Wild Horse

[broncofaninfla]

What did you think of the Wild Horse formation?

:salute:

[Slick]

Predictable.

[BroncoWave]

Predictable.

So predictable we completed every single pass we ran out of it.

I think it was pretty cool. If nothing else, it gives future teams one more thing to have to prepare for against us, whether we use it or not.

[Slick]

Moreno didn't complete any passes BTB.

[broncofaninfla]

Orton was 7/7

[Slick]

Orton was 7/7

Under center. Are you calling him motioning from the WR spot back under center as still being in the WildHorse formation? I don't.

[honz]

Under center. Are you calling him motioning from the WR spot back under center as still being in the WildHorse formation? I don't.

McD and Orton said the whole point of it was to get NE to tip their hat as to what type of coverage they were gonna go with on a given play. I think it is a wrinkle that we may see a bit more of in 2 or 3 other games this year, but not something that we will see every game. Just a little wrinkle to catch teams off guard with.

[jrelway]

if it confuses the defense so they have to call a timeout, im for it. nothing but good came out of the wild horses.

[Slick]

McD and Orton said the whole point of it was to get NE to tip their hat as to what type of coverage they were gonna go with on a given play. I think it is a wrinkle that we may see a bit more of in 2 or 3 other games this year, but not something that we will see every game. Just a little wrinkle to catch teams off guard with.

It's a great idea. I guess either I misunderstand what the wildcat is, or the thread starter does. Sure, we lined up in it, but then we'd motion out of it and run a standard pass play, unless Moreno takes the snap directly, which he did, and we ran it every time. It worked for a while. I have no problem with the formation if we're screwing with defenses, I just don't see Moreno going all Ronnie Brown on anyone this year.

[honz]

It's a great idea. I guess either I misunderstand what the wildcat is, or the thread starter does. Sure, we lined up in it, but then we'd motion out of it and run a standard pass play, unless Moreno takes the snap directly, which he did, and we ran it every time. It worked for a while. I have no problem with the formation if we're screwing with defenses, I just don't see Moreno going all Ronnie Brown on anyone this year.
Agreed. I think we only ran out of it once after that first drive because NE adjusted to it well. It wasn't a "true" wildcat as there was no option for Moreno other than to run it. I think it was a one time thing just to get the Pats on their heels, but we may see it early in games again once or twice this year.

[Bronco Warrior]

I would love to see more creative offense from the boy Genius! There is a bit of method in this madness! Now SD will be spending half of their time trying to work on it, and they will probably see none of it lol! Buit they will see something else creative if not the Wild Horse! How about the Bucking Bronco??

[BroncoWave]

Under center. Are you calling him motioning from the WR spot back under center as still being in the WildHorse formation? I don't.

Yep, because when we go to the line in that formation the D has to adjust to it, then when Orton shifts behind center, that throws the defense off. So while the play itself is ran out of a base formation, the D has to be ready for the threat of run or pass when Moreno first lines up behind center.

[Fan in Exile]

It's a great idea. I guess either I misunderstand what the wildcat is, or the thread starter does. Sure, we lined up in it, but then we'd motion out of it and run a standard pass play, unless Moreno takes the snap directly, which he did, and we ran it every time. It worked for a while. I have no problem with the formation if we're screwing with defenses, I just don't see Moreno going all Ronnie Brown on anyone this year.

You are strictly speaking correct that the play was not run out of the wild horses formation when Orton motioned back behind center. However it was still valuable in that it let him read a simpler defense and make a play. So the formation was valuable when we ran a play from it and when it allowed Orton to make a completion from a different formation.

At the same time it also caused Bill to burn three timeouts which is great.

[Bronco Warrior]

It also makes the defense more of a base package, can't substitute fast enough When Orton goes back under Center. There has only been one team so far in the Pros (Miami) that has had anything but token success with the Wild Cat but McDaniels has used it just to creat pre-snap confusion and runs it just enough to make them respect the threat!

[Slick]

You are strictly speaking correct that the play was not run out of the wild horses formation when Orton motioned back behind center. However it was still valuable in that it let him read a simpler defense and make a play. So the formation was valuable when we ran a play from it and when it allowed Orton to make a completion from a different formation.

At the same time it also caused Bill to burn three timeouts which is great.

I'm being to literal about it I guess.

[Lonestar]

McD and Orton said the whole point of it was to get NE to tip their hat as to what type of coverage they were gonna go with on a given play. I think it is a wrinkle that we may see a bit more of in 2 or 3 other games this year, but not something that we will see every game. Just a little wrinkle to catch teams off guard with.

I also see it played with direct snap to Moreno or Hillis down the road with KO in the shotgun... I think it opens up that as play.. that is all depending on what look the defense gives them..

anything we put in a game plan now makes the DC have to plan against it as well as putting in valuable time practicing to stop it..

any time they do that is time they do not have for other plays..

If Y'all have noticed each week Josh comes up with plays to get someone else invested in the game.. two weeks ago Marshall last week Eddie and Scheffler more than before..

NOW I know that all of them have been on the field and are doing what they are supposed to do but the defense keys on someone and all of sudden KO makes the read to go to the open man.. (anyone think this would have happened last year)..


so the real question is who is SAN going to allow to be open or single covered.. screen passes to Hillis and Moreno or is Bucky going to be back for this game.. since he had an extra day to heal..

[TXBRONC]

Moreno didn't complete any passes BTB.

True but he didn't throw any either out that formation. But Orton did after motioning back under center.

[Dirk]

Wow. I was the only one that voted against it. It worked for the most part that is true. But I just hate gimmicky stuff.


But....if it helps them win then by all means use it. I just don't like it.

[TXBRONC]

Wow. I was the only one that voted against it. It worked for the most part that is true. But I just hate gimmicky stuff.


But....if it helps them win then by all means use it. I just don't like it.

Maybe it's not something you would run every game but it's wrinkle that use every once in awhile to give the opposition something new to think about.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Maybe it's not something you would run every game but it's wrinkle that use every once in awhile to give the opposition something new to think about.

True -The opposition will have to at least wonder if we will run it, and if so, what they need to do to defend it. From day one, Coach McDaniels said every week, the offense will change up.

[AlWilsonizKING]

Under center. Are you calling him motioning from the WR spot back under center as still being in the WildHorse formation? I don't.


The announcers did.


PEACE!!!

[broncofaninfla]

Wow. I was the only one that voted against it. It worked for the most part that is true. But I just hate gimmicky stuff.


But....if it helps them win then by all means use it. I just don't like it.

My jaw dropped when we started out in it as I had no idea what to expect but in the end it kept NE off balance and does give opposing defensive coordinators more to have to worry about. I doubt it will ever be our bread and butter like it is with Miami but I like the addtional demension it brings to the offense.

[Bronco Warrior]

Something helped Orton step up his game...let's credit the wild horse!

As for getting more people involved here's hoping he comes up with something to get Brandstater's cannon arm involved! :rofl:

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Something helped Orton step up his game...let's credit the wild horse!

As for getting more people involved here's hoping he comes up with something to get Brandstater's cannon arm involved! :rofl:

What helped Orton step up his game was NO GLOVE

[Slick]

The announcers did.


PEACE!!!

I wouldn't urinate on Phil Simms if he were on fire.

[frauschieze]

Needed one more option on the poll:

Like it in the playbook, but don't want to see it with any real frequency.

I don't suspect we will either. McD really seems to be tailoring the game plan and plays to each team's defensive weaknesses.

That said, San Diego's weakness to me, seems to be their rush defense and statistically, they are weak against passes to the TEs and RBs (http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef) (similar to NE). Maybe the Wild Horses will work on them too. But I hate the idea of using it two games in a row. I'm hoping McD has some more tricks up his hoodie sleeves.

[Zweems56]

It's a great idea. I guess either I misunderstand what the wildcat is, or the thread starter does. Sure, we lined up in it, but then we'd motion out of it and run a standard pass play, unless Moreno takes the snap directly, which he did, and we ran it every time. It worked for a while. I have no problem with the formation if we're screwing with defenses, I just don't see Moreno going all Ronnie Brown on anyone this year.

Orton moving back under center is still considered part of the wild horses package. The reason they split him out wide like that and move him back under center is so he can get a better look at the coverage from the edge instead of under center. Just because Moreno doesn't take the snap doesn't mean that we're no longer in the "wild horses" package. This wild horses look we got on sunday isn't the Wildcat, its a completely different wrinkle.

[Bronco Warrior]

The next one is with the Wild Horse formation with Orton out wide and Brandstater lined up at TE...then they never know what QB will come under Center! lol! Will finally have to cover deep lol!

[underrated29]

I liked it, but here is my problem with it. I discovered it real fast and so did billy b.

If it is a direct snap to knowshon then moreno is going to run strait ahead. There is no gimmick no trickery. If you dont see orton in close you bring the safties low and stack the box.


Once NE did this, they shut it down pretty well.

I also dont like it because the way we run it we essentially havev 10 guys on the field instead of 11. As orton just stands there. The CB on Orton cheats in becuase we know Knowhson is running and Orton is not going anything.




What i would like to see us do is run the wild horse, but put a WR in motion so we have the option of the run going to the edge or up the gut. We also then have the option to pass because the d wont just crash down on knowshon.


There needs to be something else, otherwise its just a run play that tells the defense exactly what we are going to do.

[Dean]

Yep, because when we go to the line in that formation the D has to adjust to it, then when Orton shifts behind center, that throws the defense off. So while the play itself is ran out of a base formation, the D has to be ready for the threat of run or pass when Moreno first lines up behind center.

The defense would have no trouble shifting back into a normal defense. You gain the advantage from the personnel that is on the field.

[Dortoh]

Loved it but doubt it will be in the playbook each week.

The name is kinda gay IMO but when you are wearing those unis and socks what difference does it really make LOL

[BroncoWave]

The next one is with the Wild Horse formation with Orton out wide and Brandstater lined up at TE...then they never know what QB will come under Center! lol! Will finally have to cover deep lol!

Your #3 QB is ineligible to play unless of an emergency. He can't be on the field at the same time as QB1 or QB2.

[Day1BroncoFan]

I think we'll see some variations on it in the future. The mediocre results it produced last week won't let it be used with frequency and success.

I expect to see some variation of it against SD to confuse them on D.

I think it could easily be over used.

[weazel]

I think it is pretty lame that they call it the wild horses offense. They could score every single time they lineup in it and it would still be a lame name.

[Bronco Warrior]

Your #3 QB is ineligible to play unless of an emergency. He can't be on the field at the same time as QB1 or QB2.

If he is activated he can be..like Vick..and um....IT WAS A FREAKING JOKE! It was a wild idea..let's call it the Wild Ass! The technecalites can be easily gotten around...should Josh really wants to do it! :throwrock:

[sneakers]

Eh, I need more evidence to make a decision.

[oobehr]

I would love to see an offense run 2 pocket passers at the same time. None of this michael vick, pat white junk. Have orton and simms at on the field at the same time in the backfield with a fullback then have 3 wideouts. That would be cool, if you can keep your qb's from getting beasted.

[Zweems56]

I would love to see an offense run 2 pocket passers at the same time. None of this michael vick, pat white junk. Have orton and simms at on the field at the same time in the backfield with a fullback then have 3 wideouts. That would be cool, if you can keep your qb's from getting beasted.

There is absolutely NO reason for there to be two quarterbacks on the field at the same time unless at least one of them is a LEGITIMATE threat to run the ball (Vick). Whoever isn't throwing the ball in that situation is a waste of a player on the field. They can't block, they can't catch, and they can't run. You're basically playing with 10 players on the field for what reason? The fraction of a second where defenders will be asking themselves "what in the shit are two quarterbacks on the field for?" Regardless of which one receives the snap, the defense knows they're handing off the ball to a rb, or passing the ball. If they're passing the ball, all it does is negate the other quarterback. If they're running the ball, it negates the purpose of both quarterbacks. There's just NO sense in having two pocket passers on the field at the same time.

[Bronco Warrior]

What do you mean...Orton is a huge rushing threat!!!! :woot:

[Italianmobstr7]

I like the name, I like the idea. I hope we see it or a similar version of it throughout the season when needed.

[Tned]

It's late here (almost 3am), so I haven't read the replies yet, so sorry if this is covered.

In concept I like what they did, and I really like the twist of having the QB motion back under center. HOWEVER, I think the reason the runs out of the wild horse failed after the first 2 or 3, is that it was missing some major components of the wild cat.

When Arkansas ran it, it was successful because there were 5 different plays that could come from the snap to McFadden (and a few more variations, but 5 major ones).

For simplicity, we will say McFadden is taken the snap and Felix Jones is lined up outside, in a slot or WR spot.

Jones is put in motion heading towards McFadden and the ball is snapped to McFadden, now there are five possible options.

1. McFadden hands to Jones, who continues the sweep type motion and runs to the outside, while McFadden dives up the middle to draw defenders to him.
2. McFadden hands to Jones, who dives up the middle, while McFadden either runs outside, or acts like he has the ball to pass.
3. McFadden fakes to Jones who keeps running the sweep, and McFadden runs up the middle.
4. McFadden fakes to Jones, who runs up the middle, while McFadden takes the ball and runs outside.
5. McFadden fakes to Jones, bootlegs left, and throws to a wide open receiver around the left numbers (often in the endzone).

There are than subtle variations of those, suck as dose Jones motion in, or is he standing next to McFadden in shotgun when the ball is snapped.

The poit is, the defense has to defend inside and outside, against two seperate runners, and the fake handoffs to both, not to mention the play action passing, which keeps them from cheating everyone up to stop the run.

Miami runs the wildcat pretty similar to the way Arkansas did it (they either have the former OC or QB coach, or someone else from the Arkansas staff, can't remember who).

so, while motioning Orton under center was a nice tweak, and Orton threw very effectively out of it, the formation and play calling is very lacking in the run department, because on the plays where orton doesn't motion in, the Moreno runs become very predictable.

[frauschieze]

I think of this song every time I hear or read about this formation:

t3PbbeUL5SI

It's starting to drive me nuts.

[dogfish]

i think bill belichick peed in his pants a little bit when he saw it, so it must be a good thing. . . .

[TXBRONC]

i think bill belichick peed in his pants a little bit when he saw it, so it must be a good thing. . . .

And I wouldn't doubt that when he saw Denver in that formation he looked across the field at McDaniels and said under his breath "Why that little bastage." :D

[oobehr]

I know 2 qb's on the field would be pretty stupid but doesn't mean I don't want to see it, just to see what the hell it can do. Who knows.

[Bronco Warrior]

i think bill belichick peed in his pants a little bit when he saw it, so it must be a good thing. . . .

Bellichick with pee in his pants gives me , and him a warm feeling!