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VonDoom
10-14-2019, 08:29 AM
Gotta start this early since our game is on Thursday. What do you think our strategy will be?

https://twitter.com/masedenver/status/1183640138359791616?s=21

SR
10-14-2019, 08:32 AM
With Denver's luck, KC's defense will stop the run and their defense will look like the '84 Bears Thursday night.

Shazam!
10-14-2019, 08:32 AM
Fangio gotta follow Houston blueprint keep Mahomes and Co off the Field

RUN RUN RUN AMD RUN SUM MORE

Mahimes is a lil dinged up if Denver can get to him gotta make it count

Flacco and the Offense MUST score more than 16 if they hope to pull this off

I think Broncos can actually pull this out, they lost what 6 straight? I woulda preferred KC not desperate for a Win but thats the hand they were dealt

Hawgdriver
10-14-2019, 11:58 AM
Gotta start this early since our game is on Thursday. What do you think our strategy will be?

https://twitter.com/masedenver/status/1183640138359791616?s=21

Strategy will be to get Lindsay and Freeman to quote the inimitable Carlos Hyde: 'They can't f*&king stop us'.

underrated29
10-14-2019, 12:02 PM
I would run a lot this game but I would also call a TON of PA and PA boots. The chefs are going to sell out to stop the run. Hit them with some PA and we should be able to move the ball.

Sadly, I am sure they will be able to move the ball a lot more successfully than we will. I still think we get our ish pushed in on this one.

turftoad
10-14-2019, 12:42 PM
This game is huge,
We are two games back of KC. A win puts us one game back and a better Div record. This is a must win game boys and girls, period!

NightTrainLayne
10-14-2019, 01:18 PM
I'm not expecting a win, and I'm okay with that as long as we continue this trajectory of improvement. We've been a little bit better each week it seems, and that won't be enough to beat the Chiefs yet, but I'll be happy if we just continue to improve on both sides of the ball.

turftoad
10-14-2019, 02:00 PM
We are playing at home. We have a good shot at this one.

BroncoWave
10-14-2019, 02:10 PM
I was kinda shocked at how low the opening line was. They only have KC favored by 3.5. Vegas is giving us a legit shot.

Shazam!
10-14-2019, 02:11 PM
2 weeks ago 31 other Teams would have loved to have Denver on their schedule.

Today 31 other Teams wouldnt want to come face Denver at home after the Defense's performance the last two weeks.

If it were anyone but maybe KC or NE we'd expext a W.

If somehow Fangio can stop Mahomes Broncos in the thick of things in the AFC.

Its totally nuts how fast they went from thebfirst four weeks to last two.

VonDoom
10-14-2019, 02:12 PM
Mike Klis @MikeKlis 42m
Fangio On Mahomes: “I think he’s the John Elway of 80s and 90s. He’s Aaron Rodgers ... “ #9sports

Nicki Jhabvala @NickiJhabvala 42m
Vic Fangio on Patrick Mahomes: "Great passer, a great improviser, plays with a lot of athletic arrogance, which is a compliment — he's very confident, very poised and doesn't rattled — and he has an arm that is really good. ... The guy is really, really special."

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 43m
"Against this guy (Mahomes) you have to defend two plays...the one they've called and the one he can (improvise)." Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan

Andrew Mason @MaseDenver 43m
Fangio, on whether Ja’Wuan James is healthy enough to play Thursday: “I don’t know yet"

Andrew Mason @MaseDenver 42m
Fangio: “Our practices this week won’t be very strenuous” so it will “be a lost week” for some players coming off IR and returning to practice.

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 39m
"(Andy Reid) has always had a good screen game. They've always got it....it's always on his play call list. Usually misdirection involved and they can be tough to handle." Vic Fangio #Broncos
@1043TheFan

Hawgdriver
10-14-2019, 03:24 PM
I was kinda shocked at how low the opening line was. They only have KC favored by 3.5. Vegas is giving us a legit shot.

Duh. It's like you guys haven't been watching the Broncos.

What really bugs me is that Buff doesn't think a win is realistic. I used to think he was smart.

Shazam!
10-14-2019, 05:33 PM
I was kinda shocked at how low the opening line was. They only have KC favored by 3.5. Vegas is giving us a legit shot.

Duh. It's like you guys haven't been watching the Broncos.

What really bugs me is that Buff doesn't think a win is realistic. I used to think he was smart.

I think theyre getting KC at a really great time and theyre facing Denver on the road at the wrong time. It is all set up.

0-6 vs KC and Broncos almost beat them last year, when Denver was worse and KC was better right?

****ing Flacco cannot turn the ball over.

KC defense smells like wet garbage in a hot day.

Im really hyped about this game and watching this Defense the last two weeks its a totally different team than we saw the 1st month

Cugel
10-14-2019, 05:50 PM
With Denver's luck, KC's defense will stop the run and their defense will look like the '84 Bears Thursday night.

That's '85 Bears, not '84 but the Chiefs haven't one player capable of matching any the '85 Bears. Besides the Broncos will simply try and run the ball 40 times and the Chefs' run defense is horrible.

Cugel
10-14-2019, 05:52 PM
Quote Originally Posted by BroncoWave View Post
I was kinda shocked at how low the opening line was. They only have KC favored by 3.5. Vegas is giving us a legit shot.

The line dropped dramatically the last 2 weeks as the Chefs have sucked. But this is a division game, so they will be prepared for the Broncos. We'll see if the Broncos can slow them down.

Canmore
10-14-2019, 10:55 PM
Mahomes doesn't look right. His ankle is bothering him. Get after him.

Timmy!
10-14-2019, 11:48 PM
Mahomes doesn't look right. His ankle is bothering him. Get after him.

Without his mobility, he isn't the same QB.

That said, keep him off the field. Run the ball down their throats. Don't stop. Don't get discouraged, just keep pounding it, all directions, reverses, whatever. Pound. The. Ball.

Canmore
10-15-2019, 12:03 AM
Without his mobility, he isn't the same QB.

That said, keep him off the field. Run the ball down their throats. Don't stop. Don't get discouraged, just keep pounding it, all directions, reverses, whatever. Pound. The. Ball.

All night long

Lindsey and Freeman.

Timmy!
10-15-2019, 12:04 AM
All night long

Lindsey and Freeman.

Book, Jano, the beer vendor guy, whoever.

Elevation inc
10-15-2019, 05:49 AM
Gotta start this early since our game is on Thursday. What do you think our strategy will be?

https://twitter.com/masedenver/status/1183640138359791616?s=21


KC has a hobbled OL, a Hobbled Mahomes, and some DL players missing so we should run the ball a lot, and hopefully be more diverse on offense while doing that and not turn it over and make some plays down the field. I also think what we did against green bay could work against Mahomes, as long as we execute.

MasterShake
10-15-2019, 08:00 AM
Without his mobility, he isn't the same QB.

That said, keep him off the field. Run the ball down their throats. Don't stop. Don't get discouraged, just keep pounding it, all directions, reverses, whatever. Pound. The. Ball.

Reports are his ankle is pretty jacked and its showing up in his stats as the game goes on. The last two weeks he has posted completion ratings of 56% and 54% respectively. He has a hell of an arm and great accuracy with the deep ball, but ultimately those are low percentage plays even for the best and eventually you will have to run the ball or do shorter plays on the route tree for your receivers which Reid and Mahomes don't seem comfortable with for whatever reason.

I will fully admit the only reason I have hope for this game is that Mahomes looks human with his injury, but we HAVE to keep their defense off balance with our offense. I imagine they are going to load the box to start and Flacco has to make them pay with Sutton and Sanders (if he plays) and get our damn Tight Ends involved more. Regardless its nice to have a meaningful game after the way our season started. Also I can't stand Tyreek Hill and I hope the Broncos defense smashes him into the turf. He's a piece of crap.

LawDog
10-15-2019, 09:20 AM
Dear Detroit Fans, we feel ya, Sincerely Broncos Country.

Buff
10-15-2019, 10:35 AM
Duh. It's like you guys haven't been watching the Broncos.

What really bugs me is that Buff doesn't think a win is realistic. I used to think he was smart.

I am not sure why you ever thought that!

I am informed by the fact that I almost fell asleep a few times at Sunday's game when our offense was on the field. I want to be optimistic if this team will let me.

Elevation inc
10-15-2019, 11:21 AM
Our defense is the best chance we got. Our offense is a 2011 offense with better RB’s same quality OL and a QB who can checkdown for 3 yds more effectively I guess.....

Buff
10-15-2019, 11:32 AM
My biggest concern is that the blueprint that Indy and Houston established is that you run the ball and keep your offense on the field as much as possible... We've shown almost a total inability to sustain drives and keep the chains moving. Also - Deshaun Watson and Jacobie Brisset are great at improvising and squeaking out some yards when the play breaks down - Flacco, not so much.

BroncoWave
10-15-2019, 11:39 AM
Shut the **** up buff. We're going to pound their brains in!

Buff
10-15-2019, 11:40 AM
Shut the **** up buff. We're going to pound their brains in!

You should have enjoyed optimistic buff while it lasted!

Canmore
10-15-2019, 11:49 AM
We got this.

Davii
10-15-2019, 12:04 PM
My biggest concern is that the blueprint that Indy and Houston established is that you run the ball and keep your offense on the field as much as possible... We've shown almost a total inability to sustain drives and keep the chains moving. Also - Deshaun Watson and Jacobie Brisset are great at improvising and squeaking out some yards when the play breaks down - Flacco, not so much.

We also haven't played a run D this bad. Five straight games they've allowed 129 or more rushing yards. We should be able to keep ahead of the chains, have 3rd and 2 instead of 3rd and 7+, and be able to pick up more conversions.

We shall see. Our OL continues to improve, we might have our starting RT back, and on a short week with the DL already banged up we might be able to really get them tired out at altitude and just grind them down.

Denver Native (Carol)
10-15-2019, 12:42 PM
LIVE: Tuesday press conference

Oct 15, 2019
Coach Fangio, OC Rich Scangarello, DC Ed Donatell, STC Tom McMahon, QB Joe Flacco, RB Phillip Lindsay and OLB Von Miller meet the media ahead of #KCvsDEN.

Fangio just talked, Scangarello is now talking
https://www.denverbroncos.com/video/tuesday-media-availability

VonDoom
10-15-2019, 01:27 PM
Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 49m
Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan"every game has it's own personality."

Troy Renck @TroyRenck 49m
#Broncos Emmanuel Sanders and Ja'Wuan James will practice today... Hopeful they play Thursday. #Denver7

Nicki Jhabvala @NickiJhabvala 48m
Fangio said he expects CB Duke Dawson to be available for Thursday's game vs. Chiefs. "I think so," Fangio said.

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 46m
"We're gonna have to be able to move the ball..score points. It's going to be hard to slow down their offense." Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 46m
"We're not shy about listening to (players) suggestions. If they make sense, we'll use it." Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan

Troy Renck @TroyRenck 45m
#Broncos Fangio acknowledges offense has to do its part this game. Denver went into a shell almost purposefully vs #Titans
given how well D was playing #Denver7

Poet
10-15-2019, 03:09 PM
I'm a little concerned about the acceptance, in almost any game, of the offense 'going into a shell." However, we ******* won, and winning feels goooooooooooooood. :D

BroncoWave
10-15-2019, 03:39 PM
I'm a little concerned about the acceptance, in almost any game, of the offense 'going into a shell." However, we ******* won, and winning feels goooooooooooooood. :D

I'd usually agree, but it was probably a pretty strategically sound call in that game. Only way we were losing that was if Tennessee's defense scored.

Denver Native (Carol)
10-15-2019, 03:39 PM
Troy Renck
‏Verified account @TroyRenck
31m31 minutes ago

#Broncos @I_CU_boy says of Thursday: "The Chiefs are a good team with a powerful offense. The fact is this: we are good, too." Denver will look to run on a KC defense that has allowed 26 runs of 10 yards or more. My #Denver7 story on #Broncos big game: http://bit.ly/2MOoJFQ

Davii
10-15-2019, 03:42 PM
I'm a little concerned about the acceptance, in almost any game, of the offense 'going into a shell." However, we ******* won, and winning feels goooooooooooooood. :D

Well, with the defense balling out the only way they were going to win is if we pushed on offense and they got short fields on O. They have a good D, and I think in this case it was a good strategy.

Poet
10-15-2019, 03:55 PM
Well, with the defense balling out the only way they were going to win is if we pushed on offense and they got short fields on O. They have a good D, and I think in this case it was a good strategy.

It just lacks the killer instinct that I think a team has to have. It is good strategy. There's just something about it that I find troublesome. I'm probably being unfair.

HORSEPOWER 56
10-15-2019, 04:20 PM
I hope we come out firing against KC who will most likely load the box to stop the run. First play should be play action and a deep shot. If it connects, they’ll be like WTF? Then we use balance to keep them from loading the box. We can run, but not into a 8 or 9 man box every time. If we try to do that we’ll go 3 and out and it will give them confidence.

We must break their will early and show them we are the more physical team. I’d also do hurry up or at least no huddle vs their defense and use our home field advantage for once!

Davii
10-15-2019, 04:54 PM
It just lacks the killer instinct that I think a team has to have. It is good strategy. There's just something about it that I find troublesome. I'm probably being unfair.

Maybe. I don't know. I prefer a smart strategy, if that's what it truly was.

Poet
10-15-2019, 05:06 PM
Maybe. I don't know. I prefer a smart strategy, if that's what it truly was.

I'm just going to assume I'm being a *****.

Hawgdriver
10-15-2019, 07:20 PM
My biggest concern is that the blueprint that Indy and Houston established is that you run the ball and keep your offense on the field as much as possible... We've shown almost a total inability to sustain drives and keep the chains moving. Also - Deshaun Watson and Jacobie Brisset are great at improvising and squeaking out some yards when the play breaks down - Flacco, not so much.

We are #6 in plays/drive so far this year...?

Hawgdriver
10-15-2019, 07:23 PM
Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 49m
Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan"every game has it's own personality."

Troy Renck @TroyRenck 49m
#Broncos Emmanuel Sanders and Ja'Wuan James will practice today... Hopeful they play Thursday. #Denver7

Nicki Jhabvala @NickiJhabvala 48m
Fangio said he expects CB Duke Dawson to be available for Thursday's game vs. Chiefs. "I think so," Fangio said.

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 46m
"We're gonna have to be able to move the ball..score points. It's going to be hard to slow down their offense." Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan

Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey 46m
"We're not shy about listening to (players) suggestions. If they make sense, we'll use it." Vic Fangio #Broncos @1043TheFan

Troy Renck @TroyRenck 45m
#Broncos Fangio acknowledges offense has to do its part this game. Denver went into a shell almost purposefully vs #Titans
given how well D was playing #Denver7

I like this guy.

Simple Jaded
10-15-2019, 09:49 PM
I'd usually agree, but it was probably a pretty strategically sound call in that game. Only way we were losing that was if Tennessee's defense scored.

Even I thought they would win no matter what when they scored their only TD of the game.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:55 AM
I'd usually agree, but it was probably a pretty strategically sound call in that game. Only way we were losing that was if Tennessee's defense scored.

The likelihood of a defense scoring against us is rather high with our current QB and the nature of how the offense disappears. Once teams stop our run game, were pretty much f'ed. It is so reminiscent of what we did in 2011, run as much as we can and hope for a couple pass plays with sub par QB.....

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 01:59 AM
Flacco and Tebow aren't even in the same galaxy. Stop. Tebow couldn't complete 66% of his passes in his wildest dreams. Flacco is what we thought he was, about the 20ish best starter in the league, but he's an actual QB1, we haven't had that since 2015.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:01 AM
Flacco and Tebow aren't even in the same galaxy. Stop.

they both were and are playing sub par during a year where we are relying on the run and our defense, its similar to 2011 whether you like it or not...

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:03 AM
they both were and are playing sub par during a year where we are relying on the run and our defense, its similar to 2011 whether you like it or not...

Ya...let me know when we complete 2 (or was it 3? lol) passes on the road.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:06 AM
Flacco and Tebow aren't even in the same galaxy. Stop. Tebow couldn't complete 66% of his passes in his wildest dreams. Flacco is what we thought he was, about the 20ish best starter in the league, but he's an actual QB1, we haven't had that since 2015.

Your right one is more accurate but that's not hard when you keep checking down for 2 to 3 yds on 3rd and7, 3rd and 9....or when you hold the ball and take a sack to take us out of field goal range....cant get a incomplete if you hold the ball there....

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:12 AM
Your right one is more accurate but that's not hard when you keep checking down for 2 to 3 yds on 3rd and7, 3rd and 9....

Id argue play calling is more to blame there.....or Freeman running routes 1/2 yard short of the sticks last game.

Nobody, and I do mean NOBODY, thinks Flacco is all world or the long term answer, but the guy hasn't been horrible. If anything, you should be jumping all over his 4 fumbles already, that is honestly my main anger towards him at the moment. Those aside, he's on pace for a decent year, despite shit tackle play and an offense with a rookie HC, rookie OC, who has, by their own coaches admission, "went into a shell" to conserve the lead last game. He's an average QB, he just is. I'm not entirely sure what he did to you personally, but come on man. Also, Tebow couldn't spell check down.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:14 AM
Ya...let me know when we complete 2 (or was it 3? lol) passes on the road.

Because 18 passes at home is good right? Especially when half of them were check downs, lets not also forget he managed a whopping 14 passes completed on the road at SD the week before.....I guess 1400 yds, 6 Td's and 5 int's is what we should expect from a SB winning in his prime through 6 games.....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:15 AM
Id argue play calling is more to blame there.....or Freeman running routes 1/2 yard short of the sticks last game.

Nobody, and I do mean NOBODY, thinks Flacco is all world or the long term answer, but the guy hasn't been horrible. If anything, you should be jumping all over his 4 fumbles already, that is honestly my main anger towards him at the moment. Those aside, he's on pace for a decent year, despite shit tackle play and an offense with a rookie HC, rookie OC, who has, by their own coaches admission, "went into a shell" to conserve the lead last game. He's an average QB, he just is. I'm not entirely sure what he did to you personally, but come on man. Also, Tebow couldn't spell check down.

I'm am irritated at his 4 fumbles and his 5 in'ts and his stupid sacks taking us out of field goal range, he also hasn't show great accuracy or decision making consistently...in fact I see the same avg Qb play he has been showing for about 5-6 years, he is doing exactly what I said he would do all summer.

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:16 AM
Because 18 passes at home is good right? Especially when half of them were check downs, lets not also forget he managed a whopping 14 passes completed on the road at SD the week before.....I guess 1400 yds, 6 Td's and 5 int's is what we should expect from a SB winning in his prime through 6 games.....

I can't blame him for the Fant Int....He's quietly on pace to have his best year since 2014. For the love of all that is good and holy don't mistake me as a fan of the guy, I'm simply calling it for what it is. He's mid/lower mid/tier QB1. We knew this.

Again, the fumbles are the worst part, but you haven't even mentioned them. He's not the solution, but he's also not the problem. He's a placeholder, and the best one we've had in years. It could be much, much worse. We've friggin seen it. *shrugs*

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:21 AM
I'm am irritated at his 4 fumbles and his 5 in'ts and his stupid sacks taking us out of field goal range, he also hasn't show great accuracy or decision making consistently...in fact I see the same avg Qb play he has been showing for about 5-6 years, he is doing exactly what I said he would do all summer.

I'd rather take the sack than throw the pick. I'm pretty sure he's not the one calling 5-7 step drops when our tackles are horrible. Just saying. I agree on average QB play, I think that's all we are hoping for. If things go south don't get me wrong I want to see Lock. That said I think Flacco will improve as Scags gets more experience.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:22 AM
Id argue play calling is more to blame there.....or Freeman running routes 1/2 yard short of the sticks last game.

Nobody, and I do mean NOBODY, thinks Flacco is all world or the long term answer, but the guy hasn't been horrible. If anything, you should be jumping all over his 4 fumbles already, that is honestly my main anger towards him at the moment. Those aside, he's on pace for a decent year, despite shit tackle play and an offense with a rookie HC, rookie OC, who has, by their own coaches admission, "went into a shell" to conserve the lead last game. He's an average QB, he just is. I'm not entirely sure what he did to you personally, but come on man. Also, Tebow couldn't spell check down.

Every Denver fan should hate Joe Flacco. He comes here and is sold as a SB winning QB in his prime and exactly what we need, but he hasn't changed shit for the offense, its just as bad, if not worse...he keeps making dumb mistakes a 12 year vet shouldn't make.....There is a reason Baltimore was ready to move on and were now paying the price. The saving grace is we did attempt to address the position correctly this year by going with Lock in the draft. I get the vet move but he was the wrong call.....it should be clear to any football fan...

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:25 AM
I can't blame him for the Fant Int....He's quietly on pace to have his best year since 2014. For the love of all that is good and holy don't mistake me as a fan of the guy, I'm simply calling it for what it is. He's mid/lower mid/tier QB1. We knew this.

Again, the fumbles are the worst part, but you haven't even mentioned them. He's not the solution, but he's also not the problem. He's a placeholder, and the best one we've had in years. It could be much, much worse. We've friggin seen it. *shrugs*

I mention the fumbles in the post before this. He is not playing like a QB 1 at all....and if 1400 yds, 6td's and 5 int's has him on pace for his best year since 2014 that just reinforces we never should have gone after him to begin with. I don't mistake you as a fan boi of flacco, but I refuse to listen to anyone saying he aint a problem when he clearly is. They also both have blame for that play....he threw a soft deep ball, it wasn't a very good pass....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:27 AM
I'd rather take the sack than throw the pick. I'm pretty sure he's not the one calling 5-7 step drops when our tackles are horrible. Just saying. I agree on average QB play, I think that's all we are hoping for. If things go south don't get me wrong I want to see Lock. That said I think Flacco will improve as Scags gets more experience.

or how bout he does the smart vet thing and throws the ball away...so we can kick a field goal.....Manning would have had that ball in the dirt by the back so fast the 3 points would be a lock....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:27 AM
I'd rather take the sack than throw the pick. I'm pretty sure he's not the one calling 5-7 step drops when our tackles are horrible. Just saying. I agree on average QB play, I think that's all we are hoping for. If things go south don't get me wrong I want to see Lock. That said I think Flacco will improve as Scags gets more experience.

Flacco is maxed out, we need to get Scags his Garappolo.....hopefully that's lock, time will tell....

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:28 AM
Every Denver fan should hate Joe Flacco. He comes here and is sold as a SB winning QB in his prime and exactly what we need, but he hasn't changed shit for the offense, its just as bad, if not worse...he keeps making dumb mistakes a 12 year vet shouldn't make.....There is a reason Baltimore was ready to move on and were now paying the price. The saving grace is we did attempt to address the position correctly this year by going with Lock in the draft. I get the vet move but he was the wrong call.....it should be clear to any football fan...

"Any" football fan would also admit that Lock wasn't, and isn't ready, and I was stoked when we drafted him. Flacco isn't exactly costing us games, yet. I don't think anybody really bought the SB winner in his "prime" line, did they? It's pretty clear the guy could throw 12312145531233 TD's and you'd still not piss on him to put him out if he was on fire, and that's all well and good, I'm not Flacco champion. I'm simply saying he's what I expected, and actual, albeit lower tier, QB1. *shrugs*

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:31 AM
Flacco is maxed out, we need to get Scags his Garappolo.....hopefully that's lock, time will tell....

100% agree

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:31 AM
"Any" football fan would also admit that Lock wasn't, and isn't ready, and I was stoked when we drafted him. Flacco isn't exactly costing us games, yet. I don't think anybody really bought the SB winner in his "prime" line, did they? It's pretty clear the guy could throw 12312145531233 TD's and you'd still not piss on him to put him out if he was on fire, and that's all well and good, I'm not Flacco champion. I'm simply saying he's what I expected. Maybe I was wrong?

If he can throw over 200 yds, maybe get 2 Td's and not turn the ball over I would be happy cause that's avg...were getting below avg right now........maybe complete more then 14 and 18 passes as well in which they aren't 3 yd check downs....hell maybe not let the offense disappear for 3 quarters or better yet make money where it counts on 3rd down and in the redzone......

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:33 AM
or how bout he does the smart vet thing and throws the ball away...so we can kick a field goal.....Manning would have had that ball in the dirt by the back so fast the 3 points would be a lock....

Well...other than 2015, sure. Pey-Pey threw 17 picks in 10 games that year.

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:34 AM
Well...other than 2015, sure. Pey-Pey threw 17 picks in 10 games that year.

and I was pissed at him royally....I was happy when we went with OZ we needed a change, and were headed that way again with below avg vet qb play

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:35 AM
If he can throw over 200 yds, maybe get 2 Td's and not turn the ball over I would be happy cause that's avg...were getting below avg right now........maybe complete more then 14 and 18 passes as well in which they aren't 3 yd check downs....hell maybe not let the offense disappear for 3 quarters or better yet make money where it counts on 3rd down and in the redzone......

Again, agree, but I think it's a lot on Scags. Flacco doesn't call the plays. When its doomed from the start you can't pin it all on the QB. He is better than Trev, Brock (that hurts) and Keenum. *double shrugs*

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:38 AM
Again, agree, but I think it's a lot on Scags. Flacco doesn't call the plays. When its doomed from the start you can't pin it all on the QB. He is better than Trev, Brock (that hurts) and Keenum. *double shrugs*

2015 Brock I don't think so, most recent verison of Brock yes....Brock ruined his career playing for O'Brien in Houston.....Flacco's statistics don't back that up all the way with trev and case either....Is he a more talented QB? Sure i can see why some say that....Is he using that talent effectively to prove that? No i don't think he is.

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:40 AM
I guess this is all pointless, since we are going to run the ball 70 times down the chorfs throat. Flacco will be 3/6 for 60 yards and a TD....and MO will get a Jano jersey. :D

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 02:42 AM
I guess this is all pointless, since we are going to run the ball 70 times down the chorfs throat. Flacco will be 3/6 for 60 yards and a TD....and MO will get a Jano jersey. :D

your right and the TD by Flacco will be on a check down for 3yds to JANO.....:lol:

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:44 AM
Brock I don't think so, most recent verison of Brock yes....Brock ruined his career playing for O'Brien in Houston.....Flacco's statistics don't back that up all the way with trev and case either....Is he a more talented QB? Sure i can see why some say that....Is he using that talent effectively to prove that? No i don't think he is.].

Ahhh, what could have been. The fact that the Texans ended up with Watson and we get stuck in QB purgatory is a cruel joke.

Timmy!
10-16-2019, 02:45 AM
your right and the TD by Flacco will be on a check down for 3yds to JANO.....:lol:

All day.

Hawgdriver
10-16-2019, 06:50 AM
I'm not entirely sure what he did to you personally, but come on man.

Last five Elev posts: [I hate Flacco. Offense sucks.]

Hey, dude can stay on message and on-brand like no other! Like Joel and the run game.

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 07:04 AM
Sorry Inc, I had to stop taking your posts on Flacco seriously when you started comparing him to Tebow. That's easily the dumbest thing you have said about Flacco. It's pretty clear that your hate for him is clouding any sort of objective judgement on his play.

Also, stop it with this stupid strawmam "Where is this super bowl MVP in his prime we were promised" argument. Literally no one has claimed that's what we were getting/that's what he was expected to be.

Nomad
10-16-2019, 07:10 AM
I’ve noticed my boy, Jano, has been mentioned a lot. I like seeing him get all this love.

Nomad
10-16-2019, 07:12 AM
Inc’s dislike for Flacco reminds me of when I disliked Cutler.

Nomad
10-16-2019, 07:17 AM
I wonder if this is the week Mahommie attempts his behind the back pass?

Davii
10-16-2019, 07:32 AM
I wonder if this is the week Mahommie attempts his behind the back pass?

Hopefully he attempts his "flat on his back just got crushed by Von Miller" dance.

slim
10-16-2019, 08:23 AM
Sorry Inc, I had to stop taking your posts on Flacco seriously when you started comparing him to Tebow. That's easily the dumbest thing you have said about Flacco. It's pretty clear that your hate for him is clouding any sort of objective judgement on his play.

Also, stop it with this stupid strawmam "Where is this super bowl MVP in his prime we were promised" argument. Literally no one has claimed that's what we were getting/that's what he was expected to be.

Good point. Tebow is twice the QB Flacco will ever be!!!

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:38 PM
Sorry Inc, I had to stop taking your posts on Flacco seriously when you started comparing him to Tebow. That's easily the dumbest thing you have said about Flacco. It's pretty clear that your hate for him is clouding any sort of objective judgement on his play.

Also, stop it with this stupid strawmam "Where is this super bowl MVP in his prime we were promised" argument. Literally no one has claimed that's what we were getting/that's what he was expected to be.

Yeah but that doesn’t bother me because I really alluded to the fact the lame ass offense we had in 2011 without the ability to make throws in the passing game is currently where we stand yet again....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:39 PM
Inc’s dislike for Flacco reminds me of when I disliked Cutler.

Cutler was a avg QB as well so your dislike is warranted...

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:42 PM
Sorry Inc, I had to stop taking your posts on Flacco seriously when you started comparing him to Tebow. That's easily the dumbest thing you have said about Flacco. It's pretty clear that your hate for him is clouding any sort of objective judgement on his play.

Also, stop it with this stupid strawmam "Where is this super bowl MVP in his prime we were promised" argument. Literally no one has claimed that's what we were getting/that's what he was expected to be.

You must have missed all those comments this summer from posters then about he is a solid QB 1 with a good arm, throws a deep ball will be a big upgrade....etc...I didn’t in fact I’m pretty much said he would be exactly what he has been through 6 games....subpar.....it sucks watching such crap QB play year in and year out...I just refuse to put on some blinders to how sub par he truly is....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:44 PM
Last five Elev posts: [I hate Flacco. Offense sucks.]

Hey, dude can stay on message and on-brand like no other! Like Joel and the run game.


Your wrong my last post before this was that Flacco would throw a TD to Jano on a 3 yd checkdown...lol

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:46 PM
The likelihood of a defense scoring against us is rather high with our current QB and the nature of how the offense disappears. Once teams stop our run game, were pretty much f'ed. It is so reminiscent of what we did in 2011, run as much as we can and hope for a couple pass plays with sub par QB.....

For those that can’t read I didn’t actually compare Tebow and Flacco simply alluded to similarities between offensive performance. The good news is we are winning with 16 and 20 points instead of 10 and 13.....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:48 PM
Last five Elev posts: [I hate Flacco. Offense sucks.]

Hey, dude can stay on message and on-brand like no other! Like Joel and the run game.

Nothing incorrect with what I posted either FYI....

VonDoom
10-16-2019, 01:56 PM
https://twitter.com/aricdilalla/status/1184539601505083393?s=21

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 01:58 PM
https://twitter.com/aricdilalla/status/1184539601505083393?s=21

We need that, if James can go well and be effective that might be another good boost for the run game...

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 02:03 PM
KC is so banged up. We could not have possibly caught them at a better time.

SR
10-16-2019, 02:05 PM
You must have missed all those comments this summer from posters then about he is a solid QB 1 with a good arm, throws a deep ball will be a big upgrade....etc...I didn’t in fact I’m pretty much said he would be exactly what he has been through 6 games....subpar.....it sucks watching such crap QB play year in and year out...I just refuse to put on some blinders to how sub par he truly is....

I don't think Flacco has been sub-par at all. I think he's been pretty good. He's had a few bad throws and his stats don't jump off the page, but the team hasn't lost because of Flacco. He's been good. He does have a great arm. He throws a great deep ball. He's smart, doesn't take a lot of bad sacks, doesn't turn the ball over, and doesn't make a ton of bad throws. He's the best QB not named Manning that this team has had since Jake Plummer...like it or not.

Buff
10-16-2019, 02:26 PM
Flacco is Alex Smith 2.0, but with less mobility and a better deep ball.

He's going to manage the game. He's going to limit your downside... And he has a really capped upside and has almost zero improvisation skills when the play breaks down.

He's simultaneously the least of our problems and a mild concern.

VonDoom
10-16-2019, 02:41 PM
I don't think Flacco has been sub-par at all. I think he's been pretty good. He's had a few bad throws and his stats don't jump off the page, but the team hasn't lost because of Flacco. He's been good. He does have a great arm. He throws a great deep ball. He's smart, doesn't take a lot of bad sacks, doesn't turn the ball over, and doesn't make a ton of bad throws. He's the best QB not named Manning that this team has had since Jake Plummer...like it or not.

I think your assessment of Flacco is based on his reputation and/or the guy he was five or six years ago. I always hear that he’s a great deep ball thrower, but that’s not really his game anymore. Just watching the games this year should show you this. His ANY/A is 5.76, good for 22nd out of 34 qualifying QB’s. As for the other things you mention here, his interception rate is 23rd out of 33 and his sack percentage is 21st out of 34. In other words, he is who we thought he was – below average.

Again, my issue isn’t really Flacco, per se. It’s the idea that we think we can bring in mediocre or worse veteran QB’s and pay them as if they’re quality starters. There are two realistic paths to success in the NFL nowadays – 1) get a good QB on a rookie deal and use the cap savings to bolster other areas on your team (which is hopefully what we will do with Lock – that’s why it’s imperative that he plays sooner rather than later) and 2) have a full fledged superstar, game changing QB making full QB money, and figure that you always have a chance because you have that guy. Hard to come by, of course, and with any luck, option 1 leads to option 2 eventually. Otherwise, you have to keep trying. Flacco is neither of these things (and neither was Keenum) so we’re just treading water until we move on.

Buff
10-16-2019, 03:02 PM
I think your assessment of Flacco is based on his reputation and/or the guy he was five or six years ago. I always hear that he’s a great deep ball thrower, but that’s not really his game anymore. Just watching the games this year should show you this. His ANY/A is 5.76, good for 22nd out of 34 qualifying QB’s. As for the other things you mention here, his interception rate is 23rd out of 33 and his sack percentage is 21st out of 34. In other words, he is who we thought he was – below average.

Again, my issue isn’t really Flacco, per se. It’s the idea that we think we can bring in mediocre or worse veteran QB’s and pay them as if they’re quality starters. There are two realistic paths to success in the NFL nowadays – 1) get a good QB on a rookie deal and use the cap savings to bolster other areas on your team (which is hopefully what we will do with Lock – that’s why it’s imperative that he plays sooner rather than later) and 2) have a full fledged superstar, game changing QB making full QB money, and figure that you always have a chance because you have that guy. Hard to come by, of course, and with any luck, option 1 leads to option 2 eventually. Otherwise, you have to keep trying. Flacco is neither of these things (and neither was Keenum) so we’re just treading water until we move on.

The hidden downside of Flacco is the opportunity cost. You're paying him a ton of money to be average, which prevents building depth in other areas --- and his skillset is limited at this stage, so even in the best case scenario, you're getting slightly above average QB play and hoping to hit in every other phase of the game.

So basically, what you said - just worded differently.

SR
10-16-2019, 03:11 PM
I think your assessment of Flacco is based on his reputation and/or the guy he was five or six years ago. I always hear that he’s a great deep ball thrower, but that’s not really his game anymore. Just watching the games this year should show you this. His ANY/A is 5.76, good for 22nd out of 34 qualifying QB’s. As for the other things you mention here, his interception rate is 23rd out of 33 and his sack percentage is 21st out of 34. In other words, he is who we thought he was – below average.



It's unfair to pin those stats on solely Flacco. How many of his picks were bad routes or tipped passes? Are the short throws a result of not having enough time to throw? Are the sacks due to injuries and bad offensive line play/assignment execution? It isn't just "these are the stats and it's all his doing".

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 03:26 PM
KC is so banged up. We could not have possibly caught them at a better time.

I hope we drop 220 rushing yds and 4 rushing tds on them....just downright own em, so then when our QB and Wr’s account for 14 passes it won’t matter cause we just made KC our biatch lol....

Elevation inc
10-16-2019, 03:27 PM
I think your assessment of Flacco is based on his reputation and/or the guy he was five or six years ago. I always hear that he’s a great deep ball thrower, but that’s not really his game anymore. Just watching the games this year should show you this. His ANY/A is 5.76, good for 22nd out of 34 qualifying QB’s. As for the other things you mention here, his interception rate is 23rd out of 33 and his sack percentage is 21st out of 34. In other words, he is who we thought he was – below average.

Again, my issue isn’t really Flacco, per se. It’s the idea that we think we can bring in mediocre or worse veteran QB’s and pay them as if they’re quality starters. There are two realistic paths to success in the NFL nowadays – 1) get a good QB on a rookie deal and use the cap savings to bolster other areas on your team (which is hopefully what we will do with Lock – that’s why it’s imperative that he plays sooner rather than later) and 2) have a full fledged superstar, game changing QB making full QB money, and figure that you always have a chance because you have that guy. Hard to come by, of course, and with any luck, option 1 leads to option 2 eventually. Otherwise, you have to keep trying. Flacco is neither of these things (and neither was Keenum) so we’re just treading water until we move on.


Good post and well said. Wish I had the patience to be more eloquent in my post when it comes to flacco....but I don’t.....

VonDoom
10-16-2019, 03:31 PM
It's unfair to pin those stats on solely Flacco. How many of his picks were bad routes or tipped passes? Are the short throws a result of not having enough time to throw? Are the sacks due to injuries and bad offensive line play/assignment execution? It isn't just "these are the stats and it's all his doing".

Fair point but the same can be said of any QB - are all of their interceptions and sacks solely on them? No but that’s why we have stats to standardize things like this. The longer the season goes, the better the sample size. I didn’t look up his stats in prior years but I suspect they’re similar. I know his ANY/A has been bottom third for at least four or five years though

SR
10-16-2019, 04:06 PM
Fair point but the same can be said of any QB - are all of their interceptions and sacks solely on them? No but that’s why we have stats to standardize things like this. The longer the season goes, the better the sample size. I didn’t look up his stats in prior years but I suspect they’re similar. I know his ANY/A has been bottom third for at least four or five years though

This is true, but I still respectfully disagree with any notion that Flacco has been terrible.

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 04:16 PM
We're two roughing the passer calls against the defense away from Flacco having us at 4-2. He's not a world beater, but he's not costing us games either.

SR
10-16-2019, 04:18 PM
There are also other things to consider. It's his first year in a new offense with an entirely new team (coaching staff, players, line, stadium, etc.) and those variables need to be taken in to account. You can't build the chemistry you need to build through OTAs and training camp when you play against the same players every day. He played minimal snaps in the pre-season. The offense and defense are going to continue to improve.

Buff
10-16-2019, 04:47 PM
We're two roughing the passer calls against the defense away from Flacco having us at 4-2. He's not a world beater, but he's not costing us games either.

I think this is an over-simplistic trap... He's squandered a lot of opportunities and left some points on the field in those games too - maybe they don't come down to the final possession if the offense is more effective.

But we're basically saying the same thing.

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 04:54 PM
I think this is an over-simplistic trap... He's squandered a lot of opportunities and left some points on the field in those games too - maybe they don't come down to the final possession if the offense is more effective.

But we're basically saying the same thing.

Sure, but the point is we've been in all 6 games we've played this year. Flacco has done about what we could have hoped for, do enough to keep the offense afloat while the defense shines. We're 2-0 since the defense finally woke up.

VonDoom
10-16-2019, 04:56 PM
We're two roughing the passer calls against the defense away from Flacco having us at 4-2. He's not a world beater, but he's not costing us games either.


I think this is an over-simplistic trap... He's squandered a lot of opportunities and left some points on the field in those games too - maybe they don't come down to the final possession if the offense is more effective.

But we're basically saying the same thing.

Yeah, he threw a terrible INT in the Bears game, threw the INT before the half in the Jaguars game (and then disappeared until we were behind). Don't play into that "we should be 4-2" thing Wave - this is the kind of thinking that keeps this team in nowheresville.

Buff
10-16-2019, 04:57 PM
Sure, but the point is we've been in all 6 games we've played this year. Flacco has done about what we could have hoped for, do enough to keep the offense afloat while the defense shines. We're 2-0 since the defense finally woke up.

I don't agree with that though. We are bottom third in yards/game. We're bottom third in points/game. We are bottom third in 3rd down conversions. We should hope for more.

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 04:59 PM
Yeah, he threw a terrible INT in the Bears game, threw the INT before the half in the Jaguars game (and then disappeared until we were behind). Don't play into that "we should be 4-2" thing Wave - this is the kind of thinking that keeps this team in nowheresville.

He also led us to last minute go ahead TDs in both of those games. My point is that the defense has underperformed relative to expectations more than Flacco has.

BroncoWave
10-16-2019, 05:04 PM
I don't agree with that though. We are bottom third in yards/game. We're bottom third in points/game. We are bottom third in 3rd down conversions. We should hope for more.

Sure I hope for more. I'd love to recreate the 2012 and 2013 offenses. But Peyton isn't walking through that door. It's not like there were a ton of better options than Flacco on the market this off-season. He's who we have though, and he's done about as well as expected. And until Lock can return, we don't really have a choice.

Magnificent Seven
10-16-2019, 07:44 PM
15158

I am excited for tomorrow night!

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 12:39 AM
He also led us to last minute go ahead TDs in both of those games. My point is that the defense has underperformed relative to expectations more than Flacco has.

This is a sound point for sure....I was pretty upset with many of our defensive personnel even more so then flacco. I have alluded to that in many post as well. On this point we do agree.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 12:48 AM
Sure I hope for more. I'd love to recreate the 2012 and 2013 offenses. But Peyton isn't walking through that door. It's not like there were a ton of better options than Flacco on the market this off-season. He's who we have though, and he's done about as well as expected. And until Lock can return, we don't really have a choice.

I'm not even looking for that, I want a offense that can take time off the clock, stay consistent through the game and score more then 21 points consistently, minimize turnovers and negative plays, be more efficient in the red zone and on 3rd down. that's all I ask for, with a top defense that makes damn near every game winnable if we do that and show up...its only a matter of time if our offense continues like it is before the offense vs defense LR battles pop up, the chemistry goes down hill etc.....when we play like this on offense even the best defense cant always recover after constant 3 and outs. we were 2 of14 on 3rd down last week, Flacco was a big part of that.

were getting sub par QB play much like the Bengals are getting from Dalton...its below avg. and we should want more. I understand we cant change it, but that doesn't mean I cant be vocal and irritated about how he is playing, especially since I alluded to the fact all summer of how he is a Avg QB and he has done nothing to prove otherwise this season at this point. In fact to be honest I actually, even in all my dislike of the guy expected him to be a bit better than he has so far....to me he has been subpar....

Poet
10-17-2019, 02:32 AM
Earlier in this season, when one side of the ball was playing well, the other side sucked/underperformed -depending on how you sliced it - and that ended up hurting the side of the ball that was playing decently. It sucks when you aren't playing solid football on both sides of the ball. That usually requires one side of the ball to be exceptional if you want any sustainable success. Flacco has been an average NFL starter. Average NFL starters can hit some nice throws, but will make some rough decisions, or are limited in their play. If they didn't, they'd be more than average.

I'm not a fan of Flacco as a long term solution to this team. If Lock's on this team next year/we have someone like Tua on the roster/some insane happenstance that couldn't be predicted and we have someone else, Flacco shouldn't be starting. That being said, I appreciate the feeling of having someone out on the field who isn't an embarrassment to the franchise.

Inc, I feel you in general regarding Flacco. But right now, we're okay with him.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 04:29 AM
Earlier in this season, when one side of the ball was playing well, the other side sucked/underperformed -depending on how you sliced it - and that ended up hurting the side of the ball that was playing decently. It sucks when you aren't playing solid football on both sides of the ball. That usually requires one side of the ball to be exceptional if you want any sustainable success. Flacco has been an average NFL starter. Average NFL starters can hit some nice throws, but will make some rough decisions, or are limited in their play. If they didn't, they'd be more than average.

I'm not a fan of Flacco as a long term solution to this team. If Lock's on this team next year/we have someone like Tua on the roster/some insane happenstance that couldn't be predicted and we have someone else, Flacco shouldn't be starting. That being said, I appreciate the feeling of having someone out on the field who isn't an embarrassment to the franchise.

Inc, I feel you in general regarding Flacco. But right now, we're okay with him.

In no way shape or form should we be happy with a 2-4 record, a offense with a QB that has disappeared most of every game and a overall body of work that's produced 6 Td's, 8 turnovers and 1400 some odd yards in 6 f'in games, not to mention the 9 points cost in the get points area of the field because of stupid sacks....nobody was happy when trevor, or case did that and I'm pretty damn sure people were pissed when peyton played that way in 2015.....how the flying frick is Flacco getting a pass its crazy talk....

Poet
10-17-2019, 05:19 AM
In no way shape or form should we be happy with a 2-4 record, a offense with a QB that has disappeared most of every game and a overall body of work that's produced 6 Td's, 8 turnovers and 1400 some odd yards in 6 f'in games, not to mention the 9 points cost in the get points area of the field because of stupid sacks....nobody was happy when trevor, or case did that and I'm pretty damn sure people were pissed when peyton played that way in 2015.....how the flying frick is Flacco getting a pass its crazy talk....

Who said we were talking about the record? I'm talking about the offense in general. It's a passable, if not spectacular and often frustrating offense. But so much of that isn't on Flacco.

People actually defended Trevor Siemian to the hilt. I never understood it because his talent level was clearly so low, but they did. No one's giving Flacco a pass, either. People have taken issues with some of his turnovers. There's middle ground to be had in all of this, and that's where I think most people are landing. He's meh. But his brand of 'meh' is average NFL QB play. Because some of those picks weren't on him. A lot of the duress he's under isn't on him, either.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 05:40 AM
Who said we were talking about the record? I'm talking about the offense in general. It's a passable, if not spectacular and often frustrating offense. But so much of that isn't on Flacco.

People actually defended Trevor Siemian to the hilt. I never understood it because his talent level was clearly so low, but they did. No one's giving Flacco a pass, either. People have taken issues with some of his turnovers. There's middle ground to be had in all of this, and that's where I think most people are landing. He's meh. But his brand of 'meh' is average NFL QB play. Because some of those picks weren't on him. A lot of the duress he's under isn't on him, either.


I don't care about talent level if the results are still mediocre. Trevor dealt with crappy play calling a bad OL and worse RB's, why doesn't he get a pass but flacco does when the actual results and performance on the field are the same. It makes no sense once teams stop our run game were f'ed.....

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 05:43 AM
Who said we were talking about the record? I'm talking about the offense in general. It's a passable, if not spectacular and often frustrating offense. But so much of that isn't on Flacco.

People actually defended Trevor Siemian to the hilt. I never understood it because his talent level was clearly so low, but they did. No one's giving Flacco a pass, either. People have taken issues with some of his turnovers. There's middle ground to be had in all of this, and that's where I think most people are landing. He's meh. But his brand of 'meh' is average NFL QB play. Because some of those picks weren't on him. A lot of the duress he's under isn't on him, either.

I would also really be curious if AVG QB 1 play could be constituted as 6 td's, 8 turnovers and a 2-4 record. That to me is subpar and unacceptable it was the same for case and trevor.....we wouldn't allow excuses from the OL or all the turnovers being there fault, but now we allow it for flacco? subpar Qb play is subpar Qb play...and for the most part that's what were getting, the stats and the execution of our offense back that up. You can blame the OL and playcalling but people did the same for trevor and case and it still wasn't acceptable.

Poet
10-17-2019, 05:53 AM
I would also really be curious if AVG QB 1 play could be constituted as 6 td's, 8 turnovers and a 2-4 record. That to me is subpar and unacceptable it was the same for case and trevor.....we wouldn't allow excuses from the OL or all the turnovers being there fault, but now we allow it for flacco? subpar Qb play is subpar Qb play...and for the most part that's what were getting, the stats and the execution of our offense back that up. You can blame the OL and playcalling but people did the same for trevor and case and it still wasn't acceptable.

You would have to put that QB in Flacco's situation. Also, while Flacco has accounted for eight turnovers, some of those aren't on him. If you put Case Keenum or Trevor on this offense they would have worse stats. Mostly because they are worse at quarterbacking.

There is no person on this board who was more frustrated with TS and CK than I, outside of three or four members. If we had TS or CK our run game would be worse because there'd be no reason to respect intermediate or deep passes. Even though we've not been exceptional at big passing plays teams are still respecting it as a potential. Why? Because Joe Flacco has a real NFL arm.

The difference in our positions is this - you're putting everything on JF as his fault. I'm putting what I at least deem to be his fault on him.

Also, most people aren't going to hold fumbles against a QB when it's a sack.

Poet
10-17-2019, 05:55 AM
I don't care about talent level if the results are still mediocre. Trevor dealt with crappy play calling a bad OL and worse RB's, why doesn't he get a pass but flacco does when the actual results and performance on the field are the same. It makes no sense once teams stop our run game were f'ed.....

Well, TS got a pass for an entire season.

Results aren't all on the QB. Flacco can't control the defensive misfirings with Yiadom, for instance. He can't control the fact that defense failed to protect a lead against Chicago. QB is the most important position, but it isn't the only position. Lord knows Flacco wasn't at fault for Fangio's defensive failings early on in the season.

Shazam!
10-17-2019, 05:58 AM
Everyone likes to pretend its all the QBs fault when an offense is plagued by hideous blocking, a talent void at TE, bad drops and OCs who THINK theyre the smartest guy in the room trying too hard to be a genius playcaller in a square peg round hole deal.

The OLine lost numerous starters in 2016 (Harris, Polumbus, Mathis) and took several steps backwards and some bad misses at T in Okung and Stephenson. It went from better than average to terrible.

QB always gets the lion share of the blame. But lets not pretend that its all on the QB. It isn't.

Poet
10-17-2019, 05:59 AM
Everyone likes to pretend its all the QBs fault when an offense is plagued by hideous blocking, a talent void at TE, bad drops and OCs who THINK theyre the smartest guy in the room trying too hard to be a genius playcaller in a square peg round hole deal.

QB always gets the lion share of the blame. But lets not pretend that its all on the QB. It isn't.

The problem is when we take those things, which are reasonable reasons to not kill a QB, and apply them to garbage players like CK TS.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 06:01 AM
You would have to put that QB in Flacco's situation. Also, while Flacco has accounted for eight turnovers, some of those aren't on him. If you put Case Keenum or Trevor on this offense they would have worse stats. Mostly because they are worse at quarterbacking.

There is no person on this board who was more frustrated with TS and CK than I, outside of three or four members. If we had TS or CK our run game would be worse because there'd be no reason to respect intermediate or deep passes. Even though we've not been exceptional at big passing plays teams are still respecting it as a potential. Why? Because Joe Flacco has a real NFL arm.

The difference in our positions is this - you're putting everything on JF as his fault. I'm putting what I at least deem to be his fault on him.

Also, most people aren't going to hold fumbles against a QB when it's a sack.


I have posts all over Faulting the OL, Harris, Wolfe, Gotsis, defensive and offensive play calling, bolles and his holding issues, yiadom being a tool, Jewell starting at LB, Harris at NT, WR's not being able to always separate, The TE position.....I am clearly the minority for flacco here on this board, most everyone it seems is accepting and willing to excuse subpar play for various reasons because of a supposed strong arm,QB1 talent despite that not being shown really at all except for maybe a couple minutes each game.

Poet
10-17-2019, 06:06 AM
I have posts all over Faulting the OL, Harris, Wolfe, Gotsis, defensive and offensive play calling, bolles and his holding issues, yiadom being a tool, Jewell starting at LB, Harris at NT, WR's not being able to always separate, The TE position.....I am clearly the minority for flacco here on this board, most everyone it seems is accepting and willing to excuse subpar play for various reasons because of a supposed strong arm,QB1 talent despite that not being shown really at all except for maybe a couple minutes each game.

If you have an average Qb, and you put him in this situation, you're not going to get great numbers. I'm not giving him a pass, it's not like people are raving about how he's the reason we have two wins, and arguably should have had a third. I think your dislike of him is guiding you a bit. I hated the trade for him, too. He's exceeded my expectations because I thought he would be playing much worse than he has.

Shazam!
10-17-2019, 06:09 AM
Its been proven yiu can win in the NFL with mediocre QBs if they're given a chance with talent on offense. Show me a good OLine ill show you a QB who looks like a superstar.

No TE.
Weak at WR
BAD OLine play

Its like the Broncos field 7 vs 11

And the playcalling from McCoy to Musgrave has done NOTHING to help the offense with refusal to adapt (like they did with Tebow, for example) to help the players overcome their handicaps

All a recipe for garbage QB production and a bad offense.

Poet
10-17-2019, 06:12 AM
Its been proven yiu can win in the NFL with mediocre QBs if they're given a chance with talent on offense. Show me a good OLine ill show you a QB who looks like a superstar.

No TE.
Weak at WR
BAD OLine play

Its like the Broncos field 7 vs 11

All a recipe for garbage QB production and a bad offense.

There have been several teams with strong lines that have sucked on offense because of their QB. For many years Cleveland has a strong offensive line, they're Cleveland. Tennessee has had one of the best lines in football for years, and have been very bland to bad at QB.

If the NFL was 'just literally' assemble the best line and you get great performance, people would be drafting guards and center in the top ten consistently. You're overstating your position too much.

Shazam!
10-17-2019, 07:27 AM
Its been proven yiu can win in the NFL with mediocre QBs if they're given a chance with talent on offense. Show me a good OLine ill show you a QB who looks like a superstar.

No TE.
Weak at WR
BAD OLine play

Its like the Broncos field 7 vs 11

All a recipe for garbage QB production and a bad offense.

There have been several teams with strong lines that have sucked on offense because of their QB. For many years Cleveland has a strong offensive line, they're Cleveland. Tennessee has had one of the best lines in football for years, and have been very bland to bad at QB.

If the NFL was 'just literally' assemble the best line and you get great performance, people would be drafting guards and center in the top ten consistently. You're overstating your position too much.

Its a team game King. Theres 10 other players on offense, an so much comes with talent amd coaching. Cleveland has had few of those things besides Thomas.

QB receives all the blame all the time and is put on pedestal when theyre succeeding. Much more to a successful team than that. Moving parts need to mesh together to perform at a high level consistently. So much more than just QB.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 08:11 AM
If you have an average Qb, and you put him in this situation, you're not going to get great numbers. I'm not giving him a pass, it's not like people are raving about how he's the reason we have two wins, and arguably should have had a third. I think your dislike of him is guiding you a bit. I hated the trade for him, too. He's exceeded my expectations because I thought he would be playing much worse than he has.

2 of 14 on 3rd down last week, poor red zone efficiency,those are marks of good QB play??? its not all on the Qb with this offense, i get that but come on you honestly expected that and consider it exceeding expectations?

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 08:16 AM
You can not give Flacco a pass for the OL, play calling and other facets of the offense and then ignore that when it comes to other QB's this board is notorious for that going all the way back to 2009 with Orton.....if we want to say Flacco has more talent then any Qb we have had since manning....fine I'm on board with that, but he hasn't been playing up to that talent.

Hawgdriver
10-17-2019, 08:24 AM
Inc, I feel you in general regarding Flacco. But right now, we're okay with him.

Ja, ja. Stimmt.

Poet
10-17-2019, 02:55 PM
I apologize, Elevation. I tried my best to persuade you. I yield.

Elevation inc
10-17-2019, 07:22 PM
It’s all moot remember what I Said in the game day thread 300 yds 3 td’s lol

Elevation inc
10-18-2019, 01:19 AM
so yeah, way to mess it up offense.....