Who should start next week? [Archive]

wayninja

11-15-2015, 08:08 PM

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 08:08 PM

Peyton. The goal is to win the SB right? You start Peyton. Brock is playing better right now, but Peyton needs to get out of this funk somehow. Not sure practices will help him snap out of this. Only way I want Brock playing is if Peyton is still physically hurting from today.

We're not winning a Superbowl with either one. But even if our coaches and front office are too stubborn/blind to admit that, Brock STILL is the right choice because he's better than Peyton right now.

Brock should start, Peyton will start.

Krugan

11-15-2015, 08:09 PM

Manning will start.

Unless there is more to this injury then meets the eye.

I think he should start, although im not entirely sure it will matter who is behind center, our oline is very poor. Its not even arguable. That is the chink in this armor, even 4 man rushes are beating them , and fast.

Os might help with that, but he still seems to read slow, so **** i dont know.

I just want this team to win.

Northman

11-15-2015, 08:09 PM

No one knows Manning better than Dungy, even he said the Broncos should start Brock. That to me says a LOT.

slim

11-15-2015, 08:10 PM

Ir.

:d

BroncoWave

11-15-2015, 08:10 PM

Welp, this just in from Kubes' presser:

"Peyton's our quarterback. If Peyton is healthy and ready to go, he's our quarterback."

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:11 PM

We're not winning a Superbowl with either one. But even if our coaches and front office are too stubborn/blind to admit that, Brock STILL is the right choice because he's better than Peyton right now.

Brock should start, Peyton will start.

You have to give Peyton a shot here to redeem himself.

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 08:11 PM

You have to give Peyton a shot here to redeem himself.

He's had 9 games. It's only gotten worse.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:11 PM

Welp, this just in from Kubes' presser:

"Peyton's our quarterback. If Peyton is healthy and ready to go, he's our quarterback."

It has to be this way. HUGE leader in the locker room. Every player looks up to him, you bench him, the morale of this team goes down the sewer.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:12 PM

He's had 9 games. It's only gotten worse.

7-2.

Buff

11-15-2015, 08:13 PM

Poll fail.

Simple Jaded

11-15-2015, 08:13 PM

In before "you guys are so stupid, it's all the OL, Brock sucks" Cugel.

Northman

11-15-2015, 08:15 PM

If Manning really cared he should bench himself. He is hurting the team more right now than helping them.

BroncoTech

11-15-2015, 08:17 PM

A lot of issues;
How fast can Peyton come back from injury at his age?
How do they get the run going?
Is Brock ready?
How will the defense react with a change?

I say we let Peyton get well, he looked good coming off the bye week, and start the kid and see how it goes.

slim

11-15-2015, 08:17 PM

7-2.

9-17?

Northman

11-15-2015, 08:18 PM

Kubes apparently admitted he shouldnt have played Manning today. Ya think?

slim

11-15-2015, 08:19 PM

Kubes apparently admitted he shouldnt have played Manning today. Ya think?

IR will be the reason...lol.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:19 PM

Peyton starts next week.

aberdien

11-15-2015, 08:19 PM

Kyle Orton

Nomad

11-15-2015, 08:20 PM

If Manning really cared he should bench himself. He is hurting the team more right now than helping them.

This, or it's up to the locker room. If the locker room still has confidence in Manning, then I don't see the coaches making changes.

slim

11-15-2015, 08:20 PM

Peyton starts next week.

Let's hope so!

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:20 PM

Cecil Lammey ‏@CecilLammey 1m1 minute ago
"We all support Manning 100 percent. I do not expect to be the starter. " Brock Osweiler #Broncos

wayninja

11-15-2015, 08:20 PM

Peyton starts next week.

But does he finish?

BroncoWave

11-15-2015, 08:21 PM

Sure seems like all the talk coming out of Denver right now is that Peyton will take back over assuming full health. Super gay.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:22 PM

Should be "Peyton will start next week (if he's 100%)."

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:22 PM

But does he finish?

Don't know, but that wasn't the topic.

Northman

11-15-2015, 08:22 PM

Cecil Lammey ‏@CecilLammey 1m1 minute ago
"We all support Manning 100 percent. I do not expect to be the starter. " Brock Osweiler #Broncos

What else is he going to say? Lmao. Brock would be an idiot to publicly say he should start.

BroncoJoe

11-15-2015, 08:23 PM

7-2.

Thanks to the defense.

wayninja

11-15-2015, 08:23 PM

Sure seems like all the talk coming out of Denver right now is that Peyton will take back over assuming full health. Super gay.

The qualifier of "full health" is an easy out.

wayninja

11-15-2015, 08:23 PM

Don't know, but that wasn't the topic.

Yes, but I'm asking you that. Specifically. That's why there a ? symbol at the end.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:24 PM

Thanks to the defense.

Should Peyton apologize for those wins?

Nomad

11-15-2015, 08:25 PM

Thanks to the defense.

Yeah....defense did a decent job today considering no help from the offense. It could of been the ass whoopin like the Raiders did some years ago.

BroncoJoe

11-15-2015, 08:27 PM

Should Peyton apologize for those wins?

Is that what I said?

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:28 PM

Yes, but I'm asking you that. Specifically. That's why there a ? symbol at the end.

Its an uknown. How should I know if he finishes. If he plays better than tonight, which is HIGHLY likely, then he'll finish.

Look, this isnt' the first HoF QB to be benched for a bad game. THe greatest comeback of all time came from when HoF QB Jim Kelly was sat down. We all have been saying that Peyton has been playing poorly all year, this isn't knew. THIS kind of bad, is new. But is it where you expect the coach and GM to SIT the HoF QB now, after going 7-2 and one game away from setting the all-time record for a guy that has never started a game??? No, Not if he's healthy. Hopefully, if he's healthy enough to start, he's healthy enough to finish.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:28 PM

Is that what I said?

I'm asking you that.

Slick

11-15-2015, 08:31 PM

It has to be this way. HUGE leader in the locker room. Every player looks up to him, you bench him, the morale of this team goes down the sewer.

What about team morale as they watch Manning lose the game in the first half and then watch a young guy come in and fight his ass off and lead 2 TD drives?

Let's not act like this was Manning's only poor performance this season.

chazoe60

11-15-2015, 08:32 PM

Should Peyton apologize for those wins?

For $15Mil Peyton should be apologizing profusely

Bronco4ever

11-15-2015, 08:33 PM

What else is he going to say? Lmao. Brock would be an idiot to publicly say he should start.

@BrockOsweiler: Fo reals, did you see how much better we played after I got in? Of course I should start over that old fart.

VonDoom

11-15-2015, 08:34 PM

I love Manning more than most here, but he looks done. If it's injury, he's not going to magically recover by next week. Our o-line gets worse every week and at least Os is mobile and has a chance to make plays if things break down.

Nomad

11-15-2015, 08:34 PM

What about team morale as they watch Manning lose the game in the first half and then watch a young guy come in and fight his ass off and lead 2 TD drives?

Let's not act like this was Manning's only poor performance this season.

If his teammates really feel this way, then the Captains should take charge and go to Kubiak and Elway and say the locker room has no confidence in Manning. I don't believe the BRONCOS want this controversy, and not sure if that's even the mentality within the locker room.

Slick

11-15-2015, 08:43 PM

If his teammates really feel this way, then the Captains should take charge and go to Kubiak and Elway and say the locker room has no confidence in Manning. I don't believe the BRONCOS want this controversy, and not sure if that's even the mentality within the locker room.

Manning's crucial picks cost them the Colts game, almost cost them the first Chief game and I'm sure I'm forgetting more. He's thrown a lot of them. I know the guys look up to him but they're not blind.

I don't see how it would be a controversy. The guy has played pretty poorly.

HORSEPOWER 56

11-15-2015, 08:43 PM

This is dangerous ground to tread on right now. I feared we'd end up in this situation this season. Sure, Brock looked okay out there in limited action, but how much of it was "real" and how much of it was going against a defense with a huge lead playing a vanilla defense who hasn't scouted you?

If Peyton is truly injured, Brock should play, but by just making Brock the starter if Peyton can still go might lose the locker room. Today was (I'm guessing), Manning's worst game as a pro and probably in his life. There's no guarantee that even if he'd stayed in we wouldn't have been shut out. The defense actually didn't play poorly, but 4 turnovers and zero offensive production will take its toll on any defense.

It's a bad position to be in for Elway and Kubiak. Go with Brock, possibly give the impression that you're calling the season a wash and alienating the locker room -or- go with Peyton and hope he can perform. I don't think either of them think Brock is some kind of savior or are confident he can lead even a 7-2 team to the playoffs. Either way, if their decision on this isn't successful, they're going to look like idiots. Either for benching Manning in favor of an unproven commodity, or for playing Manning when he's clearly not the guy he was. I don't envy them.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 08:43 PM

I personally think Os SHOULD start, but I don't think he will. Who should start, and who do you think will start?
Os should start. We are not going anywhere with Manning. He's looked good exactly one game this year and that was against a defense that is showing it's not any good.

That said he won't. I really think it's time Manning sits with a mysterious injury for the rest of the season.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:43 PM

What about team morale as they watch Manning lose the game in the first half and then watch a young guy come in and fight his ass off and lead 2 TD drives?

Let's not act like this was Manning's only poor performance this season.

Well come on now, let's put what you said into some context here. I'm sure it wasn't any secret to the players about Manning's injuries. He went out there obviously injured and tried to compete. To us as fans I think we look at it a bit more robotically than the players do. We want the guy who gives us the best opportunity to win, to play. Obviously that was Oz today because Peyton Manning was injured. The players want the guy who has been leading them for 3 and 1/2 years to play and battle it out.

Brock played good, no doubt about that, I've said it several times that TD pass to Caldwell, there's no way in hell could Peyton EVER do that. But Brock drove down the field when it was 29-0 in late 3rd and 4th quarter. Also against a defense who spent 2 weeks prepping for Peyton Manning. Peyton has had a lot of bad games this year, but he's also put us in a position to win some games this year too. I personally would just rather the guy has been to the SB 3 times, over someone who has held the clip board for 3 and 1/2 years.

Northman

11-15-2015, 08:44 PM

If Manning sits it will be labeled due to injury even if there isnt one. No way the players or coaches embarrass him by saying he just isnt any good anymore.

Simple Jaded

11-15-2015, 08:45 PM

Y'all act like 17 Ints is so bad.

aberdien

11-15-2015, 08:45 PM

Denver Broncos ‏@Broncos 7m7 minutes ago Sports Authority Field at Mile High
.@Millerlite40: "That's The Sheriff, man -- The Sheriff. He's got a great legacy. ... Today was just a rough day."

FanInAZ

11-15-2015, 08:46 PM

7-2.

Remember when we were 6-0 under Orton?

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 08:46 PM

You have to give Peyton a shot here to redeem himself.He's had enough of a shot. He's been horrible.

Joel

11-15-2015, 08:46 PM

Slick

11-15-2015, 08:47 PM

Well come on now, let's put what you said into some context here. I'm sure it wasn't any secret to the players about Manning's injuries. He went out there obviously injured and tried to compete. To us as fans I think we look at it a bit more robotically than the players do. We want the guy who gives us the best opportunity to win, to play. Obviously that was Oz today because Peyton Manning was injured. The players want the guy who has been leading them for 3 and 1/2 years to play and battle it out.

Brock played good, no doubt about that, I've said it several times that TD pass to Caldwell, there's no way in hell could Peyton EVER do that. But Brock drove down the field when it was 29-0 in late 3rd and 4th quarter. Also against a defense who spent 2 weeks prepping for Peyton Manning. Peyton has had a lot of bad games this year, but he's also put us in a position to win some games this year too. I personally would just rather the guy has been to the SB 3 times, over someone who has held the clip board for 3 and 1/2 years.

Our opinions differ in this case. I think Manning is done.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:47 PM

Remember when we were 6-0 under Orton?

Remember when Orton took us to the Superbowl?

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:47 PM

Our opinions differ in this case. I think Manning is done.

Hey no worries, that's what this forum is all about.

aberdien

11-15-2015, 08:49 PM

Lindsay Jones ‏@bylindsayhjones 12m12 minutes ago
Manning refused to blame poor play on injuries. "That's an easy way out to say after the fact."

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 08:49 PM

Remember when Orton took us to the Superbowl?

The Manning who took us to the Superbowl is not the Manning who has played for us this season.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:50 PM

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:51 PM

but EVEN if his awful play's solely or largely due to nagging injuries, the bottom line remains that he's playing awfully, regardless of WHY. If it's just injuries, so healing up will restore him to form, going back out there behind an awful line every week can't heal and can only worsen any injury hobbling him literally or figuratively. And IF, once again, it's just injuries, that means Brock produced more at 100% than Manning at <100%: Being healthy "enough" to jog back out there doesn't make him well enough he SHOULD.

Think of it this way: He's taken weekly rest days 3 years running, and is splitting practices with his backup for the first time in his CAREER, all because we don't want his aging body so beat up by the playoffs that he can't sustain a SB run: We saw how that goes when he tore his quad this time last year, and played with BOTH ankles taped the year before that. If he's too hurt to beat average teams at home in November, continual play won't get him healthy enough to beat good teams on the road in January.

The decision to bench him would be so much easier if he wasn't Peyton Manning. If this was Orton we were talking about it, it'd be a no brainer.

But you're right, if he's 100% he plays, and there shouldn't be any question. To me it's the obvious answer. There's a big difference between a 27 year old QB playing injured and a 39 year old playing injured. I think Oz can do a good enough job against the Bears, but I'm thinking about the long run for this season, and I have too many concerns regarding Oz to feel like he gives us a better chance than Peyton.

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 08:52 PM

Plus.... most likely it's not a move you make, and then 'go back.'

Horsepower nailed it. Brock looked "ok" in a limited time against a defense that was playing pretty damned safe, and they were STILL gettting to him nearly every snap. But what if we need that last minute drive that we've seen Peyton lead a couple times this year? Is Brock capable? Don't know. We WILL find out, but is now the right tiem to pull the rug out from Peyton for good? Lets be honest, once you make that move, its a move for good because you can't just simply go back and forth.

Do you think we'll win a Superbowl with Peyton?

If the answer is no, you go to Brock. Either he comes in and is amazing and we're a contender, or we get to evaluate him for next year. Playing Peyton has no value unless he wins us a Superbowl. I don't think it can happen, so I think the right move is Brock.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 08:54 PM

Well come on now, let's put what you said into some context here. I'm sure it wasn't any secret to the players about Manning's injuries. He went out there obviously injured and tried to compete. To us as fans I think we look at it a bit more robotically than the players do. We want the guy who gives us the best opportunity to win, to play. Obviously that was Oz today because Peyton Manning was injured. The players want the guy who has been leading them for 3 and 1/2 years to play and battle it out.

Brock played good, no doubt about that, I've said it several times that TD pass to Caldwell, there's no way in hell could Peyton EVER do that. But Brock drove down the field when it was 29-0 in late 3rd and 4th quarter. Also against a defense who spent 2 weeks prepping for Peyton Manning. Peyton has had a lot of bad games this year, but he's also put us in a position to win some games this year too. I personally would just rather the guy has been to the SB 3 times, over someone who has held the clip board for 3 and 1/2 years.He also drove down the field when it was 22-0 and not over yet. he got picked in the end zone. I expect that from a young guy. But don't pretend the game was over before he had already outperformed Manning.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:54 PM

The decision to bench him would be so much easier if he wasn't Peyton Manning. If this was Orton we were talking about it, it'd be a no brainer.

This is so true, and despite so many thinking its a 'no brainer' and it shouldn't matter who Peyton is, it absolutely matters. There is STILL room for class and respect in this game.

Elway knows that the NFL, and the fans, take take tak and Take. The last thing he's going to do to Manning is dump him to the side the moment he can't give anymore. The fans simply don't care who the man IN the uniform is or that it's actually human, all they care about is the uniform.

Nomad

11-15-2015, 08:54 PM

I guess one of you is gonna have to step up and get on the red phone with Kubiak/ Elway.

tripp

11-15-2015, 08:56 PM

The Manning who took us to the Superbowl is not the Manning who has played for us this season.

There is no winner in this "who should start" debate.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 08:56 PM

aberdien

11-15-2015, 08:57 PM

I guess one of you is gonna have to step up and get on the red phone with Kubiak/ Elway.

https://media4.giphy.com/media/nqQNegYFoKMdG/200_s.gif

Nomad

11-15-2015, 08:58 PM

https://media4.giphy.com/media/nqQNegYFoKMdG/200_s.gif

I bet he can get it done

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 09:00 PM

The decision to bench him would be so much easier if he wasn't Peyton Manning. If this was Orton we were talking about it, it'd be a no brainer.

But you're right, if he's 100% he plays, and there shouldn't be any question. To me it's the obvious answer. There's a big difference between a 27 year old QB playing injured and a 39 year old playing injured. I think Oz can do a good enough job against the Bears, but I'm thinking about the long run for this season, and I have too many concerns regarding Oz to feel like he gives us a better chance than Peyton.
You are putting a lot of blame on an injury. What about games 1-6 where he played horrible and they won only because of defense? Frankly if this defense wasn't great this team would be 0-9 and it would be because of Manning. Even an above average defense could not have covered up for his play this season. He leads the league in picks, hasn't gone a single game this season without one, and is no where near the same player he was.

I agree if this wasn't Manning the decision would be easier, Hell if it wasn't Manning he would never have played after the bye.

The worst part is Brock made good decisions today throwing the ball away, How many times has Manning thrown picks this year where he should have done that? The answer is far too many.

I think Manning is done. I wish he had retired after last year.

Joel

11-15-2015, 09:01 PM

The Manning who took us to the Superbowl is not the Manning who has played for us this season.
Really? This seasons Manning looks eerily like that SBs Manning: Either he aged a decade over the SB bye, or there's more to it.

tripp

11-15-2015, 09:04 PM

You are putting a lot of blame on an injury. What about games 1-6 where he played horrible and they won only because of defense? Frankly if this defense wasn't great this team would be 0-9 and it would be because of Manning. Even an above average defense could not have covered up for his play this season. He leads the league in picks, hasn't gone a single game this season without one, and is no where near the same player he was.

I agree if this wasn't Manning the decision would be easier, Hell if it wasn't Manning he would never have played after the bye.

The worst part is Brock made good decisions today throwing the ball away, How many times has Manning thrown picks this year where he should have done that? The answer is far too many.

I think Manning is done. I wish he had retired after last year.

You're right I am putting a lot of blame on the injury, but I also blame the offense as a unit for their piss poor performances for this season, Manning included.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 09:04 PM

Really? This seasons Manning looks eerily like that SBs Manning: Either he aged a decade over the SB bye, or there's more to it.You think this Manning looks anything like that Manning "on the football field"?

HORSEPOWER 56

11-15-2015, 09:05 PM

Do you think we'll win a Superbowl with Peyton?

If the answer is no, you go to Brock. Either he comes in and is amazing and we're a contender, or we get to evaluate him for next year. Playing Peyton has no value unless he wins us a Superbowl. I don't think it can happen, so I think the right move is Brock.

I think we can win with Peyton and we also can win one with Brock. A lot of it depends on turnovers and the running game. If our offense can chew some clock and stop turning the ball over, we have as good a chance as any team. Our defense is championship caliber when they aren't constantly being put in bad positions by the offense.

I wonder what happened to the short-to-intermediate passing game. It has seemed non-existent the past few weeks. Peyton is throwing deep way too much. It seems counterintuitive like Manning and Kubiak are trying to prove something about Manning's arm and it is backfiring. I would think a shorter more controlled passing attack (like Peyton has done most of his career) would be better on both him and the O-line. It's also not the Kubiak "West Coast" way to throw deep all the time. This "wing and a prayer" offense is killing us. Just throwing it up for grabs deep is not working and is putting the defense in a hole every game.

Northman

11-15-2015, 09:07 PM

Nope. Not when he's just one win away from setting the record, and he chose Denver over everyone else. Not when he just took us to a SUper Bowl, and not when he has made us relevant over the last few years. No, if I'm Elway, I have more respect for the man in the uniform than what you are. It's easy to do as a fan sitting back here.

I think thats your problem or i should say the difference between you and i. Im about the team, not one player no matter how good he used to be. The bottom line will always be about winning ballgames and winning a championship. All records should be secondary and as nice as it would be to see Manning get that record you have to come to terms that it might just not happen for him. You cant sacrifice winning ballgames just trying to get a aging QB to pass a record. Thats not good business, its not logical no matter how well intentioned it might be. I think its beyond clear that Manning isnt going to improve and it would be incredibly moronic to allow him to keep hurting the team just to try and pass a record. As good as guys like Marino and Kelly were the one thing that always eluded them was a championship. It sucks that they couldnt get one but it happens and Manning may not get that record because of how he is playing. Elway also knows you can lose the fanbase when you are not winning football games because you are thinking only about one player. You talk about respect but i would hope that Manning would have enough respect not to keep playing when he knows he is more of a problem for the team than not.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 09:08 PM

THat first INT on 3rd down was just horrible..... horrible.

Simple Jaded

11-15-2015, 09:09 PM

North, Manning is not going to bench himself, that's wishful thinking.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 09:10 PM

I think thats your problem or i should say the difference between you and i. Im about the team, not one player no matter how good he used to be. The bottom line will always be about winning ballgames and winning a championship. All records should be secondary and as nice as it would be to see Manning get that record you have to come to terms that it might just not happen for him. You cant sacrifice winning ballgames just trying to get a aging QB to pass a record. Thats not good business, its not logical no matter how well intentioned it might be. I think its beyond clear that Manning isnt going to improve and it would be incredibly moronic to allow him to keep hurting the team just to try and pass a record. As good as guys like Marino and Kelly were the one thing that always eluded them was a championship. It sucks that they couldnt get one but it happens and Manning may not get that record because of how he is playing. Elway also knows you can lose the fanbase when you are not winning football games because you are thinking only about one player. You talk about respect but i would hope that Manning would have enough respect not to keep playing when he knows he is more of a problem for the team than not.
A player of Manning's caliber will never bench himself. To be that good you have to have a confidence in yourself. Any benching of Manning must come from Kubiak and the organization, because Manning will never say that. And I would not expect him to.

chazoe60

11-15-2015, 09:11 PM

Crazy how a QB that can move can make an OL look better while one who is a statue helps to make them look worse. Yes, our OL sucks and that's all the more reason to play Brock.

Northman

11-15-2015, 09:12 PM

North, Manning is not going to bench himself, that's wishful thinking.

Oh i know. And he will continue to suck and i will start to resent him more for it. Such is life.

Bronco4ever

11-15-2015, 09:13 PM

Start Brock next week, hope Manning heals from whatever ailments he has, and start him vs New England.

Northman

11-15-2015, 09:13 PM

Start Brock next week, hope Manning heals from whatever ailments he has, and start him vs New England.

NE will crush him.

Slick

11-15-2015, 09:14 PM

Denver Broncos ‏@Broncos 7m7 minutes ago Sports Authority Field at Mile High
.@Millerlite40: "That's The Sheriff, man -- The Sheriff. He's got a great legacy. ... Today was just a rough day."
Von's in denial.

Crazy how a QB that can move can make an OL look better while one who is a statue helps to make them look worse. Yes, our OL sucks and that's all the more reason to play Brock.
I thought the line looked just as bad. Both QBs were running for their lives or taking shots. Brock just manages to escape it better.

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 09:16 PM

Nope. Not when he's just one win away from setting the record, and he chose Denver over everyone else. Not when he just took us to a SUper Bowl, and not when he has made us relevant over the last few years. No, if I'm Elway, I have more respect for the man in the uniform than what you are. It's easy to do as a fan sitting back here.

I just don't agree with this. I don't think it's disrespectful to bench a player who isn't playing well. It's disrespectful to the organization to start a player who isn't best for the team.

Really? This seasons Manning looks eerily like that SBs Manning: Either he aged a decade over the SB bye, or there's more to it.

No he doesn't. This season's Manning doesn't look like the guy who threw for 5,000+ yards and 55 TDs.

I think we can win with Peyton and we also can win one with Brock. A lot of it depends on turnovers and the running game. If our offense can chew some clock and stop turning the ball over, we have as good a chance as any team. Our defense is championship caliber when they aren't constantly being put in bad positions by the offense.

I wonder what happened to the short-to-intermediate passing game. It has seemed non-existent the past few weeks. Peyton is throwing deep way too much. It seems counterintuitive like Manning and Kubiak are trying to prove something about Manning's arm and it is backfiring. I would think a shorter more controlled passing attack (like Peyton has done most of his career) would be better on both him and the O-line. It's also not the Kubiak "West Coast" way to throw deep all the time. This "wing and a prayer" offense is killing us. Just throwing it up for grabs deep is not working and is putting the defense in a hole every game.

I just don't think we can win a Superbowl with Peyton. He has nothing left in the tank.

chazoe60

11-15-2015, 09:17 PM

Von's in denial.

I thought the line looked just as bad. Both QBs were running for their lives or taking shots. Brock just manages to escape it better.

That was kinda my point. Where Manning faints like Orton Brock moves his feet and at least attempts to make something positive happen.

Joel

11-15-2015, 09:20 PM

You think this Manning looks anything like that Manning "on the football field"?
Yes, that was the point: Manning posted the BEST PASSING SEASON IN HISTORY, took a week off for the bye, and returned looking pretty average against SD and N*, then took another week off and looked like he does NOW. Most players get worse WITHOUT a weeks rest (that's why we have playoff byes) but evidently that changes after 35.

Or the impotent run surge and porous pass protection I screamed about throughout 2013, most analysts ranted about throughout 2014 and Kubiak dumped 3/5 starters to fix in 2015 were at least as big a problem as our QB turning 37 or 39. That he IS old, immobile and has surgically fused vertebræ makes that likely. One difference between 2013 regular and postseason Manning was having both ankles taped the whole postseason but not the first half of the regular season. Kinda like last years quad tear.

The real question may be whether his body's broken down by each December because he's old or just unprotected, and the answer's probably "both."

Northman

11-15-2015, 09:20 PM

Brock breaking tackles was eerily like Big Ben. I was actually cheering at the end even though we still lost the game. Im totally behind this kid and hope he does well.

Simple Jaded

11-15-2015, 09:22 PM

That was kinda my point. Where Manning faints like Orton Brock moves his feet and at least attempts to make something positive happen.

Orton will always put the G. O . A. T in The Fainting Goat.

Bronco4ever

11-15-2015, 09:22 PM

NE will crush him.

He's sort of been crushed by everyone this season. I can see him sitting out next week to get his barrings for NE. Not saying that he's necessarily going to play any better, but it's hard to imagine he wouldn't play in that game.

tripp

11-15-2015, 09:30 PM

Brock breaking tackles was eerily like Big Ben. I was actually cheering at the end even though we still lost the game. Im totally behind this kid and hope he does well.

I'm rooting for him too, whether it be next week or next year. I'd prefer to see Peyton under center, but I'm on board with whoever is taking snaps.

Northman

11-15-2015, 09:32 PM

I'm rooting for him too, whether it be next week or next year. I'd prefer to see Peyton under center, but I'm on board with whoever is taking snaps.

Im behind whoever gives us the best chance to improve the offense and win. Im not confident that Manning is that guy anymore.

Joel

11-15-2015, 09:35 PM

Really? This seasons Manning looks eerily like that SBs Manning: Either he aged a decade over the SB bye, or there's more to it.No he doesn't. This season's Manning doesn't look like the guy who threw for 5,000+ yards and 55 TDs.
Yeah, he does. THAT season's Manning didn't throw for 5000+ yds and 55 TDs in the SB: He had 1 TD and 2 Ints, about the same TD/Int ratio as now. His completion percentage was ~5% better, but that's about the only difference. He played AWFULLY in the SB, just as now, despite blocking so good it only allowed an elite D a SINGLE sack: That's how it went, right? ;) Never mind forcing him to hurry EVERY throw, just as now, or sending the first snap through our end zone and posting a 2 YPC rushing average.

I just don't think we can win a Superbowl with Peyton. He has nothing left in the tank.
Then he had nothing left in the tank when he played equally badly IN a SB: The 5000+ passing yds and 55 TDs were just some kind of freaky extended anomaly, like Tebow Time.

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 09:37 PM

Yeah, he does. THAT season's Manning didn't throw for 5000+ yds and 55 TDs in the SB: He had 1 TD and 2 Ints, about the same TD/Int ratio as now. His completion percentage was ~5% better, but that's about the only difference. He played AWFULLY in the SB, just as now, despite blocking so good it only allowed an elite D a SINGLE sack: That's how it went, right? ;) Never mind forcing him to hurry EVERY throw, just as now, or sending the first snap through our end zone and posting a 2 YPC rushing average.

Then he had nothing left in the tank when he played equally badly IN a SB: The 5000+ passing yds and 55 TDs were just some kind of freaky extended anomaly, like Tebow Time.

So you're saying that his WORST game of 2013 is now his normal performance every week. That's my point. Bad games happen to everyone, but it's an every week thing for him this year. He's done.

Joel

11-15-2015, 09:39 PM

Im behind whoever gives us the best chance to improve the offense and win. Im not confident that Manning is that guy anymore.
We all know whom you're behind and how that inevitably colors anyones opinion of both his greatest rival and greatest nemesis, especially since they're brothers.

Joel

11-15-2015, 09:43 PM

So you're saying that his WORST game of 2013 is now his normal performance every week. That's my point. Bad games happen to everyone, but it's an every week thing for him this year. He's done.
I'm saying he's playing the same as in his worst game of THE BEST SEASON ANY QB EVER HAD for the same reason, and it's NOT age. Think benching him for Brock the LAST time we trailed 29-0 goes any better than THIS time? More importantly, think Brock brings us back from 24-0 on the road against Rivers, let alone wins by DOUBLE DIGITS?

I Eat Staples

11-15-2015, 09:46 PM

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 09:48 PM

I think thats your problem or i should say the difference between you and i. Im about the team, not one player no matter how good he used to be. The bottom line will always be about winning ballgames and winning a championship.
No. There is no difference there, I'm just being more realistic about it. You want to pretend that the coaches and players on the team don't know that there is a human inside that uniform 18, and you want to pretend that if YOU were in charge, you would simply be able to ignore that fact and p urely make decisions based on 'facts and bottom lines.' I'm telling you, that as "great" as that sounds (not really), its not realistic. Kubiak, Elway, and everyone else in that locker room doesn't purely see the bottom line to the point that they feel you should ignore the player that is in that uniform. For that player, that person, ACTUALLY DOES matter. He's HUGE to the NFL, and HUGE to the game of football, and you can't (as a person in charge and part of that ecosystem) simply ignore it. It surrounds you every day. There isn't a day that the media, the fans, the players, the practices, the offense....isn't completely enveloped by Manning, and that's what comes with having a player of that kind of stature. Kubiak HAS to repect it. Purely for the respect of the game as well as respect for Manning.

As a fan, and sitting at home on the couch and all that matters to us is the bottom line man... the wins. What's the record stats. "That guy committed a penalty, I'd SIT HIM DOWN!!" " This team is undisciplined, I'd RUN THEM ALL DAY UNTIL THEY FELL DOWN if I were coach!!" We've heard all these statements from fans because they/we think we know so much better. We don't actually have to deal with them as people, only as uniform numbers that are in our colors.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 09:53 PM

I'm saying he's playing the same as in his worst game of THE BEST SEASON ANY QB EVER HAD for the same reason, and it's NOT age. Think benching him for Brock the LAST time we trailed 29-0 goes any better than THIS time? More importantly, think Brock brings us back from 24-0 on the road against Rivers, let alone wins by DOUBLE DIGITS?we'll never know how Brock would have done. Even asking is stupid IMO. This Manning is not playing well, You think it is all the line. Does It matter? Because we are not getting a better line this season. So playing the guy who can help the line would be the smart thing to do.

I think that SB showed NFL teams how to beat the older version of Manning. It's a system that is routinely ran against him now and it works so why would teams go away from it. He has lost his patients in the pocket, he's lost his mobility in the pocket and he has to get his body into the throws now so teams put guys in his face. A younger version of Manning could throw while pressured and was a master of pocket presence and reading a defense. He no longer seems to be able to do that. Be it age, or defenses figuring him out the end is the same, he's not performing up to par and it's a huge problem for this team.

Brock showed today that he is better that Manning at some things. One of those things is dealing with pressure. Since we are not getting a new line play the guy that can help them and that is not Manning anymore.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 09:56 PM

No. There is no difference there, I'm just being more realistic about it. You want to pretend that the coaches and players on the team don't know that there is a human inside that uniform 18, and you want to pretend that if YOU were in charge, you would simply be able to ignore that fact and p urely make decisions based on 'facts and bottom lines.' I'm telling you, that as "great" as that sounds (not really), its not realistic. Kubiak, Elway, and everyone else in that locker room doesn't purely see the bottom line to the point that they feel you should ignore the player that is in that uniform. For that player, that person, ACTUALLY DOES matter. He's HUGE to the NFL, and HUGE to the game of football, and you can't (as a person in charge and part of that ecosystem) simply ignore it. It surrounds you every day. There isn't a day that the media, the fans, the players, the practices, the offense....isn't completely enveloped by Manning, and that's what comes with having a player of that kind of stature. Kubiak HAS to repect it. Purely for the respect of the game as well as respect for Manning.

As a fan, and sitting at home on the couch and all that matters to us is the bottom line man... the wins. What's the record stats. "That guy committed a penalty, I'd SIT HIM DOWN!!" " This team is undisciplined, I'd RUN THEM ALL DAY UNTIL THEY FELL DOWN if I were coach!!" We've heard all these statements from fans because they/we think we know so much better. We don't actually have to deal with them as people, only as uniform numbers that are in our colors.I don't think anybody but Yash is saying the decision should be easy. But just because it's a tough decision doesn't mean that benching him is the wrong decision.

Yashahla17

11-15-2015, 10:00 PM

http://www.denverbroncos.com/cda-web/audio-video-module.htm?vv=pop-out&id=59b0e5a2-2077-4520-bfe3-e7ed86fcba21&previewMode=true

Need more of a qb like this. Brock like a big ben knows you cant arm tackle,him.

Slick

11-15-2015, 10:00 PM

we'll never know how Brock would have done. Even asking is stupid IMO. This Manning is not playing well, You think it is all the line. Does It matter? Because we are not getting a better line this season. So playing the guy who can help the line would be the smart thing to do.

I think that SB showed NFL teams how to beat the older version of Manning. It's a system that is routinely ran against him now and it works so why would teams go away from it. He has lost his patients in the pocket, he's lost his mobility in the pocket and he has to get his body into the throws now so teams put guys in his face. A younger version of Manning could throw while pressured and was a master of pocket presence and reading a defense. He no longer seems to be able to do that. Be it age, or defenses figuring him out the end is the same, he's not performing up to par and it's a huge problem for this team.

Brock showed today that he is better that Manning at some things. One of those things is dealing with pressure. Since we are not getting a new line play the guy that can help them and that is not Manning anymore.

I agree with you here but it just reinforces the fact that 18 should have hung it up after last year. I think John made a huge mistake in thinking he could run a Kubiak offense and with how shitty this offensive line is it only magnifies the problem. Now they're stuck.

Nomad

11-15-2015, 10:01 PM

I don't think anybody but Yash is saying the decision should be easy. But just because it's a tough decision doesn't mean that benching him is the wrong decision.

No one says it'll be the wrong decision, but the keyboard warriors around here pretend it'll be that easy to bench Manning. No the players aren't the decision makers and they won't say anything stupid to the media, but if they're not on board with benching Manning it could really tear a team up within. And the BRONCOS, as of late, haven't showed a lot of discipline to begin with, perhaps the locker room is having a rough time. We'll never know.

Slick

11-15-2015, 10:04 PM

What is a keyboard warrior?

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:04 PM

I don't think anybody but Yash is saying the decision should be easy. But just because it's a tough decision doesn't mean that benching him is the wrong decision.

No. I'm not saying its an "easy" decision, nor the wrong one. But I don't think its realistic to expect the coaches nor the GM to pull Manning before he breaks that record... no matter how "easy" the fans think that decision is (or should be). I'm saying that the coaches have a lot more on that decision.

broncobryce

11-15-2015, 10:05 PM

No one knows Manning better than Dungy, even he said the Broncos should start Brock. That to me says a LOT.

I agree. I was shocked when Dungy said that, but if he's saying it maybe there is a chance Kubiak see it that way.

Yashahla17

11-15-2015, 10:09 PM

[QUOTE=broncobryce;2410806]I agree. I was shocked when Dungy said that, but if he's saying it maybe there is a chance Kubiak see it that way.[/

Dungy doesn't want to see manning go out on his back looking miserable for a record.

gregbroncs

11-15-2015, 10:10 PM

No. I'm not saying its an "easy" decision, nor the wrong one. But I don't think its realistic to expect the coaches nor the GM to pull Manning before he breaks that record... no matter how "easy" the fans think that decision is (or should be). I'm saying that the coaches have a lot more on that decision.If they are making a decision based on getting a guy a record then the problem is far worse than I thought. NOBODY should put a single player above the team. Emotions aside if that record has ANY bearing on the decision then that is a MAJOR problem. An organization cannot put 1 player above the franchise I don't care who he is.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:11 PM

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:13 PM

If they are making a decision based on getting a guy a record then the problem is far worse than I thought. NOBODY should put a single player above the team. Emotions aside if that record has ANY bearing on the decision then that is a MAJOR problem. An organization cannot put 1 player above the franchise I don't care who he is.

yeah.. again, this sounds great coming from a fan sitting at home. We all have these "hard tough stances"..because THATS how you WIN DAMNIT! But its not real. If you don't think players matter to the GMs, the owners, and the coaches in this game, then you are being extremely naive. You can call it a "major problem" allllll you want, but the truth is, players/people DO matter. They aren't just numbers and stats on a page like they are to fans.

Slick

11-15-2015, 10:16 PM

yeah.. again, this sounds great coming from a fan sitting at home. We all have these "hard tough stances"..because THATS how you WIN DAMNIT! But its not real. If you don't think players matter to the GMs, the owners, and the coaches in this game, then you are being extremely naive. You can call it a "major problem" allllll you want, but the truth is, players/people DO matter. They aren't just numbers and stats on a page like they are to fans.

They are to coaches who win. Belichick would bench Brady in a heartbeat, records be damned, if he felt like Brady was costing his team games.

11-15-2015, 10:16 PM

I say **** it and let Champ Bailey start at QB next week.

wayninja

11-15-2015, 10:16 PM

The Manning who took us to the Superbowl is not the Manning who has played for us this season.

It's the manning that played IN the superbowl that has been playing for us.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:17 PM

They are to coaches who win. Belichick would bench Brady in a heartbeat, records be damned, if he felt like Brady was costing his team games.

Yeah.. again.. this is coming from fans that don't really have any personal attachment to the people. I absolutely would make a bet that you are wrong on this. Just because the "perception" is that Brady doesnt' mean anything to Belicheck, I feel VERY confident that you are very very wrong.

Slick

11-15-2015, 10:21 PM

Yeah.. again.. this is coming from fans that don't really have any personal attachment to the people. I absolutely would make a bet that you are wrong on this. Just because the "perception" is that Brady doesnt' mean anything to Belicheck, I feel VERY confident that you are very very wrong.

I think you are right in Peyton's case but wrong here. Fair enough.

Mike

11-15-2015, 10:23 PM

At this point I don't see how it tears the team apart. It is disheartening as a fan to see Manning throw pick after pick, it has to be the same for the players. They know it, just like we know it. Manning has been crap for the last half of last year and most of this year. It sucks, but it sucking doesn't make it not true.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:24 PM

BroncoWave

11-15-2015, 10:26 PM

I do agree that it wouldn't tear the team apart.

It probably would have at 7-0 but with 2 straight ugly losses, Peyton getting even worse and now even being hurt, I think all the players would understand if they went with Brock. It doesn't look like they will be going with Brock just yet, but I don't think it would be nearly as unpopular of a decision as it would have been a few weeks ago.

Ravage!!!

11-15-2015, 10:33 PM

It probably would have at 7-0 but with 2 straight ugly losses, Peyton getting even worse and now even being hurt, I think all the players would understand if they went with Brock. It doesn't look like they will be going with Brock just yet, but I don't think it would be nearly as unpopular of a decision as it would have been a few weeks ago.

My point is that t hey can't make a "permanent" move yet. It's not something you can 'go back' on once you make that call. For injury (or even saying it's for injury) sure...but you can't make the move for Brock to be the #1 at this point because once it's been made, we can't go back on it. At 7-2 I don't think its the right time, BUT, as "FAN".. I absolutely wouldn't mind because I certainly know we aren't going anywhere in the playoffs with this team. As the coach and GM, there HAS to be other things to consider,and I know there are.

NightTerror218

11-15-2015, 11:53 PM

Peyton. The goal is to win the SB right? You start Peyton. Brock is playing better right now, but Peyton needs to get out of this funk somehow. Not sure practices will help him snap out of this. Only way I want Brock playing is if Peyton is still physically hurting from today.

Brock, if Peyton is having rib issues let him rest a few games.

Peytons ego was hurt today.

TimHippo

11-16-2015, 12:09 AM

I do agree that it wouldn't tear the team apart.

You're tearing me apart, Lisa!

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 12:35 AM

I say **** it and let Champ Bailey start at QB next week.

Damned fine idea.

Magnificent Seven

11-16-2015, 01:29 AM

Personally, I think Peyton Manning should rest and miss Chicago game. Therefore, he can heal up and get well prepared for big game against Patriots on Sunday Night Football.

Brock Osweiler can take care of offense.

Peyton Manning and DeMarcus Ware should rest and get ready for Sunday Night Football.

JPPT1974

11-16-2015, 01:35 AM

Want to see Peyton get at least one more win. Just to break the record of wins. But it is time for the Brock O era to begin.

Dzone

11-16-2015, 04:54 AM

Manning may end up tied with Favre for wins. Thats like kissing your sister

sneakers

11-16-2015, 06:50 AM

Even the GOATs get old, time to get in someone who has teh chance to get it done

BroncoWave

11-16-2015, 07:11 AM

I know these comparisons aren't totally fair given Manning's injury and most of Brock's snaps coming in garbage time, but still interesting nonetheless. This was tweeted by Andrew Mason:

"Broncos' offense averaged 20.6 net yards/possession. On the drives Manning led, it averaged 4.33 yards. With Osweiler, it averaged 57.25."

EastCoastBronco

11-16-2015, 08:17 AM

I think some people on this board are overestimating how much faith the "Locker Room" has in Manning.
With the exception of the Green Bay game this team has won "in spite" of his mistakes the entire season.
The past is the past and Manning's "present" isn't exactly inspiring people to greater heights.
If he is hurt and cannot perform then he needs to sit.
Records be damned.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 09:26 AM

As I said, it's easy for them to say that Manning is hurt and sit him for a week rather than say he's being benched for performance issues. That at least gives them a chance to see what Brock has when they have an entire week to game plan for him as the starter. Beyond that, who knows? Someone on Twitter made a point that Manning's best game this year was against GB, after a week off for the bye. A week off this week will at least give them a chance to see how he's progressing going forward.

ShaneFalco

11-16-2015, 09:48 AM

tebow should start

Al Wilson 4 Mayor

11-16-2015, 10:04 AM

Manning won't play next week. Schefter tweeted this morning the tendon in Manning's foot is torn. They better not even consider playing him with that injury. We've all seen what happens if he can't plant hard when he throws.

We might be 7-4 two weeks from now.

Dzone

11-16-2015, 10:28 AM

Next Sunday happens to be Brock Osweillers 25th birthday.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor

11-16-2015, 10:31 AM

Next Sunday happens to be Brock Osweillers 25th birthday.

No kidding? Next Sunday is my birthday as well.

gregbroncs

11-16-2015, 10:42 AM

yeah.. again, this sounds great coming from a fan sitting at home. We all have these "hard tough stances"..because THATS how you WIN DAMNIT! But its not real. If you don't think players matter to the GMs, the owners, and the coaches in this game, then you are being extremely naive. You can call it a "major problem" allllll you want, but the truth is, players/people DO matter. They aren't just numbers and stats on a page like they are to fans.
Players matter but records be shouldn't. Getting a record should not even come into consideration regarding playing time.

11-16-2015, 10:43 AM

tebow should start

I lol'ed

Dzone

11-16-2015, 10:56 AM

Seems like Brock takes some hard hits when he runs. Maybe cuz he is 6-8, leaves him vulnerable to getting smashed. Hope Simien is ready to go if Brock gets a concussion

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 11:36 AM

I'm just not sure if Brock can play worse than what we've seen from Manning.

Manning needs to sit - at least against Chicago. Reevaluate the week after for NE.

gregbroncs

11-16-2015, 11:42 AM

I'm just not sure if Brock can play worse than what we've seen from Manning.

Manning needs to sit - at least against Chicago. Reevaluate the week after for NE.can you play worse than a 0.00 QBR?

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 11:44 AM

can you play worse than a 0.00 QBR?

Nope.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 12:02 PM

tripp

11-16-2015, 12:27 PM

I kind of wish Osweiler's first start would come against anyone but the Bears. When a new starter comes in, there's often the element of surprise, as there is no film on the guy and a smart coach can design a game plan to maximize that player's strengths before teams figure out how to counter them. Of course, he'll (presumably) be starting against John Fox, who has seen more of Osweiler in the last three years than any of us.

But how much can John Fox really know about Oz after seeing him in only practices and meaningless pre-season games? I mean he is in a different system after all. I'm holding some faith as the Bears defense is pretty bad, and we're against Jay Cutler.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 12:36 PM

But how much can John Fox really know about Oz after seeing him in only practices and meaningless pre-season games? I mean it he is in a different system after all. I'm holding some faith as the Bears defense is pretty bad, and we're against Jay Cutler.

That's certainly a factor, so I hope it makes a difference. Fox won't know how Kubiak will use him, but he knows Brock's strengths and weaknesses. I have to assume he does, anyway. Coaches evaluate their players in practices all the time.

As for Cutler, I'd love to say we'll destroy him but he has played quite well in Gase's system this year. He tore up a good Rams team on the road yesterday.

tripp

11-16-2015, 12:47 PM

That's certainly a factor, so I hope it makes a difference. Fox won't know how Kubiak will use him, but he knows Brock's strengths and weaknesses. I have to assume he does, anyway. Coaches evaluate their players in practices all the time.

As for Cutler, I'd love to say we'll destroy him but he has played quite well in Gase's system this year. He tore up a good Rams team on the road yesterday.

Yeah Langford looked good yesterday. Zach Miller looks effective too. But we'll be fine. If we can just prevent turning the ball over we'll be fine.

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 12:49 PM

From Peter King:

The Fate of Peyton Manning
After the Broncos’ loss to Kansas City—the worst game of Peyton Manning’s career—Denver coach Kubiak said, “That’s on me,” implying that he should not have started Manning because the quarterback wasn’t healthy enough. It struck me at the time that Kubiak was being a good team guy in saying that, taking the blame for the poor performance. Manning looked weak-armed, as he has all season, and his decisions were questionable, especially the interception to linebacker Josh Mauga, which was poorly thrown, off-target and soft. But on Monday morning, ESPN’s Adam Schefter reported that Manning was playing with a partially torn plantar fascia in his foot, which worsened in the Chiefs game.

I agree with Kubiak: If Manning is fit, he should be Denver’s quarterback. But what constitutes “healthy” for Manning now? There was no immediate timetable given for his recovery. If the Broncos’ training staff can get Manning to where his foot isn’t barking, then he should play. But if he plays the way he played on Sunday, and the way he has often played this year (nine touchdowns, league-high 17 interceptions), Manning has to understand that Kubiak needs to do what’s best for the team and play Brock Osweiler.

I don’t think it’s foolish or disrespectful to suggest that Osweiler is a better option than Manning, because today he is. Sunday in Chicago and in 13 days at home against New England, Osweiler might be the best option, too, especially if Manning’s foot is as bad as the report indicates. The Broncos are 7-2 and have a three-game lead in the AFC West, with seven more to play. But that lead will evaporate if there is a push for Manning to return too soon.

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/11/16/monday-morning-quarterback-nfl-week-10-tom-brady-patriots-giants

Hard to disagree.

TimHippo

11-16-2015, 01:35 PM

But how much can John Fox really know about Oz after seeing him in only practices and meaningless pre-season games? I mean he is in a different system after all. I'm holding some faith as the Bears defense is pretty bad, and we're against Jay Cutler.

I'm sure Fox will fully exploit Osweiler many deficiencies. Also the Bears are really playing hard now that they have the chance to compete for the division thanks to the Ditka Curse crippling the Packers who 3 weeks ago were running away with the division.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 02:01 PM

Nomad

11-16-2015, 02:11 PM

I don't think it matters. Whole team is playing like shit. Defense is playing dirty and giving up bad penalties. Offensive line is just brutal. Maybe Osweiler can hold course long enough to eek out some wins. Manning can't if he's hurt. Probably can't even if he isn't. Denver doesn't have a playmaker at quarterback either way.

This is a disappointing situation.

It's like watching LSU football. LoL. I've been getting a double dose of suckage the last couple weekends. LoL. At least BRONCO fans stayed in their seats the whole game.....pathetic Tiger fans started leaving at the half. It is a disappointing situation.

But I expect both teams to bounce back this weekend with wins!

Nomad

11-16-2015, 02:21 PM

That's certainly a factor, so I hope it makes a difference. Fox won't know how Kubiak will use him, but he knows Brock's strengths and weaknesses. I have to assume he does, anyway. Coaches evaluate their players in practices all the time.

As for Cutler, I'd love to say we'll destroy him but he has played quite well in Gase's system this year. He tore up a good Rams team on the road yesterday.

Still all these years, Cutler is still a Jekyll and Hyde QB....you never know who'll show up. The Bears should just watch the Chiefs game plan, because it was pretty effective against the BRONCOS defense. The defense did a good job overall holding them to FGs and punts.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 02:30 PM

Still all these years, Cutler is still a Jekyll and Hyde QB....you never know who'll show up. The Bears should just watch the Chiefs game plan, because it was pretty effective against the BRONCOS defense. The defense did a good job overall holding them to FGs and punts.

They should probably watch the Colts tape instead - that game our defense was being beaten. Yesterday they did okay, considering the Chiefs got the ball at midfield or beyond on every possession. I heard that we only allowed 20 yards per possession, which would have been fine if it didn't put them in field goal range each time.

Nomad

11-16-2015, 02:50 PM

They should probably watch the Colts tape instead - that game our defense was being beaten. Yesterday they did okay, considering the Chiefs got the ball at midfield or beyond on every possession. I heard that we only allowed 20 yards per possession, which would have been fine if it didn't put them in field goal range each time.

We all found out the Luck is one tough SOB. Cutler aint Luck. Either way....those are 2 games to start with. One common factor in all 3 games is the running QB. Josh McCown almost managed an upset keeping drives alive with his feet. Containing the QB seems to be an issue.

Timmy!

11-16-2015, 03:18 PM

Oz has the goods. Just watch.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 03:21 PM

It's official:

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 57s58 seconds ago

Kubiak said he told the team that Peyton Manning WILL NOT PLAY this week. Brock Osweiler will start.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:21 PM

Seems like Brock takes some hard hits when he runs. Maybe cuz he is 6-8, leaves him vulnerable to getting smashed. Hope Simien is ready to go if Brock gets a concussion

He will get smarter at that, dude was just trying to,show his teammates he is going all in for them. Guaranteed he's not going head on with linebackers next week unless there undersized and its for a first down or touchdown.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:22 PM

It's official:

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 57s58 seconds ago

Kubiak said he told the team that Peyton Manning WILL NOT PLAY this week. Brock Osweiler will start.

So it took the old man having a beat up shoulder, beat up ribs and a torn up foot for kubiak to grow some balls and make the decision. Oh well. The brock era has begun.

Buff

11-16-2015, 03:23 PM

It's official:

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 57s58 seconds ago

Kubiak said he told the team that Peyton Manning WILL NOT PLAY this week. Brock Osweiler will start.

I am actually intrigued to see a regular season gameplan designed for Brock. Should be a lot more bootlegging and chucking it deep I'd think.

VonDoom

11-16-2015, 03:25 PM

I am actually intrigued to see a regular season gameplan designed for Brock. Should be a lot more bootlegging and chucking it deep I'd think.

I'm glad Kubiak just made the call today. Gives them a whole week to create a plan for Brock, which should be the offense Kubiak wants to run anyway

Nomad

11-16-2015, 03:26 PM

Brock will be a failure if he lets Jay beat him. I'd start a 'Trevor needs to play' movement.

EastCoastBronco

11-16-2015, 03:26 PM

Pressure is going to be huge when the networks start their annual Brady vs Manning rhetoric.
Let's hope that Kubiak makes the right choice this time.

Denver Native (Carol)

11-16-2015, 03:27 PM

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 2m

Kubiak: "This is a little bit different for him [Osweiler], but I know he'll do a great job in his preparation."

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 2m

Kubiak said "the grind of the season" has worn Manning down.

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 4m

Kubiak said he told Manning that his "total focus" has to be on rehabilitation work this week.

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 4m

Manning will not dress at all. Trevor Siemian will be the backup in Chicago.

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 4m

Kubiak said he reviewed the entire week, and felt Manning had to step back and get back to feeling good.

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 5m

Kubiak: "I know that's the best decision for [Peyton], to get him back and healthy."

Andrew Mason ‏@MaseDenver 5m

Kubiak said he told the team that Peyton Manning WILL NOT PLAY this week. Brock Osweiler will start.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:30 PM

Pressure is going to be huge when the networks start their annual Brady vs Manning rhetoric.
Let's hope that Kubiak makes the right choice this time.

Manning cant play the next few weeks. No matter what hype is floating around, this team will have to stand behind 17 because hes the guy going forward into next year as well. If manning gets healthy around week 14-15-16 ill let him start the games but not end it so he gets credit for the win for the record.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 03:36 PM

I am actually intrigued to see a regular season gameplan designed for Brock. Should be a lot more bootlegging and chucking it deep I'd think.

Ugh. Can we just rip up the sideline deep fade/go?

I'm so damn sick of that play. Crosses, screens, bootlegs, waggles, quick outs...lets see a full offense.

Buff

11-16-2015, 03:39 PM

Ugh. Can we just rip up the sideline deep fade/go?

I'm so damn sick of that play. Crosses, screens, bootlegs, waggles, quick outs...lets see a full offense.

Well, in fairness, it's the right play to run with our WRs getting jammed by lesser DBs - but when your success rate it like 10% then what's the point?

The one that killed me yesterday was the split trips/bunch formation screen that everybody in the building knew was coming.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:42 PM

Ugh. Can we just rip up the sideline deep fade/go?

I'm so damn sick of that play. Crosses, screens, bootlegs, waggles, quick outs...lets see a full offense.

Get ready for some 50 yard bombs.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 03:45 PM

Well, in fairness, it's the right play to run with our WRs getting jammed by lesser DBs - but when your success rate it like 10% then what's the point?

The one that killed me yesterday was the split trips/bunch formation screen that everybody in the building knew was coming.

They did call some slantsonce Brock was in, which is another way to break up press coverage. Rather see that then chucking it deep along the sideline. Especially considering that Kansas City upped the blitz when Osweiler came in.

tripp

11-16-2015, 03:48 PM

What if.... Brock Osweiler has better stats than Tom Brady this week.....:shocked:

chazoe60

11-16-2015, 03:50 PM

Ugh. Can we just rip up the sideline deep fade/go?

I'm so damn sick of that play. Crosses, screens, bootlegs, waggles, quick outs...lets see a full offense.

Not as sick as I am off the WR bubble screen.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:54 PM

tripp

11-16-2015, 03:55 PM

Not as sick as I am off the WR bubble screen.

I never want to see a bubble screen ever again.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 03:55 PM

They did call some slantsonce Brock was in, which is another way to break up press coverage. Rather see that then chucking it deep along the sideline. Especially considering that Kansas City upped the blitz when Osweiler came in.

So your saying they didn't play prevent defense and brock was effective vs the same defense manning wasn't

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 03:58 PM

So your saying they didn't play prevent defense and brock was effective vs the same defense manning wasn't

Don't argue with me about something somebody else said dipshit.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 03:59 PM

Not as sick as I am off the WR bubble screen.

The bubble screen works just fine. Just not when it's one of only four passing plays you call.

chazoe60

11-16-2015, 04:04 PM

The bubble screen works just fine. Just not when it's one of only four passing plays you call.

If I had a dollar for every time the bubble screen has worked for the Broncos the last couple of seasons, I'd have enough money to buy one of them Starbucks cups everyone's talking about.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 04:05 PM

Don't argue with me about something somebody else said dipshit.

Haaa! Just saying

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 04:08 PM

If I had a dollar for every time the bubble screen has worked for the Broncos the last couple of seasons, I'd have enough money to buy one of them Starbucks cups everyone's talking about.

It works at a way higher percentage than the deep fade/go.

And you'd probably be able to buy at least a week's worth.

Krugan

11-16-2015, 04:57 PM

Once teams start getting hit with 50 yard bombs the screenplay will be effective, i wonder why we dont run any screens to the running backs though? When teams are licking there chops to burn a o line like every play then let them blow through and hit some screens behind them.

Hard to run a screen when there is no respect for the run or the pass. Our line is the problem, more than anything else, but its easier to focus on one star than see the whole galaxy.

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 05:05 PM

Hard to run a screen when there is no respect for the run or the pass. Our line is the problem, more than anything else, but its easier to focus on one star than see the whole galaxy.

Yeah, I'll contest this. Defenses know Manning can't do much. You know, like scramble, throw the deep ball (accurately and consistently), throw the slant with velocity, play under center (which does help the running game), etc. etc. etc. So, they stack the box and play our receivers tight off the line.

We'll see what having a mobile QB with an arm does to the OL. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty confident the OL will look a lot better next week.

And people will say "well, it's just the Bears!".

Krugan

11-16-2015, 05:14 PM

Yeah, I'll contest this. Defenses know Manning can't do much. You know, like scramble, throw the deep ball (accurately and consistently), throw the slant with velocity, play under center (which does help the running game), etc. etc. etc. So, they stack the box and play our receivers tight off the line.

We'll see what having a mobile QB with an arm does to the OL. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty confident the OL will look a lot better next week.

And people will say "well, it's just the Bears!".

Not alot of QBS can do anything with 2 seconds, i dont care what arm strength is left. He was hurt this week, shouldnt have been out there, but he has had velocity and accuracy at multiple times this year, no enough but part of the time.

Our oline has been below average in every game but maybe 1. So again, its not all about manning, although he does take his fair share of the blame.

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 05:18 PM

Not alot of QBS can do anything with 2 seconds, i dont care what arm strength is left. He was hurt this week, shouldnt have been out there, but he has had velocity and accuracy at multiple times this year, no enough but part of the time.

Our oline has been below average in every game but maybe 1. So again, its not all about manning, although he does take his fair share of the blame.

You think Manning could have made the TD pass Brock had? Escape the rush with someone basically tackling him, stepped up through another tackler and throws a dart for a TD?

Uh, no. He would have been the fainting goat, and we'd hope for a good play on the next down.

He will make the OL better because the DL can't just rush to a single spot.

Nomad

11-16-2015, 05:20 PM

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 05:53 PM

Hard to run a screen when there is no respect for the run or the pass. Our line is the problem, more than anything else, but its easier to focus on one star than see the whole galaxy.

The only pass ive gave the o line is the fact that the system they prepared for,during otas and all through training camp was scrapped in week 3 for this kubiak/manning pistol BS. With brock back there it shouldnt take long to get used to something they trained at for months. The o line will be better next year for sure though, we have some good young talent... I like sambrello i like garcia, i like vasquez. Sure up the other two spots and we should be good going forward in a very olinemen friendly scheme that we havent been able tomrun with manning.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 05:56 PM

You think Manning could have made the TD pass Brock had? Escape the rush with someone basically tackling him, stepped up through another tackler and throws a dart for a TD?

Uh, no. He would have been the fainting goat, and we'd hope for a good play on the next down.

He will make the OL better because the DL can't just rush to a single spot.

Kubiak now gets to change the launch points and brock is big ben like he will create launch points shedding defenders who think they can just arm tackle him. Defenders will soon realize brock is a big ass guy whose just mobile enough to make them look foolish like big ben.

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 06:01 PM

Kubiak now gets to change the launch points and brock is big ben like he will create launch points shedding defenders who think they can just arm tackle him. Defenders will soon realize brock is a big ass guy whose just mobile enough to make them look foolish like big ben.

Yeah, let's hold off on the Big Ben comparisons until we actually see if he can do that. He made a couple good plays, but also got stuffed on others.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 06:08 PM

Getting stuffed happens when you play like that. Big ben has gotten stuffed plenty of times. Im not saying he's about to be big ben yet, but he seems of that mold. Big strong arm guy who just cannot be arm tackled and extends plays due to that and makes big plays due to having that skill.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 06:16 PM

Osweiler isn't a magical fix for everything that ails this team.

BroncoJoe

11-16-2015, 06:18 PM

Osweiler isn't a magical fix for everything that ails this team.

Let's not kid ourselves - he'll help. Will he be the miracle elixir? Probably not. But it can't get worse - from a QB performance perspective.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 06:27 PM

Osweiler isn't a magical fix for everything that ails this team.

Not at all. But things should be a a lot better.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 06:31 PM

Not at all. But things should be a a lot better.

Don't confuse different with better.

Krugan

11-16-2015, 06:38 PM

You think Manning could have made the TD pass Brock had? Escape the rush with someone basically tackling him, stepped up through another tackler and throws a dart for a TD?

Uh, no. He would have been the fainting goat, and we'd hope for a good play on the next down.

He will make the OL better because the DL can't just rush to a single spot.

I didnt say he could, but your basically agreeing with me, but only being defensive about it.

Brock was under pressure just as manning was, it didnt make the oline play better, he was able to shake a few sacks, by a few quite a few.

The oline still sucked.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 06:39 PM

Don't confuse different with better.

Bro the bar is so low that anything thats not 17 turnovers and 3 and outs is better right? When he entered the game did thing get better? Come on bro we cant be arguing semantics and shit like that. Better, different..... I Guess.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 06:47 PM

Bro the bar is so low that anything thats not 17 turnovers and 3 and outs is better right? When he entered the game did thing get better? Come on bro we cant be arguing semantics and shit like that. Better, different..... I Guess.

Look, Bro.

Osweiler is playing in his first game. Can it get worse than the Chiefs game? Probably not (help us if it does). But go look at his last 16 games stats posted by BroncoWave. It can get a lot worse than that over the course of the next eight games.

For example, that play everyone's fawning over where the defensive end was completely unblocked and just whiffed on the sack? The one where everyone is calling Osweiler the next Roethlisberger? Yeah, he's not going to fix the end coming off clean and whatever warm body is at right tackle completely whiffing a block. He doesn't fix that our backs are getting hit in the backfield on more than 50 percent of run attempts. He doesn't fix the massive number of drops. Maybe it's a wake up call to the rest of the offense. I certainly hope it is, but I'm not putting any money on it.

He's not a fix all. This basically went from a Super Bowl contending team to a quarterback development year in two games. Maybe next year Osweiler is the guy, but I'm not expecting him to magically turn Denver's offense into a good offense anytime this year and contend immediately, no matter how good the defense is.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 06:52 PM

chazoe60

11-16-2015, 06:53 PM

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 06:54 PM

You're

"To." Randomly capitalized "See." Not capitalizing Brock. It's a complete mess.

chazoe60

11-16-2015, 06:56 PM

"To." Randomly capitalized "See." Not capitalizing Brock. It's a complete mess.

To be fair, I didn't notice those other mistakes because I rarely get more than two words into his posts.

Slick

11-16-2015, 06:59 PM

Well your entitled too feel how you feel. I See brock as the answer to alot of the issues, i see brock changing the way defenses have to play us. I see brock allowing us to go back to our initial oline friendly scheme. We'll see.

Denver's atrocious O line isn't good for Brock developing. He won't have the luxury of a running game and they're going to blitz the shit out of him in passing situations. Probably the best point you've ever made is Kubiak being able to change launch points. Having a pocket that isn't in the same place down after down might help a little.

Nomad

11-16-2015, 07:01 PM

To be fair, I didn't notice those other mistakes because I rarely get more than two words into his posts.

I know I could use a grammar refresher course.

11-16-2015, 07:39 PM

NightTerror218

11-16-2015, 07:50 PM

Osweiler isn't a magical fix for everything that ails this team.

No but the RBs could do better.

They will receive the ball running and with this the OL will not have to hold the block as long to open a hole. The 2 seconds that occur when the RB starts from shot gun and when getting hand off on run from under center could be a difference make for OL getting initial push and having to hold gap open for 2 seconds longer before moving to 2nd level to block.

AP was talking about how he prefers hand off from under center so much more then from shotgun because he is running and can use his strength to break tackles and can get more yards.

I would not be surprised to see Green being FB or Thompson as FB in Chicago game as lead blocker.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 07:58 PM

No but the RBs could do better.

They will receive the ball running and with this the OL will not have to hold the block as long to open a hole. The 2 seconds that occur when the RB starts from shot gun and when getting hand off on run from under center could be a difference make for OL getting initial push and having to hold gap open for 2 seconds longer before moving to 2nd level to block.

AP was talking about how he prefers hand off from under center so much more then from shotgun because he is running and can use his strength to break tackles and can get more yards.

I would not be surprised to see Green being FB or Thompson as FB in Chicago game as lead blocker.

Adrian Peterson doesn't play for the Broncos. C.J. Anderson does and he's said he prefers running out of the shotgun. The shotgun and running thing is a myth.

Joel

11-16-2015, 08:06 PM

Denver's atrocious O line isn't good for Brock developing. He won't have the luxury of a running game and they're going to blitz the shit out of him in passing situations. Probably the best point you've ever made is Kubiak being able to change launch points. Having a pocket that isn't in the same place down after down might help a little.
Your counterpoints are far more relevant than a variable launchpoint (which isn't really good news for a line that has trouble protecting the QB even when it KNOWS where he is.) I'd love to see Oz come out and go all Fran Tarkenton on the league, but the leagues record suggests he'll more likely go all David Carr. Ask yourselves: Is Derek THAT much better than his brother, or is Oaklands line just that much better than the train wreck that got their rookie QB sacked 72 times and Kubiak and Dennison hired for damage control?

I won't be a bit surprised if a month from now Yoshi's full of the same "excuses" he's been mocking, plus bashing Kubiak for "sabotaging" Oz by delaying his initial start till we faced his old coaches on the road, and letting Old Manning play the easy first half of the schedule but putting Oz out there against contenders like Cincy and NE*. The reality remains that a healthy Manning gives our run surge and pass protection its best shot; if even HE can't do it, don't expect wonders from a career benchwarmer.

Slick

11-16-2015, 08:20 PM

Your counterpoints are far more relevant than a variable launchpoint (which isn't really good news for a line that has trouble protecting the QB even when it KNOWS where he is.) I'd love to see Oz come out and go all Fran Tarkenton on the league, but the leagues record suggests he'll more likely go all David Carr. Ask yourselves: Is Derek THAT much better than his brother, or is Oaklands line just that much better than the train wreck that got their rookie QB sacked 72 times and Kubiak and Dennison hired for damage control?

I won't be a bit surprised if a month from now Yoshi's full of the same "excuses" he's been mocking, plus bashing Kubiak for "sabotaging" Oz by delaying his initial start till we faced his old coaches on the road, and letting Old Manning play the easy first half of the schedule but putting Oz out there against contenders like Cincy and NE*. The reality remains that a healthy Manning gives our run surge and pass protection its best shot; if even HE can't do it, don't expect wonders from a career benchwarmer.

I don't know Joel. It sure makes it easy for a defense to simply rush to the spot when they know where it is every single down. I'm not saying the o line will be good just that it may help them " a little."

gregbroncs

11-16-2015, 08:29 PM

Your counterpoints are far more relevant than a variable launchpoint (which isn't really good news for a line that has trouble protecting the QB even when it KNOWS where he is.) I'd love to see Oz come out and go all Fran Tarkenton on the league, but the leagues record suggests he'll more likely go all David Carr. Ask yourselves: Is Derek THAT much better than his brother, or is Oaklands line just that much better than the train wreck that got their rookie QB sacked 72 times and Kubiak and Dennison hired for damage control?

I won't be a bit surprised if a month from now Yoshi's full of the same "excuses" he's been mocking, plus bashing Kubiak for "sabotaging" Oz by delaying his initial start till we faced his old coaches on the road, and letting Old Manning play the easy first half of the schedule but putting Oz out there against contenders like Cincy and NE*. The reality remains that a healthy Manning gives our run surge and pass protection its best shot; if even HE can't do it, don't expect wonders from a career benchwarmer.You understand that the offense moving the launch point means they will know where it's supposed to be thrown from but that the defense won't? Changing the location of the QB does slow a defensive line. Having a QB that can take a hit without diving for the ground increases the amount of time said QB has to throw, even if only be 1-2 seconds.

I'm not saying Brock is the answer, But he looks like a better fit for this scheme and this O-line. And moving the pocket and launch point is a valid counter to an aggressive O-Line. Something you can't do very often with Manning.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor

11-16-2015, 08:34 PM

Don't confuse different with better.

It doesn't get any worst than 5 completions and 4 interceptions.

Joel

11-16-2015, 08:36 PM

I don't know Joel. It sure makes it easy for a defense to simply rush to the spot when they know where it is every single down. I'm not saying the o line will be good just that it may help them " a little."
When half of them are unblocked at the snap, most quickly reach whatever the particular spot is that down. I suspect Cugel's right: Opponents will send the house through our submarine screen door, ignore the impotent run when we play-action, and use lots of subtle complex coverage to exploit Oz' inexperience. That goes double for Fox and Gase, who surely remember what fools Oz and what doesn't, and McCoy, who blitzed Manning through our awful line, too, and spent a year watching Oz' rookie practices.

Then there's that OTHER game in two weeks: MANNING hasn't solved Belicheats D in TWO DECADES trying; what's Oz gonna come up with in his second pro start?

That's over half our remaining schedule, leaving a possible SB Bengals team, Pitt and the Raiders (Del Rio's seen Oz in a few practices, too.)

One of the best arguments for riding Mannings final season as far as we could was that it would give Kubiak and Dennison an extra offseason to solidify the line before Oz' first start; now that's off the table. It is what it is, but it's probably going to get a lot worse before it gets any better. If we thought Oz was ready to be the franchise QB, why bring Manning back despite the fact he's not worth $20 million/year anymore? Not that Oz is AWFUL, else we wouldn't have risked the paycut talking Manning into retirement, but....

Joel

11-16-2015, 08:38 PM

You understand that the offense moving the launch point means they will know where it's supposed to be thrown from but that the defense won't? Changing the location of the QB does slow a defensive line. Having a QB that can take a hit without diving for the ground increases the amount of time said QB has to throw, even if only be 1-2 seconds.

I'm not saying Brock is the answer, But he looks like a better fit for this scheme and this O-line. And moving the pocket and launch point is a valid counter to an aggressive O-Line. Something you can't do very often with Manning.
The bootlegs and such will help, but when the launch point changes by necessity because Oz is running for his life yet again, everyone's guessing, and the D has a better view of the action than the offensive linemen receiving rather than giving pancakes. The answer is BLOCKING; if we can't do that, neither Manning reading and releasing as fast as Marino nor Oz staying alive as long as Tarkenton can truly solve the problem, only mitigate it.

Slick

11-16-2015, 08:41 PM

You don't have to convince me that it might not look good. I'm not sure I deserved that response. Cugel's not the only poster here who sees how bad Denver's line is.

MOtorboat

11-16-2015, 08:53 PM

It doesn't get any worst than 5 completions and 4 interceptions.

I hope Brock is as good as everyone seems to think he is.

11-16-2015, 09:10 PM

I hope Brock is as good as everyone seems to think he is. Here's my take: Brock has good skill. He's got all of the physical tools you want your QB to have - he's big, he doesn't go down easy and can break tackles, he can scramble for positive gains when needed, he's got a helluva strong arm, and can make all of the throws. What we don't know is how smart he is, how well he learns from mistakes, how he can lead. That'll all be revealed in the next few weeks. Do I think he's the long-term answer for Denver? Don't know. I hope he is for the sheer fact that if he's not then a shit load of time and a brilliant mind were wasted trying to mentor him.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:19 PM

Do you sniff glue? A lot?

How old are you? Is there an age thread. I'd like to know the age of the members or an age group because some of the jokes be so 1988.

11-16-2015, 09:21 PM

How old are you? Is there an age thread. I'd like to know the age of the members or an age group because some of the jokes be so 1988.

I'm 31. So 1988 jokes are a little before my time. Fortunately, or unfortunately, glue sniffing jokes are ageless.

At least I didn't ask if you ate paint chips as a child.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:21 PM

11-16-2015, 09:22 PM

KC blitzed damn near the whole time Brock was in and he was still effective. I think the entire offense elevates their game next week anyway. KC played prevent most of the time Brock was in.

I also edited your post for grammatical correctness.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:22 PM

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:23 PM

KC played prevent most of the time Brock was in.

I also edited your post for grammatical correctness.

Lies.

11-16-2015, 09:23 PM

Lies.

I make $18/hr.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:29 PM

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:29 PM

I make $18/hr.

Pretty good. Congrats

tripp

11-16-2015, 09:34 PM

I hope Brock is as good as everyone seems to think he is.

If he plays like anything like Hoyer tonight, I'll be happy.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:41 PM

Hoyer? Brock upside is way more than a Hoyer whose just a serviceable type of backup.

11-16-2015, 09:43 PM

Its been at least 20 years since I've heard sniffing glue. Its time too Leave elementary school jokes alone bro. Gotta get updated material then will i give you credit as far as being a jokester. Why is the material either grade school or dick? Lol got to step it up fellas.

I know you don't know me, but I'm pretty good at this shit talking thing. I wouldn't expect you to know anything about that.

11-16-2015, 09:44 PM

Pretty good. Congrats

I thought we were telling lies, so I told a lie.

I Eat Staples

11-16-2015, 09:45 PM

Man i hope we see some fullback action next week.

Ew, fullbacks in 2015.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:45 PM

I know you don't know me, but I'm pretty good at this shit talking thing. I wouldn't expect you to know anything about that.

I cant tell yet.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:47 PM

Ew, fullbacks in 2015.

Yup, would help especially with a guy like thompson or green who can creep out the backfield. I want to see the broncos use check downs. And use some fullback lead blocking.

11-16-2015, 09:47 PM

I cant tell yet.

Again I say, I wouldn't expect you to know anything about that.

I Eat Staples

11-16-2015, 09:49 PM

Yup, would help especially with a guy like thompson or green who can creep out the backfield. I want to see the broncos use check downs. And use some fullback lead blocking.

If we're taking snaps from the Shotgun, sure, I'm all for it.

Yashahla17

11-16-2015, 09:50 PM

Hoping the shotgun is just another formation, im hoping the real kubiak offense shows up

I Eat Staples

11-16-2015, 09:59 PM

Hoping the shotgun is just another formation, im hoping the real kubiak offense shows up

Can't be a power running team with a bad offensive line. It won't work.

Simple Jaded

11-17-2015, 12:26 AM

Can't be a power running team with a bad offensive line. It won't work.

The Broncos ZBS isn't a power system, they've generally avoided more talented lineman over the years.

Btw, get over the Shitgun, Staples.

chazoe60

11-17-2015, 12:29 AM

I make $45 an hour. Am I lying?

MOtorboat

11-17-2015, 12:45 AM

I make $45 an hour. Am I lying?

Union lackey.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor

11-17-2015, 01:24 AM

I hope Brock is as good as everyone seems to think he is.

I'm not saying he's good. All I know about Brock is he has a lot of upside.

The point I was making in that post is, 5 completions and 4 interceptions isn't just bad, it's horrifically bad.

MOtorboat

11-17-2015, 01:34 AM

I'm not saying he's good. All I know about Brock is he has a lot of upside.

The point I was making in that post is, 5 completions and 4 interceptions isn't just bad, it's horrifically bad.

No one was disputing that.

It would be markedly unfair to use that game as the benchmark.

Al Wilson 4 Mayor

11-17-2015, 10:41 AM

No one was disputing that.

It would be markedly unfair to use that game as the benchmark.

Undoubtedly, but there is optimism for improvement over that performance.

gregbroncs

11-17-2015, 03:32 PM

No one was disputing that.

It would be markedly unfair to use that game as the benchmark.How about using this season as the indicator. Or the last half of last season and the first half of this season? It's not unfair to do that and if you do Manning has failed.

Cugel

11-17-2015, 03:54 PM

In before "you guys are so stupid, it's all the OL, Brock sucks" Cugel.

Brock doesn't suck at all. What are you talking about? I never thought he sucked.

He better not suck because he's the future franchise QB. I think he's going to struggle this season because he's never started an NFL game before and defenses are going to throw everything at him to try and confuse him and get him to make bad decisions.

But they are going to stick with him over the next 2 or 3 years and try and develop him and get an OL that can protect him.

It is all on the OL though. Kubiak's offense is designed to run the ball and they can't run the ball. Do you suppose Ronnie Hillman running 7 times for 1 yard was Peyton's fault?

Unless they turn that around, this team is going nowhere in the playoffs whether they have Peyton or Brock at QB.

As we've seen the last 3 weeks, not even Aaron Rogers can make up for bad OL play. Their RBs ran the ball for less than 50 yards against the Lions and they lost for the 3rd straight time. If Aaron Rogers can't win with a one-dimensional offense, why would anybody expect Brock Osweiler to do it?

Cugel

11-17-2015, 04:01 PM

Frankly, I hope Kubiak is not dumb enough to try and rush Peyton back for the Patriots game. He needs to be 100% healthy and the OL needs to be able to block better than they have for him to be effective. The Pats are going to win that game regardless of who they start at QB and even if the Broncos won, they're still not getting home field advantage because the Pats might lose 1 or 2 games this year.

But, does anybody think the Broncos are going 14-2 while beating New England and the Patriots lose another game? Seriously?

So, the AFC Championship Game is going to be in Foxborough and if the Broncos want to win it, they are going to have to go there and beat the Pats in January.

And for that they are going to need a healthy Peyton. Of course even if Peyton is 100% he might not be good enough; they won't be favored in that game for sure - if they even get there. But, that's their best hope.

BroncoJoe

11-17-2015, 04:10 PM

Brock doesn't suck at all. What are you talking about? I never thought he sucked.

He better not suck because he's the future franchise QB. I think he's going to struggle this season because he's never started an NFL game before and defenses are going to throw everything at him to try and confuse him and get him to make bad decisions.

But they are going to stick with him over the next 2 or 3 years and try and develop him and get an OL that can protect him.

It is all on the OL though. Kubiak's offense is designed to run the ball and they can't run the ball. Do you suppose Ronnie Hillman running 7 times for 1 yard was Peyton's fault?

Unless they turn that around, this team is going nowhere in the playoffs whether they have Peyton or Brock at QB.

As we've seen the last 3 weeks, not even Aaron Rogers can make up for bad OL play. Their RBs ran the ball for less than 50 yards against the Lions and they lost for the 3rd straight time. If Aaron Rogers can't win with a one-dimensional offense, why would anybody expect Brock Osweiler to do it?

Curious that you skated over CJ's 7 carries for 34 yards.

Having a mobile QB with an arm will help the OL.

wayninja

11-17-2015, 04:12 PM

How about using this season as the indicator. Or the last half of last season and the first half of this season? It's not unfair to do that and if you do Manning has failed.

Failed is being kind. He's been the worst QB in the league, and that isn't an exaggeration.

He's been given ample time to "get comfortable" with the new offense and to heal of any late season injury from last year.

It just isn't happening. I really do not like saying it, but the team is simply better off without him now. There is simply no good reason to believe he will come back from this. That doesn't mean he can't, mind you, just that the evidence against him is pretty overwhelming.

tomjonesrocks

11-17-2015, 04:41 PM

Failed is being kind. He's been the worst QB in the league, and that isn't an exaggeration. He's been given ample time to "get comfortable" with the new offense and to heal of any late season injury from last year. It just isn't happening. I really do not like saying it, but the team is simply better off without him now. There is simply no good reason to believe he will come back from this. That doesn't mean he can't, mind you, just that the evidence against him is pretty overwhelming.

Are you a witness??

MOtorboat

11-17-2015, 04:48 PM

Didn't Cugel say Osweiler was going to sign somewhere else. Now he's the QBOF?

Hedge those bets.

wayninja

11-17-2015, 05:49 PM

Are you a witness??

I am a witness to reality. And that embarrassing game against KC crossed the line of how much benefit of the doubt I was willing to give him.

He's still one of the greatest to ever play the game, but it just looks like he really is done.

Oh... you mean this thread. Yeah... I'm a witness to... whatever this is.

Simple Jaded

11-17-2015, 10:08 PM

Brock doesn't suck at all. What are you talking about? I never thought he sucked.

He better not suck because he's the future franchise QB. I think he's going to struggle this season because he's never started an NFL game before and defenses are going to throw everything at him to try and confuse him and get him to make bad decisions.

But they are going to stick with him over the next 2 or 3 years and try and develop him and get an OL that can protect him.

It is all on the OL though. Kubiak's offense is designed to run the ball and they can't run the ball. Do you suppose Ronnie Hillman running 7 times for 1 yard was Peyton's fault?

Unless they turn that around, this team is going nowhere in the playoffs whether they have Peyton or Brock at QB.

As we've seen the last 3 weeks, not even Aaron Rogers can make up for bad OL play. Their RBs ran the ball for less than 50 yards against the Lions and they lost for the 3rd straight time. If Aaron Rogers can't win with a one-dimensional offense, why would anybody expect Brock Osweiler to do it?

The OL is the worst Broncos line since Shanatan was scraping the bottom of the barrel for Ephraim Sallam and Brn Hamilton but it isn't constantly throwing to the first read on every play, that's entirely on Manning and that's the reason for a lot of his Ints. He used to know the right throw before the ball was snapped but not in this offense, his mind is failing him when he needs it most.