Will Peyton Manning Start Another Game in Denver?

[BroncoWave]

This is the opposite of my "will Brock start a game this season" poll from a few weeks ago. Now we are flipping it. In your opinion, do you think Peyton ever starts another game for the Denver Broncos?

[GEM]

I don't think so. Brock is the future, putting him back on the bench would be detrimental to his development.

[Northman]

I dont know if putting Brock back on the bench will hurt him but i just dont think you can rush Manning back and if Brock continues to play well you wont want to mess with the chemistry that Brock has built up. I just think if Manning comes back its going to be next year for another team if he wants that record.

[Nomad]

If Manning heals quick, I see him starting. Well.....when Brock beats the Patriots.....maybe Manning won't start again. :D

[CrazyHorse]

If Osweiler gets hurt. I'd like to see Manning get the record for career wins even if it's not with us.

[wayninja]

I kinda foresee Osweiler struggling down the stretch. He probably does just enough to keep us ahead in the west, but kubes makes the switch heading into the playoffs with a recuperated (hopefully) manning.

We'll see.

[ShaneFalco]

Did you guys see what they just announced on sunday night?

Peyton will play another year and even if not for Broncos.

[Nomad]

WoW! Manning plans to play next year with or without being a BRONCO.

[ShaneFalco]

I bet he is pissed and wants to play against Brady

[Northman]

Definitely will not be a Bronco. I dont think Denver takes a chance next year even if Manning is healthy.

[tomjonesrocks]

WoW! Manning plans to play next year with or without being a BRONCO.

I can't find anything written on that. What's the report?

[Nomad]

I can't find anything written on that. What's the report?

It was reported on SNF......cant think of the guy's name that reported it.

[ShaneFalco]

https://twitter.com/ChrisBurke_SI/status/668595839682654208

[wayninja]

It was reported on SNF......cant think of the guy's name that reported it.

Mike Florio

While the possibilities are definitely shrinking, I think it might be premature to say the Manning never takes another snap for the Broncos.

[tomjonesrocks]

https://twitter.com/ChrisBurke_SI/status/668595839682654208

Hmm. I've felt several times he wasn't necessarily done but it's an odd report timing-wise and really a distraction if they have recent information.

Obviously it would seem unlikely Denver would bring him back and probably wouldn't even talk with his agent if history holds. I wonder where he could go to start but would prefer his last game be as a Bronco...

[VonDoom]

It was reported on SNF......cant think of the guy's name that reported it.

Dungy disputed that. Either way, I'd say that's the likeliest scenario at this point

[wayninja]

Dungy disputed that. Either way, I'd say that's the likeliest scenario at this point

He didn't exactly dispute it, just said that he's very close to manning and that it took him by surprise and that florio must have a 'scoop'.

[ShaneFalco]

They were saying he wanted to be back for the brady game and stuff

[Slick]

If this is ture, it's pretty lame of anyone in the Manning camp on the day Denver wins without him to make that kind of statement. It might be BS. I guess we'll see.

[NightTrainLayne]

It's too early to answer this question. Way too many variables to know, but most depend on how well Brock continues to play.

As to Manning coming back next season? I have no doubt that Manning wants this. I have no doubt that Manning thinks he has the ability. But I really can't see a contender bringing him in. Would Manning go to a basement-dweller team to play another year? Maybe. But that would be really sad.

I hope somebody talks some sense into him. It's been an epic, historic career. But it won't last another season.

[Nomad]

If this is ture, it's pretty lame of anyone in the Manning camp on the day Denver wins without him to make that kind of statement. It might be BS. I guess we'll see.

Never thought of it that way, but you have a good point.

[Nomad]

It's too early to answer this question. Way too many variables to know, but most depend on how well Brock continues to play.

As to Manning coming back next season? I have no doubt that Manning wants this. I have no doubt that Manning thinks he has the ability. But I really can't see a contender bringing him in. Would Manning go to a basement-dweller team to play another year? Maybe. But that would be really sad.

I hope somebody talks some sense into him. It's been an epic, historic career. But it won't last another season.

Yeah, he'll become Brett Farve (minus taking pics of his junk and sending it to a lady reporter:D)if he continues with another team.

[tripp]

I would've said Yes had I just heard from Mike Florio that Peyton intends to play next year. I think now, you need to play Brock the rest of the season to see what you've got. From what I saw today, looked like a QB who has been in this league for a couple of years. It's extremely hard to tell right now how Brock is going to play for the rest of the season. I need to see Brock play again next week to get a better idea. The more I think about it, Brock starting should be a week to week based on performance.

[BORDERLINE]

Once manning is healthy then I can give you an honest answer. Brock looked good today frantic at times poised at times. The play calling helped and also the run game gave him a boost. He can deliver the passes with more zip. Nothing he can't fix. If he's playing well and Manning is healthy well then that's a good problem to have.

[SR]

Peyton will start against NE

[tomjonesrocks]

Peyton will start against NE

Tough call as I think the Pats rout Denver regardless. I'm not even sure I want to watch it. Should be a curb-stomp. Denver's not ready for that team.

[tripp]

Tough call as I think the Pats rout Denver regardless. I'm not even sure I want to watch it. Should be a curb-stomp. Denver's not ready for that team.

Well the Giants by all means almost won that game, IMO, should've won that game, but lost. Comparing our team to the Giants? We're better, up and down that roster. Why can't our defense stuff the Pats? Gronk has destroyed us every time we've played against him, so Idk how Wade Phillips is going to address that, but something needs to be done. Patriots D isn't THAT great. They have excellent coaches that some how make up for the lack of talent the roster has.

Long story short, I think we can beat them, it'd be a close game, but we could beat them. We have the talent, and the coaches to do it. Just no turn overs and we can win.

[SR]

Tough call as I think the Pats rout Denver regardless. I'm not even sure I want to watch it. Should be a curb-stomp. Denver's not ready for that team.

I think Denver's defense will be up for this game. Wouldn't surprise me if Ware and Manning both play. Definitely don't think it'll be a rout.

[BroncoWave]

Peyton will start against NE

I don't think there is any way in hell he starts against New England. If he does, I would probably be about as angry over that as anything I have ever been angry over as a Broncos fan. Would basically be a slap in the face to the idea that Denver is doing everything in their power to win games. Even when Manning was fully healthy early in the season he sucked, and he's not going to miraculously be 100% with just a week off. See: Last year's playoff game.

[Nomad]

Manning hasn't lost his starting job. He's just injured. I don't see how Kubiak tells him no if the Doc gives Manning an ok to play.

[SR]

I don't think there is any way in hell he starts against New England. If he does, I would probably be about as angry over that as anything I have ever been angry over as a Broncos fan. Would basically be a slap in the face to the idea that Denver is doing everything in their power to win games. Even when Manning was fully healthy early in the season he sucked, and he's not going to miraculously be 100% with just a week off. See: Last year's playoff game.

I think he plays. I feel the same way you do, but this season has disaster written all over it to me.

[BroncoWave]

Manning hasn't lost his starting job. He's just injured. I don't see how Kubiak tells him no if the Doc gives Manning an ok to play.

There is no rule that says you can't lose your starting job to injury. Brock just came in and played better than arguably any game than Peyton has played all season other than GB. On the road against the one team who would know how to gameplan him nonetheless. I just don't see how it's any debate any more that Brock gives us a better chance to win than Peyton. I think it would be a slap in the face to the team to trot Peyton back out there as long as Brock is playing as well as he is.

If Denver is concerned about coddling Peyton's ego, getting him records, etc then sure, start Peyton. If they are trying to give us the best chance to win, though, I don't see how you do that.

This may seem like a hard anti-Manning stance, but it's nothing against Peyton. It's all about what is best for the Broncos. I just don't see how any reasonable person who has watched the Broncos this season could say Peyton gives us the best chance to win right now.

[Simple Jaded]

I'm giving the Broncos the benefit of the doubt in regards to Manning being injured (I don't think he is but I'm wrong all the time and never more so than this season) so I'm going to assume Manning plays in a few weeks.

[Nomad]

No one said a thing about rules, or padding stats. I just think if Brock was the #1 starter, then Peyton would have been IR'd. Kubiak isn't gonna bench a healthy Manning.

I don't see how he plays with the foot injury, though.

[BroncoWave]

If Kubiak trots Manning out there and he plays anything less than excellent, then he looks like a giant clown IMO. If he does put him back out there, he better hope he turns back into 2013 Manning or I think this could all blow up in his face.

He doesn't owe anything to Peyton Manning. His job is to do what's best for the Denver Broncos. If it hurts Manning's feelings, tough shit. He can go play for a shit team like Houston next year and get his record there.

I fear the worst-case scenario of Manning coming back in, still playing like shit, then retiring at the end of the year, and Brock resenting sitting on the bench despite clearly outplaying him then signing somewhere else. Then we are left holding the bag with no QB.

[Simple Jaded]

If Kubiak trots Manning out there and he plays anything less than excellent, then he looks like a giant clown IMO. If he does put him back out there, he better hope he turns back into 2013 Manning or I think this could all blow up in his face.

He doesn't owe anything to Peyton Manning. His job is to do what's best for the Denver Broncos. If it hurts Manning's feelings, tough shit. He can go play for a shit team like Houston next year and get his record there.

I fear the worst-case scenario of Manning coming back in, still playing like shit, then retiring at the end of the year, and Brock resenting sitting on the bench despite clearly outplaying him then signing somewhere else. Then we are left holding the bag with no QB.

Well yeah, when you put it all like that and stuff it kinda sounds bad.

[Nomad]

Wave....I'm not saying your wrong. I'm echoing Kubiak's comments. Again, I don't see how Peyton heals this quickly from that foot injury. And if Osweiler manages to get a win vs the Patriots, I'd be curious to see what Kubiak says.

[BroncoWave]

Wave....I'm not saying your wrong. I'm echoing Kubiak's comments. Again, I don't see how Peyton heals this quickly from that foot injury. And if Osweiler manages to get a win vs the Patriots, I'd be curious to see what Kubiak says.

Hopefully Kubes is just "saying the right things" in regards to Peyton right now until he amicably figures out how to make a clean break from Peyton to Os. I would be really, really disappointed in him if he caves and brings back Peyton just because he's Peyton. Like you, I don't see any way he gets back to 100% health this season. He might get medical clearance to play, but that doesn't mean he's 100%. The docs cleared him to play against KC and we see how that turned out.

I trust that Kubes will make the right decision here. I hope my trust is not misplaced.

[I Eat Staples]

Hopefully Kubes is just "saying the right things" in regards to Peyton right now until he amicably figures out how to make a clean break from Peyton to Os. I would be really, really disappointed in him if he caves and brings back Peyton just because he's Peyton. Like you, I don't see any way he gets back to 100% health this season. He might get medical clearance to play, but that doesn't mean he's 100%. The docs cleared him to play against KC and we see how that turned out.

I trust that Kubes will make the right decision here. I hope my trust is not misplaced.

I'm not as optimistic. I hope Brock is the starter for the rest of the season but I have a bad feeling Kubiak goes back to Manning and Manning plays as badly as he has all season.

There's no question Brock is better right now, and as the coach, Kubiak has to be willing to play the better player.

[BroncoWave]

I'm not as optimistic. I hope Brock is the starter for the rest of the season but I have a bad feeling Kubiak goes back to Manning and Manning plays as badly as he has all season.

There's no question Brock is better right now, and as the coach, Kubiak has to be willing to play the better player.

I'm giving Kubes the benefit of the doubt until given reason not to. I think he is smart enough to know what is best for the team. I really, really hope for the Broncos' sake I am not wrong.

[tomjonesrocks]

I think Denver's defense will be up for this game. Wouldn't surprise me if Ware and Manning both play. Definitely don't think it'll be a rout.

Obviously this will be heavily discussed in the next week. Maybe I'm underrating playing at home but I'm expecting a smackdown.

I've lost some confidence in this defense and see no reason why Brady won't carve it up - over/under on personal fouls out of frustration is 4. Prob a suspension will ensue.

[Simple Jaded]

Beating the P*triots with Osweiler pretty much necessitates a Brady/Bledsoe scenario.

[BroncoWave]

Beating the P*triots with Osweiler pretty much necessitates a Brady/Bledsoe scenario.

No doubt. I think that is pretty much already the case regardless of if we beat NE, but this would absolutely seal it.

I wonder if Peyton would be able to swallow his pride and suit up and sit on the bench. It would be fascinating to see that play out. Surely Denver would just IR him at that point, but who knows.

[TXBRONC]

This is the opposite of my "will Brock start a game this season" poll from a few weeks ago. Now we are flipping it. In your opinion, do you think Peyton ever starts another game for the Denver Broncos?

I think it will depend on how things go over the next few weeks.

[BroncoWave]

I think it will depend on how things go over the next few weeks.

The point is that you have to guess based on what you think will happen over the next few weeks! :D

[MasterShake]

I hope so. Brock looked great today but if/when Manning can get healthy enough I'd still want him leading this team. I don't want to see him again until he is ready though. In the meantime I will be rooting my ass of for Brock. I love Manning but I love the team more and if he is not good to go he needs to sit. I know Kubiak and Elway will make the right decision, thank God I don't have to make that type of call!

[BroncoWave]

I hope so. Brock looked great today but if/when Manning can get healthy enough I'd still want him leading this team. I don't want to see him again until he is ready though. In the meantime I will be rooting my ass of for Brock. I love Manning but I love the team more and if he is not good to go he needs to sit. I know Kubiak and Elway will make the right decision, thank God I don't have to make that type of call!

My view, though, is that over the first two weeks of the season when Manning was as healthy as he will be all season, he was still terrible. No matter how well he heals from these injuries, I don't think he gets back to 100% health at all this season, and even his play at 100% health was not better than what we have seen from Brock thus far. Short of Brock just totally imploding, I'm not picturing a scenario in which Manning ever gives us a better chance than Brock to win again.

I was against benching Manning early on because we were undefeated and we had no clue what we would have in Brock. Well now we have lost a couple with Manning and we know that Brock is starting to look pretty damn decent. I've seen enough to come to the conclusion that Brock gives Denver the best chance to win. Maybe I'm wrong, and I hope I am wrong if Manning comes back and starts, but I just don't see it.

[MasterShake]

My view, though, is that over the first two weeks of the season when Manning was as healthy as he will be all season, he was still terrible. No matter how well he heals from these injuries, I don't think he gets back to 100% health at all this season, and even his play at 100% health was not better than what we have seen from Brock thus far. Short of Brock just totally imploding, I'm not picturing a scenario in which Manning ever gives us a better chance than Brock to win again.

I was against benching Manning early on because we were undefeated and we had no clue what we would have in Brock. Well now we have lost a couple with Manning and we know that Brock is starting to look pretty damn decent. I've seen enough to come to the conclusion that Brock gives Denver the best chance to win. Maybe I'm wrong, and I hope I am wrong if Manning comes back and starts, but I just don't see it.

Yeah its hard to argue with stats. The last half of last season was blamed on an injury and now it turns out the first half of this one could be as well. If he is that messed up I wish he would have quit when his body told him to. I'm too much of a fan to not be biased after what he has done for this franchise. Even in a few short years he made us relevant and a perennial contender. I imagine many fans of the Colts were having this same conversation right before they released him, but it is hard not to argue we may have went as far as we can with Manning.

I'm frustrated for him and with him at the same time if the extent of his injuries are really the cause of his poor play. I think Kubiak catered as much as he could so I don't really put the blame more on one side or the other. Like I said above I am a fan of Manning, but I am more of a fan of my team. I want whatever is best for us this season and moving forward, and if that is Brock I will be all for it. If it really is just a matter of Manning getting healthy I would like to see him come back if he looks good in practice or whatever, but I'm not sure its that simple.

[BroncoWave]

Yeah its hard to argue with stats. The last half of last season was blamed on an injury and now it turns out the first half of this one could be as well. If he is that messed up I wish he would have quit when his body told him to. I'm too much of a fan to not be biased after what he has done for this franchise. Even in a few short years he made us relevant and a perennial contender. I imagine many fans of the Colts were having this same conversation right before they released him, but it is hard not to argue we may have went as far as we can with Manning.

I'm frustrated for him and with him at the same time if the extent of his injuries are really the cause of his poor play. I think Kubiak catered as much as he could so I don't really put the blame more on one side or the other. Like I said above I am a fan of Manning, but I am more of a fan of my team. I want whatever is best for us this season and moving forward, and if that is Brock I will be all for it. If it really is just a matter of Manning getting healthy I would like to see him come back if he looks good in practice or whatever, but I'm not sure its that simple.

Yeah I get it, and I am hugely appreciative of what Manning did for this franchise. I proudly wear my Manning jersey often, and will continue to do so. I have nothing against him personally, I just think he is flat out done, and I think it's best for the Denver Broncos for Brock to take over the reigns from here on out. Regardless of what happens, we are certainly in for an interesting next few weeks.

[MasterShake]

Yeah I get it, and I am hugely appreciative of what Manning did for this franchise. I proudly wear my Manning jersey often, and will continue to do so. I have nothing against him personally, I just think he is flat out done, and I think it's best for the Denver Broncos for Brock to take over the reigns from here on out. Regardless of what happens, we are certainly in for an interesting next few weeks.

I'll be there either way! :cool:

[tripp]

What if.... Brock plays the remaining important games, we lock the #2 seed, and the meaningless week 17 game against SD, Peyton plays, break the win record, and rides off into the sunset.

[Locnar]

Manning is chopped liver. Give me some Brockwurst

[OrangeFanatic]

Peyton was done years ago. Playing him anymore only hurts the team. Time to look to the future.

[broncobryce]

Take the name out of it and look at his play, his stats. Worst rating in the league. Doesn't fit the offense Elway hired the head coach to run. Not that hard to figure out to me.

[TimHippo]

What if.... Brock plays the remaining important games, we lock the #2 seed, and the meaningless week 17 game against SD, Peyton plays, break the win record, and rides off into the sunset.

Won't happen. The only record he wants is another super bowl which would put him on the same level as his brother and Elway in terms of super bowl wins.

[Yashahla17]

So the manning camp is already stirring up distractions. This is the same guy who peacefully got booted out of indy but yet he appears to,be starting a ruckus in Denver because he sees the young kid brock is flat out better than him, one of the worst thing that could have happend was brady text getting out there saying manning is finished and he (brady) can play another 7 years. Manning is clearly taking this whole thing personal. I hope he doesnt see the field the rest of the year, he can go elsewhere and break his records. The guy is not a Bronco, he was a hired gun. Its time to move on. I'd imagine elway doesn't like the rumblings coming out of camp manning either.

[Yashahla17]

What if.... Brock plays the remaining important games, we lock the #2 seed, and the meaningless week 17 game against SD, Peyton plays, break the win record, and rides off into the sunset.

I said this a week ago..... Its the only scenerio where manning should be seeing the field again.

[Valar Morghulis]

I think manning will be back in about three weeks, plays one more game, gets "injured" again and goes on IR

I also think Brock lights up the pats next week

[Northman]

Peyton will start against NE

Yea, i dont see that happening honestly. I think it will be a tough game to win regardless but putting Manning at more risk with his injury is not a wise thing to do if you are wanting to make a run to the SB. From everything that i have read Manning is going to need weeks of healing to get back to snuff.

[BroncoWave]

Yea, i dont see that happening honestly. I think it will be a tough game to win regardless but putting Manning at more risk with his injury is not a wise thing to do if you are wanting to make a run to the SB. From everything that i have read Manning is going to need weeks of healing to get back to snuff.

Get back to what though? His week 1 self? No thanks, still.

[SR]

I hope so. Brock looked great today but if/when Manning can get healthy enough I'd still want him leading this team. I don't want to see him again until he is ready though. In the meantime I will be rooting my ass of for Brock. I love Manning but I love the team more and if he is not good to go he needs to sit. I know Kubiak and Elway will make the right decision, thank God I don't have to make that type of call!

My issue with Peyton being healthy and coming back in is what good will it do? At the beginning of the season he played like shit and was completely healthy. We all attributed it to a new offense and him not trusting his offensive line/not getting good protection. Nothing changed. He led the NFL in interceptions before he was injured. I don't see what good brining Peyton Manning back in will do.

[SR]

Peyton was done years ago. Playing him anymore only hurts the team. Time to look to the future.

No he wasn't done "years ago".

[Northman]

Get back to what though? His week 1 self? No thanks, still.

Depends. We simply dont know if he was hurt to begin the season or not. Hard to argue how he looked against GB after a week's rest which was in major contrast to the other games he played. Personally, i think the injury is just a ploy for bad playing but im not there and dont know what the truth is. Either way, if Manning is/was hurt and and we make the playoffs it does leave the team with a bit of a conundrum. I think ultimately Manning is done in Denver and will most likely break his record somewhere else next year, from everything ive read about his injury this isnt something that can be fixed after just one week.

[SR]

Depends. We simply dont know if he was hurt to begin the season or not.

Yes we do and no he wasn't.

Look at the preseason. Offense couldn't move the ball and Peyton was throwing picks. He was healthy.

[Rick]

I think the only way he plays again is if Brock comes back out and looks like he isn't worth looking at anymore(doubtful) or if we have locked up whatever playoff position we are going to get and bring out Manning just for the record chase.

[Northman]

Yes we do and no he wasn't.

Look at the preseason. Offense couldn't move the ball and Peyton was throwing picks. He was healthy.

My gut tells me your right but the reality is we really dont know. Towards the end of last year everyone thought he was healthy when he was struggling and then you hear about his quad issue.

[SR]

My gut tells me your right but the reality is we really dont know. Towards the end of last year everyone thought he was healthy when he was struggling and then you hear about his quad issue.

We knew about the quad injury while the season was going on last year, but we didn't know the severity of if. All we heard during camp was Peyton was healthy and had some extra zip on the ball with the latter obviously being false. There's no reason to think Peyton wasn't healthy at the beginning of the season, but there is every reason to believe his skills have dramatically declined and he needs to hang em up.

[BroncoJoe]

From MMQB:


What do we do now?

Osweiler winning this game in Chicago wasn’t the biggest surprise in the league this year. But the way he won it was notable. Osweiler played with confidence and a self-assuredness that belied his experience. His experience, basically, was that he had none. In his last start, nearly four years ago, Osweiler and his Arizona State teammates got their clocks cleaned in the Maaco Bowl in Las Vegas. Asked late Sunday afternoon if he had any doubts about his ability to play well in an NFL game, Osweiler said from Chicago: “When you haven’t started a game in three-and-a-half years, those thoughts do creep in.”

Manning was intercepted in every game he played this year—a league-high 17 in all.
Osweiler was not intercepted in 12 drives in Chicago on Sunday.

Manning, with sore ribs and plantar fasciitis in a heel, was left home to rest and rehab by the Broncos, and I’m told he did a lot of both over the weekend. Everyone was mum on what the Broncos were likely to do this week, but let’s go on coach Gary Kubiak’s word. He said Manning is the starting quarterback when healthy. Eight days ago, Manning’s throws were weaker than they’d ever been, and he wasn’t comfortable moving on his sore heel. His ribs ached. Is there any chance all of those things heal enough to be fully healthy in a week? Kubiak can always say, “Peyton’s not fully there yet, so we’re giving him at least another week to get himself right.” Manning may not like that, but lions in winter don’t like being told it’s wintertime either.

Manning’s highest passer rating in a game this year: 101.7.
Osweiler’s passer rating Sunday: 127.1.

Osweiler looked like more of a Kubiak quarterback than Manning has this year—though that’s a bit unfair because Manning just hasn’t had the same arm strength and admitted in training camp he had no feeling in his passing fingertips. Osweiler is fine being under center, which fits more of the Kubiak mold; Manning vastly prefers the shotgun or pistol. Osweiler is more athletic and is comfortable running bootlegs. Manning doesn’t like throwing on the run. Kubiak said of Osweiler: “He can do everything. He’s a very composed young man, and the more he plays, I think, the better he’s going to get. We booted a little bit, not a lot. They [the Bears’ defenders] were up the field quite a bit, but the threat of us [running bootlegs], I think, helped us run the ball.” Osweiler finished 20 of 27, and more importantly, took care of the ball.

“One thing we stressed all week was ball security,” Osweiler told reporters after the game, “and coming out of this game with no turnovers. To be able to play the entire 60 minutes and have a zero in that turnover column was huge for the offense.”

Manning’s passes are slow and sailing this year.
Osweiler’s fastball, right now, clearly has more velocity.

Mike Florio of NBC and Pro Football Talk reported on the Sunday night NBC game that Manning was planning to play in 2016, even if he had to play somewhere other than Denver. Manning’s former coach, Tony Dungy, said on TV that he was surprised by the story. I can’t imagine Manning would be happy with that report, though as someone who has worked with Florio for several years at NBC, I know he’s got his ears to the ground and is a very solid reporter. Manning has told me the past three years that he’s playing it one year at a time, and will decide after each season whether he’s going to play another. But minds change sometimes. We shall see.

My gut feeling is that the Broncos will let Manning heal and rehab at least one more week, though all voices on this topic, including Manning’s, were silent Sunday night. If this is the case, and Osweiler either plays valiantly and very close against New England, or beats the Patriots, then I think the Broncos have to face the reality that Osweiler should continue to play. Those, of course, are very big ifs.

This time is coming. It comes for every player. I would be careful about putting Manning out to pasture just yet, but I would also be pragmatic and smart. Every decision Kubiak and Elway make has to be for the team first and Manning—and all individuals—after that. What do we do now? Play Osweiler at least one more week is my guess. But whatever happens, the near future will be high drama in Denver.

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/11/23/monday-morning-quarterback-nfl-week-11-brock-osweiler-broncos

[EastCoastBronco]

If we beat NE with OZ at the helm running Kube's offence that will be the end of it.
The torch will be officially passed.

[Yashahla17]

Depends. We simply dont know if he was hurt to begin the season or not. Hard to argue how he looked against GB after a week's rest which was in major contrast to the other games he played. Personally, i think the injury is just a ploy for bad playing but im not there and dont know what the truth is. Either way, if Manning is/was hurt and and we make the playoffs it does leave the team with a bit of a conundrum. I think ultimately Manning is done in Denver and will most likely break his record somewhere else next year, from everything ive read about his injury this isnt something that can be fixed after just one week.
Manning was the healthiest he'd ever been due to having days off in training camp and otas, and in the pre season, he was as fresh as fresh gets. The packers game was just one of them games he looked solid but lets be honest he had zero touchdowns and 1 int in his best performance? Thats pretty sad when you think about it.

[OrangeFanatic]

No he wasn't done "years ago".

Yes he was. Even when he played good he choked when it really mattered.

[Northman]

Manning was the healthiest he'd ever been due to having days off in training camp and otas, and in the pre season, he was as fresh as fresh gets. The packers game was just one of them games he looked solid but lets be honest he had zero touchdowns and 1 int in his best performance? Thats pretty sad when you think about it.

Of course.

[MOtorboat]

I'm going to say yes, after contemplating this for 24 hours.

[BroncoJoe]

I'm going to say yes, after contemplating this for 24 hours.

24 hours didn't help me. I have no idea. I think it's all up to Brock and how well he plays. I do hope they don't bring Manning back for SNF - much to the chagrin of NBC.

[MOtorboat]

24 hours didn't help me. I have no idea. I think it's all up to Brock and how well he plays. I do hope they don't bring Manning back for SNF - much to the chagrin of NBC.

Even if Manning isn't healthy, I just don't see him giving up. Whether it's this season or next, or even not with the Broncos, I don't know. I just don't think he's never starting a game again.

[cmc0605]

I may have a unique position on this topic, but I'm not entirely sure it much matters who starts.

I like both QBs. I still think Manning can play and I think Brock is more than capable of being the QB of our future. I want to see Brock in a larger sample size, especially once there's some more film on him (we will probably see how he responds to Belichick and co.).

Both bring +'s and -'s to the table, be it experience, situational football awareness (with Manning), or some more mobility and a better arm (with Brock). I never found the argument that "Brock can run for his life better than Manning" a very satisfactory way to approach this problem philosophically, but it is true and the o-line isn't going to get much better. The arguments in favor of Manning never had anything to do with his stats this year, but rather what his ceiling is in a different offensive system, and that really boils down to whether you think the struggles have to do with age or other issues. Some think "he is done," others think he can still execute at a high level if things around him are the way he is comfortable with.

I actually think that if Manning is the starter, they should give him his no-huddle rhythm based offense back, and allow him to use his brain. That's what he does well. Since Kubiak has been mostly unwilling to do that in favor of a failed experiment, it's kind of a moot point. Brock can run Kubiak's system better, no doubt. I wish that Kubiak could have admitted that before the season began instead of giving us this story about how we're all trying to reach a compromise. I would have had no problem if they gave the controls to Brock earlier on in a honest fashion.

But, back to the point: in this system, behind this o-line, and with this playcalling, this is a 10-20 point/game offense, regardless of QB. Even if Brock has an excellent stat line, like he did vs. CHI, you end up with 17 points to show for it. That's what it is. The model is efficiency, not making many mistakes, and hoping the run game works that day.

This is all well and good if the defense continues to play stellar, and if the run game works. I get the point of what Kubiak wanted to do, and the whole romanticization of what we did back in 1998, etc. It's all a good postseason recipe. But it's going to fail if the D has a bad day or the run game gets stifled. If you need a must-score TD with two minutes left, or to overcome a 14 point deficit, I'd take Peyton all day. I think Brock can handle that situation, too, but we still have to see more samples with him in different situations. Either way, we won't see that ceiling in this system unless the game starts to get away from us.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I think manning will be back in about three weeks, plays one more game, gets "injured" again and goes on IR

I also think Brock lights up the pats next week

This game has me worried. Our line stinks, and the Patriots front 7 is really good. It might be a long night.

[GEM]

Brock is starting vs. the Pansies. Just got a text from Channel 4.

[tomjonesrocks]

Brock is starting vs. the Pansies. Just got a text from Channel 4.

Well that was fast...but yep - on NFLN now...

Hmm.

[BroncoJoe]

Welp - while I'm glad Manning gets another week to heal, I'm a bit surprised Kubiak and the Broncos decided to announce so quickly. Should have pulled a Belichick and kept them guessing.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

I don't think anyone would believe Manning would be even close to ready this week. Besides, our playbook was pretty vanilla against the Bears.

[Joel]

Yea, i dont see that happening honestly. I think it will be a tough game to win regardless but putting Manning at more risk with his injury is not a wise thing to do if you are wanting to make a run to the SB. From everything that i have read Manning is going to need weeks of healing to get back to snuff.
That's where I am. He was already hurt too badly to play KC, but three quarters TRYING could only have worsened multiple injuries: I doubt two weeks is enough for a 39-year-old to fully recover from all that, so trying to rush him back for a final meeting with Brady could well make it his final meeting with ANYONE. Maybe it'd be different if this were a must-win game or Oz had been awful @Chicago (though probably not) but Oz was fine and 8-3's not the end of the world. Let Manning heal so we have him when it's do or die.

End of an era, changing of the guard: The FINAL Brady vs. Manning showdown was almost certainly last week. Peyton's gone next year and Brady would be 41 by his next scheduled game against Eli (unless we trade for him.... :tongue:) It could happen in the playoffs, but not if Peyton tries to rush it next weekend. Looks like his career ended where it began after all: Not because the Colts cut him, but because they installed fake grass in a retractable roof stadium.

[Joel]

This is all well and good if the defense continues to play stellar, and if the run game works. I get the point of what Kubiak wanted to do, and the whole romanticization of what we did back in 1998, etc. It's all a good postseason recipe. But it's going to fail if the D has a bad day or the run game gets stifled. If you need a must-score TD with two minutes left, or to overcome a 14 point deficit, I'd take Peyton all day. I think Brock can handle that situation, too, but we still have to see more samples with him in different situations. Either way, we won't see that ceiling in this system unless the game starts to get away from us.
That should be the QBs job in ANY good offense: Not slinging it 40-50 times/game to either bury opponents by 30 pts or GET buried due to Ints, but put the team on his back to lead a comeback and/or throw a game-winning strike the reliable safe ground game and solid D faces a team good enough they can't just overpower it. Accepting high variance risk/reward ratios is foolish unless necessary, but even Franco Harris and the Steel Curtain needed Bradshaw to earn his paycheck every now and then.

Little off topic, but it's not romanticizing our repeat championship teams, only realization that all the above's why we achieved so much more with Elway on his last legs than Elway in his prime: Because we weren't a one-man offense, the same reason our last SB looked depressingly like Elways first three. IF/when Manning's healthy I'd still rather try it with him than a QB getting his first career start midseason; Kubiaks offense isn't dependent on any particular QB talent, just SOME kind of GOOD talent.

[Buff]

I may have a unique position on this topic, but I'm not entirely sure it much matters who starts.

I like both QBs. I still think Manning can play and I think Brock is more than capable of being the QB of our future. I want to see Brock in a larger sample size, especially once there's some more film on him (we will probably see how he responds to Belichick and co.).

Both bring +'s and -'s to the table, be it experience, situational football awareness (with Manning), or some more mobility and a better arm (with Brock). I never found the argument that "Brock can run for his life better than Manning" a very satisfactory way to approach this problem philosophically, but it is true and the o-line isn't going to get much better. The arguments in favor of Manning never had anything to do with his stats this year, but rather what his ceiling is in a different offensive system, and that really boils down to whether you think the struggles have to do with age or other issues. Some think "he is done," others think he can still execute at a high level if things around him are the way he is comfortable with.

I actually think that if Manning is the starter, they should give him his no-huddle rhythm based offense back, and allow him to use his brain. That's what he does well. Since Kubiak has been mostly unwilling to do that in favor of a failed experiment, it's kind of a moot point. Brock can run Kubiak's system better, no doubt. I wish that Kubiak could have admitted that before the season began instead of giving us this story about how we're all trying to reach a compromise. I would have had no problem if they gave the controls to Brock earlier on in a honest fashion.

But, back to the point: in this system, behind this o-line, and with this playcalling, this is a 10-20 point/game offense, regardless of QB. Even if Brock has an excellent stat line, like he did vs. CHI, you end up with 17 points to show for it. That's what it is. The model is efficiency, not making many mistakes, and hoping the run game works that day.

This is all well and good if the defense continues to play stellar, and if the run game works. I get the point of what Kubiak wanted to do, and the whole romanticization of what we did back in 1998, etc. It's all a good postseason recipe. But it's going to fail if the D has a bad day or the run game gets stifled. If you need a must-score TD with two minutes left, or to overcome a 14 point deficit, I'd take Peyton all day. I think Brock can handle that situation, too, but we still have to see more samples with him in different situations. Either way, we won't see that ceiling in this system unless the game starts to get away from us.

I appreciate this measured and nuanced perspective in a sea of flaming hot takes. The last two paragraphs are spot-on.

[Northman]

Welp - while I'm glad Manning gets another week to heal, I'm a bit surprised Kubiak and the Broncos decided to announce so quickly. Should have pulled a Belichick and kept them guessing.

To be honest i would not doubt it at all if we dont see Manning until the playoffs and even thats a big if. The minimum amount of time to heal an injury like that is 12 weeks, 6 at best but not a good idea.

[cmc0605]

That should be the QBs job in ANY good offense: Not slinging it 40-50 times/game to either bury opponents by 30 pts or GET buried due to Ints, but put the team on his back to lead a comeback and/or throw a game-winning strike the reliable safe ground game and solid D faces a team good enough they can't just overpower it. Accepting high variance risk/reward ratios is foolish unless necessary, but even Franco Harris and the Steel Curtain needed Bradshaw to earn his paycheck every now and then.

Little off topic, but it's not romanticizing our repeat championship teams, only realization that all the above's why we achieved so much more with Elway on his last legs than Elway in his prime: Because we weren't a one-man offense, the same reason our last SB looked depressingly like Elways first three. IF/when Manning's healthy I'd still rather try it with him than a QB getting his first career start midseason; Kubiaks offense isn't dependent on any particular QB talent, just SOME kind of GOOD talent.

I understand Peyton has had a bad season, but historically his 30-40+ points/game performances (along with what other elite QBs have done), do not come at the expense of lots of interceptions and gambles. That's why they are elite. Hoping your team pulls through late in the 4th quarter when you have five minutes left and are within 3 points of the other team (week after week) is much more of a gamble IMO, and exhibits larger variance, than having someone who can consistently go out there and shred defenses.

That is what you get in run-first and horizontal passing game systems. It might work out if the D is great and we're clicking on the run game. We might win the superbowl with 17 points. I get that is the goal, but I'm thinking statistically here...I'd still rather have a high-octane offense than one that runs for the sake of running.

[BroncoWave]

I may have a unique position on this topic, but I'm not entirely sure it much matters who starts.

I like both QBs. I still think Manning can play and I think Brock is more than capable of being the QB of our future. I want to see Brock in a larger sample size, especially once there's some more film on him (we will probably see how he responds to Belichick and co.).

Both bring +'s and -'s to the table, be it experience, situational football awareness (with Manning), or some more mobility and a better arm (with Brock). I never found the argument that "Brock can run for his life better than Manning" a very satisfactory way to approach this problem philosophically, but it is true and the o-line isn't going to get much better. The arguments in favor of Manning never had anything to do with his stats this year, but rather what his ceiling is in a different offensive system, and that really boils down to whether you think the struggles have to do with age or other issues. Some think "he is done," others think he can still execute at a high level if things around him are the way he is comfortable with.

I actually think that if Manning is the starter, they should give him his no-huddle rhythm based offense back, and allow him to use his brain. That's what he does well. Since Kubiak has been mostly unwilling to do that in favor of a failed experiment, it's kind of a moot point. Brock can run Kubiak's system better, no doubt. I wish that Kubiak could have admitted that before the season began instead of giving us this story about how we're all trying to reach a compromise. I would have had no problem if they gave the controls to Brock earlier on in a honest fashion.

But, back to the point: in this system, behind this o-line, and with this playcalling, this is a 10-20 point/game offense, regardless of QB. Even if Brock has an excellent stat line, like he did vs. CHI, you end up with 17 points to show for it. That's what it is. The model is efficiency, not making many mistakes, and hoping the run game works that day.

This is all well and good if the defense continues to play stellar, and if the run game works. I get the point of what Kubiak wanted to do, and the whole romanticization of what we did back in 1998, etc. It's all a good postseason recipe. But it's going to fail if the D has a bad day or the run game gets stifled. If you need a must-score TD with two minutes left, or to overcome a 14 point deficit, I'd take Peyton all day. I think Brock can handle that situation, too, but we still have to see more samples with him in different situations. Either way, we won't see that ceiling in this system unless the game starts to get away from us.

If not for an unfortunate trip on 4th and goal, we score 24. Keeping in mind this is on the road, in Brock's first start, against the coaching staff that knows him better than any staff in the NFL. I think it's a little unfair to Brock to say this is just a 10-20 ppg offense based on this game.

I see no reason why we couldn't regularly eclipse 20 points with Brock.

Buff can call it a "hot take" all he wants, but I think that unless Brock falls apart, it would be a massive mistake to go back with Peyton. I just don't see any way he gets healthy enough this season to get back to 100%, and he sucked this season when he was at 100%.

If is name was anything other than Peyton Manning, this would not be a debate at all.

[BroncoJoe]

I understand Peyton has had a bad season, but historically his 30-40+ points/game performances (along with what other elite QBs have done), do not come at the expense of lots of interceptions and gambles. That's why they are elite. Hoping your team pulls through late in the 4th quarter when you have five minutes left and are within 3 points of the other team (week after week) is much more of a gamble IMO, and exhibits larger variance, than having someone who can consistently go out there and shred defenses.

That is what you get in run-first and horizontal passing game systems. It might work out if the D is great and we're clicking on the run game. We might win the superbowl with 17 points. I get that is the goal, but I'm thinking statistically here...I'd still rather have a high-octane offense than one that runs for the sake of running.

The orange highlighted text is the downfall of your post.

It's been a while since Manning was capable of that.

[BroncoWave]

I understand Peyton has had a bad season, but historically his 30-40+ points/game performances (along with what other elite QBs have done), do not come at the expense of lots of interceptions and gambles. That's why they are elite. Hoping your team pulls through late in the 4th quarter when you have five minutes left and are within 3 points of the other team (week after week) is much more of a gamble IMO, and exhibits larger variance, than having someone who can consistently go out there and shred defenses.

That is what you get in run-first and horizontal passing game systems. It might work out if the D is great and we're clicking on the run game. We might win the superbowl with 17 points. I get that is the goal, but I'm thinking statistically here...I'd still rather have a high-octane offense than one that runs for the sake of running.

That Peyton Manning that can score 30-40 points per game is dead and gone. He's never coming back. And as I said in my last post, we were a trip on 4th and 1 away from scoring 24, and we did it without the help of defense touchdowns that Peyton got in nearly every one of our wins.

[MOtorboat]

That Peyton Manning that can score 30-40 points per game is dead and gone. He's never coming back. And as I said in my last post, we were a trip on 4th and 1 away from scoring 24, and we did it without the help of defense touchdowns that Peyton got in nearly every one of our wins.

To me, though, that 4th and 1 was at the heart of the problem as to why Chicago was in it, not a testament to the philosophy.

That 4th and 1 and a pair of 3rd and 1s in the 4th quarter where the play call was essentially a dive damn near lost that game on Sunday. Was it week 1 Manning threw the fade on 4th and 1 to ice the game? Week 3? Whatever week doesn't matter, but sometimes you have to be a lot more aggressive in your play calling on crucial third and fourth downs late in the game with the lead to win the game, rather than survive.

I say that with the full understanding that "no major mistakes" was essentially the philosophy going in to a quarterback's first ever start on the road and that is why the play calls on those short yardage, high-leverage downs was conservative and bland. As Joe pointed out yesterday, the play calling should get more aggressive as Osweiler develops.

We know Manning can do it. He's done it this year. Can he do it when his body is at 75 percent is the question. I would like to see them gamble with Osweiler in a high-leverage, mid-season moment to see if he can too. If he can, then Osweiler is the guy from here on out, IMO, because then you can run the conservative, Kubiak-style offense knowing you have the explosive offense available to you should you need it, without the drama of having to bring in Manning as some sort of closer.

And, yes, before its thrown back at me, this is not the offense I would run in today's football, but I can live with it if it's winning games.

[BroncoWave]

To me, though, that 4th and 1 was at the heart of the problem as to why Chicago was in it, not a testament to the philosophy.

That 4th and 1 and a pair of 3rd and 1s in the 4th quarter where the play call was essentially a dive damn near lost that game on Sunday. Was it week 1 Manning threw the fade on 4th and 1 to ice the game? Week 3? Whatever week doesn't matter, but sometimes you have to be a lot more aggressive in your play calling on crucial third and fourth downs late in the game with the lead to win the game, rather than survive.

I say that with the full understanding that "no major mistakes" was essentially the philosophy going in to a quarterback's first ever start on the road and that is why the play calls on those short yardage, high-leverage downs was conservative and bland. As Joe pointed out yesterday, the play calling should get more aggressive as Osweiler develops.

We know Manning can do it. He's done it this year. Can he do it when his body is at 75 percent is the question. I would like to see them gamble with Osweiler in a high-leverage, mid-season moment to see if he can too. If he can, then Osweiler is the guy from here on out, IMO, because then you can run the conservative, Kubiak-style offense knowing you have the explosive offense available to you should you need it, without the drama of having to bring in Manning as some sort of closer.

And, yes, before its thrown back at me, this is not the offense I would run in today's football, but I can live with it if it's winning games.

I will never have any issue with a team running the ball on 4th and goal from the 1. I do question why run Ronnie instead of CJ or a QB sneak, but even with prime Peyton I don't mind that call.

Should we mix it up some? Sure, and I'm sure we will the more experience Brock gets. But the way I see it, we were incredibly unlucky to only score 17 in that game. As Brock gets more experience, I see no reason why we won't be consistently scoring over 20 with him.

[MOtorboat]

I will never have any issue with a team running the ball on 4th and goal from the 1. I do question why run Ronnie instead of CJ or a QB sneak, but even with prime Peyton I don't mind that call.

Should we mix it up some? Sure, and I'm sure we will the more experience Brock gets. But the way I see it, we were incredibly unlucky to only score 17 in that game. As Brock gets more experience, I see no reason why we won't be consistently scoring over 20 with him.

For the record, I was much more disappointed in play calls on the 3rd and 1s at midfield in the fourth quarter than the 4th and goal from the 1.

[BroncoWave]

For the record, I was much more disappointed in play calls on the 3rd and 1s at midfield in the fourth quarter than the 4th and goal from the 1.

Yeah, it definitely was disappointing to see that John Fox seemingly took over for us in the 4th quarter. We can't be that passive, even with a young QB in Brock. I certainly agree that we need to really see what Brock can do in that situation instead of playing it as safely as humanly possible.

[MOtorboat]

Yeah, it definitely was disappointing to see that John Fox seemingly took over for us in the 4th quarter. We can't be that passive, even with a young QB in Brock. I certainly agree that we need to really see what Brock can do in that situation instead of playing it as safely as humanly possible.

My biggest play call annoyance Sunday: Would have liked to see one of the late 3rd and 1s as a bootleg or a waggle instead of a dive and the 2nd and 8 from our own 4 a dive instead of a boot.

In general, I don't think it was bad, just overly conservative.

[I Eat Staples]

I don't get why you don't QB sneak on every 4th and 1 when you have a 6'8 QB.

[TimHippo]

I don't get why you don't QB sneak on every 4th and 1 when you have a 6'8 QB.

All the slow giant has to do is fall down and he will gain over 1 yard. That's automatic.

[VonDoom]

I see no reason why we couldn't regularly eclipse 20 points with Brock.

I think the standard has to be a little higher than that, honestly. 20 ppg would put us 27th in the league right now. Most teams can score 20 with any QB. 24 points, for example, would be 11th in the league. That's more like what I would hope for in this scenario.


I will never have any issue with a team running the ball on 4th and goal from the 1. I do question why run Ronnie instead of CJ or a QB sneak, but even with prime Peyton I don't mind that call.

Should we mix it up some? Sure, and I'm sure we will the more experience Brock gets. But the way I see it, we were incredibly unlucky to only score 17 in that game. As Brock gets more experience, I see no reason why we won't be consistently scoring over 20 with him.

I think (hope) that a lot of what we did yesterday was conservative to ease Brock into being comfortable running the offense. They have to open it up a little or at least mix it up. My biggest play call frustration was after the Trevathan INT. We had the ball at the Chicago 25 and we went run, run, run, run, pass (only because it was 3rd and 9) and then the 4th down call. I have no issue with going for it that, but I agree, use JT or CJ or sneak it. Straight up the middle. Even still, the Hillman run would have worked with better execution.

[TXBRONC]

I think manning will be back in about three weeks, plays one more game, gets "injured" again and goes on IR

I also think Brock lights up the pats next week

If Osweiler lights up the ****Patsies it will be difficult send him back to the bench.

[Joel]

I understand Peyton has had a bad season, but historically his 30-40+ points/game performances (along with what other elite QBs have done), do not come at the expense of lots of interceptions and gambles. That's why they are elite. Hoping your team pulls through late in the 4th quarter when you have five minutes left and are within 3 points of the other team (week after week) is much more of a gamble IMO, and exhibits larger variance, than having someone who can consistently go out there and shred defenses.

That is what you get in run-first and horizontal passing game systems. It might work out if the D is great and we're clicking on the run game. We might win the superbowl with 17 points. I get that is the goal, but I'm thinking statistically here...I'd still rather have a high-octane offense than one that runs for the sake of running.
Statistically, no one shreds playoff (let alone SB) defenses very often. And just because a game's tight doesn't make it high variance; if the leading team's a GOOD one its solid running won't flip the field for OPPONENTS with turnovers and its solid D won't allow them even FGs very often: The OPPONENT'S forced into high variance play because they trail a solid team that makes them earn every inch and has left the very little time to do it, so they must swing for the fences against a great D. I'll take skill vs. luck every time.

[I Eat Staples]

Passing the ball a lot, playing a fast-paced, risk/reward style of play decreases variance because it lengthens the game and gives both teams more possessions; thus, the better team is more likely to win.

Mistakes are more forgivable because you're punting less and scoring more points, so 1 or 2 turnovers won't kill you.

[Joel]

To me, though, that 4th and 1 was at the heart of the problem as to why Chicago was in it, not a testament to the philosophy.

That 4th and 1 and a pair of 3rd and 1s in the 4th quarter where the play call was essentially a dive damn near lost that game on Sunday. Was it week 1 Manning threw the fade on 4th and 1 to ice the game? Week 3? Whatever week doesn't matter, but sometimes you have to be a lot more aggressive in your play calling on crucial third and fourth downs late in the game with the lead to win the game, rather than survive.

I say that with the full understanding that "no major mistakes" was essentially the philosophy going in to a quarterback's first ever start on the road and that is why the play calls on those short yardage, high-leverage downs was conservative and bland. As Joe pointed out yesterday, the play calling should get more aggressive as Osweiler develops.

We know Manning can do it. He's done it this year. Can he do it when his body is at 75 percent is the question. I would like to see them gamble with Osweiler in a high-leverage, mid-season moment to see if he can too. If he can, then Osweiler is the guy from here on out, IMO, because then you can run the conservative, Kubiak-style offense knowing you have the explosive offense available to you should you need it, without the drama of having to bring in Manning as some sort of closer.

And, yes, before its thrown back at me, this is not the offense I would run in today's football, but I can live with it if it's winning games.
The highlighted part is what I've been saying all along, and you can be sure "having the explosive offense available should you need it" is integra: This is a guy who played under and then coached Elway, after coaching Steve Young in the interim. He just doesn't go for "explosive" at the risk of "exploding" when slow and steady's doing the job's just fine; the problem is, as it has been since Manning got here, our blocking's so awful neither slow and steady running OR explosive passing can work well against good D.

The 4th/3rd and 1s illustrate that: If your line's SO pathetic it has HALF A DOZEN tries to muster enough surge for a SINGLE yard but can't succeed on ANY of them, boots won't work much better. We're caught by the rulebook, because we don't have more than 2-3 blockers and it won't LET us have 8-9 eligible receivers.

[Joel]

Passing the ball a lot, playing a fast-paced, risk/reward style of play decreases variance because it lengthens the game and gives both teams more possessions; thus, the better team is more likely to win.

Mistakes are more forgivable because you're punting less and scoring more points, so 1 or 2 turnovers won't kill you.
It extends the games by in high variance ways though, so variance increases both per possession and overall. Rolling two dice has TWICE the variance of flipping two coins; rolling three (i.e. an extra possession) TRIPLES the total variance. Meanwhile, all outcomes for each coin are within a standard deviation of the average (because only two exist,) but each die has two outcomes outside a standard deviation of the average.

Also, you're NOT punting less: The NFL rushing average is perennially just over 4 yds (it's been with 0.2 yds of 4.1 all but 5 of the last 68 seasons,) so even if three plays average 25% less than an average teams average, you can still pick up 4th and 1 with 2 yds to spare. The only reason you'll punt less passing is because you'll throw those 1 or 2 turnovers instead: When you DON'T turn it over, the runs will keep moving the chains (at least) as consistently as the passes; they'll just have fewer possessions to do so.

So will your opponents, and when you're FACING a team that has a lot of 3-play 80 yd TD aerial assaults, that's a good thing: Plod down the field 4 yds at a time so you've still got the ball when the gun sounds, and if you're trailing so you NEED that one-play score, THEN put it up and take your chances.

[Simple Jaded]

Now the offense is too conservative?

Omg, this season has everything, I have so much to give thanks for.

[Yashahla17]

I don't get why you don't QB sneak on every 4th and 1 when you have a 6'8 QB.

Works for brady as well. He's almost guaranteed the yard on his sneaks.