great position for an impact player. We may have to wait on the DT as Cincy has a HUGE need there, but still plenty of talent awaits us.

[Bronco9798]

Matt Ryan won't be going to the Chiefs at 5. Just dont see that happening. Chiefs will go with OL or CB at that pick.

[Zweems56]

Dan Connor is my guess.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Matt Ryan won't be going to the Chiefs at 5. Just dont see that happening. Chiefs will go with OL or CB at that pick.

Again, not locking em in. I do see him going high though.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Keith Rivers, Dan Conner, or Kenny Phillips would be very nice additions.

[The Hamburgler]

Lets take Andre Woodson. LOL, JK.

Lets take Kenny Phillips


mainly because i hate seeing our safeties giving WR's and TE's 10 + yards on coverage, and i dont want our safeties to be juked out by Tavaris Jackson again. And Kenny wouldnt let that happen lol

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Did U watch the Alamo Bowl last night? Connor is just damn good...always in position. That DT from A&M was soft as F. Always getting pushed around by an average OL.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Dan Conner is awesome... living in PA i get to see all the Penn State games, I've been to more than a few and I've meet the kid two or three times. I like Keith Rivers as well and Kenny Philips, so I don't think we can go wrong sitting at #12 and taking one of these players. I also like D.J. Williams progression at MLB and I feel better about taking an outside linebacker in the draft instead of a MLB and moving D.J. back to WILL.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Dan Conner is awesome... living in PA i get to see all the Penn State games, I've been to more than a few and I've meet the kid two or three times. I like Keith Rivers as well and Kenny Philips, so I don't think we can go wrong sitting at #12 and taking one of these players. I also like D.J. Williams progression at MLB and I feel better about taking an outside linebacker in the draft instead of a MLB and moving D.J. back to WILL.

I know it ain't happening, but I'd love for Shanny to move DJ to where he belongs and draft Connor AND a MLB like Goff or Bell. We have too many holes for that, but I think it's do wonders for the run D and make DJ happy since his contract is coming up soon.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Dan Conner is awesome... living in PA i get to see all the Penn State games, I've been to more than a few and I've meet the kid two or three times. I like Keith Rivers as well and Kenny Philips, so I don't think we can go wrong sitting at #12 and taking one of these players. I also like D.J. Williams progression at MLB and I feel better about taking an outside linebacker in the draft instead of a MLB and moving D.J. back to WILL.

I remember watching him in Hershey at the State Title game for Strath Haven. He was a man among boys out there. EVERYONE knew who he was just because of his presence all over the place.

Same w/ Puz too. When Hopewell played in Hershey I got to see him. He was RB as well and dominated on both sides of the ball.

[BOSSHOGG30]

I know it ain't happening, but I'd love for Shanny to move DJ to where he belongs and draft Connor AND a MLB like Goff or Bell. We have too many holes for that, but I think it's do wonders for the run D and make DJ happy since his contract is coming up soon.

I think Conner would struggle in the NFL if he wasn't a MLB or WILL linebacker.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Do you think Beau Bell can play OLB in the NFL? Some sites have him there as opposed to MLB.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Beau Bell 6'3" 245 4.65

Excellent size and bulk...Terrific range and can go sideline-to-sideline...Very good timed speed...Real aggressive and has a good motor...Strong and tough...Violent and reliable tackler...A decent pass rusher and blitzer...Does a nice job versus the run...Active and a terror in pursuit...Extremely productive and makes a lot of plays.

Has some durability concerns...Not as athletic as his workout numbers would lead you to believe...Has tight hips and does not do a great job in man coverage...Poor ball skills...Too aggressive at times...Has some trouble shedding blocks...Instincts are relatively average...Leadership abilities and work ethic have been questioned.

[BOSSHOGG30]

I would actually draft Andrew Studebaker in the 4th or 5th round as a future stud at WILL, leave D.J. at middle and draft Philip Wheeler in the 2nd or 3rd round. I would use the 1st round pick for DT or S. Wheeler is very good at playing over the tight end, I love his motor and big hit ability.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Tavares Gooden of Miami is another who could be around in the 4th or 5th where we have multpile pix to take a flier.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

So we also pick at #42, right? Since there are only 31 pix in round 1, and we will be in a rotation after that, we should be the 11th pick of round 2, right...giving us #42?

[TXBRONC]

So where is Frank Okam projected to go?

[Stargazer]

As of today, I want Kenny Phillips to be the #1 selection.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

So where is Frank Okam projected to go?

Consensus is saying late first. He looked very soft in the bowl game.

Marcus Harrison of Arkansas may be a 2nd-mid round option for us. He has more girth (310lbs) than Ellis and Balmer and plays tougher than Okam. I have always liked Dre Moore of Maryland as well. Matt Malele is a project for later rounds, but he is a gap plugger that may fit well for Bates.

[dogfish]

it's a long time 'til draft day, but as of right now otah is probably my choice of the guys who we can realistically expect to be there (no guarantee, of course). . . .

[SmilinAssasSin27]

it's a long time 'til draft day, but as of right now otah is probably my choice of the guys who we can realistically expect to be there (no guarantee, of course). . . .

I like Otah and although I wanna go a different direction w/ the #12, he would be the OT I'd want.


Another 2nd/mid round option could be Heath Benedict. He'd be a project but could fit any most of the OLine spots:

Heath Benedict 6'6" 320

Has excellent size and a large frame...A fantastic athlete with great quickness and agility...Is strong, powerful and gets a nice push...Light on his feet and slides well laterally..Mobile with terrific range..Versatile and could play a number of positions.

Didn't play against top competition..Very raw and has a ways to go when it comes to technique...Plays too tall...Average pass blocker...Is not very stout at the point of attack...Has some minor durability concerns....Might lack a killer instinct...Mental toughness has been questioned...Wasn't always dominate at the Division II level.

Born in the Netherlands...Was a elite prep recruit who began his college career at Tennessee but after redshirting in 2003 with a elbow injury he transferred due to academic troubles...Could also project to guard at the next level...One of the best small school prospects available and appears to have all of the physical tools that you look for..A really intriguing player who should test extremely well in workouts.

[atwater27]

I have a feeling Shanny will go best overall value regardless of need. I would not be surprised, depending on who is available, if he went with an O-lineman or something crazy like a WR or RB if someone special slipped down to us.

[Italianmobstr7]

I'm hoping we can get Dan Connor, Kenny Phillips, or the best available OL or DL.

[CoachChaz]

Carl Nicks is another guy that looks good to me in the middle rounds.
________
Portable vaporizers (http://vaporizer.org/portable)

[atwater27]

I would say Dan Connor would be a no brainer if available. I am concerned about his size though. 230 pounds. We need big bruisers to transform our defense, not little guys who can get blown away by a pulling guard.

[CoachChaz]

Assuming no one slips to us...I go with Phillips. We need playmakers on defense and he's the best one out there.
________
M21 (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/BMW_M21)

[Bronco9798]

I'm sure Shanny will have some surprises come draft day and we won't picking in that #12 slot.

[MHCBill]

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

[atwater27]

I'm sure Shanny will have some surprises come draft day and we won't picking in that #12 slot.

Yeah. Anytime Shanny is close to the top 10 in the draft you know he can't help himself. But then again he may trade down if some one makes a decent offer. I'd piss myself if we could get Dorsey.

[CoachChaz]

Yeah. Anytime Shanny is close to the top 10 in the draft you know he can't help himself. But then again he may trade down if some one makes a decent offer. I'd piss myself if we could get Dorsey.

He'd only be sadly wasted if Bates is still running the show.
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Lamborghini 400Gt Monza (http://www.lamborghini-tech.com/wiki/Lamborghini_400GT_Monza)

[BOSSHOGG30]

We are getting someone really good, we know that... picking in the top 12 doesn't happen too often for Denver... they better not mess this one up.

[atwater27]

He'd only be sadly wasted if Bates is still running the show.

I was thinking just that with him and Ellis.

[atwater27]

You still gotta wonder if Shanny has that "drunk and lost in a Vegas casino" look when he thinks of Darren McFadden.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Any good defensive coordinators available?

[CoachChaz]

I was thinking just that with him and Ellis.

Either one would be amazing in the middle with Thomas...IF we ran a traditional scheme. We could have one of the best young DL's in football if not for Bates and his garbage. If he's still here, I want Phillips. The kid is the complete package.
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F1 641 (http://www.ferrari-wiki.com/wiki/Ferrari_F1_641)

[atwater27]

Any good defensive coordinators available?

Ya think Singletary would be worth a look? I always pick him up in Madden:laugh:

[Skinny]

I'm hoping we can get Dan Connor, Kenny Phillips, or the best available OL or DL.I could go for either of those two if we sit still ....

[BOSSHOGG30]

Ya think Singletary would be worth a look? I always pick him up in Madden:laugh:

He will more than likely be a head coach in the NFL next season.... somewhere in Atlanta.

[Skinny]

I would say Dan Connor would be a no brainer if available. I am concerned about his size though. 230 pounds. We need big bruisers to transform our defense, not little guys who can get blown away by a pulling guard.I'm not concerned with weight Personally ... Zach Thomas is 230 soaking wet with pads on and the longer cleats but he could tackle a bus.

As long as the guy can tackle ...

[CoachChaz]

I'm not concerned with weight Personally ... Zach Thomas is 230 soaking wet with pads on and the longer cleats but he could tackle a bus.

As long as the guy can tackle ...

Can we please refrain from putting Dan Connor and Zach Thomas in the same sentence?

tia
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GUSTAV BRUNNER (http://www.ferrari-wiki.com/wiki/Gustav_Brunner)

[BOSSHOGG30]

I want Pete Rodriguez as our special teams coach and Leslie Frazier as our defensive coordinator

[Italianmobstr7]

I'm not concerned with weight Personally ... Zach Thomas is 230 soaking wet with pads on and the longer cleats but he could tackle a bus.

As long as the guy can tackle ...

I'd say that Dan Connor is damn good at tackling. The guy is the all-time leading tackler at Penn State aka Linebacker U...

[BOSSHOGG30]

Enough on the 2008 NFL Draft... when will Denver draft Knowshon Moreno?

[atwater27]

OK, so we pretty much have a consensus here, that barring a move up, down or an unexpectedly available player, hearing the name Connor, Phillips or Laurinitis would be acceptable to us all?

[BOSSHOGG30]

Dorsey, Chris Long, Jake Long, Philips, McFadden, Laurinitis, Conner, or Ellis

[Italianmobstr7]

OK, so we pretty much have a consensus here, that barring a move up, down or an unexpectedly available player, hearing the name Connor, Phillips or Laurinitis would be acceptable to us all?

I would agree with that. I'd be thrilled with any of those 3.

[atwater27]

a bunch of mocks have us picking Keith Rivers. Don't know anything about him. Would this be a reach?

[BOSSHOGG30]

a bunch of mocks have us picking Keith Rivers. Don't know anything about him. Would this be a reach?

No he is awesome too

[G_Money]

Keith Rivers = DJ Williams. Nothing wrong with him, would be a good weakside backer, is not a big leader and is not the most instinctive football player from what I've seen.

If we're gonna keep Williams in the middle, we could do worse than drafting his doppelganger to fill the hole at Will.

~G

[underrated29]

Hey guys for those of us interested in the draft, but have absolutely no idea about most players, do you think you could post their position next to their names.

I know phillips is a safety, right?
dmac we know
larinitus we know
long we know

But someof the others we might not, or atleast i might not. Well, i dont.

But if we ended up with S,LB,DT,OL-i would be happy.

I dont know much about stewart and its not a huge postition of need as we already got 3 capable backs, but from what i have heard he would fit our system the best. Is that true, would you be pissed if we snagged him?

[MOtorboat]

Enough on the 2008 NFL Draft... when will Denver draft Knowshon Moreno?

I think we should take a long, hard look at Justin Forsett.:D

[CoachChaz]

Rivers can definately fly and be a playmaker. Key word for this defense.
________
Do Brasil (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Ford_do_Brasil)

[MHCBill]

Enough on the 2008 NFL Draft... when will Denver draft Knowshon Moreno?
You know Zweems played against him...

If he hadn't mentioned it.

[Italianmobstr7]

Keith Rivers = DJ Williams. Nothing wrong with him, would be a good weakside backer, is not a big leader and is not the most instinctive football player from what I've seen.

If we're gonna keep Williams in the middle, we could do worse than drafting his doppelganger to fill the hole at Will.

~G

I agree. We could do much worse than snagging Rivers. The guy will be a good NFL LB.

[CoachChaz]

You know Zweems played against him...

If he hadn't mentioned it.

Just out of curiosity...Where are we getting the money for Johnson, Dansby, Faneca and Starks?
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FERRARI 330 HISTORY (http://www.ferrari-wiki.com/wiki/Ferrari_330)

[atwater27]

Just out of curiosity...Where are we getting the money for Johnson, Dansby, Faneca and Starks?

If you turn off the salary cap option on Madden, duh!

[CoachChaz]

If you turn off the salary cap option on Madden, duh!

Silly me. What was I thinking
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Vaporizer affiliate program (http://vaporizeraffiliateprogram.com)

[atwater27]

I do think we could land Dansby at a decent price though. That would be a sweet move, and would give us a playmaker at OLB.

[BOSSHOGG30]

I think we should take a long, hard look at Justin Forsett.:D

Yeah if we want another back who averages less than 4.0 yards per carry in the NFL.

[MOtorboat]

Yeah if we want another back who averages less than 4.0 yards per carry in the NFL.

Settle down Boss...it was a joke :elefant::elefant:

[BOSSHOGG30]

Settle down Boss...it was a joke :elefant::elefant:

:laugh::beer:

[MOtorboat]

:laugh::beer:

I love the :beer: smiley, but seriously, what's up with the glowing dude on the left?

BTW...I like OT Ryan Clady, Boise State, but wouldn't complain if we got Phillips, either...

[BOSSHOGG30]

I love the :beer: smiley, but seriously, what's up with the glowing dude on the left?

BTW...I like OT Ryan Clady, Boise State, but wouldn't complain if we got Phillips, either...

He is buzzing I guess

[MHCBill]

Just out of curiosity...Where are we getting the money for Johnson, Dansby, Faneca and Starks?

Retire: Smith, Lynch, Ferguson, Hamilton/Nalen

Cut: Gold, Walker, Henry

[CoachChaz]

Retire: Smith, Lynch, Ferguson, Hamilton/Nalen

Cut: Gold, Walker, Henry

We'd probably have a bigger cap hit if we cut Walker and Henry
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Amc Computerized Engine Control History (http://www.dodge-wiki.com/wiki/AMC_Computerized_Engine_Control)

[CoachChaz]

Yeah if we want another back who averages less than 4.0 yards per carry in the NFL.

Lynch got exactly 4.0 on a bad team
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SUBARU STELLA SPECIFICATIONS (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Subaru_Stella)

[MHCBill]

Take the hit... they are not worth the money anymore.

My humble opinion.

[CoachChaz]

Take the hit... they are not worth the money anymore.

My humble opinion.

I agree...but the hit would not leave us enough to sign those 4 guys.
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Honda H4 Transmission Specifications (http://www.honda-wiki.org/wiki/Honda_H4_transmission)

[BOSSHOGG30]

Lynch got exactly 4.0 on a bad team

With Pro Bowl tackle and a beef up o-line and one of the more favorable rushing defense schedules.

[BOSSHOGG30]

Henry's contract
3/5/2007: Signed a five-year, $22.5 million contract. The deal included an $8.5 million signing bonus and contains $12 million in total guarantees. Also included is a stipulation requiring Henry to pay back $6 million of his signing bonus if he's suspended for drugs at any point during the deal. 2007: $595,000 (+ $100,000 workout bonus + $35,000 per-game roster bonuses), 2008: $730,000 (+ $100,000 workout bonus), 2009: $1.375 million (+ $6 million guaranteed-for-injury option bonus due 3/1 + $100,000 workout bonus), 2010: $2.4 million (+ $100,000 workout bonus + $500,000 roster bonus), 2011: $3.9 million (+ $100,000 workout bonus + $500,000 roster bonus), 2012: Free Agent

Walker's contract
5/8/2006: Signed a five-year, $40 million contract. 2007: $600,000 (+ $6 million option bonus + $4 million roster bonus), 2008: $2.1 million (+ $4.4 million in offseason option bonuses), 2009: $5.6 million, 2010: $5.85 million, 2011: $6.7 million, 2012: Free Agent

[slim]

We'd probably have a bigger cap hit if we cut Walker and Henry

It looks like Javon wants out.

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2007/dec/31/javon-walker-open-leaving-broncos/

[MHCBill]

I agree...but the hit would not leave us enough to sign those 4 guys.
Are you sure?

If we have to we can keep either Henry or Walker, but not both.

My preference, lose Henry.

I'm still not sure even if we take the cap hits we can't sign those four free agents.

Cap goes up next year and with that many high priced retirees there should be enough room to absorb the cap hits and sign those players.

I'm not sure either, but if possible this is what I would do.

[atwater27]

We should just keep henry, use him while we can and wait for him to mess up with drugs again so we can recoup some money. He is still valuable to us. He is a monster when he is healthy.

[frauschieze]

It looks like Javon wants out.

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2007/dec/31/javon-walker-open-leaving-broncos/

Sounds like his ego can't handle being #2.

[CoachChaz]

With Pro Bowl tackle and a beef up o-line and one of the more favorable rushing defense schedules.

2007 run defense ranking...bolded are Buffalo opponents. Aside from a few...I think they faced the tougher ones more often.

1.MIN
2.BAL
3.PIT
4.WAS
5.TEN
6.DAL
7.PHI
8.NYG
9.ARI
10.NE (2x)
11.JAX
12.SEA
13.NO
14.GB
15.IND
16.SD
17.TB
18.CAR
19.HOU
20.STL
21.CIN
22.SF
23.DET
24.CHI
25.BUF
26.ATL
27.CLE
28.KC
29.NYJ (2X)
30.DEN
31.OAK
32.MIA (2X)
________
Hawaii Medical Marijuana Dispensaries (http://hawaii.dispensaries.org/)

[MHCBill]

Bryant Johnson wouldn't mind.

He's been a #3 for years, why not become a #2.

Plus he's a great run blocker.

[CoachChaz]

Are you sure?

If we have to we can keep either Henry or Walker, but not both.

My preference, lose Henry.

I'm still not sure even if we take the cap hits we can't sign those four free agents.

Cap goes up next year and with that many high priced retirees there should be enough room to absorb the cap hits and sign those players.

I'm not sure either, but if possible this is what I would do.

Lineman are just getting paid so much these days. It'd be tough to get two of the better ones out there.
________
N62 (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/BMW_N62)

[dogfish]

I like Otah and although I wanna go a different direction w/ the #12, he would be the OT I'd want.


Another 2nd/mid round option could be Heath Benedict. He'd be a project but could fit any most of the OLine spots:

Heath Benedict 6'6" 320

Has excellent size and a large frame...A fantastic athlete with great quickness and agility...Is strong, powerful and gets a nice push...Light on his feet and slides well laterally..Mobile with terrific range..Versatile and could play a number of positions.

Didn't play against top competition..Very raw and has a ways to go when it comes to technique...Plays too tall...Average pass blocker...Is not very stout at the point of attack...Has some minor durability concerns....Might lack a killer instinct...Mental toughness has been questioned...Wasn't always dominate at the Division II level.

Born in the Netherlands...Was a elite prep recruit who began his college career at Tennessee but after redshirting in 2003 with a elbow injury he transferred due to academic troubles...Could also project to guard at the next level...One of the best small school prospects available and appears to have all of the physical tools that you look for..A really intriguing player who should test extremely well in workouts.



thanks for the heads-up. . . i'm way behind on draft reading for this year, and any info is always appreciated. . . .

[dogfish]

OK, so we pretty much have a consensus here, that barring a move up, down or an unexpectedly available player, hearing the name Connor, Phillips or Laurinitis would be acceptable to us all?


everyone but me, i guess. . . . unless we do some heavy lifting in free agency, i'll be really disappointed if we take phillips-- not that i don't think he'll be a good player, but the best secondary in the league is just wasted if you can't stop the run or sustain drives on offense. . . i said it after last year and was right, and i'll say it again-- add all the skill position talent in the world, this team isn't going anywhere untill we get tougher and more talented in the trenches. . . .



*shrugs*



shanahan dones't care what i think, though, so we'll probably add a few bums in FA, then spend our 1st day picks on a safety and a running back. . .

[CoachChaz]

everyone but me, i guess. . . . unless we do some heavy lifting in free agency, i'll be really disappointed if we take phillips-- not that i don't think he'll be a good player, but the best secondary in the league is just wasted if you can't stop the run or sustain drives on offense. . . i said it after last year and was right, and i'll say it again-- add all the skill position talent in the world, this team isn't going anywhere untill we get tougher and more talented in the trenches. . . .



*shrugs*



shanahan dones't care what i think, though, so we'll probably add a few bums in FA, then spend our 1st day picks on a safety and a running back. . .

I think we already have the talent in the front 7...it's just not being utilized properly in this system.
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AIRSTREAM (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Ford_Airstream)

[slim]

everyone but me, i guess. . . . unless we do some heavy lifting in free agency, i'll be really disappointed if we take phillips-- not that i don't think he'll be a good player, but the best secondary in the league is just wasted if you can't stop the run or sustain drives on offense. . . i said it after last year and was right, and i'll say it again-- add all the skill position talent in the world, this team isn't going anywhere untill we get tougher and more talented in the trenches. . . .



*shrugs*



shanahan dones't care what i think, though, so we'll probably add a few bums in FA, then spend our 1st day picks on a safety and a running back. . .

I couldn't agree more. My hope is they will address the OL and DL via free agency and/or trade. Then if they want to take a LB or S on day one, be my guest.

[atwater27]

everyone but me, i guess. . . . unless we do some heavy lifting in free agency, i'll be really disappointed if we take phillips-- not that i don't think he'll be a good player, but the best secondary in the league is just wasted if you can't stop the run or sustain drives on offense. . . i said it after last year and was right, and i'll say it again-- add all the skill position talent in the world, this team isn't going anywhere untill we get tougher and more talented in the trenches. . . .



*shrugs*



shanahan dones't care what i think, though, so we'll probably add a few bums in FA, then spend our 1st day picks on a safety and a running back. . .
I totally agree with you, but if the 1st round talent in the trenches is gone by our pick, why reach? I personally hope we go after Haynesworth first and foremost and perhaps Fanaca or Starks if that doesn't work. But we are almost as F'ed at linebacker and safety as we are DT, so might as well get the best available linebacker or the best safety in the draft considering the top DE's, DT's and O-lineman will probably be gone before us.

[dogfish]

I think we already have the talent in the front 7...it's just not being utilized properly in this system.


i don't know. . . i thought gold sucked last year in a different scheme-- he doesn't look as fast as he was when he first came into the league, and he misses a ton of tackles. . . webster is adequate, but he takes bad angles and also misses too many tackles. . . engelberger is a stiff, and mckinley is a journeyman who got let go by the browns. . . the rest of our veteran DLs are a bunch of warm bodies-- i personally think they'd be better in a cover-2 type of scheme, but i'm not a big fan of guys in the 280 range playing DT. . . . i do like the potential of the young guys from last year's draft, and elvis is a stud, but dj is really the only LB on the team that i think is worth anything. . . . JMO, though. . . .

[frauschieze]

Haynesworth has been a monster this year but it's a contract year for him and he hasn't as well in the past. I still can't get over the face stomping of last season.

[dogfish]

I totally agree with you, but if the 1st round talent in the trenches is gone by our pick, why reach? I personally hope we go after Haynesworth first and foremost and perhaps Fanaca or Starks if that doesn't work. But we are almost as F'ed at linebacker and safety as we are DT, so might as well get the best available linebacker or the best safety in the draft considering the top DE's, DT's and O-lineman will probably be gone before us.

i'm assuming that haynseworth is gonna get franchised. . . corey williams is the guy i really want in free agency, and i hope we make a serious push to get him-- i wouldn't mind jordan gross either, but williams would be my top target. . . if we could sign him i think we'd be free to go after OT or LB in the 1st. . . i need to do more reading, and see what happens with the combine and the all-star games, etc, but right now i'm not so sure that a guy like otah would be a reach where we're going to pick. . . scott wright has him going somewhere around 11 in his last mock, and the guy obviously has tremendous upside. . . i'm not as sure with guys like baker and clady, but right now i'd feel pretty good about taking otah. . .

as for LB, i was hoping laurinaitis would be available, but he probably won't be if we pick at #12-- i wouldn't mind rivers, or possibly connor, but i think laurinaitis is a better prospect than either. . . ah well, what can you do?


:noidea:

[BigDaddyBronco]

i'm assuming that haynseworth is gonna get franchised. . . corey williams is the guy i really want in free agency, and i hope we make a serious push to get him-- i wouldn't mind jordan gross either, but williams would be my top target. . . if we could sign him i think we'd be free to go after OT or LB in the 1st. . . i need to do more reading, and see what happens with the combine and the all-star games, etc, but right now i'm not so sure that a guy like otah would be a reach where we're going to pick. . . scott wright has him going somewhere around 11 in his last mock, and the guy obviously has tremendous upside. . . i'm not as sure with guys like baker and clady, but right now i'd feel pretty good about taking otah. . .

as for LB, i was hoping laurinaitis would be available, but he probably won't be if we pick at #12-- i wouldn't mind rivers, or possibly connor, but i think laurinaitis is a better prospect than either. . . ah well, what can you do?


:noidea:
I agree with you on Williams. The Packers on usually frugal so he might get out of there. I bet his price tag makes us think that Graham was cheap.

A guy like Carlos Dansby can be brought in cheaper and we wouldn't have to use a 1st round pick on a LB.

If Phillips was a talent like some of the other Miami safeties he could really make a huge impact with playmaking abilities. Just having some pass coverage skills and some range (sorry John Lynch) would make a difference.

[underrated29]

well said dogfish.

Here's my thing on the whoole reaching thing. If you need a guy take him. Who gives a dam about value and if you had to reach or not. yeah there might be an all star saftey or a cant miss corner, But if its not a top priority then take the guy who is...you know..

Just like in my fantasy draft this year. I already had good rb's and Good qb, and i took housh and holt and traded back up to get boldin. the guys were like you are dumb, you totally reached for him....I was like what???? Are you serious? I am set at rb and QB and i dont care what effing round i take him in. As i wll now be set at wr. Who cares about value, yeah i could have waited and taken like lee evans or someone. But i NEEDED that guy..So what if i gave up my 6th rd pick and passed on bears d and evans etc. I got a good player and he helped me win my championship. I think the broncos should keep that in mind.

Not saying that if the right guy falls we shouldnt pull the trigger, but that whole thing about value is just stupid. You dont want a team that is all value guys that you got at the right value, you want a team that is good and will dominate. Regardless of where you took them. But S is a need and i wouldnt be upset, but if an excellent DT,OT,LB is there, imo REACH!!

[G_Money]

Not saying that if the right guy falls we shouldnt pull the trigger, but that whole thing about value is just stupid. You dont want a team that is all value guys that you got at the right value, you want a team that is good and will dominate. Regardless of where you took them. But S is a need and i wouldnt be upset, but if an excellent DT,OT,LB is there, imo REACH!!

We need:

S
LB
OL
DL
WR/KR
RB
FB

Would you be happy if we picked a mediocre WR/KR in the 1st based on his potential just because it was a need?

I wouldn't be - you can get a WR/KR later in the draft who's probably just as good as Ted Ginn Jr...I mean that hypothetical mediocre WR/KR.

That's the reach part.

You want to draft a guy who isn't likely to be there at your next pick, and who isn't the equal of 3 other guys who WILL be there at your next pick.

Sure, we can draft Okam with the 12th pick just because he's a DL...but is he better than Moore, Ellis, Bryant, et al? And will one of those guys be there in the 2nd?

If he's not significantly better, and one of them will be there, then don't draft Okam with the 12th pick. He's a reach.

The reason people are all over Phillips is because most of the other safeties have issues. He's the issue-free safety with the big upside. He could still flop, sure...but the 2nd round safeties, or 4th round safeties, are much MORE likely to flop. I wish he would have closed out his college career with ridiculously awesome play instead of just really good play, but he's still head and shoulders over the rest of the guys.

I like several safeties and safety projects in this draft, but it's not deep in em. And you can't say anybody is better than or equal to Phillips right now at the safety position. There WON'T be a guy with as good a chance to be an All-Star available in the 2nd round.

Personally, I'm infatuated with the idea of turning Woodyard into a SS from a weak-side backer, but I don't know how Woodyard feels about that and he'd be a project for sure.

Phillips starts tomorrow, and we're looking for starters. If we draft him, I won't cry.

~G

[dogfish]

I agree with you on Williams. The Packers on usually frugal so he might get out of there. I bet his price tag makes us think that Graham was cheap.

A guy like Carlos Dansby can be brought in cheaper and we wouldn't have to use a 1st round pick on a LB.

If Phillips was a talent like some of the other Miami safeties he could really make a huge impact with playmaking abilities. Just having some pass coverage skills and some range (sorry John Lynch) would make a difference.

dansby's actually near the top of my FA wishlist, but PFW said a month ago that the 'tards were starting contract negotiations with him, and that they're pretty committed to keeping him around. . . they've been cheap in the past, but now that they're raking in dough with that new stadium they seem a little more willing to shell out, and i have a feeling they'll franchise him if they can't get a deal done. . .


i'm kind of hoping that we look at safetes in FA-- there's going to be a pretty solid group available, and gibril wilson, madieu williams, yeremiah bell or eric coleman would all be upgrades. . .

[BigDaddyBronco]

Unfortunately, if we draft 11 or 12 we will probably not get Phillips. My guess is that he gets picked up by Cincy or New Orleans. Of course everything changes after combine, work outs, etc. so who knows.

[Skinny]

dansby's actually near the top of my FA wishlist, but PFW said a month ago that the 'tards were starting contract negotiations with him, and that they're pretty committed to keeping him around. . . .Yeah this was from a couple days ago df ... http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3170392

[dogfish]

Yeah this was from a couple days ago df ... http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3170392


thanks for the link, skin. . .


i was pretty sure they weren't going to let him go. . .

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Unfortunately, if we draft 11 or 12 we will probably not get Phillips. My guess is that he gets picked up by Cincy or New Orleans. Of course everything changes after combine, work outs, etc. so who knows.

Cincy needs DT and Ellis or a DE will likely be the call. Justin Smith is a FA. NO BETTER draft a CB. Even when they went to the NFC Title game, they got burnt deep regularly. Both Jenkins boys will be there and I bet NO takes one of em.

[TXBRONC]

Here we are talking about staying put at the 12th pick in the draft, but depending on who Shanahan targets he just as likely to try and move up or down.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

I'd be OK with a move back cuz we'd still get a OT like Otah or Clady, a LB like Connor or Rivers and get an additional pick. I personally am cool at 12 where we can possibly land Phillips.

[TXBRONC]

I'd be OK with a move back cuz we'd still get a OT like Otah or Clady, a LB like Connor or Rivers and get an additional pick. I personally am cool at 12 where we can possibly land Phillips.

I don't have problem with staying put. At the 12 spot we should come away with an impact player.

[mclark]

Matt Ryan won't be going to the Chiefs at 5. Just dont see that happening. Chiefs will go with OL or CB at that pick.

I agree. I think Ryan is vastly over-rated. I think the Chiefs will look for offensive line.

[mclark]

Consensus is saying late first. He looked very soft in the bowl game.

Marcus Harrison of Arkansas may be a 2nd-mid round option for us. He has more girth (310lbs) than Ellis and Balmer and plays tougher than Okam. I have always liked Dre Moore of Maryland as well. Matt Malele is a project for later rounds, but he is a gap plugger that may fit well for Bates.

Wasn't Marcus Harrison suspended after a drug arrest at the start of the season?

[BOSSHOGG30]

King Carl already said he doesn't see any QB's in the bowl games that have his interest or that would be an upgrade over Croyle.

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

kenny phillips baby, Will change the way we play defense.

[BOSSHOGG30]

kenny phillips baby, Will change the way we play defense.

Surprise... JWalk likes a Florida player. :D

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

Surprise... JWalk likes a Florida player. :D

HaHa thats the best player on the board at that pick in my mind.

[BOSSHOGG30]

HaHa thats the best player on the board at that pick in my mind.

He is a stud and the best safety by far available.

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

He is a stud and the best safety by far available.

Put Phillips and Hamza back there with Paymah and Bailey and Bly if he stays **i think he will** and that secondary is set. Then draft a big time DT and bring in a real MLB, Move Dj back ot weakside. Now thats a DEFENSE that can do something special.

[dogfish]

kenny phillips baby, Will change the way we play defense.



the way we play "defense" right now is by getting run on all day long and having no pass rush-- think a DB is really going to change that?

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

the way we play "defense" right now is by getting run on all day long and having no pass rush-- think a DB is really going to change that?

Yes because we can be versitile in how we play defense. And the thread was with the 12th pick what should we do. Kennny phillips would give us that ball hawk who can cover ground and fly up to support the run. This defense dont need thatmuch, Just a play making Safety and a real MLB and a big time DT and were pretty much set. Kenny Phillips is what this secondary has been lacking for years.

[SmilinAssasSin27]

I agree about Phillips, but think Abdullah is a bum. Gimme Hamlin in FA AND Phillips.

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

Hamlin is on the market?? Didnt know that ill take him also. But Hamza made some good plays and some bad plays for his first year starting. I mean he was a p squad guy. He played pretty well. He will never be an star safety though.

[WARHORSE]

Matt Ryan won't be going to the Chiefs at 5. Just dont see that happening. Chiefs will go with OL or CB at that pick.

You of course live up there in the redlands 9er. You really think they will move forward with Croyle?

I heard Peterson talking about what a big mistake it was of his to let his Oline get old. True.

That Oline kept them competitive for the longest.
I think they go Oline as well, but pass up a chance at Ryan?

Im not sure. They could always go QB in round two I guess.

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

After KC witness Broncos drafting there franchise guy, And Oakland drafting who they think is there franchise guy, Chargers have Rivers even though he aint ____. KC will probably go ahead and draft the big time QB, If not they will take one of the top Tackles as you all said,

[SmilinAssasSin27]

Hamlin is on the market?? Didnt know that ill take him also. But Hamza made some good plays and some bad plays for his first year starting. I mean he was a p squad guy. He played pretty well. He will never be an star safety though.


Yeah, Hamlin only signed a 1 year deal w/ Dallas.

Top 2008 Free Agent DB

Asante Samuel, UFA, New England Patriots
Samuel is quickly becoming known as one of the best cornerbacks in the NFL, having posted a league-best ten interceptions last season. He has followed it up with six interceptions this season, and while his interception totals have been impressive, so has his ability to stick to receivers on a regular basis. He’s shutdown quality receivers, helping the Patriots to an undefeated record through so far. If Samuel is not signed to an extension, he’ll command big dollars on the market.

Mike Doss, UFA, Minnesota Vikings
The former Colts safety has a new home this season, and if he can avoid injury, he could see a long-term deal from Minnesota. Doss The former Colts safety has a new home this season, but he hasn’t played well enough to earn a starting role and has been on the field during just eight games with little to show for it. Doss recorded a pair of interceptions in just six games during the ’06 season, and had two picks each of the three seasons prior to ‘07. He has some ability and playoff experience under his belt. He’ll likely have to take that ability and experience to a new home for ’08.

Domonique Foxworth, RFA, Denver Broncos
Foxworth is used mainly as a nickel defender, and while fast, he doesn’t always make the best play on the ball. He’s just 24, so experience and playing time should help his development. If another team thinks he can be a top two cornerback, he may seek to leave Denver to take on that bigger role. His RFA status will make it difficult to pull him away from the Broncos, but the cornerback position is one of great significance in the modern NFL, so there’s a chance.

Drayton Florence, UFA, San Diego Chargers
Florence held onto his starting spot over Antonio Cromartie when it was thought that Cromartie would win the job early. However, even though the veteran showed his resolve and stepped up his play, Cromartie will probably be the starter next season. Florence is not a shutdown type of player, but he does make plays when he needs to most of the time and he had three interceptions in 2006 with two this season. The Chargers can afford to let him hit the market, and the best bet is that Florence will find a starting position somewhere else come next season.

Randall Gay UFA New England Patriots
Gay is just 25, and while he benefits from playing for a solid Patriots team, he is still a decent player in his own right. He’s been able to step up even more this season and post solid numbers, while also showing more consistency. He has registered 37 total tackles to go along with three interceptions. The Patriots and Gay will look to keep him in New England, but a few teams could jump in and try to lure him away, including the New York Jets, who were interested in Gay last offseason.

Marcus Trufant, UFA, Seattle Seahawks
Trufant’s contract has voided based on playing time and given the team’s commitment to other players at his position, it appears that the cornerback will be looking for a starting position elsewhere. His 2004 season was easily his best, when he compiled 96 total tackles, five interceptions, and a sack. He was unable to match that type of production until this season, in which he has 77 total tackles and seven interceptions. He will be one of the top defensive targets on the market.

Ken Hamlin, UFA, Dallas Cowboys
The Arkansas product has 59 total tackles and five interceptions, and has helped Dallas to one of the league’s best records. Hamlin is still young at 26, and should have several seasons ahead of him, so there will be teams interested in using him at the safety spot. Dallas will look to sign him to an extension so that they can continue to benefit from his play.

Other Free Agent Cornerback
Chris Carr RFA Oakland Raiders
Tory James UFA New England Patriots
Karl Paymah RFA Denver Broncos
B.J. Sams UFA Baltimore Ravens
Chad Scott UFA New England Patriots


Other Free Agent Safety
William Bartee UFA Kansas City Chiefs
Jay Bellamy UFA New Orleans Saints
Omar Stoutmire UFA Washington Redskins
Derrick Strait UFA Carolina Panthers
Gibril Wilson UFA New York Giants

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

wOULD BE NICE TO BRING IN TRUFANT AND HAMLIN.......DUMP BLY AND DRAFT PHILLIPS

[dogfish]

wOULD BE NICE TO BRING IN TRUFANT AND HAMLIN.......DUMP BLY AND DRAFT PHILLIPS

why not keep bly as a nickel back?













seriously, cornerback may be the strongest position on the team right now, and you think we should take a cap hit to release and replace bly when we're looking at starting eric pears and ryan harris at offensive tackle, and rotating larry, curly and moe with marcus thomas at defensive tackle? everybody's entitled to their opinion, but i'd say that's about as far from wise use of our limited cap dollars in free agency as i can imagine. . .



once again, we'd be relying on a bunch of 2nd day guys to shore up the lines, the biggest weaknesses on the team-- exactly what's killed us the past few years. . . luckily, there's approximately as much chance of the broncos signing me as marcus trufant. . .

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

Uhhh Bly is not on trufants level, Bly cant tackle, Bly is dominated when teams run his way. Ive said before i dont think Bly will be gon, But heyyy if we could dump him and get trufant then im all for it, If he stays then we better draft Phillips because the pump fake smokes him everytime,

[mopatt24]

Hamlin is on the market?? Didnt know that ill take him also. But Hamza made some good plays and some bad plays for his first year starting. I mean he was a p squad guy. He played pretty well. He will never be an star safety though.

I believe Hamza played out of position as well. He took over at SS but was listed as FS behind Lynch.

[Jwalk - JayCutty6Goes - CasinoRoyal]

^^^yOUR RIGHT HE IS SUPPOSE TO BE PLAYING FS, NOT SS

[mopatt24]

I expect Hamza to take over at FS. I also like Jamar Adams from Michigan, if we take a LB in the first, we can take Adams in the second

[Watchthemiddle]

^^^yOUR RIGHT HE IS SUPPOSE TO BE PLAYING FS, NOT SS

As good as he played at times for us this year, I think he woulb be even better at FS.

[Broncospsycho77]

If we don't address LB in free agency, then I think that we should take a linebacker at 12, especially considering the depth of this year's LB class. I think that one thing the Broncos lacked last year was passion, and if we can get a passionate guy like Laurinaitis or Connor, they could fire up the D and give them incentive to play.

Now given, DT is a big need in this draft, but I think that we'll pick up somebody this offseason, whether it be Haynesworth or somebody else, but DT should be addressed before the draft to even become mediocre. There's too big of a drop off this year in talent at that position.

Whether we stay with Bates or go back to a 1 gap system, linebacker will still be an issue. Williams is a stud, but I don't think he should lead this team; he should lead by example, hopefully at Will. One of those Big 10 LBs will definitely step up as leaders, as they have this year. They are athletic monsters, and their actions and demeanor mirror that persona. I want somebody that eats, breathes, and just oozes passion, and those 2 guys are just right for that.