Coaching Options for 2019

[Ziggy]

I'll be shocked if Joseph isn't gone by the time the bye week is over. Time to start looking at options for the 2019 season. I really hope I'm wrong and Joseph turns out to be a stud. This team has the talent to make a playoff run. If it doesn't happen, Elway pulls the trigger on a new coach. Here are some of the names that will be tossed around later in the season.

John DeFillipo
Matt Lafleur
Dave Toub
Jim Schwartz
Jim Bob Cooter
David Shaw
Jim Harbaugh

My money is on one of the first two names listed, with Shaw as a close third.

Thoughts?

[dogfish]

defilipo or lafleur would be my top picks. . . shaw would work as well. . . i just hope john's ready to go outside "the family," and bring in some new blood rather than digging up another of gary's old assistants. . .

[ChubbNYiadom]

I can't even wrap my head around coach hunting week 2 of the pre season. Whether Vance stays or goes now isn't the time for me.

[Valar Morghulis]

Schwartz, Harbaugh or Shaw

[WARHORSE]

Wade Phillips.

On the agreement that he ran the defense on gamedays and in practice.

[Shazam!]

Rick Dennison

[Valar Morghulis]

Rick Dennison

You keep mentioning him, at first I thought it was just playful nostalgia, but I think you are serious. What is it about him that you think would make him a good HC?

[Shazam!]

Rick Dennison

You keep mentioning him, at first I thought it was just playful nostalgia, but I think you are serious. What is it about him that you think would make him a good HC?

He is a Bronco through and through. He knows what it took to win during the Championship years, developed under Shanahan. A lot of Coaching experience as a Coordinator and position Coach. Knows what it takes to make an OL play with fluidity. Familiar with the operations at DV. Great relationship with Elway and Kubiak. He wouldnt need to be a GM as well.

I wanted Shanahan last year. He would have been option 2. At this point he can be no worse?

I am a leader of men at my job (Unfortunately). I can also smell weakness a mile away. Look at VJ. On the sidelines of a PRESEASON GAME IN HIS SECOND YEAR he is totally lost and a deer in headlights. He couldnt prep this team for an exhibition game.

Josh McDaniels tenure may be forgotten about very quickly.

Mike Shanahan would be a better option at this point.

[Dapper Dan]

I’m all in for Cooter.

[Dapper Dan]

I can't even wrap my head around coach hunting week 2 of the pre season. Whether Vance stays or goes now isn't the time for me.

We have been coach hunting for almost a year.

[NightTerror218]

Need a guy who is willing to stand up to Elway to not try and push his guy. Coach who doesn't want to be his players best friend. If a player makes a mistake call him out, they are grown ass men.

[Davii]

Why is everyone so convinced Elway is pushing Lynch?

What has anyone seen from Lynch that would make you think Elway would push for him?

[Shazam!]

Why is everyone so convinced Elway is pushing Lynch?

What has anyone seen from Lynch that would make you think Elway would push for him?

Because the backup QB job was just handed to him. Last year he was 3rd string and Sat was thoroughly outplayed. He doesn't get it and there isnt a magic switch to flip.

[Davii]

Because the backup QB job was just handed to him. Last year he was 3rd string and Sat was thoroughly outplayed. He doesn't get it and there isnt a magic switch to flip.

Ok... now tell me why that means Elway is coaching the team. VJ is immune to being an idiot?

[Hawgdriver]

Need a guy who is willing to stand up to Elway to not try and push his guy. Coach who doesn't want to be his players best friend. If a player makes a mistake call him out, they are grown ass men.

I'm a grower ass man too. Maybe I could be a Bronco? Or does it just mean I will make more mistakes?

[Davii]

I'm a grower ass man too. Maybe I could be a Bronco? Or does it just mean I will make more mistakes?

I'm just an ass man. Or is that "ass, man"?

[dogfish]

I'm just an ass man. Or is that "ass, man"?

both. . . me, too. . . :D

[WARHORSE]

Because the backup QB job was just handed to him. Last year he was 3rd string and Sat was thoroughly outplayed. He doesn't get it and there isnt a magic switch to flip.


If you think Elway is calling the shots on depth chart then you have to say Elway was responsible for putting McKenzie on the field last year.....in which case he should be fired.

[Denver Native (Carol)]

Why is everyone so convinced Elway is pushing Lynch?

What has anyone seen from Lynch that would make you think Elway would push for him?

Totally agree with you. To me, the following is the reason why Lynch has not been cut, and he sure did nothing Sat. night for any other team to want him.


Keep in mind the Broncos would suffer a $2.5 million hit by cutting Lynch, who carries a $4.457 million dead money charge in the third of his four-year rookie contract.

https://247sports.com/nfl/denver-broncos/Article/Broncos-fan-starts-GoFundMe-to-cut-Paxton-Lynch-120612028/

[underrated29]

I do not think we fire VJ and I do not think Lynch gets cut.

Imo the whole thing was for him to not look just as bad as he did so we could trade him to some team for a 2025 conditional 7th. That looks to be out now as well.

[Cugel]

Why is everyone so convinced Elway is pushing Lynch?

What has anyone seen from Lynch that would make you think Elway would push for him?

Because Elway at his presser said "We're not kicking Paxton to the curb" in explanation of why he didn't draft a QB.

Well, why NOT kick Paxton to the curb? At what point do they acknowledge that Paxton is just a flat bust? If he stays on the opening day roster then we know that Elway insisted upon it.

Because, if you were Vance Joseph would you consider keeping Paxton as your backup QB knowing that your job was on the line? No. Nobody sensible would do that.

No matter what he says publicly, VJ cannot be happy that if Keenum is hurt, and he needs a backup QB to step in the only choice he now has is Paxton Lynch or Chad Kelly who has never started an NFL game. And it doesn't look like Kelly will be on the opening day roster unless they get rid of Paxton.

It certainly doesn't appear that VJ is in charge of this team. It looks like Elway is calling all the shots and he is stubbornly sticking to the mantra "we drafted Paxton and we liked him for a reason, it's up to you to coach him up till he's ready" crap.

I'll believe something different the day I see Paxton hit the FA market (nobody is going to trade for him).

[ChubbNYiadom]

Need a guy who is willing to stand up to Elway to not try and push his guy. Coach who doesn't want to be his players best friend. If a player makes a mistake call him out, they are grown ass men.

What coaches around the league calls there player's out to the media? Damn near zero....

[Cugel]

After a breakout performance in his NFL debut on Saturday night, will the first-year quarterback Chad Kelly finally receive some second-team reps in practice?

“We’ll see. We’ll watch the tape and see where we are,” Head Coach Vance Joseph said post-game.

Translation: we’re going to have to wait to see what the boss man has to say on the matter.

I.e. he's going to have to wait until he sees whether Elway will permit him to push Lynch to #3rd on the the depth chart, which would be a sign to all the world that he's about to get cut (a 3rd year veteran being passed over for an essential rookie who has never played an NFL game).

What is getting more and more clear is that the fan reaction if they keep Lynch and cut Kelly will be loud and bitter.

[FanInAZ]

Wade Phillips.

On the agreement that he ran the defense on gamedays and in practice.

He's a great DC, but I'm to understand that he doesn't want a 3rd crack at being a HC because of how the 1st 2 went. I'd be in favor of a HC that would bring him back, but he's already got this same job with the Rams. Unless they hire another HC that wants to bring in his own coordinators, he's not going to be avalible anytime in the foreseeable future.

[dogfish]

What coaches around the league calls there player's out to the media? Damn near zero....

bill parcells says what's up. . .

[ChubbNYiadom]

We have been coach hunting for almost a year.

Who is we? Not the Broncos organization..... This ain't the time for this, There is so much football left on the menu to be worried about this. So much can happen, and the guy whose band wagon most of you are on (kelly) is Vance Joseph hand picked quarterback, he was the one pre draft and post draft saying Chad was his favorite quarterback in that draft.

Whether Vance stays or goes is irrelevant right now, it's Week 2 of the preason. The Vikings entire unit has been together for year's now, they started fast big deal.

we have a ton of new/young guy's in a lot of key roles on offense and defense, they started slow but they didnt fold and fought back. Unlike last year. If we're looking pathetic week 1-5 then go ahead and kick and scream for a new coach but geez not right now when there working in new guy's, New quarterback with a offense that's in it's first pre season game together. I have complete faith that the overwhelming talent will prevail for us. And if Vance and his staff can't make it work then yes they'll be canned but this is way too premature fire the staff talk.

But proceed as you wish.

[FanInAZ]

bill parcells says what's up. . .

In fairness, Chubb didn't say zero, but "Damn near zero..." So pointing out only a single example of someone who hasn't coached in 12 years doesn't disprove his point.

[ChubbNYiadom]

bill parcells says what's up. . .

Where is bill parcels? He's out of the league for a while now, he's also from the old old old school, that doesn't exist anymore and rightfully so, it's none of fan's or the media business too know how the staff leans on there players in private. I'm sure he's ripped into McKenzie privately but showed faith in the kid and now look at him, totally looking good in camp, it then transferred onto the first game.

The media doesn't need to be involved in that, Joseph didn't have to bash Lynch publicly but yet Monday morning he benched his ass.

[NightTerror218]

What coaches around the league calls there player's out to the media? Damn near zero....

Just about all will call a player out needing to improve or play better instead of a blanket good game but need to watch the film Comment

[ChubbNYiadom]

Just about all will call a player out needing to improve or play better instead of a blanket good game but need to watch the film Comment

That's not true man, coaches just don't do that stuff, he clearly told Paxton behind closd doors that his play is unacceptable and then benched him, but yet you all want more in the sense of hearing that conversation through the media.

[Dapper Dan]

Who is we? Not the Broncos organization..... This ain't the time for this, There is so much football left on the menu to be worried about this. So much can happen, and the guy whose band wagon most of you are on (kelly) is Vance Joseph hand picked quarterback, he was the one pre draft and post draft saying Chad was his favorite quarterback in that draft.

Whether Vance stays or goes is irrelevant right now, it's Week 2 of the preason. The Vikings entire unit has been together for year's now, they started fast big deal.

we have a ton of new/young guy's in a lot of key roles on offense and defense, they started slow but they didnt fold and fought back. Unlike last year. If we're looking pathetic week 1-5 then go ahead and kick and scream for a new coach but geez not right now when there working in new guy's, New quarterback with a offense that's in it's first pre season game together. I have complete faith that the overwhelming talent will prevail for us. And if Vance and his staff can't make it work then yes they'll be canned but this is way too premature fire the staff talk.

But proceed as you wish.

The forum.

[ShaneFalco]

i think chubbnyiadom is saying that he is voting for Hugh Freeze, chad kellys old coach.

[Cugel]

You guys are forgetting that if VJ gets fired it's highly likely he will be fired DURING the season, not after, and in that case Bill Musgrave will get the acting HC job. He'll have a chance to show what he can do - short of a showcase job interview.

[slim]

You guys are forgetting that if VJ gets fired it's highly likely he will be fired DURING the season, not after, and in that case Bill Musgrave will get the acting HC job. He'll have a chance to show what he can do - short of a showcase job interview.

Why are you always a day late and a dollar short?

[Cugel]

Why are you always a day late and a dollar short?

Why does everything you say have to be so stupid?

[UnderArmour]

David Shaw is going to cost big bucks to lure from Stanford. He's making $4.1 million a year right now, plus he has job security in one of the best places to live in the country. Contract discussions would start at $6 million a year, and probably end around a 4 year pact at $6.5 million a year. Those are big bucks for an ownership operating out of a trust. With that said, I would love the guy if VJ doesn't learn how to coach.

[MOtorboat]

Why does everything you say have to be so stupid?

Your obvious post was obvious. Slim isn’t the stupid one in this scenario.

[MOtorboat]

I'll be shocked if Joseph isn't gone by the time the bye week is over. Time to start looking at options for the 2019 season. I really hope I'm wrong and Joseph turns out to be a stud. This team has the talent to make a playoff run. If it doesn't happen, Elway pulls the trigger on a new coach. Here are some of the names that will be tossed around later in the season.

John DeFillipo
Matt Lafleur
Dave Toub
Jim Schwartz
Jim Bob Cooter
David Shaw
Jim Harbaugh

My money is on one of the first two names listed, with Shaw as a close third.

Thoughts?

I like LaFleur, but why’d he leave L.A.?

[Valar Morghulis]

I am buying some khakis

[Krugan]

David Shaw is going to cost big bucks to lure from Stanford. He's making $4.1 million a year right now, plus he has job security in one of the best places to live in the country. Contract discussions would start at $6 million a year, and probably end around a 4 year pact at $6.5 million a year. Those are big bucks for an ownership operating out of a trust. With that said, I would love the guy if VJ doesn't learn how to coach.

Colorado state income tax 4.63% california top rate(assuming with that salary he would be there)is 13.3%. Might be a difference.

[Shazam!]

David Shaw is going to cost big bucks to lure from Stanford. He's making $4.1 million a year right now, plus he has job security in one of the best places to live in the country. Contract discussions would start at $6 million a year, and probably end around a 4 year pact at $6.5 million a year. Those are big bucks for an ownership operating out of a trust. With that said, I would love the guy if VJ doesn't learn how to coach.

Colorado state income tax 4.63% california top rate(assuming with that salary he would be there)is 13.3%. Might be a difference.

4.6?! Wow...

[BroncoWave]

i think chubbnyiadom is saying that he is voting for Hugh Freeze, chad kellys old coach.

**** that piece of shit. Only won at ole Miss because he cheated his ass off. Dude was a damn high school coach before he went there. They is no way Elway is so stupid.

[MOtorboat]

I am buying some khakis

You want Jake from State Farm?

[Valar Morghulis]

You want Jake from State Farm?

No, I just like khakis and posted on the wrong thread, sorry, that was misleading

[MOtorboat]

No, I just like khakis and posted on the wrong thread, sorry, that was misleading

Really? I thought you were referencing Harbaugh. That’s his thing; cheap khakis from Wal-Mart.

[Valar Morghulis]

Really? I thought you were referencing Harbaugh. That’s his thing; cheap khakis from Wal-Mart.

FFS of course I was referencing harbaugh!!!!

The tone of my post, in my head at least was genius April ludgate level sarcasm

[Nomad]

**** that piece of shit. Only won at ole Miss because he cheated his ass off. Dude was a damn high school coach before he went there. They is no way Elway is so stupid.

Tell us how you really feel about him? :D. Ole Miss/LSU is my favorite rivalry. I had forgotten about what Freeze did.

[Nomad]

I am buying some khakis

I'm a khakis kind of guy.

[BroncoWave]

Tell us how you really feel about him? :D. Ole Miss/LSU is my favorite rivalry. I had forgotten about what Freeze did.

That guy is a slimeball of the highest degree. I don't want him anywhere near the broncos.

[MOtorboat]

That guy is a slimeball of the highest degree. I don't want him anywhere near the broncos.

Who among us hasn’t banged a hooker in Tampa, though?

[Ziggy]

I like LaFleur, but why’d he leave L.A.?

So that he could be the offensive coordinator and call plays during games.

[MOtorboat]

So that he could be the offensive coordinator and call plays during games.

Ah. Well, maybe I will like him less in Tennessee then.

[Broncos Mtnman]

I'm just an ass man. Or is that "ass, man"?


12855

[elsid13]

I like LaFleur, but why’d he leave L.A.?

Because he wanted to be the man. McVee was calling the plays. Lafleur has ties to Shannahans and Gary so he is in the family.

[elsid13]

Ah. Well, maybe I will like him less in Tennessee then.

I think he going to be extremely good in Tenn with Marcus Mariota running a WC/ZBS system.

[slim]

I miss Kubes

[UnderArmour]

I miss Kubes

I would love to have him back as Offensive Coordinator. Kubs needs to look out for his health, and it would be irresponsible to throw money at the guy to lure him into risking his life after what happened during his last 2 head coaching stints. I don't want a death on our sideline. Guy should not be a head coach.

[BroncoJoe]

I miss Kubes

He is still with the team, and was in the box with Elway last night.

[Shazam!]

I miss Kubes

He is still with the team, and was in the box with Elway last night.

I am thrilled he is involved, he may be the key to what appears to be a great Draft class.

[Valar Morghulis]

Kubes offense during his tenure as HC was putrid.

Everything sucked. Passing, running, blocking, the whole thing. It stank.

It was bland and predictable.

It was outdated.

I love kubes but keep him in his front office role

[slim]

Kubes offense during his tenure as HC was putrid.

Everything sucked. Passing, running, blocking, the whole thing. It stank.

It was bland and predictable.

It was outdated.

I love kubes but keep him in his front office role

Yeah, I hate winning super bowls

[Slick]

Yeah, I hate winning super bowls

Wade's historic defense won that Superbowl.

[Northman]

Wade's historic defense won that Superbowl.

^This.

I love Kubes and all but it had way less to do with him just like the team actually winning had less to do with Manning as it did the defense that year.

[dogfish]

who hired wade?

[Slick]

who hired wade?

He deserves the credit for that but it doesn't take the stink off of that offense.

[Northman]

who hired wade?

The LA Rams

[Shazam!]

The Broncos had one of or the worst OLine of any Super Bowl champion i believe and it hastened Peytons decline.

I believe Elway didn't build on the position as Shanahn did on arrival to protect Elway and power the running game, even tho Zimm was in Denver already and some pieces were in place.

Thats what he was given to work with no, he found a way.

If Polumbus didnt come in at the last minute idk if Denver even makes it. That was luck.

[slim]

Wade's historic defense won that Superbowl.

Head coach gets no credit. I understand.

[slim]

Shanny was a terrible head coach. Those SB wins were all about Kubes and Robinson

[Shazam!]

Shanny was a terrible head coach. Those SB wins were all about Kubes and Robinson

Horrible.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Kubes offense during his tenure as HC was putrid.

Everything sucked. Passing, running, blocking, the whole thing. It stank.

It was bland and predictable.

It was outdated.

I love kubes but keep him in his front office role

Maybe the conservative offense was to keep horribly bad quarterbacks from turning the ball over? Manning did what he wanted until the wheels fell off.

[Shazam!]

He was trying to mask that the OLine was horrible and Manning could not endure the beatings he was taking since 2014 after the SB vs Seattle the Line was exposed. A lot of it was smoke and mirrors. When they got Polumbus midseason his contribution cannot be forgotten. They turned a corner because of him, and went from putrid/below mediocre to at least a serviceable, average OLine. I believe this.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

He was trying to mask that the OLine was horrible and Manning could not endure the beatings he was taking since 2014 after the SB vs Seattle the Line was exposed. A lot of it was smoke and mirrors. When they got Polumbus midseason his contribution cannot be forgotten. They turned a corner because of him, and went from putrid/below mediocre to at least a serviceable, average OLine. I believe this.

Manning couldn’t throw a football 30 yards the last half of 2015

[Hawgdriver]

Shanny was a terrible head coach. Those SB wins were all about Kubes and Robinson

Kubiak is OG. Elway is OG. I love riding wit dem boys.

The 2018 draft looks like they got their shit in a sock. They picked clownshoes for a reason. Maybe that reason was a peyote visionquest, maybe not. These guys compete hard, I love the Broncos, can't wait to see all of us proven wrong in 2018.

[dogfish]

Shanny was a terrible head coach. Those SB wins were all about Kubes and Robinson

bobby turner and alex gibbs were the real architects of 32 and 33-- shanny was just along for the ride. . .

[Shazam!]

He was trying to mask that the OLine was horrible and Manning could not endure the beatings he was taking since 2014 after the SB vs Seattle the Line was exposed. A lot of it was smoke and mirrors. When they got Polumbus midseason his contribution cannot be forgotten. They turned a corner because of him, and went from putrid/below mediocre to at least a serviceable, average OLine. I believe this.

Manning couldn’t throw a football 30 yards the last half of 2015

Was never the same after 2014. He took a lot of big hits.

[Valar Morghulis]

Yeah, I hate winning super bowls

Winning the Superbowl was great sure, and kubes is a great HC compared to VJ, but his offensive scheme is done. The game has changed, he was unable to evolve his scheme. Keep him in the FO, and keep Dennison away from the franchise.

[dogfish]

Winning the Superbowl was great sure, and kubes is a great HC compared to VJ, but his offensive scheme is done. The game has changed, he was unable to evolve his scheme. Keep him in the FO, and keep Dennison away from the franchise.

dennison is a bum. . . kyle shenanigans is doing just fine with that same scheme, though. . .

[iLands]

Insane Harbaugh over anyone, but it would never happen.

[Hawgdriver]

Insane Harbaugh over anyone, but it would never happen.

I wonder how well Harbaugh's approach would fare with all the player safety game changes.

[Valar Morghulis]

dennison is a bum. . . kyle shenanigans is doing just fine with that same scheme, though. . .

Kyle completely revamped his offense for RG3 and manzel and had success. When the players don't fit his scheme he can innovate. Kubes lacks that versatility and calls every game like it's 98.

It doesn't need reinvented, but it does need to evolve. A la kyle

[Valar Morghulis]

I wonder how well Harbaugh's approach would fare with all the player safety game changes.

He's in the NCAA I am sure he had already had to change

[Hawgdriver]

Kyle completely revamped his offense for RG3 and manzel and had success. When the players don't fit his scheme he can innovate. Kubes lacks that versatility and calls every game like it's 98.

It doesn't need reinvented, but it does need to evolve. A la kyle

Yeah, Kubiak is mad stubborn with an ego. Wanted to bend Peyton Manning to his will even though the dude had a proven system for 10+ wins a year. :lol:

These younger coaches, they'll eat their own caca if it means they can get some wins.

Curious if Kyle and the LA Rams coach are studs this year. I think they will be.

[UnderArmour]

Yeah, Kubiak is mad stubborn with an ego. Wanted to bend Peyton Manning to his will even though the dude had a proven system for 10+ wins a year. :lol:

These younger coaches, they'll eat their own caca if it means they can get some wins.

Curious if Kyle and the LA Rams coach are studs this year. I think they will be.

I don't get where the idea that Kubs is a bad offensive coach comes from.

To be fair, Manning was already showing signs of decline towards the end of 2014. Manning was physically done during the 2015 season, and had Kubiak overly relied on "the Manning offense," the Broncos would not have won Super Bowl 50. Brock Osweiller, Paxton Lynch, and Trevor Siemian have never looked better than they did under Kubiak. The drop off from 2016 to 2017 offensively was astronomical, and the 2016 offense was already pretty lackluster.

Kubiak worked wonders with the Ravens in 2014. He won a playoff game with TJ Yates. If the guy wanted to go back to coaching, any team would be lucky to have him on their coaching staff. That said, his health comes first, so head coaching is absolutely out of the question except on an interim basis.

[Hawgdriver]

I don't get where the idea that Kubs is a bad offensive coach comes from.

To be fair, Manning was already showing signs of decline towards the end of 2014. Manning was physically done during the 2015 season, and had Kubiak overly relied on "the Manning offense," the Broncos would not have won Super Bowl 50. Brock Osweiller, Paxton Lynch, and Trevor Siemian have never looked better than they did under Kubiak. The drop off from 2016 to 2017 offensively was astronomical, and the 2016 offense was already pretty lackluster.

Kubiak worked wonders with the Ravens in 2014. He won a playoff game with TJ Yates. If the guy wanted to go back to coaching, any team would be lucky to have him on their coaching staff. That said, his health comes first, so head coaching is absolutely out of the question except on an interim basis.

I think he's a great offensive coach! Just stubborn, maybe too much so. If he adopted an RPO with Lynch I think he'd still be HC. But I'm just a dude and he's a SB winner.

[Valar Morghulis]

I think he's a great offensive coach! Just stubborn, maybe too much so. If he adopted an RPO with Lynch I think he'd still be HC. But I'm just a dude and he's a SB winner.

you are so much more than just a dude!

[BroncoJoe]

you are so much more than just a dude!

No. He's just a dude.

[Valar Morghulis]

No. He's just a dude.

Your not even that

[Shazam!]

I want someone with Broncos roots. Again.

[BroncoJoe]

Your not even that

That hurts.

*You're

[ChubbNYiadom]

I don't get where the idea that Kubs is a bad offensive coach comes from.

To be fair, Manning was already showing signs of decline towards the end of 2014. Manning was physically done during the 2015 season, and had Kubiak overly relied on "the Manning offense," the Broncos would not have won Super Bowl 50. Brock Osweiller, Paxton Lynch, and Trevor Siemian have never looked better than they did under Kubiak. The drop off from 2016 to 2017 offensively was astronomical, and the 2016 offense was already pretty lackluster.

Kubiak worked wonders with the Ravens in 2014. He won a playoff game with TJ Yates. If the guy wanted to go back to coaching, any team would be lucky to have him on their coaching staff. That said, his health comes first, so head coaching is absolutely out of the question except on an interim basis.

Dude kubiak tried to have manning running bootlegs and waggles...... kubiak offense is beyond out dated and that's why he's out of coaching .

[UnderArmour]

Dude kubiak tried to have manning running bootlegs and waggles...... kubiak offense is beyond out dated and that's why he's out of coaching .

He's out of coaching because of his health issues. You must have slept through Kubiak's 2 seasons where the Broncos won Super Bowl 50, then went 9-7 with a 7th round quarterback at the helm.

No doubt there were early season adjustment issues balancing what Manning was comfortable with, what he could physically do, and shifting towards a reliance on the run game. However, Kubiak overcame those issues by season's end, and by the time Manning came back week 17 the offense was stable enough to move the chains in spite of Manning's health. 2014 with the Ravens is a much better sample of what the Kubiak offense can do than 2015 or 2016, because the Ravens actually had some talent up front and a quarterback that had complete feeling in his throwing arm.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

That hurts.

*You're

Don’t they teach English in England?

[Davii]

Don’t they teach English in England?

BroncosForums.com, teaching the English English since Dave showed up.

[MOtorboat]

BroncosForums.com, teaching the English English since Dave showed up.

To be fair, they ****** up the language a long time ago...

[Valar Morghulis]

Not English


******* Canadians

[MOtorboat]

Not English


******* Canadians

I think you're German. You should have said, "******* Bahamians!"

[MOtorboat]

P.S. The Scottish have ****** up more languages than Mike Tyson.

[dogfish]

probably time to dust this baby off. . .

i will be keeping a close eye on how difilippo's and lafleur's squads perform. . .

[Ziggy]

The question is, will Elway go with a young prodigy like a Sean McVay or a veteran coach like a Harbaugh?

[Valar Morghulis]

The question is, will Elway go with a young prodigy like a Sean McVay or a veteran coach like a Harbaugh?

Either works for me - just as long as we end this abortion of an experiment in VJ

[Davii]

[X] None of the above

[Rick]

I wouldn't mind Schwartz. He would probably solidify the defense. I think we have the players here to fit his scheme.

I also think he would probably hold on to Musgrave who I think is doing a decent job.

[dogfish]

The question is, will Elway go with a young prodigy like a Sean McVay or a veteran coach like a Harbaugh?

i suspect he'll go with an inexpensive coach, so that rules out harbaugh. . . if we go with a vet, i'm afraid it will likely be someone else from one of gary's old staffs, which frankly terrifies me. . . i'm holding out hope for one of the young gun OCs. . .

[dogfish]

I wouldn't mind Schwartz. He would probably solidify the defense. I think we have the players here to fit his scheme.

I also think he would probably hold on to Musgrave who I think is doing a decent job.

i would cry. . .

[Jsteve01]

dennison is a bum. . . kyle shenanigans is doing just fine with that same scheme, though. . .

It isn't the same system though. Just as Musgrave's isn't the same the sad part is that once again Musgrave who is doing a pretty good job will be the victim of a regime change.

[Jsteve01]

i suspect he'll go with an inexpensive coach, so that rules out harbaugh. . . if we go with a vet, i'm afraid it will likely be someone else from one of gary's old staffs, which frankly terrifies me. . . i'm holding out hope for one of the young gun OCs. . .

John and Jim would never coexist haha. we should have at least interviewed McVay. the coaching search was an effing farce.

[Poet]

Nick Saban.

[Poet]

Or Pete Carrol.

[dogfish]

aside from bellyache-- who is an impossible to reproduce outlier-- who would you say are the best coaches in the league right this minute?

my short list would probably look like doug pederson, sean payton, sean mcvay, andy reid, and mike zimmer. . . you could put sneaky pete on there as a lifetime achievement award, but his squad has completely fallen apart this year. . . who else? john harbaugh? doug marrone? don't tell me tomlin. . . i do think jim harbaugh would be on the list if he was still in the league. . . mostly, i see a bunch of offensive hotshots, with one or two defensive holdovers. . . matt nagy is already showing a lot of promise in chicago. . .

if you hire a guy like schwartz, i think you're just setting yourself up for the next lovie smith, jack del rio, marvin lewis, john fox, jeff fisher, etc. . . the zimmer's and carrol's are pretty few and far between these days. . . unless the plan is to go with another journeyman QB, our top priority has to be finding and developing a young QB-- and i just don't trust a defensive minded guy to be in charge of that process. . . even if you do find a great young QB coach, you risk losing him and having to start from scratch when some other team hires the up-and-comer away from you to run their offense, or their team. . . nope. . . i want a situation where our offensive scheme comes from the HC himself, so you know it won't be changed. . . i don't expect the HC to necessarily do all the hands on work, but i want him directly involved with the process. . . hiring a personnel manager ("leader of men") who delegates everything to his coordinators just isn't the best way to do it when you're breaking in a young QB, and the smart teams have realized this. . . it's why the rams canned fisher for mcvay, why the bears brought in nagy, etc. . . doesn't mean it always works, obviously--but IMO, it gives you the best odds. . . i was really hoping we'd get frank reich next year, but mcdickhead managed to screw us one last time. . . i'll still hold out hope for a rams-style approach, with de filippo or lafleur as HC, and a gnarly vet DC. . . for my money, that's simply the best model out there right now. . . i know from past experience that people will always pine for the big name hire (bill cowher!!111!!11!!), but maybe they should take a close look at how it's going for gruden out in chokeland, and be careful what they wish for. . .

[Buff]

Shaw is the guy. Stanford connection. Pro system. Ties to the NFL. Brings an inherent credibility.

But at this stage I'd settle for any guy who knows how to use timeouts and challenges appropriately.

[Northman]

Is McVay the Rams coach? If so he is really good and has done a nice job there. I would not be surprised if the Rams win it all this year.

[Poet]

Pete Carrol would fix the team in a season or two and bring about five productive years before it falls apart. That seems to be his way.

I thought you were of the opinion that Reid was a worthless chump, Dog?

[dogfish]

Is McVay the Rams coach? If so he is really good and has done a nice job there. I would not be surprised if the Rams win it all this year.

he is, and matt lafleur is his OC there. . .



Pete Carrol would fix the team in a season or two and bring about five productive years before it falls apart. That seems to be his way.

I thought you were of the opinion that Reid was a worthless chump, Dog?

i like to mock his shortcomings because he's the chiefs coach, but i respect him. . . can't win the big one, but he's at least a top-notch program builder. . . carrol is the oldest coach in the league, isn't currently available, and brings a ton of baggage. . . i would pass him over, and look for a longer-term, more sustainable solution. . . and i don't think guys like schwartz, perry fewell, or whoever are the next carrol anyway. . . shaw i would be good with, he's on my short list after the other two. . .

[Jsteve01]

Is McVay the Rams coach? If so he is really good and has done a nice job there. I would not be surprised if the Rams win it all this year.

Yeah and he has worked with both Shannys and with Gruden. He is a phenom. Badass and wasnt even on our radar

[Jsteve01]

Defelippo hasnt impressed me so much this year. Matt lafleur. How much is him and how much mcvay?

[dogfish]

Defelippo hasnt impressed me so much this year. Matt lafleur. How much is him and how much mcvay?

it's a fair question, but there's no way to be 100% sure. . . the eagles didn't know how much was pederson, and how much was andy-- rams had no way of knowing for sure what mcvay would do without gruden looking over his shoulder, etc. . . . . . you do good interviews, do your due diligence to the best of your ability, and make the most informed decision possible. . .

who would your top choices be?

[Shazam!]

Mike Tomlin

Rick Dennison

Hell Mike Shanahan

[Poet]

Mike Tomlin

Rick Dennison

Hell Mike Shanahan

:shocked:

[dogfish]

dennison's not even qualified to hold a coordinator job. . . without gary holding his hand, he's been demoted back to a position coach. . . if he's not the single worst candidate out there, i don't know who is. . .

[Hawgdriver]

:shocked:

Don't stare at the retard, Kinger. That's not polite.

[Hawgdriver]

j/k Shazam. I know you love you some old school washed up Shanny dudes.

[Jsteve01]

Defelippo hasnt impressed me so much this year. Matt lafleur. How much is him and how much mcvay?

it's a fair question, but there's no way to be 100% sure. . . the eagles didn't know how much was pederson, and how much was andy-- rams had no way of knowing for sure what mcvay would do without gruden looking over his shoulder, etc. . . . . . you do good interviews, do your due diligence to the best of your ability, and make the most informed decision possible. . .

who would your top choices be?

Again even with the issues he has had, i really like Frost, shaw, pat fitzgerald. Other than pats hate for rpo

[dogfish]

j/k Shazam. I know you love you some old school washed up Shanny dudes.

gregg williams for HC!



Again even with the issues he has had, i really like Frost, shaw, pat fitzgerald. Other than pats hate for rpo

i'm not sure who frost and fitzgerald are. . .

[elsid13]

Mcvay, and Lafleur are Mike and Kyle Shananan guys. They both run systems based upon that ZBS/WCO that they learned under Shannahan. Jeremy Bates out of NYJ would also be guy to consider.

[MOtorboat]

he is, and matt lafleur is his OC there. . .

LaFleur is running the shit show in Tennessee now. :wave:

(To be fair he is saddled with Blaine Gabbert right now)

[dogfish]

LaFleur is running the shit show in Tennessee now. :wave:

(To be fair he is saddled with Blaine Gabbert right now)

i didn't realized they'd hired him. . . not sure why he'd go from LA to tennessee. . . but yea, not gonna judge him on what he can accomplish with zero talent and a backup QB. . .

[MOtorboat]

Shaw is the guy. Stanford connection. Pro system. Ties to the NFL. Brings an inherent credibility.

But at this stage I'd settle for any guy who knows how to use timeouts and challenges appropriately.

I’m not sure Shaw is your guy if you’re looking for clock management...

[Nomad]

Shaw seems to have a good home at Stanford. Why would he want to leave there?

[Buff]

I’m not sure Shaw is your guy if you’re looking for clock management...

Tell me more...

[elsid13]

i didn't realized they'd hired him. . . not sure why he'd go from LA to tennessee. . . but yea, not gonna judge him on what he can accomplish with zero talent and a backup QB. . .

Because he wanted to run and call his own offense.

[MOtorboat]

Tell me more...

I’m vague on this, and I debated saying anything, but I seem to remember some glaring clock mismanagement in games...

[MOtorboat]

Ok, it was the Rose Bowl several years ago. Maybe he’s corrected his style, but this is Marty (Fox) Ball... https://www.dailynews.com/2014/01/01/stanford-football-coach-david-shaw-didnt-help-himself-with-rose-bowl-performance/

[Jsteve01]

my two least fave coaches ever. Play not to lose. it drives me crazy. Actually like them both as people but would break my tv if we ever had them.

Pat Fitzgerald from NW dog and Scott Frost from Nebraska. Tons of football people are hyping Frost as the complete package.

[MOtorboat]

my two least fave coaches ever. Play not to lose. it drives me crazy. Actually like them both as people but would break my tv if we ever had them.

Pat Fitzgerald from NW dog and Scott Frost from Nebraska. Tons of football people are hyping Frost as the complete package.

Scott Frost isn’t going anywhere.

[Shazam!]

j/k Shazam. I know you love you some old school washed up Shanny dudes.

I would be wary going with another unproven Coach or NCAA guy. But at the direction this team is going in they need someone to step in at the pro level and FAST to get this team competitive again. Because after the VJ misfire, if Elway screws up the next time he most certainly will not be around.

And the only reason i say Shanahan partly in jest. But if we see more of what we saw yesterday VJ wont last the Season and someone will have to step in immediately.

I thought McD was the worst it can get.

[Jsteve01]

my two least fave coaches ever. Play not to lose. it drives me crazy. Actually like them both as people but would break my tv if we ever had them.

Pat Fitzgerald from NW dog and Scott Frost from Nebraska. Tons of football people are hyping Frost as the complete package.

Scott Frost isn’t going anywhere.

I get it. He loves Nebraska. But an odd tidbit. Most Nebraskans are Broncs fans....so

[MOtorboat]

I get it. He loves Nebraska. But an odd tidbit. Mist Nebraskans are Broncs fans....so

Depends on which part of the state...I’m aware.

[Jsteve01]

my two least fave coaches ever. Play not to lose. it drives me crazy. Actually like them both as people but would break my tv if we ever had them.

Pat Fitzgerald from NW dog and Scott Frost from Nebraska. Tons of football people are hyping Frost as the complete package.

Scott Frost isn’t going anywhere.

Frost by the way has played forBill Walsh, Belichek, Parcells, Tomlin, Chip Kelly etc. Whats that like 14 superbowls?

[Jsteve01]

I get it. He loves Nebraska. But an odd tidbit. Mist Nebraskans are Broncs fans....so

Depends on which part of the state...I’m aware.

Would you say youre woke in regards to the Chiefs /broncos dynamic in nebraska?

[MOtorboat]

Frost by the way has played forBill Walsh, Belichek, Parcells, Tomlin, Chip Kelly etc. Whats that like 14 superbowls?

Yeah. I don’t think he played under Kelly, but his big break was as OC at Oregon for Kelly.

[MOtorboat]

Would you say youre woke in regards to the Chiefs /broncos dynamic in nebraska?

Slightly.

[Jsteve01]

Frost by the way has played forBill Walsh, Belichek, Parcells, Tomlin, Chip Kelly etc. Whats that like 14 superbowls?

Yeah. I don’t think he played under Kelly, but his big break was as OC at Oregon for Kelly. sorry...lazy posting. I originally intended to say played with or coached with. Forgo Osborne

[MOtorboat]

sorry...lazy posting. I originally intended to say played with or coached with. Forgo Osborne

Gruden, Monte Kiffin, Joe Barry, Jeremy Bates, Raheem Morris and Tomlin were all on that Buccaneers coaching staff he played for, and he was John Lynch’s backup. The people he’s been around are impressive, and his coaching rise was also impressive. I don’t disagree at all. He’s just not going anywhere for awhile.

[Jsteve01]

What about Bates? How have his gsmr plans looked?

[Hawgdriver]

I would be wary going with another unproven Coach or NCAA guy. But at the direction this team is going in they need someone to step in at the pro level and FAST to get this team competitive again. Because after the VJ misfire, if Elway screws up the next time he most certainly will not be around.

And the only reason i say Shanahan partly in jest. But if we see more of what we saw yesterday VJ wont last the Season and someone will have to step in immediately.

I thought McD was the worst it can get.

I hope they figure it out!

[aberdien]

Frost has at least 3 years in Nebraska (eternity when he whips that program into shape, which he will).

Why would Shaw leave his cozy Stanford job?

Jim Bob Cooter!

[Nomad]

Frost has at least 3 years in Nebraska (eternity when he whips that program into shape, which he will).

Why would Shaw leave his cozy Stanford job?

Jim Bob Cooter!


That's what I keep asking.

[dogfish]

did you guys watch the rams-vikes game last week? de filippo's squad didn't win, but he wasn't out-coached by mcvay-- his scheme and play calls looked just fine. . .

[tripp]

I think Harbaugh would be an excellent choice if he gets fired. I'm not interested in hiring anymore rookie HC's.

[Jsteve01]

No way harbaugh and John coexist

[ShaneFalco]

Hugh Freeze

https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/meridianstar.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/5/06/5064f2f2-e1c9-11e5-85bf-d714e3a0f32f/56d91c3cb3d8f.image.jpg?resize=1200%2C1414

[MOtorboat]

Hugh Freeze

https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/meridianstar.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/5/06/5064f2f2-e1c9-11e5-85bf-d714e3a0f32f/56d91c3cb3d8f.image.jpg?resize=1200%2C1414

Shotgun Willie’s couldn’t handle that.

[dogfish]

No way harbaugh and John coexist

it's un-possible. . . zero percent chance. . . i think it's extremely unlikely that the next HC will be the big name that fans want. . .

[dogfish]

I'm not interested in hiring anymore rookie HC's.

why? sean mcvay and doug pederson were rookie HCs a couple years ago, and now they look like the best coaches in football who aren't named belichick. . . give me the next aggressive young mind over the john foxes and jeff fishers of the world all day, err day. . . JMO. . .

[The Glue Factory]

why? sean mcvay and doug pederson were rookie HCs a couple years ago, and now they look like the best coaches in football who aren't named belichick. . . give me the next aggressive young mind over the john foxes and jeff fishers of the world all day, err day. . . JMO. . .

The problem is finding that young hotshot. We've rolled the dice twice with young hotshots and experienced old hands each and lost all four times! And that's just looking at the four most recent HC's.

It seems like finding a decent or better HC is just as much a crap shoot as the NFL draft.

[tripp]

why? sean mcvay and doug pederson were rookie HCs a couple years ago, and now they look like the best coaches in football who aren't named belichick. . . give me the next aggressive young mind over the john foxes and jeff fishers of the world all day, err day. . . JMO. . .

Because VJ was a rookie HC and look at him. We signed McD as a rookie HC, and look at him. I don't think it's crazy to think Broncos fans are a little apprehensive about getting a rookie HC given their recent history with them.

[tripp]

The problem is finding that young hotshot. We've rolled the dice twice with young hotshots and experienced old hands each and lost all four times! And that's just looking at the four most recent HC's.

It seems like finding a decent or better HC is just as much a crap shoot as the NFL draft.

Yeah, just because 2 rookie HC's panned out vs the tons of shitty ones still doesn't exactly give me hope. You're right it's all a crap shoot at the end of the day. But I feel like you have more of an idea with what you're getting when you sign an experienced HC. I'm not talking about the Jeff Fisher's of the world either, I'm talking about the Harbaugh's. I know those type of HC's aren't easy to come by, but worth looking for over rookie HC's imo.

[Shazam!]

Tomlin

[Shazam!]

I think Denver needs a proven Coach to restore fundamentals. A la a football rehab like Elway said when he brought back Osweiler. They went with the inexperienced coordinators route twice and failed, even tho McD was a much hotter commodity than VJ ever could have been.

Mike Tomlin would be a great, great guy to provide the leadership needed. I think he has just been with Pitt too long, a change is needed, similar to Shanahan here.

[The Glue Factory]

That's what Fox was after McNumbnutz. I agree we need someone to restore Bronco football in the locker room, I'm leary about Elway's ability to arrive at the best candidate.

[Shazam!]

That's what Fox was after McNumbnutz. I agree we need someone to restore Bronco football in the locker room, I'm leary about Elway's ability to arrive at the best candidate.

Honestly Fox is the kind of Coach Denver needs right now.

[dogfish]

Honestly Fox is the kind of Coach Denver needs right now.

not too shabby!

[The Glue Factory]

Honestly Fox is the kind of Coach Denver needs right now.

Just as he was the kind of coach we needed after McNumbnutz. He just won't bring home any Lombardi's. I'd prefer a coach that will return not only the proper locker room attitude but be able to take us to the promised land.

[Shazam!]

Honestly Fox is the kind of Coach Denver needs right now.

not too shabby!

Im heavy on Tomlin because i expect him to get fired and he will be the best Coach available.

[Poet]

We need an offensive guy, imo. More importantly, we need a damn QB to pair the offensive coach with.

[Simple Jaded]

Scott Frost May not have a choice if he keeps losing, “Total package” ... lololololop ... 0-11.

Paul Chryst, LeFleur or Toub (It’ll be Toub).

The real question who they should bring in to restore Wades defense.

[Northman]

Hey its Jaded!

[dogfish]

i could live with toub, if he brings in a quality offensive coordinator. . . we'll probably get stuck with jim fassel, though. . .

[MOtorboat]

For the umpteenth time...Scott Frost ain’t going anywhere folks. He’s not getting fired. He’s not going to the pros.

[dogfish]

For the umpteenth time...Scott Frost ain’t going anywhere folks. He’s not getting fired. He’s not going to the pros.

i ain't got time to read back through the whole thread. . . who do you want, MOseph?

[MOtorboat]

i ain't got time to read back through the whole thread. . . who do you want, MOseph?

I’m intrigued by LaFleur.

[dogfish]

I’m intrigued by LaFleur.

high on my list as well. . . okay, maybe a better question-- what's your short list ( :naughty: ) of candidates to contact for interviews? would have to be, what, at least 4-5 names?

[MOtorboat]

high on my list as well. . . okay, maybe a better question-- what's your short list ( :naughty: ) of candidates to contact for interviews? would have to be, what, at least 4-5 names?

I haven’t thought too hard about it.

LaFleur, Bieniemy, Mark Helfrich, Lincoln Riley, maybe. I’m not sure. Those are the schemes I like right now, so that’s not really representative of who would be a good head coach.

[elsid13]

If we are looking for new HC, Denver should be looking at OC/DC with some run time as coordinator and highly ranked unit.

[MOtorboat]

Im heavy on Tomlin because i expect him to get fired and he will be the best Coach available.

Your coaching suggestions are gawd awful. Dennison, despite the fact you have hated the o-line performance since ... wait for it ... Dennison was the offensive line coach. Tomlin, because hiring a guy who just got fired is uber brilliant. John Fox, because egads, wut?

[Shazam!]

Im heavy on Tomlin because i expect him to get fired and he will be the best Coach available.

Your coaching suggestions are gawd awful. Dennison, despite the fact you have hated the o-line performance since ... wait for it ... Dennison was the offensive line coach. Tomlin, because hiring a guy who just got fired is uber brilliant. John Fox, because egads, wut?

I did not call for Fox, I said they need a Coach 'like' him ala Tomlin for football rehab.

Dennison was interviewed previously for the job you know... So...

And the OLine is... Wait for it.... Still awful. Yea, Rick Dennisons fault?

Stick to baseball little man.

[Poet]

Why would we need someone like Tomlin in an offensive QB driven league?

[The Glue Factory]

And the OLine is... Wait for it.... Still awful. Yea, Rick Dennisons fault?

So the O-Line showing no improvement makes Dennison a good coach? That's like saying a child's 3rd grade teacher is good when that child failed not just 3rd grade but went on to fail 4th, 5th and 6th grade too.

Dennison sucks and it first showed when Shanny shafted Gibbs in favor of Dennison.

[Poet]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-week-3-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

One of the most interesting storylines of the season so far has been how improved the Broncos’ offensive line looks. They currently sit as the fourth-best line in pass-blocking efficiency and second in run-block grade. Denver hasn’t exactly faced world-beater fronts in Seattle, Oakland and Baltimore, but you can only block the men in front of you. The biggest surprise has been the play of former fifth-round pick Connor McGovern, who has earned a 79.4 overall grade so far this season at right guard.


In other words, a lot of the sacks and pressures are coming from Keenum, who has been noted to hold onto the ball too long.

Keenum sucks, it's not the line.

[Shazam!]

And the OLine is... Wait for it.... Still awful. Yea, Rick Dennisons fault?

So the O-Line showing no improvement makes Dennison a good coach? That's like saying a child's 3rd grade teacher is good when that child failed not just 3rd grade but went on to fail 4th, 5th and 6th grade too.

Dennison sucks and it first showed when Shanny shafted Gibbs in favor of Dennison.

So now the OLine woes are Rick Dennisons fault. smh

[Shazam!]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-week-3-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

One of the most interesting storylines of the season so far has been how improved the Broncos’ offensive line looks. They currently sit as the fourth-best line in pass-blocking efficiency and second in run-block grade. Denver hasn’t exactly faced world-beater fronts in Seattle, Oakland and Baltimore, but you can only block the men in front of you. The biggest surprise has been the play of former fifth-round pick Connor McGovern, who has earned a 79.4 overall grade so far this season at right guard.


In other words, a lot of the sacks and pressures are coming from Keenum, who has been noted to hold onto the ball too long.

Keenum sucks, it's not the line.

Have you watched any games last year and 2016 down the stretch or were you still a Bengals fan

[Poet]

Have you watched any games last year and 2016 down the stretch or were you still a Bengals fan

I've watched every game, and the fact that you have to take a pot shot to push your weak position up is telling. Don't go down that road with me, Shazam. The fact that you can't tell when a QB holds onto the ball too long, fails to step up into a stable pocket, and then gets sacked, while also choosing to not throw the ball away, that's telling. You seem to think that the way this game works it that the line blocks, and the QB has no impact on that at all. That's not how the game works.

You also seem to think that this offensive league with young QB's putting up insane numbers means we need a HC who is weak on scheme and predicated on defense. That's the exact opposite of the situation. I don't know what games you've been watching, but it's the opposite of what everyone else sees.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Scott Frost May not have a choice if he keeps losing, “Total package” ... lololololop ... 0-11.

Paul Chryst, LeFleur or Toub (It’ll be Toub).

The real question who they should bring in to restore Wades defense.
They need 3 more all pros to restore Wades defense.

[Shazam!]

Anyone who is going to try to break it down how the Broncos OLine is anywhere near even mediocre or close to acceptable in the passing game dept hasnt watched a single game in the last... Weeks? Years? Keenum has been pretty bad. I agree. But dont make out like it isnt a problem.

I think its the Tackles because the interior has been great, especially McGovern.

[Buff]

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-week-3-nfl-offensive-line-rankings

One of the most interesting storylines of the season so far has been how improved the Broncos’ offensive line looks. They currently sit as the fourth-best line in pass-blocking efficiency and second in run-block grade. Denver hasn’t exactly faced world-beater fronts in Seattle, Oakland and Baltimore, but you can only block the men in front of you. The biggest surprise has been the play of former fifth-round pick Connor McGovern, who has earned a 79.4 overall grade so far this season at right guard.


In other words, a lot of the sacks and pressures are coming from Keenum, who has been noted to hold onto the ball too long.

Keenum sucks, it's not the line.

If the Denver Broncos are 4th best in pass-blocking efficiency then their methodology for calculating pass blocking efficiency is broken.

[Shazam!]

Ok people! Broncos have one of the top OLines in the League now! If thats what your glasses tell you, great! Bolles is a future Hall of Famer!

The OLine pass protection isn't a problem, its playing at a high level. Okay!

[Poet]

Ok people! Broncos have one of the top OLines in the League now! If thats what your glasses tell you, great! Bolles is a future Hall of Famer!

The OLine pass protection isn't a problem, its playing at a high level. Okay!

When confronted with facts that obliterate your position you turn to pure hyperbole and strawmanning. I'm sorry you cannot support your argument.

[Poet]

If the Denver Broncos are 4th best in pass-blocking efficiency then their methodology for calculating pass blocking efficiency is broken.

A lot of the issues regarding the sacks and hurries aren't on the offensive line. Do I think Denver is a great line? No. But the past two years people pretended that we had the worst line in the league, and that wasn't even close. There were about ten or so lines that were worse. We've been trained to see a sack or a hit and go 'omfg the line' and we've been trained to think that giving up a sack means that the player was terrible the rest of the game.

Denver's pass blocking line isn't great, but it's more than adequate.

[Poet]

Anyone who is going to try to break it down how the Broncos OLine is anywhere near even mediocre or close to acceptable in the passing game dept hasnt watched a single game in the last... Weeks? Years? Keenum has been pretty bad. I agree. But dont make out like it isnt a problem.

I think its the Tackles because the interior has been great, especially McGovern.

You keep talking about how people aren't watching games and yet aside from a few plays from Bolles the tackles have been okay, and I don't even think Bolles is that great, though I've defended him because he's young. Last week you were in the gameday thread, or maybe it was two weeks ago (I am tired so forgive me the dates were wrong) screaming about the tackles giving up sacks and just about everyone else pointed out that the man was covered and Keenum sat in the pocket like a statute. Part of being a good QB is feeling pressure and adjusting to it. Great lines get bailed out by good QB play too, for instance New Orleans is reputed to having a good line this year and what does Brees do very well?

I honestly think your understanding of the game is this: if the QB is playing poorly then it must be the offensive line.

And that's not real, man.

[Shazam!]

Bolles is awesome! Especially in pass protection! Got it! Im out!

[Poet]

Bolles is awesome! Especially in pass protection! Got it! Im out!

Who said he was awesome? Does it bother you that you have to literally strawman a person to support your positions? How do you even function?

[Shazam!]

Bolles is awesome! Especially in pass protection! Got it! Im out!

Who said he was awesome? Does it bother you that you have to literally strawman a person to support your positions? How do you even function?

He is terrible and more of a liability.

Oh wait no. Hes awesome.

[Poet]

He is terrible and more of a liability.

Oh wait no. Hes awesome.

I accept your concession - when you have to put forth positions I don't present you're losing. So your argument is, and not I'm literally making it for you, is that beacuse the LT is suspect the line is bad. Well, the other evidence disputes that, and multiple sacks, again, were also on the QB. But you don't care because a narrative is more important than truth.

You're a nice person, though.

[Buff]

A lot of the issues regarding the sacks and hurries aren't on the offensive line. Do I think Denver is a great line? No. But the past two years people pretended that we had the worst line in the league, and that wasn't even close. There were about ten or so lines that were worse. We've been trained to see a sack or a hit and go 'omfg the line' and we've been trained to think that giving up a sack means that the player was terrible the rest of the game.

Denver's pass blocking line isn't great, but it's more than adequate.

It's not. Full stop. We'll never agree on this.

[Poet]

It's not. Full stop. We'll never agree on this.

It's at worst an average offensive line. I don't think it's great, but there are far worse in the league. There's more to the equation than feast or famine.

[Jsteve01]

high on my list as well. . . okay, maybe a better question-- what's your short list ( :naughty: ) of candidates to contact for interviews? would have to be, what, at least 4-5 names?

I haven’t thought too hard about it.

LaFleur, Bieniemy, Mark Helfrich, Lincoln Riley, maybe. I’m not sure. Those are the schemes I like right now, so that’s not really representative of who would be a good head coach.

Bienemy would be another mcd. And i am not buying that this system is his. It is all Andy Reid. Laughed my ass off watching tear into ware last year after a fumble. ******* hypocrite. Remember fumbling in the open field vs notre dame?

[Jsteve01]

Ok people! Broncos have one of the top OLines in the League now! If thats what your glasses tell you, great! Bolles is a future Hall of Famer!

The OLine pass protection isn't a problem, its playing at a high level. Okay!

When confronted with facts that obliterate your position you turn to pure hyperbole and strawmanning. I'm sorry you cannot support your argument.

Ive been a huge pff fan for years but i have heard more and more people i respect questioning their methodology. See Von not msking their all players of the week after 3 sacks and a forced fumble vs seattle

[Shazam!]

He is terrible and more of a liability.

Oh wait no. Hes awesome.

I accept your concession - when you have to put forth positions I don't present you're losing. So your argument is, and not I'm literally making it for you, is that beacuse the LT is suspect the line is bad. Well, the other evidence disputes that, and multiple sacks, again, were also on the QB. But you don't care because a narrative is more important than truth.

You're a nice person, though.

I didn't concede anything. I know what I watch. Bolles is awful, Veldheer was ok but he is having his own issues.

Hell i didnt even bring it up!

Tomlin may be available as Fox was when he was fired from Carolina. Instant upgrade over VJ. Would Coach to Denver's strengths, great running game and defense is a Coach's dream. I would fear yet another hot coordinator to fail again or a Steve Spurrier.

[Poet]

It is a far cry from these stupid takes that ignore the rest of the situation. Even the eyeball test, which apparently, because of the contents of this thread shows us we need socialized medicine, indicates that the line is fine. Great? No. Good? Maybe not even that, but it's a fine line. FFS, everyone else in the world witnesses Keenum hold onto the ball too long on some of these sacks, but apparently a few of us need the eye doctor.

And occasionally the other team has good players and makes plays too. The standard is either perfection or you're trash, and if one player is suspect then someone everyone else is trash, too.

It's puzzling.

[Jsteve01]

He is terrible and more of a liability.

Oh wait no. Hes awesome.

I accept your concession - when you have to put forth positions I don't present you're losing. So your argument is, and not I'm literally making it for you, is that beacuse the LT is suspect the line is bad. Well, the other evidence disputes that, and multiple sacks, again, were also on the QB. But you don't care because a narrative is more important than truth.

You're a nice person, though.

I didn't concede anything. I know what I watch. Bolles is awful, Veldheer was ok but he is having his own issues.

Hell i didnt even bring it up!

Tomlin may be available as Fox was when he was fired from Carolina. Instant upgrade over VJ. Would Coach to Denver's strengths, great running game and defense is a Coach's dream. I would fear yet another hot coordinator to fail again or a Steve Spurrier.

you win big by risking big. I like tomlin but dont even know if he'll be available. We need a hot offensive mind who can manage people. The eagles last year and the rsms this year are winning with coaches who were qb whisperers.

[Poet]

You're conceding an argument when you can only attack not what your opponent argues, but what you want them to argue.

Tomlin isn't fixing this team. He's not fixing anything - he can't even run a team with a HoF QB and WR on it with a RB putting up numbers, too.

[Jsteve01]

You're conceding an argument when you can only attack not what your opponent argues, but what you want them to argue.

Tomlin isn't fixing this team. He's not fixing anything - he can't even run a team with a HoF QB and WR on it with a RB putting up numbers, too.
Who are you engaging right now? Not sure we disagree

[Poet]

Who are you engaging right now? Not sure we disagree

Both you and Shazam.

[Shazam!]

You're conceding an argument when you can only attack not what your opponent argues, but what you want them to argue.

Bro im not attacking anything. Broncos pass prot is not even close to average. Anyone trying to say this is a stength is delusional. Bolles is horrific and looking like a bust.

But No. Hes fine.

I think all this constant Keenum vitriol from you and a few others has spilled out to other areas. People here wanna make out like theyre Mike Shanahan or something, but were all just fans.

Just like Keenum is a shit QB and the worst player in the League? We supposed to take that seriously too? Ok.

The Broncos Oline in passing sits is not a strength no matter how you spin it and Bolles is awful.

There ARE improvements so im not glass half empty! The inside 3 have been very very effective and they can run the ball because of two young dynamic Backs. But lets not pretend there isnt problems in pass prot. Bolles is a HUGE liability.

[Poet]

I have just taken the time out of my day to read pundits and other rankings. The worst thing I could find was the Broncos ranked 18th at pass protection. The best was fourth. Somewhere in the middle of that is good to average. You only fixate on Bolles and address nothing else. It's a bad way to guage line play, and you refuse to ever admit that Keenum has caused sacks that are on him because he holds onto the ball too long. You're seeing only what you want.

Keenum has at times been a truly awful QB and even when the line played well in the first two weeks he was bad. Look at his entire career and tell me he's not a bad QB, and then tell me the truth.

I'm not spining anything, and you're literally telling me what my arguments are, which is just intellectually dishonest. I like you, you're a nice enough guy, but you're blind.

[Shazam!]

I have just taken the time out of my day to read pundits and other rankings. The worst thing I could find was the Broncos ranked 18th at pass protection. The best was fourth. Somewhere in the middle of that is good to average. You only fixate on Bolles and address nothing else. It's a bad way to guage line play, and you refuse to ever admit that Keenum has caused sacks that are on him because he holds onto the ball too long. You're seeing only what you want.

Keenum has at times been a truly awful QB and even when the line played well in the first two weeks he was bad. Look at his entire career and tell me he's not a bad QB, and then tell me the truth.

I'm not spining anything, and you're literally telling me what my arguments are, which is just intellectually dishonest. I like you, you're a nice enough guy, but you're blind.

Its been the weak link of the offense for years man. Years. And Bolles should be benched. He is terrible and may be the weak Link.

Manning. Siemien. Keenum. QBs under constant duress will have shaken confidence.

See Eli Manning. Watch the NYG offense and what that Line has done to him. Hes shellshocked from the beatings.

[Shazam!]

Besides stop draggung it off topic. Coaches. Tomlin. Better than VJ. All i was saying.

[Poet]

Not offensive minded, not x's and o's, not a QB developer, but is probably an actual leader of men, and a player's coach. It wouldn't be the end of the world, I guess.

[Shazam!]

Not offensive minded, not x's and o's, not a QB developer, but is probably an actual leader of men, and a player's coach. It wouldn't be the end of the world, I guess.

I think he would be exactly what the Broncos need right now as far as discipline and fundamentals. He is a proven winner. I know Pitts defense is like wet garbage on a hot day right now, but they've had a lot of turnover and he's been there for what, like 10+ years now? He'd be a good.solid option if Elway went the experiences winner route.

[Northman]

King is just flinging bullets in here, he dont care who he hit. Lmao

[Poet]

King is just flinging bullets in here, he dont care who he hit. Lmao

This is what happens when you give a Viking a heater.

[Poet]

We bout to name change to The Style Don and go back to the old days.

[Northman]

King has gone all Berzerker!!!

[Valar Morghulis]

The return of Don stylisimo!!

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

This thread be like:

:throwrock:

[Poet]

This thread be like:

:throwrock:

You’re not wrong.

[Poet]

The return of Don stylisimo!!

I fear I’m going to a dark place.

[The Glue Factory]

So now the OLine woes are Rick Dennisons fault. smh

Your comment leads me to a few different conclusions:

1. London called wanting their village idiot back
2. You don't know how to debate
3. You lack the ability to use reason and logic
4. Your emotions are running away with you

I suppose it could be a combination of some or all of those. But based on your responses to not just myself, but King as well, I'll simply bow out of this discussion now rather than deal with your childishness.
Should you have questions, re-read King's responses for details.

[Shazam!]

Broncos have a GREAT OLine! Yay!

[Jsteve01]

Who are you engaging right now? Not sure we disagree

Both you and Shazam.

Mkay buckshot. I actually agree with you. Quit flashing Nam and stay on topic

[UnderArmour]

Its been the weak link of the offense for years man. Years. And Bolles should be benched. He is terrible and may be the weak Link.

Manning. Siemien. Keenum. QBs under constant duress will have shaken confidence.

See Eli Manning. Watch the NYG offense and what that Line has done to him. Hes shellshocked from the beatings.

Bolles got overwhelmed by KC, that doesn't make him terrible. Kansas City has one of the better pass rushes in the NFL, and has many many OTs look stupid. Unfortunately, Butt tore his ACL, so if the game plan was to run 2 TE sets the bulk of the game, that went right up in shreds.

As far as benching Bolles: Veldheer, if healthy, could definitely slide in at LT and do a better job. Turner has looked great at RT in relief of Veldheer so far, and did not look too awful at the end of last year. Turner may actually develop into a viable long-term option at the position if he keeps this up. IF the Broncos did go this route though, it would be extremely risky to rely on Veldheer to stay healthy. It would also kill any chance Bolles would ever have of developing into a long-term guy at tackle.

Not to mention, if the Broncos wanted to draft a tackle to replace Bolles, other teams would become aware of it for draft day. The 49ers came completely out of left field to take McGlinchey ahead of the Raiders, and that exact scenario would play out again if teams knew that the Broncos were eyeing a tackle. Keeping Bolles in the lineup at tackle would keep teams from trading up ahead of us, even if the long-term plan is to convert Bolles to guard or RT.

[Poet]

Mkay buckshot. I actually agree with you. Quit flashing Nam and stay on topic

I disagreed with him on one sentence and then addressed you on the other.

Get you a poster who can do both.

[Shazam!]

Its been the weak link of the offense for years man. Years. And Bolles should be benched. He is terrible and may be the weak Link.

Manning. Siemien. Keenum. QBs under constant duress will have shaken confidence.

See Eli Manning. Watch the NYG offense and what that Line has done to him. Hes shellshocked from the beatings.

Bolles got overwhelmed by KC, that doesn't make him terrible. Kansas City has one of the better pass rushes in the NFL, and has many many OTs look stupid. Unfortunately, Butt tore his ACL, so if the game plan was to run 2 TE sets the bulk of the game, that went right up in shreds.

As far as benching Bolles: Veldheer, if healthy, could definitely slide in at LT and do a better job. Turner has looked great at RT in relief of Veldheer so far, and did not look too awful at the end of last year. Turner may actually develop into a viable long-term option at the position if he keeps this up. IF the Broncos did go this route though, it would be extremely risky to rely on Veldheer to stay healthy. It would also kill any chance Bolles would ever have of developing into a long-term guy at tackle.

Not to mention, if the Broncos wanted to draft a tackle to replace Bolles, other teams would become aware of it for draft day. The 49ers came completely out of left field to take McGlinchey ahead of the Raiders, and that exact scenario would play out again if teams knew that the Broncos were eyeing a tackle. Keeping Bolles in the lineup at tackle would keep teams from trading up ahead of us, even if the long-term plan is to convert Bolles to guard or RT.

He was awfully terrible in Baltimore too. He is a liability amd should be benched. Turner looks to be better and should have a look.

Does it surprise me that the right guys arent getting the time they should have? No... See Booker D.

Im hoping if they cut King it sends a message.

[UnderArmour]

He was awfully terrible in Baltimore too. He is a liability amd should be benched. Turner looks to be better and should have a look.

Does it surprise me that the right guys arent getting the time they should have? No... See Booker D.

Im hoping if they cut King it sends a message.

Baltimore also has a good pass rush. Bolles should do fine against New York, probably struggle against the Rams, struggle against the Chargers twice (Bosa will be back), struggle against Houston, against KC again, and possibly struggle against Myles Garrett.

You're absolutely right to be concerned, because that's half the Broncos schedule, but there are only a handful of left tackles in the league that don't struggle or need help against these teams.

[Shazam!]

I think Bolles' play in obvious passing sits and their lack of a game breaking TE is what is killing them on the Line. Leary, Paradis and McGovern have done very well and it shows on the ground. Tackle continues to drag the whole Offense down. I know it sounds simple but it is i think

[Simple Jaded]

They should Move Bolles to C to succeed Parastiff, that’s unless they like paying top dollar for average players ... wait ... shit.

[NightTerror218]

Rams game could be his last game. I would not fire VJ before that game like feeding new coach to wolves

[Poet]

They should Move Bolles to C to succeed Parastiff, that’s unless they like paying top dollar for average players ... wait ... shit.

Why do you hate the best center in football? Paradis is a god and you are far too harsh on him. He's played at an all-pro level the past three years, and he's on essentially on a hall of fame pace.

[Shazam!]

They should Move Bolles to C to succeed Parastiff, that’s unless they like paying top dollar for average players ... wait ... shit.

Why do you hate the best center in football? Paradis is a god and you are far too harsh on him. He's played at an all-pro level the past three years, and he's on essentially on a hall of fame pace.

Paradis and Leary have played well. McGovern is a first year starter and i think he can get better. Tackles are just God-awful.

[Simple Jaded]

Parastiff is criminally overrated.

[Poet]

Parastiff is criminally overrated.

This is why I beat you.

[Simple Jaded]

This is why I beat you.

Should trade him and Scappy-Doo for five 1st round picks.

[Poet]

Should trade him and Scappy-Doo for five 1st round picks.

I'd never trade you.

[Simple Jaded]

I'd never trade you.

Clearly, you negotiated my No-Trade claus, I’m referring to Case Romo.

[Poet]

Clearly, you negotiated my No-Trade clays.

Oh, I lied about that so I could spend more time with your wife. She's pretty.

[Simple Jaded]

Oh, I lied about that so I could spend more time with your wife. She's pretty.

Sancho?

[Poet]

Sancho?

I call her bendy.

[Simple Jaded]

I call her bendy.

She is flexible, .

[Poet]

She is flexible, .

She has to be since she puts up with your shit.

[goodforubud]

Rick Dennison

Genius, we could then go 0-16 for several years strait and get the best player in the draft for years!

[Simple Jaded]

She has to be since she puts up with your shit.

That’s how she was Sainted, she’s not even religious.

[MOtorboat]

GFUB is killing it!

[Hawgdriver]

GFUB is killing it!

Not too shabby.

[Broncoknight30]

John DeFillipo

[Poet]

If we are doing retreadsid like Pete Carrol

If we are doing younger selections I like him bob cooter. I just want a talented and hard working beast.

[spikerman]

What about John Harbaugh? If the Ravens tank there’s a chance he could be fired. I’m just spit balling.

[Poet]

What about John Harbaugh? If the Ravens tank there’s a chance he could be fired. I’m just spit balling.

I don't think we could be upset with that. He's always been able to find some nice offensive coordinators, so it's not like wouldn't have someone to help a youngster QB out.

[dogfish]

bill cowher!!111!!11!



sorry, somebody had to. . .

[Shazam!]

Rick Dennison

Genius, we could then go 0-16 for several years strait and get the best player in the draft for years!

You clearly didn't watch the NYJ game. Anyone could do better, myself included.

I want a former Bronco.