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View Full Version : Coach Joseph calls out DT, issues challenge



Northman
03-29-2017, 05:27 PM
http://www.12up.com/posts/4788418-broncos-coach-calls-out-broncos-star-wr-demaryius-thomas?a_aid=41091


While at the NFL's annual coaches meetings, Joseph said he wanted Demaryius Thomas to work out the kinks in his game and become a consistently dominant force in the passing game for the Broncos.

The Broncos longtime No. 1 option has had plenty of high moments, like his 1,619 receiving yards in 2014 or his 80-yard overtime touchdown catch for the win over the Steelers in the playoffs. But those plays have been undermined by an extensive history of dropped passes.


For instance, Thomas was unreliable at times last year, dropping seven passes and losing two fumbles, according to USA Today.


"I want 88 to be a dominant player all the time, Joseph said Tuesday as reported by USA Today. I dont want him to ease into games. I want him to be a guy to step out. Its time."

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 05:30 PM
http://www.12up.com/posts/4788418-broncos-coach-calls-out-broncos-star-wr-demaryius-thomas?a_aid=41091

#MOdissonance

Buff
03-29-2017, 05:54 PM
Did he pronounce his name correctly at least?

BeefStew25
03-29-2017, 06:13 PM
He beat the steelers. Man that was awesome.

MOtorboat
03-29-2017, 06:26 PM
Meanwhile, "we love our quarterbacks!"

turftoad
03-29-2017, 06:45 PM
It's pretty tough to be dominant with sub par OL and QB play.

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 06:50 PM
At some point someone should rein in the noise. It's not 'calling out'. It's placing leadership expectations on your best offensive player, telling him you need him to be man. Usually, he's the man.

BeefStew25
03-29-2017, 06:58 PM
Meanwhile, "we love our quarterbacks!"

Oh you just stop. 2nd year and rookie.

King87
03-29-2017, 09:02 PM
Yeah, the all-pro caliber WR is at fault for not being consistent on our offense last season...

Meanwhile he's really fond of the QB who was one of the worst starters in the entire ******* league.

ShaneFalco
03-29-2017, 09:21 PM
https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61zhnFCrfnL._UX679_.jpg


https://www.amazon.com/Boss-Seller-Funny-Trevor-Siemian-Sleeve/dp/B01LN9GYUQ%3Fpsc%3D1%26SubscriptionId%3DAKIAIMWEOG IQ5KDQVZRQ%26tag%3Dpriceads-20%26linkCode%3Dsp1%26camp%3D2025%26creative%3D165 953%26creativeASIN%3DB01LN9GYUQ

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 09:34 PM
Yeah, the all-pro caliber WR is at fault for not being consistent on our offense last season...

Meanwhile he's really fond of the QB who was one of the worst starters in the entire ******* league.

Those were not his words. These are all your words. They are lousy words.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 09:36 PM
King and Mo, you guys are my brothers, but it's amusing how triggered this quote has the two of you. :D

ShaneFalco
03-29-2017, 09:37 PM
i wear that trevor siemian shirt to work

Denver Native (Carol)
03-29-2017, 09:40 PM
Thought this would fit well in this thread

Patrick Smyth‏Verified account @psmyth12 25 Dec 2016

Happy 29th birthday to Broncos WR @DemaryiusT, whose 592 career catches & 8396 rec yds both are 7th most in NFL history thru 28 yrs.

King87
03-29-2017, 09:45 PM
King and Mo, you guys are my brothers, but it's amusing how triggered this quote has the two of you. :D

I find it so stupid to call out one of the best players in the league while coddling a QB who is demonstrably average.

Hey, DT, we need you to do more for us!

Hey coach, you find me a QB who can throw me the ******* ball.

/crickets.

Imagine how bad TS would have been if he didn't have one of the best WR tandems in the entire ******* game.

ShaneFalco
03-29-2017, 09:47 PM
king what size ?

ill send you a Siemian work shirt too

King87
03-29-2017, 09:48 PM
king what size ?

ill send you a Siemian work shirt too

If I wanted to wear trash I'd still be sporting Cincinnati jerseys. ;)

ShaneFalco
03-29-2017, 09:53 PM
when you give your rebuttal to the judge he will know you support the hero of Denver.

And he will tremble.

King87
03-29-2017, 09:55 PM
when you give your rebuttal to the judge he will know you support the hero of Denver.

And he will tremble.

Man, I love you. Never change. You're my boy.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:17 PM
King, Mo, you really don't see why he'd try to light a fire under an established vet who tends to be inconsistent at times over two young players still finding their way?

MOtorboat
03-29-2017, 10:22 PM
King, Mo, you really don't see why he'd try to light a fire under an established vet who tends to be inconsistent at times over two young players still finding their way?

Well, I made one sarcastic remark, and have in no way indicated I don't understand.

It just seems unnecessary to call out the guy who has five straight years of 90 catches and 1,000 yards publicly. Seems a little nonsensical. There's more players that need a kick in the ass on offense than Thomas.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:23 PM
King, Mo, you really don't see why he'd try to light a fire under an established vet who tends to be inconsistent at times over two young players still finding their way?

How is he inconsistent? He's consistently excellent. You're not going to light much of a fire by going after an elite position player who only falls off when he has utter shit at QB.

I remember when Pete Carroll talked of Russell Wilson - he said things like 'if he wants to be big time, and I think he is, he has to win in the fourth quarter'. I remember Belichick being tough on a young Tom Brady.

This actually worries me a bit.

dogfish
03-29-2017, 10:30 PM
now this is how you lead men!


:first:

Jsteve01
03-29-2017, 10:31 PM
it completely worries me. You got a great dude who's the leader in the community who admittedly is had an issue with the drops that is a High character guy like they said 7th fastest to those yards through age 28 and that's after playing a year with freaking Tebow then you factor in all the off-the-field stuff he's dealt with in his career including having his whom he had never even really been around in his grown life get out of prison last year. I think the guys doing pretty well. Sure I would love him to have as few drops as Sanders. But guess what? Sanders gets open a lot because of Demaryius Thomas. You want to reduce his Drops? Make him work with the quarterbacks a little bit extra after practice spend some extra time with the jugs machine but calling him out in the offseason at the owners meetings is ridiculous

King87
03-29-2017, 10:32 PM
now this is how you lead men!


:first:

I'm still mad at you, by the way. Yelling at me for defending myself from someone who attacked me! That's not how you lead me! That's not how you make me a better poster.

You are, mirroring Vance Joseph in this regard.

In all actual seriousness, I sure as shit hope that he's going to be a guy who actually does motivate people.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:32 PM
How is he inconsistent? He's consistently excellent. You're not going to light much of a fire by going after an elite position player who only falls off when he has utter shit at QB.

I remember when Pete Carroll talked of Russell Wilson - he said things like 'if he wants to be big time, and I think he is, he has to win in the fourth quarter'. I remember Belichick being tough on a young Tom Brady.

This actually worries me a bit.

It's too early to say for Lynch, but I think Siemian is already working as hard as he possibly can. He has to be to have become a starter so quickly from being a 7th round pick. No amount of tough love is going to give him more talent.

DT has all the talent in the world, but he is inconsistent. Don't read me his stats, we all know his stats. The truth is, if you watch games and don't just read the stats (and I know you do), you can see he drops more passes than he should. It's just a fact. I'm sure coach Joseph has seen the same thing on film or he wouldn't be making these comments.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:34 PM
How is he inconsistent? He's consistently excellent. You're not going to light much of a fire by going after an elite position player who only falls off when he has utter shit at QB.

I remember when Pete Carroll talked of Russell Wilson - he said things like 'if he wants to be big time, and I think he is, he has to win in the fourth quarter'. I remember Belichick being tough on a young Tom Brady.

This actually worries me a bit.

Also this part is just false. He had his fair share of drops with Manning as QB too.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:36 PM
It's too early to say for Lynch, but I think Siemian is already working as hard as he possibly can. He has to be to have become a starter so quickly from being a 7th round pick. No amount of tough love is going to give him more talent.

DT has all the talent in the world, but he is inconsistent. Don't read me his stats, we all know his stats. The truth is, if you watch games and don't just read the stats (and I know you do), you can see he drops more passes than he should. It's just a fact. I'm sure coach Joseph has seen the same thing on film or he wouldn't be making these comments.

DT has drops - so does just about every other big time WR. He wasn't even in the top fifty in drop percentage this past year. In fact, he's so good that what a lot of fans call drops wouldn't even come close to being scored as a drop by anyone who isn't a Denver fan. But Pete Carroll wasn't exactly dealing with a uber talented monster in his QB - he still didn't shy from calling him out. Tom Brady was a sixth rounder.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:38 PM
Also this part is just false. He had his fair share of drops with Manning as QB too.

Having drops isn't failing as a WR when you're putting up huge numbers. Otherwise the vast majority of Pro Bowl WR's are failing.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:39 PM
Having drops isn't failing as a WR when you're putting up huge numbers. Otherwise the vast majority of Pro Bowl WR's are failing.

King, you are better than to put words in my mouth like that. That shit wouldn't fly in a courtroom. Where did I say he is "failing as a WR". I have never said or implied anything close to that.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:41 PM
King, you are better than to put words in my mouth like that. That shit wouldn't fly in a courtroom. Where did I say he is "failing as a WR". I have never said or implied anything close to that.

You put words in my mouth. Go back and reread.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:43 PM
You put words in my mouth. Go back and reread.

You used the words "failing as a WR", as if it were something I said or implied.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:46 PM
He wasn't inconsistent under Manning. I said he only falls off when he has shitty QB's. You said that was false because he had drops with Manning. I took a pretty tame interpretation of your words.

I'm saying he had drops with Manning, but so does just about every other big time WR sans like two guys. On top of that, I said he wasn't failing, you seemed to say he was failing under Manning because of his drops.

We can reclarify as the semantics aren't the main parts of what either one of us are speaking about.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:47 PM
I'm going to paste VJ's quote again as I feel people are blowing it up way bigger than it is:

"I want 88 to be a dominant player all the time,” Joseph said Tuesday as reported by USA Today. “I don’t want him to ease into games. I want him to be a guy to step out. It’s time."

He's not saying DT sucks or is failing or anything like that. Just that he'd like to see more consistency. I don't see the issue with that. Also, just because he isn't publicly calling out his QBs doesn't mean he isn't coaching them just as tough in practice.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:49 PM
He's consistently excellent, doesn't actually have the egregious drops that we say he does, is attributed to have more drops by fans than what is actually scored as a drop, and is compared to the guy whose life he makes easier (Sanders).

Denver fans seem to underrate DT. He should be talking about how much he believes in our QB's but how much they need to improve.

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 10:50 PM
I'm with wave here. DT is amazing but I don't think this is his final draft. Plus he's the top paid offensive player. Broncos need him to be a leader, and a leader accepts responsibility for the offense.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:54 PM
He's consistently excellent, doesn't actually have the egregious drops that we say he does, is attributed to have more drops by fans than what is actually scored as a drop, and is compared to the guy whose life he makes easier (Sanders).

Denver fans seem to underrate DT. He should be talking about how much he believes in our QB's but how much they need to improve.

I hope DT isn't as sensitive about these comments are you and Mo are.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:55 PM
I hope DT isn't as sensitive about these comments are you and Mo are.

I'm just a guy making arguments on a message board, man. Just a guy who gets passionate about most things he likes. I guess in true message board fashion I should be saying that you're triggered by my alleged triggeredness.

BroncoWave
03-29-2017, 10:56 PM
I'm just a guy making arguments on a message board, man. Just a guy who gets passionate about most things he likes. I guess in true message board fashion I should be saying that you're triggered by my alleged triggeredness.

#triggeredbrothers

King87
03-29-2017, 10:56 PM
I'm with wave here. DT is amazing but I don't think this is his final draft. Plus he's the top paid offensive player. Broncos need him to be a leader, and a leader accepts responsibility for the offense.

And he's one of the top paid offensive players because he earned it. Who says he's not a leader? We actually need whoever the **** our QB is to be a leader.

Everything the 'TS crowd' says about other players on the team literally applies to him.

King87
03-29-2017, 10:57 PM
#triggeredbrothers

I love you bro. Never change.

MOtorboat
03-29-2017, 11:16 PM
I hope DT isn't as sensitive about these comments are you and Mo are.

I haven't been sensitive at all. Sarcastic, once, yes, but not sensitive.

There is a logical reason to call out a star player in public, i.e., the Phil Jackson zenmaster approach. Call him out publicly and demand the most out of him.

There is also a logical way to light a fire without going public. Personally, I'm a fan of not going public. But, Joseph apparently believes in the former. We'll see how it works. I think Thomas will be the same player he has been, which, reminder, is an elite wide receiver in the league.

I still don't care about his drops. Just don't.

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 11:44 PM
And he's one of the top paid offensive players because he earned it. Who says he's not a leader? We actually need whoever the **** our QB is to be a leader.

Everything the 'TS crowd' says about other players on the team literally applies to him.

couldn't agree more

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 11:45 PM
I still don't care about his drops. Just don't.

Like a mother's love for her child.

King87
03-29-2017, 11:51 PM
Like a mother's love for her child.

If the mother has an understanding that her child will have similar 'issues' as other children while also understanding that the people who root for her children will falsely attribute those issues to be more than what they are...then yes.

King87
03-29-2017, 11:52 PM
couldn't agree more

So maybe the coach should be sending the message to the guy who isn't good at football.

Hawgdriver
03-29-2017, 11:58 PM
So maybe the coach should be sending the message to the guy who isn't good at football.

You mean Trevor. The guy who threw for ~4,000 yards (on a 16 game rate) with a 2:1 TD:int ratio as a first year starter while injured behind a 4OL line.

Ok dude. Keep running your yapper while the world reads your juvenile, hyperbolic takes.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:01 AM
So maybe the coach should be sending the message to the guy who isn't good at football.

Being called out by the coach isn't going to make someone who isn't good at football...suddenly good at football.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:09 AM
You mean Trevor. The guy who threw for ~4,000 yards (on a 16 game rate) with a 2:1 TD:int ratio as a first year starter while injured behind a 4OL line.

Ok dude. Keep running your yapper while the world reads your juvenile, hyperbolic takes.

I mean Trevor Siemian, the guy who threw for 3,400 yards, with a hugely limited skillset as a second year player. Why spin it to fit your narrative? You know, the guy who got hurt while we poopoo better Qb's who have also been hurt.

Okay, dude. We can just act like I haven't time and time again produced the same arguments that you, as long as every other ******* TS fanboy failed to rebut. Juvenile my ass - I guess facts are hyperbole now. And it wouldn't be as hilarious if you actually lived up to not ignoring hyperbole when it suits your position.

'OMFG King, his arm isn't weak'. That's why the scouting reports said it was overall adequate, but struggled on the same throws that we saw last year.

'OMFG King, he was a first year starter!' Sweet, it's hyperbole to act like he was anything close to a rookie. So I'm sure you pointed that out to the TS fan boys - you didn't though.

'OMFG King, the line was bad! It was so bad! Worst in the league! So terrible! That's why he struggled!' I've never seen you once go 'well, the line was bad, but it wasn't even close to being as bad the fan base acts like...and let's not act like the second year starter who didn't do shit in regards to recognizing defenses, using hot routes, or getting rid of the ball helped them out, either.

See, the problem with calling someone juvenile is that when they actually dig into the subject matter past superficial garbage the insult fails.

So either step your 'analysis' up or kindly shut the **** up.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:10 AM
Being called out by the coach isn't going to make someone who isn't good at football...suddenly good at football.

But it's going to make DT better?

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:11 AM
But it's going to make DT better?

If his issues are with effort, then absolutely.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:12 AM
Like a mother's love for her child.

All 7 of them. Oh, the horror.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:14 AM
All 7 of them. Oh, the horror.

You can scoff all day, but I think these comments by VJ validate what many of us have been saying for years about DT.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:14 AM
If his issues are with effort, then absolutely.

So DT doesn't try hard because he has drops? Even though his drops are commensurate with his peers? I've never seen him quit on a game. I have seen him block his ass off, which is typically attributed to WR's who care and try hard, though.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:16 AM
So DT doesn't try hard because he has drops? Even though his drops are commensurate with his peers? I've never seen him quit on a game. I have seen him block his ass off, which is typically attributed to WR's who care and try hard, though.

VJ's comments would imply that his effort might not be there 100% of the time, hence the "easing into games" remark. That's not to say he never tries hard, just that the effort is not as consistent as he would like.

I'm not saying that DT lacks effort, just that IF that is the issue (which seems to be VJ's implication), then yes, being called out could correct that. Being called out isn't going to give TS more football talent.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:19 AM
VJ's comments would imply that his effort might not be there 100% of the time, hence the "easing into games" remark. That's not to say he never tries hard, just that the effort is not as consistent as he would like.

I'm not saying that DT lacks effort, just that IF that is the issue (which seems to be VJ's implication), then yes, being called out could correct that. Being called out isn't going to give TS more football talent.

But I've seen him have fast starts. Some WR's and QB's take time to get into a rhythm.

This is still similar to the aforementioned coaches taking the same route to their QB's. Brady and Wilson were not thought to be bastions of talent.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:19 AM
All 7 of them. Oh, the horror.

He wasn't in the top fifty for drop percentage this past season.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:20 AM
But I've seen him have fast starts. Some WR's and QB's take time to get into a rhythm.

This is still similar to the aforementioned coaches taking the same route to their QB's. Brady and Wilson were not thought to be bastions of talent.

Again, I'm not trying to convince you DT has effort issues. I'm saying IF he has these issues that VJ is implying, then yes, public criticism could help remedy said issues.

Do you think being called out by their coaches gave Brady and Wilson more football talent? Maybe they were also called out because of effort issues.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:22 AM
You can scoff all day, but I think these comments by VJ validate what many of us have been saying for years about DT.

Ok. Sorry, I don't hate the best player on the offense? I'm not really sure what answer you want at this point.

Seven drops on over 144 targets just isn't a concern for me.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:22 AM
Again, I'm not trying to convince you DT has effort issues. I'm saying IF he has these issues that VJ is implying, then yes, public criticism could help remedy said issues.

Do you think being called out by their coaches gave Brady and Wilson more football talent? Maybe they were also called out because of effort issues.

Well, they were being called out to be more productive. So I don't think getting called out necessarily means that the message is about talent.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:24 AM
Ok. Sorry, I don't hate the best player on the offense? I'm not really sure what answer you want at this point.

Seven drops on over 144 targets just isn't a concern for me.

Recognizing and addressing his flaws isn't the same as hating him, but nice to see you keep using that tired argument.

Hawgdriver
03-30-2017, 12:24 AM
I mean Trevor Siemian, the guy who threw for 3,400 yards, with a hugely limited skillset as a second year player. Why spin it to fit your narrative? You know, the guy who got hurt while we poopoo better Qb's who have also been hurt.

Okay, dude. We can just act like I haven't time and time again produced the same arguments that you, as long as every other ******* TS fanboy failed to rebut. Juvenile my ass - I guess facts are hyperbole now. And it wouldn't be as hilarious if you actually lived up to not ignoring hyperbole when it suits your position.

'OMFG King, his arm isn't weak'. That's why the scouting reports said it was overall adequate, but struggled on the same throws that we saw last year.

'OMFG King, he was a first year starter!' Sweet, it's hyperbole to act like he was anything close to a rookie. So I'm sure you pointed that out to the TS fan boys - you didn't though.

'OMFG King, the line was bad! It was so bad! Worst in the league! So terrible! That's why he struggled!' I've never seen you once go 'well, the line was bad, but it wasn't even close to being as bad the fan base acts like...and let's not act like the second year starter who didn't do shit in regards to recognizing defenses, using hot routes, or getting rid of the ball helped them out, either.

See, the problem with calling someone juvenile is that when they actually dig into the subject matter past superficial garbage the insult fails.

So either step your 'analysis' up or kindly shut the **** up.

I honestly don't understand why you and MO evangelize to discredit Siemian. He is what he is. It's difficult to start at QB in the NFL. His work was serviceable, and better than a 7th round pick projects in the NFL by far. No one in the NFL thinks that he is MVP material. He's the starter. Why generate hateful narratives about our starter? I don't get it.

Would I have preferred Romo? Yes.

Would I be fine if they drafted Mahomes? Yes.

Would I be fine if Paxton makes the jump? Yes.

We all would. Until then, Siemian is serviceable and not as bad as you say.

Go MFing Broncos!

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:24 AM
Well, they were being called out to be more productive. So I don't think getting called out necessarily means that the message is about talent.

Well shit, if only VJ would just call out Siemian, we'd have the next Brady or Wilson on our hands!

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:26 AM
Recognizing and addressing his flaws isn't the same as hating him, but nice to see you keep using that tired argument.

As opposed to you spending the first two pages of this thread pulling out the "why you so triggered" bullshit? We've both used hyperbole here.

King87
03-30-2017, 12:27 AM
Well shit, if only VJ would just call out Siemian, we'd have the next Brady or Wilson on our hands!

Not what I'm saying at all. I'm simply saying that if calling out someone works, there are better targets than our all-pro WR.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:28 AM
As opposed to you spending the first two pages of this thread pulling out the "why you so triggered" bullshit? We've both used hyperbole here.

Will you at least admit that the head coach calling out some of DTs flaws maybe kinda sorta just a little bit legitimizes some of the arguments from fans pointing out said flaws? It's one thing when it's just a-holes like us on a message board spouting hot takes. It's another when the head coach says it.

Timmy!
03-30-2017, 12:29 AM
http://img2.gifmagazine.net/gifmagazine/images/962054/original.gif

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:29 AM
Not what I'm saying at all. I'm simply saying that if calling out someone works, there are better targets than our all-pro WR.

And maybe he'll target those people too. The offseason is still quite young. If DT is the only guy he ever calls out publicly, then I'll agree it's unfair. But he could just be the first of many.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:29 AM
I honestly don't understand why you and MO evangelize to discredit Siemian. He is what he is. It's difficult to start at QB in the NFL. His work was serviceable, and better than a 7th round pick projects in the NFL by far. No one in the NFL thinks that he is MVP material. He's the starter. Why generate hateful narratives about our starter? I don't get it.

Would I have preferred Romo? Yes.

Would I be fine if they drafted Mahomes? Yes.

Would I be fine if Paxton makes the jump? Yes.

We all would. Until then, Siemian is serviceable and not as bad as you say.

Go MFing Broncos!

I haven't discredited him at all. He's just not a very good NFL quarterback. Like, it's a cool story and he seems like a super good guy. Everyone screamed about how terrible Manning was in his last year and Siemian was about on par with Manning last year, but everyone wants to praise Siemian?

He's going to be the starter of my favorite team in the fall, barring something ridiculous happening at this point, so I hope he does well. His entire year as the starter indicates otherwise. We apparently have different opinions about his play. Cool.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:30 AM
Will you at least admit that the head coach calling out some of DTs flaws maybe kinda sorta just a little bit legitimizes some of the arguments from fans pointing out said flaws? It's one thing when it's just a-holes like us on a message board spouting hot takes. It's another when the head coach says it.

I already did.

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:31 AM
I already did.

I must have read over it?

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 12:33 AM
I must have read over it?

I talked about reasonable justifications for doing this in public vs. doing it in private. My biggest issue is calling out the best player. He's far from the problem on offense. Far from it.

Hawgdriver
03-30-2017, 12:34 AM
I haven't discredited him at all. He's just not a very good NFL quarterback. Like, it's a cool story and he seems like a super good guy. Everyone screamed about how terrible Manning was in his last year and Siemian was about on par with Manning last year, but everyone wants to praise Siemian?

He's going to be the starter of my favorite team in the fall, barring something ridiculous happening at this point, so I hope he does well. His entire year as the starter indicates otherwise. We apparently have different opinions about his play. Cool.

Cool.

BeefStew25
03-30-2017, 12:43 AM
I must have read over it?

You still read MO's posts?

BroncoWave
03-30-2017, 12:48 AM
You still read MO's posts?

I like to throw him a bone sometimes.

Mike
03-30-2017, 08:08 AM
I haven't discredited him at all. He's just not a very good NFL quarterback. Like, it's a cool story and he seems like a super good guy. Everyone screamed about how terrible Manning was in his last year and Siemian was about on par with Manning last year, but everyone wants to praise Siemian?

He's going to be the starter of my favorite team in the fall, barring something ridiculous happening at this point, so I hope he does well. His entire year as the starter indicates otherwise. We apparently have different opinions about his play. Cool.

One was the best at his position to ever play the game on his way down = man he is bad...for Manning.

One was a 7th round draft pick, first year starter = better than we expected.

Both played behind shitty olines, anemic run games, in a very shitty offense. No reasonable person could have expected Siemian to carry this offense last year, but that is what the coaches put on him and some idiotic fans were expecting.

Siemian is what he is, a young guy who showed some talent, but we don't know how good he can be because of all the above. He may be a decent system QB or he may be a good backup. Unless the Broncos can fix the line and come up with a better offensive gameplan we will never know and every QB will look garbage. Same as Manning, Brock, and Lynch.

Teams are built in the trenches. I don't care who is QB, as long as we fix the offense. If they can't do that then any QB we get is going to have a rough time.

Nomad
03-30-2017, 08:42 AM
Accept the challenge, DT.

Freyaka
03-30-2017, 09:51 AM
I would really caution everyone to not read a whole lot into this. It's coach speak. We don't know what question was asked that garnered this answer and we don't know what the full text was.

As an example there was an article a week or two ago with a quote that made it sound like Coach Joe had said that Lynch was talent and nothing else and gave the impression that he was hinting that Lynch would have a tough time making it in the league. It was taken out of context and the full quote revealed generic coach speak and he was actually praising Lynch.

Reporters misquote all the time to stir the pot... It's easy to read a lot into such a small snippet, but that doesn't mean we're reading it exactly as intended in context of the question asked and the full quote.

Nomad
03-30-2017, 10:02 AM
I guess I interpret Coach Joseph to DT as lead by example being the All Pro veteran he is and by improving your flaws. I believe he's pushing him to be a leader on the field. This offense definitely needs a good leader.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 11:30 AM
One was the best at his position to ever play the game on his way down = man he is bad...for Manning.

One was a 7th round draft pick, first year starter = better than we expected.

Both played behind shitty olines, anemic run games, in a very shitty offense. No reasonable person could have expected Siemian to carry this offense last year, but that is what the coaches put on him and some idiotic fans were expecting.

Siemian is what he is, a young guy who showed some talent, but we don't know how good he can be because of all the above. He may be a decent system QB or he may be a good backup. Unless the Broncos can fix the line and come up with a better offensive gameplan we will never know and every QB will look garbage. Same as Manning, Brock, and Lynch.

Teams are built in the trenches. I don't care who is QB, as long as we fix the offense. If they can't do that then any QB we get is going to have a rough time.

Well, we're always going to disagree on the last part. QB is the most important position on the field. I've acknowledged the nice story, good guy thing. It's a great story. Now, that we're past where he was drafted, which matters not one ounce, then we can talk about his poor play.

Freyaka
03-30-2017, 12:29 PM
I guess I interpret Coach Joseph to DT as lead by example being the All Pro veteran he is and by improving your flaws. I believe he's pushing him to be a leader on the field. This offense definitely needs a good leader.

And I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting more out of him. I've just seen others on another board using this as ammunition "see, even Coach Joe things DT sucks"

It's coach speak, people are going to read what they want to hear into it and it ultimately is just a generic answer that doesn't mean a whole lot at this point in the year.

Davii
03-30-2017, 12:30 PM
Well, we're always going to disagree on the last part. QB is the most important position on the field. I've acknowledged the nice story, good guy thing. It's a great story. Now, that we're past where he was drafted, which matters not one ounce, then we can talk about his poor play.

I agree that QB is the most important. I don't think our line has been any good for a while but it was certainly more apparent without a HOF QB behind it.

Mike
03-30-2017, 12:31 PM
Well, we're always going to disagree on the last part. QB is the most important position on the field. I've acknowledged the nice story, good guy thing. It's a great story. Now, that we're past where he was drafted, which matters not one ounce, then we can talk about his poor play.

Can't talk about his poor play without acknowledging that every other QB that played in this system in Denver has looked like shit, or that the offense line is awful, or that we have no run game.

Freyaka
03-30-2017, 12:36 PM
Can't talk about his poor play without acknowledging that every other QB that played in this system in Denver has looked like shit, or that the offense line is awful, or that we have no run game.

I feel like i've seen this conversation play out 1000 times before somewhere... Can't put my finger on it. Seems like an exercise in futility to me.

ShaneFalco
03-30-2017, 12:37 PM
long live Seimian

Denver Native (Carol)
03-30-2017, 01:48 PM
from article:


HE WANTS DT TO BE 'A DOMINANT PLAYER'

Demaryius Thomas is one of just 13 players in NFL history with at least 500 receptions, 7,000 receiving yards and 50 receiving touchdowns in his first seven seasons. He's in elite company. He's among the best at what he does.

Joseph wants more.

"I want him to be a dominant player all the time," Joseph said. "I don't want him to ease into games. I want him to step out and be a guy.

"It's time because he's a great player. He can take over a game. But every game we play, I want his mindset to be to walk on the field and take over the game."

The rest of the team can help particularly on the ground. Joseph reiterated his desire to get the ground game going; if that happens, Thomas will have more one-on-one opportunities.

"I want him to win every one-on-one," Joseph said.

Those could come both outside and inside. Joseph said he plans to move Thomas around, giving him chances in the slot as well as outside.

"He's a great runner of the football with wide-receiver screens and that's been his trademark for years, to catch the screen and go 60 and 70 yards," Joseph said. "Having more variety in the offense is going to help him."

full article - http://www.denverbroncos.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/Key-points-from-Vance-Joseph-as-he-answered-questions-Tuesday/4107f329-78cf-4b59-9021-943053c796d7

Freyaka
03-30-2017, 02:15 PM
from article:



full article - http://www.denverbroncos.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/Key-points-from-Vance-Joseph-as-he-answered-questions-Tuesday/4107f329-78cf-4b59-9021-943053c796d7

See the full quote presents more of a "I want to see him do more, here's how I can help him do more" It's all coach speak... I really wouldn't say he's calling him out, more wanting to see more (and hell, after last year, I want to see more out of most of the players on offense)

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 02:19 PM
I agree that QB is the most important. I don't think our line has been any good for a while but it was certainly more apparent without a HOF QB behind it.

No, the line has not been good. I'm just not going to use that as an excuse for poor quarterback play. And I don't think we need to fix this before that or that before this. Both need to be fixed. It's true that the quarterback position in this situation is the one more likely to develop without change. I'm just skeptical that it will. I'm also more concerned about the quarterback than the line, just my opinion.

BroncoJoe
03-30-2017, 03:14 PM
Jesus. You'd think Siemian is the 2nd coming of Tebow or something. He's above serviceable. Actually pretty good. Sure we can do better, but with the exception of a few teams, who couldn't? He's our QB for now and he's not as terrible or as good as some here want us to believe.

As to DT and the comments, I love the kid. Terrific player, and his stats demonstrate that.

That said, I've seen subtle changes in his game over the last couple of years. His YAC doesn't seem to be anything special when compared to his first few years. He goes down on first contact, which is definitely different than his past. I'm glad he is a Broncos player, but I think he could really be elite if he's pushed. I'm just not seeing that extra drive from him like we saw during his first couple of years.

MOtorboat
03-30-2017, 03:17 PM
No one has said he is as bad as Tebow. No one is even suggesting that or implying it in any way at all.

BroncoJoe
03-30-2017, 03:21 PM
No one has said he is as bad as Tebow. No one is even suggesting that or implying it in any way at all.

No one (to my knowledge) has mentioned Tebow's name, but just read some of King's posts about him and get back to me. Some of your's too...

tia.

ShaneFalco
03-30-2017, 03:23 PM
Tebow is better then both Lynch and Siemian combined

BroncoJoe
03-30-2017, 03:33 PM
Tebow is better then both Lynch and Siemian combined

OK - now that's going a bit too far...

Jsteve01
03-30-2017, 04:15 PM
Jesus. You'd think Siemian is the 2nd coming of Tebow or something. He's above serviceable. Actually pretty good. Sure we can do better, but with the exception of a few teams, who couldn't? He's our QB for now and he's not as terrible or as good as some here want us to believe.

As to DT and the comments, I love the kid. Terrific player, and his stats demonstrate that.

That said, I've seen subtle changes in his game over the last couple of years. His YAC doesn't seem to be anything special when compared to his first few years. He goes down on first contact, which is definitely different than his past. I'm glad he is a Broncos player, but I think he could really be elite if he's pushed. I'm just not seeing that extra drive from him like we saw during his first couple of years. so for the record would you say calling him out publicly prior to ever setting foot on the field with him is the ideal way to motivate the guy? Im not being snarky either. I just think it is stupid with a guy like DT to pull that shit with no relationship. He has literally no ground to say that shit. Reminds me of a George Karl type move

BroncoJoe
03-30-2017, 04:20 PM
so for the record would you say calling him out publicly prior to ever setting foot on the field with him is the ideal way to motivate the guy? Im not being snarky either. I just think it is stupid with a guy like DT to pull that shit with no relationship. He has literally no ground to say that shit. Reminds me of a George Karl type move

I don't believe he "called him out" publicly or otherwise. Read his whole comment.

dogfish
03-30-2017, 04:47 PM
Tebow is better then both Lynch and Siemian combined

at what?

NightTerror218
03-30-2017, 05:40 PM
Every player should be challenged to be better. DT had left plays on the field with drops.

Northman
03-30-2017, 05:59 PM
I knew this thread would be priceless. It did not disappoint.

Hawgdriver
03-30-2017, 06:40 PM
I knew this thread would be priceless. It did not disappoint.

I should call out North for irresponsible thread starting. Internet arson.

dogfish
03-30-2017, 07:22 PM
I should call out North for irresponsible thread starting. Internet arson.

some vikings just want to watch the world burn. . .

Hawgdriver
03-30-2017, 07:30 PM
some vikings just want to watch the world burn. . .

I went to the Viking exhibit at DMNS yesterday. Saw North's ancestors. My own, too lol.

dogfish
03-30-2017, 07:31 PM
I went to the Viking exhibit at DMNS yesterday. Saw North's ancestors. My own, too lol.

is it good? i was thinking about checking it out. . .

King87
03-30-2017, 09:55 PM
No one (to my knowledge) has mentioned Tebow's name, but just read some of King's posts about him and get back to me. Some of your's too...

tia.

At no point have I said that he's Tebowesque. It's incredible to me that pointing to specific and obvious flaws in his game as vigorously as his fan boys defend him means I think he's one of the worst QB's in the history of the game.

The problem isn't my posts - the problem is with the people who take my words and interpret them to mean something so outlandish so they can discredit the arguments.

So, do better.

TIA.

Hawgdriver
03-30-2017, 10:10 PM
is it good? i was thinking about checking it out. . .

Was decent. You might pass.

Freyaka
03-31-2017, 06:13 AM
at what?

Missing the mark? Though I dunno...Lynch may be a decent competition with him in that area currently.

FanInAZ
03-31-2017, 06:27 AM
at what?

Doing all the things that you'd ask a RB to do.