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View Full Version : Top 12 pick, what do they do with it?



weazel
12-30-2007, 07:39 PM
I dont see Denver using the first pick where it is at, I see a trade down. With as many needs as this team has, they need to add picks. The Broncos have holes on both lines, LB, and safety... lets hope the lines for sure are rebuilt.

your thoughts?

BOSSHOGG30
12-30-2007, 07:40 PM
Gold is good as gone and we still need D-line help, so I say we should stay put and get best available DE, DT, LB, or S.

claymore
12-30-2007, 07:41 PM
People will disagree, but we need an Oline first, and a Dline second. Im sick of Cutler snapping the ball, and having pressure the second he looks at his second read...... If it wasnt for Marshal making fantastic catches our record would be alot worse..............

weazel
12-30-2007, 07:42 PM
looks like the freaks are moving in on this forum! :beer:

claymore
12-30-2007, 07:43 PM
Kinda cool when you think of it, but this is the first offseason for this board correct?

UnderArmour
12-30-2007, 07:44 PM
Take the best player available(Outside of QB). That's the best idea.

Watchthemiddle
12-30-2007, 07:45 PM
If there is an immediate impact player available at #12 or where ever we end up I could see us taking him.

All likely though, we will trade down and stockpile. I don't see us trading up.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 07:48 PM
For Denver to think about trading down I think there are a couple of questions to answer.

1.) How deep is this draft?

2.) Will there be a huge drop off in talent from the first round to the second round and beyond?

Stargazer
12-30-2007, 08:04 PM
Denver should keep the pick & select DT/LB/S.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:07 PM
Denver should keep the pick & select DT/LB/S.

I agree if winning this game means we slipped two spots in the draft order I think would be well worth our while to keep the pick.

Skinny
12-30-2007, 08:15 PM
Gold is good as gone...With Winborn's play as his hit against the salary cap compared to Gold's, i'd have to agree with ya. I'm not 100% of course but it certainly looks to be very possible ...

Of course Gold could be asked to take a pay cut to stay as well ...
People will disagree, but we need an Oline first...I don't disagree with ya on the 'need' fact ... it's obvious IMO. But i prefer to look for help in FA rather than the Draft when it comes to the O-line ... but that's just me though ...

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 08:15 PM
LB is VERY deep and Safety is VERY weak. Although I agree that we need LB and DT more than S, we can wait on both if Kenny Phillips is there.

I think OT should be handled via FA and DT in the mid rounds of teh draft.

I'd go S at 12 if Kenny is there, then LB.

If Kenny is gone, gimme Ellis at DT or Connor at LB than a LB in round 2.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 08:16 PM
I would stand pat though. No tinkering w/ the 12th. We can get a difference maker there. Besides, we have plenty of mid round pix and Foxxy and Gold if we wanna trade back in later on.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:17 PM
I would stand pat though. No tinkering w/ the 12th. We can get a difference maker there. Besides, we have plenty of mid round pix and Foxxy and Gold if we wanna trade back in later on.

I just wished we had a 3rd round pick.

Tned
12-30-2007, 08:30 PM
Gold is good as gone and we still need D-line help, so I say we should stay put and get best available DE, DT, LB, or S.

While we definately need to draft/buy a pass rush, we also need to do something with the pass blocking. Shanny and company either need to go back to the play calling they used in '04/'05 or get an o-line that can pass block.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:37 PM
While we definately need to draft/buy a pass rush, we also need to do something with the pass blocking. Shanny and company either need to go back to the play calling they used in '04/'05 or get an o-line that can pass block.

I understand why Shanahan likes the undersized offensive linemen but it is not impossible to run his scheme with bigger offensive line that wont get over powered at the point of attack as often.

Stargazer
12-30-2007, 08:37 PM
I just wished we had a 3rd round pick.

The Jarvis Moss trade...

I think Denver should've just stand pat when that deal went down.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:40 PM
The Jarvis Moss trade...

I think Denver should've just stand pat when that deal went down.

I knew the reason.

I don't disagree with you maybe they should have, but I also remember at the time they were concerned that Moss was going to be gone before we picked.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 08:41 PM
The Jarvis Moss trade...

I think Denver should've just stand pat when that deal went down.

I can't blame him for that. He went into the draft w/ 3 names on his short list. The other 2 were gone. He did what he felt he had to.

I think one was Adam Carriker, DT/DE from Nebraska who went to St. Louis. The other was the Tennessee DT, Justin Harrell, who went to GB. Interesting how things may have changed had they lasted til Denver's pick...being DTs and all.

Tned
12-30-2007, 08:45 PM
Gold is good as gone and we still need D-line help, so I say we should stay put and get best available DE, DT, LB, or S.


I understand why Shanahan likes the undersized offensive linemen but it is not impossible to run his scheme with bigger offensive line that wont get over powered at the point of attack as often.

Or, go back to playcalling that works with the smaller line.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:46 PM
I can't blame him for that. He went into the draft w/ 3 names on his short list. The other 2 were gone. He did what he felt he had to.

I think one was Adam Carriker, DT/DE from Nebraska who went to St. Louis. The other was the Tennessee DT, Justin Harrell, who went to GB. Interesting how things may have changed had they lasted til Denver's pick...being DTs and all.

Yeah, with two of his top three choices gone and thought Moss could be gone as well I can't fault Shanahan for moving up to get Moss.

omac
12-30-2007, 08:51 PM
DT. And Lepsis was being beaten way too easily, so an LT would be okay too.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 08:58 PM
Or, go back to playcalling that works with the smaller line.

If you're meaning going back to how the offense was run with Jake under center I don't know T. We didn't use a lot of multiple receiver sets and in my opinion I think we started losing the nice run/pass balance that Shanahan loves to have.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:00 PM
DT. And Lepsis was being beaten way too easily, so an LT would be okay too.

I think on the whole of the season Lepsis did well for a guy coming off a knee injury.

Tned
12-30-2007, 09:06 PM
If you're meaning going back to how the offense was run with Jake under center I don't know T. We didn't use a lot of multiple receiver sets and in my opinion I think we started losing the nice run/pass balance that Shanahan loves to have.

In the '04/'05 time frame, we were among the most balanced team in football, with nearly a 50/50 ratio, which is considered VERY run heavy in the NFL.

I know we didn't use many multi-receiver, but that is because the only way to effectively pass with the tiny line, was running two TE and two RB + TE sets, that we could both run and pass out of. Little bootlegs to the TE for 4 yard pickups and stuff like that.

I am not saying it is ideal, but right now he or Heimerdinger/dennison are calling plays like they have a line capable of straight up pass blocking, but they have a line capable of running the plays they called a couple of years ago with success.

I would much prefer the ability to run 4 and 5 wide sets at times, but our line doesn't appear capable of pulling that off, except when they are playing OUR defense.

keithbishop
12-30-2007, 09:09 PM
LB is VERY deep and Safety is VERY weak. Although I agree that we need LB and DT more than S, we can wait on both if Kenny Phillips is there.

I think OT should be handled via FA and DT in the mid rounds of teh draft.

I'd go S at 12 if Kenny is there, then LB.

If Kenny is gone, gimme Ellis at DT or Connor at LB than a LB in round 2.

I agree. OT should be addressed in FA. I'd be surprised if we end up with more than 1 impact player in FA and both Cutler and the running game could be helped tremendously by improvement at OT.

2 of the following: DT/S/LB can be addressed in the 1st 2 rounds without reaching. I'd prefer to stand pat with pick #12, but trading down is always an option.

So many holes, so few picks.....

keithbishop
12-30-2007, 09:11 PM
I think on the whole of the season Lepsis did well for a guy coming off a knee injury.

I'm OK with another season of Lepsis/working in Ryan Harris when possible. RT needs to be addressed.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:16 PM
In the '04/'05 time frame, we were among the most balanced team in football, with nearly a 50/50 ratio, which is considered VERY run heavy in the NFL.

I know we didn't use many multi-receiver, but that is because the only way to effectively pass with the tiny line, was running two TE and two RB + TE sets, that we could both run and pass out of. Little bootlegs to the TE for 4 yard pickups and stuff like that.

I am not saying it is ideal, but right now he or Heimerdinger/dennison are calling plays like they have a line capable of straight up pass blocking, but they have a line capable of running the plays they called a couple of years ago with success.

I would much prefer the ability to run 4 and 5 wide sets at times, but our line doesn't appear capable of pulling that off, except when they are playing OUR defense.


There are a few things I think should be taken into consideration. We did lose two of our best interior linemen. Our starting left tackle was coming back from a major injury and I think our right guard and tackle are questionable. Pears might still develop into a solid tackle but there just something about Holland that I'm sold on.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:17 PM
I'm OK with another season of Lepsis/working in Ryan Harris when possible. RT needs to be addressed.


I'm not sold on our right guard as well. More so him than Pears.

DenBronx
12-30-2007, 09:26 PM
jamal was one of the 3 de's on shannys list. i think carriker was the 2nd so he had to make a move. i wish now we had styaed put and picked nelson or beason. then we would have got an impact player and still had our 3rd round pick. :laugh:

broncofanatic1987
12-30-2007, 09:28 PM
The Jarvis Moss trade...

I think Denver should've just stand pat when that deal went down.

Jarvis Moss has nothing to do with us not having a 3rd round pick in the next draft. He's the reason we didn't have a 3rd round pick in the last draft. Marcus Thomas is to blame for us not having a 3rd round pick in the next draft. The Broncos gave up the last draft's 6th and 7th round picks plus the 2008 3rd to the Vikings so they could take Thomas in the 4th in the 2007 draft. I don't think the trade was worth it, but that's what it was.

Whichever pick the Broncos get in the 2008 draft, I hope they keep it and get a good player. If they trade, it will likely be to move up, not down.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 09:29 PM
I know that Harrell was one of em cuz once he went, that's why Shanny moved up. he mentioned it on draft day...don't ask for a link...been way too long and I'm kinda lazy.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:30 PM
I know that Harrell was one of em cuz once he went, that's why Shanny moved up. he mentioned it on draft day...don't ask for a link...been way too long and I'm kinda lazy.

I know you're right because I remember Shanahan mentioning it on draft day as well.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 09:31 PM
Jarvis Moss has nothing to do with us not having a 3rd round pick in the next draft. He's the reason we didn't have a 3rd round pick in the last draft. Marcus Thomas is to blame for us not having a 3rd round pick in the next draft. The Broncos gave up the last draft's 6th and 7th round picks plus the 2008 3rd to the Vikings so they could take Thomas in the 4th in the 2007 draft. I don't think the trade was worth it, but that's what it was.

Whichever pick the Broncos get in the 2008 draft, I hope they keep it and get a good player. If they trade, it will likely be to move up, not down.

I think that in time it will have been well worth it. Thomas is definitely woth a 3rd rounder and the last 2 pix were almost worthless given the ability to sign undrafted FAs.

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:34 PM
I think that in time it will have been well worth it. Thomas is definitely woth a 3rd rounder and the last 2 pix were almost worthless given the ability to sign undrafted FAs.

I remembering hearing that if Thomas has not been kicked off the Florida football team he would have graded out as 1st round pick.

Tned
12-30-2007, 09:35 PM
There are a few things I think should be taken into consideration. We did lose two of our best interior linemen. Our starting left tackle was coming back from a major injury and I think our right guard and tackle are questionable. Pears might still develop into a solid tackle but there just something about Holland that I'm sold on.

I know, but I am looking at what happened last year as well. The season opened last year with a clear change in the play calling, even when Jake was under center. I believe that was the changes that Heimerdinger was brought in to add, but we didn't have players capable of pulling it off.

I would love to be wrong, and that if Nalen and Hamilton (who many people claimed last year got knocked around like bowling pins) come back healthy and Lepsis is another year removed from his injury, maybe our line will be capable of blocking on their own, to allow for spread formations, but I don't think that will be the case. More times than not, the pressure comes on both ends when our tackles get badly beat.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 09:36 PM
I remembering hearing that if Thomas has not been kicked off the Florida football team he would have graded out as 1st round pick.

Yep...it was a stupid move on his part to break curfew with his team and be seen by someone who knew he was on "team probation", but I chalk that one up to immaturity. He seemingly has grown up since then.

Tned
12-30-2007, 09:38 PM
Yep...it was a stupid move on his part to break curfew with his team and be seen by someone who knew he was on "team probation", but I chalk that one up to immaturity. He seemingly has grown up since then.

I read somewhere that Henry took Thomas under his wing, that's probably why Thomas cleaned up is act. ;)

:laugh:

Skinny
12-30-2007, 09:38 PM
I would be happy with Sedrick Ellis. Addressing the DT is a biggy for this Defense. And Kenny Philips would'nt cause me to beat up my T.V. either ... he could help address the run and pass Defense ...


I know that Harrell was one of em cuz once he went, that's why Shanny moved up. he mentioned it on draft day...don't ask for a link...been way too long and I'm kinda lazy.One of a few that had this reported ...

http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/sports/packers/index.php?ntid=253455

TXBRONC
12-30-2007, 09:42 PM
I read somewhere that Henry took Thomas under his wing, that's probably why Thomas cleaned up is act. ;)

:laugh:


Great Denver's version of Cheech and Chong. :laugh:

broncofanatic1987
12-30-2007, 09:43 PM
I think that in time it will have been well worth it. Thomas is definitely woth a 3rd rounder and the last 2 pix were almost worthless given the ability to sign undrafted FAs.

I won't hold my breath on Thomas making the trade worth it. We could have used the 7th round pick to take Paul Soliai instead of letting him go undrafted and signed by Miami. Soliai has the physical dimensions to be the run stopper our defensive tackles were supposed to be in the new scheme. I believe he was projected to be a 3rd or 4th round pick, but for whatever reason, he went undrafted, but still might have been a better fit than Thomas.

We definitely could have used the 3rd round pick this year. We better make the right moves in free agency because we're not going to have many opportunities to get it right in the draft.

HolyDiver
12-30-2007, 09:46 PM
LB is VERY deep and Safety is VERY weak. Although I agree that we need LB and DT more than S, we can wait on both if Kenny Phillips is there.

I think OT should be handled via FA and DT in the mid rounds of teh draft.

I'd go S at 12 if Kenny is there, then LB.

If Kenny is gone, gimme Ellis at DT or Connor at LB than a LB in round 2.

Lepsis will be back next year and even healthier after a full year after his knee injury..............He did just fine. Let Foster and Pears fight over the RT............Kuper, Myers and Holland did very well IMO. Let's go all Defense in the first three picks.............And we can worry about the Offense again in 2009. If you ask me, besides replacing Lepsis, which can wait another year, the Offense is set. Once healthy, we can have a starting lineup of the following..........Marshall, Walker, Stokley, Sheffler ( his pass catching abilities outweighs Grahams slightly better blocking abilities) Lepsis, Kuper, Myers, Holland, HARRIS or Pears...............Cutler and Young.............Going without a Fullback because Marshall and Walker are both excellent blockers.............We would go with three Wide Receivers, one TE and one Runningback who is a very good Receiver out of the backfield. ..............Concentrate on a stud DT and Middle Linebacker, so DJ can dominate at the weakside...............And I know we have a shot at Jamie Silva(S) and Craig Steltz (S) in the 3rd or 4th round, is we could trade both 4th round picks for a 3rd.

BOSSHOGG30
12-30-2007, 09:48 PM
Lepsis will be back next year and even healthier after a full year after his knee injury..............He did just fine. Let Foster and Pears fight over the RT............Kuper, Myers and Holland did very well IMO. Let's go all Defense in the first three picks.............And we can worry about the Offense again in 2009. If you ask me, besides replacing Lepsis, which can wait another year, the Offense is set. Once healthy, we can have a starting lineup of the following..........Marshall, Walker, Stokley, Sheffler ( his pass catching abilities outweighs Grahams slightly better blocking abilities) Lepsis, Kuper, Myers, Holland, Foster or Pears...............Cutler and Young.............Going without a Fullback because Marshall and Walker are both excellent blockers.............We would go with three Wide Receivers, one TE and one Runningback who is a very good Receiver out of the backfield. ..............Concentrate on a stud DT and Middle Linebacker, so DJ can dominate at the weakside...............And I know we have a shot at Jamie Silva(S) and Craig Steltz (S) in the 3rd or 4th round, is we could trade both 4th round picks for a 3rd.


Foster is gone HD.

HolyDiver
12-30-2007, 09:50 PM
Foster is gone HD.

I don't know why I keep calling Harris, Foster.................

slim
12-30-2007, 09:51 PM
I don't know why I keep calling Harris, Foster.................

LOL...chalk it up to old age :laugh:

BOSSHOGG30
12-30-2007, 09:51 PM
Harris is a left tackle. He won't battle with Pears. If Lepsis comes back we need to move him to right tackle or he can battle it out with Harris at left tackle. Hopefully we will bring in a veteran like Max Starks or someone with experience that can give us depth or a more realiable starter.

slim
12-30-2007, 09:55 PM
Harris is a left tackle. He won't battle with Pears. If Lepsis comes back we need to move him to right tackle or he can battle it out with Harris at left tackle. Hopefully we will bring in a veteran like Max Starks or someone with experience that can give us depth or a more realiable starter.

Why can't Harris take over at RT for a year? I agree we should go after a FA LT, but if we can't get one, we have to keep Lepsis at LT and let Harris/Pears battle for RT.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 10:01 PM
I would be happy with Sedrick Ellis. Addressing the DT is a biggy for this Defense. And Kenny Philips would'nt cause me to beat up my T.V. either ... he could help address the run and pass Defense ...

One of a few that had this reported ...

http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/sports/packers/index.php?ntid=253455

great find.

BOSSHOGG30
12-30-2007, 10:03 PM
Why can't Harris take over at RT for a year? I agree we should go after a FA LT, but if we can't get one, we have to keep Lepsis at LT and let Harris/Pears battle for RT.

He can, but you would be asking a guy who never played right tackle in his life to play right tackle. I think everyone is a little over worried about our o-line.

Things to think about:

1) Denver had a lot of shuffling going on the o-line due to injuries. Show me a team that can do good when they lose so many starters off the o-line.
2) Harris, Pears, Kuper, Myers, Holland are all young guys with little experience and will only get better.
3) Holland and Harris are new to Denver's system
4) Hamilton should be back and he can play center. If not we still have Myers and a project that Shanny likes a lot on the practice squad in Fenton.
5) Holland and Kuper did very well at gaurd and look like guys we can count on for 2008.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 10:06 PM
He can, but you would be asking a guy who never played right tackle in his life to play right tackle. I think everyone is a little over worried about our o-line.

Things to think about:

1) Denver had a lot of shuffling going on the o-line due to injuries. Show me a team that can do good when they lose so many starters off the o-line.
2) Harris, Pears, Kuper, Myers, Holland are all young guys with little experience and will only get better.
3) Holland and Harris are new to Denver's system
4) Hamilton should be back and he can play center. If not we still have Myers and a project that Shanny likes a lot on the practice squad in Fenton.
5) Holland and Kuper did very well at gaurd and look like guys we can count on for 2008.

I've been saying that for 2 months...err...the injury part. I don't think the OL is as bad off as what some perceive it to be. Granted, we need to get healthy, but we should be OK addresing other needs first.

HolyDiver
12-30-2007, 10:07 PM
Harris is a left tackle. He won't battle with Pears. If Lepsis comes back we need to move him to right tackle or he can battle it out with Harris at left tackle. Hopefully we will bring in a veteran like Max Starks or someone with experience that can give us depth or a more realiable starter.

He needs to learn to play both left and right Tackle...............Hell, look at Carswell. He played TE, H-back, Fullback, Tackle and Guard................So I think HARRIS can play both Tackles..................He has play a few snaps at Right Tackle this year when Pears went out briefly.

Tned
12-30-2007, 10:11 PM
Lepsis, Kuper, Myers, Holland, HARRIS or Pears...............Cutler and Young.............Going without a Fullback because Marshall and Walker are both excellent blockers.............We would go with three Wide Receivers, one TE and one Runningback who is a very good Receiver out of the backfield. ..............Concentrate on a stud DT and Middle Linebacker, so DJ can dominate at the weakside...............And I know we have a shot at Jamie Silva(S) and Craig Steltz (S) in the 3rd or 4th round, is we could trade both 4th round picks for a 3rd.

Considering how poorly our O-line has been blocking with a bunch of two TE and 1 TE + FB formations, I am not sure how they get the job done without an upgrade, and going to a lot of single TE & no FB sets.

HolyDiver
12-30-2007, 10:14 PM
Considering how poorly our O-line has been blocking with a bunch of two TE and 1 TE + FB formations, I am not sure how they get the job done without an upgrade, and going to a lot of single TE & no FB sets.


Defenses would be at a greater disadvantage, not knowing if it's going to be a run or pass since we could do both equally from that formation. We would have 5 potential Receivers to throw to.................The Patriots use this formation alot.

Tned
12-30-2007, 10:20 PM
Defenses would be at a greater disadvantage, not knowing if it's going to be a run or pass since we could do both equally from that formation. We would have 5 potential Receivers to throw to.................The Patriots use this formation alot.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see the Broncos run that formation, I just don't think our O-line can pull it off and have Cutler finish the season not on IR.

Dean
12-30-2007, 10:53 PM
I think the previous two games have clouded posters view of our O-line. Jay has only been sacked 26 times in a 16 gamee season (that's not chopped liver). Since 9 of them came in the two games I mentioned, IMO there is unreasonable concern about it. These two games Graham was hurt and didn't help with max protection. This was a line in which not a single player had started next to the man on either side of him.

Next year we will have the advantage of experience, Lepsis having had time to heal. Our Notre Dame draft pick ready to help out, and possibly Hamilton and Nalen back. That would already add strength that we were missing this year. Even our running backs were continually nicked up.

IMO we need a nose tackle to control the middle, an OLB, a right O-tackle, and two safeties (I think John will retire).

I expect the front office to fill one or two of these through free agency. They are exceptional at obtaining value when trading. So at least one of these and/or more draft picks will be obtained by trading a player or two. That leaves the draft to fill in the blanks.

Drafting an O-lineman to develop him for a year doesn't sound good to me right now but LBs and safeties often play as rookies and good D-tackles are seldom released as free agents. They almost always have to come by way of draft or trade.

Tned
12-30-2007, 11:02 PM
I think the previous two games have clouded posters view of our O-line. Jay has only been sacked 26 times in a 16 gamee season (that's not chopped liver). Since 9 of them came in the two games I mentioned, IMO there is unreasonable concern about it. These two games Graham was hurt and didn't help with max protection. This was a line in which not a single player had started next to the man on either side of him.
.

For me, it's not the last two games, because I have been saying for longer than two weeks that it is a problem. The problem being calling plays as if we had a line capable of straight drop-back pass blocking, when the line can't.

I think the 26 sacks is more a credit to Cutler than the line. In addition to those 26 sacks, how many throws were there off of the back foot, as he was back peddling from pressure, throw aways, etc.

It is possible that if Hamilton and/or Nalen come back, Lepsis one more year from his injury, and then the other guys vying for the open tackle and guard spot, maybe everything will be fine, but as I see things now, Shanny needs to retool the line, or go back to the play calling he used in '04/'05, which was heavy on misdirection, bootlegs, two TEs, etc.

Stargazer
12-30-2007, 11:35 PM
I can't blame him for that. He went into the draft w/ 3 names on his short list. The other 2 were gone. He did what he felt he had to.

I think one was Adam Carriker, DT/DE from Nebraska who went to St. Louis. The other was the Tennessee DT, Justin Harrell, who went to GB. Interesting how things may have changed had they lasted til Denver's pick...being DTs and all.

It was the teams that Denver leaped who didn't show any intention of drafting DE.

18 Cincinnati Leon Hall - CB
19 Tennessee Michael Griffin - S
20 NY Giants Aaron Ross - CB

That's why when it went down I surprised they made the trade & throwing a 3rd rounder in '08 to move up 4 slots.

To me, it didn't make sense. And now Denver has a whole with no 3rd this year. These selections are who you develop your football team with. Not just the #1 pick, but the lower rounds.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 11:38 PM
You can't focus on all the teams we jumped. Ya have to focus on the team we jumped directly in front of...Cincinnati. Who is to say they had no interest in Moss? They drafted a CB, but maybe that was because the DE they wanted was taken.

Stargazer
12-30-2007, 11:47 PM
You can't focus on all the teams we jumped. Ya have to focus on the team we jumped directly in front of...Cincinnati. Who is to say they had no interest in Moss? They drafted a CB, but maybe that was because the DE they wanted was taken.

I still think moving up 4 slots for Moss wasn't smart. And the teams I listed I would've been surprised if they went DE. Cincy clearly needed CB & went that way. Same with the Giants, and Tenn also went DB(S). Just didn't surprise me one bit the way it played out. It worked with Cutler the previous year, so I suppose it worked since they definately selected who they wanted. Trading up for Cutler didn't shock me. But, the Moss one did. Just an opinion.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-30-2007, 11:54 PM
I hear what yer saying, but since Shanny said Moss was the only one still on his list, I don't begrudge him for making it happen.

I'm still mad it wasn't Posluszny.

broncofanatic1987
12-30-2007, 11:57 PM
It was the teams that Denver leaped who didn't show any intention of drafting DE.

18 Cincinnati Leon Hall - CB
19 Tennessee Michael Griffin - S
20 NY Giants Aaron Ross - CB

That's why when it went down I surprised they made the trade & throwing a 3rd rounder in '08 to move up 4 slots.

To me, it didn't make sense. And now Denver has a whole with no 3rd this year. These selections are who you develop your football team with. Not just the #1 pick, but the lower rounds.

I will say it one more time. The 2008 3rd round pick was given to Minnesota as part of the trade that allowed the Broncos to take Thomas in the 4th round. The Broncos gave the 2007 3rd round pick up in order to move up to take Moss. The trade for Moss was worth it if they thought there was a chance he would be gone by the time they picked 21st. The trade for Thomas was not worth it considering he wasn't a starter for most of the season and they had to abandon the scheme(not entirely his fault of course). But, there was at least one analysis of Thomas before the draft that indicated he wasn't a fit for the new scheme.

Stargazer
12-30-2007, 11:58 PM
I'm still mad it wasn't Posluszny.

10 tackles in week one versus the Broncos.

Surprised he slipped to the 2nd round(34 overall).

SmilinAssasSin27
12-31-2007, 12:03 AM
10 tackles in week one versus the Broncos.

Surprised he slipped to the 2nd round(34 overall).

I was F'ing shocked. If AJ Hawk was a top 5 pick and Connor is a top 15 prospect, there is NO WAY Puz shoulda dropped to round 2.

Brand
12-31-2007, 12:07 AM
The Broncos can still get to 11 depending upon the coin toss with the Bills. I don't know who the Broncos will pick and I have no preferences at this time. I would need to see who they pickup - if anyone - in FA, and who does what at the combines....

There are always guys who show up that were not expected to be decent prospects, but they do every year. So, I will read the various mocks out there, but take them with a grain of salt until the combines are finished and the "lists" are complete.

One guy that intrigues me as a prospect is McFadden. I am certain that most folks will say the DT, LB or OT positions need help, but I have some belief that one or more of those positions will be addressed on FA. If that were the case, and if he were there - and there are some early mocks that say he could be there at 12 - would you take a franchise RB? Interesting question, but I would not commit yet.....

MOtorboat
12-31-2007, 12:12 AM
McFadden won't be there when we pick, but nice try.

Stargazer
12-31-2007, 12:15 AM
I will say it one more time. The 2008 3rd round pick was given to Minnesota as part of the trade that allowed the Broncos to take Thomas in the 4th round. The Broncos gave the 2007 3rd round pick up in order to move up to take Moss. The trade for Moss was worth it if they thought there was a chance he would be gone by the time they picked 21st. The trade for Thomas was not worth it considering he wasn't a starter for most of the season and they had to abandon the scheme(not entirely his fault of course). But, there was at least one analysis of Thomas before the draft that indicated he wasn't a fit for the new scheme.

You are correct. Now as the endless hours of draft yap & leading up to the draft, the selection of Thomas in the 4th because of no picks available in the 2nd day(I believe). Well, he's a DT & will take more than 1 year to develop so the jury is out on him. I actually liked the selection of Thomas. Give him more time. You're right, the 3rd round pick in 07 was used to move up. Most picks used in the 1st round to move up a few slots involves draft picks that year. Not the following year.

And I still do not agree with trading up 4 spots for Moss for an 07 3rd round pick.

Stargazer
12-31-2007, 12:16 AM
The Broncos can still get to 11 depending upon the coin toss with the Bills.

There's no coin toss. Denver beat Buffalo. Denver will select #12.

TXBRONC
12-31-2007, 06:44 PM
I still think moving up 4 slots for Moss wasn't smart. And the teams I listed I would've been surprised if they went DE. Cincy clearly needed CB & went that way. Same with the Giants, and Tenn also went DB(S). Just didn't surprise me one bit the way it played out. It worked with Cutler the previous year, so I suppose it worked since they definately selected who they wanted. Trading up for Cutler didn't shock me. But, the Moss one did. Just an opinion.


Maybe it wasn't smart although I'm not will to say that at this point. If Jarvis becomes an impact player on the defensive line, then in my opinion it was worth it.

SmilinAssasSin27
12-31-2007, 07:03 PM
www.footballsfuture.com mock draft. Interesting picks and assessments at 12 and 13.

12 Denver - Keith Rivers, LB, USC
Rivers is the type of performer that could blow up in the post season with his natural athleticism and speed. He has the onfield production the past two seasons to go with the talent, and he would be a great fit on the weakside in Denver.

13 Carolina - Kenny Phillips, S, Miami
Phillips has already declared, and should be taken in the first half of the first round. If he works out well, he may be gone at this point. He has the type of all around ability to see the pro bowl early and often in the NFL.

topscribe
12-31-2007, 11:34 PM
While we definately need to draft/buy a pass rush, we also need to do something with the pass blocking. Shanny and company either need to go back to the play calling they used in '04/'05 or get an o-line that can pass block.

I still believe experience and jelling will take care of pass blocking.

I just do not know how the Broncos should even think about anything else
until they have strengthened their DT position. They cannot continue to be
30th in the league in stopping the run and expect to contend for the playoffs,
let alone entertain any ideas about the Super Bowl.

-----

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 01:50 AM
The Broncos can still get to 11 depending upon the coin toss with the Bills. I don't know who the Broncos will pick and I have no preferences at this time. I would need to see who they pickup - if anyone - in FA, and who does what at the combines....

There are always guys who show up that were not expected to be decent prospects, but they do every year. So, I will read the various mocks out there, but take them with a grain of salt until the combines are finished and the "lists" are complete.

One guy that intrigues me as a prospect is McFadden. I am certain that most folks will say the DT, LB or OT positions need help, but I have some belief that one or more of those positions will be addressed on FA. If that were the case, and if he were there - and there are some early mocks that say he could be there at 12 - would you take a franchise RB? Interesting question, but I would not commit yet.....

"Though Buffalo and Denver had the same strength-of-schedule, their tie for the 11th and 12th positions was broken by the conference tie-breaker. Since Denver defeated Buffalo in head-to-head competition, Buffalo is given priority in the draft order and will select in the 11th position."

All Teams Draft order (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story;jsessionid=C83FABB073BC987F7565FCA0A0C7F358? id=09000d5d805a3a57&template=without-video&confirm=true)

Broncospsycho77
01-01-2008, 02:02 AM
I don't want just a good contender as filler for a DT. I want a monster, a passionate player. Unfortunately, those guys are at LB. A Laurinaitis or Connor would be great there. We need somebody to take the reins and just be a freak of nature.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 02:22 AM
I don't want just a good contender as filler for a DT. I want a monster, a passionate player. Unfortunately, those guys are at LB. A Laurinaitis or Connor would be great there. We need somebody to take the reins and just be a freak of nature.

I have seen one mock that had us taking Laurinaitis and another one had us taking Connor. I have seen a couple that has us taking Ellis.

I have been saying we need the most help at DT but I wouldn't be to upset if we ended up with Laurinaitis. I think he will be gone by the 12th pick though.

Scarface
01-01-2008, 08:37 AM
People will disagree, but we need an Oline first, and a Dline second. Im sick of Cutler snapping the ball, and having pressure the second he looks at his second read...... If it wasnt for Marshal making fantastic catches our record would be alot worse..............

Yep, I agree. O-Line is a huge concern. I don't know if we'll address it in FA or the draft but we had better freakin address it. All you have to do is take a look at the best QBs in this league and they have one common denominator and that's outstanding O-Line play among a few other things. One thing they're not doing is running for their lives.

MOtorboat
01-01-2008, 10:19 AM
Here's looking at you, Ryan Clady...

MHCBill
01-01-2008, 10:38 AM
Lepsis will be back next year and even healthier after a full year after his knee injury.Sorry, but he won't.

In for another very interesting off-season.

Fix the Dline...

New defensive game plan... maybe attack and aggressive.

Stregthen the Oline...

SmilinAssasSin27
01-01-2008, 10:47 AM
Well...Lepsis' decision makes things more interesting anyway. I still say get a FA OT, but Otah is looking more and more appealing if we don't go that route.

MHCBill
01-01-2008, 11:14 AM
Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

MHCBill
01-01-2008, 11:15 AM
Coach should be happier with me today... I have us signing only two "major" free agents.

Faneca and Bryant Johnson.

Italianmobstr7
01-01-2008, 11:19 AM
Coach should be happier with me today... I have us signing only two "major" free agents.

Faneca and Bryant Johnson.

I would be happy with that. If Javon leaves (obviously likely) I'd love to have a very underrated Bryant Johnson (from Penn State!) and Faneca is a beast. He is kind of old, so I might prefer someone like Jake Scott, but either way it will upgrade the o-line.

MHCBill
01-01-2008, 11:32 AM
Suitors for Javon?

Minny, Tennessee, Philly...

Can we possibly get a #3 for him?

UnderArmour
01-01-2008, 12:08 PM
Coach should be happier with me today... I have us signing only two "major" free agents.

Faneca and Bryant Johnson.

No and no.

Italianmobstr7
01-01-2008, 12:31 PM
No and no.

Why "no and no"? I'm not arguing, just want you to explain why you don't want either or both of these guys. Bryant Johnson could be a #2 or #3 for us and a damn good one. He wouldn't be too costly either. Faneca I realize has a high price tag, but sometimes you've got to pay a lot to protect our future. You have to ask yourself is it worth it? I think that it might be to keep Jay from getting pummeled.

gobroncsnv
01-01-2008, 12:45 PM
Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

LOS

LOS

LOS

LOS

LOS

UnderArmour
01-01-2008, 01:12 PM
Why "no and no"? I'm not arguing, just want you to explain why you don't want either or both of these guys. Bryant Johnson could be a #2 or #3 for us and a damn good one. He wouldn't be too costly either. Faneca I realize has a high price tag, but sometimes you've got to pay a lot to protect our future. You have to ask yourself is it worth it? I think that it might be to keep Jay from getting pummeled.

Bryant Johnson is nothing special. We can do better in the draft... In the 6th or 7th round. He's certainly not better than Stokely, who we want in the slot to work his magic. Picking somebody up who is worse than Stokely makes no sense.

Faneca? Do the Broncos EVER sign high priced free agent offensive linemen? Or even draft guards high? Definitely not going to happen. Seattle will sign him, and if there is a bidding war, which there will be, I don't see us paying top dollar for him.

Italianmobstr7
01-01-2008, 01:17 PM
Bryant Johnson is nothing special. We can do better in the draft... In the 6th or 7th round. He's certainly not better than Stokely, who we want in the slot to work his magic. Picking somebody up who is worse than Stokely makes no sense.

Faneca? Do the Broncos EVER sign high priced free agent offensive linemen? Or even draft guards high? Definitely not going to happen. Seattle will sign him, and if there is a bidding war, which there will be, I don't see us paying top dollar for him.

Have you watched Bryant Johnson? The kid is a stud. You don't hear about him because he's the type of player you want. He's good, can make catches in traffic, break tackles, and he's not a prima donna. Any rookie WR that is drafted is going to take a while to develop. See Calvin Johnson. I agree w/ you on Faneca. He's going to be too pricey more than likely. But I could definitely see Johnson being a Bronco. He'd be a perfect fit w/ Cutler, Scheffler, Marshall, Stokely.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 01:22 PM
I don't see a need to be searching more receivers at this time. Unless Javon is released or dealt I think we're going to be fine and right now I don't that happening.

Italianmobstr7
01-01-2008, 01:23 PM
I don't see a need to be searching more receivers at this time. Unless Javon is released or dealt I think we're going to be fine and right now I don't that happening.

I certainly hope not. I like Javon. I'd much rather have him than Johnson or Berrian or any free agent receivers. However if Javon does leave, I'd love to have Johnson as a Bronco.

MHCBill
01-01-2008, 01:24 PM
I agree Mobster.

Johnson would be a perfect fit for our #2.

We need someone that is a TEAM PLAYER first and foremost. Johnson is that player. He's been playing second or third fiddle for the Cards for a few years, and now he has an opportunity to become a starter.

Plus he can block in the running game like a mother.

What more could we want as a #2 WR?

Someone that is happy to get their 50 catches and more than willing to block downfield.

With the prima donnas at the WR position these days this is the exact player that we now need.

Faneca may be expensive, but if the coaches think he is that big of an upgrade over Kuper then they'll have to spend the money. If he's not, then don't spend the money. My guess is that professional NFL coaches can evaluate offensive guards better than we can.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 01:26 PM
Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips

Phillips -Yes

Phillips - No

Phillips - No

Phillips - No

Phillips - No

If we had more than one guy named Phillips it would get a tad confusing. :D

Brand
01-01-2008, 01:27 PM
Almost every year, you hear the pundits, experts and other hangerson declare with absolute definitiveness that the best players are in the top 5 or so, and everyone after that is "less talented" or have major flaws in the way they play the game. If those sinners are to be believed, the Broncos will pick someone who has a flaw in his game, character or genes. No way the Broncos can win this "pick 'em, plug 'em, pay 'em" scheme. It is an annual mantra for many to say: "TRADE DOWN!!", while the minority choice is "TRADE UP".

The first is predicated on the "Quantity Breeds Quality" theory. What usually transpires is that the players actually trend to the average an the teams; best hope, according to the theory, is to reach average which will win at least an average number of games. The hope is that a "Good QB" will elevate the game so that the team will win a few more than average. Thus saith the proponents.

The second theory holds that getting an "Elite Player" will automatically elevate the team to greatness by virtue of this "Frank Meriweather" character who inspires and leads the downtrodden, but game, players to the level of average. It takes three "Elite Players" to make a difference, and they take three years to accumulate. What usually happens is that he "Elite Player", humping his arse with a bunch of losers, serves his apprenticeship and then moves on to a team that has four or five "Elite Players" and comes back and beats up on his old teammates with gusto. Having Elite Players" really is a risky strategy because of a number of factors. Among these is that an injured Elite Player is damm expensive to carry on the books. And rehab is less than certain. And Elite Players often turn into efete snobs and can start lockerroom diseases, an dscrew up the media by refering to him-/her-/itself in the third person. Everybody knows the media members are, individually and collective, easily confused, an dset about th elocker rooms asking where the Elite Player is.....

It would make sense to find a balance in a draft situation. The best method may be to throw a dart at a specially rigged dartboard. Percentages for success are probably as good as any other method. I would line up the names of the "better" players regardless of position on the dart board, and when Gooddell puts the Broncos on the clock, keeping your feet foursquare on the floor under the chair, hurl the dart up there and see what it hits. If the dart lands on the wall, all bets are off, and a trade should be vigorously pursued. If it lands on a player who seems snice and who is sort of a large size, you can't go wrong. If the player can run, jump and grunt in appropriate manners, that's the boy for this team, especially if he knows his left foot from his right foot....

If you have read this piece this far, you have blown about a minute of your life learning a simple moral: it doesnt amount to a hill of beans right now until the combines and the FA periods are over.

Amen.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 01:37 PM
Almost every year, you hear the pundits, experts and other hangerson declare with absolute definitiveness that the best players are in the top 5 or so, and everyone after that is "less talented" or have major flaws in the way they play the game. If those sinners are to be believed, the Broncos will pick someone who has a flaw in his game, character or genes. No way the Broncos can win this "pick 'em, plug 'em, pay 'em" scheme. It is an annual mantra for many to say: "TRADE DOWN!!", while the minority choice is "TRADE UP".

The first is predicated on the "Quantity Breeds Quality" theory. What usually transpires is that the players actually trend to the average an the teams; best hope, according to the theory, is to reach average which will win at least an average number of games. The hope is that a "Good QB" will elevate the game so that the team will win a few more than average. Thus saith the proponents.

The second theory holds that getting an "Elite Player" will automatically elevate the team to greatness by virtue of this "Frank Meriweather" character who inspires and leads the downtrodden, but game, players to the level of average. It takes three "Elite Players" to make a difference, and they take three years to accumulate. What usually happens is that he "Elite Player", humping his arse with a bunch of losers, serves his apprenticeship and then moves on to a team that has four or five "Elite Players" and comes back and beats up on his old teammates with gusto. Having Elite Players" really is a risky strategy because of a number of factors. Among these is that an injured Elite Player is damm expensive to carry on the books. And rehab is less than certain. And Elite Players often turn into efete snobs and can start lockerroom diseases, an dscrew up the media by refering to him-/her-/itself in the third person. Everybody knows the media members are, individually and collective, easily confused, an dset about th elocker rooms asking where the Elite Player is.....

It would make sense to find a balance in a draft situation. The best method may be to throw a dart at a specially rigged dartboard. Percentages for success are probably as good as any other method. I would line up the names of the "better" players regardless of position on the dart board, and when Gooddell puts the Broncos on the clock, keeping your feet foursquare on the floor under the chair, hurl the dart up there and see what it hits. If the dart lands on the wall, all bets are off, and a trade should be vigorously pursued. If it lands on a player who seems snice and who is sort of a large size, you can't go wrong. If the player can run, jump and grunt in appropriate manners, that's the boy for this team, especially if he knows his left foot from his right foot....

If you have read this piece this far, you have blown about a minute of your life learning a simple moral: it doesnt amount to a hill of beans right now until the combines and the FA periods are over.

Amen.

I can't say I disagree for the most part.

Dean
01-01-2008, 01:51 PM
If you have read this piece this far, you have blown about a minute of your life learning a simple moral: it doesnt amount to a hill of beans right now until the combines and the FA periods are over.

Amen.

Fortunately, I am a fast reader. As far as making predictions and preparing mock drafts, I agree that it is an excercise in futility. Even after the all-star games, combine, and FA it is still pretty much a crap shoot. What makes or breaks a player is as much to do with who he is not what he can do. We don't have a test to tell what his desire and motivation is.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 02:32 PM
Here's looking at you, Ryan Clady...

I like Ryan Clady for obvious reasons :D Most fans hate the idea of taking O-linemen in the first round because they aren't sexy picks. I know the impact they have on a team is far more that what is seen. I just don't feel the need we have at O-line is as great as the need at D-line. Although I agree Both need improvement.

Truthfully, most the guys brought up here would be solid picks. I wouldn't be to upset with any of them. I just hope Shanahan don't go out and grab a WR,TE,P,K,CB in the first round. Then say it was because he was the best athlete on the board. He has been picking that way for years and it hasn't got us anywhere. The last couple years he has been picking out of need and we have seen our draftee's make an impact to actualy help us win games.

IMO he needs to address a position of need as we have done the last few years.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 03:14 PM
I like Ryan Clady for obvious reasons :D Most fans hate the idea of taking O-linemen in the first round because they aren't sexy picks. I know the impact they have on a team is far more that what is seen. I just don't feel the need we have at O-line is as great as the need at D-line. Although I agree Both need improvement.

Truthfully, most the guys brought up here would be solid picks. I wouldn't be to upset with any of them. I just hope Shanahan don't go out and grab a WR,TE,P,K,CB in the first round. Then say it was because he was the best athlete on the board. He has been picking that way for years and it hasn't got us anywhere. The last couple years he has been picking out of need and we have seen our draftee's make an impact to actualy help us win games.

IMO he needs to address a position of need as we have done the last few years.


When has Shanahan ever taken a kicker or a punter on the first day? Wide receiver, tight end, and corner back are all possible I just don't see that happening because I think as he evaluates each postion those three positions wr, cb, te are good shape.

While I have no problem with us taking an offensive tackle in the first round it is doubtful that a guy at that position could make an impact right away because it takes about a year for linemen understand the system.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 03:29 PM
When has Shanahan ever taken a kicker or a punter on the first day? Wide receiver, tight end, and corner back are all possible I just don't see that happening because I think as he evaluates each postion those three positions wr, cb, te are good shape.

While I have no problem with us taking an offensive tackle in the first round it is doubtful that a guy at that position could make an impact right away because it takes about a year for linemen understand the system.

Shanahan has never taken a Punter or Kicker with the first round pick. I didn't say that he had. I was simply throwing out positions we don't need to waist our first round pick on.

Shanahan has said many times, his picks weren't based on need. They were based on the best athlete on the board at the time.

IMO we need to pick based on our need as we have done the last few years. If a guy we are scouting at a position of need will fall later then the 12th pick, we should trade down and pick the guy we want there. I don't like the idea of holding the 12th pick to take a great QB just because he fell to the 12th pick.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 04:09 PM
Shanahan has never taken a Punter or Kicker with the first round pick. I didn't say that he had. I was simply throwing out positions we don't need to waist our first round pick on.

Shanahan has said many times, his picks weren't based on need. They were based on the best athlete on the board at the time.

IMO we need to pick based on our need as we have done the last few years. If a guy we are scouting at a position of need will fall later then the 12th pick, we should trade down and pick the guy we want there. I don't like the idea of holding the 12th pick to take a great QB just because he fell to the 12th pick.

Yes he has done that some of the time but not always. I'm sure there are plenty of examples of guys he's picked for positions of need prior to the past three years.

Shanahan has made some bad moves moves over the years but he isn't fool. If the guy Shanahan wants at 12 is there why take the chance unless its just couple of spots in the draft? I say that because at the 12th spot in the draft there should be player there that is impact player and fill a need.

Brand
01-01-2008, 04:20 PM
And I don't think position is the major factor. Just best athlete who plays a position that is among the several at which the Broncos have a need.....

Not saying he's gonna be, but if McFadden is there, he might take him.....

I have seen enough drafts to know that there is always a player who drops down and everyone is surpriosed he is still there...... Teams change their views of the draft depending uponm a lot of events and other factors.......

If Javon leaves, a WR might be in the cards.....

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 04:38 PM
Yes he has done that some of the time but not always. I'm sure there are plenty of examples of guys he's picked for positions of need prior to the past three years.

Shanahan has made some bad moves moves over the years but he isn't fool. If the guy Shanahan wants at 12 is there why take the chance unless its just couple of spots in the draft? I say that because at the 12th spot in the draft there should be player there that is impact player and fill a need.

Your right, if you feel the guy you want might be taken you should keep the pick and grab him.

However, If you know the teams behind you are looking to draft another position it makes sense to trade down.

For example, If one of the top QB's fall and you know the teams picking behind you want a QB you should trade down and let them pick the QB. You can still pick the guy you wanted. You get extra picks to go with the trade, not to mention, the salary of the player you wanted is cheaper because of drafting him with a lower pick. A perfect example of this was the Jags last year. They traded with us and still got the guy they wanted plus extra picks, plus cheaper contract and cap hit.

Requiem / The Dagda
01-01-2008, 04:46 PM
Like I reported about two months ago, the Broncos are interested in upgrading the tackle position. I didn't catch light of the Lepsis news until now as I just got back from a New Years party in Duluth, MN. - but this proves me right more than likely. It's going to happen somewhere on day one!

Dean
01-01-2008, 04:51 PM
Your right, if you feel the guy you want might be taken you should keep the pick and grab him.

However, If you know the teams behind you are looking to draft another position it makes sense to trade down.

For example, If one of the top QB's fall and you know the teams picking behind you want a QB you should trade down and let them pick the QB. You can still pick the guy you wanted. You get extra picks to go with the trade, not to mention, the salary of the player you wanted is cheaper because of drafting him with a lower pick. A perfect example of this was the Jags last year. They traded with us and still got the guy they wanted plus extra picks, plus cheaper contract and cap hit.

That looks good on paper but you really don't know what other teams want. NFL coaches and organizations go to great lengths to keep that a secrete or teams would continually be jumping ahead of others to get a paricular player or position.

The Broncos thought they had a trade with the Ravens several years ago. At the last instant the Ravens backed out leaving the Broncos on the clock. Guess who they ended up picking.


















If you chose Foster as our pick, ding, ding, ding you are a winner.:eek:

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 06:08 PM
Your right, if you feel the guy you want might be taken you should keep the pick and grab him.

However, If you know the teams behind you are looking to draft another position it makes sense to trade down.

For example, If one of the top QB's fall and you know the teams picking behind you want a QB you should trade down and let them pick the QB. You can still pick the guy you wanted. You get extra picks to go with the trade, not to mention, the salary of the player you wanted is cheaper because of drafting him with a lower pick. A perfect example of this was the Jags last year. They traded with us and still got the guy they wanted plus extra picks, plus cheaper contract and cap hit.

Sure, but the catch you're rolling the dice that your man isn't on their radar. You're probably pretty safe within a pick or two but I would be nevervous about dropping five spots or more but that's just me.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 06:16 PM
That looks good on paper but you really don't know what other teams want. NFL coaches and organizations go to great lengths to keep that a secrete or teams would continually be jumping ahead of others to get a paricular player or position.

The Broncos thought they had a trade with the Ravens several years ago. At the last instant the Ravens backed out leaving the Broncos on the clock. Guess who they ended up picking.


















If you chose Foster as our pick, ding, ding, ding you are a winner.:eek:


I thought it was that the Ravens jumped ahead us to select Terrell Suggs.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-01-2008, 06:21 PM
Keep in mind that Shanny always seems to have a list of top 3 guys he wants or thinks he can get. When we got DJ, he stated he wanted Tommy Harris, the WR Clayton...or DJ. Last year it was Harrell, the Arkansas DE...or Moss. He wouldn't say it Cutty was the #1, but he also liked Leinart and Donte Whitner. I expect this year to be no different. If his list of 3 consists of someone still ther at #12, he will take that remaining player. If 2 are gone by 8 or 9, he will have to decide to trade up or trade back.

MOtorboat
01-01-2008, 06:40 PM
Keep in mind that Shanny always seems to have a list of top 3 guys he wants or thinks he can get. When we got DJ, he stated he wanted Tommy Harris, the WR Clayton...or DJ. Last year it was Harrell, the Arkansas DE...or Moss. He wouldn't say it Cutty was the #1, but he also liked Leinart and Donte Whitner. I expect this year to be no different. If his list of 3 consists of someone still ther at #12, he will take that remaining player. If 2 are gone by 8 or 9, he will have to decide to trade up or trade back.

Let us ALWAYS remember that it takes two to tango...someone must trade with you, to trade up or down...

Scarface
01-01-2008, 06:41 PM
Keep in mind that Shanny always seems to have a list of top 3 guys he wants or thinks he can get. When we got DJ, he stated he wanted Tommy Harris, the WR Clayton...or DJ. Last year it was Harrell, the Arkansas DE...or Moss. He wouldn't say it Cutty was the #1, but he also liked Leinart and Donte Whitner. I expect this year to be no different. If his list of 3 consists of someone still ther at #12, he will take that remaining player. If 2 are gone by 8 or 9, he will have to decide to trade up or trade back.

Maroney too.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 06:48 PM
Sure, but the catch you're rolling the dice that your man isn't on their radar. You're probably pretty safe within a pick or two but I would be nevervous about dropping five spots or more but that's just me.

Sure, there is always some risk. Dropping more then 3 spots and figuring your guy will still be their would be stretch to say the least. Not to mention you never know if the teams that are now ahead of you are going to trade out of their picks. Someone could trade up and grab the guy you want so there is always risk.

If the guy is an impact player that feels a huge need it would be better to take him with the 12th then to risk losing him.

As a lot have said, If Shanahan had 3 guys scouted and 2 are gone he will take the 3rd rather then move back. If 2 or all 3 are still on the board I bet he moves back if he can, grabs the extra pick and still gets one of the 3 guys he wants.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 06:57 PM
Let us ALWAYS remember that it takes two to tango...someone must trade with you, to trade up or down...

your right. Teams aren't going to trade with you if they feel you or anyone else they are jumping behind wants their guy.

I'm sure they would be willing if you sold the farm like Ditka did. But that would be one of the dumbest things ever. There is no one in this years draft worth that!

SmilinAssasSin27
01-01-2008, 07:00 PM
Let us ALWAYS remember that it takes two to tango...someone must trade with you, to trade up or down...

Shanny seems to usually be able to make some sort of swap. No other coach has made more trades in the past 5 years.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 07:00 PM
Let us ALWAYS remember that it takes two to tango...someone must trade with you, to trade up or down...

Personally I like to salsa with ladies rather than tango. (Looks around for wife.)

SmilinAssasSin27
01-01-2008, 07:01 PM
your right. Teams aren't going to trade with you if they feel you or anyone else they are jumping behind wants their guy.

I'm sure they would be willing if you sold the farm like Ditka did. But that would be one of the dumbest things ever. There is no one in this years draft worth that!

If Ricky Williams was "worth" it, so is McFadden...especially given what AP did this year.

Broncospsycho77
01-01-2008, 07:03 PM
If Ricky Williams was "worth" it, so is McFadden...especially given what AP did this year.

I think McFadden will be better than AP. He's a freak of nature, in all aspects of the word. I can't say if I've ever seen a player who has ever dominated like he does on a consistent basis while splitting handoffs with another star.

MOtorboat
01-01-2008, 07:06 PM
I think McFadden will be better than AP. He's a freak of nature, in all aspects of the word. I can't say if I've ever seen a player who has ever dominated like he does on a consistent basis while splitting handoffs with another star.

I disagree. Adrian Peterson dominated in every game he played in college. McFadden disappeared for games at a time. Consistent...no...He never was injured, I'll give him that, but consistent, hardly.

P.S. With that said, I'm still a huge McFadden fan. But AP is the freak of nature.

fcspikeit
01-01-2008, 07:28 PM
If Ricky Williams was "worth" it, so is McFadden...especially given what AP did this year.

Who said Ricky Williams was "worth" it? I think only Ditka thought that...

If all we needed was a stud running back that would be one thing but for us to trade all our picks + next years #1 to get McFadden would be beyond stupid!

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 07:35 PM
Maroney too.

I remember Shanahan saying that if Cutler had been gone he would have been very comfortable taking Maroney.

Scarface
01-01-2008, 08:04 PM
I remember Shanahan saying that if Cutler had been gone he would have been very comfortable taking Maroney.

Even after he took Cutler he tried to trade back into RD1 to take Maroney. Shanny was hard up for him.

SmilinAssasSin27
01-01-2008, 08:13 PM
I disagree. Adrian Peterson dominated in every game he played in college. McFadden disappeared for games at a time. Consistent...no...He never was injured, I'll give him that, but consistent, hardly.

P.S. With that said, I'm still a huge McFadden fan. But AP is the freak of nature.

I don't think consistency is the issue. The issue is that some teams knew how to D him up and had the personnel. LSU has an overrated D who was also banged up. Arkansas is such a mess this year after their QB left and WRs followed, that McFadden is the ONLY weapon. Some teams just did a better job acknowledging that than others.

and yes, I know Felix Jones is a stud, but he's also a RB. The argument remains that teams put like 10 in the box and dared the **** to throw.

TXBRONC
01-01-2008, 09:03 PM
I don't think consistency is the issue. The issue is that some teams knew how to D him up and had the personnel. LSU has an overrated D who was also banged up. Arkansas is such a mess this year after their QB left and WRs followed, that McFadden is the ONLY weapon. Some teams just did a better job acknowledging that than others.

and yes, I know Felix Jones is a stud, but he's also a RB. The argument remains that teams put like 10 in the box and dared the **** to throw.


To do what he did without any kind of passing game shows what kind of beast this kid is.

Brand
01-02-2008, 10:23 AM
I don't care whom the Broncos take, as long as they get a RB somewhere, somehow who can run the Halfback Pass play. Sandy Eggo was so vulnerable to that play, I went hoarse yelling at the TV for Denver to run that play. Remember the throw back to Elway? I also remember a time or two when Sharpe caught passes from the RB, but that play didn't happen much because Elway was....well, Elway. But that play could just break a team's D like a good screen pass.

Sorely would like to see that play come back. Paul Hornung used to make teams look absofreakinglutly stupid with his passes to Dowler.....

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 10:25 AM
I don't care whom the Broncos take, as long as they get a RB somewhere, somehow who can run the Halfback Pass play. Sandy Eggo was so vulnerable to that play, I went hoarse yelling at the TV for Denver to run that play. Remember the throw back to Elway? I also remember a time or two when Sharpe caught passes from the RB, but that play didn't happen much because Elway was....well, Elway. But that play could just break a team's D like a good screen pass.

Sorely would like to see that play come back. Paul Hornung used to make teams look absofreakinglutly stupid with his passes to Dowler.....

We could always take Tim Tebow when he comes out of college since he won't be a good QB in the NFL, just like most Florida QB's.

MHCBill
01-02-2008, 10:38 AM
I don't care whom the Broncos take, as long as they get a RB somewhere, somehow who can run the Halfback Pass play. Sandy Eggo was so vulnerable to that play, I went hoarse yelling at the TV for Denver to run that play. Remember the throw back to Elway? I also remember a time or two when Sharpe caught passes from the RB, but that play didn't happen much because Elway was....well, Elway. But that play could just break a team's D like a good screen pass.

Sorely would like to see that play come back. Paul Hornung used to make teams look absofreakinglutly stupid with his passes to Dowler.....
Seems like good logic.

Draft a running back so he can throw.

Scarface
01-02-2008, 11:15 AM
This has nothing to do with the 12th pick but...


Broncos unlikely to receive extra picks
By The Denver Post
Article Last Updated: 01/01/2008 11:54:34 PM MST

The Broncos aren't expected to acquire any compensatory picks for the April draft. Those draft picks are given to teams based on free-agency moves from the year before.

Because the Broncos signed several players, they are not expected to get extra picks when the compensatory picks are issued in March. Denver, which will pick 12th in the first round, has eight picks in the 2008 draft. The Broncos don't have third- and sixth-round picks, but have extra choices in the fourth, fifth and seventh rounds.

http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_7858971

MHCBill
01-02-2008, 11:21 AM
For you guys that follow the draft classes pretty well how deep is this year's draft?

2006 seemed incredibly deep... 2007 seemed okay at the top but not much depth day two.

What does 2008 and 2009 look like?

Should we look at using a lot of our late picks this year to move up earlier or do we trade some away for next year?

Scarface
01-02-2008, 11:26 AM
'08 is on the weaker side, imo.

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 11:27 AM
It is deep in certain areas.... plus a lot can change from now till the time period that underclassmen have to make their final decision...

Very deep
OLB
OT
OG
RB
DE

Decent Depth
MLB
CB
WR
K
P
TE
C

Low Depth
DT
FB
QB
S

Lonestar
01-02-2008, 12:25 PM
It is deep in certain areas.... plus a lot can change from now till the time period that underclassmen have to make their final decision...

Very deep
OLB
OT
OG
RB
DE

Decent Depth
MLB
CB
WR
K
P
TE
C

Low Depth
DT
FB
QB
S


IF this is indeed true then priorithy seems to get this DT stuff done first @12 then start looking for OLB's / OT

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 12:59 PM
I might disagree on the low depth at DT. If you are looking for an immediate Pro Bowler, then you can say it isn't deep, but there is some solid talent out there.

Ellis, Dorsey, Balmer, Bryant, Okam, Moore, Laws, Pressley, Dotson, Hayden, Powell...

DE is more of a weak spot. Chris Long is a stud, Campbell will be one day and Jackson is okay. After that, it's a crap shoot.
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BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:06 PM
I might disagree on the low depth at DT. If you are looking for an immediate Pro Bowler, then you can say it isn't deep, but there is some solid talent out there.

Ellis, Dorsey, Balmer, Bryant, Okam, Moore, Laws, Pressley, Dotson, Hayden, Powell...

DE is more of a weak spot. Chris Long is a stud, Campbell will be one day and Jackson is okay. After that, it's a crap shoot.

I disagree

DE?

Chris Long DE 6'3" 266 VIRGINIA
Derrick Harvey DE 6'4" 250 FLORIDA
Calais Campbell DE 6'7" 279 MIAMI (FLA.)
Vernon Gholston DE 6'3" 255 OHIO STATE
Quentin Groves DE 6'3" 249 AUBURN
Tommy Blake DE 6'2" 252 TCU
Jeremy Thompson DE 6'5" 262 WAKE FOREST
Christopher Ellis DE 6'4" 252 VIRGINIA TECH
Lawrence Jackson DE 6'5" 266 USC
Clifford Avril DE 6'2" 249 PURDUE
Kendall Langford DE 6'5" 290 HAMPTON

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:07 PM
DT Only 7 Good to decent ones.

Glenn Dorsey DT 6'1" 310 LSU 98
Sedrick Ellis DT 6'1" 305 USC 97
Kentwan Balmer DT 6'4" 297 NORTH CAROLINA 90
Marcus Harrison DT 6'2" 303 ARKANSAS 86
Frank Okam DT 6'4" 325 TEXAS
DeMario Pressley DT 6'4" 290 NORTH CAROLINA ST 77
Andre Fluellen DT 6'1" 279 FLORIDA STATE

G_Money
01-02-2008, 01:07 PM
I'm with Chaz on the DT thing. You aren't guaranteed that Ellis is any better than Moore, and Moore should be available after the 1st round.

We could draft a 2nd round DT and do very well w/ him. 2nd DAY DTs would definitely be some sort of wish-and-a-prayer, but most 2nd day picks are. That's why I'd like to spend our 2nd day picks on positions we're good at drafting then: OL, RB, etc.

Just stay away from 1st round DTs and I'll be okay. S or LB in the 1st, DT can come in the 2nd if we feel we must (but honestly - wouldn't a new scheme do more for our DL than any draftpick possibly could in the scheme we're failing to run now?).

~G

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:09 PM
Look at the drop off at safety

(the score to the right is their grade according to scouts inc.)

Kenny Phillips S 6'1" 203 MIAMI (FLA.) 94
Jonathan Hefney S 5'8" 180 TENNESSEE 78
Joshua Barrett S 6'1" 225 ARIZONA STATE 77
Quintin Demps S 5'11" 202 UTEP 75
Christopher Horton S 6'0" 214 UCLA 74
Darien Williams S 5'11" 200 OKLAHOMA 73
Thomas Zbikowski S 5'11" 207 NOTRE DAME 72

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 01:12 PM
I disagree

DE?

Chris Long DE 6'3" 266 VIRGINIA
Derrick Harvey DE 6'4" 250 FLORIDA
Calais Campbell DE 6'7" 279 MIAMI (FLA.)
Vernon Gholston DE 6'3" 255 OHIO STATE
Quentin Groves DE 6'3" 249 AUBURN
Tommy Blake DE 6'2" 252 TCU
Jeremy Thompson DE 6'5" 262 WAKE FOREST
Christopher Ellis DE 6'4" 252 VIRGINIA TECH
Lawrence Jackson DE 6'5" 266 USC
Clifford Avril DE 6'2" 249 PURDUE
Kendall Langford DE 6'5" 290 HAMPTON

Guys like Gholston, Harvey and Groves will most likely end up as LB's depending on who drafts them. Blake will never play in the NFL due to the injuries, Langford will be a DT.

Makes the list ALOT smaller.
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BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:12 PM
QB's with a 70 or better on Scout Inc scale:

Matt Ryan QB 6'4" 221 BOSTON COLLEGE 97
Brian Brohm QB 6'3" 225 LOUISVILLE 96
Andre Woodson, Jr QB 6'4" 219 KENTUCKY 95
Chad Henne QB 6'2" 225 MICHIGAN 79
Joseph Flacco QB 6'6" 236 DELAWARE 76
Dennis Dixon QB 6'3" 195 OREGON 73
John David Booty QB 6'2" 210 USC 71
Joshua Johnson QB 6'2" 195 SAN DIEGO 70

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:13 PM
RB's

Darren McFadden RB 6'2" 212 ARKANSAS 99
Jonathan Stewart RB 5'11" 233 OREGON 93
Felix Jones RB 6'0" 202 ARKANSAS 88
Rashard Mendenhall RB 5'11" 225 ILLINOIS 86
Steve Slaton RB 5'10" 196 WEST VIRGINIA 84
Mike Hart RB 5'9" 200 MICHIGAN 82
Ray Rice RB 5'9" 197 RUTGERS 81
Tashard Choice RB 5'11" 207 GEORGIA TECH 73

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:14 PM
WR's

DeSean Jackson WR 6'0" 179 CALIFORNIA 95
Limas Sweed WR 6'4" 219 TEXAS 93
Early Doucet III WR 6'0" 210 LSU 92
Malcolm Kelly WR 6'4" 217 OKLAHOMA 91
Mario Manningham WR 6'0" 188 MICHIGAN 90
Adarius Bowman WR 6'3" 225 OKLAHOMA STATE 89
James Hardy WR 6'5" 218 INDIANA 88
Earl Bennett WR 6'1" 205 VANDERBILT 86
D.J. Hall WR 6'2" 189 ALABAMA 85
Donnie Avery WR 5'11" 183 HOUSTON 81
Dorien Bryant WR 5'10" 172 PURDUE 80
Harry Douglas IV WR 5'11" 169 LOUISVILLE 79
Keenan Burton WR 6'0" 202 KENTUCKY 78
Andre Caldwell WR 6'0" 202 FLORIDA 77
Lavelle Hawkins WR 5'11" 186 CALIFORNIA 74
Eddie Royal WR 5'9" 181 VIRGINIA TECH 71
Marcus Monk WR 6'5" 214 ARKANSAS 70

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:14 PM
TE's

John Carlson TE 6'4" 252 NOTRE DAME 90
Fred Davis TE 6'3" 245 USC 88
Dustin Keller TE 6'2" 245 PURDUE 79
Kellen Davis TE 6'5" 253 MICHIGAN STATE 72
Martin Rucker TE 6'4" 245 MISSOURI 71

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:15 PM
FB's

(no one scores a 70 or above)

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 01:15 PM
Look at the drop off at safety

(the score to the right is their grade according to scouts inc.)

Kenny Phillips S 6'1" 203 MIAMI (FLA.) 94
Jonathan Hefney S 5'8" 180 TENNESSEE 78
Joshua Barrett S 6'1" 225 ARIZONA STATE 77
Quintin Demps S 5'11" 202 UTEP 75
Christopher Horton S 6'0" 214 UCLA 74
Darien Williams S 5'11" 200 OKLAHOMA 73
Thomas Zbikowski S 5'11" 207 NOTRE DAME 72

Where are Castille, Adams, Steltz, Smith?
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BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:15 PM
OT's

Jake Long OT 6'7" 309 MICHIGAN 97
Ryan Clady OT 6'6" 317 BOISE STATE 95
Jeffrey Otah OT 6'6" 339 PITTSBURGH 92
Samuel Baker OT 6'5" 312 USC 91
Michael Oher OT 6'5" 323 MISSISSIPPI 90
Gosder Cherilus OT 6'6" 312 BOSTON COLLEGE 86
Christopher Williams OT 6'6" 315 VANDERBILT 80
Tony Hills OT 6'5" 303 TEXAS 77
Carl Nicks OT 6'4" 328 NEBRASKA 72

BigDaddyBronco
01-02-2008, 01:16 PM
Our other huge problem is that we don't have a 3rd round pick.

Guys like Demps and Barrett and Moore are most likely 3rd round picks. We have 2 4ths so we can go after the take a chance players like Marcus Thomas, but much of the big guys are gone by then.

I would love the Broncos to get a monster DT like Haynesworth or the guys at Jacksonville. Think how much it helps the run defense and how it helps get pressure on the QB in 1st and 2nd down.

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:16 PM
OG's

Roy Schuening OG 6'3" 315 OREGON STATE 83
Andrew Radovich OG 6'5" 299 USC 76

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:17 PM
C

Steven Justice OC 6'3" 283 WAKE FOREST 86
Kory Lichtensteiger OC 6'2" 309 BOWLING GREEN 74
Cody Wallace OC 6'4" 297 TEXAS A&M 70

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 01:17 PM
Our other huge problem is that we don't have a 3rd round pick.

Guys like Demps and Barrett and Moore are most likely 3rd round picks. We have 2 4ths so we can go after the take a chance players like Marcus Thomas, but much of the big guys are gone by then.

I would love the Broncos to get a monster DT like Haynesworth or the guys at Jacksonville. Think how much it helps the run defense and how it helps get pressure on the QB in 1st and 2nd down.

Look at the Texas boys
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BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:17 PM
DT's

Glenn Dorsey DT 6'1" 310 LSU 98
Sedrick Ellis DT 6'1" 305 USC 97
Kentwan Balmer DT 6'4" 297 NORTH CAROLINA 90
Marcus Harrison DT 6'2" 303 ARKANSAS 86
Frank Okam DT 6'4" 325 TEXAS 81
DeMario Pressley DT 6'4" 290 NORTH CAROLINA ST 77
Andre Fluellen DT 6'1" 279 FLORIDA STATE 74

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:18 PM
DE's

Chris Long DE 6'3" 266 VIRGINIA 98
Derrick Harvey DE 6'4" 250 FLORIDA 96
Calais Campbell DE 6'7" 279 MIAMI (FLA.) 95
Vernon Gholston DE 6'3" 255 OHIO STATE 94
Quentin Groves DE 6'3" 249 AUBURN 88
Tommy Blake DE 6'2" 252 TCU 86
Jeremy Thompson DE 6'5" 262 WAKE FOREST 85
Christopher Ellis DE 6'4" 252 VIRGINIA TECH 81
Lawrence Jackson DE 6'5" 266 USC 79
Clifford Avril DE 6'2" 249 PURDUE 76
Kendall Langford DE 6'5" 290 HAMPTON 70

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:18 PM
ILB's

James Laurinaitis ILB 6'2" 244 OHIO STATE 96
Dan Connor ILB 6'3" 228 PENN STATE 94
Rey Maualuga ILB 6'2" 251 USC 92
Tavares Gooden ILB 6'2" 231 MIAMI (FLA.) 88
Philip Wheeler ILB 6'1" 234 GEORGIA TECH 84
Beau Bell ILB 6'1" 249 NEVADA LAS VEGAS 79
Vincent Hall ILB 5'11" 236 VIRGINIA TECH 77
Jonathan Goff ILB 6'2" 236 VANDERBILT 73

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:19 PM
OLB's

Keith Rivers OLB 6'2" 236 USC 94
Ali Highsmith OLB 6'0" 221 LSU 93
Shawn Crable OLB 6'4" 243 MICHIGAN 84
Xavier Adibi OLB 6'1" 219 VIRGINIA TECH 76
Bruce Davis OLB 6'2" 231 UCLA 73
Jordon Dizon OLB 5'11" 221 COLORADO 71

Lonestar
01-02-2008, 01:20 PM
DT Only 7 Good to decent ones.

Glenn Dorsey DT 6'1" 310 LSU 98
Sedrick Ellis DT 6'1" 305 USC 97
Kentwan Balmer DT 6'4" 297 NORTH CAROLINA 90
Marcus Harrison DT 6'2" 303 ARKANSAS 86
Frank Okam DT 6'4" 325 TEXAS
DeMario Pressley DT 6'4" 290 NORTH CAROLINA ST 77
Andre Fluellen DT 6'1" 279 FLORIDA STATE


I'd guess that the ones in red would be the only ones I'd want in Bates system a 279 pound DT does not seem to fill the bill so to speak..

We are talking wide body cloggers here not someone that the OLINE guys outweigh by 30+ pounds.

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:20 PM
CB's

Malcolm Jenkins CB 6'1" 203 OHIO STATE 95
Mike Jenkins CB 6'0" 200 SOUTH FLORIDA 93
Aqib Talib CB 6'1" 201 KANSAS 91
Reggie Smith CB 6'0" 199 OKLAHOMA 90
Terrell Thomas CB 6'1" 200 USC 88
Justin King CB 6'0" 185 PENN STATE 87
Dejuan Tribble CB 5'9" 190 BOSTON COLLEGE 86
Antoine Cason CB 6'0" 190 ARIZONA 85
Dwight Lowery CB 6'0" 185 SAN JOSE STATE 80
Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie CB 6'1" 181 TENNESSEE STATE 79
Chevis Jackson CB 5'11" 191 LSU 77
Trae Williams CB 5'10" 185 SOUTH FLORIDA 76
Zackary Bowman CB 6'1" 203 NEBRASKA 74 I
Simeon Castille CB 6'0" 190 ALABAMA 73
Jonathan Zenon CB 5'11" 179 LSU 71

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:20 PM
S
Kenny Phillips S 6'1" 203 MIAMI (FLA.) 94
Jonathan Hefney S 5'8" 180 TENNESSEE 78
Joshua Barrett S 6'1" 225 ARIZONA STATE 77
Quintin Demps S 5'11" 202 UTEP 75
Christopher Horton S 6'0" 214 UCLA 74
Darien Williams S 5'11" 200 OKLAHOMA 73
Thomas Zbikowski S 5'11" 207 NOTRE DAME 72

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:21 PM
K & P

(no one scores above 70)

BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 01:24 PM
Where are Castille, Adams, Steltz, Smith?

Castille is listed as a cornerback same with Reggie Smith
Jamar Adams S 6'2" 210 MICHIGAN 65
Craig Steltz S 6'1" 210 LSU 30
Reggie Smith CB 6'0" 199 OKLAHOMA 90

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 02:10 PM
Castille is listed as a cornerback same with Reggie Smith
Jamar Adams S 6'2" 210 MICHIGAN 65
Craig Steltz S 6'1" 210 LSU 30
Reggie Smith CB 6'0" 199 OKLAHOMA 90

Castille and Smith will both be safeties.
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BOSSHOGG30
01-02-2008, 02:14 PM
Castille and Smith will both be safeties.

I agree that Castille would make a great one, but as for Scout Inc... they have him listed at cornerback.

CoachChaz
01-02-2008, 02:28 PM
I agree that Castille would make a great one, but as for Scout Inc... they have him listed at cornerback.

Scout, Inc. is a waste. They are too big and commercial anymore. I remembering reading something on a consensus poll a year or two ago that showed that most scouts and organizations use their service primarily for info and less for accuracy of knowledge.
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Astrass
01-02-2008, 09:24 PM
I dont think Shanny believes in building through the draft. I see him maybe trading our pick for vets in various ways. On the other hand if Shanny believes he can obtain an absolute stud then he will use his pick or trade up.

Dean
01-02-2008, 10:50 PM
Scout, Inc. is a waste. They are too big and commercial anymore. I remembering reading something on a consensus poll a year or two ago that showed that most scouts and organizations use their service primarily for info

Okay so far.


and less for accuracy of knowledge.

If they are not noted for accuracy of knowledge, why would scouts and organizations use them?

I was right there with you up to the last 6 words. Then you lost me man.

fcspikeit
01-03-2008, 02:18 AM
DT Only 7 Good to decent ones.

Glenn Dorsey DT 6'1" 310 LSU 98
Sedrick Ellis DT 6'1" 305 USC 97
Kentwan Balmer DT 6'4" 297 NORTH CAROLINA 90
Marcus Harrison DT 6'2" 303 ARKANSAS 86
Frank Okam DT 6'4" 325 TEXAS
DeMario Pressley DT 6'4" 290 NORTH CAROLINA ST 77
Andre Fluellen DT 6'1" 279 FLORIDA STATE

Can I have a link to the site where your getting these ratings?

On, http:www.//profootballexperts.scout.com they have the DT ranked like this,,

Rank Rating Name Yr Ht/Wt/40 College Home
DT 1 Glenn Dorsey SR 6-2/299/- LSU Gonzales, LA
DT 2 Sedrick Ellis SR 6-1/285/- USC Chino, CA
DT 3 Kentwan Balmer SR 6-5/288/- North Carolina Weldon, NC
DT 4 Frank Okam SR 6-5/320/- Texas Dallas, TX
DT 5 Joseph Bryant SR 6-5/322/- Texas A&M Jasper, TX
DT 6 Andre Fluellen SR 6-4/280/- Florida State Cartersville, GA
DT 7 Demario Pressley SR 6-3/295/- North Carolina State Greensboro, NC
DT 8 Nick Hayden SR 6-5/301/- Wisconsin Hartland, WI
DT 9 Dre Moore SR 6-4/311/- Maryland Charlotte, NC
DT 10 Lionel Dotson SR 6-4/286/- Arizona Houston, TX
DT 11 Barry Booker SR 6-4/290/- Virginia Tech Amherst, VA
DT 12 Keilen Dykes SR 6-5/295/- West Virginia Youngstown, OH
DT 13 Jason Shirley SR 6-5/330/- Fresno State Fontana, CA


They have the top 4 on the list, listed with 5 stars. I like the # system from your site better.

scout.com (http://profootballexperts.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=9&c=12&yr=2008&nid=83&lnid=124&rc=4&pid=22)

CoachChaz
01-03-2008, 08:05 AM
Okay so far.



If they are not noted for accuracy of knowledge, why would scouts and organizations use them?

I was right there with you up to the last 6 words. Then you lost me man.

What I meant was more for bio info and specifics on physical abilities and history...and less for their ability to assess a players qualities. Most NFL teams assess the abilities themselves regardless of what report they have read, but Scout, Inc. is one of those places that seems to do it for the money.
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MOtorboat
01-03-2008, 08:36 AM
Can I have a link to the site where your getting these ratings?

On, http:www.//profootballexperts.scout.com they have the DT ranked like this,,

Rank Rating Name Yr Ht/Wt/40 College Home
DT 1 Glenn Dorsey SR 6-2/299/- LSU Gonzales, LA
DT 2 Sedrick Ellis SR 6-1/285/- USC Chino, CA
DT 3 Kentwan Balmer SR 6-5/288/- North Carolina Weldon, NC
DT 4 Frank Okam SR 6-5/320/- Texas Dallas, TX
DT 5 Joseph Bryant SR 6-5/322/- Texas A&M Jasper, TX
DT 6 Andre Fluellen SR 6-4/280/- Florida State Cartersville, GA
DT 7 Demario Pressley SR 6-3/295/- North Carolina State Greensboro, NC
DT 8 Nick Hayden SR 6-5/301/- Wisconsin Hartland, WI
DT 9 Dre Moore SR 6-4/311/- Maryland Charlotte, NC
DT 10 Lionel Dotson SR 6-4/286/- Arizona Houston, TX
DT 11 Barry Booker SR 6-4/290/- Virginia Tech Amherst, VA
DT 12 Keilen Dykes SR 6-5/295/- West Virginia Youngstown, OH
DT 13 Jason Shirley SR 6-5/330/- Fresno State Fontana, CA


They have the top 4 on the list, listed with 5 stars. I like the # system from your site better.

scout.com (http://profootballexperts.scout.com/a.z?s=211&p=9&c=12&yr=2008&nid=83&lnid=124&rc=4&pid=22)

It's ESPN's Scouts, Inc.

http://sports-ak.espn.go.com/nfl/draft08/index

Both me and Boss paid for the ESPN Insider, so you'll see us using this a lot...just viewing the prospect list should be free though...

HolyDiver
01-03-2008, 10:11 AM
I would take Stump Thompson from Auburn in the later rounds...............He seems like a blue collar type..............very short, under 6' but weighs 300 pounds..................I like this guy and think he's a good fit for us............Can probably be had with a 6th or 7th round pick, because of his height...................Sedrick Ellis is alot bigger than 285............I would take him with our #1 pick..............or, Maualuga if he comes out.

mclark
01-03-2008, 12:02 PM
I don't see us trading down. What's the point? We have a lot of picks this year. We might try to make a trade (Henry, Javon, day two picks) to get a third round pick. Shanny has made moves to try to trade UP the past few years. The best players are at the top of the draft (generally speaking) not at the bottom.

We need defensive help:

Sedrick Ellis
James Laurinitis
Dan Connor
Kenny Phillips
Keith Rivers
(or Rey Maluaga if he were to change his mind and come out)

all would give us that.

We also need a starting left tackle. So if we don't get that person in free agency we could also look at trading down a few spots for Clady. Jeff Otah reminds me of another George Foster waiting to happen -- so I hope we don't go that route. I want us to sign a left tackle in free agency -- and also a starting guard in free agency.