The truth about the 2018 Broncos

[Hawgdriver]

Here it is. I am going to put it out there, what we have in 2018.

Case is decent. A bit of an upgrade from Siemian, who is a fine NFL QB. A good backup with a capable line. Case has some years and now some swag, can be a leader. But he's no NFL QB like a Rodgers or a Wilson. Still, you can win lots of NFL games with him if your team and coaching is solid.

We have no backup on this roster.

The WR position is an embarrassment of riches. Not only do the Broncos have the best tandem in the league, but Sutton and the dude from Penn St. are already legit. Sutton is a steal, should have been top half of the first round, and the other dude will be that #3 WR that fantasy owners reach for in their draft. Plus we have talent at 5 and 6 that makes a stable and often impressive dude like Sunshine expendable. Aaron Rodgers would cream for this WR set. Yes, a full All State commercial with the Denver WR corps.

Did I mention Sutton?

TE is so weak. That is, unless Jake Butt is an 80% snap count guy who can block and get separation. We'll see. Tall task for a dude with 0 NFL snaps.

The O line is finally decent but if we lose a tackle all bets are off. Garcia is guard depth, but he hasn't shown much pass pro competence to this point in his career. Still, O line excuse mode appears resolved.

RB is fine. I don't like Hendersons, but if the RB Hendo doesn't put the ball on the ground, this group is fine. Totally fine. Royce might even be good, he's got the right kind of nugget to complement Case for this offense. To be real with you, I think they are going to kick serious ******* ass.

On the D--Talib will have the last laugh. Like, a laugh with some tears. ****. Roby will be Roby. A dude that makes you cream in one moment, and marvel at ineptitude the next. That's Roby. He'll get picked on by the modern day Mannings. And if not him, then definitely the #3 guy, who was playing against guys who wish they had a PS invite this year. Then again, maybe the talent on the roster--I mean Cravens and Simmons--will be used somehow to mitigate this hole. That's on Woods.

Linebacker is fine if Marshall ain't hurt. He's a baller. Davis is a baller but has GI Joe Action Figure disease. :lol: Love you, Todd, but c'mon man you know turning them hips and tracking a Freeman on a well-designed play ain't yo thang. They can handle their business and maintain a league top 5 against the rush. They are legit good ballers against the run, you watch.

The D line might be the best in the league. Some injury/depth type things here, but all teams have that. This is why the Broncos might be playing in Feb. The unit is without peer and might actually be all time if Ray and Chubb both max out. Both of those dudes are scary good. If we have to trade Ray, please get us either a combo of solid CB + OL depth, or legit #2 QB + pick.

ST without fumblehands will be fine. The UDFA Buff should be thrown into the PR/KR role, idc if he's shifty or has the shimmy shake. He's reliable and shown genuine ability behind QB on a handoff.

The team is surprisingly without fatal flaw. That means this is the type of team a good HC and staff could take to make a playoff run. Denver has the right culture. It's all about whether or not VJ treats the NFL like some sleepy coed or crumbles under the strain. What I mean by that is 7-9, we ain't got no HC right now. Who TF leaves MacKenzie in after all those turnovers in the middle of a losing streak? Did he think more goal-line muffed punts would help?

Damn...that dude better redact his process or something. With a Sharpie. And socks. I don't know what that means.

Plus, we got this "Lynch Offense." Elway said the offense was designed for Paxton. The dude in your headset with the high pitched voice geeking out over the kills he got last round. Great PUBG homie, but don't let him near the keys of an NFL franchise.

So, to sum it up, it's a great roster, but the officer corps is going to run them into machine gun nests. I don't have much faith in the leadership.

Good leaders would have shitcanned MacKenzie, Paxton, and IRman to give dudes like Edibali (at their position) or Sloter or Traylor their job. Not because their are obviously better or have higher expected win production, but because they demonstrate the guts it takes to build a championship team. I don't see that.

Anyway, it's a good team, and if leadership can perform, we'll have a great season.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

This write up would be complete with a prediction.

[Shazam!]

The Oline is 'decent'? Best WR tandem in the League?

Stopped reading.

Thanks for your effort but we need to see tomorrow night before making all these assumptions. Your points are all valid and the strengths and weaknesses are known by all.

[Hawgdriver]

This write up would be complete with a prediction.

I called a 7-9.

But here is where I put on a little shimmy shake. It's a 12-4 roster with a 3-13 coaching staff.

[Shazam!]

This write up would be complete with a prediction.

I called a 7-9.

But here is where I put on a little shimmy shake. It's a 12-4 roster with a 3-13 coaching staff.

I agree with that if all i have to go on is last year. Lets hope VJ grew into it.

[Buff]

7-9 or 8-8 feels about right. I see an improved, but average team with a HC who adds zero value from a strategic standpoint & who is almost certain to be fired before next season. I have this weird pessimistic feeling that I can't shake after attending training camp last week.

If we have any injuries at o-line or in the secondary we might be screwed. We are paper thin there - we're basically relying on Veldheer to fix a completely dysfunctional group. When I was watching OL vs DL 1:1s at training camp, it was an unfair fight - they were just getting dominated repeatedly.

We might not have a starting NFL caliber TE on the roster.

I'm cautiously optimistic that we will at least be competitive (as opposed to last year when the ******* Miami Dolphins were running up the score on us with glee) and if we get lucky a few times we could be competing for a playoff spot... But I think the ceiling is capped as I don't see us being able to go toe to toe with the master tacticians as long as VJ is at the helm.

[Nomad]

We squeak out a win against a team we're not supposed to beat.

10-6 and a possible wildcard spot. :D

[NightTrainLayne]

"A 12-4 roster with a 3-13 coaching staff".

Brilliantly put.

[Freyaka]

I called a 7-9.

But here is where I put on a little shimmy shake. It's a 12-4 roster with a 3-13 coaching staff.

It's just brutally disgusting how accurate this is...

[Northman]

We squeak out a win against a team we're not supposed to beat.

10-6 and a possible wildcard spot. :D

Thats the record i predicted because our schedule seems pretty favorable. And thats with me having a lot of doubts about Keenum so im kind of surprised i have a more positive outlook than other people on here. Lol

[Hawgdriver]

I'm still super stoked about the season. More so than the last two years. Maybe VJ, Woods, and Musgrave really dialed it in during the offseason. We'll know by the end of September if their game is tight.

[BeefStew25]

When 7 fires VJ, is Musgrave the interim?

[Buff]

When 7 fires VJ, is Musgrave the interim?

Him or Kollar, probably.

[BeefStew25]

Him or Kollar, probably.

Like I bet Kubes and 7 and VJ meet. Then VJ leaves and Kubes is like, “Road Dog wtf. Why’d you hire him?”

[Buff]

Like I bet Kubes and 7 and VJ meet. Then VJ leaves and Kubes is like, “Road Dog wtf. Why’d you hire him?”

Right? Kubes is like, "We could have had Junior Shanahan if you had gotten over your grudge at his dad."

[HORSEPOWER 56]

Like I bet Kubes and 7 and VJ meet. Then VJ leaves and Kubes is like, “Road Dog wtf. Why’d you hire him?”

I think it’s more like, “man, was I wrong about him!”

VJ is Kubes’ boy more than Elway’s. Kubes wanted him as our DC over Wade, remember? We lucked out the second the stupid Bungles decided to block his hiring by us. Wade came and SB 50 was delivered. Had Kubes gotten what he wanted, we never would’ve had that Super Bowl. Note what VJ did to a pretty good (personnel wise) Miami defense? Yeah...

[Shazam!]

Like I bet Kubes and 7 and VJ meet. Then VJ leaves and Kubes is like, “Road Dog wtf. Why’d you hire him?”

Right? Kubes is like, "We could have had Junior Shanahan if you had gotten over your grudge at his dad."

That is disappointing.

[DenBronx]

Like I bet Kubes and 7 and VJ meet. Then VJ leaves and Kubes is like, “Road Dog wtf. Why’d you hire him?”

Right? Kubes is like, "We could have had Junior Shanahan if you had gotten over your grudge at his dad."

That is disappointing.


Yeah, we whiffed big time by not hiring Kyle Shanahan and retaining Wade. I want to let this go but I just can't.

[Tangerine]

Here's the thing, terrible coaches have been dragged to Super Bowl by talented rosters, horrible coaches like Bill Callahan and Jim Caldwell went to the Super Bowl, they were then exposed in later years after the talent level fell off. Heck, Jim Caldwell almost went 16-0 and won the Super Bowl, if not for resting the starters and a well timed onsides kick.

If the roster is good enough, VJ likely won't hold them back, at least anymore than Jim Caldwell did in '09. The question is how good is this roster? Is it good enough to overcome VJ? That we don't know yet, a lot of young players need to step up and Keenum needs to continue the pace he started last year.

[NightTrainLayne]

Here's the thing, terrible coaches have been dragged to Super Bowl by talented rosters, horrible coaches like Bill Callahan and Jim Caldwell went to the Super Bowl, they were then exposed in later years after the talent level fell off. Heck, Jim Caldwell almost went 16-0 and won the Super Bowl, if not for resting the starters and a well timed onsides kick.

If the roster is good enough, VJ likely won't hold them back, at least anymore than Jim Caldwell did in '09. The question is how good is this roster? Is it good enough to overcome VJ? That we don't know yet, a lot of young players need to step up and Keenum needs to continue the pace he started last year.

Man, I haven't seen Mike Hawk in forever! It's good Mike Hawk could pop in this afternoon.

[Tangerine]

Man, I haven't seen Mike Hawk in forever! It's good Mike Hawk could pop in this afternoon.

Mike Hawk likes to lurk in the bushes, and only pop out if he gets excited enough...

[BeefStew25]

Right? Kubes is like, "We could have had Junior Shanahan if you had gotten over your grudge at his dad."

Then 7 is like, “Pop a Prilosec, grand mal boi.”

[Shazam!]

Here's the thing, terrible coaches have been dragged to Super Bowl by talented rosters, horrible coaches like Bill Callahan and Jim Caldwell went to the Super Bowl, they were then exposed in later years after the talent level fell off. Heck, Jim Caldwell almost went 16-0 and won the Super Bowl, if not for resting the starters and a well timed onsides kick.

If the roster is good enough, VJ likely won't hold them back, at least anymore than Jim Caldwell did in '09. The question is how good is this roster? Is it good enough to overcome VJ? That we don't know yet, a lot of young players need to step up and Keenum needs to continue the pace he started last year.

Was that the case with Shanahan? Is that the point

[Canmore]

Man, I haven't seen Mike Hawk in forever! It's good Mike Hawk could pop in this afternoon.

I was going to say the same thing.

[FanInAZ]

23 reply and no one has yet post:

I want the truth!

I can handle the truth!

[slim]

23 reply and no one has yet post:

I want the truth!

I can handle the truth!

Nice try, but that's not the quote.

[Freyaka]

Man, I haven't seen Mike Hawk in forever! It's good Mike Hawk could pop in this afternoon.

You should consult your physician about some pills for that

[FanInAZ]

Nice try, but that's not the quote.

So I modified it to suit my fancy, so higher King to sue me.

[slim]

So I modified it to suit my fancy, so higher King to sue me.

I wouldn't hire King to clean my toilet.

[Nomad]

Nice try, but that's not the quote.

LoL!

[Nomad]

I wouldn't hire King to clean my toilet.

Punter King, or BF King?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

When I first saw this thread I thought we were drawing straws for our beloved resident poster.

[Cugel]

Yeah, we whiffed big time by not hiring Kyle Shanahan and retaining Wade. I want to let this go but I just can't.

The worst part is that I think Shanahan didn't get the job in part because he wanted a new QB and no part of Paxton Lynch/Trevor Siemian and Joseph was like a grateful puppy who would lick Elway's hand and say "Oh, boy! Paxton is your guy? Sure thing! Paxton is tall."

He wanted more of an independent direction than Elway wanted to give. He wanted more of a "yes" man who would do what the "organization" i.e. Elway wanted. Shanahan would have wanted to hire his own coaches (although he would have wanted to keep Wade).

But, Billy Musgrave would NOT have been the OC. Shanahan is his own coordinator and calls all the plays himself, and Elway wanted to keep Musgrave and promote Joe Woods. He also did not want to pay Wade a new contract (Woods was cheaper), and Shanahan the most lucrative contract in the league.


Former NFL executive Michael Lombardi joined The Ringer’s NFL podcast and told us something new about head coach Kyle Shanahan: He has no offset language in his contract.

“There’s no offset clause in your contract, which is significant in the NFL,” Lombardi said as part of a larger topic. “Which means if Kyle Shanahan gets fired in year two, he gets all his money and can double dip, which is unheard of in the NFL.” (http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/23/kyle-shanahan-has-no-offset-language-in-his-contract-report/)

Jim Tomsula had offset language in his contract, and now he’s being paid to coach defensive line for the Redskins. Let’s say Washington is paying him $800,000 and the 49ers owed him $3 million. The offset language means Jed York would pay Tomsula $2.2 million instead. It’s language that is in nearly every NFL contract, including players. It’s advantageous for ownership to have these clauses to save money.

So while Shanahan was insistent at his opening press conference that he didn’t demand full control of the roster or other football operations leverage points, he did make sure he set himself up with the sweetest contract in the league.

“I’ve been in a lot of different organizations and there’s lots of things that I believe are important to consistently win and to be able to talk to Jed realistically where we thought the team was at and where we thought it could go and to not hold anything back and to see how he reacted and to understand his commitment,” Shanahan said at his opening presser. “When a guy is committed and gives you a six-year contract and shows that he’s willing to give you some time.”

It probably forced York to bite his knuckles in private room, but after ridding himself of three coaches in three seasons, the CEO had to expect ridiculous contract demands from arguably the most qualified coaching candidate on the market.

That means Shanahan basically has a 6 year guaranteed contract. They can fire him before 6 years, but if they do, they will pay him the full value of his contract, PLUS he can go out and get another coaching job AND what he gets from that new job will NOT offset what he is owed by the Broncos!
'
He can "double-dip" which as the article points out "is unheard of in the NFL" for obvious reasons. If you fire your coach and somebody else hires him, they don't want to have to still pay him for another 3 years or something. And with Shanahan they will. It's a big risk.

And one Elway was unwilling to pay. But, Shanahan turns into a top NFL coach (which it looks like he will) then it was a big mistake, because you'd want to keep him around for 6 years anyway and you just didn't hire him because you were being cheap and unwilling to take a chance.

[slim]

Punter King, or BF King?

Yes.

[Nomad]

Yes.

LoL!

[Hawgdriver]

I'm glad this first game went so poorly overall. Reset expectations. Light a fire. Got a weird vibe about Broncos leadership I don't like. Like everything good recently was all PFM. I don't like this feeling.

[Nomad]

I'm glad this first game went so poorly overall. Reset expectations. Light a fire. Got a weird vibe about Broncos leadership I don't like. Like everything good recently was all PFM. I don't like this feeling.

The team will gel.

[nevcraw]

Kinda Glad they got bashed last night. Too much hype out of camp. Lynch gotta go. He’s still a project and light may never come on. Time to cut bait. Kelly is a way better qb then Lynch already. And boy does he got some swagger. A long way to go but great start.
Great to see IM get that punt return to given him some confidence. I’m not in the camp of cutting a rookie with that kind of talent because he had a bad first year.
Lots to work on before the Seahawks but feeling optimistic about a turnaround season.

[Shazam!]

I'm glad this first game went so poorly overall. Reset expectations. Light a fire. Got a weird vibe about Broncos leadership I don't like. Like everything good recently was all PFM. I don't like this feeling.

The team will gel.

We said that in 2008 Lol