John Elway’s Future in Denver?

[Colorado4Life]

I think I am going to be in violation of the Denver Broncos 11th Commandment (Special thanks to Ronald Reagan), Thou Shalt never speak ill of a Denver Bronco, but I want to know what his plans are for the franchise. How does he intend to restore the respectability of this team? I am very disappointed that Chad Kelly didn’t work out but that was not on Elway in fact, he is to be commended for giving Kelly a chance that no other franchise was willing to give him.

In terms of Vance Joseph, Elway could have fired him but also gave him another chance. We passed up on QB this past draft and apparently overpaid Keenum. Players come and go and that is part of the business but there needs to be some continuity at some level. The QB marathon is getting old and the head coaching shuffle feels like it hasn’t stopped since Shanahan. Can Hogan be the future QB that the Broncos so desperately need? The defense may not be as strong as it once was but at times it has its moments.

John Elway led this team to two super bowl victories as a player and he is a true Broncos legend and so letting him go should not be taken lightly but is his ego interfering in his judgment or the ability to be the executive who has the best short term and long term interests of the Denver Broncos in mind? At times he is brilliant. Acquiring Peyton Manning was an excellent short term fix and added two more SB appaearances and one win and he deserves credit for that. Right now it feels like we are on a ship sailing and the captain of the ship has no idea which direction we are going or who will remain on the crew. The waves and a bumpy ride are a part of this and many people while not finding this pleasant will accept it if we appear to get back on course but right now it feels as we are just drifting. No we are not at the top of the NFL anymore but neither are we at the total botttom either. John Elway is being condemned by the incredibly high expectations that he instilled in Denver both as a player and an executive. Nobody can truly expect perfection but we want to know that even if the ship gets lost for a while we will get back on course. :elefant::defense:

[Northman]

Meh, John has bought himself enough currency with 2 SB appearances and a championship. If the team continues to plummet for the next 3 years than i can see a change being made but he does have a grace period to get it right. IMO

[BroncoJoe]

OK, everyone! Let's all overreact and jump off a cliff! We're doomed! Forever!

[Colorado4Life]

Northman, I grew up with him as a player. What is the plan? I don’t want him to fail I want him to succeed. I live in Indianapolis and remember the Suck For Luck slogans. What will or can he do to fix the franchise? If we don’t have a QB option in the draft do we stick with Keenum go to Hogan or what? It’s the uncertainty that is terrible. I hope Keenum will pull it together like last week for the remainder of the season but that is yet to be seen for now.

[wayninja]

John is going to restore integrity by drawing a line in the sand that is arbitrarily adhered to! Conduct MATTERS (unless you are like, really good, or we have depth issues). The punishment WILL fit the crime (if enforced)! And a statement will be made that the Broncos reputation WILL NOT be sullied (probably... anymore... hopefully).

Also, Kelly was a longshot. Hogan is like a powerball hopeful.

[Colorado4Life]

OK, everyone! Let's all overreact and jump off a cliff! We're doomed! Forever!

Joe my friend, you should know me better then that, this is not a chicken little moment but rather a true inquiry. Where do we go from here? I don’t want this to be a franchise that says those are my players, I must see where they go because I am their leader. I want a disciplined franchise. Making mistakes in the draft can happen to any franchise. I don’t want to replace the legend I want him to come up with a plan that will get us going in the right direction again. I hate mid season firings but if Elway knows he is going to Fire Vance Joseph maybe he needs to do it sooner then later. Sutton is going to be a Star and as many have said I think that Chubb made sense during the last draft. We need QB play that can keep us in the close games. I hope Keenum finds it in himself to reproduce last season somehow for the remainder of the year. Because it isn’t over yet and maybe this will be a catalyst that helps change the entire franchise like the 45-10 victory over hapless Arizona.

[BroncoWave]

I give him one more young QB before I start going that far. If we draft another guy and he's a bust that sets us back a few more years, then you start strongly considering looking at his job.

[The Glue Factory]

To be honest, whatever plan John has in mind is Broncos intellectual property and you have as much chance of learning what that is as a snowball in hell. The only thing us fans can do is deal with what IS. What will be will be revealed when it happens and all that is left to us fans is speculation and discussion.

[Poet]

He's going to get his Herbert so it's okay!

[Colorado4Life]

The Glue Factory, I concur but at some point we need to be persuaded that we are back on course. Fans need to return to the stadium to support the franchise even as it struggles. We want to see the sunny side even if it takes a while to get there.

[The Glue Factory]

The Glue Factory, I concur but at some point we need to be persuaded that we are back on course. Fans need to return to the stadium to support the franchise even as it struggles. We want to see the sunny side even if it takes a while to get there.

So what you really want is some kind of statement from Elway that things aren't as bad as they seem.

[wayninja]

He's going to get his Herbert so it's okay!

Suck for the Duck!

[Nomad]

Suck for the Duck!

Cougs made the Ducks suck. Is that close enough?

[Shazam!]

All i know is almost 10 years ago the Broncos were in their current state when they brought Elway in. Team is starting to become a joke again.

Minus PFM his record is below .500 right now.

[BroncoJoe]

All i know is almost 10 years ago the Broncos were in their current state when they brought Elway in. Team is starting to become a joke again.

Minus PFM his record is below .500 right now.

Same is true minus Elway.

[Poet]

He's a better drafter than he gets credit for, IMO.

I believe JFE learns lessons; he knows what it be like.

[Colorado4Life]

So what you really want is some kind of statement from Elway that things aren't as bad as they seem.

I don’t think things are totally bad to be honest. I just want to know that the man at the helm still has a contingency plan when things don’t work out. No Kool Aid needed for this Homer just donuts, but things don’t work out fine, move on. At times he does and at times he doesn’t and it’s the uncertainty and indecisiveness that concern me. I was disappointed when Tebow was sent to New England because he was passionate and fun to watch while Manning was methodical and fun to watch not for his physical athleticism but his tactical genius. Elway made that happen and we won another Super Bowl as a direct result of Elway brining in Manning. I am also fascinated by the chaos that will unravel with what appears to be the Brittany vs Beth ownership struggle. I hope it’s decided as soon as possible and so we can regain stability. I apologize but I am focused on the next several moves, as chess is a passion and so when things don’t work out you have a backup plan. My final thing is I want Elway to be more levelheaded. For all practical purposes, passion is for players and coaches, should be more analytical so that unfortunate incidents like the releasing of Chad Kelly are seen as a business decision exclusively, albeit a disappointing one, and not an emotional one with hurt feelings etc...

[Tned]

OK, everyone! Let's all overreact and jump off a cliff! We're doomed! Forever!

Well, if the Broncos have another losing season, the first back to back losing seasons in what 40 years, well, then, I think people should chill out and realize it's the first time in over four decades the Broncos have had back to back losing seasons.

Insert "Broncos fans are spoiled" statement wherever you see fit.

[Tned]

I give him one more young QB before I start going that far. If we draft another guy and he's a bust that sets us back a few more years, then you start strongly considering looking at his job.

Considering Cutler is by far the best QB the Broncos have drafted, Brian Griese, Siemian and Maddox probably rounding out the top four, I think it's fair to say, we should cut Elway a little slack as it's clearly something in the Denver water that impacts QB draft decisions.

[spikerman]

Insert "Broncos fans are spoiled" statement wherever you see fit.

You might want to rephrase. I sense anatomically impossible suggestions ahead.

[Hawgdriver]

Considering Cutler is by far the best QB the Broncos have drafted, Brian Griese, Siemian and Maddox probably rounding out the top four, I think it's fair to say, we should cut Elway a little slack as it's clearly something in the Denver water that impacts QB draft decisions.

What's the number of franchise QBs, all-time? 50? 80? Let's say since '78. Some teams haven't had one that whole time...although it can be tough to tell when it's a good QB lost in a bad team/coaching situation.

My point is that if you say there have been about 64 legit QBs in 40 years x 32 teams (again, for easy math) with a franchise period of 10 years, that's what...

*Mathing* 1280 team years / 640 QB years...

50% coverage. Meaning half the time your team has a guy. That kinda squares with the state of the NFL right now, about 50% or so with a guy you'd call franchise (he'd get you to the big game and not stink up the joint).

They don't grow on trees! And I'm not sure there have been 64 of them...most need a HOF type coach to pair with them.

This whole exercise has me wishing we'd taken a flyer on a QB last draft, you gotta put your chips in if you wanna win.

[Poet]

What's the number of franchise QBs, all-time?

This whole exercise has me wishing we'd taken a flyer on a QB last draft, you gotta put your chips in if you wanna win.

Two thoughts: Firstly, it sort of depends because some analysts thought and think guys like Flacco and Ryan (both divisive in their own rights) are franchise guys; Secondly, it didn't feel that way when Chubb was going off, but today it does. I suspect we will hem and haw back and forth about it.

[Poet]

To be fair to Elway, he fails quickly. If something doesn't work, and it's pretty obvious, he will mostly move on. I say this in general.

It will be an interesting offseason.

[Hawgdriver]

Two thoughts: Firstly, it sort of depends because some analysts thought and think guys like Flacco and Ryan (both divisive in their own rights) are franchise guys; Secondly, it didn't feel that way when Chubb was going off, but today it does. I suspect we will hem and haw back and forth about it.

Yeah, 'franchise' is vague. Kinda works though.

[Poet]

Yeah, 'franchise' is vague. Kinda works though.

I think for your point maybe HoF worthy or in that discussion is closer to what you want. Flacco cannot make the HoF and Ryan's a longshot too. But guys like Rivers (borderline guy although a ring gets him in most likely) and the like are definitely of what I thought about when I read your post.

[Simple Jaded]

Elway should get the same grace period of anyone that’s GM’ed an All-time great defense, an All-time great offense and a SB loss and win.

On the other hand, Elway should also get the same criticism of any other GM that cant draft to save his ass.

This is a guy that fired a HC after a SB appearance and three straight division titles (iirc), he’s been through 3 HC’s in 9 seasons, his team is in disarray for the 3 straight season ... what do you think Elway would do if he was the boss of someone in the same position as he’s in? He’d fire him.

[Poet]

If you're referring to Fox, that guy was also looking for a way out, too. Kubiak stepped down because of health reasons, and I think he would have been kept by Elway if not for that.

VJ is the glaring problem on the "who is your coach resume."

[Simple Jaded]

Every GM has excuses.

[Poet]

Every GM has excuses.

My coach has a bad ticker and "this guy wants to leave because I want him to coach differently (Fox)" isn't much of an excuse. Also, the 9-7 team wasn't in disarray, but it was headed that way.

Look, VJ and the inability to get a QB are the failings we can put on Elway. He's put a lot of ammo in the latter, and VJ is a failure.

The drafts are more of a mixed bad than what a lot of people want to admit.

[Simple Jaded]

My coach has a bad ticker and "this guy wants to leave because I want him to coach differently (Fox)" isn't much of an excuse. Also, the 9-7 team wasn't in disarray, but it was headed that way.

Look, VJ and the inability to get a QB are the failings we can put on Elway. He's put a lot of ammo in the latter, and VJ is a failure.

The drafts are more of a mixed bad than what a lot of people want to admit.

Yeah, a mixed bag of shit and dog vomit.

[Poet]

Yeah, a mixed bag of shit and dog vomit.

One of the best ILBs and DE's in teh game left in FA. Both play at a pro bowl level consistently. Neither have made it because the PB voting and selection process is stupid. Elway drafted them.

Shane Ray has been hurt but he's a good player when he's on the field. He's not going to PB's either but he's going to easily secure a decent contract in FA.

These are just some examples of guys who have panned out but aren't exactly getting Elway a lot of praise for one reason or another. Is he great at drafting? No. When the SB team was put together and the championship was won I was shouted down for not believing Elway was the best GM in the game next to Baltimore's. A lot of people told me I was wrong, but that extreme view was in error. A few years later and now another extreme view is popular, and it is wrong as well.

[MOtorboat]

I don’t think Elway is going anywhere. But that doesn’t mean he doesn’t deserve criticism. He’s had some really bad drafts, specifically 2015 and 2017, and 2016 wasn’t very good either. They seem to have bucked that trend with the 2018 draft, but that’s the crux of the organizational problems right now.

2017: One starter (Bolles), one rotational player (Walker).
2016: Two starters (Simmons and Janovich) and three rotational players (McGovern, Booker, Parks).
2015: One starter (Heuerman) and two rotational player (Ray, Garcia).
2014: Two starters (Roby, Paradis).

And the problem is, outside of Simmons, Paradis, and maybe Janovich, there isn’t a single player on that list that people don’t question why he’s playing (and some question Paradis). So, even the guys who have stuck in those four drafts have been questioned as replacement level players.

[Cugel]

OK, everyone! Let's all overreact and jump off a cliff! We're doomed! Forever!

Well, not doomed forever, but certainly for this season and next.

Elway is firing Vance Joseph, possibly during the season. The new head coach will fire all VJ's assistants and hire his own.

Most of the veterans on the team will be cut or traded. A bunch of them are FAs next season and Elway has not offered them new contracts.

And due to his horrible drafting the last 5 years - except this last draft, he has virtually NO talent behind them to bring on.

Look at the probable players who may go bye-bye in 2019:

Bradley Roby – UFA in 2019.

Darian Stewart – $2.8 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $3.6 million in cap savings.

Tramaine Brock – UFA in 2019.

Demaryius Thomas – $3.5 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $14 million in cap savings.

Emmanuel Sanders – $2.68 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $12.9 million in cap savings.

Jared Veldheer – UFA in 2019.

Max Garcia – UFA in 2019.

Billy Turner – UFA in 2019.

Menelik Watson – A team option in 2019. $1.3 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $6.1 million in cap savings.

Ronald Leary – $1.75 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $7.6 million in cap savings.

Derek Wolfe – $2.37 million in dead money if he’s cut vs $8.5 million in cap savings.

Domata Peko – UFA in 2019.

Shelby Harris – Some disparity in reports. Either he’s an RFA or a UFA in 2019.

Zach Kerr – UFA in 2019.

Brandon Marshall – $4 million in dead money vs $5 million in cap savings.

Todd Davis – $2 million in dead money vs $3 million in cap savings.

And this says nothing about the QB position where dumping Case Keenum would cost them $10m but keeping him would cost them $21m.

I can't see them keeping him, but bringing in another veteran won't be cheap either.

[Cugel]

I don’t think Elway is going anywhere. But that doesn’t mean he doesn’t deserve criticism. He’s had some really bad drafts, specifically 2015 and 2017, and 2016 wasn’t very good either. They seem to have bucked that trend with the 2018 draft, but that’s the crux of the organizational problems right now.

2017: One starter (Bolles), one rotational player (Walker).
2016: Two starters (Simmons and Janovich) and three rotational players (McGovern, Booker, Parks).
2015: One starter (Heuerman) and two rotational player (Ray, Garcia).
2014: Two starters (Roby, Paradis).

And the problem is, outside of Simmons, Paradis, and maybe Janovich, there isn’t a single player on that list that people don’t question why he’s playing (and some question Paradis). So, even the guys who have stuck in those four drafts have been questioned as replacement level players.

It's worse than you are making out.

Paradis is an UFA next season and Elway refused to extend him, so he will get a huge offer from some other team. The entire rest of the OL will need replacing.

Bolles is a bust. (Not that they were draft picks, but Leary is injured and a busted FA signing, Veldheer is injured like always and is an UFA so he's not back. They signed those guys because their OL draft picks (Sambrailo and Schofield were busts).

Heurmann and Garcia are replacement level players and both are UFAs.

Roby is a UFA.

Etc. Most of the few players who stuck around this long won't be here next year so those drafts were a complete waste.

[MOtorboat]

It's worse than you are making out.

Paradis is an UFA next season and Elway refused to extend him, so he will get a huge offer from some other team. The entire rest of the OL will need replacing.

Bolles is a bust. (Not that they were draft picks, but Leary is injured and a busted FA signing, Veldheer is injured like always and is an UFA so he's not back. They signed those guys because their OL draft picks (Sambrailo and Schofield were busts).

Heurmann and Garcia are replacement level players and both are UFAs.

Roby is a UFA.

Etc. Most of the few players who stuck around this long won't be here next year so those drafts were a complete waste.

I’m not going to criticize Elway because of the nature of fairly set contract structures. There’s nothing he can do about players hitting free agency at the end of a rookie contract, especially if we’re complaining that they’re replacement level.

[The Glue Factory]

I don’t think things are totally bad to be honest. I just want to know that the man at the helm still has a contingency plan when things don’t work out. No Kool Aid needed for this Homer just donuts, but things don’t work out fine, move on. At times he does and at times he doesn’t and it’s the uncertainty and indecisiveness that concern me. I was disappointed when Tebow was sent to New England because he was passionate and fun to watch while Manning was methodical and fun to watch not for his physical athleticism but his tactical genius. Elway made that happen and we won another Super Bowl as a direct result of Elway brining in Manning. I am also fascinated by the chaos that will unravel with what appears to be the Brittany vs Beth ownership struggle. I hope it’s decided as soon as possible and so we can regain stability. I apologize but I am focused on the next several moves, as chess is a passion and so when things don’t work out you have a backup plan. My final thing is I want Elway to be more levelheaded. For all practical purposes, passion is for players and coaches, should be more analytical so that unfortunate incidents like the releasing of Chad Kelly are seen as a business decision exclusively, albeit a disappointing one, and not an emotional one with hurt feelings etc...

Whether Elway has a contingency plan or not isn't for us to know (goes back to intellectual property of the Broncos.) All we can do is suffer through the uncertainty of plans being implemented. We will be the last ones to know.

[Buff]

It's worse than you are making out.

Paradis is an UFA next season and Elway refused to extend him, so he will get a huge offer from some other team. The entire rest of the OL will need replacing.

Bolles is a bust. (Not that they were draft picks, but Leary is injured and a busted FA signing, Veldheer is injured like always and is an UFA so he's not back. They signed those guys because their OL draft picks (Sambrailo and Schofield were busts).

Heurmann and Garcia are replacement level players and both are UFAs.

Roby is a UFA.

Etc. Most of the few players who stuck around this long won't be here next year so those drafts were a complete waste.

If Matt Paradis gets a huge offer from anyone, I will eat MO's matching pajama top and bottom.

[MOtorboat]

If Matt Paradis gets a huge offer from anyone, I will eat MO's matching pajama top and bottom.

They don’t match.

[BeefStew25]

They don’t match.

Do the bottoms have a hole in the ass for outhouse visits

[Hawgdriver]

Do the bottoms have a hole in the ass for outhouse visits

Don't call Dave an outhouse.

[MOtorboat]

Do the bottoms have a hole in the ass for outhouse visits

I keep my rifle in the outhouse in case of Injuns, too.

[ShaneFalco]

Cut john elway

[BroncoWave]

How's it going, Shane?

[ShaneFalco]

#DeserveKeesum

[Poet]

Cut john elway

At least you don't want him burned, shot, or drowned!

[Tned]

Elway should get the same grace period of anyone that’s GM’ed an All-time great defense, an All-time great offense and a SB loss and win.

On the other hand, Elway should also get the same criticism of any other GM that cant draft to save his ass.

This is a guy that fired a HC after a SB appearance and three straight division titles (iirc), he’s been through 3 HC’s in 9 seasons, his team is in disarray for the 3 straight season ... what do you think Elway would do if he was the boss of someone in the same position as he’s in? He’d fire him.

I believe it was four straight division titles with Fox.

[Tned]

Cut john elway

You'll always have Chad's kneel down to end the half...

[Colorado4Life]

Whether Elway has a contingency plan or not isn't for us to know (goes back to intellectual property of the Broncos.) All we can do is suffer through the uncertainty of plans being implemented. We will be the last ones to know.

I wish more information was forthcoming like from companies in which I own stock but unfortunately the amount of money it would take to buy an interest in the Broncos is astronomically above my means and so you are correct, I am forced to sit and wait. However, as someone who spends money on Broncos tickets and merchandise and who has been a Broncos fan for over 30 years now you cannot fault me for desiring to know that the team we all love and support has a strategy to get out of the quicksand we find ourselves in for the time bein even if my poverty prohibits me from deserving to know. Hopefully the Broncos culture of excellence is restored as soon as possible either way. The franchise feels like it is being torn apart, I hope you can be the glue that holds us together. :elefant:

[The Glue Factory]

I wish more information was forthcoming like from companies in which I own stock but unfortunately the amount of money it would take to buy an interest in the Broncos is astronomically above my means and so you are correct, I am forced to sit and wait. However, as someone who spends money on Broncos tickets and merchandise and who has been a Broncos fan for over 30 years now you cannot fault me for desiring to know that the team we all love and support has a strategy to get out of the quicksand we find ourselves in for the time bein even if my poverty prohibits me from deserving to know. Hopefully the Broncos culture of excellence is restored as soon as possible either way. The franchise feels like it is being torn apart, I hope you can be the glue that holds us together. :elefant:

If we pool our resources we might have 2 pennies to rub together for the effort. Being a fan for 40 years, I have been through a lot but not as much as those who've been there since the beginning. Their loyalty is the stuff gods are made of. As a mere mortal all I can do is hope and pray that the ship gets righted soon. If you lend me a few bucks I'll happily buy you a drink at the local tavern/pub/bar of your choice. :beer:

[Freyaka]

Meh, John has bought himself enough currency with 2 SB appearances and a championship. If the team continues to plummet for the next 3 years than i can see a change being made but he does have a grace period to get it right. IMO

I too felt that way once. I kinda feel like the way he's continuously bungled the QB situation since Manning has him on pretty thin ice. I could see Brittany getting control here shortly and replacing Elway. As long as Ellis is in power, I think Elway's safe, but he needs to start righting the ship quickly because of one of the Bowlen daughters takes over, I'm not sure he has a lot of time left as it stands.

[BeefStew25]

I think the above post is complete poop and based on emotion and boredom.

[BeefStew25]

What’s the oppo of a salute

[Mike]

It's worse than you are making out.

Paradis is an UFA next season and Elway refused to extend him, so he will get a huge offer from some other team. The entire rest of the OL will need replacing.

Bolles is a bust. (Not that they were draft picks, but Leary is injured and a busted FA signing, Veldheer is injured like always and is an UFA so he's not back. They signed those guys because their OL draft picks (Sambrailo and Schofield were busts).

Heurmann and Garcia are replacement level players and both are UFAs.

Roby is a UFA.

Etc. Most of the few players who stuck around this long won't be here next year so those drafts were a complete waste.

Bolles is a disappointment, but still too early to call him a bust, IMO.

Paradis won't be missed. I have no idea why this guy gets so much love. He ain't great. He will get signed, but it won't be a huge offer.

Bye to IR man and Garcia...not a big loss by any means.

Roby...doubt he goes anywhere for a big deal. He is a 3rd CB on teams, not a 1st or 2nd. Won't get a huge offer.

Denver should be seeking to move players though and stock up on draft picks.

Denver's biggest concern is finding the right coach that can bring in a solid staff. This team has talent.

[Hawgdriver]

What’s the oppo of a salute

A bungthumb?

[Freyaka]

Roby...doubt he goes anywhere for a big deal. He is a 3rd CB on teams, not a 1st or 2nd. Won't get a huge offer.



Our phones were blowing up with trade offers for Roby and reports are the Eagles really wanted him, we weren't listening to trades, but there were interested parties reaching out to us. I think you underestimate his value based on emotion from one bad play in the Jets game.

[Freyaka]

I think the above post is complete poop and based on emotion and boredom.

Well, you have more experience with poop than I do.

[Mike]

Our phones were blowing up with trade offers for Roby and reports are the Eagles really wanted him, we weren't listening to trades, but there were interested parties reaching out to us. I think you underestimate his value based on emotion from one bad play in the Jets game.

No...I just don't think he is a 1 or 2 CB. He is an average player though, but I don'te expect him to get a huge offer from anyone.

[TXBRONC]

No...I just don't think he is a 1 or 2 CB. He is an average player though, but I don'te expect him to get a huge offer from anyone.

I disgree Mike I think Roby is proving that he belongs in the starting line up.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I believe it was four straight division titles with Fox.

We didn’t win the division with Tebow. We were 8-8 that year with Fox.

[Freyaka]

We didn’t win the division with Tebow. We were 8-8 that year with Fox.

We did win the division with Tebow.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2011/index.htm

We had the same record as SD and Oak, but we had the tie breaker and won the division. It's how we were able to play the Steelers in Denver.

[Cugel]

I too felt that way once. I kinda feel like the way he's continuously bungled the QB situation since Manning has him on pretty thin ice. I could see Brittany getting control here shortly and replacing Elway. As long as Ellis is in power, I think Elway's safe, but he needs to start righting the ship quickly because of one of the Bowlen daughters takes over, I'm not sure he has a lot of time left as it stands.

It's more likely that Elway leaves if Beth Bowlen takes over, because that would mean she would fire Joe Ellis who is close to John Elway. If Brittany took over, she might want to keep Joe Ellis around to lean on as an advisor, and leave Elway in charge for now.

But, ultimately she will fire John unless he starts turning things around. More likely though is that he's already left by the time either of them gets control. He's on a five year deal and he might now see it out if the team keeps losing and he fails to find a QB again and the fans stop showing up.

That's when they fired McMOron, after the home Raiders loss and 20,000 no-shows showed exactly what the fans were feeling. 20,000 fewer parking fees, and concessions fees and all that $ they make off home games. Their profits were down about 1/3 on that game.

If something like that happens again, changes will have to be made. And if those changes don't solve things, more changes including John Elway.

[nevcraw]

Elway will be long gone by the time a bowlen kid takes over.

[Tned]

What’s the oppo of a salute

:2thumbsdown:

[Ground Control]

OK, everyone! Let's all overreact and jump off a cliff! We're doomed! Forever!

Agreed...but, Elway's ego needs to be checked. He's clueless on QBs and QBs are the NFL. I don't think questioning Elway's future is a jump off a cliff. Are you saying that the Broncos, without Elway, is suicide? To be clear: I want Elway to stay. I think he is learning and is really smart. Manning was all the wrong drug for him, though. Manning was a supreme leader and that made every GM decision easier. Moving on, Elway knows that he has been an idiot on QBs and has looked for help on the issue. Unfortunately, he found Kubiak...but I think he may be aware of Kubiak's idiocy, now that we are living the Keenum experiment. I also like Keenum, BTW. He just needs a OC that works with him.

Anyway, to question Elway's place in the Broncos organization is not jumping off of a cliff. For all of those fans that claim to have the highest standards for their team of choice, it should be a given to question all levels of management of a team in a serious tailspin. They may turn it all around and get to the playoffs but either way, Elway has been a serious DB on many drafts/ decisions/ statements. He has also been a genius. All good but he is not untouchable, IMO. He is one free agent signing (Manning) away from utter failure as a GM. If he has the clout to make epic signings in the future, or takes this year's draft class as the example to live by, he will earn his place as GM. If he makes the 2017 class, or his egotistical push to pay nothing for the QB position, his norm, all bets are off. As far as clout goes, he spent it all on Manning. Teams and players know he is a serious dick and hard to work for. All of Elway's personal credit is used up and he is now riding on the coattails of the organization...and must survive by making good decisions.

I've heard way too many overly simplistic and deflective interviews by Elway to give him a pass. The guy is good and I am a fan of his GM tenure. I just think his good has been balanced by extreme bad and it's not crazy to question him, or his position. I loved this year's draft and worst-case scenario: we should give him a few years to rebuild.