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View Full Version : How much do we miss Trevathan and Jackson.



CrazyHorse
10-10-2016, 03:49 PM
I must not be the only one that's noticed our run defense and coverage on linebackers has been a liability. This isn't just the Falcons game either. It's been a trend so far this season.

turftoad
10-10-2016, 03:53 PM
Trevathan a lot, Jackson, not so much.

CrazyHorse
10-10-2016, 03:58 PM
Trevathan a lot, Jackson, not so much.

I don't think the run defense would have been as bad had Walker not been lost for the season.

underrated29
10-10-2016, 05:06 PM
I don't think the run defense would have been as bad had Walker not been lost for the season.


Trevathan a lot, Jackson, not so much.



These exactly

BORDERLINE
10-10-2016, 05:19 PM
They are great players but I feel we didn't lose much. The defense has held opponents to 20 or under the whole year. Sunday was a first. as long as the offense scores over 20 the chances of winning are huge!!!

We'll rebound nicely on Thursday

BroncoWave
10-10-2016, 05:21 PM
Eh, no point in really dwelling on the guys we lost. That's just the cost that comes with winning the Super Bowl. Can't keep everyone. Overall there has been little to no dropoff on D. Atlanta is just a tough matchup for us, and even still the D held their own most of the game. We will see few more teams with that kind of offensive talent.

Northman
10-10-2016, 05:22 PM
What was the alternative? Pay them the money? There was only so much money to go around as it was.

VonDoom
10-10-2016, 05:45 PM
I don't think the run defense would have been as bad had Walker not been lost for the season.

Totally agree. And as others said, there wasn't enough money to go around for everyone. No team keeps every player year to year. We have to adapt.

I notice there aren't threads like this about Osweiler

Dapper Dan
10-10-2016, 08:03 PM
Not much.

ShaneFalco
10-10-2016, 08:18 PM
miss danny t alot

DenBronx
10-10-2016, 08:22 PM
That Atlanta game is winnable with a healthy Trevor so I don't know why everyone is acting like the sky is falling.

But...in answer to the question we do miss Trevathan. I was sad we couldn't retain him.

tripp
10-10-2016, 08:24 PM
That Atlanta game is winnable with a healthy Trevor so I don't know why everyone is acting like the sky is falling.

But...in answer to the question we do miss Trevathan. I was sad we couldn't retain him.

I agree, but the way Atlanta had used their RB's on us is alarming though

dogfish
10-10-2016, 09:51 PM
some, for sure. . . as others have said, what are you gonna do about it?

i think danny's coverage skills are what we miss the most-- as was clearly illustrated yesterday. . . having two ILBs who could really cover, along with our secondary, made our defense about as close as you can get to invulnerable to mismatches. . . i like davis, but he can't cover like danny. . . though honestly, marshall didn't play any better yesterday. . . if teams start picking on us there, i myself wouldn't mind seeing zaire anderson get some burn to see if he can shore it up. . .

as for the run game, i think the biggest part of it is up front, not the linebackers. . . and sly seems like he's part of the issue. . . i have no idea if part of it is trickle-down from lesser talent around him, but IMO he doesn't seem like he's getting it done at the same level he was last year. . . i would say we miss malik most on third downs, where we aren't getting the disruptive inside push. . . von has been making up for some of that with his beastly effort, though. . . one other thing is that our safeties have uncharacteristically missed some tackles here and there-- not a lot, certainly, but it can get you gashed when they do. . .

all in all, they're still a hell of a unit. . . will be interesting to see if guys like gotsis, parks, simmons, anderson and watson can grow in the scheme. . . frankly, a guy we aren't missing that much is D ware-- because ray has grown into the role. . . the others were never considered potential top ten picks, and may not have the same ceiling as shane, but there's still plenty of potential there. . . parks in particular looks like a guy who can grow into a leadership role on the back end of the defense. . . now that we have some promising young safeties, maybe next year they can actually draft an ILB higher than the 5th or 6th round. . .

wayninja
10-10-2016, 10:01 PM
What was the alternative? Pay them the money? There was only so much money to go around as it was.

Let different guys go and then start threads about how much we miss them, instead. Naturally.

NightTerror218
10-10-2016, 11:08 PM
That Atlanta game is winnable with a healthy Trevor so I don't know why everyone is acting like the sky is falling.

But...in answer to the question we do miss Trevathan. I was sad we couldn't retain him.

Not with the way to oline played.

NightTerror218
10-10-2016, 11:10 PM
I am glad we did not pick up 5th yr option on sly.

Hawgdriver
10-10-2016, 11:56 PM
. . having two ILBs who could really cover, along with our secondary, made our defense about as close as you can get to invulnerable to mustaches. .

That's how I read it, and I thought, damn if dog ain't making yet another great point.

wayninja
10-11-2016, 12:04 AM
having two ILBs who could really cover, along with our secondary, made our defense about as close as you can get to invulnerable to mustaches. .


That's how I read it, and I thought, damn if dog ain't making yet another great point.

http://media2.s-nbcnews.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Slideshows/_production/ss-100518-famous-mustaches/ss-100514-mustache-tease.today-ss-slide-desktop.jpg

Yeah. Good luck ILB's.

BroncoWave
10-11-2016, 12:17 AM
Let different guys go and then start threads about how much we miss them, instead. Naturally.

You're really on fire tonight!

Jaded
10-11-2016, 12:35 AM
Trevathon didn't play in the Nickle much, that wa mostly Marshall, but Trevathon was far better in coverage when teams caught Denver in base defense. However, replacing Trevathon isn't exactly hard, Davis just sucks but he's actually faster than Zaire Anderson and Nelson just seems to be considered a STer.

Regardless, Luke Keukley can't cover those two RB's in man coverage, imo.

I'd still like to see Davis challenged.

Joel
10-11-2016, 03:41 AM
I don't think the run defense would have been as bad had Walker not been lost for the season.
That; not only was he at least as effective as Jackson in run D on the edge, he was also the guy who rotated with Sly at NT all but the first four weeks (when Walker was STARTING during Wolfes suspension; D did pretty good against both run and pass the first month of 2015, yes?)

Others also have a valid point that the #1 offense didn't exactly blow us up nor out. They exploited some matchups in the first half, as in all our games, but Wade made halftime adjustments that pretty much stonewalled that #1 offense until the gun, as in all our games. They got points off a couple short fields, but neither Jackson nor Trevathan could prevent Lynchs Int (I don't recall whether Trevathan covered punts, but I'm pretty sure Jackson didn't.)

So far in 2016 (counting Sunday) the Falcons have averaged 4.5 yds/att rushing: Against us they averaged 3.8 (i.e. their season average minus our game is even higher than 4.5 yds/att.) That's despite our offense leaving our D on the field most of the game. The TOTAL looks nice, because road teams up double digits in the second half kill clock and avoid turnovers, but just because Atlanta ran a lot doesn't mean they were getting much when they did.

Atlanta averaged exactly 38 pts/gm until we held them to 23 Sunday: Our anemic run blocking, porous pass blocking and raw rookie QB were the issue, NOT our D.

Traveler
10-11-2016, 11:48 AM
While I do believe letting Jackson leave in FA was the correct move, we really do miss his interior presence. We get little if any push up the gut on obvious passing down, and Jackson di play the run well.

Buff
10-11-2016, 12:07 PM
This idea that Trevathan was some coverage specialist ace feels like revisionist history to me. I understand he is better than a typical ILB at coverage - but pass catching RBs and TEs were still our Achilles heel even when he was here.

Valar Morghulis
10-11-2016, 12:22 PM
While I do believe letting Jackson leave in FA was the correct move, we really do miss his interior presence. We get little if any push up the gut on obvious passing down, and Jackson di play the run well.

For one season.

Lynch12
10-11-2016, 03:45 PM
I don't miss them, I miss walker, I think in nickle and dime situations we need to use more safeties on the field instead of davis and nelson.

VonDoom
10-11-2016, 03:48 PM
I don't miss them, I miss walker, I think in nickle and dime situations we need to use more safeties on the field instead of davis and nelson.

Well, in nickle and dime situations, Davis and Nelson AREN'T on the field. The Falcons kept us in more base defense by being a run threat. Our D-line hasn't been great at stopping the run, so taking an ILB off the field for another safety in running downs doesn't help us. They just made really good use of their RB's as pass catchers. As we've said, not that many teams can do that to us.

CrazyHorse
10-12-2016, 02:59 AM
Well, in nickle and dime situations, Davis and Nelson AREN'T on the field. The Falcons kept us in more base defense by being a run threat. Our D-line hasn't been great at stopping the run, so taking an ILB off the field for another safety in running downs doesn't help us. They just made really good use of their RB's as pass catchers. As we've said, not that many teams can do that to us.

James White and Dion Lewis?

Lynch12
10-12-2016, 01:04 PM
Well, in nickle and dime situations, Davis and Nelson AREN'T on the field. The Falcons kept us in more base defense by being a run threat. Our D-line hasn't been great at stopping the run, so taking an ILB off the field for another safety in running downs doesn't help us. They just made really good use of their RB's as pass catchers. As we've said, not that many teams can do that to us.

Well they needed to come up out of the (base) and do something different, cant be getting smoked by running backs. I dont know why people are acting like freeman and the other guy arre some elite pass catchers.

Lynch12
10-12-2016, 01:06 PM
James White and Dion Lewis?

The steelers as well, lol @ the notion that only the falcons can do that to us and there in the NFC so it really doesn't matter much? Broncos better fix it because two of the opposition (steelers/patriots can burn us the same way if we dont fix it.

BroncoWave
10-12-2016, 01:28 PM
The steelers as well, lol @ the notion that only the falcons can do that to us and there in the NFC so it really doesn't matter much? Broncos better fix it because two of the opposition (steelers/patriots can burn us the same way if we dont fix it.

We had similar issues covering backs last year as well and still went a combined 3-1 against the Pats and Steelers last year, including 2 playoff wins. Even as badly as Atlanta's running backs gashed us, we still held their team well below their season averages in points and yards.

VonDoom
10-12-2016, 01:38 PM
The steelers as well, lol @ the notion that only the falcons can do that to us and there in the NFC so it really doesn't matter much? Broncos better fix it because two of the opposition (steelers/patriots can burn us the same way if we dont fix it.

I already said the Steelers and Patriots would present the same problem, so I'm fully aware of the situation. It mostly comes down to the fact that our d-line hasn't been as good against the run this year, which has had adverse effects elsewhere. You want to put a safety out there to cover Coleman? Fine, then he runs and we don't have enough power to stuff him. I'm not saying it's hopeless - we'll adjust. But they found a weakness and went after it. Good for them.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
10-12-2016, 07:50 PM
We weren't bad at covering backs last year. We were in the top ten statistically. It was an area a lot of teams tried to exploit because we were #1 or #2 in everything else. The reality is we just aren't as good up the middle as we were last year.

Jaded
10-12-2016, 10:38 PM
Potroast, Eugene Monroe and Travis Feeney. Championship.

VonDoom
10-13-2016, 06:38 AM
Potroast, Eugene Monroe and Travis Feeney. Championship.

I don't know why we haven't given Knighton at least a look.

broncofaninfla
10-13-2016, 07:54 AM
Marshall and Davis have been weak against runs straight up the gut this year. Add to it they have both been lacking in pass coverage. There's a definite slip from last year.

Lynch12
10-13-2016, 10:15 AM
We had similar issues covering backs last year as well and still went a combined 3-1 against the Pats and Steelers last year, including 2 playoff wins. Even as badly as Atlanta's running backs gashed us, we still held their team well below their season averages in points and yards.

Fair enough, it's worst though. The falcons cannot win the game because there running.backs are pass catching. I didnt like seeing it, I dont remember losing a game due to backs catching the ball last year.

Lynch12
10-13-2016, 10:18 AM
Marshall and Davis have been weak against runs straight up the gut this year. Add to it they have both been lacking in pass coverage. There's a definite slip from last year.

What's changed? Marshall was badass last year vs the run and in coverage.

Lynch12
10-13-2016, 10:19 AM
Potroast, Eugene Monroe and Travis Feeney. Championship.

Knighton thrived here. We should bring the man back, I think there is some horseplay between him and elway. Some ego tripping.

slim
10-13-2016, 10:41 AM
He doesn't fit what they are trying to do.

Slick
10-13-2016, 11:05 AM
I miss Malik. He was really good last year.

dogfish
10-13-2016, 03:50 PM
What's changed? Marshall was badass last year vs the run and in coverage.

i think it's the fact that danny was our top coverage 'backer last year. . . with him gone, marshall has been given more responsibility-- in coverage, and i'm guessing probably in lining up the D as well. . . i do think he's played pretty well other than this past sunday. . . i blame our problems in run D more on the D-linemen than the ILBs. . . crick is a step below malik and vance walker, sly doesn't seem to be playing as well, and we have no depth. . . winn was used very sparingly on sunday, and i don't think gotsis has played at all the past couple weeks-- he's not ready, and it forces the starters to play more snaps. . . last year we had fantastic depth with walker and antonio smith coming off the bench. . . without those guys, sly has been forced to play in the nickel. . . i think our front is getting worn down a little compared to last year, when we had the depth and confidence to rotate more. . .