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Denver Native (Carol)
03-21-2016, 05:13 PM
BOCA RATON, Fla. -- During his introduction to Houston, Texans quarterback Brock Osweiler said he felt the Texans gave him the best chance to succeed. Today at the NFL owners meetings, Texans owner Bob McNair shed a little more light on what exactly that meant.

In part, it was a chance to create his own legacy, away from the shadow of two of the best quarterbacks ever to play the game.

"I guess the thing that really helped us is that he does like our offense, and Coach [Bill] O'Brien gives the quarterback a little more leeway at the line of scrimmage and all quarterbacks like that," McNair said. "I think that helped. And then of course he had played behind Peyton [Manning] and with [executive vice president of football operations/general manager] John Elway there. Their shadows were quite large. He was still going to be under that and compared to them. He has a chance to be a real hero in Houston. And we’ve got a good ball club so I think all those things entered into it."

McNair said Osweiler's agent told the Texans those factors were important.

rest - http://espn.go.com/blog/houston-texans/post/_/id/15859/texans-owner-brock-osweiler-wanted-to-get-out-of-elway-and-mannings-shadow

weazel
03-21-2016, 05:15 PM
sounds like a weak minded individual with very low self confidence

Joel
03-21-2016, 08:55 PM
sounds like a weak minded individual with very low self confidence
I agree on the first part, but not the second. After all, he thinks he knows more about NFL QBs than a guy who used to BE one, coached Steve Young and Elway, managed to briefly make Griese, Plummer and Schaub respectable, and even won a playoff game with a 5th round rookie TJ Yates. Because a 5th round pick was all the boss allowed to challenge Schaub, and that went so well NO more QB picks were allowed: Kubiak liked Keenum in the next draft, but had to sign him as an UDFA.

Oh... you meant Oz, didn't you? Yeah... poor dumb SOB.... :tsk:

He got his wish for a place in the sun, and I wish him all the luck he'll need. Houstons offense is in worse shape than ours. We're rebuilding a bad line; they're tearing down a good one. They only have ONE receiving threat (and NO TEs) and are integrating a new starting RB as well as QB. I hope Oz learned a lot from (almost) half a season running for his life in Denver, because his 5 million neighbors have been known to show up at a bad QBs house to pick a fight in front of his kids.

tomjonesrocks
03-21-2016, 09:26 PM
Yes I clicked in the thread and am commenting but am already sick of this story.

Cugel
03-21-2016, 09:29 PM
"I guess the thing that really helped us is that he does like our offense, and Coach [Bill] O'Brien gives the quarterback a little more leeway at the line of scrimmage and all quarterbacks like that," McNair said.

What that means is that the Texans let Osweiler have more freedom to run the offense. Even Peyton Manning was restricted by the offense. During the SB Manning saw a defensive shift when they were down near the goal line, and called an audible. Kubiak saw that and ran down the sideline frantically calling timeout --- so he could revert to a safe running play into the line. Result - 3 points.

Well, it worked in that they won the SB despite Manning's two turnovers, but NO QB really likes having his hands tied like that. Osweiler liked the Adam Gase offense he was in for 3 years a lot better than the Kubiak offense.

So did Manning of course. Frankly, giving the inexperienced QB the keys to the car and saying OK kid, you drive as fast as you want isn't really a recipe for success. I guess we'll see what he does with that freedom.

But, I'd rather the Broncos QB execute the system the way it's designed rather than try and be his own coach on the field. That's fine for Peyton Manning, but Osweiler is no Peyton Manning. He thinks he is. They are going to learn otherwise when he starts taking big hits and throwing INTs and failing to get the team in the right formation.

It's easy to forget because he's got that huge $72M contract, that he's only started 7 games and there will be some learning curve. But, frankly, there is nobody else in the NFL, not even Tom Brady who really can execute the Peyton Manning offense. There's a reason why he was the best QB in regular season NFL history.

Cugel
03-21-2016, 09:34 PM
Oh... you meant Oz, didn't you? Yeah... poor dumb SOB....


You really can't call a guy "dumb" for saying "Yes, thank you very much, I do believe I WILL accept $25,000,000 this year!"

TXBRONC
03-21-2016, 09:36 PM
That is disappointing.

Hawgdriver
03-21-2016, 09:38 PM
Echoes of Aaron Rodgers and Favre...not

Northman
03-21-2016, 09:41 PM
I agree with Weasel, just sounds like Brock has a confidence issue. I mean i get it, we've seen other QB's play in Denver who got scared when things didnt go their way and used the same excuse as Brock is here. But, you can either be afraid and fold or you can know that you play with an organization with rich history and rise above to make your own mark. At the end of the day i would rather have a guy like Aaron Rodgers who is unafraid to carve his own path rather than a guy tuck tale and go elsewhere because he might be scared of some scrutiny when he struggles. Either way, Brock will find that the grass isnt always greener elsewhere and he shouldnt kid himself that its going to be an easy road in Houston. Every fanbase can come down on their QB when they dont become or show the promise they were believed they were getting. You think Bears fans still think Cutler is their savior? Not likely and i highly doubt Jay still thinks those fans are 10's either. If Brock struggles he can bet his ass that the pressure will be on him to perform and to live up to that contract he was given. If anything, he will have it harder in Houston than he did in Denver because at least with a recent title the Bronco fans will be a little more forgiving compared to an organization that still has yet to bring home a trophy.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-21-2016, 09:52 PM
I agree with Weasel, just sounds like Brock has a confidence issue. I mean i get it, we've seen other QB's play in Denver who got scared when things didnt go their way and used the same excuse as Brock is here. But, you can either be afraid and fold or you can know that you play with an organization with rich history and rise above to make your own mark. At the end of the day i would rather have a guy like Aaron Rodgers who is unafraid to carve his own path rather than a guy tuck tale and go elsewhere because he might be scared of some scrutiny when he struggles. Either way, Brock will find that the grass isnt always greener elsewhere and he shouldnt kid himself that its going to be an easy road in Houston. Every fanbase can come down on their QB when they dont become or show the promise they were believed they were getting. You think Bears fans still think Cutler is their savior? Not likely and i highly doubt Jay still thinks those fans are 10's either. If Brock struggles he can bet his ass that the pressure will be on him to perform and to live up to that contract he was given. If anything, he will have it harder in Houston than he did in Denver because at least with a recent title the Bronco fans will be a little more forgiving compared to an organization that still has yet to bring home a trophy.

Great post - totally agree

Simple Jaded
03-21-2016, 09:59 PM
More leeway, just what a QB going into his 8th start needs.

Dapper Dan
03-21-2016, 10:26 PM
Total Faggz.

Cugel
03-21-2016, 11:45 PM
At the end of the day i would rather have a guy like Aaron Rodgers

I think we would all prefer a QB like Aaron Rogers - in any way like Aaron Rogers. Sadly it doesn't look like the Broncos are going to get another Hall of Fame QB any time soon. Kaepernick is about the best they can hope for this year.

And more likely, our QB will be the butt-fumbler. I'm not saying in advance he can't have any success, but. . . .

artie_dale
03-22-2016, 07:04 AM
I'd call him a Pansy, but that'd be offensive to certain flowers.

Very weak though.

Lets see:
a) Successful organization - CHECK
b) Surrounded by talent - CHECK
c) Defense that takes pressure off offense - CHECK
d) Legacy of winning - CHECK
e) Consecutive losing seasons = Not in the last 4 decades - CHECK

Hey, if Brick is intimidated by any of those or too arrogant to see those or too ignorant to think the Texans have those or to egocentric to think he will bring those to Houston... I wouldn't want him anyway (am still glad he stepped away).

OrangeHoof
03-22-2016, 09:25 AM
I dunno. Would you rather spend your career being compared with Manning and Elway or being compared with Schaub and David Carr? If he gets them to the playoffs, he can be the Man. If he takes Denver to the playoffs it will always be "yeah but Peyton or John would have done it better".

The Texans do have an excellent defense, not as great as Denver's but not bad. The offense is awful other than D-Hop and that's the big risk for him. He'll get a grace period for a year or two. OTOH, if the offense suddenly clicks, he can bask in the credit.

Bottom line, he took the money just like several other Broncos that now have new addresses. Are they all cowards?

Northman
03-22-2016, 09:53 AM
I dunno. Would you rather spend your career being compared with Manning and Elway or being compared with Schaub and David Carr? If he gets them to the playoffs, he can be the Man. If he takes Denver to the playoffs it will always be "yeah but Peyton or John would have done it better".

The Texans do have an excellent defense, not as great as Denver's but not bad. The offense is awful other than D-Hop and that's the big risk for him. He'll get a grace period for a year or two. OTOH, if the offense suddenly clicks, he can bask in the credit.

Bottom line, he took the money just like several other Broncos that now have new addresses. Are they all cowards?

None of the other players play QB, none of the other players have made an excuse that they want to play from under a shadow. If you want to play for more money than just state that, but if you are worried about criticism than he will have a lot to learn whether he plays under a shadow or not. If he fails in Houston he will still get criticized so he's not really avoiding anything. Like i said earlier, i guess Rodgers should of just left and not even tried to create his own legacy in GB since he was playing under a shadow since its such a burden. I mean heck, this past year he actually outplayed the legend and most people wanted him in over Manning so i would venture to say people were just fine with him.

The Glue Factory
03-22-2016, 10:59 AM
None of the other players play QB, none of the other players have made an excuse that they want to play from under a shadow. If you want to play for more money than just state that, but if you are worried about criticism than he will have a lot to learn whether he plays under a shadow or not. If he fails in Houston he will still get criticized so he's not really avoiding anything. Like i said earlier, i guess Rodgers should of just left and not even tried to create his own legacy in GB since he was playing under a shadow since its such a burden. I mean heck, this past year he actually outplayed the legend and most people wanted him in over Manning so i would venture to say people were just fine with him.

I would add Steve Young to the list of successful QBs in the shadow of a parting HOF and Luck seems to be doing a fine enough job in Indy.

If Os was worried about the shadow from Manning, he'll have to man-up wherever he goes. Manning's shadow here is nothing. His shadow of greatness will be in Indy. The Duke is STILL casting his shadow in Denver, albeit in a different way now. Even Manning won't be able to make an impact in John's shadow which is sufficiently ancient enough to now be nastolgia.

GEM
03-22-2016, 12:29 PM
Bye bitch. :whistle:

weazel
03-22-2016, 12:42 PM
I feel bad for Brent errrr Brock.

Cugel
03-22-2016, 03:40 PM
Like that sign that hung in Lambeau Field after Favre left: "We'll never forget you Brent!" :laugh:

Cugel
03-22-2016, 03:44 PM
I just find the entire statement by their owner difficult to believe. Really, what is our last memory of Peyton? Throwing for 130 yards, no Tds and 2 turnovers in the SB, coming off a year in which he threw 19 Ints.

It really shouldn't be hard to top that last year of Manning's. Just win another SB and people around here would already be measuring him for the Ring of Fame. And how good would he really have to be to win another SB with this defense?

He'd have to be good, but not great. Surely, he'd have enough self-confidence to think he could do that.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-22-2016, 04:09 PM
I just find the entire statement by their owner difficult to believe. Really, what is our last memory of Peyton? Throwing for 130 yards, no Tds and 2 turnovers in the SB, coming off a year in which he threw 19 Ints.

It really shouldn't be hard to top that last year of Manning's. Just win another SB and people around here would already be measuring him for the Ring of Fame. And how good would he really have to be to win another SB with this defense?

He'd have to be good, but not great. Surely, he'd have enough self-confidence to think he could do that.

Until I hear Osweiler or his agent dispute what the owner said, I will believe it is true.
Also, your last memory of Peyton is far from mine - i.e. how he turned the SD game around, and how maybe he did not alone win the remaining games, but he sure did not do anything to lose them either. Plus, do you really think that Osweiler could even come close to doing what John or Peyton did with the Broncos?

from the article I posted:

McNair said Osweiler's agent told the Texans those factors were important.

Osweiler signed with Houston on a four-year deal worth $72 million, with $37 million guaranteed. His agents had little communication with the Broncos after their initial offer, and didn't allow a counter offer once the Texans reached the number Osweiler ultimately signed for. There is some feeling that Osweiler might have left Denver even if the money were the same, and this aligns with that thinking.

http://espn.go.com/blog/houston-texans/post/_/id/15859/texans-owner-brock-osweiler-wanted-to-get-out-of-elway-and-mannings-shadow

BroncoJoe
03-22-2016, 04:14 PM
Buck Frock.

Hey! Frock. That's his new name for me.

ShaneFalco
03-22-2016, 04:53 PM
Bitter Brock

The Glue Factory
03-22-2016, 05:31 PM
Until I hear Osweiler or his agent dispute what the owner said, I will believe it is true. Also, your last memory of Peyton is far from mine - i.e. how he turned the SD game around, and how maybe he did not alone win the remaining games, but he sure did not do anything to lose them either. Plus, do you really think that Osweiler could even come close to doing what John or Peyton did with the Broncos?

Also consider that Brock was not doing anything to inspire the offense to win. Peyton comes in, performs similarly to Brock (iirc) but provides some inspiration for the team to man-up and pull out the win. I wonder if the real reason he left was that he wilted under the light of true leadership which is perhaps the single most important aspect of the QB position.

dogfish
03-22-2016, 06:10 PM
eff you, brent! you gigantic, overgrown nancyboi. . .

Cugel
03-22-2016, 07:04 PM
McNair said Osweiler's agent told the Texans those factors were important.

Osweiler signed with Houston on a four-year deal worth $72 million, with $37 million guaranteed. His agents had little communication with the Broncos after their initial offer, and didn't allow a counter offer once the Texans reached the number Osweiler ultimately signed for. There is some feeling that Osweiler might have left Denver even if the money were the same, and this aligns with that thinking.

First of all, all you fans act like "cutting off communications" with Broncos players and staff or "not giving the Broncos the right to match" Houston's offer is somehow an attack on the Broncos.

This is NORMAL negotiating strategy that ANY CONTRACTS LAWYER would know. You NEVER let your client talk to management or other workers in the middle of contract negotiations because now suddenly you, as agent are in the middle of a three way negotiation, and your client is undermining your negotiating strategy! Who knows what the idiot might say? I'd tell my clients the same thing every time. That's Lawyer negotiations 101 and nothing unique to the Broncos.

Normally, you would NOT give the former team the "right to match." This again is standard. The only reason Osweiler's agent would call the Broncos back at that point is if he thought he could get an even better offer (like $19M or something) from the Broncos.

Why would they do that? What consideration are the Broncos offering in exchange for a right of first refusal? "Right to match" also called "Right of first refusal" is a valuable contract right, and if you want it you have to pay for it! They didn't, so Brock's agent is under no obligation to let them match any offer.

Elway gave his best offer, and indicated that they would not go above it. And the Texans topped it by $8M over a 4 year deal. The Broncos offer wasn't even close.

So, neither of these things which you act like are so significant have any real significance at all. Any attorney would do the same exact thing.

Osweiler might well have left Denver if they offered him $18M - because he liked Houston's offense better than the Kubiak offense. He's going to have the chance to throw more in their offense, so he'll have better passing numbers, which will translate to possibly getting more money in his next contract.

But, really you don't have to look past the money. $8,000,000 is $8,000,000. There are a some things I wouldn't do for $8,000,000, but I'd have to think about it before saying "no" to any of them.

wayninja
03-22-2016, 07:23 PM
If Brock was worried about being able to live up to the legacy of Manning and Elway, then his fears are fully justified. Good luck being a big fish in a small pond.

Joel
03-22-2016, 10:21 PM
If Brock was worried about being able to live up to the legacy of Manning and Elway, then his fears are fully justified. Good luck being a big fish in a small pond.
Except Houston's not exactly small, so if he crashes and burns he'll have 5 million people screaming for his head. Ask Schaub how that goes.

Simple Jaded
03-22-2016, 10:28 PM
I had more respect for Osweiler when he was just pissed about being benched from a starting job that may have never promised to him.

wayninja
03-23-2016, 12:15 AM
Except Houston's not exactly small, so if he crashes and burns he'll have 5 million people screaming for his head. Ask Schaub how that goes.

Houston itself may not be small, but their Quarterback legacy ponds? Puddles compared to Denver. Maybe he's the next Sage Rosenfels?

Joel
03-23-2016, 03:03 AM
Houston itself may not be small, but their Quarterback legacy ponds? Puddles compared to Denver. Maybe he's the next Sage Rosenfels?
Yeah, but that's kind of the problem: Ask Sanchez what it's like to be the latest in a long and nearly unbroken line of a major cities sports failures.

The Texans haven't existed long enough to have a HoF QB (their original QB won't be eligible till next year, and probably isn't holding his breath) so most natives think of Oilers QBs, which were mostly awful. Blanda and Moon were HoFers, but in between Pastorini was the most successful, which is sad considering he was succeeded by Ken Stabler who was succeeded by Oliver Luck who was essentially traded for Archie Manning. Houstonians are getting impatient.

That's understandable given a major city whose sports franchises were known as choke artists until the Rockets finally came through in the clutch 20 years ago: Despite NFL, MLB and NBA teams, that repeat was the FIRST and remains the ONLY pro championship Houston won since repeating as inaugural AFL champs (they did win several hockey titles when they got Gordie Howes whole family to play for them, but that was in a defunct league.)

It's like Cleveland with better weather and 10X the population. They won't give Oz any time to find his feet: He'll be a big fish in the big Bayou City, or gator bait.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
03-23-2016, 03:52 AM
Echoes of Aaron Rodgers and Favre...not

Yeah, but

Cugel
03-23-2016, 08:32 AM
I had more respect for Osweiler when he was just pissed about being benched from a starting job that may have never promised to him.

Delete the word "may". Kubiak never made Osweiler a permanent starter. He always said "for this week." He always intended to get Peyton Manning back. Osweiler somehow became convinced that he "won" the job in Peyton's absence and deserved to keep it and was reportedly "furious" with Kubiak when told Manning was coming back in the game.

Well, screw that. Nobody has a guaranteed starting role. Manning was the starter and deserved to be. Osweiler didn't play so perfectly that they couldn't go back to Manning. He got benched after the team was flat and lifeless in the San Diego game. Manning came in, the entire stadium was electric, the team picked up and suddenly everything was different. They won the rest of their games including the SB.

So, Brock's whining about being benched? ZERO sympathy. None whatever. Screw that!

The Glue Factory
03-23-2016, 11:32 AM
so, brock's whining about being benched? Zero sympathy. None whatever. Screw that!

this! ^^^

Simple Jaded
03-23-2016, 05:13 PM
"I don't want a QB that's afraid of shadows" Cecil Lamicil

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
03-23-2016, 08:40 PM
"I don't want a QB that's afraid of shadows" Cecil Lamicil

Oh snap

DenBronx
03-23-2016, 09:15 PM
"I don't want a QB that's afraid of shadows" Cecil Lamicil

Lol gonna it him up XBOX tonight and ask him about that comment. Can't wait till we crush Brocks confidence.

Simple Jaded
03-24-2016, 03:27 PM
Lol gonna it him up XBOX tonight and ask him about that comment. Can't wait till we crush Brocks confidence.
Yeah I have to give him credit, I like to rip Lammey but that was great.

BroncoJoe
03-24-2016, 03:30 PM
"I don't want a QB that's afraid of shadows" Cecil Lamicil

He'll be seeing shadows alright - when he visits Mile High as a member of the Texans. But, the won't actually be shadows.

GEM
03-24-2016, 03:33 PM
"I don't want a QB that's afraid of shadows" Cecil Lamicil

That was the first thing I thought when I read the comment as well. Screw that bullshit.

Simple Jaded
03-24-2016, 03:42 PM
But to me, when word got out via Texans owner (which to me gives it validity) that he wants no part of their shadow he basically forever links himself to that comparison. If he flourishes he's golden, blazed his own trail, if he fizzles the "Shadows" become part of his legacy.

Pretty much the way it would have been had he stayed in Denver.

I love the irony in that.

Joel
03-24-2016, 08:21 PM
But to me, when word got out via Texans owner (which to me gives it validity) that he wants no part of their shadow he basically forever links himself to that comparison. If he flourishes he's golden, blazed his own trail, if he fizzles the "Shadows" become part of his legacy.

Pretty much the way it would have been had he stayed in Denver.

I love the irony in that.
I dispute that first half. Even if he broke all Mannings records and led Denver to 4-5 Championships he'd still be seen as just an important parts of Elways complete breakfast. That's inevitable for even the best players on dynasties, but Oz never could've been to Denver what Elway was (and is) or what Manning was to the Colts.

An elite career probably would've gotten him out of Mannings shadow, but never Elways: That simply wouldn't be possible while Elway remained the GM who brought in Oz and ALL 52 OTHER Broncos on our championship teams. And it'd be a perverse Catch 22: The farther Oz took us, the more secure Elways job would be. It's not likely to be shaky any time soon regardless, so the most likely scenario was that Elway would outlast Oz; Oz outlasting Elway would be pretty much impossible.

All those considerations are a HUGE ego trip for a 25-year-old who's only started 7 games. His 5-2 record's not bad, and the OT wins against NE* and Cincy were huge. But even a broken down Manning went 7-2 with the same team, and, IMHO, the NE* win was more about the D and CJ than Oz. He's not even started HALF a season in a FOUR YEAR career, but already focused on his "legacy"?

He's either the best QB in history (doubtful, since that was his predecessor) or being a champions roleplayer went to his head.

Denver Native (Carol)
03-24-2016, 08:47 PM
This article does not paint a real promising picture of Osweiler. Some things from article:


It's apparent the Texans were desperate, which is why it wasn't a surprise to see them give a four-year, $72 million contract with $37 million guaranteed to free-agent pivot Brock Osweiler earlier this month.

It's hard to come to grips with the fact a man who has started just seven NFL games and has a career passer rating of 86 is now one of the 15 highest-paid quarterbacks in football, but demand continues to triumph over supply on a free-agent market that is making unaccomplished players far richer than ever before.

In the Week 12 victory over the Patriots that O'Brien is referencing, Osweiler completed just 54.8 percent of his passes, going 23-of-42. Denver made a great comeback, but even when the game was on the line in the fourth quarter and overtime, Osweiler was just 8-of-17 (47.1 percent). Meanwhile, running backs C.J. Anderson and Ronnie Hillman ran for 86 yards and two touchdowns on eight carries during that span.

It was by no means a bad performance for a first-year starter. Osweiler did complete two gorgeous passes beyond 30 yards to receivers Demaryius Thomas and Emmanuel Sanders late in the fourth quarter, but he didn't face any pressure on either of those completions. And aside from that, he was just 5-of-14 for 56 yards (four yards per attempt) in the quarter.

A few more notes on that performance:

He put Denver ahead with a fairly easy four-yard touchdown pass late in the fourth, but that only came after Osweiler was let off the hook. He took an ugly sack in the red zone after becoming a deer in headlights against a tepid Patriots rush but was bailed out by a defensive holding penalty.
His only completed pass on Denver's game-winning touchdown drive in overtime was a checkdown over the middle. Anderson did the rest.
He did indeed face a lot of pressure, but he completed only 43.8 percent of his passes and posted a 30.7 passer rating when facing pressure that evening, according to Pro Football Focus.

Osweiler's numbers in big spots were ugly. His numbers under pressure (52.2 percent completions, 66.9 rating) were ugly. His numbers overall (NFL's 10th-lowest passer rating) were ugly. He struggled beyond his first read and took too many sacks (23 on 310 dropbacks, which gave him the 10th-highest sack rate in football). What's more, he was ultimately benched in favor of the league's lowest-rated passer.

There's a reason the Broncos weren't willing to break the bank to keep him around, even after 39-year-old Peyton Manning retired.

full article - http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2626930-why-the-houston-texans-might-be-overrating-brock-osweiler

tomjonesrocks
03-24-2016, 08:58 PM
This article does not paint a real promising picture of Osweiler. Some things from article: full article - http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2626930-why-the-houston-texans-might-be-overrating-brock-osweiler

Great article.

Nomad
03-24-2016, 10:42 PM
When I think of QBs that played in Houston, I think of Warren Moon. Brock will always be shadowed.

Hawgdriver
03-24-2016, 11:21 PM
I dispute

Best Joel post of all time. . . but then you ruined it...

:damnmate:

Poet
03-24-2016, 11:23 PM
I can understand why he feels the way that he does. With that being said, Elway and the Broncos wanted him. No one was expecting him to be a beast this year and Brock got a pass for his mistakes on the field. He even had some fans defending him when he was benched, too. Furthermore, Brock was replacing an aging and feeble Manning; every time Brock completed a deep pass the fans jogged their memories because they could barely remember what that looked or felt like.

I think he took the money and ran, I don't blame him, but if this was a huge part of his decision then I really think he misjudged the climate.

Joel
03-24-2016, 11:32 PM
In the Week 12 victory over the Patriots that O'Brien is referencing, Osweiler completed just 54.8 percent of his passes, going 23-of-42. Denver made a great comeback, but even when the game was on the line in the fourth quarter and overtime, Osweiler was just 8-of-17 (47.1 percent). Meanwhile, running backs C.J. Anderson and Ronnie Hillman ran for 86 yards and two touchdowns on eight carries during that span.
Just underscores what I said earlier: The OT wins against the other two top AFC teams cemented us as the AFC favorite, but beating NE* was all about the D and CJ, not Oz. Granted it was only his second career start, but that's why you don't pay $72M for a guy with less half a season of starts. He contributed more against Cincy, but that was only THEIR QBs second career start; anyone think we win in OT if Dalton plays?

Simple Jaded
03-25-2016, 01:02 AM
I hereby dispute your dispute.

Joel
03-25-2016, 01:27 AM
I hereby dispute your dispute.
Noted; any supporting arguments, or just disagreement for disagreements sake? I'm not convinced even Manning escaped Elways shadow in Denver, despite shattering every individual passing and team scoring record in the book and becoming the ONLY QB to win SBs for different teams: How could Oz POSSIBLY have topped that, and if the answer is "he couldn't," how could he ever escape Elways shadow in Denver?

Realistically, he'll probably and promptly crash and burn in Houston, likely leaving him WISHING he'd remained a champion in Elways shadow. Again, 7 starts into his career is a bit early for him to focus on trying to surpass two of the greatest QBs of all time. But IF that's his hubristic focus, leaving Denver suits it.

BroncoTech
03-26-2016, 11:31 PM
I just hope this Sanchez guy doesn't hear about these shadows from the past that are so tall no one can surpass them.

WARHORSE
03-28-2016, 10:54 AM
Oz will still get compared to Manning. With him saying he wanted more freedom at the line of scrimmage I dont think the Texan fans believe thats so he

can dance.


On second thought.....I refuse to vouch for the intelligence of Texan fans.

Cugel
03-28-2016, 11:26 AM
Just underscores what I said earlier: The OT wins against the other two top AFC teams cemented us as the AFC favorite, but beating NE* was all about the D and CJ, not Oz. Granted it was only his second career start, but that's why you don't pay $72M for a guy with less half a season of starts. He contributed more against Cincy, but that was only THEIR QBs second career start; anyone think we win in OT if Dalton plays?

That's all true, but you can't criticize the Texans for offering Osweiler $72 M. They had to do that to steal him from Denver. You can criticize Elway for offering $64M because Osweiler didn't deserve that much either!

Texans had Steny Hoyer who threw 3 INTs and turned the ball over 5 times in a 30-0 home playoff loss. It doesn't get much worse than that. Unless they got a decent QB Rick Smith is going to be fired by next season.

Now they've got a guy who can save his job for a couple of years at least. Is that worth $72M? Well to Rick Smith it is! They were already writing "How Much Longer Does Rick Smith Get a Pass?" (http://houseofhouston.com/2015/10/26/texans-how-much-longer-does-gm-rick-smith-get-a-pass/) articles in the local press last October. And that was before the playoff blowout.

His butt is on the hot seat if they don't make the playoffs this season. And without a better QB than Steny Hoyer it was not likely. So, it's definitely worth it to Smith!

Cugel
03-28-2016, 11:32 AM
Noted; any supporting arguments, or just disagreement for disagreements sake? I'm not convinced even Manning escaped Elways shadow in Denver, despite shattering every individual passing and team scoring record in the book and becoming the ONLY QB to win SBs for different teams: How could Oz POSSIBLY have topped that, and if the answer is "he couldn't," how could he ever escape Elways shadow in Denver?

Realistically, he'll probably and promptly crash and burn in Houston, likely leaving him WISHING he'd remained a champion in Elways shadow. Again, 7 starts into his career is a bit early for him to focus on trying to surpass two of the greatest QBs of all time. But IF that's his hubristic focus, leaving Denver suits it.

He's not a bad QB so I'd be very surprised if he "promptly crashed and burned" in Houston. They are in a very weak division so 11 wins are probably a given. They still have a pretty good defense and their offense isn't bad. With Osweiler they could possibly even get a first round bye.

Where things get dicey however is when teams start focusing more and more on Osweiler's weaknesses. Defenses aren't going to just let him do what he does best. They will analyse everything he does and look to take away his strengths and attack his weak points. He holds onto the ball too long. He's tall and lanky and while he's pretty athletic for such a tall man, he's not agile or graceful.

He's going to take a beating despite their OL being a lot better than Denver's 2015 line. Unless he learns to get rid of the ball quicker and how to take a hit without getting creamed everytime he's not going to last 16 games.