Did the Broncos play dirty against Cam Newton? Shannon, Ray (and skip)

[Az Snake]

CvVG5KI-SzU

[TXBRONC]

Play loose, play fast, and play pissed off. (Ray Lewis)

[BroncoTech]

No, I wouldn't say the Broncos play dirty.

[Nomad]

I would say it was a damn fine defensive effort by the BRONCOS. Panthers should of protected better.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I'm surprised no one is talking about how most of those hits were outside the pocket where he is classified as a runner.

[DenBronx]

I'm surprised no one is talking about how most of those hits were outside the pocket where he is classified as a runner.

That was my initial thought. Cam has broke records for rushing as a QB and is still only 27. When he leaves the pocket like that he gives himself up as a RB. So, of course he's going to get hit more. Just ask RGKnee and Mike Vick about that.

[Slick]

Thanks for posting that AZ.

[Dzone]

That is a fine video. "This is friggin football. This is one of the best football games Ive seen in a long time" -Ray Lewis

[Magnificent Seven]

CvVG5KI-SzU

Thanks. I enjoyed reading closed caption and understanding this situation.

[slim]

**** Cam

[Broncoknight30]

The pathetic part to me is how ESPN was trying to bring the race card AGAIN into the situation. I think they almost did an Outside the Lines about it. Cam Newton's father insinuated if it was "Brady" they would have thrown more flags. Well, Brady never and I mean never runs any sort of read option. Brady hardly EVER scrambles.

That is a large of Cams game. His game opens himself up to hits. I thought one of those questionable hits could have been called. Not the one Von Miller was associated with. Miller was NOT head hunting, and did not launch. Their helmets hit and it was as much Cam hitting Miller as the other way around. Those plays should be allowed to happen, and thank God they did not call it. I do not care what is in the rule book regarding that particular play. It is a dumb rule to begin with.

The one vicious hit by Stewart was called. He will be fined.

I am just beyond sick of the race card being pushed by the ESPN types. I am sick and tired of it constantly being used for EVERY AND ANY situation.

[slim]

:confused: I didn't find any of them particularly hard to understand.

I believe he is hearing impaired you insensitive ass

[slim]

The pathetic part to me is how ESPN was trying to bring the race card AGAIN into the situation. I think they almost did an Outside the Lines about it. Cam Newton's father insinuated if it was "Brady" they would have thrown more flags. Well, Brady never and I mean never runs any sort of read option. Brady hardly EVER scrambles.

That is a large of Cams game. His game opens himself up to hits. I thought one of those questionable hits could have been called. Not the one Von Miller was associated with. Miller was NOT head hunting, and did not launch. Their helmets hit and it was as much Cam hitting Miller as the other way around. Those plays should be allowed to happen, and thank God they did not call it. I do not care what is in the rule book regarding that particular play. It is a dumb rule to begin with.

The one vicious hit by Stewart was called. He will be fined.

I am just beyond sick of the race card being pushed by the ESPN types. I am sick and tired of it constantly being used for EVERY AND ANY situation.

Easy....stop watching ESPN

[Slick]

Take a lap, Wave.

[Dzone]

No shit. I miss the old days when we could turn on sports to escape for a while. Now we tune in to watch sports and get lectured on social injustice and inequality. Espn is the worst.
Cam is 6-6 280. You have to hit him hard or he will bulldoze you. Tebow was the same way. Tebow was like Janovich trying to play quarterback.

[slim]

His BF hall of fame status is currently under review

[Dzone]

Easy....stop watching ESPN

For sure. Espn sucks. I put those ******** on block.

[slim]

No shit. I miss the old days when we could turn on sports to escape for a while. Now we tune in to watch sports and get lectured on social injustice and inequality. Espn is the worst.
Cam is 6-6 280. You have to hit him hard or he will bulldoze you. Tebow was the same way. Tebow was like Janovich trying to play quarterback.

You can't play like a RB and expect to be treated like a QB.

I think he had 11 carries un that game. That is typically what an RB 2 gets

[slim]

For sure. Espn sucks. I put those ******** on block.

Unless there is a game on, I never watch ESPN.

They have been a shit show for years.

[Nomad]

NFL QBs are always playing like the victim, it's not just Cam, he's following suit.

[slim]

NFL QBs are always playing like the victim, it's not just Cam, he's following suit.

But he is a victim of race discrimination!

[Nomad]

But he is a victim of race discrimination!

Out of respect for my friend's post, AzSnake, I'll pass on a comment. :)

[slim]

Out of respect for my friend's post, AzSnake, I'll pass on a comment. :)

It's okay, AZ and I are tight.

[Bronco4ever]

The NFL said there should have been a penalty on the Marshall hit. The Stewart hit was hard, but it was bang-bang and wasn't intentional to hurt him (at least in the head). The other hits were either incidental or initiated by Cam.

The amount of attention the head shots Cam received was WAY over the top. There was a grand total of 1 missed call. As other have stated, Cam set himself up for a lot of those hits. Slide down, go fetal position, take the sack, throw the ball away, ect, but when you run as much as he does, he's going to get hit. Unfortunate for him but it's true.

[atwater27]

the marshall hit will get a huge fine. That was totally inexcusable

[Az Snake]

Out of respect for my friend's post, AzSnake, I'll pass on a comment. :)


Please do not refrain from holding back on my account Brother Darkness !
Let 'er rip !!

Personally, I think slim was just being facetious.
I think....:confused:

~~~

IMO, Cam has played the race card way over the top.
Not the first, true, some called it out with good reason back in the day.
But in this day and age, Cam's assertions have been farcical.
He started in right after the SB loss acting like he was the first black QB in the league.

I remember watching Doug Williams and Russell Wilson win Super Bowls.
Warren Moon did ok. I think ol' Warren is in the HoF.
Randall Cunningham led the League in points scored.
Steve McNair was named co-MVP of the League with Peyton.
Vince Young was named Rookie of the Year.

We've had a black QB in the last 4 Super Bowls.

Not all make it to the top and stay there, just like most QBs regardless of racial origin.
JaMarcus Russell, first round draft pick.
Michael Vick.
RGIII.

In this day and age, if you are good and you can handle it, you will get the job.
Color barrier is gone in sports today and payday is 'sky's the limit' if you are worthy.
NFL Teams don't care what color you are.
They only care if you are the best to get the job done.

I do remember tough times for black athletes back in the day.
I watched Jim Brown mow down defenses and get paid peanuts.
I also watched QB's like Y.A. Tittle get hit so hard and often you couldn't tell what color he was.

All black athletes faced racism back in the day, true.
Cassius Clay/Mohammed Ali:
He definitely faced real racial barriers.
He was was loud and proud.
That was his right and he backed it up.
He had class.
Many call him the greatest of all time.

Cam, if you want to be loud and proud, back it up or shut up.
Follow Ali's example. Don't be a loser.
Don't be a whine baby and cry race when you lose.
Don't get your mommy and daddy to pull the race card for you.
You have millions, where's the social injustice in that ?

[Pudge]

Skip Bayless just made good points and was very rational.... my perception of reality is suddenly called into question

Sent from my SM-G928V using Forum Runner

[TXBRONC]

Please refrain from holding back on my account Brother Darkness !
Let 'er rip !!

Personally, I think slim was just being facetious.
I think....:confused:

~~~

IMO, Cam has played the race card way over the top.
Not the first, true, some called it out with good reason back in the day.
But in this day and age, Cam's assertions have been farcical.
He started in right after the SB loss acting like he was the first black QB in the league.

I remember watching Doug Williams and Russell Wilson win Super Bowls.
Warren Moon did ok. I think ol' Warren is in the HoF.
Randall Cunningham led the League in points scored.
Steve McNair was named co-MVP of the League with Peyton.
Vince Young was named Rookie of the Year.

We've had a black QB in the last 4 Super Bowls.

Not all make it to the top and stay there, just like most QBs regardless of racial origin.
JaMarcus Russell, first round draft pick.
Michael Vick.
RGIII.

In this day and age, if you are good and you can handle it, you will get the job.
Color barrier is gone in sports today and payday is 'sky's the limit' if you are worthy.
NFL Teams don't care what color you are.
They only care if you are the best to get the job done.

I do remember tough times for black athletes back in the day.
I watched Jim Brown mow down defenses and get paid peanuts.
I also watched QB's like Y.A. Tittle get hit so hard and often you couldn't tell what color he was.

All black athletes faced racism back in the day, true.
Cassius Clay/Mohammed Ali:
He definitely faced real racial barriers.
He was was loud and proud.
That was his right and he backed it up.
He had class.
Many call him the greatest of all time.

Cam, if you want to be loud and proud, back it up or shut up.
Follow Ali's example. Don't be a loser.
Don't be a whine baby and cry race when you lose.
Don't get your mommy and daddy to pull the race card for you.
You have millions, where's the social injustice in that ?

This is no guile in Slim. What you see is what you get. :shocked:

[BroncoWave]

Skip Bayless just made good points and was very rational.... my perception of reality is suddenly called into question

Sent from my SM-G928V using Forum Runner

Right? I was shocked at how good that segment was. Honestly, I think Skip does know what he's talking about when he's not being a total troll. But he's paid to be a troll, so that's usually what you get.

[BORDERLINE]

Cam was treated like a running QB should be treated.

[Poet]

Was it dirty when Cam Newton's jumbo sized linebacker body knocked our DB's to the ground?

[Tned]

Unless there is a game on, I never watch ESPN.

They have been a shit show for years.

Ditto

[Az Snake]

Cam was treated like a running QB should be treated.

^^^^^^^^^ Exactly.
When a QB is running, he is a RB if he doesn't slide prior to contact.
If Cam doesn't want to get hit, he needs to slide feet first before contact like a QB.

Ray and Shannon made some great points about ball carriers lowering their heads prior to impact.
That includes RBs, WRs, TEs and QBs.

If the NFL office is going to comb the game film to look for for hits on Cam........
They dam well better look at all the holding going on every play against the entire Broncos' D-Line.

[Canmore]

^^^^^^^^^ Exactly.
When a QB is running, he is a RB if he doesn't slide prior to contact.
If Cam doesn't want to get hit, he needs to slide feet first before contact like a QB.

Ray and Shannon made some great points about ball carriers lowering their heads prior to impact.
That includes RBs, WRs, TEs and QBs.

If the NFL office is going to comb the game film to look for for hits on Cam........
They dam well better look at all the holding going on every play against the entire Broncos' D-Line.

Nah... that's not important...

[Simple Jaded]

I'd like to point out that Newton is a bed wetting, tooth-flossing, tantrum-throwing, Me-First, pretentious and fake af, Icon wannabe, front-runner Diva Princess.

If any of those white QB's acted like Newton after a loss they'd never live it down.

Don't give me "I just hate to lose", everybody does, yet everybody but Newton can handle it like a grown-ass man.

[Joel]

I'm surprised no one is talking about how most of those hits were outside the pocket where he is classified as a runner.
The other half of the Stephen A. Smith/Skip Bayless shit show discussed that in a different video, specifically saying he wasn't arguing those cases, only the ones where Cam was indisputably a PASSER. The problem (as alluded to there and elsewhere) is that even in those cases Cam's one of those QBs who's made his name in large part because he shrugs off and fights out of sacks to either fire a strike or scramble for a first down. Big Ben was cited as a similar example.

PASSERS like that must be treated as runners even when they're not, because they can and often do instantly morph into one at any time.

The "Cam is the new Shaq" argument's also entertaining; so Cam's an overrated unskilled player who dominates by sheer physical force that must be countered with the same? Then we're right where we should be, though Cam throws FAR more accurately than Shaq EVER could (my best friend always referred to him as Doink.)

[Joel]

Was it dirty when Cam Newton's jumbo sized linebacker body knocked our DB's to the ground?
Or when Cam was walking back to the huddle and shoved his shoulder into the back of a Broncos DB he had 30-40 lb. on, or on the running play where Cam threw a BLOCK on a LB he outweighed by 20 lb? If Cam wants to play QB like a FB (or LB) he's going to receive the same kind of punishment he dishes out to others.

[Simple Jaded]

Shaquille O'Neal unskilled and overrated because he can't shoot FT's?

[spikerman]

I don't know the NFL rule, but I do know that at the college level Stewart would have been ejected for his hit since that was a clear example of targeting. None of the other ones stood out to me, but I need to re-watch the game.

[Simple Jaded]

Yeah they don't **** around in college.

[LawDog]

I don't know the NFL rule, but I do know that at the college level Stewart would have been ejected for his hit since that was a clear example of targeting. None of the other ones stood out to me, but I need to re-watch the game.

You should rewatch the game. I did specifically watching for the hits on Newton. The only one I had issue with was by Marshall, he clearly launches up and hits Newton straight in the facemask. I don't know what college calls "targeting, but I disagree that Stewart targeted. Cam was running out to his left and would have kept running but saw Stewart coming up and chose to dump the ball rather than lose yards. Stewart turns his head and leads with his shoulder - a perfectly fine hit on a runner - what I saw was Newton's arm/shoulder/head coming down as a result of the throw. The result was their helmets hitting. I don't see how Stewart could have changed direction to avoid it.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I don't think they played dirty. However, if a defense was flying around puttin the hurt on our qb I'd probably be screaming. :laugh:

[Hawgdriver]

Unless there is a game on, I never watch ESPN.

They have been a shit show for years.

I used to use the website but that's a shit show now, too.

[GEM]

I don't think they played dirty. However, if a defense was flying around puttin the hurt on our qb I'd probably be screaming. :laugh:

If said qb was running around being mouthy, he should have probably expected it. :lol:

[GEM]

Broncos defense to the mouthy biatch:

9425

[spikerman]

You should rewatch the game. I did specifically watching for the hits on Newton. The only one I had issue with was by Marshall, he clearly launches up and hits Newton straight in the facemask. I don't know what college calls "targeting, but I disagree that Stewart targeted. Cam was running out to his left and would have kept running but saw Stewart coming up and chose to dump the ball rather than lose yards. Stewart turns his head and leads with his shoulder - a perfectly fine hit on a runner - what I saw was Newton's arm/shoulder/head coming down as a result of the throw. The result was their helmets hitting. I don't see how Stewart could have changed direction to avoid it.
Stewart led with the crown of his helmet. That was textbook targeting. In college he would have excused himself from the rest of the game.

[TXBRONC]

Stewart led with the crown of his helmet. That was textbook targeting. In college he would have excused himself from the rest of the game.

I don't know Spike. I'm honestly not so sure he lead with crown of his helmet.

[spikerman]

I don't know Spike. I'm honestly not so sure he lead with crown of his helmet.

Ok, it looks pretty blatant to me, but I'm not going to claim to be all-knowing.

[spikerman]

I'll just leave this here for people to decide for themselves. Under college rules (I've conceded that NFL rules may be different), leading and making forcible contact with the crown of the helmet is targeting and warrants an ejection.
9427

And for the record, I really like Stewart.

[LawDog]

I'll just leave this here for people to decide for themselves. Under college rules (I've conceded that NFL rules may be different), leading and making forcible contact with the crown of the helmet is targeting and warrants an ejection.
9427

And for the record, I really like Stewart.

I agree that the crown of his helmet hit Cam in the helmet. And a single screen capture looks blatant, but if you watch it in motion Stewart turns his head and throws his shoulder. The helmet contact was in incidental. Now, I agree with the flag only because he had just thrown the ball, and wouldn't even argue against a fine, however I do not think it was intentional nor targeting - whatever that is. And if Newton had tucked the ball and was running I'm not sure it is a penalty - note that what the Zebra called was roughing the passer.

[spikerman]

I agree that the crown of his helmet hit Cam in the helmet. And a single screen capture looks blatant, but if you watch it in motion Stewart turns his head and throws his shoulder. The helmet contact was in incidental. Now, I agree with the flag only because he had just thrown the ball, and wouldn't even argue against a fine, however I do not think it was intentional nor targeting - whatever that is. And if Newton had tucked the ball and was running I'm not sure it is a penalty - note that what the Zebra called was roughing the passer.

Again, solely going by college rules, it doesn't matter whether he's a runner or not. You can't lead wih the crown of the helmet against any player. The idea is to keep your head up which he did not do. I don't believe the NFL has a "targeting rule" and only calls personal fouls.

[Simple Jaded]

That's a penalty/ejection in college but not in NFL, imo.

[Poet]

Again, solely going by college rules, it doesn't matter whether he's a runner or not. You can't lead wih the crown of the helmet against any player. The idea is to keep your head up which he did not do. I don't believe the NFL has a "targeting rule" and only calls personal fouls.

Is it not possible for a player to lower themselves into a helmet shot? I understand the rule's intent because if a tackler always keeps their head up then that can't happen, but it seems unfair to a tackler to be tasked with that obligation.

[BroncoWave]

Is it not possible for a player to lower themselves into a helmet shot? I understand the rule's intent because if a tackler always keeps their head up then that can't happen, but it seems unfair to a tackler to be tasked with that obligation.

I think it's fair for defenders to be expected to keep their heads up. Lowering your head to make a tackle is the most dangerous way you can tackle someone. You are putting your own health at risk, and you aren't seeing what you hit, which puts the other guy at greater risk too. You can still hit a guy plenty hard and do it while keeping your head up.

[Poet]

I think it's fair for defenders to be expected to keep their heads up. Lowering your head to make a tackle is the most dangerous way you can tackle someone. You are putting your own health at risk, and you aren't seeing what you hit, which puts the other guy at greater risk too. You can still hit a guy plenty hard and do it while keeping your head up.

You can't always keep your head up on the football field. For reference, one of the 'dirty hits' on Cam came fron Von Miller, IIRC. It came from a tackle Von hit him clean and then the contact from the crown arose. That hit is being called dirty but Cam also lowered into it. If he can keep his head up why can't the ball carrier keep their body up? Because they're being tackled? Well, if you can't keep your body up because you're being tackle it logically follows you can't always keep your head up while tackling.

The Stewart hit was accidental -- if the rules are going to penalize him for it, so be it. The Von Miller hit was accidental, much more minor, and almost unavoidable. The rules shouldn't penalize that. The only dirty hit was the one that the defender made via launching himself. That hit plus Newton not being pulled for evaluation should be the 'scandal'. Newton isn't getting the calls that four or five other QB's get. But because he's Cam it's somehow an issue. The whole ******* thing stinks, man.

[spikerman]

That's a penalty/ejection in college but not in NFL, imo.

I think it's still a penalty in the NFL but not an ejection. It's what used to be called "spearing."

[Joel]

I think it's still a penalty in the NFL but not an ejection. It's what used to be called "spearing."
I thought we'd established that spearing's still illegal in the NFL, but you won't live long enough to see an NFL ref call it. You'd think the solution would be to simply start enforcing a decades-old rule, but no, we went and created a WHOLE NEW one and expect it to be enforced better.

FWIW, IMHO, etc. etc. dulce et decorum est, that still's a bit misleading, because Cams follow through lowered his shoulder and head: I'm not sure Stewart would have hit him in the helmet AT ALL otherwise (certainly not with the crown of it squarely on the side of Cams helmet.) I'm not saying it shouldn't be a penalty under the letter of the rules (i.e. "we don't CARE what HARM you do/n't inflict or even TRY to inflict, only WHERE you make contact.) But I don't think Stewart intentionally sought out a headshot; it just unfortunately worked out that way because he and Cam were both still moving, very fast, in close proximity, toward each other.

[spikerman]

I thought we'd established that spearing's still illegal in the NFL, but you won't live long enough to see an NFL ref call it. You'd think the solution would be to simply start enforcing a decades-old rule, but no, we went and created a WHOLE NEW one and expect it to be enforced better.

FWIW, IMHO, etc. etc. dulce et decorum est, that still's a bit misleading, because Cams follow through lowered his shoulder and head: I'm not sure Stewart would have hit him in the helmet AT ALL otherwise (certainly not with the crown of it squarely on the side of Cams helmet.) I'm not saying it shouldn't be a penalty under the letter of the rules (i.e. "we don't CARE what HARM you do/n't inflict or even TRY to inflict, only WHERE you make contact.) But I don't think Stewart intentionally sought out a headshot; it just unfortunately worked out that way because he and Cam were both still moving, very fast, in close proximity, toward each other.
A couple of things: although the act is still a foul you won't find the term "spearing" in any rulebook. Also, when it comes to leading with the crown of the helmet it doesn't matter where on the body the contact is made. The easy solution is to keep your head up to avoid a penalty and potentially paralysis.

[TXBRONC]

Ok, it looks pretty blatant to me, but I'm not going to claim to be all-knowing.

I know you're more like Sergeant Joe Friday. (Just the facts.) :D

[Broncoknight30]

I'll just leave this here for people to decide for themselves. Under college rules (I've conceded that NFL rules may be different), leading and making forcible contact with the crown of the helmet is targeting and warrants an ejection.
9427

And for the record, I really like Stewart.

No it doesn't. He was a scrambling QB. It is still football. The play was a personal foul and he will be fined.

Stop it with the ejection shit.

Thanks.

[BroncoWave]

No it doesn't. He was a scrambling QB. It is still football. The play was a personal foul and he will be fined.

Stop it with the ejection shit.

Thanks.

You need to improve your reading comprehension. He said under COLLEGE rules it would have been an ejection. He didn't say he should have been ejected, as NFL rules are different.

[Broncoknight30]

You need to improve your reading comprehension. He said under COLLEGE rules it would have been an ejection. He didn't say he should have been ejected, as NFL rules are different.

He has said several times in this thread that that hit warrants an ejection.

I read just fine.

[Slick]

Stewart lead with his shoulder. Law Dog is spot on with his analysis of that play.

[Poet]

Cam self-styled. I have laid out the rules for self-styling time and time again!

[I Eat Staples]

Stewart's hit would be a targeting penalty and automatic ejection in college, 100% of the time. That part isn't debatable.

The NFL doesn't have a targeting foul with ejection, but that play is unnecessary roughness/roughing the passer 100% of the time. It was a dumb play by Stewart. Not malicious or dirty, but dumb and dangerous.

Some of you need to seriously chill with the homerism. There is no universe in which that hit isn't a penalty, and none of you would defend it if it were any other team. Or maybe even any other QB since you all hate Cam.

[Poet]

He lead with the shoulder. He ended up hitting Cam with the crown because Cam ducked into it. I don't fault Stewart or Newton. It's football and it happens. That being said, the rules are almost always going to end up with such a play resulting in a penalty. It's not perfect, I can deal with it, but Stewart wasn't being dumb nor he was being dirty.

[BroncoWave]

He has said several times in this thread that that hit warrants an ejection.

I read just fine.

He said under college rules it would warrant an ejection. Obviously you don't read just fine.

[Hawgdriver]

Stewart's hit would be a targeting penalty and automatic ejection in college, 100% of the time. That part isn't debatable.

The NFL doesn't have a targeting foul with ejection, but that play is unnecessary roughness/roughing the passer 100% of the time. It was a dumb play by Stewart. Not malicious or dirty, but dumb and dangerous.

Some of you need to seriously chill with the homerism. There is no universe in which that hit isn't a penalty, and none of you would defend it if it were any other team. Or maybe even any other QB since you all hate Cam.

Hay! Who are you calling you? What's with this "some of you." You need to TARGeT your strikes, homie. Or they be like....what's he talking about? They will just blow you off with your vague verbal challenges.

[Hawgdriver]

He lead with the shoulder. He ended up hitting Cam with the crown because Cam ducked into it. I don't fault Stewart or Newton. It's football and it happens. That being said, the rules are almost always going to end up with such a play resulting in a penalty. It's not perfect, I can deal with it, but Stewart wasn't being dumb nor he was being dirty.

I hereby adopt VK's erudition,

[BroncoJoe]

He lead with the shoulder. He ended up hitting Cam with the crown because Cam ducked into it. I don't fault Stewart or Newton. It's football and it happens. That being said, the rules are almost always going to end up with such a play resulting in a penalty. It's not perfect, I can deal with it, but Stewart wasn't being dumb nor he was being dirty.

Not only that, he was being tackled at the ankles by 48, causing him to begin to go down.

It was a nasty hit, an unfortunate hit, but I really don't believe it was intentional. It's football.

[Poet]

Not only that, he was being tackled at the ankles by 48, causing him to begin to go down.

It was a nasty hit, an unfortunate hit, but I really don't believe it was intentional. It's football.

Exactly. As a football fan, I know that the call will be made each time. While it can be unfair, it results in a betterment of the league overall. Or, in other words, the weak spot in the rules is outweighed.

The rest of this 'dirty' shit and the like is hogwash.

I shall go to another thread.

[I Eat Staples]

He lead with the shoulder. He ended up hitting Cam with the crown because Cam ducked into it. I don't fault Stewart or Newton. It's football and it happens. That being said, the rules are almost always going to end up with such a play resulting in a penalty. It's not perfect, I can deal with it, but Stewart wasn't being dumb nor he was being dirty.


Not only that, he was being tackled at the ankles by 48, causing him to begin to go down.

It was a nasty hit, an unfortunate hit, but I really don't believe it was intentional. It's football.

I don't think Stewart purposely hit him in the head or was trying to injure him at all. But launching into a QB with your shoulder as he releases the ball is always going to be a penalty if you get them high or late. It could have cost us the game.

[Poet]

So he should lead with not his shoulder, helmet, or any other body part? Should he slide tackle him? Corkscrew flip upon him? Moonwalk on him? Exactly what do you want him to do? Stewart didn't launch himself either.

So, if Stewart didn't launch himself, and Newton ducked into it when Stewart was going for a legal hit, what exactly are you mad about? If Newton isn't to be blamed becuase he was getting pulled down then it's hard to blame Stewart either. Honestly I'm not sure what people wanted to have happen there? I guess Stewart should just go lower? It would have been hard to do so from that play.

[Hawgdriver]

Broncos played with honor.

[BroncoWave]

Broncos played with honor.

So they played like Klignons? :D

[weazel]

I think this thread belong in the "things that are foggots" thread

[spikerman]

You need to improve your reading comprehension. He said under COLLEGE rules it would have been an ejection. He didn't say he should have been ejected, as NFL rules are different.

Thank you for taking the time to read what I ACTUALLY wrote.

[Broncoknight30]

Thank you for taking the time to read what I ACTUALLY wrote.

Tell me why you keep bringing up what the rule is in college. What is your point? You seem to be clearly saying that is what you want in the NFL.

If that is not the reason you have brought the college way so many times, then why did you bring that up so many times?

There has to be a reason. Seriously. Why bring it up?

[NightTrainLayne]

Tell me why you keep bringing up what the rule is in college. What is your point? You seem to be clearly saying that is what you want in the NFL.

If that is not the reason you have brought the college way so many times, then why did you bring that up so many times.

There has to be a reason. Seriously. Why bring it up?

He is a college/NCAA referee. He is merely sharing his knowledge of the game, and explicitly stated something along the lines of, "this is how it's called in the NCAA".

[Broncoknight30]

He is a college/NCAA referee. He is merely sharing his knowledge of the game, and explicitly stated something along the lines of, "this is how it's called in the NCAA".

Just stating that fact?

Ok, I thought there was a point he was making in insinuating that it is the way it should be and that is what Stewart deserved.

Really, thought that was the reason he brought that up.

[spikerman]

Nope only that the hit would have been considered ejection-worthy at the college/high school level and was definitely flag-worthy in the NFL. I get that the rules are different, but that was clearly a foul. That's all I was saying.

[Broncoknight30]

Nope only that the hit would have been considered ejection-worthy at the college/high school level and was definitely flag-worthy in the NFL. I get that the rules are different, but that was clearly a foul. That's all I was saying.

Yeah, it was a foul and it was flagged. I also do not agree that it should lead to a player being ejected at any level imo.

Are you committed to a conference?

[spikerman]

Yeah, it was a foul and it was flagged. I also do not agree that it should lead to a player being ejected at any level. Flagged, but ejected?

Are you committed to a conference?

No, I only occasionally do college stuff, but here in Texas we play by college rules.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Tell me why you keep bringing up what the rule is in college. What is your point? You seem to be clearly saying that is what you want in the NFL.

If that is not the reason you have brought the college way so many times, then why did you bring that up so many times?

There has to be a reason. Seriously. Why bring it up?

It's because many people here know him and respect his opinion on these types of calls because he's a high school referee in Texas.

Bring it down a notch please.

[Broncoknight30]

It's because many people here know him and respect his opinion on these types of calls because he's a high school referee in Texas.

Bring it down a notch please.

Yeah, we got it worked out. Did not notice?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Yeah, we got it worked out. Did not notice?

I'm on skimming while I work

[slim]

Does anyone know if the college rule for helmet-to-helmet is different than the NFL rule?

[Poet]

I was with you, Spiker.

[BroncoWave]

Does anyone know if the college rule for helmet-to-helmet is different than the NFL rule?

I don't know, I'm still trying to google color rush.

[I Eat Staples]

So he should lead with not his shoulder, helmet, or any other body part? Should he slide tackle him? Corkscrew flip upon him? Moonwalk on him? Exactly what do you want him to do? Stewart didn't launch himself either.

So, if Stewart didn't launch himself, and Newton ducked into it when Stewart was going for a legal hit, what exactly are you mad about? If Newton isn't to be blamed becuase he was getting pulled down then it's hard to blame Stewart either. Honestly I'm not sure what people wanted to have happen there? I guess Stewart should just go lower? It would have been hard to do so from that play.

I think the anger over the hits to Newton is a ridiculous overreaction. I don't think we played dirty at all. All I'm saying is that Stewart's hit is definitely a penalty, and a play he should avoid to prevent putting his team in a bad position. Even if you lead with the shoulder, you can't go high on a QB or receiver, at all. He should have just put his shoulder into his chest/abdomen, or not even hit him at all considering he released the ball.

I'm not a fan of how protected the QB is either, but unfortunately that's the rule.

[Poet]

How high can be really be going when the QB has to duck into it to get hit in the head, though?

[I Eat Staples]

How high can be really be going when the QB has to duck into it to get hit in the head, though?

Cam is really big, and he didn't duck THAT much.

[Broncoknight30]

Yeah, Inside the NFL is of course suggesting that the "white QBs" would have had more calls. They did not say it was because Cam is black, but that is what Irvin and J Brown are insinuating.

[Poet]

Cam is really big, and he didn't duck THAT much.

I guess they should just dive at the knees from now on.

[BroncoWave]

I guess they should just dive at the knees from now on.

There is a huge area between the head and the knees you can hit. Ever heard of wrapping up around their torso? You know, a good form tackle?

[I Eat Staples]

I guess they should just dive at the knees from now on.

Yeah, that's the conundrum. TJ Ward gets called dirty for hitting Gronk in the knee, but he's not allowed to go high. There's a strike zone for QBs now, and probably will be with receivers soon.

[JPPT1974]

You can't hit the QB over the head. Or around the neck. In the roughing the passer.

[LawDog]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000702199/article/blandino-posture-key-to-cam-newtons-protection

Oh this clears everything right up. So Newton can go from a passer, to a runner, and back to a passer all on the same play. WTF Blandino? How the F are defenders going to be able to make that split second decision as to whether he's a runner or a passer? FFS.

[Joel]

Yeah, Inside the NFL is of course suggesting that the "white QBs" would have had more calls. They did not say it was because Cam is black, but that is what Irvin and J Brown are insinuating.
Six of one. I agree with Shannon that "OF COURSE Brady gets that call, every time," but not because he's white: Because he's a pocket passer. I strongly DISAGREE with those saying Big Ben EVER gets that call, or even Luck or Rodgers. Even while still in the pocket as a non-runner, when a guy's MADE HIS NAME by shrugging off LBs and scrambling free to either fire a TD or convert a first down on his own, defenders will treat him like a RB: Because they MUST.

I honestly believe a double standard drives all this, but it's not black vs. white: It's run vs. pass.

Where was all this handwringing over head shots last January, when Ryan Shazier delivered a helmet-to-helmet on Jeremy Hill so hard it KNOCKED HIM OUT (along with the ball)? After a 6 yd gain when Cincy had 1st and 10 at the Pitt 26, up by a point well inside FG range AND the 2:00 Warning? All that BS about the BENGALS headhunting Antonio Brown out of the game, causing a penalty that caused ANOTHER penalty that put them in range of the game-winning FG?

Never should've happened. Never WOULD'VE if the officials had thrown the same flag on the very play that gave Pitt the ball in the first place (incidentally a game-clinching Cincy score that probably doesn't allow Pitt ANY final possession.) So why DID it happen?

Because Jeremy Hill's not a WR nor QB, just a RB: So :censored: him. It's a passing league, and everyone not involved in that is just supporting cast cannon fodder. The only time you'll see a helmet-to-helmet flag on a RUN is when a RB is penalized and fined for lowering HIS head to PROTECT it from a hit by that harmless defenseless LB. Y'know, the innocent LB who'll pay the identical penalty and fine for the VERY NEXT PLAY, when he helmet-to-helmets the QB on the resulting 1st and 25.

As nauseatingly and dangerously biased as that is, dual-threat "passing runners" like Cam take its absurdity up to 11: What happens when BOTH extremes of the same double standard apply to THE SAME PLAYER? This, internet; this happens....

[Joel]

He lead with the shoulder. He ended up hitting Cam with the crown because Cam ducked into it. I don't fault Stewart or Newton. It's football and it happens. That being said, the rules are almost always going to end up with such a play resulting in a penalty. It's not perfect, I can deal with it, but Stewart wasn't being dumb nor he was being dirty.
Very (if not completely ;)) thorough and accurate assessment. Likewise the point about Stewart "launching:" While I concede only seeing the clips, he never leaves his feet in any of them, so never launches. He LUNGES, so the crown of his helmet's actually LOWER than his erect 6'2" height—but he STILL hits Cam squarely in the helmet: Because Cams head and shoulders drop as he follows through on the throw. Not malicious, just unfortunate and unavoidable.

To be clear: I'm not saying Cam "intentionally" dropped his head to "draw" the flag either (because, OMFG, who would DELIBERATELY scramble their own brains like that? That's a good argument a brain "was like that when I got here.") It's just football.

I realize how that sounds, but am reaching the point I don't CARE: Everyone who wants to hear it as "it's just dog fighting" will, with or without my encouragement, and irrespective of the facts. I've about given up on maintaining the nuance between "tough" or "mean" and "dirty." We must all just accept that Reggie White was a ***** because he never clubbed an opponent in the back of the head when the refs couldn't see it. :(

[Slick]

Stewart's hit would be a targeting penalty and automatic ejection in college, 100% of the time. That part isn't debatable.

The NFL doesn't have a targeting foul with ejection, but that play is unnecessary roughness/roughing the passer 100% of the time. It was a dumb play by Stewart. Not malicious or dirty, but dumb and dangerous.

Some of you need to seriously chill with the homerism. There is no universe in which that hit isn't a penalty, and none of you would defend it if it were any other team. Or maybe even any other QB since you all hate Cam.

It's not homerism. If Cam wants to squeeze every last second out of each and every play, he's going to get blasted. Denver's D is going to punish any QB that does that. It's clear as day to me that Stewart charged up to lay the shoulder into him. As a result, their helmets collided.

Stewart just got fined almost $19,000 as a result. I'm okay with the fine and the penalty. It's the rule, but I don't think Stewart maliciously tried to go helmet to helmet there.

[Slick]

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/slickdonkey7/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif (http://s179.photobucket.com/user/slickdonkey7/media/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif.html)

This gif from the Superbowl is a perfect example. Cam has nowhere to go with the football but waits until the last second to get rid of it. As a result, Wolfe lays into him. The difference is, Wolfe's body position and Cam retreating kept their helmets from colliding as ferociously. Cam still got his bell rung.

QBs like Brady and Manning don't take shots like that because they play a different style and because they're smarter than Cam.

[Mike]

Stewart just got fined almost $19,000 as a result. I'm okay with the fine and the penalty. It's the rule, but I don't think Stewart maliciously tried to go helmet to helmet there.

I agree completely. That hit wasn't dirty, cheap, or intentional. Losing the yards sucks, but it is who our defense is. They play and hit hard. I want them to keep doing that. It sets the tone and gets in the other teams head. Keep laying the wood boys.

[Broncoknight30]

It's not homerism. If Cam wants to squeeze every last second out of each and every play, he's going to get blasted. Denver's D is going to punish any QB that does that. It's clear as day to me that Stewart charged up to lay the shoulder into him. As a result, their helmets collided.

Stewart just got fined almost $19,000 as a result. I'm okay with the fine and the penalty. It's the rule, but I don't think Stewart maliciously tried to go helmet to helmet there.

I don't think it is malicious. I do think it is very unwise though. In todays overly sensitive NFL, officials keeping their eyes on any helmet to helmet, he has to be far more aware of the circumstance. He was playing hard football. Being a bit too old school if you will imo.

Players need to be more aware that that will be called just about every time. I do think Marshall got away with one. However, Cam was representing that he was going to run. The broadcasters even thought he was over the line on that play. He did launch at his head however, and I thought that could have and perhaps should have been called.


However, when the ESPN types run these on a loop, I do not think this falls under a penalty. Close, but no. Not imo.

https://ingettlemanwetrust.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/giphy.gif

And please give me a break about this one too.

https://usatthebiglead.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/cam-newton-takes-helmet-to-helmet-hit-against-broncos.gif?w=1000

That was incidental. That should not be called. I do not care if there is some rule that says ANY hit. It is a dumb rule and it was a good no call. What just pisses me off is how the ESPN types and rest try to stir the race narrative and suggest it is racism. That is what they are saying too.

Last I saw Brady is suspended for 4 games for the most ridiculous thing we may have ever seen. Sean Peyton was suspended for a YEAR for something that was never proven that he approved.

Anyway, you get the point. Stewart's hit while not malicious imo, was foolish all the same. Should have been flagged.

[TXBRONC]

It's not homerism. If Cam wants to squeeze every last second out of each and every play, he's going to get blasted. Denver's D is going to punish any QB that does that. It's clear as day to me that Stewart charged up to lay the shoulder into him. As a result, their helmets collided.

Stewart just got fined almost $19,000 as a result. I'm okay with the fine and the penalty. It's the rule, but I don't think Stewart maliciously tried to go helmet to helmet there.

Well said Slick.

[Slick]

Big Ben does the same thing except he's not as fast. He gets clocked a lot. He's always hurt. The thing him and Cam have in common is trying to extend the play until the last millisecond. They're tough and brave for doing so but they're going to pay the price. They're both big dudes and defenses have to lay the wood to get them down.

This whole thing Cam's dad said trying to make it about race really pissed me off. It's not about race, Mr Newton, it's about how your son plays the position.

[LawDog]

I don't think it is malicious. I do think it is very unwise though. In todays overly sensitive NFL, officials keeping their eyes on any helmet to helmet, he has to be far more aware of the circumstance. He was playing hard football. Being a bit too old school if you will imo.

Players need to be more aware that that will be called just about every time. I do think Marshall got away with one. However, Cam was representing that he was going to run. The broadcasters even thought he was over the line on that play. He did launch at his head however, and I thought that could have and perhaps should have been called.


However, when the ESPN types run these on a loop, I do not think this falls under a penalty. Close, but no. Not imo.

https://ingettlemanwetrust.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/giphy.gif

And please give me a break about this one too.

https://usatthebiglead.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/cam-newton-takes-helmet-to-helmet-hit-against-broncos.gif?w=1000

That was incidental. That should not be called. I do not care if there is some rule that says ANY hit. It is a dumb rule and it was a good no call. What just pisses me off is how the ESPN types and rest try to stir the race narrative and suggest it is racism. That is what they are saying too.

Last I saw Brady is suspended for 4 games for the most ridiculous thing we may have ever seen. Sean Peyton was suspended for a YEAR for something that was never proven that he approved.

Anyway, you get the point. Stewart's hit while not malicious imo, was foolish all the same. Should have been flagged.

The first GIF shows exactly what I'm talking about with Blandino's asinine comment about passer-runner-passer. There's not another white jersey anywhere downfield that Newton could possibly be throwing to*. He tosses the ball at the last second to try and avoid the sack. Grounding or not, in that situation he has to be treated as a runner because that's how he plays and he deserved to get tackled, cleanly, and aggressively. I love that, I may just let it run on my screen all day. *No other white jerseys until the very end when some Panther comes up and starts shoving Sly in the back after the play was dead.

[Broncoknight30]

Big Ben does the same thing except he's not as fast. He gets clocked a lot. He's always hurt. The thing him and Cam have in common is trying to extend the play until the last millisecond. They're tough and brave for doing so but they're going to pay the price. They're both big dudes and defenses have to lay the wood to get them down.

This whole thing Cam's dad said trying to make it about race really pissed me off. It's not about race, Mr Newton, it's about how your son plays the position.

Everything is the race card now. The sports networks are as much filled pushing the race card as they are sports. Maybe even more so. I was just watching Shannon and Skip and Sharpe is yelling about how "bad" it has been being a black man in America. How white men really do not have any stress at all. Fits right in with the whole narrative in this political year and victimology has always been far more vital in election years for a particular party.

It makes all of us sick and the thing that causes me such stress is it is not going to get any better. They say they want an honest discussion. Trust me, that is the last thing they want. Cam's father just falls right in line with the narrative foisted on us on a virtual 24 hour a day cycle.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-zJL9JuOLQ

At least the new South Park is playing tonight to give us a little comic relief for this avalanche of racial tension.

[BigDaddyBronco]

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/slickdonkey7/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif (http://s179.photobucket.com/user/slickdonkey7/media/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif.html)

This gif from the Superbowl is a perfect example. Cam has nowhere to go with the football but waits until the last second to get rid of it. As a result, Wolfe lays into him. The difference is, Wolfe's body position and Cam retreating kept their helmets from colliding as ferociously. Cam still got his bell rung.

QBs like Brady and Manning don't take shots like that because they play a different style and because they're smarter than Cam.

And that is a great hit as it can separate a shoulder if Cam lands differently. It's on Cam to play differently if he doesn't want to get hit.

[Broncoknight30]

And that is a great hit as it can separate a shoulder if Cam lands differently. It's on Cam to play differently if he doesn't want to get hit.

Look at the way he cried about it. Embarrassing.

[BigDaddyBronco]

Look at the way he cried about it. Embarrassing.

Not even a cry, more like a fit or tantrum. He hasn't been told no a whole lot in his life, well until SB50.

[EastCoastBronco]

I said it before and I'll say it again...
If we did that to Brady or Rogers or Manning the laundry would never have stopped.
It's not a race thing, it's a "Big QB" thing.
I seriously think that the refs switch a gear when guys like Big Ben or Cam are playing.
I think our defence took what the refs gave them and ran with it.
Our D is an aggressive bunch and it is up to the refs to determine how aggressive it gets out there.

In my opinion, the Marshall hit and the Stewart hit were targeting and cheap and dirty.
Anybody who has played ball is full of shit if they don't think that those 2 hits by Stewart and Marshall weren't deliberate attempts to get him out of the game.
That's a conscious choice and it's dirty.

Every other thing our D did was good old fashioned defence.
I loved it.

Did anyone notice that we played a whole Super Bowl against him and never came near his head?

[BroncoJoe]

And that is a great hit as it can separate a shoulder if Cam lands differently. It's on Cam to play differently if he doesn't want to get hit.

LOL - his head hit the ground harder during his fit than the actual tackle.

[Slick]

I said it before and I'll say it again...
If we did that to Brady or Rogers or Manning the laundry would never have stopped.
It's not a race thing, it's a "Big QB" thing.
I seriously think that the refs switch a gear when guys like Big Ben or Cam are playing.
I think our defence took what the refs gave them and ran with it.
Our D is an aggressive bunch and it is up to the refs to determine how aggressive it gets out there.

In my opinion, the Marshall hit and the Stewart hit were targeting and cheap and dirty.
Anybody who has played ball is full of shit if they don't think that those 2 hits by Stewart and Marshall weren't deliberate attempts to get him out of the game.
That's a conscious choice and it's dirty.

Every other thing our D did was good old fashioned defence.
I loved it.

Did anyone notice that we played a whole Super Bowl against him and never came near his head?

The difference with Brady and Manning is they wouldn't allow themselves to take shots like that. They get rid of the ball much sooner. Teams still wanted to hit them just as hard, they just do/did a better job of avoiding those types of hits or getting rid of the ball.

Rodgers plays like Ben and Cam too at times. He's been hurt because of it. I think now that he's matured as a player he's taking less hits.

[Broncoknight30]

The difference with Brady and Manning is they wouldn't allow themselves to take shots like that. They get rid of the ball much sooner. Teams still wanted to hit them just as hard, they just do/did a better job of avoiding those types of hits or getting rid of the ball.

Rodgers plays like Ben and Cam too at times. He's been hurt because of it. I think now that he's matured as a player he's taking less hits.

I saw the stats for the AFC championship game. He was hit like 18 times.

Brady takes his share of hits. He admittedly cries a lot too. One of the reasons I can't stand him.

Whatever.....

QBs that run historically suffer greater hits and often more concussions. Not exactly new in the NFL either. Staubach and Young both known for their scrambling both retired due to concussions.

Anyway, Cam dishes out abuse on DBs too and if people knew the game, they would know offensive players often initiate contact. Cam has while running. Show me once when he flagged for ever being flagged for helmet to helmet.

[Slick]

I saw the stats for the AFC championship game. He was hit like 18 times.

Brady takes his share of hits. He admittedly cries a lot too. One of the reasons I can't stand him.

Whatever.....

QBs that run historically suffer greater hits and often more concussions. Not exactly new in the NFL either. Staubach and Young both known for their scrambling both retired due to concussions.

Anyway, Cam dishes out abuse on DBs too and if people knew the game, they would know offensive players often initiate contact. Cam has while running. Show me once when he flagged for ever being flagged for helmet to helmet.

True, but Brady had no choice in that game. Denver's secondary played great and the pass rush was on point. Brady doesn't normally get beat on like that though.

[Broncoknight30]

True, but Brady had no choice in that game. Denver's secondary played great and the pass rush was on point. Brady doesn't normally get beat on like that though.

Yeah. He has made a living out of staying in a sterilized pocket between the center and guards. He has historically been very difficult to blitz. His rating against 5 or more rushers is uncanny.

His kryptonite has always been when the center and guards get pushed into his face.

[MOtorboat]

The Broncos have been fined a total of $42,540, per AP.

Marshall is receiving the biggest fine at $24,300. Stewart got $18,231.

[LawDog]

The Broncos have been fined a total of $42,540, per AP.

Marshall is receiving the biggest fine at $24,300. Stewart got $18,231.

That feels about right considering the difference between the two.

[EastCoastBronco]

I don't remember any headshots on Brady (intentional or not) in the AFC Championship game.
We beat the hell out of his body, not his head.
Like I said, it's a choice to play dirty or clean.

[Broncoknight30]

I don't remember any headshots on Brady (intentional or not) in the AFC Championship game.
We beat the hell out of his body, not his head.
Like I said, it's a choice to play dirty or clean.

Show where cam newton's head was targeted that we did not address.

[LawDog]

I don't remember any headshots on Brady (intentional or not) in the AFC Championship game.
We beat the hell out of his body, not his head.
Like I said, it's a choice to play dirty or clean.

Except for the Brandon Marshall launch right into Newton's face, the rest were NOT DIRTY. And, we plunked Newton in the chest plenty of times, even in the second half. There was no change of gameplan to start head-shotting Newton. Point being, I think you are off base with your assertion that the Broncos made a choice to play "dirty", outside of the one hit by Marshall.

[Hawgdriver]

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/slickdonkey7/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif (http://s179.photobucket.com/user/slickdonkey7/media/wolfe_zpsn4nbxhrl.gif.html)

This gif from the Superbowl is a perfect example. Cam has nowhere to go with the football but waits until the last second to get rid of it. As a result, Wolfe lays into him. The difference is, Wolfe's body position and Cam retreating kept their helmets from colliding as ferociously. Cam still got his bell rung.

QBs like Brady and Manning don't take shots like that because they play a different style and because they're smarter than Cam.

Yeah, Cam has a big ego (in the athletic sense) and this is his just dessert. He plays at the very edge of his abilities and that's what the edge promises--physical punishment. It seems like a super simple math equation to me. Like you said, Slick. You said it better tho.

[tripp]

I know he's not for everyone but man I love Shannon Sharpe. Having Ray Lewis' opinion also was awesome to hear. It's so true though, I'm not sure any QB in this league is stronger physically than Cam Newton. If we play like that all season long, I don't think Alex Smith, David Carr, or Philip Rivers stand a chance. They're going to be tossing the ball up after holding it for 2 seconds in fear of getting smashed.

This is a side of Broncos football I haven't had the pleasure of seeing (outside of last year) in my time as a Broncos fan since 2001.

[TXBRONC]

I don't remember any headshots on Brady (intentional or not) in the AFC Championship game.
We beat the hell out of his body, not his head.
Like I said, it's a choice to play dirty or clean.

I still don't think they were playing dirty

[spikerman]

After all of my talking I saw some film from a game I had last week where I missed a late hit. At the time I thought it was a bang bang play, but seeing it on film I realize that I missed it. It happens. I mention it here only to show that I don't hold my opinion above anybody else's and realize that players and officials alike are fallible.

[Hawgdriver]

After all of my talking I saw some film from a game I had last week where I missed a late hit. At the time I thought it was a bang bang play, but seeing it on film I realize that I missed it. It happens. I mention it here only to show that I don't hold my opinion above anybody else's and realize that players and officials alike are fallible.

idk dude. Some of the posters here are pretty much perfect.

[TXBRONC]

After all of my talking I saw some film from a game I had last week where I missed a late hit. At the time I thought it was a bang bang play, but seeing it on film I realize that I missed it. It happens. I mention it here only to show that I don't hold my opinion above anybody else's and realize that players and officials alike are fallible.

I hold your opinions in very high regard.

[spikerman]

I hold your opinions in very high regard.

Thank you, sir.

[Broncoknight30]

After all of my talking I saw some film from a game I had last week where I missed a late hit. At the time I thought it was a bang bang play, but seeing it on film I realize that I missed it. It happens. I mention it here only to show that I don't hold my opinion above anybody else's and realize that players and officials alike are fallible.

The problem as I see them are ambiguous rules (especially at the NFL level.) If you are reffing a HS game, there is no video or "replay." Everything I would imagine is bang bang. I used to be a scout for UGA in the early 2000s. It was harder than many would think going to a HS game and needing to get video on a player. Angles etc were problematic.

I talked to many refs (HS football in South FLorida) and they commented often about that very thing that you are referring to.

It was an interesting time. My HS coach was DC for UGA. His name is Brian Van Gorder. He is with Notre Dame now, and was DC for the Falcons from 2008-2011. Anyway, my point is that there are more rules foisted on you every year. New things to look for and different judgments to be made. How do you separate the "big hits" from someone that is targeting? Sometimes it is obvious, but I am sure other times not so much.

When I played (Was a walk on at FSU) in HS, I cannot remember a moment when I was thinking I need to NOT hit this guy all that hard, cause the ref may think I am targeting. I mean thinking back on it, I was always "targeting." How does one not play at full speed? Especially the positions I played. Fullback and LB. I cannot imagine a football player, while on the field in the heat of it, needs to change the thought process from full speed, to not full speed.

Right now, I do not think I am alone in this, the game of tackle football is on a clock in this country. Too much attention about concussions and it is not going to stop. Pretty soon insurance companies (especially when that becomes nationalized) will not cover tackle football at the youth level. Then HS will not be able to insure their players. That is how the dominoes will fall and that is how it will end imo.

Right now, you refs have too much on your plate as it is. With a national media constantly reporting about concussions and the absurd notion that the game could ever be safe, it is only a matter of time. It can't. The NFL is in a tough spot and all they can do is show they are proactive. However, count on older players dying and subsequent autopsies will show effects of CTE.

I do find it interesting how hockey is not attacked relentlessly. They have a lot of concussions to say the least. The NHL plays 82 games. That is for the constant criticism about the NFL having Thursday night games and how horrible it is for the players. I mean they have 16 games compared to 82 in hockey. Hockey players play 3 or 4 times every week for like 6 months. Why wasn't Gordie Howe given an autopsy. I am certain he must have had issues. He played in an era (for like 30 years btw) where the goalies did not wear helmets. Think about that.

Anyway, I do not envy your position and the demands it has on you.

[Davii]

I was with you, Spiker.

Damn right. You want that scotch if you ever make a tailgate.

[spikerman]

The problem as I see them are ambiguous rules (especially at the NFL level.) If you are reffing a HS game, there is no video or "replay." Everything I would imagine is bang bang. I used to be a scout for UGA in the early 2000s. It was harder than many would think going to a HS game and needing to get video on a player. Angles etc were problematic.

I talked to many refs (HS football in South FLorida) and they commented often about that very thing that you are referring to.

It was an interesting time. My HS coach was DC for UGA. His name is Brian Van Gorder. He is with Notre Dame now, and was DC for the Falcons from 2008-2011. Anyway, my point is that there are more rules foisted on you every year. New things to look for and different judgments to be made. How do you separate the "big hits" from someone that is targeting? Sometimes it is obvious, but I am sure other times not so much.

When I played (Was a walk on at FSU) in HS, I cannot remember a moment when I was thinking I need to NOT hit this guy all that hard, cause the ref may think I am targeting. I mean thinking back on it, I was always "targeting." How does one not play at full speed? Especially the positions I played. Fullback and LB. I cannot imagine a football player, while on the field in the heat of it, needs to change the thought process from full speed, to not full speed.

Right now, I do not think I am alone in this, the game of tackle football is on a clock in this country. Too much attention about concussions and it is not going to stop. Pretty soon insurance companies (especially when that becomes nationalized) will not cover tackle football at the youth level. Then HS will not be able to insure their players. That is how the dominoes will fall and that is how it will end imo.

Right now, you refs have too much on your plate as it is. With a national media constantly reporting about concussions and the absurd notion that the game could ever be safe, it is only a matter of time. It can't. The NFL is in a tough spot and all they can do is show they are proactive. However, count on older players dying and subsequent autopsies will show effects of CTE.

I do find it interesting how hockey is not attacked relentlessly. They have a lot of concussions to say the least. The NHL plays 82 games. That is for the constant criticism about the NFL having Thursday night games and how horrible it is for the players. I mean they have 16 games compared to 82 in hockey. Hockey players play 3 or 4 times every week for like 6 months. Why wasn't Gordie Howe given an autopsy. I am certain he must have had issues. He played in an era (for like 30 years btw) where the goalies did not wear helmets. Think about that.

Anyway, I do not envy your position and the demands it has on you.
Yeah, I agree about the rules. They're complex. Unfortunately, I can't put the blame anywhere but on me for missing this one. I just kicked it. I feel bad, but I'm human. I just have to put it behind me and get better. I used to work with a nephew of Brian Van Gorder. His name is Brandon. Great kid!

[spikerman]

Damn right. You want that scotch if you ever make a tailgate.

Joe didn't like it, but we know better.

[Valar Morghulis]

Joe didn't like it, but we know better.

Was it the oban again?

Pronounced Obin lol!

[spikerman]

Was it the oban again?

Pronounced Obin lol!
Yes

[Broncoknight30]

Yeah, I agree about the rules. They're complex. Unfortunately, I can't put the blame anywhere but on me for missing this one. I just kicked it. I feel bad, but I'm human. I just have to put it behind me and get better. I used to work with a nephew of Brian Van Gorder. His name is Brandon. Great kid!

Just curious, where did you work with Brandon?

Another side note. My golf club I belong to, one of the starters was AD for a HS named Don Bosco prep from NJ. He was there for close 40 years. One of the top HS programs in the country. They have won several national championships. My old alma mater HS is Plantation American Heritage. Patrick Surtain (ex NFL CB) is the HC there. Well, this guy that was AD for Bosco introduced me to the Don Bosco coach and current AD a few years ago when they came to Florida to play another team.

Well, we all started talking about a game between American Heritage and Don Bosco. It happened a few weeks ago. Heritage beat them 21-0 and that was the first time Bosco was shut out in over 30 years. Mark Richt along with many scouts from around the country were there. I saw Ohio State, Notre Dame.

BTW, Heritage has one of the more interesting recruits. Patrick Surtain jr. He is around 6 foot 2. He runs a sub 4.5 forty. He is going to be a big time recruit. Maybe top in the country next year.

[EastCoastBronco]

Except for the Brandon Marshall launch right into Newton's face, the rest were NOT DIRTY. And, we plunked Newton in the chest plenty of times, even in the second half. There was no change of gameplan to start head-shotting Newton. Point being, I think you are off base with your assertion that the Broncos made a choice to play "dirty", outside of the one hit by Marshall.

If you don't think that Darien Stewart hit was targeting then we are in two different ballparks.

[Broncoknight30]

If you don't think that Darien Stewart hit was targeting then we are in two different ballparks.

Just curious. You ever play the game at any level? Just wondering. Simple yes or no.

[spikerman]

Just curious, where did you work with Brandon?

Another side note. My golf club I belong to, one of the starters was AD for a HS named Don Bosco prep from NJ. He was there for close 40 years. One of the top HS programs in the country. They have won several national championships. My old alma mater HS is Plantation American Heritage. Patrick Surtain (ex NFL CB) is the HC there. Well, this guy that was AD for Bosco introduced me to the Don Bosco coach and current AD a few years ago when they came to Florida to play another team.

Well, we all started talking about a game between American Heritage and Don Bosco. It happened a few weeks ago. Heritage beat them 21-0 and that was the first time Bosco was shut out in over 30 years. Mark Richt along with many scouts from around the country were there. I saw Ohio State, Notre Dame.

BTW, Heritage has one of the more interesting recruits. Patrick Surtain jr. He is around 6 foot 2. He runs a sub 4.5 forty. He is going to be a big time recruit. Maybe top in the country next year.
He was (is?) in the Army. In my job I work with a lot of military folks.

[spikerman]

If you don't think that Darien Stewart hit was targeting then we are in two different ballparks.

Agreed. At the college level that very clearly met the definition of targeting. I don't know what his intent was, but I doubt he'll complain about the fine. Like I said, I like Stewart and won't hold one play against him. I have got to watch the game so I can see the Marshall hit.

[EastCoastBronco]

Just curious. You ever play the game at any level? Just wondering. Simple yes or no.

Yes.
Lets just say I'm fully qualified to tell the difference between an intentional head shot and an incidental one.

[Broncoknight30]

Yes.
Lets just say I'm fully qualified to tell the difference between an intentional head shot and an incidental one.

So, when you played, you were able to play at half speed? As I mentioned in another post, when I played at HS and college level I did not know the meaning of "half speed" or not targeting. For a lack of a better word. I do not remember having a thought in my head where the NOTION of slowing down or hesitating entered my mind.

IMO, you are watching the slow motion over and over again. It is a lot faster than that, and often times you just play instinctively. That is what I think Stewart was doing. Targeting? Yeah. That is what every player does when they tackle. They target.

Also, there is A LOT of taunting going on. Cam Newton is one of the bigger talkers out there. He was venting frustration and being chippy with several Broncos. He initiated a shove with TJ. He lowered his head on Roby. It may sound like excuses for Stewart's FOOLISH play, but it is all a part of the scenario.

That play was flagged, and he was fined. There is nothing else to be said about it.

The bottom line is Cam Newton draws a lot of this on himself. One, his game exposes himself to big hits and that is not even debatable. Two, he talks crap to defenses. Trust me when I tell you defenses HATE offensive players who celebrate, or talk crap and then whine if they are touched. An offensive player is just inviting viciousness. It is a gladiator sport that is just the way it is. It is not golf, and it is tennis. Ok?

Meaning there is a bigger picture here that you seem to ignore when it comes to this situation.

What pisses me off (as I am watching Mike and Mike) is they are saying not one penalty was called on Newton as they keep playing the Stewart hit over and over again. He was flagged for it. OK? He was flagged for it. Someone tell ESPN that Stewart was flagged and fined for it.

[EastCoastBronco]

So, when you played, you were able to play at half speed? As I mentioned in another post, when I played at HS and college level I did not know the meaning of "half speed" or not targeting. For a lack of a better word. I do not remember having a thought in my head where the NOTION of slowing down or hesitating entered my mind.

IMO, you are watching the slow motion over and over again. It is a lot faster than that, and often times you just play instinctively. That is what I think Stewart was doing. Targeting? Yeah. That is what every player does when they tackle. They target.

Also, there is A LOT of taunting going on. Cam Newton is one of the bigger talkers out there. He was venting frustration and being chippy with several Broncos. He initiated a shove with TJ. He lowered his head on Roby. It may sound like excuses for Stewart's FOOLISH play, but it is all a part of the scenario.

That play was flagged, and he was fined. There is nothing else to be said about it.

The bottom line is Cam Newton draws a lot of this on himself. One, his game exposes himself to big hits and that is not even debatable. Two, he talks crap to defenses. Trust me when I tell you defenses HATE offensive players who celebrate, or talk crap and then whine if they are touched. An offensive player is just inviting viciousness. It is a gladiator sport that is just the way it is. It is not golf, and it is tennis. Ok?

Meaning there is a bigger picture here that you seem to ignore when it comes to this situation.

What pisses me off (as I am watching Mike and Mike) is they are saying not one penalty was called on Newton as they keep playing the Stewart hit over and over again. He was flagged for it. OK? He was flagged for it. Someone tell ESPN that Stewart was flagged and fined for it.

You seem to be taking this personally.
Not sure why.

I played for linebacker for 10 years: Pee Wee, High School and University.
Learned how to tackle the correct way...and the incorrect way...;-)
Played at game speed, same as you.

I'm not questioning anybody's character here.
At that point in time those 2 players chose to take a deliberate headshot.
Intentional headshots at any level...are dirty play.
It happens. I'm as guilty of it as they are.
It is what it is.

Just calling them like I see them....and, to quote Uncle Bill, "Moving on to Cincinnati"...

[BroncoWave]

Just curious. You ever play the game at any level? Just wondering. Simple yes or no.

Dude, don't be Mr. "I played and you didn't". That is literally the most annoying type of fan to talk to. Some of the best coaches and GMs in the league never played past the high school level.

[Broncoknight30]

Dude, don't be Mr. "I played and you didn't". That is literally the most annoying type of fan to talk to. Some of the best coaches and GMs in the league never played past the high school level.

Just asked him question.

[BroncoWave]

Just asked him question.

That's fine, just know that no one will take you seriously when you start playing the "I played football" card.

[LawDog]

If you don't think that Darien Stewart hit was targeting then we are in two different ballparks.

Listen to Mike Perreira (SP?) interview on Dan Patrick this morning. He says specifically that he would have a problem with the college "targeting" rule being implemented in the NFL because the college rule, as currently written, is too vague. And I think that is the exact issue that many of us are having in this instance. There is a difference between the Marshall and Stewart hits. I, and others, have said we don't have a problem with Stewart being flagged and fined. The problem with the term "targeting" is that it implies an intent to hit Newton in the head. Marshall clearly went for the head. Stewart, IMHO, did not. Stewart lead with his shoulder and hit Newton in the upper arm/bicep area with his left shoulder. Their helmets also hit, but it appears to me that it was, in fact, incidental. To call that targeting (or head-hunting, or whatever) is not accurate. If the NFL wants to include that sort of rule, it needs to be much more clear on what exactly they are looking at. That is all. We're in the same ballbark, just need to be more precise in what we are talking about.

[GEM]

Big Ben does the same thing except he's not as fast. He gets clocked a lot. He's always hurt. The thing him and Cam have in common is trying to extend the play until the last millisecond. They're tough and brave for doing so but they're going to pay the price. They're both big dudes and defenses have to lay the wood to get them down.

This whole thing Cam's dad said trying to make it about race really pissed me off. It's not about race, Mr Newton, it's about how your son plays the position.

Anything from his dad is to be taken with a grain of salt...he's a cheating scoundrel.

[Davii]

Joe didn't like it, but we know better.

It aggravated his labia.

[BroncoJoe]

Joe didn't like it, but we know better.


It aggravated his labia.

I hate you both.

[EastCoastBronco]

Listen to Mike Perreira (SP?) interview on Dan Patrick this morning. He says specifically that he would have a problem with the college "targeting" rule being implemented in the NFL because the college rule, as currently written, is too vague. And I think that is the exact issue that many of us are having in this instance. There is a difference between the Marshall and Stewart hits. I, and others, have said we don't have a problem with Stewart being flagged and fined. The problem with the term "targeting" is that it implies an intent to hit Newton in the head. Marshall clearly went for the head. Stewart, IMHO, did not. Stewart lead with his shoulder and hit Newton in the upper arm/bicep area with his left shoulder. Their helmets also hit, but it appears to me that it was, in fact, incidental. To call that targeting (or head-hunting, or whatever) is not accurate. If the NFL wants to include that sort of rule, it needs to be much more clear on what exactly they are looking at. That is all. We're in the same ballbark, just need to be more precise in what we are talking about.

I've watched that Stewart hit 20 times in super slo mo and what I see is a dude lowering his head and aiming the top of his helmet at Newton's face.
To me it's the left shoulder contact that is incidental...;-)
Call it what you will but it will be hard to convince me that Stewart wasn't deliberately looking to take Newton's head off.
I see the same type of launching that Marshall did.
It's no biggie.
I just don't see what a lot of people are seeing.

[TXBRONC]

At the end of day Stewart was fined he did end up making helmet to helmet contact Newton. He's been fined for so it's time to move on.

[Broncoknight30]

I've watched that Stewart hit 20 times in super slo mo and what I see is a dude lowering his head and aiming the top of his helmet at Newton's face.
To me it's the left shoulder contact that is incidental...;-)
Call it what you will but it will be hard to convince me that Stewart wasn't deliberately looking to take Newton's head off.
I see the same type of launching that Marshall did.
It's no biggie.
I just don't see what a lot of people are seeing.

Yeah, I agree. It was a foolish play. He probably was trying to take his head off. My point is that is the nature of the game. He needs to be wiser. He was flagged and fined.

I think my contention is it is harder than people think to ask players to NOT play instinctively. Safeties just play that way. Add to that a mouthy cam newton who does his share of taunting along with his physical nature, the result is not surprising.

[EastCoastBronco]

Yeah, I agree. It was a foolish play. He probably was trying to take his head off. My point is that is the nature of the game. He needs to be wiser. He was flagged and fined.

I think my contention is it is harder than people think to ask players to NOT play instinctively. Safeties just play that way. Add to that a mouthy cam newton who does his share of taunting along with his physical nature, the result is not surprising.


I think I said it earlier but after the game was over I remember thinking, "Man they hit his head a lot in that game".
Call me crazy but I don't remember him getting tagged once in the head during the Super Bowl and they were every bit as aggressive in that game.
Who knows??

Movin' on to Cincinnati...;-)

[Broncoknight30]

I think I said it earlier but after the game was over I remember thinking, "Man they hit his head a lot in that game".
Call me crazy but I don't remember him getting tagged once in the head during the Super Bowl and they were every bit as aggressive in that game.
Who knows??

Movin' on to Cincinnati...;-)

I think he along with the team were having more success running the ball Thursday. I think cam was a bit more chippy too. Whole off season with the loss and hearing how great the Broncos dee was.

I am thinking he was talking a little more than the Thursday game. Hence the rougher play.

What is with Cincinnati? You going to that game?

[Slick]

It never ceases to amaze me how differently people see things from the same replays.

[Valar Morghulis]

i can see both arguments - but the only thing i cant get on board with is somehow Cam's trash talk means he deserved to get hit harder.

that to me sounds like a batterer blaming the victim for mouthing off.......

it also suggests the opposite - that meek qb should be hit softer or more care taken

all qb should be hit as hard as possible all the time, but fairly

[Davii]

i can see both arguments - but the only thing i cant get on board with is somehow Cam's trash talk means he deserved to get hit harder.

that to me sounds like a batterer blaming the victim for mouthing off.......

it also suggests the opposite - that meek qb should be hit softer or more care taken

all qb should be hit as hard as possible all the time, but fairly

I don't think anyone argued he DESERVED to get hit harder, just that it seemed like HE fired up our defense and the end result was that he got hit harder. I don't know though, I didn't read every post in the thread.

[Valar Morghulis]

I don't think anyone argued he DESERVED to get hit harder, just that it seemed like HE fired up our defense and the end result was that he got hit harder. I don't know though, I didn't read every post in the thread.

maybe, for me, it seemed like him mouthing off was being used as justification for him getting him hit

[EastCoastBronco]

What is with Cincinnati? You going to that game?

Nah...It's what Bill Belichick says to reporters when he's done talking about a subject...;-)
"Movin' on to "<insert team name here>"...

[Mike]

maybe, for me, it seemed like him mouthing off was being used as justification for him getting him hit

To me...it is. I don't care if it is wrong. Run your mouth and get served. I like seeing that guy get lit up.

Didn't he even say something like if you don't want me to celebrate then stop me. I love it when guys that jaw like that get punched in the mouth.

[LawDog]

To me...it is. I don't care if it is wrong. Run your mouth and get served. I like seeing that guy get lit up.

Didn't he even say something like if you don't want me to celebrate then stop me. I love it when guys that jaw like that get punched in the mouth.

I agree, at least in part, he needs to get hit cleanly, and aggressively. He needs to think twice before he decides to run, just like QB's needed to think twice before throwing against Champ Bailey. But that's different that saying it is okay for defenders to purposely hit him in the head.

The focus of the thread was what our players were actually doing, were they "playing dirty". The only factor regarding Newton was that he is a big, strong athlete, and he often runs the ball including plays that are designed runs which requires players to defend against him differently from a pure pocket passer. His dabbing, and running his mouth, etc. don't figure into it at all. Compare it to Rivers who runs his mouth constantly.

[EastCoastBronco]

I just wanted to state this for the record...
I really enjoyed watching Newton get the shit kicked out of him by our D.
Dirty and non dirty hits alike.

I was just arguing with the guys who thought the Stewart hit wasn't dirty.

Exit stage left...

[MOtorboat]

i can see both arguments - but the only thing i cant get on board with is somehow Cam's trash talk means he deserved to get hit harder.

that to me sounds like a batterer blaming the victim for mouthing off.......

it also suggests the opposite - that meek qb should be hit softer or more care taken

all qb should be hit as hard as possible all the time, but fairly

I don't think it's fair to compare a naturally violent game to wife beating.

Did he "deserve" the hits? No. But did he play a part in why they occurred? Yes. I do see a couple of the hits as dirty. I think Denver was trying to hit him harder, but I also think they were trying to hit him harder because he's an arrogant ***** who runs his mouth. I can't compare that to the other situation, because at 6-5, 250 (or whatever he is) he lays plenty of punishment out himself.

IMO, the referees probably should have stepped in a little earlier, because by the time he was getting hit, emotions were running high. There were a couple of skirmishes fairly early, just jawing that the refs just kind of let go, that they could have thwarted some of the nastiness in the end, IMO.

[Valar Morghulis]

I don't think it's fair to compare a naturally violent game to wife beating.

Did he "deserve" the hits? No. But did he play a part in why they occurred? Yes. I do see a couple of the hits as dirty. I think Denver was trying to hit him harder, but I also think they were trying to hit him harder because he's an arrogant ***** who runs his mouth. I can't compare that to the other situation, because at 6-5, 250 (or whatever he is) he lays plenty of punishment out himself.

IMO, the referees probably should have stepped in a little earlier, because by the time he was getting hit, emotions were running high. There were a couple of skirmishes fairly early, just jawing that the refs just kind of let go, that they could have thwarted some of the nastiness in the end, IMO.

I wasn't comparing the two - i was comparing the mentality to do with justifying it

I just think all qb should be hit like newton was - because they are playing a violent game, i do not think certain qbs should get hit harder based on their attitude, because as i suggested earlier it would mean the opposite is true.....ie a qb like Manning who was a gentleman on the field should somehow be hit slightly less aggressively

whether or not the hits were dirty - like i said, i could see arguments both ways

[BroncoJoe]

When someone is shit talking, it's human nature to want to "destroy" them. It certainly elevates the play and determination of the opponent, IMO.

[Valar Morghulis]

i guess that's where we all disagree

while i accept that human nature may make us want to destroy someone - i just dont think that makes it OK if we do.

I also think it is a weak mind that allows someone elses trash talk to affect their game to the point where they make plays/mistakes that can hurt their team

[Broncoknight30]

i guess that's where we all disagree

while i accept that human nature may make us want to destroy someone - i just dont think that makes it OK if we do.

I also think it is a weak mind that allows someone elses trash talk to affect their game to the point where they make plays/mistakes that can hurt their team

Not for nothing, but there are "unwritten rules " in virtually all sports. Baseball has them for showboats. Hockey has goons on each team to protect their stars etc.

Hard for many to accept. If a player showboats and talks shit during a game, he is going to get it. I understand that offends people. Does not offend me.

[Valar Morghulis]

Not for nothing, but there are "unwritten rules " in virtually all sports. Baseball has them for showboats. Hockey has goons on each team to protect their stars etc.

Hard for many to accept. If a player showboats and talks shit during a game, he is going to get it. I understand that offends people. Does not offend me.

it doesnt offend me lol - i just disagree with y'all on this issue!

[BroncoJoe]

it doesnt offend me lol - i just disagree with y'all on this issue!

Because you're a wuss.

[Valar Morghulis]

Because you're a wuss. I will target you for that insult

[BroncoJoe]

I will target you got that insult

You've been on my radar for a while now. Prepare yourself!

[spikerman]

It aggravated his labia.

Damn you, I spit out my drink.

[Poet]

There is a huge area between the head and the knees you can hit. Ever heard of wrapping up around their torso? You know, a good form tackle?

Go tell the typical LB to form tackle Gronk or Cam Newton.

[Davii]

Damn you, I spit out my drink.

I hope it wasn't scotch!

[I Eat Staples]

Not for nothing, but there are "unwritten rules " in virtually all sports. Baseball has them for showboats. Hockey has goons on each team to protect their stars etc.

Hard for many to accept. If a player showboats and talks shit during a game, he is going to get it. I understand that offends people. Does not offend me.

It's not about being "offended." If anything, you're the one being offended by Cam's celebrating to the point of wanting to inflict harm on him.

Unwritten rules are usually used to justify archaic, barbaric practices such as a pitcher intentionally hitting a batter because he dared had the nerve to have fun.

[dogfish]

oh, look. . . ron rivera is still crying. . . i guess cam's not the only whiner in that organization. . .


“The hard thing about what happened to us this year, and I guess the reason I have such an issue with it is — you play the Super Bowl, you lose the Super Bowl. Then they tell you you’re going to open up the season against the team you just lost to in the Super Bowl,” he said. “So for the next five months, I’ve got to put up with it, deal with it, answer the questions, relive it constantly, over and over and over. Honestly, it becomes a drag. You guys know it cause I got tired of answering the questions and our guys got tired of answering the questions. . . .

“We asked for certain things to help us out. We didn’t get any of it. So I’m disappointed, let’s be honest. I’ve got a group of men in there that have done nothing but do the things that we’ve asked for the last five years. It’s been a battle to get to where we are and sometimes I feel disrespected.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/09/16/ron-rivera-still-complaining-about-having-to-open-the-season-on-road/


poor guy! maybe if you hadn't spent the whole off-season looking at it as a built-in excuse, your team would have been more prepared to play. . . i don't know that either the broncos or us fans were all that thrilled to open up with a re-match against a highly motivated team, either. . . our guys went about their business, though-- and once again, the panthers are left crying about it in the media. . . very niiice!

[BroncoWave]

oh, look. . . ron rivera is still crying. . . i guess cam's not the only whiner in that organization. . .


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/09/16/ron-rivera-still-complaining-about-having-to-open-the-season-on-road/


poor guy! maybe if you hadn't spent the whole off-season looking at it as a built-in excuse, your team would have been more prepared to play. . . i don't know that either the broncos or us fans were all that thrilled to open up with a re-match against a highly motivated team, either. . . our guys went about their business, though-- and once again, the panthers are left crying about it in the media. . . very niiice!

Rivera crying about having to open against us is hilarious. He didn't even have to try to motivate his team this offseason, that motivation was already built in just by playing us week 1.

[MOtorboat]

What a whiner. Gets it from his quarterback, or is it the other way around?

[TXBRONC]

oh, look. . . ron rivera is still crying. . . i guess cam's not the only whiner in that organization. . .


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/09/16/ron-rivera-still-complaining-about-having-to-open-the-season-on-road/


poor guy! maybe if you hadn't spent the whole off-season looking at it as a built-in excuse, your team would have been more prepared to play. . . i don't know that either the broncos or us fans were all that thrilled to open up with a re-match against a highly motivated team, either. . . our guys went about their business, though-- and once again, the panthers are left crying about it in the media. . . very niiice!

Mess with a stallion and you'll get kicked in the teeth. :nod:

[dogfish]

What a whiner. Gets it from his quarterback, or is it the other way around?

i'm starting to wonder. . .



Mess with a stallion and you'll get kicked in the teeth. :nod:

you speakin' from personal experience, tex?

[Davii]

Rivera crying about having to open against us is hilarious. He didn't even have to try to motivate his team this offseason, that motivation was already built in just by playing us week 1.

That was my thought and fear before the game, that those guys were stewing on that SB loss all offseason and were crazy motivated to show they should've won, etc

[BroncoWave]

That was my thought and fear before the game, that those guys were stewing on that SB loss all offseason and were crazy motivated to show they should've won, etc

Same. I thought it was way more of an advantage for them than us having that game in week 1. We probably wouldn't be as motivated as the SB and they would be out for revenge. It's just laughable that Rivera is using that as an excuse.

[Davii]

Same. I thought it was way more of an advantage for them than us having that game in week 1. We probably wouldn't be as motivated as the SB and they would be out for revenge. It's just laughable that Rivera is using that as an excuse.

We didn't get to open at home, boo hoo.

I mean, he does know only half the teams CAN open at home and only one team can guarantee it, right?

[Simple Jaded]

Baltimore didn't get to open at home after they won the SB.

[Poet]

His team ******* lost. They scheduled a rematch for great ratings, which they got. It would be stupid for Denver to have gone to Carolina. If he wanted this home game his team should have won. What a ******* loser. John Fox light over there.

[Pudge]

Baltimore didn't get to open at home after they won the SB.

They did, but because they had previously scheduled events they couldn't

[Canmore]

What a whiner. Gets it from his quarterback, or is it the other way around?

Nah...he got it from Phyllis with his stop in San Diego.

[TXBRONC]

i'm starting to wonder. . .




you speakin' from personal experience, tex?

No, but I have been bit by a philly.

[Poet]

The Panthers are losers, Cam is a loser, their head coach is a loser, and they deserve to be losers.

[Az Snake]

That was my thought and fear before the game, that those guys were stewing on that SB loss all offseason and were crazy motivated to show they should've won, etc

Not me.
I was sure that our O would be better and the D would go after Cam with a vengeance.
The 3 turnovers reeled me but I still had faith.
Finally when Denver came out with 2 good drives for TDs in the 2nd, Cam was in a must pass sit.
Ware and Von pinned their ears and the edge rush started to prevail.
If Denver had not had those 3 turnovers it would have been a blow out.

Crowd was buzzed and amped.
Multiple false starts and 3 wasted time outs in the first quarter by the Panthers.

This week if Denver eliminates the turnovers and the D can keep just 11 men on the field, watch out.
The Bronco fans are still hyperbuzzed. I know I am lol !!
Watch for Luck and Co. to make mistakes.

This thread is getting old.
Hope next week the question will be:
"Did the Broncos play dirty against Luck"